Tanya O'Callaghan on Heavy Metal, Activism, & Eating Plant-Based | Rich Roll Podcast

[Music] so when I'm on stage I feel safe and I'm very very present I can only be here locked in with my drummer you're looking at however many thousands of people loads of stuff on a daily basis they debate and fight about but for that 90 minutes or 2 hours or 3 hours everybody's just in it for music my guest today is my friend the singular Tanya okalan on the B guitar a heavy metal Bas rocking Irish L who has toured the world sharing the studio and the stage with icons like mayor James Keenan White Snake D Snider of Twisted Sister and most recently iron maidens Bruce Dickinson Tanya is also an Ardent activist who uses her platform to Champion animal rights environmental sustainability and human welfare Tanya is my friend she's a total badass I absolutely adore her and I promise you you're in for a treat with this one so without further Ado let's do the [Music] thing today's episode is brought to you by the awesome organizations that make this show [Music] possible are you ready to rock I think so it's very early to rock now I know it's a little it's a little early like you probably don't wake up until like noon do you I mean you don't really live The Rock and Roll Lifestyle I'm so far from Rock and Roll it's some able like you know I got up at 4:45 this morning to watch to Sunrise and come here but how does that work when you're touring and playing and up late and on planes and buses and all that kind of stuff yeah that is a little frustrating that I'm actually not more quote unquote rock and roll because I am up super early um and I don't on on show nights you know you're you're getting off stage it depends it could be 11: it could be 1:00 a.m. and then you've got hours of adrenaline to come down from yeah you can't just go to sleep no it takes a while to like come down from the the high of playing so and then you know you go to bed at could be 2:00 or 3:00 a.m. and then you've got Lobby call at 6 and you're just in this constant state of got to get to the next city but it's weird when you're on tour because you just get into that flow and you take what you can get when it comes to sleep so hence why it's important to stay healthy are you somebody who can just fall asleep whenever wherever absolutely not oh no no I wish sleep has always been a battle for me actually it's quite quite an ongoing struggle that I'm trying to figure out so when you're touring and you're up super late and you have all that adrenaline and you don't get to bed until 3:00 or 4 in the morning do you still wake up early on auto sort of autopilot yeah yeah yeah I've I don't think I've really ever slept past like eight in my whole life Wow which sucks kind of wear you out yeah you hit a wall but then I try really hard when I'm when I'm off the road to be a little bit better trying to get to bed a bit earlier so even if I get to bed at like 11: or something I'm like oh yeah I got like five or six hours tonight that's like a luxury and do you have like a a specific Rider so you can get healthy food backstage and all of that I would love to see your rider rider the most non rock and roll thing ever the furthest thing from Rock and Roll I'm was just laugh what's on it um I have blackberries and blueberries and mixed nuts and I have a yoga mat and I have sparkling water and glass bottles cuz I don't want any plastic backstage and then with hot food it's because you're traveling so many different territ and you're not quite sure what you're going to get the consistent things like rice and broccoli and maybe beans and some mixed FEG so that's pretty much as rock and roll as I get that's pretty funny it must be confusing for the venue like stage managers when they're like okay like this is what we need where's the whiskey she's Irish how does that work with the bands do you do you have a positive healthy impact on the musicians that that you tour with or are you kind of at odds with a different type of lifestyle or is that changing it feels like rocking you know sort especially with these older bands and these guys like they have to take they can't go on the road and do all this kind of stuff at their age unless they're taking care of themselves yeah yeah no for sure like and I've been really lucky that most of the Bands I've been in have embraced it so it's kind of like you get this annoying Health sidekick in the band as well as a bass player that's you know trying to bring all the the plant-based food in but it's for the most part completely embraced um with Whit snake it's it's really funny because David got super into it so there's just old milk everywhere now and he's he's all about it that's like really [ __ ] with my like mental image of like heavy metal and like what that's all about yeah I mean I mean how old is he now though he's in the 70s already' 70s yeah it's a tough industry the travel is really tough the Performing every night so you have to I think a lot of guys especially guys that have been around a while like that you realize at a certain point you can't keep going the way we used to go in the in the ' 80s and '90s so and then when you know people eat a bit better and start to feel better on the road um they just keep continue doing it but also for me like food is such a big passion for me and travel like my the first thing I have is a list of like which cities am I going to which restaurants am I going to see I want to go see the the local vegan restaurants or you know go to the steakhous and order a vegan meal and I want to bring the band and show them all this like my my love of exploring cities and food and they really Embrace that so it's been cool and and Bru is super healthy anyway so it's not a million miles off we eat very similar anyway so the backstage riter is the same he he has a couple of animal products in there but for the most part it's the same so they've been yeah and these whole family are vegan these Siders whole family yeah except for D oh my God was his his family meeing like his his partner children or his extended and his wife she's mostly like veggie vegan anyway and yeah so that it was super easy to you know just be another Regan in his yeah we're talking about D Snider from Twisted Sister like that just you know yeah but he's like someone's got to eat meat in this family maybe not like if you if you're around him enough you know MH uh I would imagine your influence probably uh wears off on some of these guys yeah doing yoga before rock and roll shows is not exactly the quintessential idea of that's so funny yeah you mentioned Bruce you mean uh you're talking about Bruce Dickinson and um who uh is of of course Iron Maiden Fame that's why you're in town right now you're about to go on tour with Bruce it's like a solo show for him right it's not an Iron Maiden thing and for people that don't know like Bruce Dickinson might be the most interesting man in the world like tell me a little bit about this guy yeah Bruce is fascinating um he's a total pooth like he really is a fascinating person he's a he's an airline pilot like you know he flew May on the plane he's yeah that famous it was a 747 right on the side and he's flying the plane with I mean it's hard enough to travel and go and play a show I can't even imagine having to fly your band he's also like a champion fencer he's you know an Avid Reader an entrepreneur he's a fascinating person and obviously a legendary singer and just he's just a great guy he's a great guy to work with and we did a tour last year doing the music of Deep Purple with the 82-piece symphony orchestra right which is where we met and got along like fire he's just good people and then now he's decided to go and do his first solo tour in I think like 18 or 19 years because he's obviously been busy doing maiden and life happening between all that so it I think it was interesting for him to see what the feedback would be when he brought out a new album and the Maiden fans it's like you know the Church of Maiden they're so supportive so the entire tour is almost sold out which is really cool to see for him because it's scary for any artist to put your own work but I can't even imagine when you're from such a big band the fan base for Iron Maiden is locked in didn't he also have a like a an aerospace company like a fleet of planes that he was managing he has all these businesses he like an entrepreneur big time Big Time yeah you guys uh God Bruce murder me if I say this wrong um I don't know if I think I think he's just early 60s I guess he's Timeless he's ageless yeah he's one of those it's actually quite hard to guess I don't know but he's like he's so childlike it's great um him and his his wife Lan is amazing as well and they're just they've got that very youthful you know still happy to travel he just loves playing which is really nice to see because a lot of artists kind of get burnt out and they get a bit sick of it all but Bruce wants to be on the road I mean he's he's we're shoving this tour in between Maiden tours so but he's not flying the plane no does he still fly I think he can privately but something changes with license like he's to renew the license I'm not sure sure how it works exactly but he's not flying us unfortunately I'm sure he's happy about that though been trying to get him on the podcast he's tough to he's tough to schedule and pin down he's a busy man hopefully at some point definitely well let's take it back you've lived such an incredible life an interesting life a dynamic uh a dynamic life and it's a really cool story so let's go back to the beginning as this young kid growing up in Ireland yeah paint the picture Tanya small town Ireland yeah I am from that very kind of quintessential Rolling Green Field small town you know very normal simple workingclass family childhood and I guess I was a little bit of a a rebel in ways from when from when I was young and it was sort of it always felt hard for me to to fit into that so from when I was a really young child I was sort of fighting this system of you're supposed to follow where did that come from Rules what what was that about what were you rebelling against was it within the the home or just naturally you had that disposition a little bit of both I think I just I had this very for me like animals was a big thing early on so I had this natural innate Instinct I was very very drawn to animals since I was like this my first memory and I realized very young at four what meat was and that kind of triggered the first acts of rebell but also I think there was Ireland is amazing I obviously love Ireland and I'm proud to be Irish and all that but our history is very kind of in institutionalized and the you know the guys of the Catholic church and all that there's somewhat of a generational itch about that in in my generation to not like bow down to church and state and all that it's in you somewhere I don't even know how to fully explain it but I felt that Rebellion it wasn't necessarily within my own family but as soon as I was in school and understanding that you know you had to follow this set of rules and you could only study these subjects and I was always really really curious and my curiosity was not allowed in an all girls catholic convent school right so and and you know for people that are just listening and aren't watching this on video like you don't present as somebody who paints between the lines thank you yeah in in in a good way in the best way right so all right so as a young person you developed this sensitivity around animals like where did that come from what is the origin of that did you grow up on a farm or around beside one so a lot of like the housing Estates in Ireland your house behind everyone's house is like a field full of cows or sheep so I grew up uh in a small kind of housing um estate and behind our house was a house full of cows and I thought when I was a little girl that the cows were my pets because I just all animals I was constantly bringing home straight and saving insects and like I was driving my parents crazy over this and there was a cow that I named Daisy well I'm sure they were all Daisy but I kind of thought you know and I would climb the fence every day and I go out and I'd run around the field and play with the cows and I just I just loved animals and then when I was about 4 we were sitting having dinner one day at with the family and my brother said that's Daisy on the table and I remember it really vividly it's actually one of my first memories and there's just like whole spark of synopsis going off in my brain like wait what like how what do you mean that's Daisy now obviously it wasn't actually Daisy it was just my brother trying to be you know an older brother we poking fun at each other or whatever but I couldn't believe it and so I immediately was didn't want to eat me and it started this whole commotion and my poor parents were like why did you say that like this is crazy so I just had this very visceral reaction to it and I thought if if my friend the cow my pet has to die for that to be on the table I don't want to be part of that so I was just declared right then and there that I was a vegetarian cuz we didn't have the language for ve I didn't find out I was a vegan until I was in my teens like we didn't have the labels around it which I'm not keen on anyway but um but yeah it was definitely triggered big time by animals and specifically by like that that kind of connection I had to this pet cat cow and we had pets and I just couldn't see the difference between my cat or the dog or the cow and you were four at the time it was a pain in the ass yeah as my my parents had loving to tell you yeah I'm I'm imagining like how that went over when you made that decision and you're young and you know parents are worried about the health of their children and want the best for them and all of that I would imagine there was some challenges or friction around that decision being being got young that was a a journey from my parents that I really appreciate in hindsight cuz they were getting told a lot like I mean you see the misinformation now around in 2024 but back then like my mom got told by a doctor that I could get rickets rickets is like a vitamin C thing though nothing got to do with eating meat or that and you know I get stunted growth and do like doctors were giving her this information so there was a phase that you know all I can do is laugh about now but like my mom would try to liquidize meat into meals so she would try to liquidize sneak it in yeah because she was just genuinely worried but I would taste it and spit it out and it became this whole thing and then when I was by the time I was about six my dad was kind of like look she's not backing down on this so she seems fine so everything cuz Ireland's very much meat and potatoes it's like you know that's it spuds and it's meat few veggies so I would just eat the same thing take the meat away and they start putting veggie burgers town but um I'm sure it was scary for them and there was very little information in your small town in Ireland like we didn't have the nutritional information back then but I didn't have the language for it when I was a kid but I was very aware of my own moral compass at that point already there it was it was a no-brainer I wasn't just going to eat it because somebody said this or somebody said this so it was it was interesting and I'm sure it was really hard for them