These Speedrunners Were Accused of Cheating...

hello you absolute legends if you have spent any amount of time on youtube in the past few years you've almost certainly come across a ton of popular videos exposing gamers who have tried to cheat their way into speedrunning fame and yes when it comes to content creators producing videos on faked speedruns i am definitely one of the biggest culprits it's just so much fun breaking down the intricacies that gaming sleuths uncover in order to weed out potential frauds there's a reason why crime forensics is one of the most watched genres on television everyone loves a good mystery and people want to find out the genius methods top thinkers use to bring people to justice just over a year ago i released a video called the worst fake speedrun on youtube and it quickly became my most viewed video ever currently sitting at 12 million views similar videos by other youtubers have also done extremely well leading to a new industry of fake speedrun videos which reminds me i definitely need to update my to-do list in fact there have been so many videos on fake speedruns that it has warped the public's perception on how common these occurrences actually are nowadays it seems like many people think every new speedrunning world record is a product of foul play skepticism is obviously incredibly important and any noteworthy achievement should be investigated but i think too many people have crossed from skepticism into outright cynicism i see it all the time the moment someone doesn't understand a particular detail about a speedrun they immediately come to the conclusion that cheats were used this sometimes even extends to speedrunners themselves and in this video we are going to look at exactly that we will examine a few instances of speedrunners that have been accused of cheating by other speedrunners because something about their speed run didn't quite make sense but in every case further investigation proved their innocence if something seems strange about a speedrun 99 times out of 100 it is simply because the person viewing doesn't have a deep enough knowledge of the game to grasp what's happening therefore you should always seek to understand first before jumping to any conclusions i really hope you enjoy now a huge shout out to this video's sponsor frag pro shooter frag is one of the most legendary shooters out there at the moment it's designed exclusively for mobile devices and has almost 70 million players it's totally free to play and the nature of the game means it's based on skill which of course allows me to crush everyone in my path the rules of frag are pretty simple the goal is to destroy enemy bunkers as quickly as possible and the first person to do so wins in order to build a team you need to collect characters which have their own unique stats and powers you can then customize your team to match your own personality and choice of strategy my favorite game mode is street frag which uses a much smaller map and games are pumped out a lot quicker which is perfect for me because i am a busy man i'm really enjoying this game at the moment and have even created my own club so it would be pretty epic if you could join if you join using the link in the description you'll receive some pretty sweet free rewards and the link even works if you're already playing frag pro shooter is heaps of fun so definitely make sure to check it out and hit me up when you're in the game on the 29th of september 2020 the speedrunner corbinos achieved a new minecraft world record with a run of 14 minutes and 56 seconds in the 1.16 random seed glitchless category the most popular category in the game by far this was a crazy world record when it happened beating the previous record by two and a half minutes these days runs of under 15 minutes are honestly pretty common but at the time this particular run was performed these strategies were much more primitive and people weren't playing anywhere near as optimally as they do now not only that but the earlier strategies required way way more luck with piglen bartering modern speedruns see players use bastions to easily collect up to 100 gold ingots to use in barters but corbinos wasn't using bastion strategies so needed to get gold by mining gold nuggets trading with a single piglen he managed to get enough pearls with only 5 ingots which is quite lucky now before the naysayers do what i told them not to this luck isn't statistically alarming the odds were around 1 in 800 for getting these trades and considering there are thousands of runs being done each day it's inevitable that people do get these kinds of runs players were still suspicious however and to add more fuel to the flames of doubt this world record was not streamed and was done offline offline world records will always raise more eyebrows and in my opinion should be avoided at all costs aside from the video itself minecraft players will provide the world folder containing all of the data and files related to that specific world that was played this helps moderators investigate any potential discrepancies and if everything checks out it increases confidence that the run is legit corbinos uploaded the folder to google drive allowing anyone to access it and one of the players that downloaded it to investigate was none other than dream dream wasn't a minecraft moderator but he obviously cared enough to take a closer look at korbino's files lo and behold he did uncover something that did not make sense the file creation time did not match up with when the run supposedly took place in fact it was hours beforehand despite the run being offline players knew exactly when the run was achieved because corbinos was talking about the run as it was happening in another player's stream corbinos also provided a recording of the full session which included some audio from that same stream in the background enabling us to establish the precise time according to what could be verified corbinos began his world record speed run at around 12 30 est but when dream who is located in the exact same time zone checked the files they showed a creation time of 9 30 am three hours earlier it's important to note that dream is in the same time zone because that would eliminate any confusion with time zone discrepancies the theory that dream put forward is that corbinos played the world record hours earlier likely using a seed that was already known to him and specifically chosen corbinos could then play about an hour of attempts recording that footage and then splicing the world record run on to the end this would make it seem like the world record run happened seamlessly after an hour or so of playtime dream brought his findings to the moderation team who after confirming that the timestamps were indeed hours before the run supposedly happened rejected the new world record and removed all of corbino's runs from the leaderboard which even included his world record in the 1.14 category now despite the fact that dream brought forward his evidence and reasoning it must be stated again that he was not a moderator and it was not his decision in any way so no blame can be cast in his direction for corbinos being removed the moderators took the information verified it and then felt it was enough evidence to ban him from the leaderboards but in hindsight they acted far too quickly there was no real investigation into any other possible reasons for the discrepancy and like i said earlier if something doesn't initially make sense cheating is only one possible explanation and every other possibility has to be examined corbynos eventually proved his innocence by showing that on his personal computer the creation time was exactly as it should have been 12 30 pm further investigation confirmed that it was google drive that was the culprit even though corbinos was in est google drive was switching the time zone to pst in retrospect this seems like a silly mistake to make but the creation time really does change i tested this myself by creating a file uploading it to google drive and then re-downloading it the creation time changed to 17 hours earlier kubernetes and dream both lived in est but would see completely different creation times when viewing the same file in the aftermath of this era the minecraft moderation team took steps to ensure that snap decisions to ban players would never happen again putting in place much better verification policies this minor controversy is also one of the many reasons that the dream investigation took so long they wanted to ensure that these types of mistakes were avoided by allowing the proper time to investigate and test any other legitimate explanations once cleared corbinosa's world record runs were placed back onto the leaderboards and they are still considered monumental leaps in the progression of minecraft speedrunning the mods just told me i faked it oh my god in early 2016 the norwegian speedrunner torje was an up-and-coming ocarina of time prodigy he had been grinding hard for the past