(upbeat music) - [Paul] Welcome to All
Heart with Paul Cardall. Before we get started, I have a giveaway. All you gotta do is go to
my website, paulcardall.com. And my last name is spelled C-A-R-D-A-L-L. So go to paulcardall.com
and join the All Heart Club. You'll receive the song I've
never made available anywhere. It's very easy. Just go to the website, paulcardall.com. Join the All Heart Club and receive this gorgeous piece of music. My guest today is the lead actor on a show I can't get enough of. Jonathan Roumie plays Jesus of Nazareth in "The Chosen" series. Jonathan is an award winning
actor, director and producer. You may have seen him on The
Rock's HBO series, "Ballers," or CBS' "Chicago Med, but this
current role that he is in, he is quickly rising as one
of today's brightest stars. And in the coming weeks, I'm going to dive even
deeper into "The Chosen," because my guests will be Dallas Jenkins, who is the director and the writer. And we talked about
casting the role of Jesus, which is not easy to do so. So that's why today's interview focuses on the personal life and the
heart of Jonathan Roumie. What is it that he's done in his life to prepare him to play the son of God? But first, here's a
scene from "The Chosen," where Jesus heals a blind
man with birth paralysis. If you're listening to the audio, you can just go to my website
under the podcast link and you can watch the scene. (woman vocalizing) (tense music) - You! By whose authority do you teach? Answer me! - If you are willing, rabbi, you know you can. - Hey, I'm talking to you! By whom do you teach? Certainly not the authority
of any rabbi from Nazareth. Where did you study? - Your faith is beautiful. Son, take heart. Your sins are forgiven. (tense music) Who is this who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone? Right. But I ask you, which is easier to say, "Your sins are forgiven,"
or "Rise up and walk"? It's easy to say anything, no? But to show you, and so that you may know that the Son of Man has
the authority on earth to forgive sins, I say to you, my son, rise, pick up your bed, and go home. (man panting) (tense music) (group gasping) Easy does it. (chuckling) (woman vocalizing) - Oh!
- Yes, yes! (crowd cheering)
(crowd applauding) - Thank you.
- Mm. Now go on. (inspirational music) - We're gonna talk about "The Chosen," but I wanna talk about you.
- Sure. - I've seen a lot of interviews
with you with, you know, everybody wants to know
about "The Chosen." I wanna know about Jonathan, because you don't just
stumble into a role like that. I was in Cartagena on a
film set with Jim Caviezel. He's playing Tim Ballard, who is a former Homeland Security agent that is heavily involved
in rescuing children from sex trafficking. - Is this the one that's
coming out in the fall? - Yes, the "Sound of Freedom"
film that is being done. - I'm excited to see that film. That film looks amazing. - It's such a heavy subject. And I was part of their
board for a long time. And I went down just to
observe what was going on. I didn't, but you know,
I met Jim and he said, that was the best, this is
the second most important role for him other than playing Jesus Christ. And I thought, wow, that's, you know, because the man got electrocuted
playing Jesus Christ. - (chuckling) Yeah, yeah. - So hopefully that's not the case. - No, but who knows? I mean, you know, at this point, my job, as faithful Christian, if I'm really walking the
walk is to just offer, offer up myself and as
a vessel for the project and allow God's will
to be done through me. And if, I'm sure there is going to be some kind of suffering, and
as a Catholic, especially, we're big on offering up
our suffering, you know, and in the same way that
the saints did, you know, martyrs and people that suffered for years for the sake of Christ and it
helps deal with the suffering. You know what I mean, to kind of know that the person responsible
for your salvation went through this already. So it becomes much easier
to deal with suffering when you're offering it up to Christ. So if that's what's meant
to happen, then so be it, but hopefully I won't get electrocuted or, or have to have surgery. - You know, that level of
commitment as a human being, but also in your career,
are you a method actor? - The short answer is yes. I would consider myself a method actor because I use things like sense memory. I use affective memory. I use elements of my own life. That's the biggest thing
with being a method actor, is you essentially are
drawing from experiences in your own life. And some people choose not to do that, or they divorce themselves from, you know, delving into their own personal lives, which I think deprives us
of a ton of richness, so. - I've had kind of a chest cold. So I get the crackling of my lungs. And maybe if you can heal
