Neal Bishop: Stockton to Juve

a very well welcome to another edition of the magpie circle podcast and we've got a championship winner with knotts county today uh a key member of probably what the most successful knotts county team the best part of two decades um midfield engine room very warm welcome to neil bishop excuse me hey great great to have you neil we've been trying to get you for a couple of weeks now so we're delighted to have you on board um today we're going to take a look back at your time at knots a little bit look back at your career as well where you are now um and i think it's fair to say you certainly did the hard yards before getting into the football league at the age of i think it's been like 25 at barnet you've clocked up uh 500 600 appearances you didn't miss many games once you were in um put into context of your career your spell at knotts county what how important to that was you how much did you enjoy it um it's got me up there um you know it was it was bananas was my was my staff but obviously we going to knox county was it was a massive step for me but it was basically my start in the football league two years there um and then nuts county coming and you know with the history of the club uh tommy johnson was at the time i was tommy spoke to me it was just it just seemed like nothing made it but it was it was a proper club probably probably club you know the stadium and the history and everything and and i had no idea what was going to happen when i come in but um you know i was desperate to get as soon as i knew they're interested i was desperate to get there um and like i said for my career it was it's got me up there for four years there a large a large part of it as well and i fully enjoyed my time there um for the majority of it anyway if it was it was good um and like i said well it was the only league i wanted in my career so it's got to be right up there let's just wind the clock back a little bit because you certainly had to put the hard yards in and i think there's a story isn't it you grew up in stockton in the northeast you're a borough fan um and you your brother played with your dad it is the same team yeah tell us about that yeah well i played for lincoln town and i think it must be about 90 20. um and we put some place called taolona tuesday night which is which is bleak it's in the middle of nowhere and honestly it can be august of minus five eight it's in the it's in the sticks outside somewhere and um we didn't have any players and obviously my dad is the next did i play a good level semi-pro um and my brother was just coming through as well obviously he's younger than me until they gave his wranglers up and me down was driving me at the time uh was in the car you know i'm going to spare you daddy you've got to spare a pair of boots with blueberry i think we have the bay 11. and um yeah he played i think he played center half uh big brother was the left foot he played left back obviously out there i think we drew two well i think them i think i was the third worst bishop on the pitch that night as well yeah my dad showed me up but no it was just we got he made the local paper and obviously we've got a little cut out when i think it's a good thing to look back too it's really it was really good but yeah my dad loved his football and he didn't have to be asked twice as he did i still tell you minute one a minute these days be daddy he's got him he's got a memory of an encyclopedia where football's concerned but yeah it's someone to look back on fondly yeah um what age was he done then your dad oh god um it would have been well it nearly in nearly fifty they've been well into his 40s but he like it seems he certainly he's done well like he looks after himself my dad touched what i've got the same physique you know he's he's tall he's lean he doesn't carry any weight so yeah oh he loves his football my dad are you all bored middlesbrough fans then oh yeah well obviously i started up there there's people where i wasn't even academy when i stand out in school of excellence and my dad took us when we were kids that's how i got it with um and i'm a firm believer you like but you said you support your local team i've got no time for these man united fans living stuck in the middle and things like that door taught me if all that don't get me started that would be wrong here but no support me local team middles but yeah when i was a kid following him up and down the country obviously gutted when i got released from the academy but you know there's still my team to this day i mean it's hard work trying to bring up my little boy to be a middlesbrough fan when we live we live there just outside doncaster now so it's gonna it's gonna take some doing that especially at the minute obviously you can't second in the games and get him involved but he uh he'll be getting himself a middlesbrough kit for christmas off of his old man for sure very good now i'm not sure whether you would you could only be a a young lad uh i come from the jurassic era but 91 uh when knots got um promoted into the top flight they beat middlesbrough two-legged semi-final playoff before they went on to beat brighton that was 91 so you would have been what eight or nine could you remember that i think i think um colin todd was the manager he had bernie slaving up from very very close games those two very close yeah i was born 81 so yes that would ten i um i remember colin todd and bruce ryok bernie slam and i don't remember this the game specifically but uh i certainly remember that year and i i i'd be shocked if my dad wasn't there great occasion last time we got up we had neil warnock's manager your lot's got him now you won't be far away this year i'll tell you that much no i like him i like him he seems to be um a rare breed left in the game these days but he's recorded that level's outstanding i think