to navigate but then at a certain point it was like she looks she seems fine maybe some generational Trauma from The Great Potato Famine you know I still eat as if the P are running out fam and panic um and then you start sort of sneaking away to volunteer at this animal rescue place right when you were also quite young I was eight yeah that became my life for 10 years so from 8 to 18 I volunteered at a shelter just outside my hometown and it was just so amazing like it was such hard work um but to be in involved in animal activism to that like depth so young really sort of in a way trained me up for the for the world and it was just this couple that you know started the shelter nonprofit outside in my hometown and it was a lot of dogs cats horses whatever animals needed rescuing but because it was totally volunteer based and I had little to no funding it was all hands on deck with volunteers so we did a lot of heavy like you know there was undercover stuff there was real bad rescue there was Animal Hoarding and I was dealing with this in my early teens and it was it was quite a lot so a lot of my activism in that sense I I sort of got out of my system Young when you start to change lanes on how you approach advocacy and and activism later on but but I was deep in it for 10 years like it was like the undercover investigation boots on the ground Ardent revolutionary energy of the whole thing yeah like banned from fur shops in Dublin and you know throwing fake blood everywhere and I could just see it all the fun stuff all the fun stuff oh my god well you had to you know there was no there was very few animal resources in Ireland like that for shelters so a lot of it was just downed animals on farms or hoarding and poverty issues with with farming with Farmers having to give up their animals and then you know neglect abuse all this stuff we were going through court cases with them and you know just hands on cleaning all the Glamorous stuff of cleaning up [ __ ] for 40 dogs every day but you start this at eight like at 8 years old how did how did you even find out this place existed or how did you you know and if you're like kind of sneaking off that young like the people that work there they're like there's an eight-year-old who showed up here well yeah know but they became my second family real quick but it was a school trip that they brought us to a shelter um for a day and we we spent the day there like the teachers brought us when I was in Primary School which I don't know what the equivalent is here but I was a element school elementary yeah so they brought us on like a day trip a field trip to see the shelter and I just didn't want to leave so I kept going back so you could volunteer and you know and then I would spend my weekends there they would drop me out when I was in my like I started going with the school first and then you can volunteer your time obviously for all sorts of things like selling tickets in school to fund raise and all that stuff and then it just became where I went every spare hour and eventually my parents are just like all in on it because at least it's keeping me out of trouble like right right right so you know I spent every weekend there and then because the school I went to was relatively close by the time I got to Secondary School in my early teens I would just what we call Mitch off school so you like bounce out for a few hours I wasn't doing anything actually rebellious or cool I was just going to the animal shelter to help out again very volunteer yeah hardcore Rebel you know the activism is really the Cent primary thing for you it's almost as if the music is something that gives you a platform and some visibility to um you know be this activist and talk about the things that that you care about most is that is that fair is that true it's 100% true yeah cuz I I never would have guessed that I would even end up in music there was no sign of it really other than I was I was I liked music and my dad played it in the background but there's no one in my family that's a musician but um I was going to be a vet or marine biologist like that's where I was headed and then I picked up a base when I was 18 and I did a total 180 it was early on that I also saw that thing of oh this is interesting if you have a platform or if you're out there you know you have a different avenue or platform that you can speak about your your passions on and CU for me music was never something that I wanted to get into for the glory of it or for the ego of it or whatever it was like oh okay you can have a platform and kind of use it even if it's just like playing around in my local bands um I could put like fundraiser kns on and use the bands to do fundraising so it was it was always it was always the root of activism and then I just did this 180 and ended up being a Basse player yeah it's it's a wild story uh I mean not just a bass player I mean you're playing with like Legends all over the world it's it's a crazy thing and you've only been here like how long eight years nine years or something like that yeah been in in pretty fast Ascent I like to jump in yeah I mean I guess but walk me through that moment where you picked up the bass like why the bass how did music enter your life like what is that origin story all about well I picked up a Bass because I dropped out of school yeah because I was I was really close to our finals which is our leaving CT and my poor parents when I think back in this story um I was really good at school I was a straight A student student um but I was just always frustrated with this kind of archaic system in in especially in this like obviously Catholic Irish school I just never felt especially when you're I was into my late teens like that I never felt that it was pushing me or it was really bringing me to where I want I just had this kind of in a Instinct that like this is really not working so I left right before like 6 months before finals and everyone's like just stay you need this piece of paper like in Ireland that's the whole thing it's like you have to get your leaving certificate then your life will be good and I was like I can't be that like I feel viscerally ill thinking about staying and what will happen is I'll just follow my friends in this format I'll just go wherever they go if I don't follow what sort of inside so when I left I had to do something so there was a local course you could do and you could pick it's like catering computers or music so I picked music cuz I'd had like two drum lessons and I thought oh [ __ ] it I'll be a musician and I went in as a drummer actually and they didn't have a drum kit and I didn't have a drum kit so they just I had had two lessons with a local band and uh they had an electronic drum kit and at the time this is way before like we brought out these amazing digital kits but I didn't like it so I was walking by one of the rooms and I saw a local bass player from my hometown playing n Masterson and he was playing all this really beautiful melodic stuff and I had never seen bass in that context I only you know it's like rock and roll and it's Punk or whatever you'd heard and I was just mesmerized so I asked if I could switch so I switched to Bass so I became a bass pair instead but there was no bass teacher there was only a guitar teacher so I was kind of left to my own devices and I just went on this obsessive journey of bass and I joined my first band which was my cousin's band like six or seven weeks after picking up a Bass and I was absolutely terrible but I thought well [ __ ] it if I get out and play with them maybe this will like dust the cobwebs off something and and self-taught yeah 100% self thought all the year there's something really interesting about you like to be that young four years old and realize like hey meet's not for me and then to have this conviction around activism such that you're like ditching school and you know for the purpose of volunteering um and then that self-awareness that school wasn't moving you in the direction of your intuition there's like a strength of character there like a uh uh self- knowledge like you knowing yourself at a very early age and what was in your interest or where your attention should be directed that I think is unusual for such a young person it's unusual for probably most people to like have that sense of it's almost like past life [ __ ] right like like you came into the world like this is who I am this is not right for me I'm gonna move and then and to be able to like against all the pressure of like the Catholic Church the school system concerned parents Etc to like make those decisions at such a young age is is is super interesting you know you say the past life stuff and then people are like oh it's woo woo I don't know like I'm not a religious person um you know I guess I'm some iteration of spiritual but maybe I had this conversation with Melanie Joy before actually you know Melanie where it's like do some people Channel something from a past life that like you arive and you know because it just just seems normal to me because it makes sense right it's like as soon as I discover this it's like well I don't want to eat them because I like animals I don't want to stay here because it's wasting my time I know my time is better spent over here but maybe that's not obvious to to most or the the pressure is too hard but to be able to live a congruent life and to know that you know you're in alignment with your morals is something that was very obvious like an natural from a young age so I don't think that it's Unique or different but I think that it's it is also probably why there's so much frustration in the world and why people are so divided in that because we we are often out of line and we're not living in congruency what we we actually feel inside and you know we obviously do that a lot when it comes to morally justifying or morally compartmentalizing things just because it's convenient yeah we compartmentalize and we deny because we have to you know consume and leave a footprint on the planet and we have to find ways to kind of justify our actions and our Behavior so that we can sleep at night given the fact that I think all human beings are innately compassionate and don't want to do harm to others or to the planet uh yeah it becomes a tricky thing but for you as a young person you know in this like I'm just imagining you in in high school um and you're cutting a very different path for yourself but peer pressure and you know the the kind of you know sense that a young person has to want to belong and and be approved of like what kind of like what was the like where did you fit in at that time in your life like were you accepted were you like a a pariah or a renegade or you know I mean it's all very punk rock but it is a little punk rock I guess when I look back I don't think I ever had that strong of a desire to fit in like I was okay with being I just I always feel like I just had blinkers on like I've always known somewhere inside like why I'm going this way or that way I had like great you know friends I was I was also bullied over certain stuff but I also had great friends it's it's a it's a mix of it all because like I had a lot of fun in school with my girlfriends but I also was very frustrated at like the tribalism within like the clicks so I floated between a lot of groups and one of my biggest issues in secondary school like two or three of my friends are from cuz I think it was a performative thing at that point by that generation that these schools have like one Muslim girl and one girl from the Balkans and one girl from you know wherever to try and look a little bit like diverse but they were everyone was kept separate like they weren't my friends that were Muslim or Hindu weren't allowed come to religious studies and I would get into these debates my teachers and the priests like why not I want to learn about their religion I want to learn about their cultures why can't they learn about mine and so I I did a lot of floating between between the different the different groups and I was never necessarily bothered by it but when it came to like Teenage like mid- teens and party time I did get a little bit of your the uncool push back because it was just never really my jam I would I would kind of party but not really not like a like what is your like have you ever you have you ever been a party here like traveling the world and being with these bands and all that none of that no I'm like I it's I can not even like a phase like I can that's the thing like I've never been a heavy drinker I've never drugs are never my jam I just I don't like the losing control part maybe I'm just a control freak I don't like that sense of so it was never my vibe and I would I had so many friends that went down that rabbit hole big time that I'm I was kind of watching on that doesn't really look like fun to me and I ended up just being as a you know band mom or like oh they there but uh not really like I've I've definitely partied at times but you know by midnight I'm probably drinking a cup of tea never yeah it hasn't been a thing for you welcome to my sleep Sanctuary come on in so the defining characteristic of this space beyond the fact that it is a tent and I do sleep outside is my pride and joy which is the eight Sleep System you can see this unit here there is a pad that goes on my mattress that allows me to temperature control my sleep environment over time the eight Sleep System learns what is optimal in terms of ensuring the best night of sleep and make suggestions about temperature tweaks to give you a better night's rest and since I've had the eight Sleep System My Sleep Quality has been enhanced by a tremendous factor and it's improved all aspects of my lived experience so here's what you're going to do to get $200 off the Pod three cover visit 8sleep.com roll or simply hit the link in the description [Music] below all right so pick up the bass you're like this is my thing you become obsessed with it you're in your first band what happens from there I uh I joined my first band in my hometown and we were like super heavy metal upside down crosses behind the drummer super fun and uh started gigging almost immediately within the first few months so I'm playing around you know playing locally and playing the small small town venues and we're loading in as this heavy metal band it was so fun and then after that I joined a couple of like corporate wedding bands so that's where you kind of cut your teeth having to yeah you got to make some money oh [ __ ] I got to make money off yeah you got to be able to play exactly exactly so I did a lot of bands in Ireland over this so within the first few years of me actually picking it up and I did this music course which although there was no bass teacher there was a guitar teacher that was great and he helped to guide me through like at least practicing some you know consistent workouts or whatever for your technicality and he would challeng you know he make me be in these different bands and then for the sake of the experience of doing an audition he sent me to do an audition to a jazz College in Dublin and it was I wasn't trying to get into the college I was just going to have an experience part of our like we had to do a report back we didn't audition and this is how it went but I didn't an audition and then the college accepted me and it became this really funny thing because you're not supposed