me, that would help, but. (Jonathan laughs) Let's go back to your
childhood because you have a, to my understanding,
and please correct me, your father is Egyptian
and Greek Orthodox. And your mother-
- Yes. - Is American and Roman Catholic. - She, yeah, she was
raised on a farm in Ireland and came out in her 20s
to the United States. My father was raised in the city of Cairo, and then he traveled to the United States in the mid to late '60s, as well. And then they met in New York
City and then started a life. And I was raised in New York City, and then we moved to the suburbs and then there wasn't the quite, so I was baptized Greek Orthodox and my parents were married
in a Greek Orthodox church. And for my mother, it's, there was no, they're so similar in
how, in their theology, in so many ways that it wasn't a big deal. And then when we moved to
the suburbs of Long Island, there wasn't really an Orthodox community that we found, and that
felt like home for us. So we started going to a Catholic church and my dad went to Catholic
school as a kid in Egypt. So it was, he was kind of raised with, with both Orthodoxy and Catholicism. So again, there, shifting back was, for my dad to shift over,
there was no real conflict, theological or liturgical, or religious conflict for him. And so myself and my sisters
made our first communion and our confirmation,
in the Catholic church. And then, yeah, just kind of, so I was raised with the faith. - Being a Catholic in
Egypt all those years ago, was that a common thing? - Christianity, I mean, Christians were, and are a minority. They're a diminishing
minority, or I should say, they're a minority that's
diminishing in numbers even still to this day, which
is pretty heart rending. And so I'm trying to do as much as I can with my own sort of work here, with some of the organizations I work with to deliver aid, to persecuted
Christians in the Middle East, and seen as being outside of the system, they get treated a bit differently. - So you play the drums. (upbeat music) - Music is a major part of
my life for a long time. I'm actually an ASCAP member, as well. And I wrote my first
song a few years back, which I was pretty proud of. And I was with a band for
about three and a half, four years, which for me,
my involvement ended in, I think, early 2017, because we had been touring
and we were overseas. And it just got to be,
it's not an easy lifestyle, as many of your listeners, I'm sure, who have been in bands,
know that road life, life on the road is not the easiest, especially when you're a
small band, in our case, a bar band, and... But it was fun. It was full of lots of
adventures, but it's not, it's also not the healthiest lifestyle. And I found that it was
sort of diverting me off of the path that I had
deemed as part of my mission to, and the reason I came out to Los Angeles was not to be in a band. It was to work as an actor. So.
- It's fascinating. - And I still play, I
still play with people. Obviously not since COVID, but
I've got a bunch of friends that whenever they've got some gigs, they're singer/songwriters,
whenever they got some gigs coming up, I'll hop in for a set. And usually, now, it's,
mostly like percussion, like Cajon and stuff like that. Yeah, and even in the band, the bar band, like we were in smaller venues
and I kind of amplified, acoustically my sound
as as a percussionist. And I would, you know, I would
use brushes with my Cajon and sort of play it almost like a kit, where I could have my
right hand is my bass drum, and my left hand is my snare drum. And I literally have
like one of those brushes I'd never seen before,
and for like the year, the first year I was with
this band playing Cajon, I was breaking my hand every night. I was like taping up my
hand because I was just, we were playing, high
energy rock and pop music and stuff where I'm like,
I can't sustain this. You know, I would need
two days to ice my hands and for it to be able to play again until I discovered brushes. And that was like, that changed my life. And so we literally just learned, we added another percussionist. And so we just kinda became this little percussive
Frankenstein of a band that sounded great, and just
had a bunch of different voices and was very much welcomed
by a lot of places that, clubs and bars that didn't
want a full drum kit. And so, and it was very portable and so it worked really
well for a long time. And when you put couple
of mics on those things, nobody knows the difference. People, are like, are you making all that sound with that box? Like yep, it's just the box, me and a box. - What are some of your
musical influences? What do you like to listen to? - Nah, I mean, I couldn't
narrow it down to one. I mean, I listen to such
a wide spectrum of stuff. I mean, I, you know, The Police
