Sunday Night Live - The True Story of Padre Pio - Fr Groeschel, w C Bernard Ruffin - 02-13-2011

well welcome tonight ooh Sunday night in New York here on EWTN and a couple of things I'd like to mention first of all our program does appear in Ireland not on Sunday night but during the week and right now in Ireland there is a tremendously important election coming up unfortunately I wish I could say that there are very clear issues in favor of pro-life but at least there are a number of candidates that are pro-life I wish they were a little stronger in their pro-life I'm half Irish my father's great-uncle was Archbishop of Armagh successor of Saint Patrick Cardinal Logue and I am appalled to imagine that there is a possibility of a vote in favor of abortion in Ireland so I'm speaking to the Irish audience and all the rest to pray to pray that there will not be this very dark dark stain on Irish history Irish history has been linked with the history of the church and faith through the centuries of a persecution of them the longest time my father's great uncle Cardinal Logue was the first Irish Cardinal in history in the middle of the 19th century into the 20th because the church had always been persecuted and there were no Irish Cardinals the churches were not Catholic churches the bishops the priests lived and hunted during the British persecution of Ireland for case for centuries and now Ireland has been fairly very free with its church over the century and here we find there is a possibility of a vote in favor of abortion in Ireland unbelievable and a disaster I wanted mention next week our guest a very eminent respected Catholic theologian and writer George Weigel and George will be speaking on Christian values in the secular world he's an outstanding writer wonderful gentleman and a near neighbor of mine so I hope that you'll pay very close attention now this evening our visitor is also a very good friend of mine for many many years and this is tester Bernard roofin and I want to tell you that he is the editor of the writer of an outstanding book on Padre Pio he's written on Catholic saints a Lutheran pastor and brother Andre them plus it Andre and now st. Padre Pio and his book they'll control us on their padre pio the true story and we want to take that's the new edition of your book there but what we want to do is take up another book written against Padre Pio and in many ways against Christianity and Sergio Luz Otto Padre Pio miracles and politics in a secular age this is published by metropolitan books and they should be ashamed themselves for putting out this book is an attack sweetly done he's carefully done of an attack of padre pio and it's a translated book so pastor welcome with so many of you thank you and I know you've got lots to think about tell us a bit about your pastor rate yes I am where where are you okay Lutheran Church to the holy comforter in Washington DC and you've been a pastor how many years uh 34 years 34 years no 36 years good and you've been on our broadcast yes Lori yeah yes a and what about well first of all how did you get to be involved with Padre Pio I first heard about Padre Pio when I was in college and there was nothing better to do on Saturday evenings than to go through old newspaper files and I was really looking for articles on to race annoy Minh who was the better known at least in America at that time for having the stigmata I've always been even as a boy interested in instances where the hand of God is manifested in human history and in doing looking for articles about to race annoy Minh I found an article about Padre Pio which I didn't think much about at the time because it I don't think it was too well written but this would have been probably in late 67 early 68 and a few months later I was at the old North Terminal in the Washington Airport about to fly back we lived in Chevy Chase Maryland and I was going back to college at Bowdoin and there was a little brown book in the bookstore on the book rack the priest who bears the wounds of Christ and I picked that up and read it and I was much impressed although later I found out that there were a number of exaggerations there but that's how I first learned about Padre Pio around that time I did write a letter to him asking whether or not I should be a Roman Catholic of that that was a time in life when I was trying to determine in what community I would serve the Lord and I got a letter back not from him but from his secretary saying that Padre Pio is praying for you and he says to trust entirely in the goodness of God and that's very interesting because that's probably one of my greatest difficulties trusting entirely in good God's goodness so I don't know whether he actually saw my letter later on I determined that the letter was written by Father Joseph Pius who had later on became a friend of mine however I'd lost the letter and I didn't find the letter until a few months after Joseph Pius had gone to his reward so I'd never know whether padre pio actually saw or read my letter well now most of us audience know much about Padre Pio some people do not he is a Capuchin friar and he is a stigmatised stigmatic he has the wounds of Christ in his hands feet and side and the first stigmatised that were recorded in history is Saint Francis himself and Padre Pio I understand it's the first priest who was ever a stigmatic and it tell us a bit about his life well he was born in a place called petrol chena which is in south central Italy excuse me just a minute we have up on the screen a photograph of Padre Pio as a very young priest and the superiors told them to take off the bandages wash his hands and take this picture to take it it was not be given out to public that was part of the record and you see the this the wounds