The Evolution Of Long-Term Intimacy: Wisdom From 23 Years of Marriage | Julie Piatt X Rich Roll

everyone that I know is in a pivotal moment of transformation it doesn't matter what stage of life you're in but I think giving ourselves the permission to recommit and like redefine what is the relationship is great Freedom it's not necessarily comfortable or easy but isn't that in fact our mission to know each other why else are we together it has been profound what we have experienced as a couple in honoring that our relationship deserves our presence and to see what is waiting for us to ReDiscover and uncover it's a whole new slate it's a whole new canvas I think the possibilities are endless today is all about intimacy we're going to talk about Intimacy in relationships how to evolve a long-term relationship Beyond calcified habits and routines expectations and projections and instead summon the courage to truly see your partner and allow yourself to be seen by your partner plus we're going to talk about Lessons Learned From the front lines of startup entrepreneurship and we're going to do this through the lens and through the experience of my wife and our 23 years together the most recurring guest in the history of this podcast Julie Patt longtime listeners are well acquainted with Julie's mystical way days with wisdom but if this happens to be your first introduction to the one who goes by shrimati uh what you need to know is that she is a truly multi-talented and multi-dimensional being she's a yogi musician Chef designer author Mama of four and the founder and CEO of Shu the best and only plant-based cheese you need concern yourselves with Julie is graciously gifting all of you guys with a a special deal on Shu when you sign up for an annual subscription to any of shu's ebx offerings at sho.com she's kindly rewarding you with the 13th box free when you use the code RRP fam 13 at checkout as well as 22% off the brand new ceremony box which includes 2 8 oz mlay chocolate mousse cakes shu's newest and first dessert offering when you use the code ml22 ma a l a y22 at checkout sho.com all right let's get into it hi Julie pie first of all rich can I just hold your hand across this table yeah I mean it's I'm a little close on the mic though there yeah no it's been a long time that we've been 12T away is this it Universe no I mean the the RP table oh yes yeah exactly the last time you were here the table was still long right yeah this is the first time okay I'm feeling you're happy very uh intimate well I always enjoy uh having you on the most frequent guest in the history of the podcast and while I was in um Atlanta at this running man event which I'll share about in a minute um lots of people coming up to say that their favorite episode episodes are the ones with you same in Memphis a that's sweet I appreciate that and typically We Begin these conversations with a bunch of hand ringing around uh the leadup to the conversation and me pestering you about finding time to sit down so we can hash out what we're going to talk about uh but I didn't do that this time so you should be proud of me I TR this is trust this is intimacy Julie yeah you didn't do it last time but you really didn't do it this time time yeah really you really didn't I I very intentionally you didn't even give me a look it wasn't even like a look like have you thought about what you're going to talk about on my show right now I'm tempted to say have you but I didn't I'm not saying that even though I kind of just did yeah definitely now I have but I'm just open to what the moment will present so how are we doing I think we're doing pretty well don't you I think so we're in we're at an interesting moment in our in our marriage in our relationship this moment I think it's a uh a transitionary phase we're in a semi um uh new space with uh two of our young our two youngest out of the house the boys still live with us but they're like roommates because they're older um and so now we're liberated from having to pick people up wherever or you know cook lots of food for lots of different people it's quieter at the house um but sudden L it's like oh hey who are you you know we don't have to be the transportation department anymore exactly um and so I think there's a um a process of trying to get to know each other in a new and different way that has presented itself which is an opportunity but also you know a little scary we've been together for 23 years is that the number yeah I mean we started dating in '99 yeah yeah that's true 23 years so pretty amazing how are you feeling about everything I'm feeling great actually about it I think it's a I think it's a moment of and you know listen every parent every couple that has kids that are listening to this you know you guys are all know the drill yeah the empty well what it's like when you have the kids and your relationship sort of becomes about you know the MTA like who's picking up who and who's getting what and it becomes very not necessarily transaction but logistical in nature yeah definitely I mean Can Can it can it can but I think apart from that I mean apart from that because that does not define our entire relationship I mean we're not really a couple that's been mired in who's picking who up so much no but you know it's it is a you know complicated decision Tree on days about like who's going where when and how they going to get there and all that kind of stuff like that does that can predominate at times and it has throughout you we've done good that our relationship isn't all about that but obviously we're both sympathetic to what that's like for parents who are raising kids and you know they have needs and places they need to go and all that kind of stuff and so your relationship can become um out of balance and overly kind of um capitalized by those types of conversations at the cost of what brought you together in the first place yeah definitely I do I feel like what we're experiencing is something much deeper than that it's more uh an opportunity of recommitting in a new way and of understanding that we've experienced many many things in 23 years that include uh children and creative projects and um experiences of life and um loss of life and you know all the things that are in a lifetime of 23 years and I think that we are for many different reasons in a place of redefining what that commitment is and I think that one of the exciting things is that we have come to a point of understanding that in order to move through so that there is no way out there is only through and in order to move through we have to be willing to uh basically uh burn or uh transmute that entire relationship of those unspoken agreements or expectations or projections of what each other have been of of what we've been to each other in order to make room for something new and so you know the Julian Rich that you know has been chronicled on this podcast for all the years of the podcast for 10 plus years um that relationship is is complete it's it's it's been fulfilled in in that form and so one of the great things that I think that is really exciting is that uh we are going into deeper layers of our relationship and where we might transcend evolve and become from this point forwards mhm and for me that's not oh the the kids have been in and we've been taking them places that's yeah I understand very but but that is kind of like a benchmark where you can plant a flag and and and easily see a demarcation line between what was before and what what is to come definitely um and it's a it's a it's a dynamic that is equal parts exciting but also terrifying um because it is forcing me to get out of