were a huge influence on me, early on, Iron Maiden was a
huge influence on my drumming. Like I learned to, I
mostly learned to drum, I got the basics through lessons, and then I mostly learned to drum just by copying what I
heard, playing what I heard and trying to figure out and decipher what I heard and break down. So Genesis, The Police, U2, Led Zeppelin, mostly rock stuff, and then it would get
a little bit heavier. I started listening to Slayer at one point and going to shows and
experiencing mosh pits. And so that kinda had a
little bit of an influence, but just for everyday playing, it was mostly like progressive rock. I got into guys like Dave Weckl and, and the Chick Corea Band, and then I started getting into jazz and Rush and Toto and
guys like Vinnie Colaiuta, whose playing was just so super clean and just like a metronome and, you know. It sort of ranged all over the places as my needs to expand
and further my education as as a player necessitated. - That's so cool, I love it. Yeah, Neil Peart, he's my... - God rest his soul, yeah. What a loss, man. - And the lyrics he would write, everything about it was a
fantastic band, but yeah, that makes sense to be a fan
of Police and all those bands playing drums and everything. I've been, you know, going
through like all your training. You have had extensive training. Did you decide to become an actor or did acting decide for you? - It kind of found me. I had no designs to be
an actor whatsoever. I was a very, extremely
shy, introverted kid. I was also an artist, a visual artist. I was a really good illustrator. I thought I might end up
doing that at one point. And I won a couple awards
as a high school student for some of my work and it was shown on a couple of galleries. And so, I thought I might do that. And then I realized I
had a real love for film. And so I wanted to try
to start directing myself towards like visual effects, something where I could
incorporate my art, my visual art into film, which
I didn't know much about, but I wanted to learn. But I was also a mimic from
the time I was a young kid. So I always had, and that
was the musician's ear that I think that came into play. And I thought, if there was
anything I'd ever wanna do, as talent, in front of
a camera, it wouldn't be in front of a camera, it'd
be in front of a microphone. Voiceover would be thing that I wanna do, like I was a huge fan of "The Simpsons," growing up, that was a huge thing for me. And so, I thought if there
was anything I would, it would maybe be voiceover. And so, when I was in
college, or actually, a couple of years after
I got out of college, there was a show at the time, and this is totally dating
myself, but who cares? Called "Celebrity
Deathmatch," and on, MTV. - Yes.
- Which all... Do you remember that show? All of these clay animated celebrities would fight each other to the death, and it went on for a few seasons. And so one day I just thought,
well, I could do some of the, the impressions for the celebrities, better than what they, the
people that they've got, for some of them, I was, a bit of a chip on my shoulder. I'm like, I could do that, you know? And so I literally found the
casting director's address when they used to put out
like mailing addresses and information in the little
book called the Ross Reports. And I sent her a letter. I wrote a letter and just said, "Hey, I could do impressions, "and I'd love to audition for the show." And I didn't hear anything
for like a few months. And then she finally, I think
I included my email address at the time, 'cause those
were still fairly new. - AOL, AOL. - Yeah, it literally was an AOL address. And she wrote me back and said, "Hey, you know, call this number "and leave a recording of
like your best impression." And so I did. And then she started
emailing me auditions. And after about two or three
months of random auditions, I start, I booked my first job, which was voicing Tony Danza, you know? - Perfect. - In "Celebrity Deathmatch." - Give us a little bit of Tony. What does Tony sound like? - Tony Micelli is kinda like Adrian. What are you doing? Sort of along those lines there, I forget what the monologue was, but it was this very gruff Italian guy. And most of whom I grew up
with, so it was a pretty easy. That was a lob for me. So I hit that one. And then I ended up doing
about 25 different characters over the course of three
seasons for the show. And then that got me, when I
wanted to go a little further, I was like, okay, I felt
a little comfortable. I said to the casting director, I said, "Hey, you know, I think I wanna
learn more about voiceover." And she's like, "Well, here's
a guy you should study with. "He's one of the best in the City." And so I went and took a class
with him and he was great. And I started finding
my voice, so to speak, with voiceover.