to get into college without the leaving certificate that I you did anyway did you go back to the high school say look at this it was pretty funny I was like oh I wasn't planning on getting in so I went to that college for a year um and I really I had a good time that's when I I met CU I'm totally self-thought so I'm going into this Jazz College of these phenomenal musicians coming in from around the world that have Jazz and classical backgrounds and I'm just like this chick from a small town Ireland that's playing in a rock band so it made me dive into to play with some pretty incredible players from all all types styles of music but after a year the college was amazing and the people were lovely but they were really trying to get me like let's get you to stay here for four years and do a jazz degree and I was like but I really like gigging like I like being out playing I'd already realized that and I was starting at that time to get TV House bang gigs so like Ireland's equival equivalent of the saturday night show stuff like that you know the Late Late Show and you're playing in the bands and then off the back of that you're getting these little gigs and I was starting to get like a little sort of session I didn't really know what it was yet like a session musician and the college was pushing me to stay but in order to really like follow the criteria of that college and get this Jazz master's degree you're practicing 9 10 12 hours a day and they didn't really encourage me gigging so I left yeah well that's that's less surprising because it wasn't your path to become a jazz musician that wasn't what your interest was and once you developed the technique and understood like the training and had enough to take away from you like getting a piece of paper saying you graduated doesn't really mean anything in the context of the career you're trying to build exactly exactly so again it was just one of those pivots where it's like okay that was a great year I met some great people that pushed me musically and now I'm going to follow this trajectory so at that stage I was in about six or seven bands at a time and are you living in Dublin at this point yeah i' gotten up to Dublin at this stage I was for the first year I was gone up and down the train for my Hometown which how far away is your hometown it's only an hour it's an hour and a bit but uh when it was funny because then when I moved to Dublin and like the only place that we could afford to be was way outside the city so it was actually further than where I was coming from my hometown so I was getting up you know 5 and six o'clock in the morning base on back two different trains up to the city and then a big walk up a hill and to go to this Jazz college but um but it was a great year you know it was a great experience but I I just knew I wanted to play live I was like okay this is my so six or seven bands you're just bopping around with all these bands what was the kind of big break or inflection point like when did things start to kick into a different gear so i' done a couple years really gigging like the Irish scene and I did um like I did a gig with Sharon core from the cores and that brought me abroad and I was starting to see that oh okay like this can this can be a career career but at the same time Ireland is small and which means it's a small scene that I was seeing that that's it like you sort of rotate in this circle of gigs and then that's all the gigs so I need to go out so I started thinking about trying to come to America or London and I had one band that were coming back and forth doing like UK shows and then I met mayard Keenan from tul I was at a tul show I was over in Glasgow um with one of my bands and he long story short in invited me to record in Arizona and I was a massive tool fan um well one of the things i' never like I've never someone who gets star stroke over anybody usually just like a you know a philosopher or a chef or something again very un rock and roll but uh mayard invited me to Arizona when I was like 21 all right hold on a second so I need to unpack that a little bit more because uh I'm trying to understand how just meeting him backstage translated into him saying come to Arizona and record on this album and not for nothing like mayard is also a polymath who does many different things he's got a Wier he's got this crazy situation out in Arizona where all kinds of stuff is happening so I think it was because I end so some of the crew I was working with in in Glasgow were working the same show so we end that's how we ended up all chatting backstage and at that time I was in this mad phase of conol rhythms Indian music in metal and Danny KY from tulle does a lot of this really eclectic drumming over metal so we were just having a very musical conversation that I think like like me and Danny and M are chanting in one of one of the Ries I knew and we're talking about music like in depth like you know just nerding out whereas all the other people who especially the girls that had come backstage it was very like fan girl situation going on so we just we're having this great conversation and at the time he was he already had pfer but he was sort of starting to think about doing another record so I think he just maybe saw some sort of passion in me about it and he said would you like to play on a track I'm thinking I mean yeah you're like gigging around in all these different bands trying to make ends me this guy's like iconic and come to Arizona and play on my record yeah so I flew home the next morning and uh my parents got this like very how old are you at this time how long ago was this I was 20 21 2021 and uh my poor parents again I like burst in the door like I'm going to America like what I'm going to America to play with and they're like the guy from that band she listens to Tool like which is kind of like scary like it's like a very I mean for a parent also you're like The Tool Guy yeah yeah I know am so I had uh exchanged a few emails then back and forth with mayor to figure out when they were doing it and I sold I think I had like one base I sold and a few hundred euros that IID saved and I bought a ticket to Arizona and because we it wasn't it wasn't a gig in the sense that like all these musicians were being hired it's like hey if you're around come so it was a decision that I was going okay I should go and do this this seems like this could be a catalyst for something else so I saved you know I saved up my little few hundred and I I bought a flight to Arizona came out and recorded uh for about two weeks was that up in Jerome yep yeah yeah so that was my a triy Trippy place it is so it's so beautiful eerie and all the things at once U I really loved it there but that was my first kind of dive into the the US music scene but Manor taking a risk on me as a young player is something that really you know I'm forever grateful for because we didn't like we just recorded we did some demos he released some of the stuff I was on but it wasn't that I was destined to be in the band with him that was like a fun recording thing you were session music yeah yeah and he he had a few friends come in and it was about jamming around and when I look back even at my gear I always laugh at this I I didn't have good gear I had this beat up shitty old base and these terrible pedals but the experience of going in was so so much learning cuz the guys that were also working with him like these are masters of their craft and we just had a blast like we recorded it all in his garage and that left me very much like w if I can record and play with that level of artist I think I need to go to the US because I've obviously done what I can in Ireland I mean a huge confidence booster but also being in Jerome isn't like you're in the mix of some kind of community upon which you're going to build a career right so how do you how do you take that experience and and and channel that into this decision to move to I mean did you know other people in the music business when you moved out no I didn't know anybody and actually it was funny because mayor told me don't move to LA yeah that sounds surprising yeah because he had already done the whole like a lot of artists do a chapter here and they're like yeah you build your career and then you then you bounce basically but uh it took it took a good few years because it's it's also not easy to just come here I can't just come here there a whole Visa process to work and all that so I went back to Ireland and you know I just kept gigging and I was gigging around and I was in up to nine bands at a time at that stage I was doing three or four corporate bands I did Joo the trio I was doing the TV stuff and I was also trying to still do my activism stuff and I think I was just you know really cutting my teeth for I got to get out to America at some stage because I couldn't get it out of my mind that if I can play with mayard over there surely this is something is happening I need to go to but I tried London first cuz I thought well I'll pop over to London it's right there and the weather was too like Ireland so yeah la was calling La was calling and sunshine really helped so then I started this whole long process of how do I go to LA and stay in LA because it's really um you can only get a esta visitor Visa at first so I can be here for 90 days but I had no idea how expensive it was in LA comparatively to smalltown Ireland or even living in Dublin at that time so I would come over and then within two weeks be totally broke and have to go home with my tail between my legs It's Not Unusual I mean this is a really hard place to move to yeah if you don't know people it can be unbelievably lonely here it's so spread out everyone's in their car it's very difficult to make plans with people people are not um so receptive to meeting new people like if you're in New York City or London you're bumping into people on the street all the time it's a much more um social you know there's a there's more social grease I think and here you have to really work at it and if you don't know anybody it becomes like a very yeah uh impenetrable kind of lonely place it's very lonely and I was really lonely at the beginning and I was terrified to be honest because I didn't know for me La was just Hollywood you're like so you go to Hollywood and that's what you do and then I you get off the bus I mean it's literally like the script right you pull up in the bus and you get out and you have your base and you're like Hollywood in Vine and you don't realize that Hollywood isn't is an idea more than it is a place you're like this is it awful it's awful and it's that exact scene and I I even it's as bad as I stayed in the Hollywood hosel because I thought well that's where you stay and I didn't know anybody so and it's all I could afford and there was a the first time there was like an assap convention on so I figured well in like anything in life if you are trying to achieve something you should try and surround yourself with people who are already doing that thing so that you can kind of try to absorb it so I figured if I go to a few music convention so ASAP was happening on on Hollywood and Vine I can't remember what the hotel is so I checked in cuz I didn't have a car I'd [ __ ] all money I'm like I'll stay here I was terrified because every night I was just like in the hostel with my base in the bed thinking this is it going to get robbed yeah this is how it's going to end um but every day of the convention that I would go I would you know start these conversations and I was on my own and so in in hindsight that was kind of a good thing because as scary as it was it forced me to talk to people I had to talk to people cuz I you know I'm like looking for a gig I'm looking for information on where the gigs are happening I didn't know anything and I didn't know one single person so it forced me and I just kept meeting all these really interesting characters and I couldn't believe it it's like this guy was in Prince's band and this guy plays for Paul McCartney and so I started to understand that oh okay these are the session players the session mus and I didn't even know that that's what I wanted to be I cuz we didn't really have the same language around it in the Irish music scene but it's also like you said like it's so lonely and I could sense immediately that it's kind of you know can be a city of sick offense as well it's like one minute you everybody's talking to each other but only if they can get something and but you slowly start and I met a lot of you know questionable characters and it was you know thankfully I I had sort of a good head in my shoulders for the most part but there there was a lot of it could have been could have been worse or could have been dodgy but then you start to meet really good people and stuff starts to slowly catalyze yeah to navigate the siant and to realize who's transactional and who isn't and who's a bullshitter I mean so much [ __ ] you know and then you realize like oh the people that are actually successful at this they're they're actually not at these things talking to people because they're working and doing the thing and being professionals um but when you're new you just want to meet anyone you can but I think you're I mean you're a very good people person um and you learn as I'm sure you have like yes you have a talent you have to be good at what you do you have to excel at the skill um but you're in this really insecure economy because there's no job security you're just bouncing around from if you're a session player or you're in a band or whatever or you're working production in film or television you go job to job to job um and the people that are successful are the ones that are good they show up on time all that kind of they're professional but also like people like them they want to work with they're like oh we have another thing like let's get so and so and you seem like somebody who understands that I guess yeah I guess so yeah and it's like cuz when I was new and I was first there you do you just have to go around and talk to everybody right but then exactly like you said the people that are really the top cats in in this field you're not going to see them at everything right they're not on the Sunset Strip like going to all these [ __ ] they're they're doing their thing yeah and at first you you have that fomo in a way and you're like oh I have to be at every party and have to be everywhere which is important at the beginning when you're networking which to an Irish person is just talking you know everyone says you got a network I'm always laughing at that word because it's it seems so forced so do I well it because it it implies the transactional nature ex exactly so I didn't I didn't like the the language around that a whole lot but you you know it was important to sort of dive in and go to all these Jam KN nights and then start to see who who's really who's really working in this industry and who's really doing what and who are the go-getters and who are just the good people who's like good people cuz I met some really shitty people at the beginning and there was a lot of like trying to be taken advantage of and you start to filter out real quick okay I don't want to give any energy over here and these people are good and then you know you show up enough times eventually they invite you up on stage to play it's like she's not going away like let her up so what was