he's you've seen what he's done already that middlesbrough fifth uh we're pretty much the same squad as he had last year i think he's got one or two two or three signings in but freebies you know he's not spending any money it just shows you what you can do if you get on the get on your training ground and you spend some time here players i think i tweet something a little bit i can't stand these managers who see ah it's not my squad don't judge me on these players whatever you think they are because you you manage it you know do your job get the training to work with the players don't pass it off on the book on someone else oh he's he's done that he's put in there uh like it's it's very much the same squad that just survived to relegation illegal last season yeah i'll i like you i always i've liked him i i think he comes across really well he comes across as someone who knows what he's doing and he certainly gets the best out of that group at the minute well he's very much managerial hall of fame in knotts county absolutely um so because you didn't become a pro footballer until you know 20s did you start having to do a trade career following you know what were you up to in your uh teens early 20s yeah i was there i was going to fit in working for a glazing company run by jamie pollock the ex-middle school player and he was because he was manager of um spinning at the time who i was playing for um so he got me in there and i was quite happy you know i got an house played part-time in the decent money playing part-time in a decent wage um just just got me outside and then um and then scarborough coming when i was it i think i've got a whippy bar at this point like i said just done the rounds non league um yeah they coming so you don't you scarborough and your um conference or nationally whatever it's called that's kind of a similar locality how did you end up down at barney because on the face of it it's not an obvious move is it no well i i played for the england seed scene which is basically the england um there's england team in there for the league yeah i i i finished the um the season at york we got got be in the playoffs unfortunately the game walking went off they beat us in the playoffs that's a running thing through my career getting beat in the playoffs but we'll touch on that um and then my contract was up and then i went down and played for them in the uh a little tournament at the end of the season and the manager then was paul faircloth who was managing band at the time and he just an informal conversation would have been interested to say again and uh it got done again it was it was it was the biggest decision uh moving away from home like i said i was i i was at york at the time billy mckeon's manager really really got along with him but you know so it was like no one ever really felt from a football league at 25 i thought if i don't do it i'll always regret it so i'll roll the dice and decide to go for it because culturally i presume it's a big change from yorkshire to north london oh yeah it is it was crazy like i said the first when i was at york and scarborough we had it was always a northeast car school so i'd always travel you know i'd spend maybe one or two nights away from friday night or whatever but i'd always i'd always be back home like i said i love me home i've always been a homer really i always want to get home when i cancel moving away obviously it's a bit harder to when you're buying it just just to pop up the road but it was a big step but like i said i thought it was something i had to do i'd always look back and wonder what if if i didn't take the opportunity how did you take to league football what did you notice the difference or was it something you just really took in your stride because you were playing basically every game from day one weren't you for the next 10 15 years in the football league yeah really like you said luckily enough i took to it really well um i think it was the training um the india was probably the big the biggest aspect of that i remember lee harrison and a few others they told me i was probably the worst trainer but then to be one of the best players on a saturday but that was because i think i was just inconsistent i wasn't used to that being the out training that level um and it took to take some getting used to i mean i wasn't being rubbish on purpose big always get up for the game on saturday because obviously that's what i was that's what i was down there for to play games and you're impressed and like once the adrenaline gets going it's sort of it sort of overrides sinus and everything like is here probably took me monday tuesday to recover um which is my where my train levels weren't so good but eventually i got up to that level and where i wanted to be i suppose at 25 and most people are doing that since 16 17 you know they become acclimatized to it but obviously it did take a bit of getting used to and a bit of homesickness obviously i mean on saturday nights i'd travel home after the game get up at nine o'clock i've less than 24 hours a room and i have nothing to go back down some of the night but it's all it was all about the learning curve and like i said it made me a more rounded better person for it so i think i'm writing something while you're in barnet uh at barnet you had a bit of um reconstructive facial surgery as a result of a clash with one of your soon-to-be teammates at knott's county yeah yeah right he left his mark on you didn't he yeah we just we played with down and down we're in the football league just before christmas and uh the ball's bounced between us and i've gone with my head and he's gone up with his foot um he tells me he's accidental but you know rather she's probably probably meant to do it so and he just he's caught me on the cheek and obviously we talked about on about adrenaline we just i just went down