very clearly so he was born in Peoria Tina his family were farmers they owned a little bit of land but not they were just a bit above peasant status and he from a very early age wanted to be Capuchin priest and his father came to America to work so that he could get a high school what the equivalent of a high school education which was requisite for him to enter the Capuchin Order but he very early in his ministry the cross in I think it's Colossians the first chapter of Colossians st. Paul says that he makes up what is lacking in the sufferings of Christ for the sake of the church and this was part of Padre Pio's ministry to join to offer up his sufferings to this to the cross as he offered up his sufferings to Christ to join in his saving work to bring humanity to God and so shortly after that he began to experience the pains in his hands and feet inside but it wasn't until a few years later in 1918 that they actually appeared visibly and they never stopped until just before he died and he had no scars but at the time of his death there were no scars which is from what I understand miraculous because it was absolutely proved that the wounds in his hands were deep and any wounds that were that deep even if they healed would leave a scar but his hands and feet and side were photographed after he died and they were perfect there was nothing there one of the captions who worked with Padre Pio as assigned to be his secretary told us that when the scabs which they come off occasionally and the wounds are very clear that you actually if you held his hand up in front of a light you could see some light coming through the the wound yes yes it is a membrane there but you actually could see yes the light what an incredible person and but that was not really the great thing about Padre Pio the immense crowns of people crowds of people particularly after the Second World War American soldiers had gone to visit him and that's when he became very popular initially the Pope Pope Benedict and Pope Pius xi were very hard on Padre Pio he never left his little village he never defended himself but there was people who spoke against Pio some of them represent rip rip all reputable people and said that he thought it was either an illusion or a subterfuge and it was later under Pope Pius 2/12 that he was given permission to see people and I spoke to many people in my life who actually saw Padre Pio they found in a kind of joyous little elk you got a real peasant from far fryer and he had a profound influence on history because after the Second World War it seemed like Italy would go to communism it would join with Soviet Russia and it would be right in the middle of Western Europe as a communist country and I heard a number of people including the father general of the cabbage in order say that it was because of Padre Pio that Italy had not gone communist so he had a profound influence on her history it's very fascinating of course that you have written a beautiful book on Padre Pio on you're a Lutheran pastor did you write anybody else like that did I write about anybody else I wrote about brother Andre brother I wrote about Fanny Crosby who was a Methodist hymn writer and a very holy lady a blind lady and brother Andre in Canada who is now santander that's right and Padre Pio is also a saint they're both canonized you better be careful you get too close to these people now it's a I did not see Padre Pio that in those days the captions were not including encouraged to go there to visit because they didn't want to make it to be a circus so the father general asked the choirs not to go there without special permission and Padre Pio never left that little village and there was no attempt to make it a popular place to go it was hard to get there you had to drive and the local people were deeply devoted to him interestingly the Archbishop of that area the Archbishop of men Fredonia I'd given Padre Pio a very hard time that's right it's it's a mixed story yes it's a mixed story we have a break now we'll be back and we want you while we're having our break and our next several minutes to start calling up and ask us some good questions or perhaps some of you have experiences spiritually with Padre Pio if you have an opportunity to read pastor Ruffins book which is published by our Sunday visitor yes I would suggest that you get it by all means and I suggest did you not get Luciano's book but just a true bulletin box because it's sarcastic and it destroy distorts things what do you think of his book yes well basically what he does is he takes all the negative things that were ever told about Padre Pio and sets them down without letting the reader know that they were refuted perhaps a you could take an example let's say somebody was this is the hundredth anniversary of Ronald Reagan let's say somebody wanted to prepare a biography of Reagan and all they did was to look up all the negative things that they could find and none of the positive ones and set them down without any explanation that is what Lutz Otto did he took all of the accusations that were made against him throughout his ministry and wrote them as if they were the truth and of course he does not deny the possibility he denies completely the possibility of the supernatural yes a miraculous it seems like his approach is how to explain how this simple silly man at times he seems to refer to him as if he was a simpleton who was manipulated by unscrupulous religious authorities at other times he considers him a charlatan he refers to him as a new rasputin's draw and other negative addresses him and speaks of him in other negative ways he presents him as as if he were just a a crook a crook a fraud and just a line out of this Luciano's book all these factors to which we must add the Capuchin