The Book of Enoch & The Nephilim

everybody Joshua Lewis here with the remnant radio so excited to be with you guys today we are going to be talking about some very interesting stuff particularly angels demons Book of Enoch all that fun stuff John are you excited about today's episode I couldn't be more excited know that I actually I am excited about this this particular topic because this is one of those things that that I think a lot of Christians are curious about I also think they are I think it will help kind of unpack the the concept of important works that aren't solo scriptura sure that aren't part of the canon but should not be necessarily dismissed absolutely so this is going to be a really fun episode one of the reasons that I'm passionate about talking about this um recently has been reignited because I went to do some evangelism with Joe Oden and Levi and some of those guys we've had on the show before and full disclosure actually filmed for them so I wasn't actually one doing evangelism per se but in our time there there were black Hebrew Israelites out there with megaphones there's like 30 or 40 of them and it's one of the largest and fastest cult group movements so we've got like Mormons Jehovah's Witnesses black Hebrew Israelites and they're answering these questions if you go onto Google if you go onto YouTube and you ask questions about the Book of Enoch by and large you were gonna find responses for cult groups they're going to give you the answers that you want to hear and unfortunately that is pulling people and drawing people into those groups because they are answering questions that the church refuses to answer exactly so it's one of the reasons that I'm really passionate about this topic the reason that I want to address it and we've got it we've got a couple of areas that we could explore today I think what I'd like to do is discuss a few things about angelology upfront so that we kind of have a modern or I mean on a modern but a consistent language when we're talking about this subject because these words mean a lot of different things to different people so kind of establish a rubric of thinking and then we can dive into the Book of Enoch and talk about what the things that I like the things that I hate why why we should use it how we should use it if we should use it all of those things together so let's dive into this if you guys are following I've got a couple of scriptures that you can follow along with I'll give you most of them right up front Galatians the circulations Genesis chapter 6 1 through 4 Deuteronomy 32 Joe but chapters 1 & 2 and job chapter 38 finally the book of Jude which is one chapter those are the primary scriptures that we will be looking at when when coming into this topic I would encourage you if you guys are listening a great primer on this discussion is a man by the name of Michael Heizer Michael is a linguist and one of the foremost linguists on the planet he's a he's a great guy I listen to his podcast regularly he's got some in-depth insight on this topic he's not one of these Pentecostal charismatic guys who jumps in starts having conversations with demons and because of that he's written all this angelology he is a linguist he is committed to biblical scripture and and because of that I believe that he has a firm foundation of this kind of teaching now I would encourage you guys if you're listening to what we're talking about today um go home study this yourself I make sure that everything that I am saying can be found and affirmed in the scriptures if not toss it out okay we we personally have a very high view of Scripture on remnant radio and I would hope I would hope Paul's like I speak in tongues more than any of you it's right up there I've used scripture more highly than any of you so so I say that to say I'd really encourage you guys to make sure these things are rooted in Scripture we are not for those of you who are worried are not going to be talking about experiences today we're not going to be talking about casting out demons today and our experiences with that we're not going to be talking about angelic visions we've had none of those things are gonna enter into this conversation we are not going to build a doctrine based off of the Book of Enoch we are not going to build a doctrine based off of other apocryphal or Gnostic Gospels that are out there we are only going to use Scripture to I think rightly define what the Bible talks about angels and demons so forth and so on I do think there is intentional ambiguity in some of these scriptures and I think that's because we don't need to know I think they're the scriptures are sufficient and what they provide so so let's let's dive into it okay Genesis chapter 6 is the first topic that many of you are the first scripture that many of you can be very familiar with there's a couple of takes on this verse and I'm gonna give you the two primary takes of this verse okay chapter 6 it says when man began to multiply on the face of the land and the daughters were born to them the sons of God saw that the daughters of man were attractive and they looked and they they took as their wives any they chose then the Lord said my spirit shall not and abide in men forever for he is flesh his days shall be a hundred and twenty years the Nephilim were on the earth in those days and also after it afterward when the sons of God came into the daughters of man and were born to them these were the mighty men who were of old the men of renown so in this text the sons of God see that the daughters of men are beautiful now here are two primary takes on this passage one is the sons of God are angels the second take is the sons of God is a reference to the descendants of Seth Cain and Abel were offering sacrifices to the Lord one sacrifice was accepted one sacrifice was denied when that took place Cain kills Abel so the righteous seed has been has been killed and this unrighteous seed through murder through deception has now taken over right so Cain is is the the eldest son on the earth but then God provides a second son and uncurse son to Adam and Eve by the name of Seth so the idea is that the sons of God are the holy or the righteous seed of Adam through the descendants of Seth that is the other approach to this text the the the the key verse that people would rest on for this is my spirit shall not abide in man for ever the punishment of the sons of God looking at the daughters of men that the daughters of men are descendants of Cain that they intermarried and because of that God brought struction flooded the earth cleansed man of their sinfulness have a couple of issues with that interpretation first of all there there was no commandment of God to man not to intermarry if anything I would say that that's probably encouraged and secondly if they are righteous seed and that's why they're called the sons of God why did they intermarry with sinful women so that's that's not