The Journey Home - 2013-04-28- Leo Brown - Former Baptist/ Evangelical

good evening and welcome to the journey home I'm Marcus Grodi host for this program I've got a got a double privilege tonight first of all just great having Leo Brown join us former Baptist and evangelical here to talk about his journey but the other privilege is that Leo is a general manager of real-life radio in Lexington Kentucky an affiliate of EWTN so even as we speak it's coming across your radio program absolutely great to have you thank you Marcus appreciate it it's it's it really is exciting to see before we get to the journey hmm it might be good to just mention the excitement of the growth EWTN affiliates oh yeah in your lifetime in mine it's a it's a new phenomenon yeah it really is and for us in Lexington you know I got to say that we just so a huge gret debt of gratitude so what I was trying to say to those early pioneers because I think it was maybe number 30 I in the nation when it first came on so this was in the late 90s so of that early batch of Catholic radio it was you know little Lexington Kentucky with 10 percent Catholic was a part of that growing trend so it's pretty amazing when you mentioned the early pilgrim pioneers is also thinking about total of this other subject you're part of Kentucky mm-hmm is a pioneering place of Catholics Sharia that came from Maryland and another place is audio after the Revolution it came out I had at those first churches yeah and it's really interesting because there is a long tradition of Catholicism in Kentucky is especially in certain pockets and we'll find these really just I mean I guess our diocese came on board right along with the Boston archdiocese and you know so there's a there's a long tradition there but then you get into mission territory which is where our diocese is and you may find in some cases 2% Catholic you know so it the numbers dwindle as you get out into what more rural and I think that was the struggle from the very beginning I mean when those first clusters of Catholic families left Maryland in the late 1700s 1798 99 Sharon that period and we and most of the priests were French priests and as Jay said yeah exactly Jay was part of you know in fact I've been working forever on a book of father John's there was one of the earliest but he was an American a convert my priest in in your area part of the struggle was out here in the wilderness trying to make a go at a surrounded by a lot of anti-catholic area and trying to live out their faith and then hold on to it some of them didn't I wasn't sayin two great things have changed so much that's still the battle right living out the faith it's still the spiritual battle like you mentioned even in the Battle of your own doing the radio station maybe that's something to talk about now if you're doing something for the Lord you really desire you want to give your life for the Lord and you're inviting this spiritual battle yeah Satan doesn't like that does he right yeah it makes it challenging but all the more worth a while when you see the results of that you know and that's that's what's beautiful and I know that you've had this experience when you may have one of those challenging times or you think could anything else go wrong and then you get one of those emails or you meet someone and they just they're just completely transformed by something that they heard or something they experienced through your ministry and it's like oh yeah this is what we do it for you know the beauty of this privilege that both you and I have been given in a relationship with EWTN to we really don't know even as we speak who's listened exactly we could fill the next hour with all the examples of people who've written us garrulous told us about just the opportunity God has touched their lives because of something hurts so we're very grateful to wtn of course we're grateful all of you watching that that support EWTN with your prayers as well as your your generosity so all that aside Sarah but infomercial in tender your journey yeah because you don't come to this just as a Catholic Catholic radio you bring a journey with you yeah well I was raised Baptist and spent a good number of years as a Baptist I guess through my early formation and my father although he was never a senior pastor or a minister per se he was educated in the seminary so he unfortunately didn't finish seminary but he who was never ordained but he was typically smarter than any of us earning a call though he was here early on absolutely and so you know he like I say he at least in my church's growing up he probably had more education than the the pastor's typically and so he would often fill in he would be kind of uh you know I'd see him the pulpit quite often he was a very active Gideon as well so he was out doing Bible distribution and so you know that there was definitely an influence on my life and so I did I did take my faith seriously as a child and tried to do the right things and tried to to follow his example but the one thing that was I guess a big challenge for me early on and I recall this going way way back is that I would always have questions that just couldn't get answered right and I would talk to my pastor I mean ask my dad about things and he usually had a little bit better insight typically than that some of the ministers that I would talk to but still I found that you know if I read scripture and tried to seek answers I would usually just kind of hit walls or or find a hole or something that couldn't be filled and and I just remember that that that was always a real challenge for me and I just seemed like there was something incomplete now that wasn't the reason why I ended up leaving the church but it was it was just kind of I think an early question that I had money do you call by chance what kind of answers you got to your inquiry well I mean I think it was Jim yeah I would say oftentimes it was the the typical answer was what God said it so why should we question that right it's in the Bible why should we question that kind of thing and you know and I can't even recall specific questions that I had I mean I know the one question that I often had was you know who made God yeah that's the one asked is it good you know but yeah it was just always kind of like you just have to accept it why why are you