friars unique status as a priest with the stigmata help to explain why Padre Pio story was so troubled so a Boreas laborious so fitful and they help to account for the final performance the one offered in st. Peter's Square in Rome on that spring day in 1999 sarcastic yes yeah who needs this you know that's what I have to say and I would suggest if you are a book PEEP somebody likes to read books you might buy but write a book a letter to the publishers here metropolitan books part of Holt and company 175 Fifth Avenue New York City 101 oh and write them and tell them what they think and they also have WWE enry Holt one line PG n ry h o LT calm and let him have it what am habit I I'm a New Yorker I don't think you just sent around a smile at this not I think he takes the position that of course you know this could not be true of course everyone knows that no one could genuine genuinely have the stigmata no one could genuinely be the means of miraculous healings no one could genuinely have all these spiritual gifts that Padre Pio had so somehow there had to be a fraud and how could a modern people be taken in by this this pathetic creature the book is basically not against Padre Pio it's again faith yes again belief in God and the belief in a personal God and certainly in denial of Jesus Christ there's no question and with his name Sergio Luz Otto I suspect that he was baptized and probably someplace his mother or grandmother some place is praying for him right now now a father with Padre Pio and the accounts of many things in the world over those 50 years where Padre Pio came into people's lives have you got some of those example yes I mean there were many examples there was one man I'm not going to mention names but he said that he went to make his confession to Padre Pio and Padre Pio was able to tell him everything that he ever did including the sins that he had committed and after that all he could do was cry cry cry and after that his life was never the same there are many many accounts similar to that where people went to make their confession to him usually it was during or after a confession that Padre Pio was able to tell them things about themselves that he never could have learned on his own and that had a profound effect on their lives I I know someone that that happened to and he he purposely made up a confession and Padre Pio waited him he got all fiendish and he said now there's a couple of things that you forgot and the man was practically ready to faint right in the the key is a confessional others who were there were not even thinking of being have religious vocation and he changed their life the very fine young priest I don't want to mention his name he was young priest then he was not a priest he was the soldier at the end of the Second World War he was not a Catholic but they brought him up the Padre Pio took his head it asked something to him and he didn't know what he said and this was a capital B later on then he was there that day father Dolan Dolan ecchi and this other man said What did he say to you to me he said well I don't want to tell you what did he tell you he said would you go home you go to become a Kappa he said what's the capital because he was not a Catholic and the rest of his life he spent his time as a capital hey joy then there were also instances where someone had intended to become a priest and he would say no you you get you're going to get married yes I know that yeah I know people have had that too but there was a priest I guess I can mention his name he's gone to his reward father John st. John he was a Jesuit who was a chaplain during the Second World War and one time Padre Pio said to him go and find sergeant so-and-so and he gave the whatever unit was he was in and tell him that his baby he's been born this was during the Second World War so he went and found out the found the sergeant and said I'm coming to you from Padre Pio the sergeant said who he'd never heard of Padre Pio he said well that never mind Padre Pio said to tell you that your son or daughter whatever it was has been born safely and your wife is doing fine and the man was flabbergasted because he was overseas he hadn't his wife was expecting he hadn't heard anything for days or weeks and this was the first time that he learned what was later confirmed that the child was born when Padre Pio said he was born then another time Father st. John said he took three service people up to see Padre Pio and they were not living good lives and so normally when Padre Pio met the service people he would embrace them and would be very warm and effusive but this time he just shook hands and said Buon Giorno and then he call father st. John aside and said questi woman epyck Cocteau pecan tea at Camino C pick amino C pick catty VA pick Camino C bad and sinful people and it turned out that the the one service man was sleeping with the service woman and the other man was an alcoholic he'd never met them mm-hmm people will tell you many stories like this but he had this in a diary when I interviewed father st. John he had his diary I don't know what's ever become of it but he was reading directly from the diary so it wasn't you know something third hand this was his own experience oh yeah a lot of things in Padre Pio when people went there directly particularly during the after the war but another thing Lazaro says is that most of the biographies are based on the writings of this man a mano le brun Otto who was a supporter of Padre Pio who was sort of like a shady operator my father was a police official he would call him a hustler and he did contribute a lot of money to the hospital but it's not true that most of the accounts are based on his recollections there are many many many primary sources about Padre Pio father