really the primary text that I would go for and primary interpretation I would say that the sons of God the phrase sons of God is historically used in the Old Testament only referencing angels in the Old Testament look up in a blue letter Bible sons of God you will see six total accounts you'll see Genesis 6:2 Genesis 6:4 Deuteronomy 32 job 1/6 job 2-1 and job 38:7 every single account of the sons of God into the Old Testament in Hebrew every single time that phrase is used it is referencing angels 100% of the time there's not a single reference in all of the Old Testament that references sons of God when it's not angels job 38:7 talks about when God lays the foundations of the earth he's actually a mocking job he's saying don't you know didn't you know that when I created this were you there who counsels God dadadada and he's talking about all this stuff and says the Angels the sons of God were singing out when I laid the foundations when I created things they sang for joy job 2 verse 1 and job 1 1 verse 6 says the sons of God presented themselves before God in this council chamber this what we will call the divine council and we'll get there in a sec and then in Deuteronomy 32 there is a reference of God dividing the nations at the Tower of Babel according to the sons of God that he divided the nation's according to the sons of God so there's a specific amount of angelic bodies and he divided the nation's according to the number of these angelic bodies there's this is a lot of information again if you guys are listening to this hearing this Michael Heizer is a great place to go listen to all this stuff because again he's a linguist and then make sure to take diligent notes I'm rambling a little bit Johnny you're doing great how many thoughts are pinholes that you want to poke poking this this far no I the the whole concept of whether or not these are referring to angels or not I think there there are definitely some opinions out there that would say that they're that they're either humans possessed by fallen angels or they are as you were saying earlier the descendants of Seth but I think it it's pretty clear at least according to our study and and what we were able to determine which is not just us studying you know one on one where we're always as we talked about on previous episodes one of the important things that we do here is we take the whole Council of Scripture Plus what the trusted knowledge knowledgeable and studied and learned voices in the church have to say plus historically what the church has looked at at these issues as so this is something that that comes from a a culmination of and I think one of the the scariest parts of any kind of pushback is is that someone is just you know reading English only yeah and saying this is what this means and and this is all that this could mean so just a admonition to those of you that are going to be studying this out for yourself please please do diligence do your homework study to show yourself approved a workman who needeth not be ashamed rightly dividing that's what we do and that and the reason that we do it and I want to echo what Josh said at the beginning of the program the the voice is speaking out on this our cultic voices and so to bring a balance to this typically this conversation is just tossed from the Christian perspective because it's apocryphal writing it's not sola scriptura it's not in a can and we're not going to look at it we don't even care it's its existence is irrelevant and today we're saying it's not there's something to to look at this not elevate it to authoritative Scripture and and you know like you were saying earlier create a doctrine of Enoch but it is definitely something I mean this book has been around it was discovered in the Dead Sea Scrolls in its entirety for the first time and several I don't know thousand years years so the the Ethiopian Book of Enoch has actually been around since 300 BC so before Christ about about three to four hundred years before Christ they had a record of it and then manuscripts portions of of first enoch are found in the Dead Sea Scrolls I think it's 11 separate slivers if you will and they're not full-text but they're kind of proof texts that that kind of been brought up against the Ethiopian Book of Enoch can be verified yeah some which is what a lot of the Dead Sea Scrolls are with the exception of the Book of Isaiah which was in its entirety which predated by I don't know how many hundreds of years the the oldest known manuscript and so this is something that it's definitely been around a long time Jude references it but in saying that that doesn't make it authoritative Lee scriptural and divinely inspired and we'll get into that in two seconds I want to make sure that we we again establish a foundation of what angels are what these sons of God are I think one of the greatest proof tanks that the sons of God are indeed angels is actually found in the book of Jude it's in Jude 6 and 7 again in one chapter it's two verses here in 6 and 7 it says and the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority but left their proper dwelling he has kept in eternal change under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day now of those of you who don't know this idea of angels who have left their abode being held in Chains is a reference to the Book of Enoch it is not a direct quote but the only place that we can find this idea of angels in Chains in first Peter and in Jude where are they referencing this where are they finding this information that information is actually in the Book of Enoch he does directly quote them in verses 14 and 15 but he is referencing them here so he says this he says that they've left their their abode they're held under darkness until the day of judgement and he says that's just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities were likewise indulging in sexual immorality wait a second were the Angels just falling out of heaven or were the Angels also indulging in sexual immorality according to Jude there were angels who left their proper dwelling and participated in sexual immorality and this is what it says just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities were likewise indulging in sexual immorality and pursued and unnatural desires or some some translations will say other flesh right it says other flesh that Sarcos hetero us and it says serves as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire so man receive judgment and angels receive judgment for having this unnatural union and relationship so here here are a couple of statements I'm not saying that these are authoritative statements it's what I perceive of Scripture up to this point that I believe that there were either multiple followings or one falling and progressive depravity I guess on the angelic bodies so there are two views that could be taken one is a third of the Angels fell with Satan pre Genesis 1 and 2 that's that