- Damn, that was my best take, too.
- I know, that was so good. It was so natural.
- I'm gonna go again. - Let's see if you have the same magic. - Oh shit.
(Taylor laughs) Hey Taylor. - Hi Martin.
- How are you? - I'm so good, I'm so happy to be talking to you.
- Hold on there. - Oh my god.
- God. - That was the one.
- Guys! That was the one.
- We'll never do it that well again. (upbeat music) Take four.
- Okay. Is it three or four? How are you doing? - So happy to be talking to you. - You too, "Directors On Directors." - Yeah.
- I think we should do, sometime, "Directors On
Directors On Mushrooms." - I was thinking margaritas
or like shots halfway through. Sure-
- Shots halfway through, could work.
- I mean, we don't know. - Well, let's get back to what we're here for.
- Mm hmm. I got the chance to go to the premiere of "The Banshees of Inisherin." It was one of the most special experiences I could ever have imagined
having at a premiere. Being there, watching it with a group of people who loved it as much as I did. I've been such a fan of your
work between your short film, "Three Billboards," you are
someone I respect so much, and so I wanted to talk to
you about, how do you do it? (Martin laughs)
What's the secret? - Thank you, Taylor. - Give us some tips.
- Now I'm embarrassed. - Put them in bullet points.
(Martin laughs) Give us some directions to follow. - As you know, I've been
a massive fan of yours for years and years and years
and loved "All Too Well," so I wanted to get into the
nitty gritty of that too. - Oh, thanks. - Did you always want to direct? - No. I always wanted to tell stories. I have always written
stories, poetry, songs. I think this just kind of grew
out of a natural extension of that storytelling, and I don't think I
ever necessarily thought that it would be something
I would sort of be allowed to do until I actually
had enough experience to kind of say, "Hey, you know what? I want to step out and do this on my own and see what it's like." And the more I did it,
the more I loved it. - Did you ever have
experiences where you knew you could do a better job than the person who was actually doing it? (Taylor clears her throat) - Whoa, we're just going
right in, aren't we? There were times when, this
actually came out of necessity. Like I was writing my videos for years and I had a video that was a very specific concept I had written, which was that I wanted to
be prosthetically turned into a man and live my life as a man and I wanted a female
director to direct it. And the few that I reached out
to were, fortunately, booked. You know, we like it when women work. - (laughs) Yeah.
- But none of the female directors that I wanted to direct it could do it. So I was like, "Well,
I could do it, maybe?" And then when I did direct, I just thought, "This is
actually more fulfilling than I ever could have imagined." - Wow, so it was almost
by accident that you. - Yeah, it was like
happenstance, and now I've done, I think I've directed
about 10 music videos and now one short, so I'm kind of, I'm just sort of inching
my way along towards taking on more responsibility. - Yeah.
- But with you and doing plays, was
there ever a point where, were you starting out
directing plays, thinking, "I want to direct films." - Weirdly, all of my plays, I never directed one of them. - Oh, so you would just write them and you never directed-
- I'd just write. - The plays?
- I'd always be in the rehearsal room with the actors and working with the director. But because you've got so much control as the playwright in the room- - Oh.
- That I never felt, yeah, the necessity to be in that much charge. And I worked with good directors who were not uncomfortable with me talking
to the actors at any point and kind of giving them
some direction anyway. In theater-
- That's amazing. - You pick the director, and you cast the actors, and no one can cut a line
that you don't want cut. So it's a very different process to being a writer on a movie. - That's fantastic.
- So that's kind of why I knew I had to direct the movies
'cause the writer is the sort of lowest form of life on a movie. - Yeah, in terms of creative control. - Exactly. I kind of knew I had to jump in and that's why I did the shorts first to sort of just see if I could do it without being completely terrified, and I was completely terrified. - I think that your short
is sort of like a, what? 26 minute full menu of
the furthest reaches of your tastes as a director, in my, it's like so undistilled, you're like, "And then the cow explodes." (Martin laughs)
(explosion booms) - And then the rabbit and the gun. - And the ambiguity to the ending, and. - Yeah (laughs) I guess so, yeah. So it's just like, hit list of my great crazy shit.
- Oh, I love that you went extreme first, 'cause I think I did too with a short that I did where it's like, "I'm just gonna give you
all my feelings of despair and heartbreak with my first short." - In "All Too Well." - Yes.
- Yeah. So talk me through the process of that. You wrote it knowing you
were gonna direct it? - I wrote it knowing I
wanted it to be a short, I wanted to treat it
completely differently than I'd ever treated a music video. I wanted to use a new cinematographer DP that I'd never used before, Rina Yang. I wanted to shoot it on 35 millimeter. And I wrote it with Sadie Sink
and Dylan O'Brien in mind. Which I heard that you wrote
"Banshees" with your full cast. - Yeah.
- Pretty much cast. - I wrote it for Colin
Farrell and Brendan Gleeson and Barry Keoghan and Kerry Condon. - Those are the four main players. Like that had to have been
amazing to kind of know what colors you wanted to paint with. - Yeah, you kind of, I guess
write to their strengths, but kind of give a little leeway to bring some strange new things to it. - I think it's a new
Colin Farrell performance. - I think he's-
- It's- - Quite lovely in it.