even asking questions why would you do that and I was wondering if you were getting the question well well that's what we Baptist leave yeah yeah sometimes that's an answer when you're asking well why do why this you know when they're and well that's what we believe yeah and I don't know that I had so much of a comparative sort of question you know it wasn't like I had influences that were you know special where I grew up everybody was Baptist you know he was out in the country of Kentucky so it wasn't like I looked at my Catholic friends and wondered why they did this now we'll say this this is interesting since converting I do recall we had a Catholic neighbor who lived across the street from us and when she passed away she gave my mother a crucifix and I remember this as a child my mother showing me this crucifix and you know here's the the corpus of Christ on this cross I'd never seen anything like it before and I remember my mother telling me you know this is this is what the Catholics this is across the Catholics have and miss Dawson had given us this and and I was just fascinated by it you know I just remember like really thinking wow there's there's something special like it was special because it was a gift to us but it was also there was something really special about this image that just intrigued me of know that Christ on this cross it was amazing since you were mostly a prop a Baptist area mm-hmm it's likely that your pastor and teachers did not feel the need to reference the the negative anti-catholic presumption yeah you know what probably didn't come up it was a it was a non-issue yeah yeah I don't even recall ever hearing anything anti-catholic per se as a Baptist as a Baptist now as an evangelical later on in life there was a little bit of a different story but no growing up I I heard negative about a lot of people and I remember my minister would kind of call people out and I didn't really ever feel that was appropriate some of the things that I hear from the pulpit but no I didn't I didn't have that kind of auntie like there was no Baptist superiority complex or anything of that nature but it was that did kind of come up come up when I became another Bible believing folk absolutely Lord Jesus yes yes and yourself were drawn to clear full scripture believing you know we in my church growing up we had a group of that we were very evangelical based in the sense that we would try to spread our faith as much as we could we did this thing called soul-winning where our youth group would actually go out as you know ten and twelve-year-old kids and knock on doors and invite people into a life of Christ through the Romans road of salvation you know all of these things that we would do so great I mean there was a sincerity there and there was a real desire I think to to fulfill the Great Commission of course I mean then it was part of what we did but I think that the biggest challenge for me I would say as as I got older I started seeing I guess these elements of hypocrisy and so when I would see somebody saying one thing and doing another it was really confusing to me and we basically had kids who were leading kids in youth group you know so it wasn't like we had any ministers necessarily these were maybe kids of more active members of the church or elders of the church or whatever who you know they maybe 19 18 years old and and they're leading the youth group for us middle schoolers kind of thing you know meaning but not well formed us yeah yeah and you know typical teenagers I think and so of course I was too young at that point to really understand probably the dynamic of what was happening in their lives and so when I saw the things that appeared to be hypocritical and inappropriate talk inappropriate behavior you know things that I just thought why would this even be the case here it just kind of really started selling even more seeds of doubt because you know I had those questions I could say from early on and then I see this inconsistency of belief and behavior and it started kind of pushing me away a little bit even you know as a 12 13 14 year old kid I just started to lose the whatever credibility I thought was there seem to kind of begin to erode so it was it became a challenge and it led me at that point down a path of of eventually abandoning my faith entirely during high school college yeah I would say it started during high school it's it's I was thinking about this recently there was a an episode in middle school that is just so incredibly vivid to me and I was like a salmon I was sincere as a as a bible-believing Baptist kid I would take my Bible to school and try to soul win at school and all of these things that wasn't very popular mind you when I would try to do that and I remember it at our lunch period we had kind of a little bit of free time afterwards where we could hang out and do whatever I guess and it's in place of recess we had this kind of social time in middle school and I remember hearing music one day and I thought what the heck is that and I went there was this stage area that connected the gym and the the lunchroom in my middle school and kids would hang out on the stage and and goof off and a friend of mine was there with his guitar playing guitar and he had this group of people around him and and I just remember it was like this rapt attention that people were paying to my friend playing guitar and I thought man there's something really special about this gift you know this gift of music and what it can do now granted it was more I have to be honest it was pretty selfish of my attraction as it was very enamored by the attention he was getting right right but I thought you know if he can do that I should be able to do that too and I remember that was there was an interesting turning point for me because it wasn't like I was the most popular kid going to school with my Bible and here's my friend who was actually one of my best friends with all of this attention because he's playing music you know so it was shortly thereafter that I ended up joining forces with them and we kind of began what was a still continues to be part of my life today as a career in music and so we began playing music together and then I got that attention as well and it was like oh this this is where I want to be that all of that faith stuff was very