is a distinct possibility and I think it's probably the majority view of Christendom is that most Christians would believe that a third of the Angels felt the only verse we have for a third of the angels falling is in in Revelation chapter 12 when it talks about Satan and a third of his angels being cast out of heaven it also talks about in that chapter that we overcame by the blood of the Lamb and the word of our testimony and that he's cast out of heaven and because he knows his time is short so I believe that revelation 12 is a future event so I don't know if all one-third have already fallen what I do know is that angels have free will and that angels fell it means in my mind that up until revelation 12 takes place in the future that angels kids still progressively be falling potentially and again I have a few verses I could use for that I know we discussed that on the phone and you were like Josh this is this is more unique than I think some some would take it well I I don't know that that necessarily there's there's error in that it's it's an opinion it's a view and and again you know wanting to push back on people who would approach this and more taking from a devil's advocate perspective of saying you know well it the Angels sons of God couldn't be referring to angels because angels don't have sexual reproductive systems well show me where it says they don't yeah there's there's a brain we can talk yep and again referencing that the the passage in Jude where it says like Sodom and Gomorrah this is why they were put in Chains right so III want to I want to take whatever the potential pushback is or whatever the potential questions are that we have today and again we're we're talking about these things because it is these very types of things that people use to punch holes in the gospel when they say well your scripture contradicts itself and you guys can't even agree on blah blah blah and so by tackling these what would seem to be obscure relatively non Salva Salva 'fuck essential texts it's to bring a cohesiveness to the to the whole of scripture so that as we are rightly proclaiming the good news we are the we are educated enough and studied enough that we can take on and and talk with even the most ardent I'm gonna get you I'm gonna trap you I'm gonna you know even Jesus had to face that with with people who were in the Jewish faith who were really really studied and they and it says multiple times in the Gospels they tried to trap him and you know the devil's tactics haven't changed and and I talk with people all the time out on the street when we're sharing the gospel with them and and they want to bring these things up and Josh you know earlier reference that that we want to try to avoid people hearing these louder more prominent voices because they're they're full of error but I don't know if you have I personally encountered people bringing stuff up like this oh yeah and I want to be able to as scripture says present a good defense that's not just John 3:16 and what does that mean that's every hole that anybody ever wants to try to punch in anything well the Bible mentions it it does and if the Bible mentions it it's it's sufficient right the Bible wants us to know about the specific things exactly I think that you know there are a few concepts so we talked about angels again I believe he said reproductive organs those kinds of things we pull that from the story of Jesus where he says do you not know because the Sadducees who don't believe in the resurrection are talking about the the woman who marries all seven brothers whose wife will she be in the resurrection Rose don't you know there will be no giving in marriage will be like the Angels well let's just consider this Jesus is male okay he has male reproductive organs right then he goes to heaven he is still male but he will not be given in marriage obviously there's the marriage supper of the Lamb which is an allegorical approach but there is no there will be no sexual relations with Jesus in the New Jerusalem so so just like Jesus he'll not be poison in marriage yes yes post millennium will not be given in marriage I think he's referencing the same there's something about our glorified state that will will not require sexual desire sexual pleasure inside of reproduction no no necessity the capacity still there the glorified body doesn't change gender which i think is one of the reasons that this is such an abominable offence in the eyes of God is they are trading natural desires for in whirl ones that's why it was such an abominable offense and with this being part of the the flood narrative if that is the case and that is the the interpretation for this it would be one of the more significant issues which I think we'll get into later where where the the New Testament the early church leaders the disciples were saying listen as we get into this we are going to make sure that those who are coming of faith don't do these specific we'll reference that later and I think that'll help even let lend more credibility to this being an angelic interaction with humanity so so we've got those verses I think one important piece of information for our audience is what our angels doing I've been asking this question for a while and have found a couple of pretty good resources on heart where they're sitting on clouds with hard with cyber's and yes yes that's what all angels do um insert satire for those of you who don't have that blackbody zap time Deuteronomy 32 739 I think it's the best representation of what angels do according to Hebrews chapter one verse I believe it's verse four it says are not all angels ministering spirits sent to administer salvation to God's elect and I'm paraphrasing there you can go look look at that verse but Deuteronomy 32 seven through nine says this remember the days of old consider the years of many generation ask your fathers and he will show you your elders and they will tell you when the most high gave to the nation their inheritance when he divided mankind when did God divide mankind and this is Deuteronomy 23 when did God divide mankind tower Babel tower Babel okay so on the same page and he said he fixed the borders of the peoples according to the number of the sons of God there's that phrase again but the Lord's portion is his people Jacob his allotted inheritance okay so there are is one translation that I'm aware of it's the NIV and that says he he numbered them according to the sons of Israel that comes from I think the Septuagint opposed to the Masoretic text and Michael Heizer would propose that that was an attempt to again divide some of this this angelic revelation of who as in as an attempt to avoid the natural interpretation however I do believe we can prove through Scripture that God these sons of God in Deuteronomy 32 were the the Prince of Persia was set up over Persia that there was a principality that was placed over Greece and over Asia Minor and over Africa