Dominic Meyer was a Capuchin was an American who was Padre Pio secretary and many of his letters he would write sec circular letters home and he would describe some of the things that had gone on and according to another man was Joe Peterson who was a servicemen during the war he later worked for the post office in Long Island I believe and he would spend a month in the summer and he talked to father Dominick and father Dominick told him that he'd asked Padre Pio once when you say you see people's guardian angels what do you mean do you really see them and Padre Pio pointed to him and said Domenico when I say I see someone's guardian angel I see them just like I see you and there are many many first-hand accounts of people who worked with Padre Pio over the years accounts of his superiors the diary of Padre Agostino and Padre Paulino just dozens of things so this is absolutely nonsense that all of the these are crazy stories invented by a sharp operator who was not trustworthy the you know most not almost nothing that you find in the most of the biographies of Padre Pio comes from Renato because the Capucines didn't want were ashamed of him didn't want people to want people to stay away from anything that he had written so this is just hogwash well it's not a surprise if you look through the history of the church people who are known very clearly as Saints met teacher people chosen by divine providence people who have lifted themselves up to respond to grace excuse me in such a situation there you know excuse me in such a situation when people like that then you must expect that they will be attacked and the perfectly example of it is our Lord Jesus Christ you know completely his holy life doing good thing well he is attacked endlessly and finally tortured to death this is what you expect don't be surprised I would be disappointed with Padre Pio if everybody thought he was wonderful I would have interestingly enough though I've spoken to a number of people who are psychologists and who are religiously oriented people not necessarily Catholic or and they have been fascinated by Padre Pio they want to hear the whole thing it's a beautiful example of divine providence and God's grace coming in to everyday world and Padre Pio like with the guardian angel he's a simple peasant person that's how he's going to say it of course and I was so pleased to know that Pope John Paul as a young priest had visited Audrey Pio and that he took him very seriously and that's how he was canonized we're going to be having a break in a few minutes and we'll have questions and we'll be very grateful if you will take the questions I want you to mention though where our cameramen would you put on the front here I want to explain here in the front is one of my oldest countries together we ordained together for the Christopher Dietrich who's wearing is dark brown capuchin habit like Padre Pio and along with him is father Andrew Apostoli we all know who is wearing exactly the same habit but it's great because we started our little community and so we hope someday to be able to be back with the cabins so that's where you see the two in the front I'll be back in a couple of minutes well we have our first call from Marilyn Marilyn tell us where you're from and what are you going to ask us I'm from Amarillo Texas by way of New Orleans Louisiana anyway god bless you both very much I wanted to ask Pastor Ruffin what he could tell us about Padre Pio's bilocation experiences there were many occasions well I won't say many there were a number of occasions of in which Padre Pio wound ever left san giovanni rotondo from 1916 until he died in 1968 was seen and conversed in and spoken to in other parts of Italy and other parts of the world for instance somebody might have been let's say in France and they would they would see him at a crucial time and he it was usually a time of crisis and Padre Pio said wherever the Lord wants me to be there I am he could never explain how that worked someone once asked him when you were visiting somebody let's say in Ireland what was the furniture like what was you know what did the the the landscape look like and he said he didn't know all he knew was the person that he was dealing with there was a I don't know try to condense this of the most famous instance occurred when he was a seminarian when he was 17 and he found himself in a house in northern Italy where the father was the the man was dying the man was a Mason he was not a believer he didn't want the last rites at all he didn't want any any religious activity around him but his wife was pregnant and so it was then fra Pio went out to the mace the Masons who were standing around and said that he had to baptize a child and they let him through because it did he had to baptize the girl much later and he wrote this down he wrote down what what had happened much later this girl whose name was Ritz Ani Giovanna Harrods Ani encountered Padre Pio at Saint Peter's in Rome she had gone there when she was 17 this was 1922 to make her confession it was late in the day the custodian said it's too late go home all the priests are gone but she saw a Capuchin priest who beckoned her into the confessional she made the confession to him after she came out the guard said didn't I tell you to go home she said well yes but this priest said that he had time to hear my confession and that's what I did and the custodian opened the door of the confessional and he said see there's nobody here what are you talking about and later on she happened to go to san giovanni rotondo and happened to meet Padre Pio and he was the man whom she encountered at Saint Peters and he said I've been waiting for you all my life you were born when your father was dying and the Blessed Mother entrusted you to