insignificant compared to do you think that as the attention you got rose your interest in in the faith oh absolutely oh yeah result of it yeah yeah yeah and you know unfortunately that that led me down a very challenged Road as a young adult because I fell into all of those traps you named them I mean sex drugs rock and roll the whole bit I mean oh is that I accepted that package how far do you go in the music at the time well by the time I was out of college I was with a band that was playing regularly playing regionally so we had a good following it was before the days of Facebook and MySpace and all the things you could really garner the attention that you could now but we did pretty well we played a lot of gigs we were shopping labels plan in kind of a three or four city area so yeah it was it was a big deal we stayed very busy released a couple of tapes back in the day you know what knids John what happened I mean at some point you you'd end up Catholic but you can't return to your face I did yeah yeah you know I think finally what happened was that lifestyle obviously what happened that lifestyle took its toll you know because I did like I say I fell into every one of those traps and the entire time I was still I still had those questions you know those questions even from childhood were still there and nothing was really answering those questions and I guess I decided somewhere along the way that I would try to basically build some sort of philosophy structure that was something that I could rely on and I'd been exposed somewhere along the way and again before the days of the internet I'm not exactly sure how I came across this but Eastern philosophy was very appealing to me so I because I guess you could have some sort of belief structure but it didn't necessarily infringe on my my personal behavior right so I could do the stuff that I wanted to do but have some sort of philosophy along with that so the doubt a team that came up very I was gonna say your eye puts you a little bit younger than me but I do remember when that Eastern music influenced later yeah yeah yeah and you know I think in the kind of alternative culture the hippie culture if you will you know that those remnants stayed on and you know and I think you could still find that today kids are very enamored by that and so for me it kind of became a replacement to some degree of whatever theology that I may have had this Eastern philosophy was an opportunity for me to kind of have again the structure without putting any limitations on what I was doing but what it ultimately led to was a real just kind of there was nothing there was no foundation there was nothing foundational for me to rely on and you know at this point in my early twenties is probably where I was and real challenged with the lifestyle I was leading it just everything took its toll I mean everything took its toll broken relationships the fact that I was abusing myself with substances I had nothing that was again with any kind of solid foundation I just I found myself really emotionally challenged to the point where I wasn't sure if I wasn't maybe losing my mind I mean it was it was that severe I found myself in a in a couple of instances really kind of losing contact with reality and again I had abused myself pretty severely with some substances to the point that I had what was only described through professionals as psychotic episodes that yeah yeah and as a result of that ended up arrested I ended up on court-ordered therapy for a solid year three times a week early on I had lost my license to drive of us having to ride a bike to do this and again I'm a 23 4 year old kid who is you know coming to grips with all of this stuff that's happening and I ended up with his craziest thing I had a therapist who was a very devout Episcopal and he could kind of see where I had come from at least you know my background and what I was challenged by and and he was there was never any any kind of you know he didn't offer well the Episcopal Church was the solution to you necessarily but he said you know I you may want to explore this god thing a little bit more because from what you're telling me you haven't really come to grips with with a lot of things that are really working in your heart right now so it's he wasn't just a psychologist from the sense of you know it's all head stuff I mean he he really kind of guided me spiritually early on you know now that I have a spiritual directorate's I kind of realized that's what he was doing for me even then and it began to open up some doors that that I'd really never wear at least I hadn't thought about in a long time that maybe I need to take this faith thing seriously as I think about you looking back that the combination and we see all the time of the music world the the substance world and and these alternative religions all of those dangerous combination come together to shake all the foundations that it would have been there for you for your whole life and then I mean there I've just we've seen happening all the time I mean we talked about spiritual warfare oh yeah I mean there you go yeah yeah well what was interesting is after this experience I left after of like I say about a year of that pretty intense therapy just to kind of keep myself out of trouble legally happy with well you know my parents really didn't know a lot about this I have to say you know I'm out of my own at this point I think they kind of had some idea of what was happening that you know I was I had to borrow money from my parents and didn't really explain a lot of what I was challenged but I think I maybe said I had a car repair or something oh that's that's why it's thousands of dollars that I need you know because I was having to pay legal fees and the things that I was I was being faced with there but I guess as it ended up at at least that period opened my heart up enough to say maybe I had been there and done that which is kind of what I thought about Christianity you know I thought it was it left me with more questions than answers and it's not a place that I necessarily want to be and it's interesting because through this time I was also I had begun a radio career which I began doing voice work when I was in college so at the age of 19 actually stepped into working in professional media and I was in rock radio