the The Big Break in La what was the first so la I started playing there was a couple of jam nights that happened out here I done some studio work with a prod I had a band in Ireland that came back and forth twice and we did an album up in Laurel Canyon with a pretty well-known producer waren hord and uh that was interesting because I like okay that's the studio side of it but again I couldn't work here so I was going back and forth back and forth and so there's like a little Studio thing on my CV for LA and of course I had mayard on my CV as far as music getting you in the door yeah people were interested when you have some sort of a resume cuz all the other work I done didn't translate over here they're big bands in Ireland or Europe but nobody knows who they are here except except one experience river river dance oh the liver dance so you were in the river dance band for like 18 months or something like that yeah I T that's like iconic it's so funny how that translates everywhere yeah I did 18 about 18 months total around the world and like we we played in China and only Olympic stadiums and it it's bigger than it seems like it's bigger new to it's so bizarre though when you're in because it's just a not just a theater show but you know what I mean for us it's just part of the culture and yeah we go to these places and it's fans coming out for every dancer every musician the River Dance was uh that translates to some people are more confused cuz when I say I work with mayor Keenan and I did the River Dance they're how do I understand this yeah they just like well I guess you're diverse there's a bit of that but um I think cuz you know obviously in these in these jam scenes and what they're asking like oh who have you played what have you done so I did have a little bit of that and then what was interesting when I first started doing that the sort of top 40 hits that people are playing out here are totally different to what I grew up in and was playing on in wedding bands back home so I had to learn a lot of music that I wasn't that familiar with so we you know the the guys in the the house bands at at the Hollywood Jam started to let me jam and over the weeks and months you'd get these little gigs first as a local band I played in like a bunch of rap bands I was in Englewood in a rap band for a couple months that was really fun was in a gospel band for a while I was doing all these round I just at that time I would do any gig I'd just say yes I'll do it and then I got a a gig with a pop artist called Jordan fiser through like Disney someone seen me play and that was a in that realm in the pop space kind of a bigger one and then I went back I did a tour with him and I went back to start doing the jam scene in La again and uh the drummer who played with d Snyder play we played together and then it was like Hey D's looking for a bass player for for oneoff show I thought perfect cuz I'm in this other gig and that's rad I kind of knew I knew who D was but I didn't really know much about his his entire back history and as me and D always joke we like supposed to do one gig and then we ended up doing like two or three years so you show up and you crush it and he's like okay I found my new B player yeah it's great and I ended up becoming his MD as well and we did like two or three years together and I I recorded some of the stuff on on his second last record so D was a big I guess the first bigger rock and roll one and then off the back of D I'd already started filling in for a friend who played for Steven Adler because he was like double booked sometimes I was playing with Steven from Guns and Roses and then White Snake we were joking like like you have big hair but probably not the biggest hair well when I first joined Whit snake and I know a lot of those guys long before I was in the band like we knew each other because again a lot you know people were session players and David had seen me play at some festivals where I was playing in bands before Whit snake so I guess it was in his head that when the position came open he already had had me in in place but when I first joined and we were doing like band shots I was like this is the first I don't have the biggest hair it's so funny that's a crazy story it happened pretty quickly too what do you make of that it happened quickly once it really started rolling but it feels like like kind of once you were in you're in and it's a smaller community of people than maybe you might think it's snowballs at a certain point but like the years the first few years in La were rough like it was really rough it was like I think I'm going to starve or not be able to fly home like at one stage I remember I had a voucher for like a a rice and bean burrito from Taco Bell and that's like all I had left what kept you in it when it was that hard I mean there doesn't seem like there was a plan B like this was it you had to make it work I think not having a plan B necessarily but a lot of this I think comes back to the music and it being a platform or a vessel there's something internal driving why I keep doing it because there's a a bigger purpose for at all so I don't really have a choice to not keep going in a way and then just pure stubbornness and there's something about resistance you know and it's just the audacity to think that you can do something and if you have such an audacious goal you know at some point I I was like well [ __ ] it I'll be a session player I don't really know what that is but I'm going to go do it and that if I can keep growing this platform then I can keep speaking for what you know my sort of path in life is all about so it's a little bit of stubbornness and a little bit of aacan we're brought to you today by Roa glasses are not something you normally think about as a piece of performance gear which when you think about it is kind of insane because you can't perform at your best if you can't see well the Geniuses at Roa basically rebuilt eyewear from the ground up no matter how active you are or how much you sweat these things never slip or fall off your face they're super durable they look awesome and they've got tons of super classy modern styles to choose from I've been rocking roas for about four years at this point I love them I'm a big fan of the Hamilton style in gloss black that's this Frame right here as well as clear or I guess they call them vintage on the website and uh if you want to try them out for yourself you can do that right now and unlock 20% off your order with the code Rich Roll roka.com or you can click the link in the descript description below okay back to the show well let's talk a little bit about how all of that works like how are you using this platform I know that um I mean we have ton like we have tons of overlap in our friend group and no lots of the same people uh but one of the things that you've done that's really cool is this highway to health series that you did with Derek green yeah yeah yeah who's you know who I know through Toby Morris and he's love those guys he's the guy and how do you say his name seura I never say seura yeah um Legend yes absolutely uh so you did this like Series where you interviewed all these people and um you know talked about uh the impact of plant-based nutrition on health Etc like that's one of the things that you've done but you've done a lot of things and I want to talk about the this documentary project that you're working on now all the things yeah yeah Derek is awesome I love Toby and dererk and all that kind he's lovely human yeah yeah and again it's one of those things like people see Derek perform and he's this big scary metal guy sco you know Heavy Metal He's a total [ __ ] cat but you know we met years ago music industry and same groups of friends and all that as well and we were seeing all these similarities of our own frustrations with the misconception around how it is is must be hard to be healthy on the road and Derek obviously is really representing in the male demographic big strong dude and vegan and we were talking about he was actually in Dublin with Kip and a few um of like the advocacy world was were recording for early iterations of a documentary and uh I remember Derek was playing in Dublin and I was on a layover and we were just sitting comparing this idea that we both had to do like a plant-based show of some form and they were essentially the same thing so why don't we join forces way more fun so we just started filming um I put together a crew from Ireland and you know raised a little funds and you know yourself you're like it'll only cost a little bit and then this big production happens like [ __ ] now we got to fundraise this part sucks but we we went around the world and Co obviously kind of stopped us like it did with with many people but we had filmed quite a bit and the idea was just to show how easy it is to actually be healthy Whole Foods plant-based anywhere in the world because if Derek and I can do it constantly on tour not knowing where our next meal is coming from and in this constant state of motion and dealing with you know every changing situations um we wanted to just show that it's it's it's actually very easy so with you know who were connected to naturally our friends are and musicians and whatnot we just started doing these interviews and we did a lot in Brazil because he's got a big base out of there and we went on board with like sea sheeper and we did ocean conservation we talked to Ford about you know the the future of automo automotives and it was it's a fun little series and we're just now starting to actually kind of push it out slowly cuz like a lot of media a project it's hard to find your footing and to get stuff out there so we figured you know we'll record a bunch of it and just let it do its old school street team thing well you was it originally intended to be something that you would set up with a streamer or a network we did fil kind of derail that and now it's like a YouTube thing yeah cuz we filmed with the intent of let's do like season one and we'll do you know Eight Episodes but right as we fil finished filming um what we considered like to be season one um we had all these cool fun interviews with d we've Mobi we've you know Kevin Smith the usuals and then a load of random like just Brilliant Minds um the negotiations with the powers that be in a lot of these streamers and that the contracts were just so ridiculous that for what it's a mission aligned project the whole point is to just put stuff out there that it might Inspire some people to you know think differently um and it was weird we just kept getting asked to sign into these things into perpetuity that they would own the content for seven years and maybe so we just pivoted at that point because the no one in in any of the Arts really knew what was happening obviously through Co it was difficult so it's like well let's just kind of chop it up into smaller segments and start putting it out and see how if it takes its own wings and are you going to continue to make new episodes well we've so much content from the original one so first we'll put all of that out and then hopefully hopefully we'll film more down the line while we tour because it makes more sense when we're on the road and if we can kind of overlap or sort of Chase each other's tails on tour cuz he's doing I'm going on tour starting like two weeks and I'll be out for three or four months and Derrick's out on their farewell cycle starting already so it's kind of about catching where we are yeah I mean where are you going to overlap I guess well in the heavy metal uh world like the big thing is all these European festivals right so all those all the all the bands are kind of in the same place at the same time going from one Festival to the next well is that true that's what we all want but what happens is like if you play Hellfest or grass pop or you know all the Sweden Rock the typicals in that run which are the the most amazing festivals to play usually you check the flyer and you're in your friends doing Friday you're doing Saturday your the friends are doing they've left before you get there and all that yeah yeah yeah which is the only frustrating thing like I was just talking to my friend this morning who uh plays with Steve hacket Genesis and he's in guadalahara when I land with Bruce and we're playing the same venue but a day and we're chasing for like two weeks we're on the same route so there's a lot of that with touring musicians we're just like I almost saw you and how do you use your your platform kind of in an analog way when you're up in front of all these people in real life all the time like what ises the what does that look like for you as somebody who spends a lot of time considering or thinking about like you're you're this public person you have this thing you care about you want to carry this message honestly just trying to live by example for me social media is a LoveHate relationship like for many people that sometimes I just want to delete it all but then I think you know what I love food and I love this travel that I do I just post about how simple it is cuz the Curiosity then that people are messaging me all the time from all over the world food looks amazing I had no idea you could eat that I had no idea you know where'd you find this restaurant so for me I just like to sort of show how easy it is and also you know in doing so you're supporting a smaller economy and you're helping restaurants around the world or whatever so a lot of it is food for me and then I really like conversing with people who think extremely differently so I like to kind of get involved in while I'm traveling in sort of very very different ju supposed world so my use of the platform in that sense is not always online you know a lot is going on off offline as well and behind the scenes and and opening a lot of dialogue as I travel with with unlikely very very unlikely people and very unlikely um Industries as well so as far as the use of social media and the platform itself like in a in a visual way it's mostly just food and and health and kind of breaking down that stereotype of rock and roll and right you must be partying all the time like I do shots of weak grass yeah I mean you want to know it's really punk rock like not partying and trying to get to bed on time and treating body right yeah well hey no judgment either I friends that can party like actual rock stars and seem to be fine but it's just God bless those people I know um I'm still trying to wrap my head around how you do it though like you're playing these gigs you don't finish until late you have this Rider so there's food backstage but still then you're immediately on a bus or going to an airport you're in airports we all know what airport food is like you arrive at your hotel room service is terrible maybe you're not near a city there's no Happy Cow you know friendly uh you know vegan restaurant that's within walking distance like how are you putting all those pieces together and keeping it you know keeping it healthy um It's a combination I guess of I've been doing it so long now I feel like I've been on the road pretty consistently for like 10 12 years like without stopping between all the bands so you get pretty smart about the small things like bringing snacks and bringing like cuz you you've had too many situations where you you've arrived in wherever Saro there's nothing open and you at least have your dried