- That was Stuart Dillon. - He rec... Stuart Dillon, yeah, very good. Stuart Dillon, you do your homework. And Stuart connected
me with my first agent, who was a commercial agent. And then she started
sending me out for stuff and I started booking. And I was also, at the time,
I became a location scout during that time, when I
was starting voiceover. And so I started working on, I was working on Giant Studio Pictures
as a scout, as an assistant and then a scout and then,
eventually, a location manager. - And you're still-
- Assistant managers- - Still in New York at this time? - Still in New York, yeah. And then, when I would
be working on a film, I'd always just kinda
check the script and see if there's anything like a small part that maybe I could audition for. And so, you know, I would
tell casting directors, I learned about headshots
and putting a resume together and I did my first play,
which was playing a drummer in a band, oddly enough, which was great, a show called "Rock Show," and then I ended up getting
a couple of auditions for some of the films I
worked on and booking them. And then that kind of led to other things. And then, I think by that time I was, I had been doing, I'd been acting, from the time I booked my first episode of "Celebrity "Deathmatch" to the time I just about was ready to leave
New York was about 10 years. - Okay. - And then I came to LA in 2000... End of 2009, beginning of 2010. - And the main switch to go to LA was because there was more
role opportunity out there? - Yeah. Once the financial,
once the housing market sort of dropped out, it became sort of, a real opportunity to examine
what it is that I wanted to do with my life. And, I thought it's either now or never, and now is the perfect
time to kind of reset and take this shot and
see if I really have what it takes to make it as an actor, to really have a successful career, and New York, while
there was, at the time, and there is even,
there was even more now, up until COVID, obviously,
there's more work than there's ever been in New York, at the time, it wasn't
as a burgeoning a city with production and
opportunities as, as Los Angeles. So I said, I might as well go
A, where the weather is better and B, where all of the
projects get their start, which is Los Angeles. So I did. - When you decided to move out to LA, because obviously, you're
close to your mother and your father, a devout religious home, and you're making this move from a place they know is safe to this
big new world out there. What was that like for them? - You know, I don't think
it was an easy thing for them to hear, but I
think they also recognized that God had given me gifts in this arena since I had been working a bit, even though it didn't
amount, in those 10 years, to what I was doing 10 years out here, it was setting me up for something larger. And I think they kind of knew,
I felt, I was sort of called, or I had a part of my destiny
was coming out to Los Angeles, But it was, of course, it
was extremely difficult to leave them and, and
for them to see me leave and I was no longer an
hour train ride away from them, coming home every weekend. So it was tough, but they've
been nothing but supportive from the beginning, from
everything I've ever done, they've been supportive of. I couldn't ask for two better parents, especially as an artist in, at that time, leaving New York, particularly unstable
circumstances to come out here. I couldn't ask for more
support than what they gave me. - I wanna skip to that
scene in "The Chosen," and we're gonna, how you
ended up doing "The Chosen," but there's a beautiful scene in there where Jesus is with his mom. - Actually, that would be
a terrible thing to behold. - My son!