and over these geographical regions and they were supposed to administer salvation to God's elect but they didn't do it properly so we see here in Psalms 82 God has taken his place in the divine council in the myths of the gods he holds judgment now some people would say this is lowercase G OD but again like like false gods but but this word Elohim is referencing godly or heavenly beings right so he he sits in him amongst the Elohim is what it says verse 2 how long will you judge unjustly and show partiality to the wicked say law so God is speaking to these Elohim you're doing a bad job give justice and and telling you to ponder it yes with say law like this is not something that you just breeze over and it's just part of the narrative this is something that he actually wants you to ponder if these were stone God's or stone images he wouldn't be speaking to them like this right he continues and he says give justice to the weak and the fatherless maintain the right of the afflicted in the destitute rescue the weak and the needy to deliver them from the hand of the wicked they have neither knowledge nor understanding they walk in darkness all the foundations of the earth are shaken I said you are God's sons of the Most High all of you nevertheless like men you shall die and fall like any Prince arise O God judge the earth for you shall inherit all the nations so here's this image of these Elohim these lesser these not God gods but these heavenly beings who are ruling over regions and we see that Prince of Persia in Daniel chapter 9 as a proof text that God sends an angel there's a principality or spirit over this region that that resists that angel going to Daniel so so this is this is I believe what these angelic bodies are doing and from that place it looks like multiple times throughout history these angelic bodies have come down to have relations with men you could say it happened in Genesis chapter 19 well it's okay so first of all Genesis 6 with the no account right we see the Nephilim there and possibly even Genesis 19 in the story of Sodom and Gomorrah because Jude references that they participate it participated in a strange flesh this is actually the gospel coalition which is a a deeply biblically rooted organization posted an article recently that I read talking about one of the possible interpretations for Genesis 19 is not the sin of homosexuality because it's not listed anywhere else except for Genesis 19 but it was actually the sin of having relationships with angelic bodies so go reference that look that up yourself I'm not saying that's definitive answer but I am firmly believing that this is I say firmly I say loosely if someone gives me a better position I'm gonna go on with that but but as I can see Scripture right now I see it that these angelic bodies are ruling and reigning on some level over the earth they have done an unfaithful job they have fallen God is judging them and that he will inherit all the nations unto himself in the last days so again Michael Heizer is a good place to look for that but now it's transition a little bit now what kind of thirty minutes into the program and talk about the Book of Enoch and how it relates to that so again I think we proved that angels are the sons of God we didn't get that from the Book of Enoch we found that in Scripture secondly that they had relationship with men again we didn't get that from the Book of Enoch we got that in Scripture however the Book of Enoch by and large addresses this narrative the entire book is about angels having relationships with men producing offspring and what that what took place as as a byproduct of that yes yes it is jump in the SEC do you have a Bible verse open no no no no I I was following along so no I I think that's one of the more important things is that is that we're proving this with Genesis to Revelation rather than just jumping off the Book of Enoch but the Book of Enoch is by and large you know we can talk about this a little bit in detail we we already discussed that this was well before Christ came on the scene this book is was established it was highly respected by Judaism and and scholars of that which is why I believe Jude and I think you agree it why Jude was referencing this because he was he was trying to appeal to just like Paul spoke when he was at Mars Hill address there was a couple of times actually when Paul spoke extra biblically but didn't you know speak in it authoritative Lee we've got the Mars Hill account the Mars Hill accountant Acts reference in Titus and then you also have the other reference in Titus so that that is you know where Paul says you know according to your own poet in acts and then specifically references by name another author and I thought I had it here but in my notes but I don't so anyways yes I do there you go that's right yeah so anyways you you want to look in acts 17 26 through 28 and it he says here this is for even your own poets have said for we are also his children so he's making an argument here and he's referring one of us to one of their popular poets and then you also want to look at Paul says in Titus 1:12 one of the Cretans a prophet of their own said cretins are always liars evil beasts and lazy gluttons so you know there's there's nothing wrong with even Jesus did it yes I suppose outside sources yeah he cited outside sources he said you say you know when there when the sky is red so he's even quoting you know modern whatever that sky is red the fish are dead or I don't know we've got a question from our buddy Barry Barry is it bolas bo WL us Barry has a question are we in the days of Noah are we there yet and what does that mean in your opinion so he's asking a question about what Jesus said jesus said as in the days of Noah so we'll so will it be and the coming of the Son of Man I'm again paraphrasing I think this is your question bear give me a thumbs up if I've nailed your question not the answer but the question so I believe that specifically I think people will take that and take some of this angelic activity and run with it and say that angels are coming back down angels are gonna have a relationships with men again all this other stuff I'm pretty confident that the passage that that you're asking about Jesus is just talking about the hastening of the day and that it will come so quickly that it will catch people at surprise that no is a preacher of righteousness saying that come it's coming it's coming it's coming and then the judgment comes and people didn't know it was coming even with all of that they thought they had time they thought they had time to repent and change their mind all this stuff I believe what he is referencing is not the the the frequency at which angels come to earth or the frequency at which demonic activity is stirred up I believe what he's referencing is the coming of judgment in the swiftness of judgment in the context of what he said does that mean that angels could come