my comfort zone and the comfortable kind of ruts and routines that just make life go easy and to uh you know offer up like a deeper level of honesty and sharing with you um which is scary because you know I kind of like things the way they are and it's easy and you know it's it's fine um and you're like I want to know all of you and I was like do you really I don't know if you really do I don't know if I want to share you know like what does that mean um so there is a you know I I have a um built-in you know default setting that that that makes me recoil when you present me with that yes um but I also recognize the opportunity and I don't want to and I'm and I'm very aware that you know a relationship is never static just like anything like you're either moving towards each other or away from each other and we're faced with a choice right now because we can't to stay the way that we've always been if we do that it is a it you know it is a a vote for Decay and I don't want to Decay and I don't want to be divorced from you or separated from you I do want to move toward you um but just not that deeply yeah like maybe a little bit we'll see you know we'll see how that goes I'll dip my toe in that um yeah we laugh but it is true it's a little scary for me and you're so good about creating um ritual and you know kind of symbolism around that to really uh Infuse that decision or this conversation with a deeper level of intentionality that makes it more three-dimensional than just like well we talked about that and we'll see how it goes right like we did a fire ceremony so maybe you can walk through that I mean the importance of ritual and what ritual means to you is something we've talked about in the past on the podcast so I don't want to necessarily retread that but I think there is something to be said for investing in the Paw necessary so that a decision and a new way forward can plant its roots so that it becomes um more capable of of of fruiting I guess of fruiting yeah that's the first time I've heard that word in a very long time well if you're going to if you want fruit you need Roots right fr people yeah if your roots aren't good the fruit is not going to so is not going to but I mean where this came from is you know first of all you know a point in evolution um but I was telling you that one of the most beautiful moments that I ever gazed upon you was after go on what is it do you have like a more do you have more a more intellectual word for gazed upon you you want no I'm saying like this is my ego like this so please continue okay was when uh after you had finished Ultram man that famous race where I was your crew Captain um you were just stripped bare of everything that burdens you that chase you chases you that haunts you that makes you run away from me that makes you run away from life or people and you were just raw and in that state you were just a sight of such beauty and what I shared with you recently was that I want to know you at that level and I want to be known at that level and I told you I'm coming for you so it's not like um you know it's not like you know you can just run away and hide because I'm I'm asking for presence is what I'm asking I'm asking to be courageous enough to sit with me and see me in my presence even though it scares you even though we may discover something that we don't know about each other that we haven't shared yet and it's hard to imagine that we we could be together 23 years and there could still be aspects of our s that we don't that we haven't shared but I think that that's true I think that we all are hiding something or never felt comfortable revealing something and it it's really a focus because what you were really speaking to when you were talking about picking up and is it's losing the presence of your relationship to a routine and it's easy to it's easier to not be present right it can sometimes be a lot easier to distract yourself and you know it's I'm busy it's work or there's Netflix or there's training or there's you know and it's not just you it's just whatever it is in life and and for me it's like you know if you think that we may be alive 20 more years neither one of us uh took vows or got into this relationship so that we could sit on the couch and say we've arrived like that hasn't been the theme of our relationship and even in the way that we come to this table in Stripes you know it's demonstrated in the jacket that you have on and the stripes that I have on we're very different beings we're from very very different perspectives and the beauty of that is when we can come together and that friction creates the Alchemy that's the beauty of this relationship and so really the question is is what else is there for us to discover and do we have the courage to go there even though it may reveal something new you know something different and I feel like a lot of people right now uh in relationships are going through this very process so I think it's very exciting I mean we definitely have been a lot more intimate and connected than we've been in years and you know it's sort of like a whole new frontier it's a whole new slate it's a whole new canvas and so um I think the possibilities are endless and I'm coming for you yeah I know see it's terrifying what am I supposed to do with that you're coming for me no I don't mean that like it's like a threat no you know I'm coming for you and I'm going to know you and you're going to know me and I'm like okay what about that scares you uh I don't know I just I think you know I am you like to be unknown it's not that I like to be unknown there is a resistance to or or just like sort of a a a zone of privacy that you know feels like like a comfort zone that um I'm reluctant to to you know forsake well you'll still have privacy but you know it doesn't have to be like I'm coming for you like you're like I'm gunning for you well no I mean the thing I mean that can be a beautiful thing it can be a romantic thing it's not like a an Annihilation thing right yeah so I mean from your side what is it that you want to know about me or what what is it like or do you do you do you have the same uh uh now I'm really on the spot desire no here's the thing hold on excuse me um of course like I do think that we have been in you know kind of an extended period of habituation to a norm and our relationship no relationship can survive that right like if you don't change then you will be changed and that you know a relationship is not immune from that so uh I'm very cognizant of the need to elevate you know the way that we interact with each other um and I'm deeply aware that I want to be with you I don't want to be without you I don't want to be away from you I want to be with you would you even say you want to be close to me would you would you say that you want to know me at the de aspect of me as long as I get to Retreat to my corner occasionally and like you know charge my battery up dude you sleep in a tent I have my own private quarters you know psychologist wet dream to try to figure out that whole thing right so we'll see how it goes I'm game for it you know I'm looking forward to it it's already it's already paid dividends in terms of our connection I think we have a long I feel good I feel I feel much closer to you I feel aligned with you I feel um I mean it feels really good to just celebrate you like to just go to Memphis and it's about you and Shu and that's the only reason that I'm there and I'm not trying to like sneak off and check my phone or make it about me or any of the you know kind of Character defects that typically Croc up crop up um that involve my ego and insecurities um