for a bit and crashed but and you know got back on with it and then because it was close to christmas and we were at darling and i think the manager said look have them under off the weekend at home so he finished the game all that and he didn't finish the game yeah i felt a bit sat in the dressing room i thought christ i feel a bit woozy here but i was i was having a week i was going out for a couple of pints on saturday night we made sure we're all back out you know christmas i thought so and i was getting dressed you know i was something mom's my face was just getting bigger and bigger and i was gone and i was just sick i don't think you should be going home you hug your phone i was like yeah you're probably right so i've got the hospital yeah crack jaw um but like again you take the positive it was probably the only christmas i had to own for the last 15 years because obviously i couldn't do anything um i stay in hospital overnight because i was concussed as well and then i had christmas at home but yeah it was it was a it was a right knuckle yeah right crack on the on the jawbone yeah did you have to wire it up then or what did they do was it just rest no it was just rest it was it was clean um there was no need i had to keep going back just for just for scans to make sure it was healing correctly but they didn't want to didn't want to do anything unless they had to so it was just a matter of time which was it was frustrating uh because initially i enjoyed being over christmas but then you know after what you missed one or two games you're desperately back involved in it i i don't think i was back to mid-january late january and i probably should have been back then but i was just i just said oh yes it's spot on it's really good because obviously you know barnett and back then there's all face masks they don't measure out two levels to get to get playing like they do these days um so yeah i'm just a fair bit of football but you know it was just one of them uh ironic things it happened to be ravs okay so two years at barnet under your belt um knotts county come calling how did that come about what happened well i remember we played we played that county down at uh barnett and um we were three nil down at half time i think johnny florida got a chick and we were terrible in this honor i i'm coming at half time and i was launching stuff around the dressing room because we honestly it was so bad for those i completely asked me and i remember come out second half and i just i think stuff like that i always tell you personally as a player you know that if you're getting beat it's embarrassing enough so i just i rolled my sleeves up and just basically ran myself at the ground i remember because of case we if we don't shut out here we're going to be in a world of trouble and i remember coming off the end i just fuming i couldn't clap me we couldn't shake anyone's hand and tommy johnson was with me in the tunnel and he said he said do you like your baseball what you do at the end of the season i'll say somewhere you know what i mean i've flipped the next gun he's going no no i basically want to sign you understand you i went yeah yeah yeah yeah and i've ignored him you know because obviously you've just been big about him end's spinning i thought oh i can't i i'm the world's worst loser i always have been always will be um so i i went up and when i got back in the car and drove before ah christ maybe i should have maybe i could have been you know yeah i calm down you got the shower when you settle down a bit yeah i thought christ that's tommy johnson i should have spoken about it from the legend um but then obviously my needs at the time and chad's ran uh and i met them in the summer because my contractors ran out and it had a bit of interest from other clubs and when they met chaz and sammy and they said one of the big things was obviously we thought we were lucky leaders and obviously during that game they sat in there dressing with halftime three and a half and all looked here was me kicking boom skips around and having arguments with people and bumps and boots off the walls and just just basically losing me and spit me down but uh tommy obviously tommy and chad really liked that he said we need a bit of that in the dressing room we like you as a player but uh and then like you see chad always says oh you didn't want to come you didn't want to come i did i always did i just wanted to make sure it was going to be right hey tommy get along really well with tommy and charlie mcpartlin and drapes all the all the boys to this day real really good always got along with them but yeah it was interesting it didn't come about because i thought ah nah tommy's gonna think i'm alright dick you know what he said but and when i met tommy goes no he said he said that made him want to sign you even more because obviously i wasn't thinking i wasn't thinking about leaving or anyone i was more worried about getting in the dress room and having it out but yeah it was it was funny how we come about so you've signed so how did you complete your deal before there was the sven the monto the whole circus or had there been any whispers or was it completely you didn't know anything about it when you signed no i got we chasm i think charlie had an idea investment was being noted um yeah he spoke about it i'll be honest i don't think he knew how big it was yeah um he mentioned ben davies to me when uh when i signed and when we went to austria pre-season i think me and ben davies had come in ricky really coming so there's already good signings there you know i mean all the good lads there um and then when we're over in austria we're hearing all this bits of pieces coming out um and i remember me i was still avenging me but david's been in the river because obviously at the end of the day you know the waters are called it's just like an ice