at the time naturally and I remember I had a I got hit this crossroads with where I was at the station I was working for and at the time I was doing overnight so it was midnight to 6:00 a.m. my moniker on air was freak daddy that was my my air name which also kind of matched my lifestyle at that time and I remember Marcus I I was just at this point where again I've been through all of this and I'm like you know there's got to be something more there's got to be something that I have yet to really embrace here I got down I met them it's like 4:00 a.m. in the morning I'm at the control board in the radio station that the biggest rock radio station in Lexington I literally get on my knees I've never prayed on my own I was in calf I've never been on my knees to pray ever the first time I'd ever surrendered myself physically in this position before I get on my knees and I pray Lord I just I want to give this to you whatever it is you name it whether it's my career my life my direction if it's getting me out of this station where there's a lot of influence is still that we're not healthy for me you name it I just I just I just want want you to take control and within a week and it and I told my boss at the time I said you know I might be I might be called to ministry I don't know I think that maybe I'm supposed to be a minister and of course he got a good chuckle handle again freak daddy yeah yeah yeah cities like okay pretty getting good good job whatever meant and but here's what was amazing within a week I got a call from a competitor in the market and they wanted me to come to the morning show now this was a real interesting proposition for me because literally I thought maybe I'm supposed to go into seminary you know maybe they're supposed to kind of follow my dad's footsteps and maybe actually do what he wasn't able to do can complete this and go into full-time ministry as a Protestant I wasn't sure but when I get this call from the other station I think well maybe this is an answer to prayer maybe this is an opportunity where I can maybe step into at least a new role and maybe have an opportunity to get out of the influences that were a part of this other radio station and into this new page now it was still rock radio was alternative rock radio and basically I'm given a position yeah yeah it Lexington's a town of 300 thousand innocent it's not a huge place but I'm suddenly thrust into this morning radio position which was very high-profile there was a high profile radio station and I even had then suddenly I had even more opportunities of negative stuff that I had before during the seasons of thinking about ministry you're not really actively back in the faith no no no not at all and I had I had no literally probably read the New Testament a few times at this point because I was active and I least had some degree of prayer life and some degree of formation because I was reading scripture and so I was trying to apply this but I was also trying to apply it with my own spin still right I had there was no formative element outside of my own you know I mean I'm just trying to figure my way through this no church home I'd been to church a few times here and they're kind of shopped around well this was a turning point because within about six months of being in this position at this new rock radio station still freak daddy mind you I began a relationship with one of the sales reps at the station and she she and I decided to go to a concert that was in Louisville which is about an hour drive out of Lexington and at the time I had a contented Cadillac I had a 1969 Cadillac Coupe DeVille that a friend of mine had dubbed the Freak dad alack by the way and this thing got about five miles to the gallon and yeah exact 455 four-barrel and she said well why don't we drive my car because it's it's easier on gas it's near a car I'm like you know I have to twist mine but she says she said oh by the way I don't have insurance that's what she told me okay great is it this was at this point this was 1996 sevenish our car was I remember in 1995 Dodge Intrepid it was a year to old and so we drive to the concert I have a couple of beers she has a couple of dozen beers and she's passed out in the car on the way home and I'm really gets late late at night I'd been up since 4:00 o'clock the morning before because I'm doing a morning show I'm doing you know 6 to 10 a.m. and so I'm thinking I got to get some caffeine in my system I get up be able to stay awake to drive home I go to a little love you know convenience store I go to get a coffee and I'm gonna ice it down and just chug this thing so I can get you know a jolt of caffeine and there ice machine is broken so I've got to sip this super hot coffee too to get home and the last thing I remember I said the cruise control at 65 this was when the speed limit was 55 on the interstate remember maybe about five miles of driving maybe and the next thing I remember is an embankment of Earth off the interstate and we're airborne in the car and I had fallen asleep behind the wheel and I you know it's one of the things you think in your last moments of life you're gonna call upon the Lord maybe right that's kind of what I'd always had in the background but I had that reserve back there you know just in case well the craziest thing is the only thing I could do as we're literally in the air and it's all slow-motion I mean it when I think about it it's like just kind of like moving through molasses you know all of this this that's happening the only thing I can say is I'm sorry I'm wrecking your car like I'm yelling this you're I'm stuck in your car she's like coming out of her stupor like what's going on you know but Gabby it was insane it was crazy and I remember I'm looking over at the interstate and I'm thinking if I can just get back over there I'll be alright but there's no control because we're in the air literally and it was amazing what happened after that because I mean I I'm sure I meant I'm like this is it this is it's we're done for I mean we're off the interstate we're in the air I mean the car is starting to tilt on my side and I'm pretty confident that I'm gonna take the impact of the accident because it's coming down on the driver's side something and I don't know how this happened because I've driven past this place many times I'm