and it was beautiful to just be in reverence of of you and and in celebration of what you achieved in this Vision that you have um and I think uh you know I I definitely want more of that and I know that um you are like in terms of like what are our needs and are our needs being met right and what are the wounds that we both bring into this equation that flare up when those needs aren't getting met um and understanding those and anticipating how to make sure that each other's needs are getting met so that we can um relax into each other and that intimacy becomes a comfortable place as opposed to a scary place that I that that that I find myself throwing walls up against the so the intimacy is what's scary and that's where the treasure is that's where the treasure lies uhhuh so until you until you until you what do you think happens in there like what do you think Happ that's that's the fear the fear is if you really know me you will run in the other direction because I am fundamentally broken and unlovable and so I front a certain way to be a certain person who can uh create the appearance of lovability and to some level uh you know I can sustain that but I have to retreat into my corner to charge the battery because that requires a lot of Tak takes a lot of energy right so when you drop all of that and you're like well this is who I am that's terrifying because you know there is something deep down that feels like if you really knew me like you would you would you would you would find me you know repulsive but in the knowing you is where the true intimacy is and without Shadow so you say no without Shadow there really isn't there really isn't any love and I mean I can share this one I can share this one experence recently which was quite enlightening for me and that is that we had a date night we went to the movies and we went to one of those places where it's like reclining and you can order food and the whole thing and so when we get to our seats I realize that you have bought two seats that are not together it's like over exaggerating happened let me just say let me just tell he bought two seats you know how when you go and you in the theater you have two that are together it's like there's they're a pair right but what he did is he bought like the left side and the right right side of two pairs and so I'm sitting there and there's this huge like hard space between us and I'm like dude like what why did you buy this seat like like and you're like no I did this on P purpose because I need to sit in the middle of the theater because this is where I want to I need to sit like ever so slightly to the left of center MH because I have all right go ahead no so I'm so I after a minute I take a breath I take a breath and then I'm think to myself okay wow I can't believe he did this and then I'm like so I say honey I'm going to go to the front and I'm going to see if they can switch my seat because I want to sit next to him I don't want to hold hands with him across a table so I go to the front and the woman moves the seat and I come to him and I said she moved us to the right so you it means he had to move into the pair to the right and you were completely annoyed and you're like now I'm not sitting in the middle and like this is a problem and when I realized is that that has something to do with your lazy eye and your sight and so you you shared with me in that experience that the world is skewed for you a little bit all the time and you have to correct for it but literally that was the first time I ever understood that after 23 years of being with you and what it did was it made me love you more it made me understand why you made that decision and I was like oh my God like he's compensating for that instead of me feeling like what is wrong with this dude like why would he choose that well there's part of there's there's two parts to it one is the crazy part which is like I have this weird OCD thing about like cemetery and like I want to be in the center seat and have it like everything has to be like a Wes Anderson movie where everything is perfectly aligned on each side um but because my left eye is so weak I have to be a little bit to the left because of the way my eyes work so even though I'm a little bit to the left of center I I perceive it as being in the center and that's that's the neurological piece that I had never shared with you but kind of you know I carry with me you had never even shared really the part I was watching so so I was watching the David Beckham documentary which I know you watched and it's fantastic anybody who hasn't seen it on Netflix it's a it's a beautifully rendered four-part series um but the parts particularly like in the later episodes where he's showing uh he's showing everybody his wardrobe and how he like organizes all of his clothes and all of that and I was like see that guy that's how I think like that's I would I do the exact same thing he's sort of like embarrassed yeah and I I don't like want to talk about that because it's there's something wrong with me you know no it's something amazing I mean so anyway I mean I think it's I is this bringing us together do you feel do you feel absolutely I mean this is this is the definition of intimacy It's like because if you're hiding something and you're not you know I mean it only brings more intimacy and connection that's all that's all there is in there and that's what presence brings so I really appreciate and I I really like that you shared that with me and it doesn't make me think oh he's a you know he's crazy or well there's there's a lot more there's a lot more weirdness where that came from we can go all the way go down there it might be a huge relief so uh what would you say or recommend to you know somebody who's watching or listening who is finds himself who is sort of finding them themselves in a relationship where where it's it's it's somewhat stagnant and there is that yearning for a deeper intimacy like how does one who hasn't who isn't as practiced in this you know Embark upon on that or raise it with their partner well I mean I think it's is having the desire you know is the most important thing it's not like I'm an expert at it I haven't digested it and been through it I I think when you agreed with me that you wanted to do this with me I wrote the outline of a book and sent it to you like within six hours yeah there's been a lot of recommended books and other things that yeah that yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah so then um and then also I'm I'm exploring some SE uality books that I don't I'm not going to share right now because I haven't digested them and I'm finding that they're a little off base but they have they have some core practices that I think will be useful so like we're designing I'm designing a Protocol no uh I'm designing a protocol for us and we'll see like how how it how it goes you know what works for us I mean we're very very good actually in in a room together like we don't really need a facilitator you know we do pretty well together if we're both willing and if we're both facilitator like you mean like a therapist you talking about like a sex therapist like a somebody standing there when we're trying to like have no I don't just anything like I'm trying to visualize what you mean I just meant like a therapist like we just you know we we have really good communication skills and um we've you know we've done a pretty good job you know communicating in our relationship and and I mean the thing this thing that we went through is largely um connected to co so it was also that polarization that we were we were playing it out in our own