- Amazing. It's so incredible. - So you loved Dylan and
Sadie's work beforehand or you knew them and knew their voices? How did that work? - I'd never met either one of them, but I had seen their work
and I'd kind of thought, you know how sometimes you see an actor and you see the work they've done, but you can kind of see how
it could have gone further? - Yeah.
- And you can kind of see flickers of how they
could really be excellent in a part they hadn't been cast as. - Yeah,
- I had seen Sadie in "Stranger Things" and I
thought she has such a presence. She has such an empathy to her. You can just see micro
emotions flash across her face in a way that I just don't
usually see in performances. It's rare, and I thought, "She's never been a romantic lead and I wonder if she'd
be interested in playing a young woman who goes
through her first, you know, catastrophic, cataclysmic heartbreak." - Yeah, and she did it so brilliantly. - She really, really did. (plates clatter) - [Dylan] Why are you so pissed off? - I'm not pissed off. Who
said I was pissed off? - Did you write it then meet her or meet her and then
hear her voice or what? - I wrote it and I wrote the manuscript and I had kind of visual references of what type of art
direction and the type, the way I wanted to film it
and the colors I wanted to use. There's just sort of a palette. I sort of put together like a, you know, a PDF of what I wanted to make, 'cause I really, I'd
never made a short before. And so I'm in the mode where I'm trying to persuade these two actors
who I don't have backups for in my mind to do the project. - Yeah.
- And trying to convince them. It didn't take any convincing 'cause they just both said yes immediately when I reached out, but
I texted them directly. - Cool.
- And then we talked a lot, had a lot of conversations,
I had them both over, they met each other, and then a couple months
later we were on set. - Wow, and so the script was
like 20 pages or 30 pages? - Yeah, it was-
- And it had dialogue and all that?
- It had dialogue. We had actually, I'd
scripted out some scenes of them falling in love, the scene of them falling
apart, breaking up. And then I'd had this argument, and- - I'm really interested in this argument. - So the argument was the one that we ended up keeping as a scene. I knew I wanted one scene to play out and I didn't know which
one it was gonna be so. - Play out without music?
- Without music. Because I thought that it
was just important to get a very potent glimpse into their dynamic. And I didn't know if that
would come through best with them falling in love,
breaking up, or fighting. It turned out the fight
was where we saw the most of who these people are
and what the problems are. - I actually had a fucking blast. Now, now this is the night,
now we're doing this. Awesome, so fucking awesome. - So could the song have
stopped at any of those points? - Yeah, we have it in the edit. I mean, we have it in, it's on film somewhere. - Yeah.
- But we didn't put it in because I just thought, I wanna tell this whole story, but I want there to be
one really, you know, portal glimpse into their
life where we stop the music because the music does a pretty good job of explaining the arc. - And just shooting that, how did it go? - It ended up being one shot. You know, we had Rina with the steady cam and we were just gonna shoot
it as many times as we needed to to get the coverage that we needed. But it turned out that it was
one of those magic takes where we don't cut till probably
85, 90% through that scene. - Wow.
- My producer and I were just at the monitor, just clutching each other. - [Martin] Oh, I love
it when that happens. - Just, you know (laughs). So it was fantastic and I think you strike me
as someone who has a lot of trust in your actors.
- Yeah. - And that was, I think, that
was that leap of faith moment of putting them in a room and they're having to
fill in all the blanks of this chemistry, and we
had talked at length about the dynamics of this fight. And it really comes down to the fact that she does not feel seen
within this relationship. And on some level, he doesn't either, because both of these people
are essentially saying, "You don't understand
where I'm coming from." - Yeah.
- "And you can't understand where I'm coming from." - Well one of the things I loved about it, sorry for interrupting you. - No, no.
- Was it did feel completely balanced. I think the song mostly is
sort of from her point of view, but that scene was equal. - I think so too.
- I was quite surprised in a lovely way that that was there. - Hey, hey, hey. Come on, come on, come on. I don't wanna fight. I don't wanna fight. - And so was that all your dialogue? Was it partly improvised or?
- It was partly improvised. I had written out that
fight with the same arc and it being about the same thing. We had just talked about
it so many times about what this fight is about and what sort of things they
would be saying to each other. It's a testament to them
as just brilliant actors and collaborators that they went in there and there were some things
that Dylan would just blurt out or that Sadie would say, and I'd just be sitting at
the monitor going, "Oh my God. Oh my God, we are keeping
that in the cut." (laughs) - So is the one we see,
was that like first take or only take?
- It was the first take. - Wow.
- And then we did one or two more, but that was
the one where I was like, you know, if you have it, you have it. - Yeah. Yeah.
- And I knew we would use that one for the most part
for the predominant length of that scene 'cause it just did
everything I wanted it to do. - And is it moments like that, that you felt made it a short film and took it away from the usual
sort of music video media? - It was moments like that and it was the fact that
it has a narrative arc. The chapters in the short film are there because it has chapters
like "The Breaking Point," "The First Crack in the Glass," those end up being chapters in a book that she one day writes. So it's structured narratively in a way that I felt had to be
different from any music video that I've made. It couldn't be a music video
where I'm singing the lyrics and you're seeing some
flashbacks and flash forwards and whatever.
- Yeah. - I wanted people to be in that world with these two characters. - And they are. - I think in terms of breakups and people fracturing
and people falling apart, watching "Banshees," first of all, it's such a special film. Watching it with other people, I think it's one of those
films that's gonna hit home and make people think and make people talk about it afterward, 'cause I've been talking
about it ever since. What was it about-
- With analysts and other friends, I hear?