bath and we had a lad session and we just stood there and dave kevin and charlie come over and uh he said oh don't worry lads i know um we don't want it too sharp but apparently there's uh the whoever what was the chairman at the time i forget his name he said oh someone's going to be announced in the coming days but you wouldn't have had any idea what was being announced like you said it was it was it was surreal actually when you were hearing it all and uh and then obviously hughes i think he was he was the first signing one he didn't speak despite coming and it just took off it was it was surreal actually it's a real all going on i mean for many years it's probably one of the challenges knots have had um they've never they've not recruited well you know recruitment is key to everything um as you all know with your new role at mansfield um but i have to say charlie recruited really really well that year because you know the likes of yourself ravenhill davis even before the munter they are proper quality signings proper quality signage you know clearly hughes is kind of like you know yeah lair on the cake isn't it because of his goal scoring but but we we were signing proper players and you mentioned the phrase earlier leaders all over the park with that squad yeah that's what you wanted that's what he spoke to me about he said he wanted leaders he said they didn't have enough of it he said they were not about footballing team but when pushed on the show you know they get bullied or or when the chips were down they could they couldn't drag themselves out so he identified that um really liked him written personally like i said get along with this day i thought he very good eye for a player i really enjoyed these sessions you know they were good well thought out dave kevin was a really good coach as assistant obviously had tommy there as well and drapes the ex nuts county but i thought it was a good balance and they had they had a really good setup there um i know each of our splits opinion charlie um as to as to if he was a good manager or not but i i can only speak from personally i really enjoyed working for him uh these sessions where i had especially pre-season it was old school running down there down the embankment um some days but it was hard it was our book fair and you i guess i really enjoyed working for him i just wish he maybe could have got a bit longer but i suppose when you look back now with what was happening it was it was sort of only always going to be a matter of time so little got the wrong person in which like you see you look back now and it was always going to happen i i think i think you're probably right now um clearly sven was the game changer in many things sven gave monto an air of credibility or credence you know a lot of middle eastern mystique and all the rest of it so we when you met sven for the first time what did he do did you not believe it until you saw him walking or what what was what was that like it was like you say i've used the word surreal and it was all the way through because you're hearing stuff um you're either in roberto carlos honestly you were at the time when it was like fiona and it was like i don't know what to believe anymore because then would have come in and i remember the game against forest pre-season the crowds the cameras it was ridiculous actually um but sven himself was a very polite demure character he wasn't in your face he was very softly spoken he was very well well-mannered almost shy he was strange um he he didn't seem really overly confident or whether he wanted to just stand in front of a group and you know be the center of attention he'd come in he'd have a word uh i mean his driver bringing him and todd up to the training ground um and they just stay back and watch which again i think charlie was a bit uncomfortable with um because every day the training [ __ ] and it was like i think you'd direct your football he never actually took a sessions fan or got involved on the training ground he was all background um but he was up the training ground and like the same time we're just there in the background all the time you're looking back you probably didn't know you know it didn't know but i think chaz felt the pressure there all the time and you know at times like you see you could see it maybe spill out charlie a bit maybe you know feel it you could see that he was feeling the pressure and i did feel a bit for him um during them times because obviously you can get the reassurance in it like you see it was just about retirement they were they wanted the wrong they want to go on figure head into to run the football side of it as well so sven's a very interesting character he's interesting the adjective views i mean i know i'm a little bit from england and um he he he's like everyone's like grandfather or uncle isn't he you know there's no real edge to him there's no you think what has this man got that makes him a football genius there's nothing that jumps out at you yeah no no i tell you i've got one story but i went out to new york i went for chinese on a saturday after a game and uh i do mean this is a time and we have to get choose this i'm not drinking obviously i'll cheat come down for the weekend so whatever we'll have a bite to eat so i'm just sat there and next thing i knew the waiter comes and wax two bottles of red wine on the table i haven't ordered them there i've got that i said i said we missed this i thought i've been the toilet i said have you heard of them i'm not drinking the car's outside and flipping and i've got a game to he said oh no he's ordered him looked over and spending talked her in the corner let me just give him the thumbs up from over there i went ah oh thanks i'm thinking so you know we've got a game chooser so anyway the weirdest parodies i said oh can i have a look at them show me the menu because i wonder