mango and mix nut one one like suitcase just full of no I don't bring I'm not that extent but I always have like in my backpack I have some snacks for like the emergency Brak seal if if hungry you know the famine spuds are in there but uh but really it's like eating sides has been a big thing like always talk about like no matter where you are in the world and steakhouses or anything like that are always going to have size like most places have vegetables but when when you're just used to ordering a certain way because food is absolutely about psychology for me I just if the restaurant seems hard for a vegan to eat at you just look at the sides and then you ask for all the sides as a as a Dish as a main but being prepared then with some snacks as well and when I'm home especially like I really stay I'm all about home cooking and and sort of stocking the middle of nowhere in the desert though right it's not like there's a whole bunch of restaurants that you're going to be going to which is probably good cuz it makes me cook it makes me cook a lot but you just yeah you just get really used to it it's like this is my normal so it's not you know it's not something that I'm going to ever oh just because there's only fast food around I'm going to eat fast food now because I know how that I've done that before and it makes me feel totally crap and then you try and perform on top of that like I used to joke with some of the guys that be on the buses with and you know we the hardest Place actually to to be consistently healthy is is the us because most of the the bus stuffs they're not necessarily the east and west coast but the bus stops in those little strip malls that have you know the Wendy's the McDonald's the Burger King whatever and then everyone's going there now they have Chipotle Chipotle save save us a lot that really is a lifesaver yeah wher you go like you can get rice and beans I know I'm so free to you're like Oh yay but at least there's that but I used to do you know cuz you can get veggie burgers veggie vegan Burgers whatever but I would still feel crap if I because it's still fast food it's just fast food and I just don't like how it makes me feel so I'd rather go into the petrol station or the gas station as you say here and get an apple a banana a bag of popcorn and a bag of nuts and water and wait until I get to the hotel then just go and get the veggie super sized meal or whatever because it's convenient so cuz I know how it feels you're already tired enough on tour and then to put the wrong fuel in and to have to walk out and play like especially in Festival season you're playing to 80 100,000 people and you're like you need to be fueled yeah correctly so it's just something I don't compromise on you know what is that like when you're walking out on stage and there's that many people in the crowd and they're going bananas it's a trip it's a trip and it's it's funny though like the bigger the crowd the easier here it is MH because it's so surreal when you're playing to the Sea of dots of everybody like jumping up and down it's really because of the bands that I've been playing with over the years it's pretty special because you're playing legendary hits you're playing stuff you know D sliders doing I want to rock or we're not going to take it and everyone's like bouncing like they're teenagers again and white snake songs so it's an adrenaline rush it's I would imagine something similar to when you're deep in it with your ultramarathon but it's also for me the only time that I'm really present which is such an interesting thing when I when I step away and I CU I'm actually quite I appear extroverted but I'm an introverted extrovert so stage like I don't like being in the crowd or having to be in a big crowd so when I'm on stage I feel safe and I'm very very present because I I can only be here locked in with my drummer I'm in this moment as as present as it gets and this energy that's coming and it's also really cool cuz you play all over the world and you look out into crowds of people who you're looking at however many thousands of people probably have loads of stuff on a daily basis they debate and fight about but music then has this beautiful Unity where for that 90 minutes or two hours or 3 hours everybody's just in it for music which is really beautiful and there's like this respect and that's kind of what I Vibe of the the whole crowd for what has been the most surreal like live performance experience that you've had oo it's been a few um actually probably more recently we finished up the European uh White Snake run at Hellfest which is one of my favorite festivals Hellfest Hellfest it's amazing we're playing it again with Bruce I love this festival and Steve VI joined us for Still of the Night so we had Steve VI come out and play on still of the night so we had the original still you know White Snake to play with Steve VI and have me there with Tommy Aldridge on drums and David Cale on vocals I was like what the [ __ ] am I doing up here this is such a trip that was amazing that was really I'll never forget that because obviously Steve is a legend in his own right and then to have David decide to bring him out for that song and nobody was expecting it and you know he's on the original recording so that was pretty incredible but I've had a few of those like I had some amazing experiences with d as well we did some really fun stuff in in South America and yeah it's uh where are the the best crowds for this kind of music is it is it South America is it Japan is it like Germany South America is pretty spectacular something about rock and roll really is still alive down there and also when you're playing and this also this can apply to anywhere really Eastern like we just played in s AO recently this is one of the most amazing experiences cuz I don't know if you ever heard um Bruce's story with s AO in the90s no oh it's phenomenal I'll let him tell it properly when you get get together but he was the only person that went in and played music um during the war and it's this whole beautiful crazy story but so Bruce is a legend in Saro because he as he'll say himself that he was just young and stupid and didn't know what he was actually doing but it was incredible no one would go in even the U un were like you're crazy so Bruce went in and played a gig in the middle of the war and he became a legend in Saro so and he hadn't been back since and we went back last year to do the concerto and everyone was just crying in the crowd it was phenomenal because guys that were now our crew and and are in the crowd were kids at the gig when Bruce came in when you know these people had no hope in this crazy crazy War that's going on and he just went in played music and they loved him so much for that and then you're you're you're back there 20 something years later and he's just a God in Saro so the energy is like something I'll never be able to explain or experience I've never seen so many people cry and like freak out because they hadn't seen them since and then we did this show and also we were doing this really beautiful unique show with the concerto Orchestra doing deep purple and some of his own songs and the songs that would have been songs he played in the '90s when he went in and played this tiny Dive Club so crowd wise you know you have those special attachment type scenarios and especially in like if you're in the Balkans or Eastern Europe and places like South America where they've had a harder time coming out of heavier times like that rock rock music was a big anchor for people it's like the Church of of rock and roll so the energy is pretty spectacular and and often if you're in countries that are poorer or lower income countes where it's a big deal to save up and go to a show so they're going like full on it's not like oh I'm going to a show this weekend this is a big deal to go to these shows so it's it's amazing for us as bands to have that energy and yeah who are like like the people that you would love to play with like who are the you know the icons like who are your influences you know it's funny I the influence question is always lost on me because of how like I didn't come to music cuz I was inspired by I all Bas ha and did you know what I mean it's not the typical but there's a couple of bands like I always always love like radio heads so unique I absolutely love their music like bands that are not necessarily in the heavy realm but have you met those guys have you met radio head no my friend's actually recording with them this week and I need to again they're one of those like you'll never see them anywhere no I know it's all col Greenwood is one of my favorite Bas they live in like Oxford or I mean they probably all live in different places now but yeah I think they do but like bands like that I just find cuz they're so different musically um but there's some I mean if we're talking about like who can you bring back as well I'd love to play with Miles Davis I'd love to you know play play with a lot of bands that aren't around anymore I love Fleetwood Mac I also love really heavy music like goira and muga and stuff like that so I'm very there's not like one band that I can say oh that's my goal because I wasn't planning any of this anyway and I ended up in some pretty bad bands and that's if if it all stopped tomorrow in music like that was good run that was pretty good good also not for nothing there aren't that many women are there in this world in this subculture that are playing at the level that you're at like more now but not a lot no we're definitely we're all friends there's like five of us are there other bass players yeah there's like five women BS and we're all friends and it's funny so no there's more and more but in different genres but it's absolutely still in the minority yeah but hopefully that is changing over time you know it's it's just by being out there and doing it you're not normalizing it you do see more and more young players coming up young girls playing and it's great like killing it yeah it's democratized it in a way right it's pretty wild though seeing that level of um musicianship from these like tiny kids on the internet like oh [ __ ] I got to go home and practice how often do you practice what is the What is the routine to stay tight well coming up to a tour I will lock myself in the room for a few weeks prior every day like cuz I'm usually learning a new set so I've never heard any of Bruce's music before so I have to go listen to it so I have a ritual that I always do which is I listen to the music for weeks prior if I have the time now this is very different if someone calls you and says I need you tomorrow but if I have the ideal situation I'm listening in really good base headphones for a couple weeks I'm out and about listening listening listening cuz it has to be like in you the music has to be internalized so then by the time cuz I do everything by year um so by the time I go to sit and learn it I'll notice if there's mistakes so you're not you're not reading sheet music no no I did over the years a little bit for certain gigs but it just hasn't it hasn't really been needed so much haven't been offered and then I just used my ear for absolutely everything R River dance or whatever it is River Dance is River Dance still touring is it still River Dance is still around it's about to start God I don't know how many years how long has this been going on like 30 years I should know this but it's definitely the guts of 30 years it's just yeah and it does its residency all the time and it's opening again in the theater in Dublin which is wild it's huge do you speaking of Dublin do you go back to Ireland much as often as I can as often as I can like on this tour so after we do South America and then we start in England um there's about 5 days in between so I'm going to pop home see my granny cuz she's 96 and pop home and see her see the family spend a few days at home and then bounce off to so ideally in between tour runs I can go and do a little stop off in Europe you're not gonna make a pit stop in greystones and jump into the Irish sea with the every time I go The Lads are like come on like oh God Steven Dave maybe have you've done it right I have yeah it's been a while I should I should I always talking about uh Steve and Dave Flynn the happy pair of guys who've been on the show before I mean they've really changed Ireland's relationship with food likeing handedly like they're so influential there yeah I thought it would never happen in Ireland it felt like what is it like now I think it's grown exponentially thanks to the lads a lot of thanks to the lads but it's also a small country so it's easier to see change when you're talking about such a small country it's much harder to see this in the US when you're talking about like what 330 million people versus 5 million people it's really exciting that I go home now and all like the petrol stations have even the shitty fast food everything has a vegan option um but you know it's it's a Hot Topic as well because we we've we're far we're farming country and I mean there's a whole other rabbit holes to go down but it's a it's a big problem that like the farmers aren't getting the support that they should be and so it creates this divide between the plant-based vegan movement and and it shouldn't because there should be a unity in the middle of it all because it's perceived as an attack on The Agrarian culture or the Farmers themselves and their lifestyle yeah which is absolutely not what the the intention is or it should be it should be a total Unity happening there but you know the way that the mainstream media and governments are often set up is to keep us divided on these issues so are there subsidies in Ireland like there are here that are underwriting some of the animal agriculture yeah I think they they're not on the scale of here but they absolutely exist and it's you know I mean here is out of control and until we get private lobbying and subsidies out of of food and politics I don't think we're going to have any chance it's it really is the you know the stone that's keeping us weighted down which sucks we should be able to see change faster in in a place like Ireland but at the same time what's really interesting because I've been away for so many years when I go home I'm starting to see this uh performative political thing happening in Ireland now that's kind of mimicking what's happening over here like we have I didn't grow up under this umbrella of feeling that we had like a left and a right I hate the Labs I hate this like sides game that politics plays but we are getting those extreme lefts and extreme rights in in Ireland now which is really weird because it's happening at the same time we're also seeing a lot of positive change but you know we it's funny because Ireland's amazing I love being Irish I love the banter I miss the crack all that and when I say crack I mean fun not the drug but we also have you know a crazy corrupt political system like everywhere else but we're small and the world sees us as like all fun and shits and giggles but uh we have we have a a lot a lot of positive things happening in the past few years my generation really stood up against the whole you know church and this institutionalized vibe that we grew up under and trying to get away from but the two things are happening at once and it's kind of frustrating because you think oh my God it's