- Yeah, so I've been talking
to it about my friends and one thing I think is that everybody relates more
to one of the main characters. Whether you're going through
like what Colm is going through or Padraic or Siobhan.
- Siobhan. - Siobhan, I think it really depends on what you're going through. I talked to a friend of
mine who's a therapist and she was saying, "If
someone brought in this dream to me and said I had this dream," I don't wanna spoil anything, "I'm wanting to cut a
part of my body off." - It's kind of in the trailer, so you're okay.
- Okay, "So I'm wanting to cut my
finger off and it's all about," she would say it's because you feel like your aliveness is being cut
off by a part of your life and this art represents the fingers. What do you think the
fingers is a symbolism for, is what I'm trying to say.
- I don't know, I just thought it was funny. - Really? You just thought it was funny? - And each time you bother
me from this day on, I'll take those shears and I'll take one of my
fingers off with them and I'll give that finger to you until I have no fingers left. - I knew it was dangerous and I knew it couldn't be a
threat towards the other person. - Mm, yeah.
- And there seems something kind of, not artistic about it, but there's something in
this self-destructive nature of Brendan Gleeson's
character, the artist, that has that, and I guess, I don't know if we all
have that to a degree, that it's something we're
sort of staving off, you know?
- Mm hmm. - However we do it to ourselves, if it's through drugs or
self-harm or all those things. He had that in him and he almost had that
before the story starts. I talked about it with Brendan Gleeson and he was wondering
whether or not the despair, which is sort of touched
upon through the film, is something that we should see building or manifesting throughout the film. But we kind of came to the decision that he's already sort of been through that before the film starts.
- Yeah. - And the whole reason
why he has to be so harsh with Colin Farrell's character is that if he doesn't do that, he could die by his own hand anyway. - Wow.
- So that kind of explains how tough he's being, because he isn't, I think in those first
scenes when he says, "I'm just not your friend
anymore, will you leave me alone?" It's being overly harsh just
to get it through to him. I think things kind of
unravel when he's being a bit nicer about it. - So him saying, "I don't
wanna be your friend," is actually the last straw in something that's probably been building for ages. - I think so. Yeah.
- Yeah, that's what it felt like.
- A dramatic last straw, yeah. But the fingers thing, the
threat of it, you kind of, I didn't know, I never plan
out a script beforehand, so I never do a treatment and never know what's gonna
happen from scene to scene. So I was kind of shocked
when he came into the pub and made that threat. But after it happened, it kind of throws everything up in the air and anything could happen after that. - So when you sit down to write a script, you haven't storyboarded the arc of it, you just see what happens.
- Yeah. Just have a vague idea of the characters. With this, it was basically, you know, the one guy doesn't wanna be friends with another guy anymore, on an island.
- I love how you say you were shocked by it as if it was sort of an involuntary thing that
just came out of your brain without you having anything to do with it. - It totally was.
- I love that. - Yeah, I love it when that happens. Plot twists like that. If you don't know that
they're gonna happen, hopefully the audience
won't see it coming too. You know the story's gonna
probably not have a happy ending, not necessarily, or a
happy next few scenes. - Yeah. (laughs)
- When something weird like that happens.
- It's delightful to watch. It's so sprinkled with humor
and warmth and coldness. It's all over the map. - And it looked pretty. - [Taylor] Oh my God. And Ben Davis.
- Yeah, fantastic.
- Had you worked with him? - [Martin] He did "Three Billboards." - Oh my gosh.
- And "Seven Psychos," too. He's a brilliant DP. I guess both of these
things we're talking about are breakup movies.
- Yes. - To a degree.
- Mm hmm. - I think you said at TIFF
that you found it hard to even sing that song 10 years before. So I am imagining you
couldn't have directed it way back when.
- No way. No way, and you know, back then I was just starting the process of writing music videos and starting to kind of
use songs as a prompt, as like a creative writing prompt, and then carry out the
visual and make a video. But I was not in a place where I ever, first of all, emotionally,
I was just kind of, I was going through exactly
what the short film depicts. And I think that time is such an incredible asset to
us when we have these stories that are hard to tell in the moment because, it's good if a
story is hard to tell. That means it's incredibly
emotionally potent. - Yeah.
- But it's impossible to tell it with perspective and truth if you're in it sometimes. - Yeah, yeah.
- Sometimes that amount of intensity can be actually stifling. - Yeah.
- And I think that having just the privilege of being
able to tell this story, the fact that it was something
that the fans wanted, this song was very grassroots. It was never made into a single, it was always just a song
on the album that I loved. And over the years, the fans made it very clear
that it was their favorite song of any song I've ever done. - That's so funny that, you did feel, didn't feel that way or it was
kind of lingering in the back of your head that it was a brilliant song? - I thought that it was, I loved it because I thought that it
was the most truthful account of heartbreak and loss and grief. In the moment, I was
on a record label . . . that, you know, any record
label would've told you back then if it's a song
that's over three minutes- - Ah, yeah.
- Then it's not gonna work at radio and you have these
songs that are so much catchier or whatever it was. Things unraveled in such a great, weird way to make this song
exist the way that it does now. And so I thought, "It's
been such a buildup, I really have to tell this story in a way that gets to the heart of it." And so it was so exciting
to kind of go through it and to be able to be
in my 30s looking back, because I think there's
a moment when you're 19 or 20 where your heart is so, so susceptible to, just getting broken, getting shattered, and your sense of self goes
out the window so quickly and it's such a formative age. - Yeah.