me you know so it was documented because he wrote that down back in nineteen five and then in 1922 the the baby was now a teenage girl actually came to see him and that that's probably one of the most famous and one of the best documented cases of bilocation where he appeared to be in two places at once and that was very early in his life yes he was 17 17 so you're dealing with a holy man throughout his life yes yes a teenager yes even as a little boy he was considered very holy place parents were very devout we have a call from Steve when you're from Steve and what he's going to tell us I'm from New Hampshire my question is I find it very odd that the father Pio never showed his hands in public went up to people in crowds and took the be always was in bandages he never took the bandages off in public around crowds nobody could actually see the stigmatism no doctors have reports or pictures of his hands without the bandages on now you always mentioned about people back in 1905 or wherever whatever it is you can't mention certain people's names because they're alive but you can mention people's names that you know are dead so nobody can interview them there's a picture of him right now up on these on the screen that means nothing that picture it looks to me like it's doctored look at the look at the color of his beard and look at his hands it's black so that looked like a doctored picture to me but he never went in public and showed his hands to doctors or people and is no pictures from doctors themselves that can verify this but that picture you just showed to me right now that's a doctored picture he's got a black and gray beard it's the same color as he and what is not like that first of all it's with regard to the photograph it was an early color photograph and many of those the color is distorted but he was examined by several doctors who left detailed reports there were at least three who wrote detailed reports back in 1918 there were doctors who examined him throughout his life now he covered his hands because his superiors wanted him to and also out of Maude he did not want people to see the stigmata but however during Mass he had to uncover his hands and so anybody that was close could see the the stigmata I of course a lot of the people that I mention are dead because he died in 1968 so of the people that were knew him very well obviously would be dead or very old but I knew very well padre Alessio who's dead who died in 2000 but he actually saw the the wounds in his hands he's normally Padre Pio cleaned his hands in a corner he didn't like people to see them but on this occasion he fainted and so Alessio came to his assistance and he saw the wounds and he said that you could see the sunlight through the wounds so there are many many people who actually saw the wounds and you saw at the very beginning of the show a picture taken under obedience in other words Padre Pio superiors made him pose and you could see it's in black and white the the wounds in his hands so those are very well documented and as we said it was he was commanded by his superiors not to show his wounds in public and he didn't walk - out of modesty yes I don't want to enter responding to our caller but obviously he is exhibiting very strong hostile projected prejudice against a Catholic Church perhaps he says his reasons but he did not make an objective approach to this situation we have a call now from Russell Russell where you from and what are you going to ask us are you there Russell do we have another caller then all right we have another caller well I want someone in our audience father Christopher what a Benedict you and I went to the seminary food together we struggle through all of those years together and we were ordained together in 1954 in Sacred Heart monastery here in Yonkers where they lie and I'm sorry excuse me 59 I entered 254 right today if you could see him Benedict is wearing the same habit as me except it's the color of gray now I'm sure a lot of people would be interested to know the story behind that but your tellement father Christopher you'd give it why is it gray yes you tell us well father Benedict was probably one of the holiest seminarians that I had ever had encountered in the seminary and while the benedict well I guess was not completely happy with the way things were run in the Francis capetians and he founded this other group the actual fact comes close but we were disappointed with some of the events that took place in the latley part of the 20th century and many people were very unhappy not just us and we had decided to start with the permission of the father general and of the Holy See to start a reform group of campus ins and we had that permission unfortunately some of the Commission provincials at that time in the United States objected to that not from the general who came to visit us and not for the father would later be the other gentleman there the was now a bishop but we were treated very very well and I have no complaints at all about how the captions have treated our community since that very day and I would hope and pray to God that we will be canonically the same community and I'd love to have it happen before I'm dead so I'm taking good care of my health as father Christopher he's much younger than me at least a few months we have Russell calling us we got to get back Russell are you there Russell where are you good evening yes greetings from New Hampshire which is the only state in the Union which is mentioned in the Bible Oh a dumb legislators changed the sentence in the Old Testament times used to be called the Garden of Eden why say Russell what he got question of the gaiden of Eden I would say that in the Garden of Eden in the Garden of Eden there was only in the guide in the first