marriage and and luckily we were wise enough and loving enough that we stayed together through that because you're a you're a WID stripe suit guy and I'm a poncho striped you know tablecloth girl so you know that was a very that was the challenge and and I would say more so than driving kids around I I really think it was that moment on the planet where everything was being polarized and so I just want to recognize us that we are here and that we um found our way to stay together so um uh you know I don't know what I would say really to all of us cuz you know everyone that I know is in a pivotal moment of transformation it doesn't matter what stage of life you're in but I think giving ourselves the permission to recommit to recommit and like redefine what is the relationship is great freedom and you know the only thing to fear is fear itself because there is no way out there's only through and you know I love you so deeply and I know you love me so deeply there's no other way you know there's there's not walking away there's no walking away we have to go deeply into each other and really see what's there and create something new that will provide the next Evolution for let's say the next 23 years and it's not necessarily comfortable or easy but isn't that in fact our mission to know each other if we're going to be in relationship isn't that in fact the true desire to know you deeply and to be known deeply I mean why else are we together out of habit or out of an agreement or out of some social construct um I don't think that's why we're together I don't think it's ever been why we're together and the proof of that has been this podcast and you know what is birthed out of our experience together I mean I told you during these discussions of recent you know I will never do what I did with you with anyone else and you will never do what you did with me with anyone else it has been profound what we have experienced as a couple and in honoring that uh I think our relationship deserves our presence and to see what is next what is waiting for us to ReDiscover and uncover yeah that's beautiful I'm with you for that whole thing awesome as scary as it may be for me but um I don't want to know what the alternative to that is a thank you and also thank you for your presence in that and thank you for meeting me and saying yes because there's a lot of men that wouldn't so thank you for being willing and and being there for me and being able to say no I'm here you know I'm right here it means a lot all right well what is the moment presenting for you right now just your cuteness and you know the wico T-shirt can we talk about Wilco sure I mean I just saw we took Trapper to uh the ace theater to see Wilco for his it was his 27th birthday and you are a hardcore Wilco fan for sure I was familiar with some of the most popular songs um I have never been so ambushed by a musical act in my life uh in the way of the the sort of unassuming way they slid onto the stage and they're singing uh you know what I would say is just a sort of maybe um calm music I don't know just sort of very ch music no no just wait but then they they ended up taking me on this journey that literally slayed me creatively like I have never seen a band play at that level and I it was just so unassuming it was you know there wasn't like explosions not not that not that I like explosions but it it was very subtle you know in in the way that it that it came about and I just became became a gigantic Wilco fan I was absolutely slayed better better late than never yeah better late than ever as I as I told the boys uh that night um I think going to see Wilco live uh is one of the last vestiges of authentic uh Gen X of an authentic Gen X experience like the crowd was definitely you know like of the older ilk lot of silver-haired guys yeah um and I think Jeff Tweety is is exactly my age but he's you know listen uh singer songwriter of a generation surrounded by some of the most masterful musicians on the planet who just Crush you know so yeah it's quite it's quite the experience I definitely want to get Jeff Tweety on the podcast he has this well he has a book about to come out but I think he passed through LA and I missed the moment while he was here in town but there are solutions around that that we said and actually interesting enough uh one of my team members June Kim uh became friendly with the basis wife and so I've already sent them Shu so I hope shu is finding them on Wilco is consuming consuming Shu I hope so I hope so I mean I'd be honored um it was just really such a beautiful uh deep um creative uh original um everything about them was just extraordinary so anyway it's it's heartwarming to hear you say that cuz I didn't I didn't know I as you said I've been a fan for a long time but I didn't know that it would connect with you yeah it did and then actually when we got to cross town I found out so I went to cross town Concourse about 10 days ago to get my Cafe ready for the grand opening launch um somebody told me that Wilco had actually played at the radio station there so um one of the guitar players is good friends with the founder of the radio station in Cross toown Concourse which is the vertical community in Memphis Tennessee where uh Shu has just opened up her first Flagship wine and cheese Cafe in addition it's where all my production exists now so it is our home in Memphis Tennessee and cross town is a vertical Community it's 1,500,000 Square fet the size of the Empire State Building on its side uh and it is um just at the Forefront of all things beautiful in life Artisan residency um music listening libraries recording studios performance theater um a new thought high school health care for 880,000 people the working uninsured uh and much much more also Global Cafe run by Refugee women um and Shu in my opinion has one of the Premier spots it was spot 13 and it's just at the base of this beautiful spiral red modern staircase uh so when you when you walk up the staircase you're in a gorgeous Museum that's like a Moma level Museum um also leading to the performance theater and green room and Art Bar um and then at the base of the stairs is where shimu wi and cheese Cafe is now uh open and ready for a new life yeah congratulations thank you so much um it was my first visit to Memphis so I just got back from Memphis and then an event in Atlanta called Running Man that I'll that I'll talk about but we were all in Memphis to celebrate the opening of your Flagship there and you had told me like you're not going to understand cross town Concourse until you visit it you can look at the photos you can go online you can understand it but until you're actually there like the scale of it um is impossible to translate you know through the phone or whatever and that was certainly the case like it is a magnificent um structure but also I think what struck me the most was the people behind the vision the vision that they held for it and what they were able to manifest Against All Odds because typically a structure like that I mean this building was originally a Sears and robu distribution facility seers had multiple of these across the country something like I don't know six or 10 of them where they would ship out all their products across the United States and in the case of the facility in Memphis there's a train track that runs right behind it where they would load all the stuff onto the train right out of the back um and this structure went phow in the wake of Sears going under in the 90s and was decrepit and falling down um and was purchased uh by Staley Kates who we met um for I don't know what like $2 million something like