couple of years and while he was always a promising player it was 2016 that really saw him come into his own 2015 saw a war between another two players battling it out for the world record jordan stone and skater 82297 with the latter eventually reigning supreme with a time of 17 minutes and 45 seconds in july jordan stone and skato were easily the two top dogs in the category with torture lagging decently behind with a personal best of around 20 minutes but months of effort and steady improvement saw him eventually land within two seconds of the world record with a 1747 achieved on the 17th of april 2016. this was easily good enough for second place and it seemed as though the world record was certainly within reach the world record for ocarina of time has always been extremely tight and players are always combing through their runs trying to find the tiniest of time saves naturally people compared toy jazz run to the world record to see where time was gained or lost one particular player named midnight noticed something strange about one of toy jess cutscenes it ran much faster than the world record held by skater the ocarina of time any percent world record is pretty notorious for containing a really high percentage of cutscene time in the run around half of the time was spent watching and waiting for cutscenes to end of all of the places to gain time on someone else the cutscenes definitely shouldn't be one of them and yet tori j was gaining over a full second on skater for doing absolutely nothing the accusations instantly began flooding in with claims that torjet was overclocking his wii people weren't sure exactly how but he was obviously doing something to speed up his cutscene even the world record holder seemed to agree that torje was up to no good at the very least he was playing on hardware that gave him an unfair advantage over the competition as i said earlier though whenever something seems wrong cheating is only one possible explanation and usually it comes down to a lack of understanding the truth is that no matter what console you're playing on this particular cutscene will not run at the same speed every time when it plays you'll notice there are chunks of debris flying around and these chunks are not set in stone they are in fact randomly generated and the more chunks that are created the more the cutscene will lag behind ultimately the speed at which the cutscene plays will differ by as much as two seconds which in a game like this is an eternity of course when you see a discrepancy like this it needs to be investigated but conclusions don't need to be drawn until a full investigation is done the ocarina of time speedrunners didn't know why the cutscenes were faster and a few of them assumed the worst but the interesting thing is that this particular issue was already well known by the tool assisted speedrun community if anyone knows the ins and outs of game code it's the tassers who meticulously formulate the most perfect runs this information wasn't widely known however until after this controversy torje would ultimately break skater's record several months later and would go on to become one of the greatest ocarina of time players ever this cutscene event would forever be fondly remembered as the fast wii incident and this cutscene actually lags depending on how much debris there is flying around which is random and so it can lag more or less and affect your best split on canon something that was known to people who tasked this game but not really to the general community until torch's fast wii was discovered recently had to do it now finally i want to revisit a video i made last december about the super mario brothers speedrunner lukuki who tied the world record i outlined lukuki's history which involved a previous incident of cheating and explained how his most recent world record was being left in limbo due to strange circumstances since making that video lukuki's run has been extensively investigated and the moderators found no evidence of cheating thus his speedrun was verified and placed onto the ranks but it appears that the video itself caused some minor controversy with some people especially those from the cookies community claiming that i was accusing him of cheating again not only that but the comments section was flooded with people claiming he was cheating and what's interesting is that the evidence they were bringing forth is easily debunked with a bit of knowledge so i really want to address those two accusations the first being that i was accusing him of cheating and the second being that he was actually cheating to begin with i never once accused him of cheating on his most recent mario record and i will play what i actually said from the video at the end of the day though this is all circumstantial i honestly don't know if there was any foul play involved and until hard evidence is revealed no one does those who know me well know that i'm not afraid to say what i think is true when billy mitchell hired a lawyer and literally threatened to sue me for saying he cheated in donkey kong i responded by making an entire video about how big of a cheat he is during the dream situation i said exactly what i thought was the case which is that he cheated and trust me i legitimately felt bad doing so i've spoken with dream and he seems like a really nice guy in person but i said it because it's what i believe to be true if i think someone has cheated i will say it directly i won't say the opposite and conspire to try and trick people into believing it i feel obligated to address this because i don't want people to confuse what i mean and take things away from videos that i never said now let's check out the concerns people had with the run and why they think it's evidence of cheating by far the biggest objection people had is the fact that he knew he tied the world record so quickly without double checking on the surface this looks sketchy but i actually addressed this in the video here is what i said super mario bros is timed in part by using the bowser pattern to determine how many frames have passed and using this metric the run was world record pace experienced players know exactly how fast a run is by looking at the hammer pattern being thrown by bowser i also said that lukuki held the world record for the last stage which means that he is very experienced with that level so would definitely be able to easily spot those patterns knowing how fast you are up to the final castle is also very easy because of how frame rules work so at the end of the day most of the top players know how fast their runs are without even checking a timer i'm really sorry i didn't make that clear but it didn't even occur to me that so many people would jump on this one particular point a lot of people also latched on to the fact that lukuki didn't show his cables and i do really understand how bad it looks which is why i included it in the video however it's only ever going to be circumstantial evidence and i don't even personally know what showing the cables would even prove and i'm sure that people posting comments about it don't either even lukuki seemed legitimately annoyed at himself for not showing was going to them how do you show the kid who's going to the tv i don't think you can't that's going to be too bored of a task oh yeah the way i said that jesus oh i'm so mad at myself bro i'm so mad about it's such like oh yeah guys i'm not going to show it because it's probably shitty you know bro it's so bad i didn't realize they did that bro i wish that video was like dude did i really do that ah it sucks 37 who's one of the super mario brothers i have to point out that showing cables was definitely not a rule and was a spur of the moment request from the moderator so it's plausible that lukuki just didn't think anything of it when it happened even though most people understandably see it as sketchy i really enjoyed making that video i found the entire situation super interesting and spent two months learning more about it but the problem is that people were so quick to judge and attack lukuki over it which was definitely not what i intended i really want to make more videos like that but i'm afraid that the speedrunners included in the video will be heard by viewers jumping to conclusions everyone is entitled to their opinion but if i were to ask anything of you it would be to try and be a bit less certain when you don't understand all of the facts if you see something that doesn't make sense ask why don't instantly proclaim that it must be due to cheating lukuki is just a kid with a tiny channel and my video has millions of views with thousands of comments berating him this is not what i wanted his world record run is almost certainly legitimate though a few people did notice a distinct lack of pizza so ultimately it will still be up to you to decide how legit it really is as always thank you so much for watching you legends i hope you are having a fantastic day and i will see you in the next video you