what probably i was just the lad for middles but i don't really understand why that's enjoy your glass now i'll do another club right eight pound bottles each two of them so far that's how we then crack we'll crack on so we did it so we nailed two bottles and then he's gone way over i saw so it was a bar downstairs i forget the name of it now we've gone downstairs and obviously had a bit boxed off so i thought well we'll have that i said well i have to get a taxi on no way i'm driving no come here neil korea so they maybe wouldn't sat with him i mean there was champagne getting part i i was legless i was absolutely legless by about midnight by the time i left because i told you so yeah you'll be okay for tuesday i'll sit in christ i want so i remember luckily enough i don't know what we won on the tuesday and i didn't have a bad game because it's like this gets out chase honestly chancellor put me through the wall but i remember that i mean like you said just that because larry deadly back oh yeah send it across oh my god no that was that that's um that's one of my favorite memories of him like i said but he was he was he was just like you said a jovial laid back nice nice nice man so you've got all these players together you've got sven in the background charlie's the gaffer lots of leaders on the pitch did you think from day one you know this is a fantastic opportunity to to get promoted yeah yeah i did i thought with this squad you look around in the dressing room big characters i mean it's important like you say you don't under overlook the likes of mattie i'm sure was still there uh craig wesk even lou rogers big characters the dressing room was john thompson who was skipper justin was full of him obviously he got mike edwards uh we had a real strong um not going to say he goes because there was no there was none of that there it was it was just a lot of strong characters who who pushed each other along and demanded demanded off each other um so and you did you looked around and you looked at the league at the time and you thought well christ you know and it's out of gauge it is out of gauge during the preseason but coming that last week would like to see it it just seemed like it was snowballing in in a positive way and we were building a hell of a lot of momentum and then obviously you rolled into that bradford game and we absolutely smashed them first game of the season just thought price pool take off you know we should be able we should we should fly from here and then of course as if it's not already enough casper's michael comes in yeah yeah again casper i again obviously mundo i don't think you know wilder streams he would have come for any other reason but yeah casper come in again a great lad um i'd say still get along with casper i still speak to him every now and again um he was he and he was the same for a young lady he was he was vocal and he was he was he was kind of a strong character and wasn't afraid to voice an opinion which obviously with his background you look his dad where his schooling was he'd probably expect that but he'd come in like i say he got involved with it with a crack on the banner with a lad straight away uh again a great he was bloody cool that season a great addition i think you see about five people he's just stuff that stopped me heading for that scene did he uh but like you said then you go through the span of the team you've got him you've got spy you've got those in midfield you've got use your top you're not gonna you won't find better than that in need too you're struggle to find in league one to be honest yeah i mean that we'll come on to that in a minute because that's the interesting point as to where things perhaps didn't quite go as they should have done after promotion um for all the players and like you said i think it was i think people were almost waiting but they were like what sixth seventh in the table you you you didn't win the first six seven eight nine on the bounce did you and that kind of put charlie under a bit of pressure i think you know yeah like you said you were expecting we're expecting just maybe not steamroll but we're expecting to to go on a to just to take off after a bad figure that i think we drew with mackersfield we we drew it and drew too many um and then talking on the telly was the last game wasn't it i think we read twice and we threw it away a couple of injuries i remember i played right back that day but i think after the game sort of charlie knew he was frustrated he was mad he was shocked around the dress room he said you're in monday uh obviously he got the bullet but i think i could say i think when i spoke about the pressure affected him that was that it was evident in that same talk and i think i think he knew it the inevitable was going up and i think he knew really that he was going to be sacked after after that game it was interesting because uh peter trembling who was kind of the chairman and the front man for muntar he said to me he was desperate to get sven in his manager but there was no way sven was going to do it he only ever wanted to be director of football he didn't want to be a frontline manager and so uh was a hands backer who clearly had worked with sven before uh yeah um and so sven could still be the director of football in the background whereas peter was desperate for sven to be managed but that was never going to happen it was never going to happen um and kind of this is when monies started or lack of them started to percolate around didn't they yeah there was rumors um i mean we um i remember once we get upstairs you you're going reception the main obviously in one of the function rooms up there remember coming down one lunchtime i've come down with ben davies i've got me at ben davies we're really really close uh and there's the butcher was there uh kicking off a reception because he hadn't been