that I think it was 3.2 million and uh everybody told him he was crazy there's nothing you could do with this and he ended up connecting with this guy Todd Richardson who is an art Professor has like a PhD or a graduate degree in I think Renaissance art but that combination of those two individuals created something very unique which was taking this property and translating it into a symbol for a future Memphis because Memphis of course has a very colorful and interesting history when we think about Memphis we think about music we think about the Civil Rights Movement but all of that is looking in the rear viw mirror and nobody was looking into the future and saying what could Memphis be or what is the vision for the Memphis that we would like to you know sort of give to Future generations and that's the vision that kind of infused what went into creating this project and the fact that it is a nonprofit that's really about the Arts like the Arts is at the center of this the Performing Arts Theater it's all run by a nonprofit because typically something like that best case scenario it just gets turned into a massive mall and it's about maximizing square feet for revenue and this is not that in any way shape or form no it's incredible and it's um it's only like 5 years old which is one of the reasons why I just feel honored that they welcomed me into take this really beautiful space um but the the facility or the community is like 95% least and so you know they have residential you know on the upper floors they have you know Church Health which is 150,000 square feet Church Health has 28 dental chairs and they can do a crown in an hour and a half wow it's unbelievable and um and there's a YMCA that's massive that's right Church Health has YMCA connected to it they have a pool they have a dog park they they have a teaching kitchen also exactly yeah they have teaching kitchen so sham is looking forward to partnering with them and and also we've been talking to Maggie Barrett from support and feed and um you know just be really really awesome to just feed the community out of those kitchens and you know just uh just share life so it's really super cool yeah it's very cool it is um it is a place of uh you know creativity for sure right and the fact that shimu is right at the base of that extraordinary red circular staircase just is like chef's kiss like what you did with the cafe um the design everything about it is so elegant and it was beautiful to have that reception and have so many people come out to celebrate um this new thing and listen you know it's hard to move your business to a state in a city where you don't really know anyone and then throw party and expect anybody to show up cuz you were like I was like I don't know who to call I I have nobody I can call I don't know I don't know I don't know anybody here um but you've been so supported by Business Leaders in that Community who really showed up for you and and the turnout was really something special and I mean one thing that I I feel like this trip I really sort of put down some of my roots I mean obviously it did open the cafe but also um rented an amazing home that I actually fell in love with that took me back to my youth um it was an amazing home and it reminded me of an architectural home that I grew up in in Alaska because my childhood friend Terry Meyer um her family lived in lner and so I spent many of my adolescent years listening to Elton John smoking pot and like you know doing gymnastics in this amazing home that had an indoor Atrium it was on a lake and it had you know the Big Stone floors and also builtins everything was built in all the couches all the Upholstery and it just has the this vibe to it you know it's like the big Labowski you know famous house that you know everybody knows from that movie so this house definitely had some of that vibe in a big way and when I picked you and Tyler up from the airport you know I was like I'm in the most beautiful home I've ever seen in my life and you know it's in Memphis like that just makes no sense whatsoever so there was a lot of stuff that was sort of on a 60-year cycle and also my opening was on a solar eclipse the ring of fire yeah a new moon solar eclipse it was called the ring of fire and when I arrived in Memphis uh one of my teammates Aaron reminded me that the song Ring of Fire was recorded in Tennessee in 1961 so there was just a lot of magic and so many people from the community in Memphis came up to me and thanked me for being there um it was really fun to see them freak out over shimu they were just devouring it and completely loving the product um and you know Memphis is a a very sacred place the lands are very sacred the aquafers the trees and you know the peoples and so um uh you know people go to Memphis to create something new you know and we've been welcomed to be a part of that and I'm just very very honored and excited about what that's going to be in my life and and in our [Music] lives the other trip about Memphis is the parallel with Egypt because you know obviously there's a Memphis in Egypt and if you're paying attention and driving around Memphis you will see statues of Ramsay and not only are there statues of Ramsay this sort of note or Ode to the other Memphis There's an actual pyramid yes there is like a giant mirrored pyramid that's bigger than you might think it is right in the middle of the city that I think at one point was or it was origin originally like a music venue or a sports venue but now it is the headquarters it is like the flagship store for Bass Pro Shops right when you go in there the ceiling is like I don't know 300 ft high or whatever it is um and it's like a it's almost like an amusement park in there like we had to go and visit cuz I was like I have to see this place it's a thing definely thing yeah and Ramsay's the second statue um also at University of Memphis and um there's no accident definitely there is a mystical connection to Egypt and Memphis Egypt was the capital when it was at its height so also not an accident that you know in the recent years I've been traveling to Egypt so I'm I'm in I'm connected in Memphis Egypt and Memphis Tennessee so we'll see what what comes of it but uh something is something is a foot for sure yeah um the other cool thing um about cross town that I experienced was that right above your space is like right upstairs from where you are is that art museum but there's also creative offices and I met um this filmmaker Craig Brewer who houses his production uh office just above you like literally right above you um and he's the guy who wrote and directed a film called Hustle and Flow which in many ways is sort of an archetypal film about Memphis he's done other things he created that TV show Terriers on FX and um he worked he's worked with Eddie Murphy quite a bit I think he coming to America to the second coming coming to America movie um Dolomite is my name black snake Moon and just a filmmaker that I follow I followed his career for a long time like I remember when Hustle and Flow came out that was a big deal uh big kind of like independent Sundance Film that launched Terence Howard's career and I was thinking about that movie as I was traveling to Memphis which was a city I'd never been to before because that's sort of the Cinematic cinematic like footnote that I have in my mind about What About Memphis and then it was so wild it was like oh he's actually here and we were up in his office like talking to him it was crazy yeah it's it's it's amazing there's so much creativity oozing out of that community and cross town is uh yeah everything that they're doing is at the highest