to the earth I do believe that in Revelation chapter 12 there's because of the preaching of the gospel because we're pushing back the kingdom of darkness that Satan no longer has dominion in heaven this is a different conversation that maybe we can have on another episode but it says Satan and a third of the angels are cast down to the earth and it says woe to you O earth for Satan knows that his time is short so I do believe that there is a more present coming down of these angelic bodies that they are more violent they're more ferocious that there's gonna be no tribulation has ever been since the dawn of time does that mean that this could happen again possibly I'm not willing to say definitively that I know that for sure or if that just means demonic activity is going to be at an all-time high I'm not sure whether what that means so I hope that answers your question Barry if you want to ask anything more specifically feel free to do that and if any of you have questions make sure to ask us below let's talk about the Book of Enoch John sure I think the first question is can Christians read The Book of Enoch can we are we allowed to are we permitted to read absolutely apocryphal book I think we are I think when you look at historically you have origin Tertullian highly Justin Martyr Justin yeah Justin Martyr very respected very much respected this book's I kind of sound like Trump talking very respected this book sorry they don't say this about me that I said I'm a huge book I'm not saying this these these men are saying this I'm not gonna say that what they're saying is true but but they would say it's true so so yeah it's a respected book from that perspective it was obviously respected enough to reference yeah at some level even though it's a minor level I think we can read that just like we read Oswald Chambers just like we read you know the the you know you think of his in church history I think it's important to say that there's a difference between something that's anointed and something that's inspired okay so what's inspired is done in the 66 books it's inspired its God breathed it's done it's closed it's fully authoritative anything that you would bring alongside of that that would be typically sinners in the hands of an angry god you know masterful sermon amazing sermon shook a whole nation you know definitely anointed some would even say inspired but not in like big I inspire okay so we make a dig a apostles a little a apostles exactly guy inspired a little I inspired exactly so and I think it's important to make that distinction I think I think to say there is nothing worth reading that I mean for sure let me caveat this this is all you ever need yeah period this is it but I like the fact that the Holy Spirit has given impressions or given insights or given illumination I would say this is revelation okay this is this is God revealing himself to humanity in sixty-six books across thousands of years and many authors okay so but this is it this is revelation then we have inspiration which is as I was reading this text we've all heard it in sermons we're like man that that was a great point I hadn't thought of that scripture that way yeah so I think in there when you were looking at like sinners in the hands of anger gosh yeah why revival terry's those kinds of things there is a slight difference between those things in the Book of Enoch because your Book of Enoch is not saying here are scriptures in here and let me put these scriptures together that's what those books are doing right those books are saying God is mad you are a sinner get right with God he will not be mad which you can find on your own wedding scripture so the Book of Enoch is is interesting in that there are there are portions of it that are reflective of Daniel and Ezekiel it's Revelation and other other portions of Scripture if you read through it I believe that it even has a pretty messianic ovarium Sen Bush you know it's got a lot of stuff I would I would argue that this book that existed 300 years before Jesus probably has more concrete prophecy about the son of man the Messiah a pre-incarnate pre-existing God that's the only one yeah it's it talks about and I've got some verses in here that will reference a a creature who existed before the earth comes down and is the Messiah it is some concrete stuff and it's very bold now a lot of people would say the the way that it's written it because I've heard a lot of people say no this is this is a gnostic you know gospel or Gnostic riding and this is this came after it there's no way historically that this came after in fairness there are three different email there are so anytime someone is talking to you about Enoch The Book of Enoch you should always request you should like oh the Book of Enoch is inspired your first question should be lost camera the first question should be which Enoch which Enoch is inspired most of them do not realize that there are three different books of Enoch first Enoch which we call first you know is the Ethiopian Enoch which is the one that historically has been consistent there are two other books of Enoch that that post-date Christianity right they are after the time of Jesus both of those I think by most scholarship is not considered the authoritative Enoch right so as so the first question I think is is can we read the book and I think you answered the question the early church fathers read the book Jude and Peter referenced the boat the book and Jude directly quotes the book in chapters and verses 14 through 16 14 15 yeah yeah 14 and 15 directly directly quotes the book so I think the first question is can we read it sure I think Paul read a Greek philosophy he read non-christian poets he read other things he familiarized himself with the religions of that day so there's nothing wrong with reading The Book of Enoch where we are not fundamentalist Christians that believe if you read some pagan philosopher that the the demons in that book are gonna come out latch on to you and your family and torment your children if you don't want to it might I mean if you if you practice anything right yes yeah but if you are if you are educating yourself for the point for the purpose of conversion to convert unbelievers I think again Peter and Jude are writing to a Jewish audience right there they're apostles to the Jews and they both a reference the Book of Enoch which again is a Jewish book so they are ref there they're quoting something that it would pull on their listeners ears something that their listeners already believed to be true so so I think when you say why should we use the Book of Enoch this would be my answer if there were a reason to read the I believe the reason to read it would be to get your eyes into the Jewish lens so that when you're reading some of the Scriptures written to Jewish people you can understand the context of not just the author but the listener what do these words mean potentially to