paid [Music] certain stuff doesn't add up you know and like i say it does it does get going but like i said with the group we had we just sort of laughed about in the dressing room like okay so let's make it put make the most of it this month it'll be your last month paisley but now but stuff to that effect um like i said with it with a group we had we just put it to the back of our minds and cracked on um but there was you certain things weren't adding up i mean we were flying down we flew down a bomber for an fa cup game we're back i said it's just not normal thank you for this it's it's really chill team and then like you see you you hear your private jets or your injects to fight climb privately so if you're cooking and the butcher's not getting paid so it was you could smell a rat somewhere you just weren't sure how it was going out i was going to rear its head and what was going to happen so campbell kind of read the script i think that when we had lee hughes on uh lee's view was that seoul read the script before most people he clearly coming on a massive contract um played the one game at welcome where we got beat what what was so like did you get much chance to interact with him or yeah i can't even see he was he was sound you just i think you put these people on a pedestal you know when you see them on the telly you just put them on a different level but you know well from my experience a lot of them are just normal guys you come in he got on um i think he was i remember his face when he went there welcome his dressing room because it was he all drowned as well i mean he couldn't stand up properly in the dressing room because he was one of those slanted rooms yeah yeah yeah he's like what the hell's going on here the warm up and then we get beat i think you've got and he's on the coach on the way back and we're all tucking into fish and chips and he's like wow what's going on yeah so he was but you know i mean that i think that was just him getting used to that level and what it's like like what it is and then one day we were training and um he'd gone back to the training he'd gone back to the ground early because that then did you get changed at the ground drive up the train and go back to the shelves i think he said someone was he's got a knock or some of them was right he had to go back they don't see the physio side then by the time he got the grounds we finished training going back all his boots had gone he packed up his stuff and he basically got so like i said i think he was out of the curve but i think obviously he was in however i think he got tipped off to be honest i think he knew what was coming uh like you she said he's probably right i think but he probably got wind of what was what was coming before we did and then he obviously spotted sunday so i'm getting out of here before before it all goes belly up so everything starts to unravel i think he became apparent there was no money behind one turn uh i think peter trendy took the club over for one pound but clearly couldn't fund it very well we're coming up to christmas what what was that like as players for you all um it was it was strange and obviously bran knew me i didn't didn't didn't have a clue what would happen um i think we had a meeting there between us pfa rep supporting the pva uh and we just agreed like you said it was it was a good dress we just agreed there's nothing we can do absolutely nothing we can do um so our i'll jump swing football games and get on the pitch and train and and play until we're told otherwise um to what i have to be honest there wasn't a month where we missed we weren't paid there was lots of rumors going around but we always got paid and while we get paid you you get your head down and do your job and that's what we did um like you said we it was a good dressing room we cracked on and pulled each other through we look i don't know what would have happened if we were missed payments and payments were late in the pfa unfortunately he never got that stage but like you said we just we just cracked we disagreed we were all going to crack on until we were told otherwise and that's what we did cruz took over very true and their first decision um was the new manager steve cottrell so uh and i i know steve back from his days at leicester and he's fairly intense as i'm sure you would be aware um but talk about hit the ground running what did did all the lads kind of think you know this you know this is the right man together so well it wasn't as over the line was it but get us moving again because we were what seventh or eighth at that point yeah i think we might have been just outside the playoffs um i do remember we did have a lot of games in hand yes probably why we were in the position we were um because remember saturday he was sadly choosing for a hell of a time and when you look back we only had probably 16 players 17 players oh well we had more but obviously that core group that played the majority of games but it wasn't he wasn't massive like he didn't have the money then to bring anyone in obviously he had that group and it might be less actually when you look at it he was probably the same starting 11 for the majority of them games just we just went sacked to choose us at the chooser and like he's intense and for that burst of time it was probably what we needed um he'd come in he said i don't want promotion i wanted a league that's that with this group of players you should be ashamed of yourselves for your league position yeah oh yeah he just he didn't he didn't beat ronda bush and like i said there's some likes of using there and that i can see he's probably he's probably what we needed i can see he takes he takes a big strong character to come in and stand in front of a group medical you're a disgrace but it might not be a disgrace but we certainly should have been higher than what we were now