- Ah, Andrew, you see, even my own mother will join
us in the Song of Miriam. - They've run out of wine. - But it's only the first day. - Yes, and it's all gone, not a drop left. - Why are you telling me this? - We can't let the
celebration end like this. And Esther's son will be humiliated. - Boys, go join the others. I'll be right there. (tense music) Mother, my time has not yet come. - If not now, when? Please. (woman vocalizing) (group chattering) (woman vocalizing) Do whatever he tells you. - And you see that very human, boy-like, mommy-like relationship that is special and fun, how does that compare to the relationship you have with your own mom? - Well, being somebody who kind
of works as a method actor, as we discussed earlier,
I brought my relationship with my mother into that
relationship with Jesus, between Jesus and the blessed mother. So for me, one of the things
when you first see us meet in Episode 5, before the wedding of Cana I kind of pick her up, I bear hug her, and I spin her around. And that was something
that I'd wanted to do because that's how I greet my mother when I haven't seen her in awhile. And, and my mother's, funny enough, they're about the same height. My mom's petite, and so
it's an easy thing to do, And anytime I pick her up,
she's literally laughing because she just, her feet are
like two feet off the ground at that point, so. It's just a moment of joy for me, and I just made sure
Dallas was cool with that. And he's like, yeah, yeah, do whatever. And he's been, you know,
great with allowing us to bring our own personal
nuggets of own lives into the show as through our characters. - So you're in LA,
you're getting situated, you're getting started, you have an agent. - Yeah. That was part of the reason why
I felt really good about it. So I came out in the fall of 2009. I had done a sort of
reconnaissance trip in 2007, and I had met with some people that said, "If you were here, we
would work with you." So I did another trip where
you're meeting casting directors and agents and managers, on
this trip in the fall of 2009, and then I got signed out of
that, and I was like, ready. And I just needed a sign to show me that that was the right decision. So the sign was getting signed. And so I said, great. And then I, three months later, I was here and I didn't go out once
for like nine months. Like I had nothing. I said, well, maybe it
just takes a little time. And then all of a sudden,
you know, it dawned on me, I'm like, this isn't, yeah,
I gotta get out of this because this is not working. And I made my own relationships,
I met other people, I found my own auditions other ways, but that was hugely frustrating. - Did you start to doubt the fact that you had this sign that you suddenly, you know, to come out
there and be out there, did you start to question
your whole purpose? - I couldn't understand it. I didn't understand
why they would sign me, and I've heard a myriad of
reasons that are not positive as to how that could
happen or why an agency would maybe do that or what
the, you know, so I just, I tried to not listen
to the negative stuff and just try to do the... I'm an optimist, I'm a
glass half-full kinda guy. So I'm like, okay. And also as my experience
working in the film industry as a location manager,
specifically, as a location manager, but almost any other department, but when you're the head of a department or the assistant, the second
in command of a department, your job is to problem solve. And on a film set, as a location manager, you're dealing, you're the liaison. Anytime you go to a new location
to shoot the day's scenes, you're now the liaison
between 15 department heads, a crew of about a hundred, and then, the person who owns that
location, that property, and you gotta basically
have your eyes everywhere, make sure people aren't breaking stuff, make sure they're not in rooms they're not supposed to be on, make sure they're not
planting a grip stand on the newly sodded turf
outside of the property of the home or whatever. And so, you're constantly
fielding questions and there's always gonna be a fire. So you have to really get
good at problem solving and not focusing on why, why, why? It's just like, all right,
this is the situation. What am I gonna do about it? How am I gonna fix it? How am I gonna move forward? How are we gonna, how am I gonna
have success at this point? So I had, there was
only so much I could do. The thing that I kind
of just procrastinated was letting go of that relationship, which I learned I would
never wait that long again to do that sort of a thing is to, for nary an audition in eight months, would never happen again. But that, you know, as I look back now, I can see that if they
had not signed me then, I might not have come out here then, things may have been different. I might not have found my destiny. So I have to look at everything
through the lens of God. God decides, as long as he
knows I have a willing heart, he's going to decide what's best for me. And then it's up to me to
just sort of recognize that, even if I don't see it, and
at the time I didn't see it. I wouldn't have seen it like that, especially compared to
now, but I would just say, well, you brought me here for something. I don't know what, but I'm
pretty sure this is still it. So maybe it's just to
kind of build up my skin, thicken my skin out here and figure out what the next move is
and learn from this some. - It reminds me, obviously,
of the scene in "The Chosen" where you're at the
well, and you're waiting. And we're all waiting as
we watched that scene, is that woman coming, because
you said you were gonna be meeting somebody, Jesus says, I'm gonna be meeting somebody
here, tells the disciples, just go in town and do their thing. And so, you know, it's kinda
like that moment where, you know something's supposed to happen, something's gonna happen, but
then, you start to go when? When is it gonna happen?