cabinet the old now calls out there was only one true church a religious body Judaism under the old New Testament their soul went through faith the Catholic Church through which salvation roses were my respect for the past why don't you enter the true church thank you well it's a long story I am there just I guess I could say that there are many people who have truly been concerned about being where God wanted them to be and for some reason they weren't in the Roman Catholic Church in many ways I have would like to be I hope my bishop isn't listening but the things have not worked out in such a way that it is practical at this point that's you know it's I could write on quite a lot about that but that this time I have a congregation and I believe that they want me to serve them and that's what I'm going to do you know we all regret that the unity of the church came apart several times in church history and in the big the big one at the time of the preparation but there was the separation with the Eastern Church the Orthodox and the Catholic and there were others during earlier times it's unfortunate but what you have is many sincere believing people some of them some of them saintly people and that's what you have to respect it's you should not be respecting an institution you should instantly respect the immortal soul of the life of the individual person and anybody could tell you that inside the Catholic Church and the Lutheran Church at a lot of other churches there are some people at are way off the beam and there are other people who looking carefully sincerely doing the best they can can it well be than in the Providence of God and the love of Christ that the salvation of souls is best accomplished at the present time with various denominations could that be the Providence of God and I would say the writings II observations of our present Holy Father and not in many more words than that is saying the same thing and I think that would have been true also a book John Paul we have a call from penny penny where you from and what are you going to ask us I'm from Port Richey Florida and I read a lot about Padre Pio and the only thing that ever I ever really wanted to ask anybody a question about was what was the reason that they kept him from practicing math or celebrating Mass because for a priest that that's his calling was it a form of punishment for some reason or was it again for what you were talking about before that it was for humility he was never kept from celebrating Mass but from approximately 19 32 to 34 somewhere in there he was forbidden to say Mass in public he had to say Mass privately within the friary and that was because of the not only because of some of the opposition from the archbishop actually by that time that archbishop had retired but a lot of the problem came from some of his followers there were a lot of mentally disturbed people in San Giovanni according to one of the priests that worked there and there were a lot of fanatical women and at one point the people thought that Padre Pio was going to be transferred and they rioted and they - they uprooted a street lamp and used it as a battering ram to break into the friary to try to get at a priest who was visiting Padre Pio whom they thought was sent by the Vatican to take him away so a lot of that those restrictions came not because of Padre Pio himself but because of the local people who created problems for him and you know it's a long story it's many different people if you read the life of st. Francis which we always present so beautifully almost like a stained-glass window there were there people at that time who hated st. Francis and detested him and said that he was a not a true person so that's something I I have something I want to tell you though I didn't want to miss it that I have my own Padre Pio story I when I was a high school boy I heard of Padre Pio and I knew the Capitan's near our house the Italian cabinet the capellini and I was very impressed by them and so finally I joined the cabinets and while I was there I was for many years a Capuchin and I love the cabbage ins and our hope that our community will be back still again part of it but I heard about Padre Pio and I was very very impressed and there was a certain moment in my life with a very just about to be ordained a priest and I was supposed to be sent to Rome to study Scripture to teach I was very anxious to preach live with the poor which I ended up doing but because I had an argument up a polite argument with William Buckley and another friar a political one I had Kant and the secretary priest-in-charge came and said in the morning you're not going to Rome you know of the study and I said why and they said because we don't think you know how to preach and I've been doing this for years and then he came back two minutes later and he had a letter he said this letter too in the mail from Europe just arrived for you and I opened it and it came from san giovanni rotondo and someone had asked padre pio to write a note to this young friar being ordained and it was a little holy car and it said Jesu say Atul conforto sOooo sustained yo+ Pio and it means may Christ be your comfort and your story Padre Pio I want to tell you that if the Archangel Michael had not come into the door I would not have been bought more more surprised thank you Pastor very very much you very grateful and we have our program to the end please don't forget to support EWTN we do need the help and Mother Angelica we'll be praying for you god bless

Channel: EWTN

Views: 450,897

Rating: 4.7999563 out of 5

Keywords: EWTN, Sunday Night Live, Benedict Groeschel, CFR, Bernard Ruffin, The True Story of Padre Pio, Catholic

Id: 6GMfi0QHm4o

Length: 53min 36sec (3216 seconds)

Published: Mon Feb 14 2011