like where did this even come into play the car ends up coming back up right and landing and like the softest Martius muddiest stuff that you can imagine when we hit it was like you know the x-wing fighter going into the Dagobah and it was like this you know just kind of just soft and smooth landing the glove compartment opened and there was no interior damage to the car whatsoever and I'm sitting here in this car thinking that didn't have to just happen no that didn't have to happen and we get out of the car there's a police officer immediately who had apparently been trying to pull me over there's another guy who jumps out of his car and he's you know are you guys alright you alright I've been following you for miles I've been blowing my horn and trying to get you to stop you almost took out five cars I mean I don't know how long you been asleep but apparently I've been all over the interstate asleep and then we launched off and go airborne and land softly so needless to say I walked away from that going God obviously has other you know them whatever I'm doing right now and so that's those we got a good place to pull sure sure you think yeah yeah let's come back after the break because yeah I mean all right lord I was totally in your hands he held now what do you want me to do yeah good let's come back in a second let's find out what he did that sure okay welcome back to the journey home on Marcus Grodi your host our guest Leo Brown we kind of left right in the middle you've landed in the mosses and you know you look back the beauty of when something that of course miraculous happens in your life in that instant you see an evidence of grace right because you could have said pointed I lucky oh yeah or you could have said point ain't I good yeah but instead you were seeing Lord you were recognizing what you know and what's interesting is the the girl that I was with basically took it that way you know you know what she kind of had this weird reaction that was kinda like this carpe diem like we could have died and now I got to go for the gusto kind of thing yeah it was very strange because I was going I think there was something more to this than that you know but what's interesting is she ended up being an impetus to a my step into the 8th angelical world because you know I had been out of the church completely no as we said foundation no formation and she said you don't want it I went to a church with a friend of mine that I think you might like and so she told me about this place and I went to checked it out and as soon as I walked in you know they're up there with electric guitars on stage and I'm thinking I can do this you know this this is all right so I got settled in there very quickly audition for the band and I was playing music in the group and I they found out that I got all this vast technical knowledge from radio and they said you know what we're we really need help so they show me this huge Mackay board and I'm like yeah I could do this you know so it I ended up being the tech director there for the the main ministry which you know it's probably about a two thousand seat auditorium at the time I think we had five services in the weekend Saturday and four on Sunday and then was slowly while it was there we built a two and a half million dollar youth facility so I transitioned into being the tech director for all of that because then we got all this equipment who's gonna run it so and then I had a team of kids probably you know five or eight kids any given Sunday that were under my formation and they were they were learning the the ropes of you know PowerPoint and you know the tech directing and all the stuff that we did because you know we had our own facility it was pretty amazing and we probably had about 150 to 200 kids on a regular basis every Sunday with that but what's interesting is it it really it gave me a him you can say what you want to say about the the megachurches for me it was a stepping stone because had I stepped into a Catholic Church at that point I probably would have run screaming because it we just wouldn't made sense to me so there was something about this church that met me where I was and gave me the opportunity then to I think see that there's always something deeper right because I thought before that I'd been there done that and then I found this and I'm realizing well there's another world and then I think that that really kind of tilled my heart so to speak to step into the Catholic Church but I think also we do affirm what's at the core of the even the mega churches mmm I mean it's about our Lord Jesus Oh what is sacrifice about Scripture it's about that personal relationship and the discipleship and it's all it's not everything and it's that's Brian the problem now mean what's there usually is it the core of what's good yeah and you know the the thing that I found with those guys is that they wanted to be very seeker friendly right so one thing was we don't we want to cross on state right we don't want to look like a church I mean it was a gymnasium essentially what with chairs that they would put on the floor because but it worked for me I mean it was when I need it when I walked in there again you know maybe if I'd have seen that crucifix that it was enamored by as a kid it may have been shocking to me you know I mean I don't know if this is really what I what I want right now but it met me where I was in it it it did bring me to an opportunity then that when I met my wife who was raised Catholic that was an opportunity for me to step into something that I had never considered before and if it would have been for her and her faith and the the fact that she was still solid as a calf as an adult right because typically my experience at least through college and on into young adulthood was every Catholic pretty much that I met they had that well I used to be Catholic but right you know what I mean it was they had some reason why they they were no longer kapha I would imagine a large percentage of those at your mega church oh sure yeah they couldn't believe me there were and that was another interesting thing when I started to step away from this they were ready to counsel me back like hey you know don't you're you're on the edge over here maybe come away you know come back but what was interesting is again you know her