level so it's like you know it's it's very very well executed on every level so so what are what are some of the I'm going to pin you down here a little bit as an entrepreneur uh who Moved their entire business from where we live to a city where you didn't really know anyone um what were some of the lessons that you learned or obstacles that you had to confront and overcome to accomplish that well I would say that it was definitely harder than I imagined which is probably a good thing because it gives you sort of this naive um maybe luck that you know makes you make these decisions to do these things I think the biggest thing that I learned is that early on in my company I was leading more as a mother you know I I have a lot of people around me and want my children to have everything you know not only my own children but sort of everyone that I'm working with and I think early on in a company's you know birth and Inception it's appropriate like it it actually works it's sort of like everybody's doing everything and it's a little bit more like a family and then when you move into a place where you really have to scale um it it I really can't leave that way so I had you know the entrepreneurial you know hard School of Knox of learning how to you know um step into really being the mother of shu as my ultimate you know focus and understanding that you know um you know the business requires a certain level of responsibility that you know that is necessary to ensure her life and um so that was you know I had wished that some of my La team would have gone to cross town in Memphis and fallen in love and moved there that's maybe a you know a big wish it's a lot to ask someone ask it's a lot to ask but you know um and so that didn't really happen um and then it became very clear that the business is in Memphis so even though during covid we were working remote like a lot of people um you know we are you know we are a kitchen facility production facility and all of the opportunity is there in Memphis so um you know we're building a team we have an amazing uh crew right now the quality of the cheese is phenomenal and one of the challenges that I had is that Tennessee egg uh wanted us to prove our um our uh expiration so we were stuck in a thre Monon holding pattern um just for wholesale not for subscription but um but it's also good because you know we hired a food scientist and we now have you know even more um I would say gold standards in place uh you know batching so that we could recall should anything happen but really what was proven is just the amazing stability of Shu and you know it it's just a very very stable product right which is why if you live in Los Angeles it wasn't available at aan for for a period of time but it's it's back I've seen it everywhere so it's back it's back yeah and during that time also that I'm in Memphis like we were waiting for for our Organic certification because we had to get moved to Memphis to do that so there were many things like I have new products that are you know that we're going to be releasing we have a butter that we're coming out with it's phenomenal it's the best thing you've ever had and we have our first dessert that we launched um shimu and uh we hosted a dinner in Malibu last month um to unveil our first dessert which is called the mlay cake and um and so we're shipping that right now and it's um just extraordinary uh caca almost like a caca mousse with hints of cayenne and um cinnamon and uh dat and it's it's kind of amazing it's cool yeah um how do you make those decisions around um adding SKS into the rotation because I know you have a million recipes and formulations and you could just blow it out like tomorrow but you have to be very careful about protecting you know the core brand and the core set of products and you've seen a lot of companies who kind of too quickly start like ramping up all their SKS and they lose focus focus and there's a sort of undermining of brand identity and it can easily spiral out of control so it has to be a measured does I mean I'd say that you know I've been on a leash for the whole time we've been in La um and so and that's because I understand from being a fashion designer you know I made that mistake you know I created a hundred piece women's collection from sports wear to evening gowns and um you know it took me a while to understand that I was you know that there was no way that I could be profitable with that much variety so I've kept a very streamline in Shu and you know of the eight flavors on our collection they're all Extraordinary like people say pick your favorite I can't really I mean they they they all stand uh on their own and they're all really really strong and I have other formulations that are extraordinary equally as extraordinary I have a mozzarella product that is the best that I've ever tasted Ed and so you know we're also sort of ready to find the product like the one the thing that really you know sets us apart or maybe would be the thing that we could scale really gigantically so um the wheels are just here to stay they're gorgeous um one of the best things about the opening was probably the most expensive thing in the in the space is the Cold Case and I got like this really gigantic like six foot Cold Case and with all cheese stocked in it when I slid the door open and smelled it I mean it just smells like Paris like it's so cheesy and so so much hits all those notes that we love about Dairy cheese um it's just extraordinary I mean it's it was really really amazing and what is it about like from a business economic marketing perspective like what is it about being in mempis that makes it better than being in Los Angeles like I think I just imagine somebody saying well I still understand why you move like why move your whole operation but I mean even just if you just look at just straight business uh which is not what shimu is at all um Memphis is in the top three cities to move your business to Simply for cost simply cost of operations and ease of operation um for me really cross town Concourse was the deciding factor um because Community is is at the core of shimu like I don't I don't really care so much of having my in a box in a store you know that's great but what I really care about is the conversations that it ignites in people as they gather around a box of cheese as you buy the box and you create a board um and we're even coming out with a series of like you know inspirational questions or things to ponder uh because every box of Shu potentially activates let's say 13 people it's all about Community like I care so much more about that which is why I'm giving giving you guys a code I I don't mean didn't mean to just segue you're like Arnold schwarzeneger would be very proud youell sell chapter you know in his book like you're you're living it right now I mean the thing but the thing is is it's like I really do want to Foster subscriptions because subscription aligns us through this Common Thread and it is the community and so we are working on things like a secret menu only for subscribers or a subscription offering where you can pay um a little more and get you know uh special recipes or healing techniques um the other thing that we're doing is we are um integrating water tiger which is my spiritual mentorship with shimu so we're not acting like you know we're not doing any of the things that food companies do like you know get your cheese for the barbecue like that's just not me so what is me is you know caring deeply about um you know sending a loved one off who has passed away and having a prayer or knowing how to create an altar or how to bless your food or how