his audience yes well here is a book that kind of gets us in the heart the mind the theology the philosophy of some of the Jewish people and I'm not gonna say totality of the Jewish people believe house wasn't that I would agree I got a note here that says IRA næss assigning the Book of Enoch and authentically analogous of that of mosaic literature affirms that Enoch although a man filled the office of God's messenger to the angels Tertullian who flourished at the close of the first in the beginning of the second century whilst admitting that the scripture of Enoch quote is not received by some because it is not included in the Hebrew Canon which would be the Old Testament or the first Testament I like to say speaks of the author as the most ancient prophet Enoch and the book as divinely inspired a divinely inspired autograph of the immortal patriarch preserved by Noah in the ark so there there are again were we're still hundreds of years removed from the oldest manuscript thousands of years removed from Enoch himself so but but at some level certainly within the context of the of the Jewish culture in which him Christianity emerges out of it is a very highly respected book I think it's I think it's worth a reading just like I think my utmost for his highest is worth reading it just like I think the pursuit of God by by Tozier is worth reading you know I read that but again as you were saying earlier Enoch is is bringing some things although it echoes is eagle and Daniel and and Isiah and some of these other books that that have prophetic and messianic language there's some stuff in it that is holy only there and had nowhere else in any part of the Bible that would answer some of the questions Hayden and one other person and now I can't scroll up Hayden and Mars l both ask the question why is the Book of Enoch not in the Canon I think there are a couple of reasons that it's not in the Canon I think manuscripts is one consistency is another a consistency between manuscripts the idea that it was released during a period that Hebrews call the four hundred years of darkness which is believed that the last inspired words were delivered to Malachi and after that there was a cessation on some level of the spoken word of God it was like in the days of Samuel it says there were they were the God spoke sparsely in that time right so they believed that there was a period of time that God did not speak or spoke less rarely less frequently yeah and in that time this book emerges I think another thing that rum oral tradition yes when it was finally written down it was written down in this intertestamental period so so oral tradition 5,000 years wrote down 300 BC so I think that there is some concern about the legitimacy of the totality of the book that anyone could have come along and added to it that that concerned some I think again consistency and unique revelation I think is something that is specific to this book that there is so much unique revelation and this is actually some of the problems that I have about the book of this kind of a good way to transition into that yeah I have a couple of I think are legitimate concerns and things that I like things that I hate about the Book of Enoch me too um I'll start with the things that I like just so they don't hammer on everything things that are like I like a pre-incarnate christ there are very few places in the Old Testament that talk about a pre-incarnate always existing God if you have Isaiah you've got a couple other verses I like the fact that they reference a God who existed before all who will judge all and because he is the Messiah will judge the nation's big stuff is cool I mean god this guy's gonna be worshipped that would make him god there's so many references like that the Messianic distinction in it that we're where it brings back the the distinction between the judgment oh yeah that God will render the father is that we know that that we we have scripture that will break down the the different judgments those who are righteous will stand before the son that's right and he will judge them so there there's there's a lot there's there's a lot of like I said that that's good stuff yeah I thought one of the good things that I read was the context of blood and I remember mentioning this tune on the phone yeah that these giants these angel human hybrids were these giant creatures who massacred once they ate everything that man could produce they started eating men they started eating animals with the blood in it and as a as a reference to some of this literature it was illuminating to me a little bit because this would have been the first mention of people eating things with the blood in it yes and how angels taught sorcery and magic and divination and how this was a demonic practice so even at the New Testament after the Levitical law had been fulfilled Paul is talking to Peter they're discussing what should the Gentile know maybe it's Peter discussing with the device the Duru Celyn counsel if it were it is the saying what what do we put on these guys yeah force the Gentiles to do and they say take care of widows and orphans also don't eat anything with blood in it yes and I think that that's interesting that it's rooted into a demonic practice yes so I think I think those two things are good it's very small list of things that I like um there's a very large list of things that I do not like I think it denies man's responsibility I think that it makes man not the focus of the fall and I think it makes the demonic forces the focus of the fall it makes them responsible for sexual immorality it makes them responsible for witchcraft it makes them responsible for violence and war and makes them literally go down the list of sins these angels taught men how to do those things yes taught women how to put on makeup and seduce men taught taught it everything that could be immoral was taught by these angels so so I don't really like that so much because I think it denies personal responsibility the second thing I really don't like is that the angels are hearing the prayers of the Saints and delivering them to God one that they that they act as this mediator and I think Christ is the inner meter between God and man yeah that's another thing I don't like I know we've got nine minutes we really could have discussed this and maybe we'll do another episode on some of these nitty-gritty things sure if you guys want it post it say hey we need another episode you didn't address enough demons our disembodied spirits of the Nephilim I think this is again convenience and finally angels over there are overseeing angels over repentance over tribulation and over everything that is powerful there are these angels who manifest and distribute repentance to the nation and I have such issues with that I have issues with the Bible references by name to angels oh yeah that's a big one Michael yeah Enoch references Uriel Raphael Raghu L and Sarah ki L