sincerity her willingness to be patient with me I think as well because ad how'd that originally get broached wellman that when the whole idea what a first kind of what we met because it was freak daddy and we were doing a bar remote and we were still freaked Eddie as you're all on the radio doing all the right yeah which was another weird thing altogether just to try to justify all of this but but I'm guessing that a part of that whole rock radio scene is it's assumed always pushing the envelope oh yeah yeah yeah well I mean it was I was a poor man's Howard Stern what are you talking about you know I mean that's that's kind of the whole thing that was my ambition in my career really you know to be on that level to be that you know Howard Stern type of figure so yeah we push the envelope a lot and then finally I tried to find a way to where we could kind of tried that area without being explicit only implicit right so and I kind of justified it that we really say it that way you know it did really come across like that because and we did outrageous things like you know we did a thing called clothing the naked listener Marcus where we would if someone actually answered that would send out my stunt guys you know you know my coke my co-host my sidekick I stayed in the studio I was kind of Marlin Perkins if you will you know the Wild Kingdom and he would go out and do all these outrageous things and if somebody answered their door nude would give them a t-shirt a station - sure oh yeah we did crazy stuff oh yeah yeah yeah but because they had that biblical reference you know clothing the naked like I justified it so yeah those are the kind of things I did but when you're in a church that on the one hand our loves our Lord Jesus it is non creedal right does not have all this foundation right for having a set moral code right you can push the envelope and the envelope was pushed not just by me but I discovered by others and and the community and you know the thing when I stepped away from that the thing I said to these guys because they saw it as a betrayal of course because it was incredibly entrenched with this community and I said guys look you know I wasn't gonna make it as an evangelical I wasn't gonna make it I just didn't have the tools you know but what I've discovered is that I had to have the Catholic faith for my salvation I had to have it otherwise I was gonna I was gonna find a loophole right I was gonna find somebody like that crazy stunt on the radio whatever I was gonna find something that would justify what I was doing because I was interpreting it all myself anyway yeah right but I met my wife in a bar because we were doing a bar remote and so we kind of it wasn't one of those situations where we were you know immediately locked together we became friends and we saw each other over the course of about a year and finally we went out for the first time we just had this amazing conversation and was mostly revolved around our faith and I'd never had that kind of conversation with anyone ever much less somebody that I was attracted to yeah so we began dating and I was introduced the first time to the Catholic Church and I had to say it was it wasn't like I came in like aha finally like what is this you know I remember the first thing Marcus I said why this music really needs some help yeah what the heck is this all about you know they heard a auditioning these people I mean come on so I came in with this arrogance that I thought I was gonna be able to somehow fix these problems that I was seeing in the liturgy you know I didn't know what liturgy was but I'm like they really need to spend about 20-30 minutes just getting into some praise here I mean what's it's up with this one entrance song and then you know they get right it yes I had all of these critiques of it but what was weird and I tell you this one took me a while to figure out I I would have kind of taking a step back to before I went into this this therapy early on in my 20s I I can what fall into these severe anxiety attacks that would basically end in almost this psychotic episode that's what led me into these this this they're at these therapy sessions early on well I started discovering in Mass a real similar reaction and I would remember we would usually pray the Our Father and then this craziness would kind of start to happen and I would have to leave I would physically get out of the church usually sweating profusely I would leave and I finally told my and and this this went on for a long time my wife and I were married in a combined ceremony of you know blessed by the Catholic Church with a priest but my youth minister came from my mega church had to borrow a suit he didn't even own a suit so he better borrow a suit that didn't fit and to do the service with us but so it was two years in our marriage before I stepped into our CIA but finally I just had to get some answers because I'm like this is crazy now didn't happen every time but there were definite times where I just I was so convicted it was like it was driven out I was driven out of this experience and it wasn't until going through my Catholic conversion and understanding the consecration and what was actually happening you know I'm in the presence of Christ you know and I had never experienced this physical presence of Christ prior to this and here's a guy that until I went to my fur confession through RCIA I mean I was packing baggage of all kinds of sin right I mean I just and an attachment and I mean you name it I mean all of these things that were still in my heart that I was still struggling with and and sometimes even still participating in right I mean all of this was there that I was bringing into the presence of Christ and it it's a sum retrospect to really understand all of that but that's why I couldn't I couldn't stay there yeah I was physically driven away you're talking about not merely an intellectual realization of the sin and the fact but there's a spiritual is a deeper oh yeah reaction that you're in canto IV it was in the process of visceral physical reaction that I all I knew is that I was so horribly uncomfortable than I had to get out it was amazing was that confronting you also and then the work you were doing and you said earlier that what bothered you way back man was the hypocrisy that was leader exactly