- Yeah. - And there's a word called longsuffering, in the scriptures everywhere. God is, God has long suffering, meaning he can patiently
wait for good things to come. And I guess an optimist,
that's the only way to survive that is to be an optimist. - Yeah. Yeah, I mean, what's your alternative? - Right, well, you've
been doing quite a bit. You've done "The Newsroom,"
"Interns," "NCIS," you did "Ballers," "Hart of Dixie," "Castle," "Parenthood," "Law and Order," you did
a couple of soap operas. - Yeah.
- The list goes on. A lot voiceover work, "Wonder Pets!" My kids will be happy about that, knowing that Jesus is
on the "Wonder Pets!" All those things, and it
leads to this massive role that you are now part of, which is, you are the main character
in one of the most important, what I believe is one of
the most important series that has found a way to be self-funded, but he says, we're gonna
do this in complete, season one, season two, we're gonna go all the way to the resurrection
slowly and carefully, as a way of building the
character in such a profound way, that by the time we see you crucified, we're all gonna be dying inside. Now you have this major role. How did you feel about all that, knowing that you would be the son of God? - Well, you know, I think
having played Jesus before, for Dallas, specifically,
in three other projects, kind of gave us that shorthand that I knew that we'd have on set. From the beginning, there's... It's been made public what the goal is. The goal is, God willing,
eight seasons, right, of eight episode per season for the show. But from the beginning, there's never been any idea
that anything is set in stone. The most I knew is that
we were moving forward with a series, that we would
shoot at least four episodes. Hopefully, we would get to
shoot all eight for a season. And then, hopefully, maybe
we get a couple of seasons. And if we were really lucky,
seven or eight seasons, by the time the series is done. So I've learned to not think about the entire scope of what it is. I think my head would probably explode if I tried to really consider what it was that we were trying to tackle here. And I think God is very
smart in his design with how he disseminates information and our experiences on earth and in life, knowing what we could and couldn't handle. - Okay. - And I think, also keeping us in faith, and as Dallas and his
wife, Amanda Jenkins say, keeping us on the manna program, the loaves and fishes where,
with the manna program, specifically, it's like, you
just get that day's bread. You know, give us this
day our daily bread, not your weekly bread,
not your monthly bread, today's bread, let's eat
today and worry about today. Tomorrow has worries all its own. So I've often reflected on that and I refer to that in my own life. So it's not really, I don't
really think about it so much. I just, I know that it's important. I know that there is a lot of people that are going to be affected by this. And my only, if I'm lucky, on
a good day, my only thought is, or my only prayer is
that Lord, let people see, not my face today or hear me speaking, but hear Jesus speaking,
and hear the Spirit speaking through me and
see Jesus within me, portraying these, reenacting these scenes out of scripture and then
everything that's extra biblical, that's in between scripture,
let that be inspired by scripture and let it be,
let it resonate with people so that they turn to scripture
and that they're inspired by the word themselves and
to explore and to meet Jesus themselves in the Bible. Now, having this,
hopefully, this relatability that, perhaps, they didn't have before, or, you know, debunking these myths about, who the son of God might have been and what it would have
meant to, to meet him as a human being on this planet. What's, did he laugh, did he dance? Did he smile, did he do these things that we're portraying in the show? And, if we really believe
that he was 100% human, as well as 100% divine, 100%
human in everything except sin, of course, if we really believe that, then we have to believe
he experienced everything, to every degree that
we did, and then some. So that's what we're trying to depict, is Jesus' humanity and how,
and the disciples' humanity. They're not just icons on stained glass. They were living, breathing
people like you and I, sitting here right now,
having this conversation. And if people can relate
to Jesus through their eyes and their experiences
and be affected by him, then maybe we, too, can
be affected by Christ. - It's fascinating
because I'm talking to you and I'm talking to Jonathan, I don't, it's amazing how you are able to create, under Dallas's guidance,
that character, of Jesus, because it's clearly a separate
