TF2: How Damage Resistances Work

that double dog would have destroyed me but thank god i had the shield on this lovely little moment in time highlights a very important part about tf2's ever so delicate balancing act damage resistances and vulnerabilities a resistance or vulnerability is inherited by a class through the use of unlockable items all of which are in place to either provide a direct benefit to the player or balance out the benefits that an item provides while the concept itself is relatively simple how they actually work in game remains an area of confusion for many players especially newer ones so my overall goal here is to explain how damage resistances and vulnerabilities work in team fortress 2. more specifically how they are applied how they translate into effective health for players and most importantly how they interact with each other so let's get started hey hey how are you it's me it's a good thing i caught you good thing i got you right at the beginning of the video you're gonna want to skip this one because this one sucks [Applause] open up those ears because here is the main fact that you need to keep with your brain as we move through this video damage resistances and vulnerabilities directly impact the effective health of the class you are playing as by effective health i mean how much health you actually have that isn't accurately represented by the health number shown on your screen unlike weapons and items that directly change your base health like the gunslinger the sandman or the islander items that provide a resistance or a vulnerability give no visual representation of how much health you actually have ah yes but the wiki should say something about this right oh wow that's about as useful as a horse with no legs okey dokey then so with the uh motivation properly solidified let's get into how resistances and vulnerabilities actually work in the general presence of either a resistance or a vulnerability the game looks at how much damage you would normally take from a source and then multiplies that incoming damage by the appropriate percentage modifier for example the charging charge gives the demoman a 30 resistance to blast damage this means that all blast damage being done to the demoman is being multiplied by one minus 0.3 or 0.7 so for example the 100 damage that is normally taken from a grenade launcher pipe gets multiplied by the percentage modifier of 0.7 making a deal only 70 damage or 30 percent less another useful way to visualize this 30 resistance would be to calculate your effective health against blast damage to do this you just take your base health and divide it by that percentage modifier so for this example the demoman has 175 divided by 0.7 or 250 health against blast damage pretty simple right wrong thankfully for us the simplicity continues because damage vulnerabilities work in the exact same way for example the candy cane makes the scout take 25 extra damage from blast sources this means that all incoming blast damage is multiplied by 1 plus 0.25 or 1.25 let's calculate the scout's effective health against blast damage in this case that would be 125 divided by 1.25 or exactly 100 health against blast damage so a grenade launcher pipe would deal exactly 125 damage against the scout using the candy cane effectively one-shotting him just to give you one more example the fists of steel for the heavy provides a 40 damage resistance to ranged sources while active meaning the heavy effectively has 500 health to work with when he has them out however they also make the heavy take 100 more damage from melee sources dropping his effective health to only 150 against melee damage there are a lot more items that have damage resistances and vulnerabilities so i've compiled a list of all of them together along with the respective health pools that they grant the user if you want to check these out there is a link to the excel spreadsheet in the description players can also be subjected to multiple resistances and vulnerabilities at the same time so how do resistances and vulnerabilities interact with each other when you have more than one resistance or vulnerability to the same damage type one's intuition might assume that they would just add up this is incorrect in tf2 damage resistances are not additive they are multiplicative this is unfortunately where the usefulness of the wiki ends so allow for me to elaborate in this symbol of mathematical terms as i can put it this is how multiple resistances or vulnerabilities stack together the percentage modifier to the damage is simply the first one multiplied by the second one multiplied by the third one and so on and so forth going back to the charge and charge demo being healed by the vaccinator medic all incoming blast damage is multiplied by 1 minus 0.3 multiplied by 1 minus 0.1 which is equal to 0.63 the damage modifier is simply the modifier from the charging charge multiplied by the modifier from the vaccinator so a 100 damage pipe from the grenade launcher would only do 63 damage i understand that this might be a little bit confusing so something i like to do with my students is give them another way to visualize a problem so for you guys here another way to visualize how resistances and vulnerabilities stacked together is that each one is applied one at a time but in no particular order for example the damage from a grenade launcher pipe goes from 100 down to 70 with the charge and charges 30 blast resistance that's because we applied the first percentage modifier of 0.7 to the 100 damage then that 70 damage drops down to 63 when you are being healed by the vaccinator medic with blast resistance enabled because we applied the second damage modifier of 0.9 to that 70 damage but the lovely thing about multiplication is that the order you do it in doesn't matter so you could have applied the vaccinator's resistance first and then the charging charge is second and would have come out with the same result aha but what about a resistance and a vulnerability well it's the same principle let's say we have that same charge and charge demo but this time he's using the clade more so that's a 30 resistance to blast damage and a 15 vulnerability to all damage while the sword is active in this case all incoming blast damage is multiplied by one minus 0.3 multiplied by 1 plus 0.15 which is equal to 0.805 so here the demoman takes 81 damage from a grenade launcher pipe since 100 times 0.805 is equal to 80.5 which is then rounded up to 81. hold on a second you thought i was done but things are about to get