I mean wife yeah yeah and and Here I am the biggest hypocrite ever yeah I mean we were recognizing that already at that point yeah yeah I think it was but you know at this point I had I'd stepped away from the evangelical ministry yeah because I was realize it was more and more drawn to the Catholic Church and but yet but I also knew that that I had a lot of issues and it was amazing the things that were beginning to get revealed to me and that you know I was really understanding about sin and about lifestyle choices and you know what and again I mean it was really having those that definitive understanding of what is what's moral and what's immoral right that that moral compass was even though Christ and the relationship that I had was real it was incomplete right it was just incomplete and there was so much that I really didn't understand and it wasn't until discovering like I say the the beautiful confines of the Catholic Church right the freedom that was given that was afforded to me when I was able to embrace Catholic teaching and Catholic morality it was like my goodness you know now I can fly because before I was weighed down with with so much well you do something wrong and Lord forgive me and just keep moving on but it's still there oh yeah yeah yeah well there was never absolutely and there was always I think God really say that you know I mean I was playing that card a lot hmm were you so now you're encountering your Baptist's upbringing your father who has this training who you've been preaching in front so you handled some Baptist Protestant formation not sure what kind of formation he got in the mega church because there's the non cradles yeah you were encountering doctrine mm-hmm as you're coming in was that standing as a barrier at all or was a no say oh my goodness it was because you know as I said before I always had this desire to have answers right and then now I've got this 2000 year tradition of salvation history and the writings of the saints and the teachings of the church and I remember the first time I got my hands on that big green catechism I'm like my goodness this is brilliant this is beautiful and I read it cover-to-cover him the people so now don't read that cover to cover it's more of a relic because I never live to us as amazing - yeah so no I I really embraced it and and I found it exactly what I needed when I needed it I mean it was amazing now what's interesting is I was going through this transition while I was still this morning show host of one of the highest-rated morning shows in the city I mean we did really well and I kind of became a local celebrity my conversion into the Catholic Church made news I mean it was it was a big newspaper paper article with a you know full-color photo of me and the whole bit so it was pretty interesting that I had that opportunity but while I was doing this I was doing a remote a broadcast live broadcast out on a weekend deal and my priest came to give me communion because I didn't make it to Mass because we're out at this event and this guy comes in we're at a movie cinema where we're doing this this big promotion and it's late at night this guy comes in and says his car's broken down he needs help and there's a priest my priest and a seminarian friend of his and I think what these guys are capable of helping this guy if they can help them but I remember the my priest friend father Norman Fischer he looked at me and as if to say are you and I of this game so I say okay sure what kind of help do you need music why I just I really need to ride home I said well do you need to go check your car out could we get it started is it out of gas what's gonna say no no I just need a ride I'm like okay so that's again I get in my car I'll take you home I get my cart man I got no gas now I come on first I got to get gas and I'll take you home ask him where he lives and it turns out this place that's about 30 miles away it's it's know we're in the neighborhood of Lexington it's this tiny community that's that's far outside of town and I'm thinking as I'm pumping gas is this guy gonna kill me oh what's going on this is crazy I get him in the car and he starts asking me all these questions his name is David and he says so Lea what what do you do and this and that and everything I say he's just a farming it was like the most affirming individual I've ever talked to like he's all that's great oh it's great you're doing that loud I mean everything whatever from the work I did to being Catholic I mean all just affirming me and everything I say and then he asked me this very bizarre question so Leah what do you hope to eventually do with your life I'm like I don't know I think maybe you know if I could have a way to combine my faith and my experience and radio and all of the things that I kind of have been formed to do if I could make all of that happen that would be pretty awesome he's like wow man I hope that works for you I certainly you know what I'm sure it's gonna work it's just mr. affirmation guy you know I'm like where did this come from I'd take him back in this tiny little trailer park that's so far off the beaten path there's no way I could go there today even though I kind of know the area twists and turns telling me how to get back I take them all the way to the back of the part to a completely dark trailer no sign of life whatsoever this guy's relatively well dressed very well groomed doesn't look like he would be where I'm taking him and I'm like is this your place he's it go yeah yeah oh do you need help with your car tomorrow or anything can can I help you and he said no no no I'm good is it bad I might I might want to get back and Rea okay he told me he was in radio to tell me Chris you think I might want to get back in radio at some points I give him my card I said we'll give me a call if you need to well the next day I saw my my priest friend and I said father man you wouldn't believe what happened last night with this guy is it go yeah tell me about it so I told mr. Idzik that doesn't surprise me I'm like why doesn't that surprise you and he said because he was an angel laughs like what he's like I knew that one I saw it now whatever go figure right I mean but it's pretty interesting what happened after that because it was shortly thereafter that I I did get the opportunity to come on board