entity from who you are, and in the music world,
you have performers, but then when you meet them, they're just, it's just average guys. Smart, intelligent, creative
people under control, humility, I believe is called,
is strength under control, and you embody that. And yet, you've created this Christ that people are posting
images of that Christ as their Christ on Facebook. And you know of me personally,
I've shared a couple things and I witness and I
share my feelings a lot about Jesus and I've
started using that image. And it's interesting because
I don't even put Jonathan in that image. That's how well you've done that job. The other thing that you're
doing that's fascinating, I know that you do a lot of
advocacy work for Catholicism, and you've been doing
prayers, prayer hours nightly. And my wife is Catholic, and so, sometimes I say, I lean
over in bed, and I say, "What are you listening to?" She goes, "I'm listening
to Jonathan do the rosary." - Oh wow. - Because it sounds like-
- What an honor. - Jesus is doing the rosary, for her. And she's having these
sacred, spiritual experiences. She's drawing closer to God because of the work you're doing. And we're just one family, Jonathan, and that's what's brilliant about the gift that God has given you. We never know.
- That's beautiful. - We never know the lives that are impacted by the choices we make, that are all heart, to
just be the best we can, do the best we can, and it expands beyond. So I'm grateful for the gift God gave you and the ability to create
what you've created. I do think that it's a, if
we go to the business side of things, it's Oscar
worthy, it's Emmy worthy. And I believe you've won- - Wow, thank you.
- A Movieguide Award. - Yeah, yeah, they've
been super supportive. And they're lovely, lovely people. And movieguide.org. I hadn't heard of them
until we got nominated for this thing, and Dallas
had been nominated before for some of his earlier work,
but I never heard of them. And then I started reading up on them. And then, at the awards,
before the actual awards are given out, we were
given a little presentation by Dr. Ted Baehr about the state
of the faith based industry and how, and I had no idea about this, but they are almost, if
not always successful, financially, like statistically speaking, like faith-based, family
inspired, family-minded films will always make money than anything else, like above and beyond, and
the fact that Hollywood doesn't capitalize on that more is, it just kind of gives you an idea as to what's going on in Hollywood, but I had no idea about that. And so their whole thing
is to encourage and reward and push on these, and
inspire these filmmakers to continue to make this kind of content. Because not only is it uplifting
and morally encouraging, but it's financially rewarding. It's like, God is sort
of rewarding these people for being faithful to him, and these are people that
really have God on their hearts. It's not, you know, a Hollywood
version of a Bible epic that they've got big
names and they're trying to make a buck, but these
are smaller companies that are making stuff
that they really want to get out there, and it's
mostly message driven. - Do you think "Then Chosen," obviously with the
crowdfunding that's happened, you had 19,000 people
from all over the world, I know a lot of people
from my home state of Utah, raised a lot of money for "The Chosen," do you think that's gonna help break down some of the walls so that
filmmaking can be done in a more personal way that
reaches a specific demographic, rather than just trying to do something that's not as meaningful or, because it seems like most of the movies that come out these days
are void of any atonement. It's man's atonement, they
try to find redemption in some alternative universe. And I always go, where is God in this? Because people are religious,
people are spiritual. That's always removed from film. - Yeah. Yeah, I think it has definitely
inspired people to try to approach filmmaking differently. I also recognize that what we've done and what we've accomplished
thus far is an anomaly, and can only be attributed
to the Holy Spirit working through this project. So I think, if people want
to harness the Spirit, and they have that within them, and they want to make films that want to be able to give
glory to God in some way, I think, if it's God's will
for it to move forward, anything can happen. I think it's, it is, you know, I couldn't give you any
kind of predictive answer on the metrics of that because it just, it's never been done before. Could it be done again? I think so, but I think
it would have to be the right project and the right audience. So, you know, it's something