Channel: Karl Jobst

Views: 857,668

Rating: 4.8553329 out of 5

Keywords: minecraft speedrun, minecraft, dream, speedrun cheater, super mario bros, ocarina of time

Id: LWPZfwe1Sj0

Length: 18min 38sec (1118 seconds)

Published: Wed Mar 31 2021

Reddit Comments

[u/8ight_9ine_3hree]

lmao at Dream accusing someone of cheating.

[u/Amberg22]

Karl Jobst made a video going through the mario player's history as highly sceptical and now says that "the problem is that people were so quick to judge and attack LeKukie over [that video]". I remember being convinced he was a cheater after having watched the video and I don't see how most people wouldn't be either. Karl didn't accuse Lekukie of cheating, but he absolutely had him labeled as one.

[u/Mayrink]

At first I thought "oh god, not another one of these", as someone who's tired of the repetitive and frankly overblown attention to cheating in the community. Imagine my pleasant surprise to find out the video wasn't just another generic "these runners are huge cheaters reeee".

If you tought of skipping out on this video for that reason, please do check it out. I almost got reverse click baited (?) myself. The idea of cheating not being that prevalent nor being the only explanation for quirks in a run/narrative is really important. Innocent until proven guilty and so on.

Also, Cutscene RNG?! Really, OoT? My god.

[u/Stujel-mabok]

File times are not reliable, it's super unfair they used it as sole evidence against him. Luckily it got overturned.

[u/N5on]

Good video and important topic

[u/BumLeeJon]

No Karl, you are the absolute legend bruv

[u/I-Killed-JR]

But dream cheated

[u/enmokusei]

Godzilla vs Kong, new RLM Best of the Worst, AND a new Karl Jobst video, all on the same day? The planets must be aligned 😅

[u/ChezMere]

I feel like as a community, our emphasis on cheating as Prime Content is a big problem and we should be doing more to reduce this.