- I wanted to tell that story, too, about sort of girlhood calcifying into this bruised adulthood. - [Martin] Were you always
gonna play the grownup writer at the end of the short?
- Yeah, I think so. I think that was always my idea for it because enough time has gone by to where you can show
someone in a different phase of their life and see how
they've been positively and negatively affected by this event- - Yeah.
- That you saw happen. - I think you kind of
grow with each feature or you learn more with each feature, or you just get less stressed or scared with each one.
- Mm hmm. - But I think this was the first one that I was kind of completely
comfortable going into, partly 'cause I knew or had worked with all of the actors before, pretty much all of the actors.
- Yeah. - And the team of like DP and production designer and first AD, which I never realized how important that job was before I started.
- Yeah! (laughs) - It's like, it's a co-pilot, basically. - Yeah, absolutely.
- Have you latched onto people who you'll definitely
bring from job to job and to features-
- Absolutely. - In the future, which
is my next question? - Ooh, yeah, I definitely
have people I've worked with who I thought were sort of imperative and integral to the process
of making what I made. And yeah, I would absolutely
work with people again, I also wanna branch out and I'm such a fan of so many people who are
out there being a part of crews on films that I love. So it's sort of half and half. There's a part of me that
really has so many people that are so talented
that I wanna work with, but I also have people
sort of in my back pocket that I've thought, you know, working with them was a dream and I wouldn't wanna
change that up at all. - So would that be like a list of DPs, or actors or?
- It'd be DPs, it'd be production designers, it'd be first ADs, it'd
be camera operators. It's, you know, costume design, wardrobe, hair, makeup. It's kind of, I've got a
little list of people who, because I love film, I
love watching movies, and I love when you see a film that takes you to a different world. I now ask myself, "Okay, who
was in charge of that part? Who was in charge of that part? Who made me feel this way?" - Yeah, so which films in your youth or 20s were those that kind of
made you wanna be a director? - Oh wow, I think there are so many that I love over my life, but with the short film that
I made in terms of heartbreak, this is really recent, but
"The Souvenir Part I and II" - Oh yeah.
- I absolutely loved. - Yeah. They were beautiful.
- They're beautiful, gorgeous, and they were about somebody
making art through heartbreak. And so I absolutely loved that. I loved "Marriage Story" and I love a lot of films
in the 70s that really like, I don't know, "Kramer
vs. Kramer," for example. - Yeah.
- Just kind of the dissolution of the belief system
that is a relationship is very fascinating to me. - Do you think all of
your work is gonna be relationship based, or
are you gonna broaden, could you see yourself doing
like a sci-fi or a Western or an Irish something?
- Wow. I couldn't see myself doing
sci-fi at this point in my life. I don't think that's where
my strengths would lie. I don't think I would go headlong into another heartbreak story because it's just, you
know, just did that. It takes a lot out of you. But what about you? I mean, you just told a really epic friendship heartbreak story, which I think is an angle that is, of all the stories that are told, I haven't seen that touched
on, that relationship dynamic. - [Martin] Yeah, they don't
usually have sort of platonic, old guys on an island breaking up. - But it's so important!
- It is. - It happens to everyone
and it's so important. - That friendship breakup-
- Yeah. - Is a weird one and it's
not really, you're right, it's not really talked about
in modern culture too much. - No.
- But it can be the most devastating
breakup of all, I find. Even though I think this
one was written more through a heartbreak point in my life. So I think the sadness
in the script was coming from that kind of point of view. - I didn't hear there was to be a session. - Last minute. Colm decided. All the ladies love Colm, you know? Always did.
- Yeah, that's not true. - I assume you want to make features. - I do, I do now. - And would the plan be to write a script or get a script from somewhere else? - I would wanna write it. It's so much easier for me to visualize how I would
wanna shoot something and how I would wanna tell a story if I know exactly where it came from. - Yeah.
- And I know exactly why each line exists, and-
- Me too, actually. - Yeah, I'm, yeah, I'm
preaching to the converted. That comes through in
what you make, I think, it's just such a sincere reason for everything existing, the way it does, and I think there's a subtlety, also, I loved how "Banshees" was shot. I loved-
- Thank you. - It was gorgeous, it was expansive. You feel like you're
getting a cinematic escape. It's really about the acting. It's really about the story. It's about the weight of it all and it's not, you know,
I love a trick shot. It's fun when you put a camera
in a ceiling fan or whatever. But this is a different
story that's told, I think, in a very pure way and I thought the restraint that you showed was actually one of the most beautiful parts of it. - Thank you, I finally
found some restraint. That's good to hear.
- It's, yeah, I mean. (both laugh) - It is a quiet film, I think. It's a quiet, that's why
I've been kind of surprised that it's going over so well that. I thought, you know, it's a quiet sad one. It's not the Marvel DC Universe, I guess. Quiet, contemplative.
- It is not, it is not the same kind of film. But I think, yes, it's
a sad film in one way, but there's a lot of
beautiful humanity in it. - I hope so, yeah.
- That very warm. - And a beautiful donkey.
- Such a beautiful donkey. There's an incredible donkey in this film. I love casting.
- Wasn't it little Jenny or something?