that we still kind of scratch our heads and say, "How did this happen? "How did this," we just
consider ourselves, all of us involved, just so blessed that it's gone where it's gone. Because I mean, if you've
heard Dallas' story, when the over at VidAngel said, "Hey, we wanna crowdfund this," using his film, "The Shepherd," which was about the nativity of Jesus, as seen through the eyes of the shepherd, "We wanna crowdfund this ourselves, "and we think we could raise
money to do the series," and Dallas' response
is like, you're crazy. You'd be lucky if you raise $800. Like literally those were his words, and $10+ million later,
we got season one shot, and now we're halfway
funded through season two through a pay it forward program, not even the same thing we did before. Like the second season is being funded completely differently
from the first season. So everything about this, I mean, the line from episode, is it 7? "Get used to different"
could not be more applicable to this series, to the concept
of what we've been able to do here and what Dallas and his team have been able to do. I didn't do any of that. I just showed up and said, "Yes," and that's been my thing is just like, just say yes, just go with it. And, and I think as a
result, a perfect storm has kind of put us in the
position we are today. But everybody, from the top
down to the distributors, it's like, what does God want us to do? I mean, that's their hearts. The guys at VidAngel, they're
some of the most beautiful, smartest marketing guys, but their hearts are for Christ, you know? And so, that's where this
pay it forward program came, and it's like, you can watch it for free. And if you feel hat
it's affected your life in a positive way, pay it forward. For 15 bucks, you can have the series on your phone permanently,
and then 10 other people, who maybe can't afford to
watch the series in Uganda, who have smartphones, can
watch the show about Jesus and know about Jesus. That's the brilliance in that system. They came up with that. So everything has been inspired and driven by the Holy Spirit throughout this entire process. And so I just, I just pray to just be able to keep saying yes, and that
God keeps me on the path. - It's a remarkable, remarkable journey. And you obviously, there's
so much ahead for you, not just with "The Chosen,"
but in all these other roles that God is gonna bring to you. It's gonna be exciting
to watch your career continue to evolve and grow. You are becoming a very
well-known, household name and that's gotta bring
some sense of comfort. And yet, you know, you have
to go out and find the jobs and audition all those things. As we conclude here on "All Heart," I always ask my guests,
and I had Dallas on, I ask my guests years from
now, when we're all gone, what is it that you
hope people who knew you remember most about who
Johnathan Roumie was? Was he driven, was he led? Who was Jonathan Roumie? What do you hope? - I think, I would hope that
people would feel that... I sought God with my heart and hoped to encounter him at every turn in my life. And to share those
encounters with other people, especially those that
are searching for meaning in their life, and that perhaps, if I could lead them to a
deeper experiential relationship with their creator, that
would be pretty amazing. - What's one thing people can do that you've done to help you
feel God's love and grace and the motivation to just continue to enjoy this beautiful world, that's very complex and a lot of painful, there's a lot of pain in this world, but what advice, amidst all
the darkness and the sadness, how do you bring the light into your life? - I'm gonna adapt something
that I kind of say in my prayer hours. The first thing I would say is be humble. Be bold. If you're going to share
your faith with anybody, you gotta be bold, but you gotta be humble and
you gotta to lead with love. But I think that the biggest
thing is to be humble, because I think if you, if
you have a sense of humility, everything else has the, the soil is tilled for
all other human virtues to take root in a person's spirit. And then you are now able to, people will want to,
they will be open to you. If they think you have
a chip on your shoulder, or you have ownership on the truth and you know what God's
saying, but nobody else does? You lost, you can't be
an effective witness. So I think the biggest thing is be humble. And then everything else
will have room to grow. - Thank you for listening to
All Heart with Paul Cardall. This has been part 1
of a three part series about "The Chosen." On the next couple of episodes,
you'll meet the creator, the writer, and the
director of this incredible inspiring series, Dallas Jenkins, on the next All Heart with Paul Cardall. (inspirational music)