agreeing with him i thought i'm having this guy straight away i thought brilliant yeah he's going to be exactly what we need he's not going to take second best he's he and he's right that group should have won that league and unfortunately he drove us towards it and like you see we've got that momentum back i think eighteen games we lost one um and it was a fantastic run and like i said i loved i loved working under steve the demands he put on you every day uh i enjoyed pushing myself pushing myself and pushing others under him and like i see he was he was definitely the right man at the right time but probably those three four months will be what the the most successful of your career in terms of winning matches and ended up winning the title yeah yeah i loved it loved it and he knew what and he knew what to do with us like you said there's some days we've been sat there when we got that running saturday tuesday i remember and it was he was tiring at the time because like you said we're playing just about every game then one day we all just come in to go well just get your trainers on we walk down the embankment big and booty shop the top we'd be such a big boys and walk all the way back and then the lads who hadn't played do a bit of training the lads who went play that just you know just basically do a jog a little round or keyboard and that'll be it and he got that balance right between you know being between you know punishing and pushing and pushing but then coming off it when the time was right and save the legs because it was all about the match it was all about games then you know you're on the run in there it's all about it's all about promotion um and he he got that fantastically right uh and i guess i enjoyed these sessions were hard they were intense like say you know him you know he worked he's one standard he's big on standards day and day out i'd like to say i loved it i really enjoyed it i thought he got the best out of me and that group and like i said we just we just took off and i think the only game we lost was was at port hill um but by then we pushed ourselves into a really strong position anyway i think we'd come off the was it off in the back of that rochester game yeah rochdale tonight which was massive emotionally physically draining and i think it just caught up it was a portable massive picture maybe it was a red hot day i think it just it just caught it what does that do but you know we've done enough by then thankfully to to kick us on what was the promotion championship parties like oh it was it was good i remember we had we had a few because i remember we had a couple we had one where we obviously we we um we would get we were guaranteed top three when that come in and then we have one when we uh got promoted and then obviously the last one was talking away and i remember we went on the bus and we stopped obviously to load up with a load of booze and uh i've just got some cans and i'm up to tell them and they get to be very gaffish come in steven but obviously don't really allocate to them but there's a few lads obviously everyone else was down there she goes wait there because i'll i'll get something for me and i'll come back are you sure gaff i said no no no i'll get him [ __ ] by the time he gets back to the till all the lads are back there still fun it must have cost him hundreds honestly he should have been his he thought he was buying me like 20 guns or whatever and he would come back usually put bottles of jack daniels on there that was all started and they didn't just [ __ ] it up on the court so he's got to go home perfect he's got on the agenda you bastard you're sleeping right he said look here you deserve it knock yourselves out and it was brilliant like you're saying that music was gone he was he gathered actually relaxed he come and sat with us um lads were flipping shot and fooled at each other he was just brilliant like you said by the time he got off there was t-shirts ripped it was flipping it was it was some trip but i remember the conversations we had like he come up and he'd say look if i can't get three or four players for next season all good players we'll go again you know we'll we'll kick on with this group he said i'll get this group group he said i support the chairman i don't know if i'm going to get what i want he said but i've identified two three maybe four players will come in to start you know not scroll players to start he said that's all i want and we'll if i get that we'll go and you know you're coming back i thought okay we're under somewhere you're running something really good that's a very interesting because i've not heard that bit before i'm not i want to get steve on here we've not got him yet um because there was a huge debate as to whether steve had just come in on a very short term agreement uh put himself back in the shop window and get another job elsewhere because obviously he's a bristol boy isn't he down that way um or was it was there a real chance he would have signed a longer-term contract i mean what what what was what's your take on it i think he'd come in originally to to just do a job i thought he looked at that gesture and looked at that squad thought i can get these promoted it gets me a point over he gets me a promotion it gets me in the shop window um but i mean if you're getting money might say something i think he like does he like this as a group i think you like the personality in the group i think you like working with us um and i think he got invested emotionally i think he wanted to stay i honestly do but i think he wanted to stay on it on his terms with regards to a budget what he could bring in what he could do with us because i think they say intense is a great way to describe him i don't think he come in if he thought we're going to be mid-table next season and just and just be happy to survive and then