and and these are angels who preside over different things so it also references Gabriel and Michael but I gotta issue with that because there's so much in the charismatic Pentecostal Rho yeah of which I are but I got issues with the angel of this the angel of that I do I do I really do man and and I'm not saying that that it I want to tread very carefully here I don't dismiss people who discuss things that in terms of their experience relationship with the Holy Spirit but you know I went to heaven and I saw the angel of Hale or I saw the angel of fire or I saw the angel you know the elemental angels I saw the angel of prosperity I saw the angel of body parts who is responsible for the and again I'm not saying that's heresy I'm just saying I don't see that anywhere in the scripture that's the importance because again your top you were elevating your revelation your Paul said this for those of you who have these angelic visitations these divine throne room encounters I'm not saying they can't happen what I am saying is that Paul saw things that were unlawful for him to speak of and he didn't speak of this so maybe some of your revelations shouldn't be a book shouldn't be a series so just shut your mouth shouldn't be part of a brand-new revelatory thing because you saw something that you may or may not be allowed to talk about and I don't know this this is my greatest problem I'm not judging in all of the Gnostic Gospels and all the apocryphal Gospels is that you will see the author or authors or whoever they may be adding information that everybody wants to know yeah when I was reading this I was like man this sounds like somebody who sat up one night and said you know we need a good book on the story of Enoch because there's only a few verses that even mention him so let's blow out this whole narrative in this whole story and write this and that's part of why I think some stuff wasn't allowed by by more scholarly men and thinkers in the early church it's like no we're not we're not going to bring this in that was decided well before the early church canonized the entire Bible they basically took what was already existing in the Hebrew Scriptures and added it to what they collected as writings in the New Testament but this was not part of the Old Testament canon if you were gonna write a book about the Gospels right let's the book of Thomas if you were gonna write a book about Jesus and you were really trying to prove that he was the son of God that he rose from the dead what parts of the story would you want to tell the most the resurrection right well but but the Gospels don't really talk about the resurrection you just see after the resurrection you see Jesus hanging out in the garden and Mary showing up yeah and don't touch me wait but what about the good part what about the part where he to send it into the earth and the part where he comes out of the tomb and the light and well there's nobody there to tell the story right but you look at the book of Thomas and if you're gonna write a really good novel you write the part where he wins you know you in great detail talk about how the stone rolled away and light emitted from the tomb and he walked out Laurie and my young and the book of Thomas in great detail none example riders metal because they weren't there and they didn't have authority to speak on it they write on eyewitness stuff and I think the Book of Enoch or conveniently does that or they're interviewing sure I think Luke went back into interviews I think I think he absolutely interviewed Mary I think he interviews the disciples I think he got first-hand said some of those who have already fallen asleep he was looking for all the eyewitnesses and yeah and that a lot of them had died yes so so yeah he's definitely interviewed these people absolutely but as I would want to write a gospel or something some type of apocryphal writing if I could write something I would want to write on the fifty days and all the demos that Jesus downloaded after the resurrection well guess what that would be horrible because Acts didn't see fit to do that yeah either did any of the Gospels so a lot of that stuff is it we just we just leave it for a time guys recognize this one a very very important thing you are going to be in the presence of God if you are if you put your faith in hope and trust in Jesus Christ and ask him to forgive your sins and you have made him Savior and Lord of your life you are going to be face to face with him with every person that's ever existed in history with every person that was ever part of writing the Canon of Scripture you're going to get all your questions answered we don't necessarily have to have those things this side of glory so let's just slow up a little bit about how fast we slap a logo on this put it in a lunchbox and profit on it as scripture says we should do and I think I think that there is a a legitimate concern that these angelic beings that you mentioned those names or seven names or whatever they are two of which are named in Scripture yet they they conveniently embody manifestations of Greek Egyptian or pagan gods that this is the God of righteousness this is the God of tribulation this is the God of XY and Z and these preside over this authority of X Y & Z where again throughout the Scriptures there is no specificity of what they do outside of Michael seems to fight a couple times in Gabriel delivers messages yeah and that's not to say that they couldn't interchange those it's not to say that Michael couldn't deliver a message or that Abril couldn't fight it's only to say that we see them doing this regularly right so as we approach the Book of Enoch just be aware that it conveniently answers all of the questions about the supernatural now some would say well obviously that's why it needs to be in the Canon I would say maybe that's why it's not in the Canon exactly maybe maybe the reason that there's so much unique revelation that goes in expounds so much on these specific angelic things I have seen if and you could probably reference this because you've done church history and especially in the Pentecostal charismatic movement that when people start going after angels they starts quoting England angels and in this revelation and that angel came to me and spoke to me and this thing and that thing and they start referencing in Yaqui introduction you could you can set your watch but how long it's gonna take that do to fall or that or that lady to fall yeah you you you can almost set your watch when people start getting their eyes often I was Jesus yeah I was just gonna say that because it's in in church today guys Gnostics have been around for in the church today you you'll hear you know we have special revelation come to our conference you know or or get this book with with unique information that God gave me in a dream or a vision listen again not judging but super sketch for me like a super sketch for me because it better it