to nurture your child through the difficult years of adolescence um these type of things are are core and being integrated into shimu and so by fostering subscriptions it allows us to join together around that messaging and around those initiatives that most of us you know care very much about at least the people that are eating what we call vibrational nourishment and that's what Treo is yeah it's great I mean I know we all you know like we buy products online and when you're purchasing it's like click here to receive you know emails with discounts or whatever and I I never click those but somehow I still end up getting all of those and I spend you know 20 minutes a day deleting all the you know kind of marketing emails that come in but there's a few that I actually like because those emails are really not about trying to sell you anything they're branded of course but they're more like magazine or they have information that is thematically relevant to whatever product they're selling but they're providing value beyond that and so I think the sense of encouraging people to subscribe to the newsletter because yeah you'll hear about whenever there's a sale or whatever but it's more about like um exploring like the you know just the the the lifestyle aspects that are meaningful to you that you care about that kind of Infuse the product and are why you created it to begin with yeah definitely and luckily you know I have my you know Ally in Li in life Mel nahas the founder of conscious city guide who is also the producer of our plant power Retreats and I have the wonderful privilege of you know sharing a friendship and she's my brand lead and also my Ops lead right now and she just gets me and so she's never trying to compartmentalize who I am and the food company and you know some of the newsletters that we sent out this month were just really exciting you know they were about you know 52 who is this loneliest whale um who has a different song than other whales and you know scientists have been tracking this being and you know just bringing awareness to the whales and to the care of these magnificent beings and you know sharing a documentary or sharing the sound bite so these are the type of things I mean I have a dream I'm going to say this now because I have a dream so I want to just lay it out here even though I'm way ahead of myself but when I went to the Arctic Circle last year um one of my water tiger members um SRE um she gifted me a trip there for my birthday and she took me to this resort called loten and I I've never felt more alive or more on just on fire in a good way like lit up as I was in the Arctic Circle I can't explain it it was something the coating coming off of the mountains um the way you see dragons everywhere you look it was just like a Magical Kingdom and I was drinking living tea like by a running River like Gandalf just out there in the fairy land and I went to a restaurant there and there were surprisingly three vegan options on the menu but two whale options on the menu and I it just hit me so hard and later I was at this surf camp which is in loton and all these beautiful young ones you know surfing in this freezing water and they you know had some vegan options in their Cafe but shortly after that I said to srees and malie who was my other friend the other water tiger me member that came with us um I said you know I want to I want to open a Shu Shack in loten and I want to align with some of these Surfers and teach them how to make Shu and make a documentary like I want to I want to go bring Shu into the community and bring awareness to whales and sort of I don't know offer a plant-based alternative uh not not in a I mean this is something that is of their lineage right so it it it's a very ancient um but the fact that these beings are still being slaughtered is just unimaginable um so it's a crazy dream that I have that I'll probably start on next year it sounds like a a Chris burkart movie Chris burkart are you listening come to me he's the perfect person come to me let's do this together you're so such a beautiful artist I mean let's do it and this is the type of thing that is exciting the other thing that's really exciting is I met the man and I'm forgetting his name and I'm sorry um he created a mobile uh clam like performance clam on a truck and it's 900 square feet and he'll take this venue on Wheels anywhere so um my next thing is Mel and I are planning a music a Shu Music Festival next year um and it's it's this amazing uh venue on Wheels so not like a clam like a mollusk like a like a clam shell like a stage yeah like Hollywood Bowl or whatever yeah from Bugs Bunny yeah I mean it's epic and it's pretty new he just finished it in the last couple months and so so it just opens up and you have an immediate portable stage wherever you want to go and there's this area called Shelby Farms and Shelby Forest which is near Memphis and you know it's a really beautiful area and so I don't know I've got I've got some I've got a little inspiration going on so those are the two things that I'm so excited about for 2024 yeah it's cool I'm super proud of you I mean it's been a long road to get to this place and it was nice to celebrate you and see the manifestation you know rot into three dimensions thank you and it's just the beginning like now you can scale you know now you have a home now you have a foundation you've got a team and um it's going to be really cool to see what evolves from there thank you babe it was super sweet having you guys all there and yeah I don't know it it like I said it was um we are having dinner um we had a a small dinner the night before with Tom shadec and Todd and Lee Richardson and Kemp and an Conrad and some of our team June and Hansa who came in to help and um it it just felt like all of a sudden we were kind of I was kind of getting settled cuz you know it's been difficult going to Memphis and not knowing anyone and you know I have like I would have a freak out sort of every time I went thinking like what did I do like why did I sign a 5year lease here but there is a really cool community of people and for people that don't know I mean Tom shadia also was a big initial instigator of you being interested in this move because of what he's doing with Memphis Rock So for people that don't know Tom is a legendary Hollywood filmmaker he made the Lion Share of the huge um big comedies of the '90s with Jim Carrey from I don't Bruce Almighty Liar Liar like some of them he produced some of the Ace Ventura like all the he made all these huge movies and then he had kind of an existential crisis when he reached the top of the mountain um and and went on this kind of search for meaning and purpose in his life uh that led him to kind of divesting himself of of all of his possessions moving to Malibu riding around on a bike teaching at Pepperdine um and making a documentary about this experience called I am um which if you haven't seen it we'll link it up in the show notes it's it's like a mustsee it's an incredible documentary um but he ultimately ended up moving to Memphis he left Los Angeles he has family roots in Memphis um and he opened this thing called Memphis rocks which is is it a it's a nonprofit set up as a nonprofit but it's basically an indoor it's a massive indoor climbing facility that is oriented around um bringing in and supporting um at risk and disadvantaged youth and teaching them outdoor and adventure skills and then taking them on Expeditions um in fact a bunch of the Memphis rocks climbers just went out and climbed with Alex honold recently photos of of that as well yeah I was at dinner with Christine who's one