- Jenny, yeah. - Yeah, Jenny.
- Jenny in real life. and Jenny in the story,
Dreamboat Little Jenny. - Jenny, just play yourself. Just keep doing what you're doing, Jenny. - [Martin] She was a
little diva, actually. - Really?
- She is quite, you know, of all the cast.
- Yeah, I've heard that about asses.
(Martin laughs) There were a lot of animals in this. - Yeah.
- There are horses, there are donkeys, there's a dog.
- There's the dog. - There's an amazing dog.
- There's a little dog, yeah. - So directing animals, is that something that you
had a lot of experience with before, or?
- Not really. I've had rabbits, as you
mentioned, in "Six Shooter." - That's a harrowing rabbit cameo. - Yeah, oh yeah. There was some rabbits
in "Seven Psychopaths," I think.
- Mm hmm. - They survived.
(Taylor laughs) But I love having them around on set. Colin Farrell says, you know, he quotes the old adage of you
shouldn't work with children and animals, but he loves
it and I love it too 'cause they are, they're just like innocent little, like everyone on the crew
just loves being around them, especially Jenny, little dreamboat. - Yeah.
- Like I watch the film now, I'm just looking at the animals. (Taylor laughs)
I don't care what Colin and Brendan are doing. - The devastating scene where, I'm not gonna give any spoilers, but when Colin comes
home to find something devastating has happened. There's a horse. - That reacts.
- Doesn't the horse sort of- - Yeah.
- The horse kind of is like, "Look over there."
- Yeah. - "There's something over
there you should see." - Totally, yeah, and then goes and sniffs, and it's as if the horse
knows the story, I feel like. - Yeah.
- And that horse, weirdly, because the horse was so good
in some of the early scenes, I kept adding more and
more for the horse to do. The morning of that shoot, of that moment, we didn't have the horse in it, but I thought it'd be so wonderful to have-
- Yeah. - Those innocent eyes on that moment, too. - Oh.
- I think that the horse makes that shot, really.
- I think so, too. That scene I think is one
of the most powerful scenes. Colin Farrell is just incredible in this. - Yeah.
- And it's just, it's the moment where
everyone in the theater was kind of audibly weeping near me. - Yeah, I always hope that that
would be, that would happen. He's so brilliant in that moment. So raw and broken, I guess, and sad.
- Yeah. - Which reminds me of
Sadie's moment in your video. - Yes.
- Just had like, for me, for Colin, there was
no direction to be given- - Really?
- That morning, 'cause I knew he would find the place and my job was to get out of the way. Maybe, you know, have him
do it an extra time or two, but try and just leave it up to him. Is that how you worked with Sadie on that moment?
- With Sadie, she is so incredible and so good that it was a very similar thing where I had a few conversations with
her about how she likes to work in those kind of
intense, emotive scenes. And she, I think she does a
lot of prep work on her own. But she also had this song that she says always makes her cry, which is "Savior Complex"
by Phoebe Bridgers. - Brilliant song.
- Which your partner actually directed the video for. - Yep, Phoebe did, the two Phoebes. - So there's another tie. But we ended up playing that song on set, giving Sadie the room for a while. There was also sort of, we wanted her to look
like she'd been crying and the kind of body heave of that. There was like, you know, screaming into pillows and stuff, and some of that we did together and some of that was just her on her own. But we wanted to give her a
lot of space in the room, so. - So you and her would clear the room, scream into pillows together, really? - And then she would do that on her own and do body work to make herself, you'll notice that her skin, you can see just the redness of, it's someone who's been
crying for a while, it's that just excruciating, heaving, sobbing pain. She's an incredible actress. She has been doing this
since she was a little kid, so I think she has her
processes, but it was, you know, there was a music element
to it, which I think is, just a beautiful thing when music can touch someone in that way. - Yeah, yeah.
- So, yeah. - Colin I know has earphones in, there was another scene on the cart where he's sort of tearful. I never know what they're playing though. They never, I never wanna pry. - Mm.
- If it's like voices or songs or-
- Yeah. - What the hell that is. - Is it until you say action or is there?
- Yeah. And then it's leave him to, actually leave him to call
action for those moments. - Oh, that's amazing.
- He'll take them out, have another thought or two, and then just say yes to the first AD. And then, and I think
that's a nice way to- - Yeah.
- Allow them to have- - That's beautiful. - [Martin] Has being an
actress in movies changed how you direct? - Every aspect of my job as a singer, I've occasionally been in a film for very short periods of time (laughs) has affected the way
that I would, you know, that I am as a director. I think I really want
someone to feel comfortable. If they want to be able
to look at the monitor or they want to be able
to know how it's set up and how it looks, then
they should be able to. If they don't wanna see
it, they shouldn't have to. I think it's helpful when people know what story it is they're telling. I've been a part of things
where you didn't know the script and no one knew what the story was. - Really?
- And you just know your little part of it.
- That's crazy. - Yeah, so I think it's important to let someone in on, "This
is why you are doing this and this is how it fits into
a bigger story, and this is, yes, this is your puzzle piece, but this is what the puzzle looks like." - Yeah.
- I imagine you're very honest and frank about that-
- That's a given. - But it's not always the case. I like to be secretive
about projects I'm making, whether it's a music video
or the short, you know, we were so top secret about it. But the people who, you
have to trust the people that you're making something with, to let them know this is
exactly why this matters. - Yeah, and they're
part of the whole team. - Yeah, I don't think I would have that experience if I hadn't
been on everything from, you know, you learn that
from like commercial shoots or a film or a music video that I early on wasn't directing or hadn't written or whatever, so. - Yeah.