the food the change you see it there but then the pressure on the farmers is creating also this big fight mhm this infighting that's happening I hope that it just doesn't end up making it erupt well you got to you got to figure out a way to pave a path forward for the farmers that economically viable for them and respectful of you know how they the the the tradition and the culture like can you transition away from the way you're doing things to use that land for something better and to make that like an attractive on-ramp for them where they can take care of their families and you make a living and all of that and until you unravel that knot and figure it out you're asking of course they're going to be defensive and interpret it as an assault on on you know who they are or their identity 100% and that doesn't nobody's going to that's not a recipe for change no it's absolutely not and putting like each side pressuring each other is just ridiculous two sides of the same coin like we all really want the same out outcome as humans but that's I mean I get really excited about things like salad or AG ulture and if we could scale that up and if that's what Farmers could transition to or you know rewilding obviously all this good stuff but it has to be like you said it has to be incentivized it has to monetize it doesn't make economic sense to just ask a farmer to C his herd down of course not it's ridiculous especially generational Farmers it's absolutely unfair um but the way that the you know the media sets it up that we're always like in these two different Echo Chambers fighting with each other and not getting to this it's it's actually the system that's it's not the sides probably agree on more than we're here fighting about one thing and we have 99 other things in common so I like what you said earlier about putting yourself in a position to have conversations with people that see the world very differently from you and you have that opportunity because you're meeting so many people and traveling all over the world and because you're so well traveled you you know have an appreciation for different cultures and different perspectives and I really think that we you know if we want to solve our problems you have to figure out how to have have a respectful compassionate conversation with somebody who sees the world very differently than you and right now my sense is that that has really broken down and it's a lot of people shouting at each other yeah and I don't know why I mean I guess I do know why we do it but I I find it very exciting to talk to someone who is going to trigger a new thought for me um who was it that said uh I don't like that man Lincoln I don't like that man very much so I must get to know yeah did say that I think it was said that so how do you practice that um well I guess it all start because touring and traveling um I started to see especially in the US like for from an outsider point of view and I love the us obviously it's given me so many amazing opportunities and I love living here but I started to hear so much of this negative talk about each other decides which team are you on and I never liked it and I can I'm a neutral outside source and I can consider myself politically stray until someone proves that they can actually commit to completing a promise but out of sheer curiosity when I'm touring and I'm talking to people every day that are awesome amazing people like really sweet reminds me of home the Midwest the South and then I'm coming back to New York or LA and I have friends who are bitching about people from the states like that's so un have you ever have you ever even been there have you had a conversation with someone and also you see because if I turn on the the TV in wherever Arkansas or Mississippi or Texas um I'm immediately seeing a different rhetoric happing and almost different news right and then you're in LA or San Francisco or New York and you turn on the TV and so you start to become very aware that there's a reason that people are having these very divisive debates and conversations but then you're out and about and you're going to your gigs and your fans and people around are just amazing people they're all lovely and they're all just going about their day-to-day lives and they have different differences of opinions but everybody is in a I believe people are inherently kind and I believe that the system is what's keeping us divided I'm constantly stopping people when they say mean [ __ ] like that about each other you know it's co just escalated so badly and that's the reason that I left La for a while I was like I can't suddenly people who were great friends and loved each other last week are like I'm never talking to that person again cuz have a different opinion whatever it was about masks or vaccines or politics or whatever and they just forgot that they were friends and it just really escalated it so I I had to sort of separate myself from a lot of people in the city and just step outside because I'm okay with people having different opinions and being at table with people who have very different opinions actually because I think it's really interesting you have to be around people with different opinions if for no other reason than to stress test your own ideas practice patience yeah the idea that you're going to immunize yourself against people who who have a different sense of the world creates a fragility like don't you want to be robust and resilient not just in your body and in your mind but in your you know the way that you interact with people and exposing yourself to people who have you know very different ideas and learning how to get along with them is something we should be embracing and seeking out not avoiding and trying to isolate ourselves from I think that's where all the growth is actually I think you know that's what we forget it's in those conversations that both parties are going to and I don't mean political parties but you know but it's so funny now you have to be so careful with like your used the language I was I was laughing about this the other day cuz I someone asked me I'm going to get you in trouble here oh I'm going to be canceled by everyone just fine someone said UK to me about Ireland are you from the UK and I said I'm from the Republic of Ireland I'm Irish Republican as in I'm from the geographical Republic of Ireland it is a republic yes yes it's a republic and then they thought that I was a republican I was like I didn't say either of the it was it just got lost in this very def it was pretty funny I was like okay here we go I don't know I think that all change comes from these conversations and I mean your platform's amazing for that because you're bringing on um so many people from different walks of life and different talk trains where a lot of the time even in our own movement in the animal rights and vegan movement which I get frustrated with all the time and that's why I kind of stay on the outskirts there's a lot of amazing people doing amazing things but there's also a lot of ego leading it the wrong path and going down these Echo chambers that are just detrimental to the cause overall and I know and I understand most of it comes a lot of it comes from Passion but if you let anything be led with ego you're just going to totally [ __ ] it up yeah I mean that's true of in every aspect of life right I think you need change makers change agents activists and revolutionaries and catalysts of all kinds and some people are hardwired to be a Frontline you know uh sign carrying activist who's shouting and I was yeah you were I'm really not wired for that I I try to you know carry the messages that are important to me in a in a gentler way and in a different way but I think it's about having a diversity of of voices and opinions but also within a community of people that feel strongly about a a subject matter or certain thing that they would like to see change or evolve in the world that you need a diversity of voices within those communities and then that Community has to deploy its energy outward rather than focusing on themselves and you know the preaching to the choir thing like at some point it's just I'm not interested in in spending my time you know talking to the people who are already on my page about a certain issue like I don't know what that I mean it it helps it helps like the community kind of cohere and congeal and creates a sense of you know um belonging to something I suppose but but ultimately it becomes you know uh it it it doesn't serve anything other than to strengthen one's sense of allegiance to a tribe and and affirm their identity but it's not actually moving the needle in terms of any kind of real change no no and that's cuz a lot of the gamechanging conversations can can be considered a bit boring as well if it's not that kind of full-on activism you know there's there's all these spaces that are so exciting for like Innovations and materials and food and I don't know why we're not cuz not every everyone's going to come at this from ethics when we're talking about just like you know the movements we're in and nobody wants to be condescended to or moralized so you have to create a way forward that is attractive to somebody and economically and you know to these industries and to you know it has to work in the world as well for for it to to really be embedded and to to get like um to get to like a critical mass or a social Tipping Point with all of this you just you need all like you just said you need all the parts like 's room for everyone at the table but we have to when you get and I'm just using the vegan movement as an example because we're in it but when you get for instance like the clean meat cell your agriculture which I think is amazing and I think it's a game changer everybody wins but you also have activists trying to take it down because one cell originally came from an animal right Purity at the cost of actually yeah changing something in a real way and that can be really detrimental and dangerous for a movement to move forward so it's like accepting it's it's progress It's not Perfection right you're just trying to move the the needle towards a social Tipping Point to make this a Kinder World in whatever way we can because we all have blood in our hands we have iPhones we exist in a world where it's almost impossible to have a little bit of of blood in your hands but if we know and we can choose to make these decisions daily when it comes to our food and how we exist in that space and we know okay well that's how the markets work if you send a market signal as a consumer if I'm buying this it's going to send a signal that there's more demand for that and the industries will change because I don't think that these you know these industries it's not that they're nefarious and waking up every morning like ha twirling their mustaches we're going to we're going to pull one over on the people they exist because we responding to markets Market forces 100% and our subsidies so like you both have to change but that takes individual action which people think is too hard but individual action seems hard but then collectively it is collective action and and sending as a consumer like those that's why I'm so passionate about this Bas because it's so easy to decide daily everything you buy is a vote with your wallet and we all work hard to earn our money and why would we spend it on this you know keeping this in existence but you know we're still looking away a lot we're really good at looking away and morally compartmentalizing these things so if we can just sort of step back and look and go okay even if like I'm always encouraging people to just be plant-based a few days a week one day a week try it a meal a day like give it a go and then you know if people get into it great but this going extreme purist on things and any and any movement is you're just scaring people a lot of the time MH so you're in the Deep South you're on tour maybe you're in Arkansas or Mississippi or rural Louis or something like that and you come upon somebody and you find yourself in a conversation and um and suddenly this person seems curious and receptive to they're like wow this Tanya like I've never seen anyone like Tanya before like what is she you know what is this person all about um and then there's an opening where they're like how do I make that lifestyle change like what do you say to that person who suddenly seems receptive to doing something different usually something like you're already vegan because you just you're vegan but you also eat meat and cheese so I look at does that mean I already I look at these things in reverse because I always find it really funny when people say that it's hard or it's you know extreme because everybody eats pasta pizza potatoes broccoli fruits veggies I mean if you're going to tell me you don't eat any of those things good base to start with so I'm like you're already vegan you just you also eat meat and dairy so it's about kind of breaking down that what people might think is complicated around food but also like I said earlier just saying if someone's asking about for instance how do I eat out order the sides instead or try to add more veggies to to every meal but I'm not a big fan of the labels of the diet it you know so I try to keep the the buzzword out a lot because for some reason they're a big trigger if you're saying like vegan or veget Arian I mean I'm not sure why because it's literally about being kind to animals I don't know why it got tagged with like the the tagline of a being extreme choice is it was all that blood you were throwing all over people back back in the day Tanya it's your fault it's my fault I'm very sorry at least I got it out of my system young I'm sorry what about the why when somebody's like well explain to me like why I should care about this or why I should do this like obviously it's working for you you seem really healthy and energetic and you have this amazing career and you seem happy um and you care about this like why should I care about this yeah well it's sometimes you're gauging like if if a person's trying to come at something from a health perspective if they have a very obvious health issue of course you can go with the we know like the science is stunningly clear that there's a serious benefit for heart disease diabetes hypertension you know all these the obvious things but if it's not a health thing then maybe it's animals maybe it's well do you really love animals have you ever looked into what you know mass animal agriculture actually looks like and what factory farming looks like cuz you know people are like oh I get grass-fed like it's funny that everybody's saying they get grass-fed when it's very small very very minimal percentage that actually is so you're I guess you're trying to gauge what the person is curious about is it their own health or is it maybe they love animals but the cool thing about the whole plant-based umbrella it's about the closest thing to a Panacea we have because you look at ocean acidification rainforest deforestation antibiotic resistance anotic diseases like there's no real negative to shifting towards this because for your own health obviously the health of the planet and then all these Ripple effects that it has out surely one of these things speaks you do you have children like this is what we're doing to the planet and their generation is going to be affected by