of the individuals he's a beautiful film director an amazing human and dear friend now and um he runs me Memphis rock rocks in some capacity um but anyway yeah I was having dinner with him and then he said I just got back from climbing with Alex so he showed me a picture and then I texted it to you so yeah it's funny yeah it's super cool and then they're going like they do big Expeditions on some of the big mountains right like Kar or I don't know yeah and my lead investor Tom Lawrence who is the person who invested in me and created my whole spiritual raise in in the way that I wanted um is why I'm in Memphis um Tom and his wife Ellie um suggested I come check it out and so um Tom Lawrence is also on the board at Memphis rocks and also for anyone who's listening this is just an amazing initiative and it's not only a Climbing gym it's a community center it offers these kids like a place to go a place to be safe and you know Tom has spent you know a lot of his heart and soul and blood and sweat and money um but he's a beautiful beautiful human being and um you know they are looking for support for that because it's a it's it's a big initiative and needs more love and more nourish I got I got have to get Tom on the podcast you have to get Tom on the podcast I went back and searched through all my emails to see when we first got introduced was 2014 that's how was waiting for shu to open up well there was that but also prior to that um the plan was um to go to Memphis rocks and like do it there and film it and like experience the kids and all of that but then covid happened and that all kind of went away and so when we were in Memphis that's the first time that I had um seen him or spoke to him you know since those those earlier conversations well I think there's a lot of opportunity to do that and also in Cross Town you know there's so much creativity and people that are on The Cutting Edge of their Innovation you know also um Matt Ross Spang or Spang Ross I think it's Matt Ross Spang um he's a music producer there that has an amazing uh studio and they do 28 artists in residency a year um also we have will McGowan who is ml's Brother my dear friend mlan um it's her brother and he's has The Woodworking Shop there so it's it's rad wooding shop is insane it's insane yeah what they're doing with wood in there I mean it's full on and they have this huge machine that's like the size of this room I forget what it's called it's called like a p& p or something like that like matys knew what it was basically it's a industrial size like laser cutter for wood that typically would only be used by developers who are you know building houses and apartment complexes Etc but not available to artists who want to do something different with it and I think so I think it's one of the very few that exist that's available for um Artisans and artists to do you know interesting things very cool and I might have G I might have said Will's last name wrong it might that might not be his name so sorry if I got it wrong also I just want to give a shout out to city wood who I got these popular Live Edge shelves from um there are a group of guys uh that are farmers uh but they have the most amazing reclaimed yard of just all kinds of different varieties and they're in Memphis Tennessee it's called citywood and I just want to thank them for uh making me these beautiful popular shelves which is in it's local wood to Memphis so anyway thanks guys in celebration of you and seeing you and being present with you um I want you to know how proud I am of everything that you have created this manifestation with your company but also just the presence that you have grown and matured into like this incredibly wise being who has a very unique and Powerful lens on not just relationships but uh how to be in the world and I've watched as you've grown into that um and all the people who um are comforted by what you share with them and I think it's really a beautiful unique expression a certain frequency that you emit into the world that is entirely your own so I just wanted to recognize you for that thank you for that thanks I love you me too um before we go I think you're offering up like a some kind of deal on the Shu situation okay so to get your shu to get you some um we're going to give uh 22% off on our new dessert offering it's a two mousse cake box it's called the mlay and uh so for that code it's mlay 22 m a c l a y22 and then uh we're going to give a code RRP fam um which is for the the 13th box free of any annual subscription you'll get the 13th box free and what is that how much is that off what you would normally it depends because it depends on which subscription you box so it's just whichever subscription you buy you'll get a free box so and you know that's all in the spirit of um building our family and community and keeping us close and aligned and um so and thank you to everyone who's supported me so far um it's because of you guys that I was able to launch this company and um create this beautiful food as art and so I hope you'll continue with me along the journey thanks um you can learn more about shrio sho.com uh and you are at shrimati yes SRI M ATI or Julie pay.com and uh yeah for all the things yeah and if you are enjoying um Julie's frequency uh you might want to check out her water tiger community Community which you can find on your website as well right yeah so it's um water tiger spiritual Community mentorship um monthly call for two hours and then you have access to over 50 techniques to help put you in the Gap um it's all self-created um so you decide where to enter and what to use um and it's a beautiful Community all right to be continued to be continued yeah all right love you babe thank you I love you sweetheart right plants Namaste that's it for today thank you for listening I truly hope you enjoyed the conversation to learn more about today's guest including links and resources related to everything discussed today visit the episode page at Rich roll.com where you can find the entire podcast archive as well as podcast merch my books Finding Ultra voicing change in the plant power way as well as the plant power meal planner at meals. ral.com if you'd like to support the podcast the easiest and most impactful thing you can do is to subscribe to the show on Apple podcasts on Spotify and on YouTube and leave a review Andor comment supporting the sponsors who support the show is also important and appreciated and sharing the show or your favorite episode with friends or on social media is of course awesome and very helpful and finally for podcast updates special offers on books the meal planner and other subjects please subscribe to our newsletter which you can find on the footer of any page at Rich roll.com Today's show was produced and engineered by Jason camiolo with additional audio engineering by Kale Curtis the video edition of the podcast was created by Blake Curtis with assistance by our creative director Dan Drake portraits by Davey Greenberg graphic and social media assets courtesy of Daniel CIS thank you Georgia Wy for copywriting and website management and of course our theme music was created by Tyler Patt traper Patt and Harry mathys appreciate the love love the support see you back here soon peace plant [Music] namaste [Music] he

Channel: Rich Roll

Views: 46,377

Keywords: rich roll, rich roll podcast, self-improvement podcasts, education podcasts, health podcasts, wellness podcasts, fitness podcasts, spirituality podcasts, mindfulness podcasts, mindset podcast, vegan podcasts, plant-based nutrition

Id: d0Jx9N2dqsU

Length: 71min 37sec (4297 seconds)

Published: Thu Nov 02 2023