- I don't know, it's just, you have to
cast people you trust and then trust them, I think.
- Exactly. That's brilliant, all
directors should do that and not a lot, or not all of them do. One of my favorite
actresses is Laura Dern. And I hear you might be working with her or have just worked with her.
- Yeah, so I worked with her on a music video for a song called "Bejeweled," and it's sort of like a twist
on a "Cinderella" story, 'cause the album's called "Midnights," and I wanted to play into the
main fairy tale that deals with the hour of midnight,
when the clock strikes 12. I wanted there to be a
scene in the beginning where it's the Haim girls
playing the stepsisters and Laura Dern playing my stepmother. And working with her was
absolutely incredible. She's one of these people who is just as wonderful off screen as she is on, and I'd heard that about her. If you love someone's work, but you hear they're
really like, you know, either like sadistic or-
- Yeah. - Bad to people or just
like, or hate doing it. - Yeah.
- You know, some people hate acting.
- Yeah. - Even though they're really good at it. - Yeah.
- So I'm not wanting, I don't wanna, I don't need it. - [Martin] Yeah. Same here. - So I've heard that Laura Dern loves it, is passionate about it, is
doing it for the right reasons. Lovely person and is also brilliant. So I wanted to work with her. I reached out to her and she came to set and it was just the most wonderful time and I feel like I wanna know her forever. - Wow.
- I simply adore a proposal, the single most defining
thing a lady could hope to achieve in her lifetime. - [Martin] Is it hard
directing yourself in things? - No, because I only direct
myself in music videos where, I know exactly what shots I
want to get for a music video. I literally shot list every single shot. - Wow.
- Because it's just, it's so much easier. I edit on set when I do music videos, too. I didn't edit on set when
I did the short film. But for a music video, when
you have it shot listed, you can just knock it out. You only have like two
days to get it done. - Right.
- So I'd rather just hit that, hit that, hit that, slot it in for a video.
- So it's not even two or three takes, it's like, or is that? - If we get it for a music video, if we get it done in one take, I move on. - Wow.
- But that's not how I approached the short film. - Of course.
- And that would not be how I would approach doing
a feature film. (laughs) Every time I sit down
with someone like you who's making work that
I adore, that I respect, it's educational for me
to learn how people work and how they make things that I think are, I mean, I think this is one of the best films I've ever seen. - Oh my God, really?
- I do, I do. - Thank you Taylor.
- I've been talking about it for weeks.
- Thank you. - I think I relate to the most, Padraic. I think my friends, they'll be like Colm, because they're like, I realize that idle time
is affecting my art. Do you think that it kind of
plays into the myth of art and suffering and how they
have to exist side by side? - I think he, that character,
sort of taps into it that, or thinks that, I
completely disagree with it. I mean, you have to write something and be completely on their side with that point of view, I think.
- Totally. Well it's a valid point of view and so many people really,
really believe that. - Yeah, but there can be a
lot of bullshit about it, too. So I don't believe that you have to be, like my set's are happy, happy places. - Yeah.
- I'm a really happy person. - You are a happy person
and you write really, poignant, sad stuff.
- Dark shit, yeah. (both laugh) Poignant and sad, or just dark shit, ideally.
- You're like, yeah. I think it's really interesting the idea of channeling something
very dark and sad and somber and about grief and all
these difficult things, but having like a lovely,
great time doing it. - Yeah.
- It's really strange, because I don't think that
anybody would imagine, you know, you guys telling this story
or even on the short film, like me and Dylan and
Sadie telling a story about just life altering heartbreak, but on set we're just like, "Oh, this is so fun.
That take was amazing!" - Exactly, that's the
funny thing about it. Like Colin and Brendan
had a chat at the start. "Do we need to keep
space between each other? Do we need to enact it in real life?" And they both were so happy
that they both agreed, no, they're just gonna have fun
(Taylor laughs) and act it.
- It's just like, that part is a myth
that you have to suffer to make good art about suffering or that you have to suffer in
order to make art in general. Like yes, it is a cathartic thing, but oftentimes, I think
that writing about your pain or your suffering, it sort
of gets out the poison. - Yeah. It helps.
- It does. - Yeah, 'cause as I said, this script was written in
a sort of place of sadness and heartbreak.
- Mm hmm. - But even the evening of
having finished those few pages, it's like, "That's pretty
good stuff about my heartbreak and sad, suffering."
- (laughing) You're like. - Which is great to be able to have that, and I'm not sure if that's an age thing or what it is. Do you feel like your
songwriting is different, even if you're talking
about a heartbreak song? Are you different in that
writing now as opposed to how you were when you were 22? - Yes, I definitely feel
more free to create now. And I'm making more albums
at a more rapid pace than I ever did before because I think the more art you create, hopefully the less pressure
you put on yourself. If you stay ready, you
don't have to get ready. If you keep making stuff, you just keep making stuff and hopefully you get better at it. - Yeah.
- It doesn't have to be so, you don't have to belabor it
and polish the doorknob so long that you forget to open the door. - Because I'm not really,
I haven't really done that, but I like the idea. I used to do that when
I was writing plays. - Mm hmm.