with Catholic radio and and that was something that wasn't on my radar screen at all it was something that I had never even articulated until that evening with this gentleman when I was giving him the ride I hadn't even put it all together so at the very least it kind of began my course toward what I do now and the ministry that I'm blessed to do because I had that conversation well you can't avoid the reality of angels when you read the New Testament that was sure yeah they're there the rod we entertained them all the time that I think announced I think again you talked about the beauty of this church that it helps us have that the freedom within boundaries in the Protestant world the the mega church world do you believe in angels are not well right it's whatever it's up there being a here but the church now no that's the way khat does right our attention and a great variety Lee well if you look back on your step into it one thing is making that transition from a musical world or unapologetically it's about me and then through a conversion and recognizing it about me and what do you do with with the gifts and the music and and the upfront Ness and all of that without going through the the spiritual conversion to our Lord in this church yeah well I think you have to recognize that whatever we have is is a gift right and just as the charismatic gifts are not for us right we don't worship the gifts but they're there to use we have to realize that we have a gift and we have to use them and that's certainly how I look at it now as a musician or as yeah in radio whatever that I can do if I know that by me offering testimony and a show of this nature or if it's what I do every day on the air and presenting a perspective it's not about how can I entertain you but but how can we walk together and wrap our heads and hearts around these issues even more solidly and and together become even better Catholics and and how do we do that yeah push that even a little more because you know when you were in the alternative radio weather you had it consciously in front of you or not there was a goal of pushing people's life yeah sure well now you have this you don't you never know who's watching the show radio right you have that potential of nudging people's lives and the channel yeah of God's grace and talk about the beauty of that now my goodness well you know our station moniker is change your station change your life that's what we say and we've promoted that we've put it on Billboard's and we say it all the time on the air and we know it's true because you know we hear the testimonies our bishop even says that over half of the RCIA candidates every year will say the radio station played a part of that it's amazing I personally anecdotally have been to RCIA classes where everyone will say this radio station played a part of me being here so you know those kind of things are you just can't you can't measure that I mean there's no way of putting any kind of price tag or measurement tool or anything that says other than this is the Holy Spirit that's working and God's working in their lives and it's it's all coming together and you know and usually for me I get those experiences that consolation comes at a time when I really really need it you know when it's been a very challenging time whether we've been assaulted with technical difficulties or our finances are challenged or you name it I'll be walking out a mass and someone will stop me and say Leo I just got to share this with you I'm glad I ran into you because in they'll share a story of how the radio station has brought them back to their faith or their families or it's just amazing and you know I sometimes feel like the guy in the cartoon with Michigan Jay Fogg you know what I'm talking about where the Frog gets out and sing sure I love my baby he'll I'm gonna get under like cuz I'm like I hear these stories I know you guys don't but you know coz I'm telling my board yet they they're out there believe me but it's it happens again you know when we need it and we know what's working and and and that's what's beautiful is that the fact that Catholic media is there to really provide these answers yeah I and you and I as converts we're not unique you know there's so many more that would I mean if they could sink their teeth into this Catholicism thing it would just be an amazing gift to them yeah and I think that that's why we do what we do and sometimes even Lee you mentioned yourself it's it's hard to communicate the beauty of this church to those outside and but God in His wisdom and his love for us can niche along the way sometimes using stepping stones as he did in your own right sure you know it sometimes it was a church that least brought you back to Christ right or letting you fly free through the air completely out of control to realize it the core of your being I need I know yeah and then dropping in your wife your life a wife who will open your heart at least to consider the beauty of the church oh yeah yeah you be good just a couple seconds here but didn't you wanted to wish somebody's how are you meetings tonight yeah it's it's my mother's 85th birthday yeah how cool is that that is that is now yeah cuz often to me that's what the journey home program is all about is an opportunity to tell what God has done in our lives to sometimes those in our lives that that was a little fullness of there but thank you for letting to do that happy birthday mom what's the website real life radio.com and we stream live there we have a lot of other resources but real life radio.com you'll find everything about what we're doing in lexington kentucky and and beyond all right thanks Lee Thank You Martha thank you very bad bless you for opening up sharing your ginger but also sharing your life again the work that you do share great work you do for Catholic radio thank you very much thank you thank you for joining us on this episode of the journey home let's pray for Leo as he continues to work and using the gifts that God has given him for the glory of God and to be a channel of the goodness of the church through radio Thank You Leo thank you joining us god bless see you next week

Channel: EWTN

Views: 16,594

Rating: 4.858407 out of 5

Keywords: JHT01390

Id: aCbpJ-39eys

Length: 56min 27sec (3387 seconds)

Published: Tue Apr 30 2013