this the planet's going to be fine you know I hate when you get the sort of performative activism of sa Save the Planet of course we all want to save the planet but the planet's going to be fine um but whether or not we want to exist here in in a on a healthy Planet while we're here and your kids and their kids so you know I often talk to to older families who have two and three generations that like by the you know they're starting to shift toward plant-based because they saw oh wow the soil like you know places in I was talking to a farmer and his family in Kansas a couple years ago and he was telling me the story of how it was when his granddad was on the land and how different it was by the time he had to work under the contracts for big agre and they're tied into using these specific you know fertilizers and pesticides the soils changed the food changed the financial system structure changed for his family and then he's like I don't want to pass this down to my son and their kids so they were starting to kind of think about shifting but a lot of you know the information is is being kept away so I really like getting into it just depends on where the person is coming from if someone is asking you from a health perspective I'm like go listen to Rich Ro and Simon Hill or read these books um but that's that's the really cool thing about this whole sort of movement per se there's a positive no matter what way you're looking at it it's there's there's really no negatives that we've yet to find it is interesting that what's good for the microcosm is good for the macrocosm what's good for you know the body is also in the interest of the planet and Future Generations um it's not about perfection of course choices that we make are going to you know create Downstream consequences as a result of being something that has to consume in order to live um but can you make the Kinder gentle gentler Choice uh and it as it turns out actually serves your own physical health and uh it's taking a taking a positive vote for the planet as well in the future generation so I love the way you characterize that it like checks all these boxes at once um but in terms of how you carry the message or speak to people trying to figure out what their values are and what they care about I think is where you find the it's important because we can't we can't all just attack each other because I believe this and you believe that so you must be wrong or you know they think you might you must be wrong it's we're never going to get anywhere if that's well you see the comments uh on this video on YouTube underneath of people shouting about oh yeah I'm sure I'm sure you know at a certain point you just you get a seriously thick skin you're like I came here to hear about Tanya the basist and heavy metal and I got a I got a dollop of the vegan world I didn't ask for that I will say I wish the word didn't have to exist because I didn't I wish none of us needed labels and I wish it was just normal to try to live as kindly as possible as we're here I feel like the you know the labeling of each other is so I'm with you the on the vegan comments in the vegan comment section that's a whole other tangent on keyboard Warriors and this thing that we do of like if would this person say it to your face that's why conversation is so and and really having conversations with people that you know think completely different and music is the great unifier that transcends all of that and brings people together do you know Maggie Barrett of course Maggie so I was thinking like could you enlist like support and feed on the tour in the way that she does for for Billy when Billy's touring I would love to I must actually ask Maggie about that I haven't talked to her in a little while we did one of her live um it's really fun cooking we on Instagram when you know the Signal's not working properly um I'd love to do something like that and actually Bruce had said I don't know if we'll be able to implement much on this first round because we're kind of testing the waters but he's very interested in like environmental ways to like what what can we do that's less impactful like when we're in certain countries we can take trains um instead of you know cuz traveling is obviously nowhere near the impact of food impact but I'd love to enlist um and start to that's a big passion for me is connecting the right people like connecting people who think you need you you yeah you got to talk to Maggie right away yeah that'd be really really cool but I think um I don't know if they're doing it in in the St just doing it in the stadiums with which is Billy at the moment or if they I think they were doing something with Coldplay as well actually I'm not sure I must ask her but it's so interesting but I would love so that's the thing you're always trying to gauge like it's one thing for me to bring in the backstage to be mostly plant-based or you know bringing the bands out right but how do you take that out of the backstage and into the experience of the people that are attending the show that's the cool thing though the one when I when I dabble with the whole I just delete social media because I kind of hate it thing but when you have fans from all these bands you work with over the years that follow you for music usually and then they actually start to see about the food or the projects that you're doing doing and this the you know the the work with the nonprofits or whatever um that's really cool cuz that's a way of of showing cuz people want people get interested in what what do you do day to day when you're not on stage so it's kind of the way a good way of using your platform just living living your life honestly on social media which is these days you know not the way you're going to monetize anyway no um yeah you got to keep that stuff at arms length yeah I'm constantly being asked to do like brand shout outs and that and I can't do anything because when I I do a lot of due diligence on anything I get involved in and it's so funny I'm like nothing nothing lives up to your standards well it's I'm hardly gonna I think a lot of people would want to know about the beauty routine there's uh not really one I'm very lazy I'm pretty lazy uh I mean I don't even know what that looks like cuz I just like water and moisturizer or what I answer to that question all the time that's so funny not enough sleep too much coffee and I know veggies but we don't have that same culture in Ireland I didn't grow up under like an obsessive sort of aesthetic Beauty like regiment for women it was you know I grew up very just playing out in the dirt and um I I guess I kind of became a bit more of a stage Persona in what I do but I try to avoid the obsession of all of that and just stay healthy and I really believe that like when people ask me what do you do what's your your like when they frame it in the beauty regime thing I'm like it's I think it's internal it's what you eat it's staying hydrated like I drink a lot of herbal tea I drink a lot of water and I eat clean Whole Foods plant-based vast majority of the time so I think that maybe helps keep me put together somewhat maybe might be a connection there maybe I don't know because I I tell you what if I didn't eat this way and practice this way of living I think I would have fallen apart on the road by now because I've seen it so many times a crew especially crew like older crew have been on the road forever and they all have diabetes or they have hypertension and they're eating fast food and drinking you know fizzy drinks all day and it's very hard to live like that yeah and I would hate to feel that crap on the road cuz it's it's hard enough to be on the go every day for three or four months at a time it's amazing how many bands that were huge in the you know 80s and 90s now are having this you know success touring and these guys are in their 70s you know and it's for ing them to be healthy yeah yeah uh because there's so much money at stake too like you know it's sort of like do you want to keep doing this all right well you're going to have to you know let go of that you know notion that you have about what rock and roll is in order to do it it's pretty funny you got like you got like Tommy Aldridge White Snake drummer Tommy's in his 70s he's amazing but he's been cycling every day since he was in his teens so he's you've got the guys that always were healthy and then you've got the ones who went hardcore rock and roll and had to do a 180 to get out of it and redo it yeah so now backstage looks very different who's the healthiest person in heavy metal me good for you no um I don't know there's a lot you know the thing is and I always do you know this band Parkway Drive no of them but I don't know they yeah so Ben Gordon is the drummer I I know him they're they're an Australian band from Byron Bay and Ben is like a major Wellness Warrior meditator super clean yeah yeah there's a lot the thing that always surprises people it's funny cuz metal and heavy Rock can quite often be associated with this like satanic like what are they doing like not so much these days but people would have always thought you know they they must be just eating cheeseburgers and drinking whiskey and whatever but actually the roots of a lot like Punk and all that is is literally about [ __ ] the system yeah like that's where it comes from and that so whatever the status quo that you're you're fighting has that like straight edge yeah true it has that also um and the kind of vegan macrobiotic sort of affiliation that came from Bad Brains and and the like but heavy metal isn't really have that same a lot of metlers though it's always like there's a lot of metal bands that are vegan like they're all like I don't know what I guess it's that it is the subculture of like questioning the system and right it's it's surprising like even the likes of Derek and you know Doyle and all these guys that are absolutely 100% like vegan and in this heavy metal world it's uh it's confusing to the brain for people it's funny because it doesn't seem to fit together you think they're going to you know chew the head off a bat or some crazy [ __ ] but just broccoli mostly I want to ask you about Bob who is this guy Bob that you're making a movie about could you talk about that a little bit oh Bob's going to be either kill me or love that he got a shout out Bob is my neighbor and he um is now Family basically um I I'll say a little bit about it cuz it's very much in its infancy stage it's a documentary I'm going to be working on with veterans and we're just we're shooting some like trailer now and fundraising for it because it's a it's a massive issue that's come across my radar one too many times to ignore where I've had a lot of veterans in my life over the years and crew and I had two partners over the years that had really chronic PTSD and I had uh the situation happened with my my neighbor Bob where he had a lot of loss happened almost two years ago now a year and a half two years ago and at the same time I was going through a lot and I just moved into this small town and we became very close very quickly over a lot of Life trauma that happened in a short space of time and when I saw the lack of resources yet again for a veteran to not only with mental health but just support in general I started to wonder if like other than you know feeding him which was really funny because Bob calls me a vegan and he thinks it's witchcraft he's a 75-year-old Vietnam veteran and he's a wonderful character amazing man you know he started to get a bit more curious about the food side of it and how that could maybe help him feel better obviously physically is one thing so I wanted to maybe just get a group of his friends um who typically just it's kind of I guess an oldfashioned thing you know they just eat a certain way or their wives cook for them and Bob lost his wife and his son in one day and he also had this Trauma from from before he's a Vietnam veteran so obviously that comes with its own battles but I wanted to see it was never supposed to escalate to what's happening now if we could just go shopping and like teach some guys who haven't sort of been self-sufficient or healthy before and then well let's start documenting it it might be fun I asked him if he'd want to and he um he was keen and curious so we started messing around with this idea of maybe do a documentary and then I started talking to a couple of people in our space about it's like oh okay that could be really fun I thought you know what it's one thing to do a media project and Bob being a catalyst of a story of many many veterans who have the same frustration where there's not a lot of resources for you come back from one war and then you're fighting this whole other War for yourself which is you know I can't none of us can even comprehend that that level of of having to deal with all this we know with the plant-based food movement that a lot of these diseases they shouldn't be having to battle on top of everything else so the idea initially is to to get a group of veterans and and do you know you know sort of I don't want to call it a transformation but like a heal Health transformation per seade to see if we can help with these food born diseases but also in the background I think it's important to have really really strong science to back it up so I want to do a study as well so we do a larger scale study so I've been going around like I was talking to Professor Garder last week I spoke to him last week about it's just very very early phases of like what's the the best way to approach this that it's not just a media project and it's not about you know that kind of Hollywood side of doing a movie about a thing that this is really hopefully going to impact in the long run and have a massive like Ripple out effect into the VA system and because there is actually a lot of incredible food clinics sort of the infrastructure is in place these Lifestyle clinics but they're not really bubbling yet because there's not enough eyes on it and there's not enough people leaning into that side so you've got you've got a lot of people fighting to make this work in this space but I just have come across this story way too many times at veterans and I wanted to again figure out like how can I use my connections my platform and bring together some storytelling which we know storytelling is very powerful and when everything happened with Bob and you know he he became an inspiration for me too as well about I talk about being tough these guys are tough anyway but so and basically in the very very early phases of putting this into a media project and also hopefully a mass study so that we can walk away with you know bulletproof data that will hopefully save the lives of a lot of veterans in controlling these diseases that there's just no need for people to be battling things like diabetes and obesity and hypertension these days like when we know we have the solution here but also with a massive focus on mental health and with that I want to lean into the gut health because obviously gut health and brain health are are intrinsically tied so having experts from all these fields come on board to to really look into this because obviously we're not saying that if you eat this way you're going to cure PTSD that's ridiculous but you're certainly going to feel better and that's a step towards healing in a more profound way and bringing in experts in