- Bang out, bang out another one and another one, and there's less pressure
that way, I guess. - Yeah, I think it's just
a phase I'm in right now. I might be in a different
phase in two months. I have no idea. It's just, recently I've found that, the more things I make,
the more things I make, and the happier I am.
- Yeah. - And everybody's different and there are people who put
an album out every, you know, five years and it's brilliant and that's the way that they work. And I have full respect for that, but I am happier when I'm
making things more often. - So do you carve out time every day to be productive in that way? - No, it kind of pushes through
without asking permission. You know, these, we were talking about
like involuntary ideas, like when you were saying,
"Oh and then it surprised me when he went into the pub
and he didn't have a finger." I have songs come to me like that, I have ideas for a
story I would wanna tell come through like that. - Do songs and do lyrics and
tunes come at at the same time? - Yeah.
- Do you have to be strumming, or?
- No. Sometimes it's a fragment of a melody that has a lyric on it already. Sometimes it's just a line
and I'll write it down and I'll use it later. Sometimes it's a melody that
I have to go to the piano and then record and remember it. But it's, the more that I'm writing, the more those ideas come. That's what I've found.
- So even on a day like this, when you've got lots of
stuff to do like this, in the afternoon, something could come. - Totally. Yeah.
- Wow. - It's only been like that
for me for the past six or seven years, so that's
why I say I think it comes with age.
- Yeah. - But I don't really know why I've been making more things recently, but I'm just trying not to question it, 'cause I kind of like it. I want it to keep going. And there's a part of writing I think that we don't understand.
- Yeah, completely. - So I don't wanna jinx it by being like, "Huh, this is all me. I'm just writing." Like I don't know why. - Yeah.
- I'm just going with it. - Talking to which, "Midnights." - Yes.
- Your new record. They call 'em records, albums? - Yes. We respond to both.
(both laugh) - I hear you're gonna,
or you have directed, you're going to direct like 11 videos for the album, is that true?
- So the videos for this one are really
fun because I wanted to do different things
than I did with the short. I wanted to kind of, I have this scene in a video
for a song called "Anti-Hero" where I have my future funeral
of if I were to have kids and those kids were to be terrible, fighting over-
- (laughs) Sorry, it's hilarious.
- Thank you. We wanted to shoot it in
like a very different style than I've shot things in the past, 'cause I just, ultimately, I wanna tell the story in
a way that's interesting for people, but I also wanna learn and I want to kind of experiment
with how to shoot scenes, and.
- Yeah, there's a great puking scene in that.
- Thank you so much. - That I love.
- I worked so hard on that. - I might steal that.
- Throwing up on myself? - Yeah, but it's blue, isn't it? - It's blue, yeah. The blue glitter in that
video was a metaphor for, like, at one point, I bleed blue glitter. It's supposed to be a
midnight blue glitter. And then at one point I'm opening, I cut through an egg and it's glitter. And so it's supposed to
be a metaphor for like, I bleed glitter, I'm not normal. There's something wrong with me. I'm not a person, I don't
belong, I don't fit in anywhere. - Cool.
- So yeah. - Do you storyboard?
- Yeah, I do. - Because when I've
written a script I think, I haven't really thought
about it in visual terms until I then storyboard it myself and I go through every single scene and then the storyboards, I'll talk through with the DP, hopefully months and months before, and the production designer, which is what we did on this.
- Wow. - Because lots of the storyboards
had shots through doorways to see the island. You don't just find a house on the island, you build a house in the perfect place to see the perfect vista,
similar with the pub. - The pub that you built.
- Yeah. Yeah. So we just-
- That blew my mind that that was something you built. It looked like it'd been there forever. - Right? Yeah. And it's a pretty weird yellow, but we just found the most
scenic road, cliff road, which had vistas and mountains,
each going each direction, and just built it and
literally kind of angled it, so through the doorway,
you would see the most of that scenery. - I was actually sort of
sad that you had built it. I was happy for the production design and the feat of engineering
and imagination that it was, but I wanted to go there. - To that pub.
- I was like, "Want to go to there." - Colin Farrell-
- And I can't. - Drove past it like three
weeks later with his son and it's gone now.
- Oh. I was afraid you were gonna say that. - Yeah, maybe they could build it. Maybe if the film goes
really, really well, people will visit, and we'll front.
- I'd like to float that idea. I'll go.
- Because we literally had to take away Padraic's
house, which we built, overlooking the island
too, 'cause you have to, it was filmed on
Inishmore, and it's a place of kind of natural beauty and heritage. So you have to take everything away and leave it exactly as it was. - Which is good.
- Which is good. - It's good.
- Which is good. Although a lot of the locals were saying, "This would be a great little
extra tourist attraction to have."
- You know. Was this an island that you
had kind of thought about and thought, "Oh, it's there
that we're gonna do it"? Did you have an overall idea
of where you wanted to be? - Well, I'd written two plays, which are sort of set on the
Aran Islands, one on each. And in my head, this is a
vague end of that trilogy of island plays. - That's so cool.
- So I kind of wanted to shoot there and we did on Inishmore, which is off the Galway coast, which is like, from my parents' house, just outside of Galway, you can see those islands where we filmed. - Wow.
- So every weekend off the shooting, I would just go back and see mom and dad and hang out. And I first went there
when I was seven years old to Inishmore, the biggest
of the Aran Islands. So.