it better be in this book and what you quote-unquote are offering as a resource is a very highly accurate condensed version of what I can find in here already by myself but if you're bringing me something that I don't see anywhere from even contents to maps I'm really not interested in it so how cool it is again just kind of recap on the Book of Enoch can Christians read it answers yes should Christians read it or why should Christians read it that might be a better why yeah the why should if you were gonna read it it would help you understand the Jewish perspective on some of these topics so that when Jesus is answering questions about angels and demons when Jude and Peter are referencing them that you know what they're referencing and who they're addressing their Jewish audience so again I think that you could read the book - maybe better understand the Jewish framework but not to take those scriptures as Authority and move it over into the scriptures and commit what theologians called eisegesis where we read a concept and we try to read that concept into the text well homosexuality was a sin that's what the Bible says but in that day a homosexuality really was Old Men molesting little boys and then reading that into the text opposed to allowing the text to speak for itself and pull truth out of it so so some would read The Book of Enoch and commit what we call eisegesis and say oh this is what they believed therefore this is what it means and read that into the text I think that would be a dangerous thing to do I think that you could read The Book of Enoch to understand the framework and to say that this is what Peter this is what Jude is referencing to help really again just to understand the Jewish context that's the best advice that I can give for it yeah absolutely and then point you to other guys who are more knowledgeable about it which is Michael Heizer oh go look it up although the show is the definitive answer on everything on everything basically it's like for New Testament basically Kuja just just under canon no just cleanser another if we're gonna joke satire we have no no horribly okay so it looks like a couple things we've got a bunch of thumbs up on banding this they want another show maybe we'll talk more just on angelic stuff and maybe reference some modern-day things or maybe talk about you know revelation verses illumination verses modern-day writings and and would Paul quote you know Tozier or you know any other political if ik you know Bill Johnson or any of those guys you know I think I think there's some good stuff there but I'm but I'm wanting to see it in Scripture definitely want to take that approach to taking another show we've got a lot of requests Chad says always ask what to do with the revelation I would agree with you Chad my brother I think there's there is stuff that that God wants to give us and show us but again not specifically to reference you Chad but but just in general I think we need to adopt the terminology illumination versus revelation because revelation makes it seem like something extra biblical illumination keeps it within the context of what has already been revealed and I think that's words are they matter that's right that's part of why we're here so also words matter Josh here's a question for you rick joyner in 2018 spoke about the endtime army of the greater works signs and wonders generation referencing to the remnant and supported out of the Book of Enoch do you see that in Enoch I'm gonna have to study that up and look and reference that and then discuss that with you I am NOT a scholar on the Book of Enoch I read it twice once was this week and I wasn't actually able to finish all of it I got about 3/4 of the way through we have VBS every night so I stay up late wake up early to read this I did and yeah so I've read it twice and and at that have not been super thorough with it I do have concerns and conditions about it but um yeah man I'll read into it I'll look up what Rick Joyner said in 2018 if you can send me the link you can toss it in here or message me privately and I'll go check that out for sure and try to answer you either privately or publicly if you guys have more questions we gotta wrap the show up but if you have more questions even after this video is live dump them in the comment section and we'll try to address it in the next video absolutely let me know what do you want us to do the next video on would you like us to do Book of Enoch would you like us to talk more about what the bible says about angels and demons those kinds of things be specific with your questions so that we can most of our shows on mondays are inviting people onto the show to discuss what they want to discuss this is a great opportunity for us to answer questions that you have so it's a little bit different be specific with your questions so that we know how to frame the show and next week is going to be an interesting episode I am it might be real interesting might be very interesting you might just have Josh and we're gonna try something which which will actually if this works it will greatly expand remnant radios capacity of having other guests who can't make it into the studio we're gonna be some facetiming skyping whatever video chatting yes video chatting I'm gonna be in Colorado delivering my daughter to the axe school of ministry and she's gonna be going overseas for five six months and I'm driving her up to Colorado Springs so I'm gonna be up there and I'll be phoning in which is be really early for me because you know I got to get up a whole extra two hours ahead of time because I need an hour to pray and get spiritual and have God give me the things that I want to say and then the time difference you're not mocking prayer I just know you're watching no I'm not mocking a geyser thank you so much for watching we're gonna wrap up the show I know there's a few of you still watching the program let's go another hour can I ask you to do this for me do me a favor we really trying to upgrade our equipment we're using cell phones to produce this show okay we we need right around a thousand twelve hundred dollars to finally upgrade everything that we have we'd love to do that before August because we were going to the 818 conference so if you liked this ministry it blessed you help us out donate go to our website the remnant radio.com and you can donate there it would be a huge blessing we love you guys thank you so much for tuning in we will see you guys next week yes we absolutely will see you next week be blessed love you [Music] [Music]

Channel: The Remnant Radio

Views: 328,528

Rating: 4.6958752 out of 5

Keywords: fallen angel, fallen angels, nephilim giants, nephilim, book of enoch debate, book of enoch, enoch, enoch and the nephilim, enoch and the nephelim, dr. michael heiser, dr. michael heiser unseen realm, angelology, theology

Id: KTLCmE26P1A

Length: 59min 47sec (3587 seconds)

Published: Wed Jul 18 2018