mindfulness in in neurology and everything to to try to help this hugely underserved demographic in the US and worldwide but it's like when you start to look into the numbers here it's absolutely terrifying that's quite beautiful what a worthy um investment of your your time and your energy uh you have this guy Bob who can be this protagonist and put a face on a much larger problem which is the ways the many ways in which veterans are suffering and falling through the cracks and not getting the resources and the help that they need um and they're just one subset of a larger more chronic issue or more more um broader issue around chronic health concerns mental health and physical health um and the idea that you would tend to to care for these veterans in that way like I think is something everyone wants to see and it's a problem everyone would want to see solved and it's complicated because how do you help somebody take care of themselves better a physical way if they have PTSD or these mental health things that that are real barriers to self-care and other aspects of your life like you have to untangle all of those knots in order in order to solve the problems yeah it is a bit of a behemoth and like it's sad like it's it's interesting because I come from a totally unmilitary we have a military neutral military presence but we're I don't have this background in but because I just jumped in so heavy into the US and it's so intense here the whole military presence and you know everyone's family almost has a veteran in it and you're just seeing it more you're out the desert by 29 Palms there's got to be a lot of I was there like like biker dudes yeah and it's so interesting because I literally live by the biggest military base in the world in 20 29 PS I was in there for the first time the other day cuz I'm starting to just like put The Feelers out and and talk to people about who might be interested in being involved because the same frustrations but it's really funny cuz you know people are setting their ways anyway like get military young military guys as well that are just like super regimented other things but that can be very positive if it's for a healthy you know if they're if they're taking those habits and applying it to a healthy approach but it's amazing to me to go into somewhere that spends so much money on like Precision training and like creating these machines of disciplined men and then you go to the chow hall and they're being fed absolute [ __ ] yeah I mean that's across the board I I went to theic training center I hopefully it's different now but the food that they were serving there I couldn't believe it to you know the most elite athletes yeah and it's the same in schools like this isn't just apply to you know you see a lot of the school system it's cool now you're seeing it roll out in the hospitals in New York that they're changing to uh default plantbase but prisons everything like this is something I'd love to dive into across a lot of different it's not just military like mhm I hate that it's the same in the prison system it's awful that like you know of course we get these reism rates because there's just no real education being pumped in or real good food or training it's a mess the whole thing is a bit of a mess it's like how can we like try to have a bit of a positive domino effect over here so with the military as well knowing like with Bob and all these friends over because a lot of crew find in the music industry come from our exmilitary they find themselves in the music industry because it's the closest thing to what they're used to deployment you're in motion still right so you get a lot of crew and so I keep seeing this pattern and it was it's just so so sad that when they do reach out for help like some some cases some states have great clinics and great resources but a lot it's just overwhelmed and underfunded and a lot of the guys and will get frustrated that obviously it's beautiful to hear and be told thank you for your service most places you go but the action then after the statement is not happening in a lot of cases and they have enough to be dealing with so if we can use unlikely connections and use storytelling and try to catalyze something positive for for this demographic because when you start like the numbers in the US are crazy with how many it's like in 70 percentile of families have a veteran in their direct family or one degree of separation and that's you know affecting them and their families and then a lot of the Community as well as bikers and stuff which is really great because I love the biker Community cuz it's got this camaraderie about it already and and these guys who you know fought together and were way together deployed there's this intense community and Brotherhood so a lot of the the support and infrastructure for a project like this is already there amongst themselves which is is exciting to see and it's just it's just like how can we bring in experts in their field so there's a lot of great doctors lined up for it which I'm excited about and honored that they've said yes and you know the doctors are excited because we haven't really tapped into this space before and professors and specialists in all walks of life to to see if we can actually do something that is not just a story but that after the fact after the movie or whatever is made that it continues to Ripple out and actually change a system to help to help these veterans long term that's so cool yeah I saw alen Desmond and Jim and Newman in your in your deck yeah I love them as doctors yeah and Columbus batist and uh we' we've actually yeah couple couple of great people coming on board G Davis and oh G too right yeah yeah yeah and that's and so you're just raising funds right you're like doing a you're trying to ra time the fundraising part of it which when you know I start all these projects I'm like I [ __ ] hate this part everybody hates fundraising but it's part of it you know and I think it's a worthy cause so my usual stress is that I get these massive ideas right before I go on tour so I have to try to get as much work done on the foundations of the project and then go on tour for a few months and then come back and hit it in the pockets when I'm off tour because I have to keep present in the music industry like I would go down a rabbit hole and just work on this all day long and work on anything that's like impact project related but I do have to honor my career in the music industry and stay present enough to have the platform and obviously tour so trying to find that balance of being on tour enough to stay you know relevant in my industry and have that platform and obviously I love touring but then as soon as I'm off the road and well I'm working on it all the time while I'm on the road as well so but I'm just in that phase now of yeah getting the sort of the roots together and the fundraising and all that fun stuff it's cool you're somebody who shows up I think that's a big piece in your success or or your trajectory like you know how to show up thank you I think that's the only way we should you know as an activist as a musician like you know to come to America and figure it out and like make your way and like build this thing I think showing up is a big part of it you have to I mean how else are you going to get anything done right it's scary it's scary at times and sometimes I I question my own decisions to take on Behemoth projects like such but I mean that's what we're here for right it's just trying trying to pay it forward in some shape or form if of course I could just tour and come home and do nothing but I feel like I would just I would not be happy inside if I wasn't paying it forward in some shape or form and and giving back because that's kind of the whole whole point of Being Human right I think I want to end this with with some thoughts about achieving a dream like you came here with a dream like a lot of people and you made it happen you're making it happen like you're manifesting these projects and these ideas into the world so if somebody's listening to this and you know they have a dream but they're confused about how to begin or where to start like what is the what is the message that you share with young people or other people who are like how do I do what you do or their version of what you do following what excites you for sure is is something to check in with yourself on because if everything you're doing if there's not like excitement in her it's not pushing you a bit so I've always kind of think yeah like sit down and think what excites you cuz there's a lot of Buzz around this like internet Generation Now of finding your purpose and you don't always just know that I've known that since I was a little girl I'm lucky that I sort of seen my path like that so that's somewhat easier when you already know but just a way to try and figure that out is just sitting with yourself what really excites me what lights me up like when I think about a project that might help all these people it's like that really [ __ ] excites me and that could be even if I fail at it I'll give it a shot you know um and then just like we were saying earlier just the audacity to try and do something that seems ridiculous and outside of comprehension at the time because I I never would have guessed that this is what I would end up doing not in a million years what I what what did you think you would be doing I thought I'd be a marine biologist or a vet but when I realized there's still time if you want there's still time I might do that you know after this next tour I'll study or you know I want to study philosophy I love philosophy and all that so but that's the thing it's also like not freaking out about you can have all these chapters in life so and it's it's absolutely okay to fail so with music because it's really difficult in the music industry I get people all the time asking like should I move to LA should I do that it's hard for me to answer that with a a straight yes or no because it's really hard and I I kind of caught the last wave of the Sunset Strip having the jam nights and that is kind of gone now and this whole pay to play so I can't say yeah you're going to come out and you're going to make it but you should come out and see if you're if you can cut your teeth at cuz it's it's pretty hard industry so there's the just try and then that actually speaking of philosophy it was a Gerta the German philosopher said uh whatever you can do or believe you can do begin it um boldness has greatness magic and Power in it just begin it and I love that because it's what's the worst it can happen I always thought that with like going up to a musician to ask about a jam night or going out to try and fund raise for a project whatever it is it's like I'm just going to try I'm just going to ask these people to see if they want to be involved or if I can do this because if they say no my ego will take a bit of a hit but I'll get over it you know and no regrets it's that it's that reflex to action no regrets right you know the classic tattoo no regs if you're going to you have that tattoo oh I've I've been tempted to get it so many times I'd love a know regards stat to I think that can be ar range just talk to Toby there you go they'll hook you up yeah yeah um well this was great thank you uh you're an inspiration I I love getting to know you a little bit better um you're a powerful presence in the world and uh the way that you show up in your art and in your advocacy is is is really is really laudable so I appreciate you coming and sharing your path that means a lot coming from you thank you very much for having me if people want to learn more about you or perhaps they want to maybe throw you a few bucks for the documentary or get involved or what you know if somebody's listening to this who is in that world and wants to connect with you like where where can you send these people yeah I mean I'm really only active on on social media wise I'm on Instagram so it's just tan cahore official I'm there but for I'll be setting up some stuff over the coming months regarding the project but you can reach me through my website so on my own website which is just my name tan.com you can email through there um and yeah when when we really start ramping up on this project I'll definitely be be setting up some type of hopefully fundraiser or intern trying to raise funds through the philanthropic movement so H was interested in helping with veterans there's definitely a project coming up that needs it yeah yeah yeah um cool how many cities are you hitting with Bruce we God we must we're doing I think we're doing 40 something shows so yeah we got about North America uh no South America first so we're starting in yeah we go down we start Mexico and then head through Brazil and then after that we go I think we're doing nine nine or 10 cities in Brazil Brazil is huge I was just there doing another tour and it's speaking thing it's so funny like no matter how many times you go it's so big but yeah we do South America first and then we do we go England up and down England and then we go across uh Europe and we land in Greece so you are doing the all the festivals in Europe over the summer so we're already all these text chains of like musician friends are you going to be there on the Friday or the Sunday or the Saturday chasing each other's taals too yeah right on we'll have fun thank you and go out and make that movie and then come back and talk to me about it I would be honored all right thanks Tanya thank you peace [Music] plance that's it for today thank you for listening I truly hope you enjoyed the conversation to learn more about today's guest including links and resources related to everything discussed today visit the episode page at Rich roll.com where you can find the entire podcast archive as well as podcast merch my books Finding Ultra voicing change and the plant power way as well as the plant power meal planner at meals. roll.com if you'd like to support the podcast the easiest and most impactful thing you can do is to subscribe to the show on Apple podcasts on Spotify and on YouTube and leave a review and or comment supporting the sponsors who support the show is also important and appreciated and sharing the show or your favorite episode with friends or on social media is of course awesome and very helpful and finally for podcast updates special offers on books the meal planner and other subjects please subscribe to our newslet which you can find on the footer of any page at Rich roll.com Today's show was produced and engineered by Jason Cameo with additional audio engineering by Kale Curtis the video edition of the podcast was created by by Blake Curtis with assistance by our creative director Dan Drake portraits by Davey Greenberg graphic and social media assets courtesy of Daniel CIS thank you Georgia W for copywriting and website management and of course our theme music was created by Tyler Patt traper Patt and Harry mathys appreciate the love love the support see you back here soon peace plance namaste he [Music]

Channel: Rich Roll

Views: 28,923

Keywords: rich roll, rich roll podcast, self-improvement podcasts, education podcasts, health podcasts, wellness podcasts, fitness podcasts, spirituality podcasts, mindfulness podcasts, mindset podcast, vegan podcasts, plant-based nutrition

Id: 79ZwEYUwP64

Length: 122min 43sec (7363 seconds)

Published: Thu Apr 25 2024