- That's really sweet. - Yeah, so it's always
had a part in my sort of Irish history, but
it's where playwrights and poets have gone for
like, a century or more. - Oh wow.
- Yeah, just to study, 'cause they say it has retained a lot of the old world Irish heritage and charm, and it does feel that way, but it also feels quite
a spiritual place to be. - It comes across that way in the film. - Well we also shot up on Achill Island, which is much more mountainous. It's where Colm's house looks
over that crescent beach. I wondered, at one point,
whether or not it would work to have two very different island types and have it seamlessly seem
like one, and I think it works, but also it feels like- - So it was two different islands. - Yeah.
- Wow. - Yeah.
- It absolutely works. - Good, good.
- I was completely fooled. I mean, the island and the sort of, the remoteness of it
and the claustrophobia- - Yeah.
- Of the beauty meeting the remoteness of it is, I think, it's a plot, it's a
character, it's a theme. It's kind of what lends itself to this feeling more like a fable. - Yeah, very much so, yeah. I was hoping.
- It's not a normal movie. (both laugh)
- Good, yes. That's what we're going for.
- It's a fable. - It is, it is. The idea of a breakup on
a place where you have to see the person every single day. - That's the claustrophobia of it. - It's horrible, yeah.
- These amazing roads that you would have to pass someone on. You know, there's no escaping it. You have breakups nowadays where people just ghost each other and it's almost like that
person never existed. You'll never see them again. - Yeah.
- It's like, I think that this is such
an amazing timeless way to confront the idea of a
breakup that you would have to confront.
- Yeah. - You would have to see this person. - Every single day.
- Everyone's, there's no secrets on this island. Everyone's talking about everything and I feel like your characters
in this, they have this, they are compelled to confess and to say everything they feel, except on certain occasions
where Padraic's sister clearly is keeping inside
how trapped she's feeling. There are cases of that. But I love that everyone's gossiping, everyone's saying things. And the one time that Colm
really respects Padraic is like, when he is finally honest. - When he's drunk, I guess.
- Yeah. - And angry, and.
- He's like, "Stop being fake nice."
- Yeah, yeah. - The tyranny of politeness. - I like the line he has where, I guess we've all had
in breakups, he says, "Maybe you were never nice,"
and we've all had that. Like maybe I was in love with the wrong,
(Taylor sighs) my projection of you instead of you. - Oh.
- Oh that's sad. - No, it's so good though. This is why I keep
talking to everyone I know about this film 'cause I keep, we keep thinking of new things
that it made us conjure up. - So what's next for you? Is it just "Midnights" and all of that? - Yeah, it's all that. Just gonna keep on making music. I haven't toured in, you know, I think, what, 2018 was
the last time I toured. - Is it that long?
- It's been that long. So I want to go and sing the songs to people who sing them back to me. It's like a whole thing. - I'll come.
- Please do. - Okay.
- Please do, that would be great. You and Phoebe can come and-
- Yay. - It'll be a blast. How did we do?
- Perfect. - Wow!
(producers clap) - All right.
- That was good. - [Producer] Congratulations. (upbeat music)
Taylor speaks so passionately about writing and shooting a feature film. It is obvious she is branching out and I am excited to see what she does.
Just think about how much emotional heft she can pack into a three minute song. Now imagine a two hour window into Taylor's world. What a gift!
This definitely doesn't come off as directors who are in equal standing. Much like Mentor and Mentee. Well done.
I found it strange that he mentioned at 38:36 having heard that she's going to direct "11 music videos," and she just glossed over that entirely. Now that we've gotten 2, it seems pretty clear from the trailer that there's only one video left (likely Lavender Haze).
It's weird that she didn't say even like, "I haven't actually revealed how many videos there are," or something, because I'm sure the rumors about it being a visual album are going to come back in full force now.
she looks absolutely amazing here
I am enjoying this, but I still don’t consider her directing resume to be “10 music videos and a short.” It really is a long music video, not a short film.
I think it went pretty well. It was obvious that Martin is more experienced, but I think her enthusiasm help the conversation stay interesting. Plus since she was paired with someone who is also a writer it still worked when she veered more into that category.
I hoped she’d talk a bit more about the future film, but I guess she’s keeping everything close to the chest for now. Also curious that she didn’t correct him on the 11 upcoming music videos question.
I’m almost done with the video and I’m sorry to say it but she comes off as being way out of her element. I admittedly don’t know how these interactions normally go, but a lot of what she’s talking about has to do with writing and not actually directing, like she could have said the same things in a discussion about songwriting and it wouldn’t have been out of place at all. She didn’t really have a ton to add in regards to actually directing and only really talked about it when asked directly, and instead gave way to McDonagh when it came to the intricacies of directing. There was also a lot of talk about her music career which I struggle to see how it fits into a directing discussion. I hate saying it but putting her in this discussion really highlighted the fact that she’s not a director more than it gave her credibility as one, and I have a bad feeling it’s going to make a lot of people dislike her for it. I’m already seeing a ton of harsh comments from those outside the fandom and I don’t think it’s going to get better unfortunately.
The arguments I saw over her saying her blood was midnight blue but ppl were like “its purple girl…”
Like the what colour is this dress.
Lmaooo
"it's supposed to be I bleed glitter, I'm not a person. I don't belong.”
Felt she was a bit nervous explaining her process at some points.
Listen to Taylor and go see The Banshees of Inisherin it is amazing!