really crazy here what about three or more resistances and vulnerabilities it sounds like the wacky t-shirt well the only way that we can have say three or four of them working together is with the battalion's backup say we have that same charge in target claymore using demoman being healed by the vaccinator medic and under the effects of a battalion's backup how much damage would he take from a grenade launcher pipe in this case well i won't talk you through this one but the same concepts apply i'll just put all of the equations on the screen and then the final answer there it is that's it that's it there you go still pretty simple i think mathematically there is one last thing that i need to cover and that's how resistances and vulnerabilities interact with crits and mini crits put simply resistances and vulnerabilities ignore crits and mini crits they only reduce or increase the damage taken by the base damage of the weapon and do not adjust damage based on the crit or mini crit value for example a pain trained soldier takes 10 percent extra damage from bullets this makes a sniper body shot deal 55 damage since 50 multiplied by one plus 0.1 is 55. under the effects of mini crits a regular sniper rifle body shot only deals 68 damage on this pain train soldier it deals 73 damage if we take the difference of 73 and 68 that's just five only five damage was added to this mini crit value that's because only ten percent of the sniper rifle's base damage was applied from the pain train's vulnerability and the extra damage from the mini crit was ignored all right let's take a brief break let's take a pause from the mathematics let the brain decompress dial it back here for a moment envision things that make you happy envision things that make you smile think about things that make your life worth living hey hold on one sec what hold on what huh what do you mean there's no such thing as a mid-roll ab break it says right here in the [ __ ] script i just did it look oh that's a d oh [ __ ] this video is sponsored by healthy eye care yes this is a mid-roll ad i actually have a sponsor this is not a joke healthy eye care offers eyesight protection for heavy screen users with their pixel protection glasses fancy names aside they sell blue light glasses that not only filter out the harsh blue light that's emitted by your electronic devices screens but they also cut down on the glare from light in general offering a sharper image as you work from home again play tf2 and intentionally throw your game because you really want to focus down that one guy with seven unusuals even while crashing this plane i've been using blue light glasses in general for about a year now and i've noticed a significant decrease in the number of headaches and eye aches i get after long sessions of working on my computer or playing video games when i was approached for a sponsorship from healthy eye care i said sure but only if you send me a pair of your glasses so i can try them out for myself so they did and here they are these are really nice entry-level blue light glasses for people who've been thinking about getting a pair for a while but just haven't gotten around to doing it yet they're affordable they work and they're pretty durable as in they won't break if you drop them on the ground and i've dropped mine on the ground several times i wouldn't endorse a product unless i myself like it and use it and i use these glasses and i like them so if you want a pair of your own pixel protection blue light glasses head on over to the healthyeyecare.com and use promo code zesty all caps for 10 off of your order shipping offered worldwide [Music] and just like that i'm in my new apartment so it shouldn't sound like i'm talking from the inside of a cardboard box and guess what i had you fooled you thought this was just going to be an informational video but no i tricked you this is now a video about why most damage vulnerabilities completely suck okay no not really but here is something interesting to note guess which weapons have damage vulnerabilities as a downside in team fortress 2. any guesses they're all on melee weapons every single weapon that has a damage vulnerability in tf2 is a melee weapon i say it as if though or a problem it is a problem why is it a problem zesty i'll tell you why a percent increase in damage taken is not as simple as a flat decrease of base health the damage taken from a vulnerability scales with distance since most weapons in tf2 have some form of damage ramp up and fall off meaning that players with damage vulnerabilities take a lot more damage when they get too close to their enemies so how does putting a damage vulnerability on nothing but melee weapons make sense okay let me dial it back here the concept of a damage vulnerability works air quotations on at least one melee weapon the power jack this item grants the user with 15 percent faster movement speed while active and 25 health restored on kill but at the cost of a 20 damage vulnerability on the wearer while it's active most of the time this weapon is used as a mobility tool however it does grant 25 health on kill which incentivizes the player to use it in combat but here's the thing melee kills with pyros usually happen within a very small time window especially with the power jack since not only are pyros able to pin players against walls with the air blast to secure a melee kill but the 15 faster movement speed closes the distance even quicker oh yeah and random crits exist that 20 damage vulnerability doesn't have enough active time in combat to be a severe detriment to the user unless they just get unlucky and whip it out right as they get hit from a high damage source that they don't see coming it's an incredibly reliable movement tool but its other benefits make it a reliable melee weapon in the right scenarios the damage vulnerability is rarely an issue with the item which is why the power jack is the best pyro melee right now aside from the extinguisher this is the only example of a current damage vulnerability that isn't completely counter-intuitive or utterly pointless case in point number one the warrior spirit the melee weapon that encourages players to use it because it does 30 more damage and grants 50 health per kill but is supposed to be balanced out because it makes you take 30 more damage when they're active after exercising my right to bear arms for a while it's not as bad as people make it out to be thanks to the fact that it can two-shot anything under 170 health and the existence of a 254 damage random crit here's fine but damage vulnerabilities on melee weapons don't work on classes like the heavy because he moves so god damn slow unlike the power jack your time window of active views with the warrior spirit is way larger leaving you even more vulnerable to extra damage but then if you try to pair it with the buffalo steak sandwich the item in the same item set that is supposed to make you even more powerful with your melee by speeding you up and making you deal mini crits just makes you take even more damage all together the warrior spirit encourages players to use their melee but then punishes them way too heavily for using their melee it's hideously counterintuitive the concept of taking more damage because you deal more damage is already not a good way to balance an item but especially so for a slow moving tank i say rework the items so the 30 damage vulnerability is completely removed but slow down the firing speed like the kjb i think that's a step in the right direction case in point number two the clademore currently the clademor grants you with half second longer charges and 25 charge back on kill but at the cost of a 15 damage vulnerability while the sword is active why valve ever opted to swap the -15 max health for a 15 damage vulnerability is just why because the damage vulnerability punishes the demoman for the exact same reasons the warrior spirit punishes the heavy it encourages players to use their melee but then punishes them for getting too close to players with their melee sure for someone who is playing as hybrid knight or full demo knight this doesn't sound like much of an issue because the variety of available shields does offset the vulnerability significantly against fire and blast damage but you still have to deal with melee and bullet damage bullet damage having the highest ramp up out of all others in the game plus this melee weapon encourages longer charges ergo longer periods of time with it out and active making you even more vulnerable to more damage even though it encourages you to have it out for longer periods of time what and then and then if you try to play full demo night with this thing it just amplifies the issue because the weapon is always out and active [ __ ] i live in this world anymore these points aside as it stands right now the clade more certainly isn't unusable it's actually pretty decent mainly because the damage vulnerability is only active when the weapon is active so if you're playing hybrid knight and time things right it shouldn't be that much of a negative impact as a user but yes i am one of those people i say revert the clade more back to having -15 max health instead of the 15 damage vulnerability i much prefer a slight punishment by having less health in all situations rather than just a really big fat counter-intuitive one when i'm supposed to be using it and then and then number three we have the southern hospitality this is a completely pointless damage vulnerability that was in place to balance out an upside that is essentially a direct upgrade to stock in servers without random crits enabled the 20 fire damage vulnerability makes no sense for the engineer because when is a pyro going to get close enough to an engineer to use his flamethrower unless the engineer is caught out alone without a sentry gun near him so i would like to say this entire time as i've been using the southern hospitality i have not been hit by fire once the downside of this weapon is not being realized at all and i top score with it okay sure one could argue that the pyro has flare guns but unless it's the detonator or the scorch shot with an ample blast radius good luck hitting him behind his buildings and other teammates and even then the initial hit from flare guns counts as bullet damage not fire so only the afterburn is affected by that vulnerability the only scenario where this vulnerability even becomes a detriment to the engineer is when he just opts to charge at a pyro or if a pyro charges him and his buildings ubered or otherwise the southern hospitality needs it needs something something to make it more worthwhile to use and something completely different to balance it out because right now this is one of the least used items in the game its upside is okay kind of gimmicky but effectively useless in comparison to the engineer's other melee options i i don't have an ample solution to rework this one i you guys throw some ideas at me i don't know [ __ ] it speaking of least used items the final case in point is the candy cane this item grants small health packs back on kill with any of your weapons in exchange for a 25 vulnerability to blast damage at all times regardless of weapon status oh god for most players this weapon it just sucks but for high skill players this weapon works really well on what some consider to be the most mobile class in the game why high level scouts know how to jump and dodge which largely negates the only downside the weapon has plus they can secure kills more often to get those health packs back and return lost health meanwhile every other scout just gets chewed up by blast damage they rarely get to make use of its upside because they have a harder time getting kills to get health packs back so they just keep dying to blast damage it's a vicious cycle this weapon is rarely used because so few players reach that upper echelon of skill to make the weapon worth using i say the candy cane needs some leveling out make it reduce the scout's base health by 15 instead of the current 25 blast damage vulnerability this way all levels of skill are subject to the same downside and upside at all times but new players won't be deterred from using the item because they won't get constantly one shot by soldiers and demoman and that's all i got i hope you guys enjoyed this video yes i know it was a long one jesus christ but what do you guys think about weapons with the resistance or vulnerability are the current ones justified are they too weak are they too strong let me know what you guys think in the comments below peace out guys and i'll see you all next [Music] time [Music] oh oh [ __ ] you leatherman

Channel: Zesty Jesus

Views: 226,571

Keywords: tf2, team fortress 2, resistance, vulnerability, damage, demoman, pyro, soldier, heavy, scout, zesty, jesus, zesty jesus, how do, work, powerjack, warriors, spirit, warriors spirit, candy, cane, candy cane, engineer, southern hospitality, demoknight, claidheamh mor, claidheamh, mor, chargin, targe, chargin targe

Id: AXYvn4G7fJw

Length: 21min 45sec (1305 seconds)

Published: Sun Oct 18 2020