we'll kick on he wanted to he wanted to go again and with that core group i think we we could have done he he'd like to say he i i i support length on the way back um he hits a long journey from turkey he said look he said i thought he he obviously did his own work he knew what players he wanted to come in i think he made initial contact with some of them i'd like to say these wearing squad players he goes look we've got the base but with three or four i think we can go again um and he was you know he was for it and then the longer it went she sort of he felt he wasn't going to happen which which i was going to be honest i was i was good because i thought he could have he could have really kicked us on very interesting and and if your take on it is correct and sounds to me like it is then that's probably the single most expensive mistake rachel has made that's the single biggest mistake he has made when you get a good manager you keep them yeah because it always costs you more to replace them it always does you know i don't i won't give you this it won't give you that budget then move on it costs you more because then you have to rip things up do this bring this and it costs you more it costs you more if you know if it was a case of budget no then you know you know reyes rey has been quoted and he quotes various figures to be fair he's you know i've seen figures of 20 million pounds that it's cost him uh it would certainly have cost him north of 10. he he would have saved an awful lot of money by keeping steve cottrell as manager giving him more money and giving him a bigger playing budget because there was a great chance we could have gone another promotion great chance with that in my opinion with that group with steve cottrell in charge yeah you look at it and i can say i think i mentioned it early on you know you get a fantasy chance in league one with that group um and and steve obviously knows his stuff he's being around and i said already identified players what he wanted to bring in which he thought he would have kicked on he didn't want to make wholesale changes he just wanted to add it really um yeah again look i don't know about finances i don't get him involved i don't want to know um i know ray true fair play we put a lot of money in but if you look at the cycle they went through after that we managed to start and play a turnover you can in hindsight it's located 2020 and i certainly don't want to come in here and criticize anyone unnecessarily but you're writing what you're saying um i'm sure you'd probably do it differently if you speak to him now um but he was more certainly the right man at the right time and because i remember the uh the end of the year awards do um rio was saying look we're trying everything we can to keep him and steve was saying oh yeah if he's right i'll stay you know the column was interviewing on the stage and that and it just like you see you thought it might happen i want it after all the lads wanted to happen um and it never did and like i said he's maybe not with regret but certainly somebody i'll look back on him and just if if we'd have had one more season under him what we could have achieved yeah if if but some maybes i know so the club have gone for craig shaw uh and and clearly part of the philosophy there was that the old knotts county boot room you know you've got drapes around there you've got uh tommy there dave kevin and you're bringing craig shaw for first cracker managership although he didn't really get very long and reyes subsequently admitted that was a major mistake not to have given him more games um what what do you think happened in that season where do you think momentum was lost i mean is it down to one thing or just a combination of things yeah it was i i'd love to put my finger on it obviously we didn't start well um craig come in he had some new ideas i think he'd be working in hungary um obviously big strat and loud he was he was probably a bit more softly spoken than what than what you'd think um more thoughtful about things and than what you think you're looking into a big center half big powerful guy he'd be in faces and and that but he wasn't um he was more softly spoken very calm um and again i read out from where he's played you know me i was i was i was excited to work under him played at the top level um great pedigree um and we i think remember blue played stuff he said we look really we look good at times in pre-season that yeah um maybe the team from last season obviously casper left and things up to happen to balance the box yes um that that was a given but you know maybe we could have like you see rather than breaking up that team too much i'd i'd basically gone off steve's ideas just add a couple to towards it but um we didn't start well and like i said we struggled for the majority of that season we got into that cycle as well didn't we of the of the managerial merry-go-round yeah um so paulince for a short time um i think it's fair to say when lee was on probably wasn't what wasn't top of the charts but i think when we've spoken before you you gotta go down got on okay with paul didn't you yeah i like paul legacy everyone will have different opinions on players and managers but again i just look at what he done as a player um i was just buzzing to work with him obviously he was in midfielder i was in midfield i'm just delighted to work under someone like that who's played at some of the best uh clubs in the world and and captain his country so look i like i i i liked him i can see why he was dawned you know i can see from both sides um he can come across as his arrogant i don't think he is i just think he's confident i think that's his way i don't see him as an arrogant man lucky where he's played he's he's probably got every right to be confident but um i i thought he done well in mattersfield he'd done well at mk don's and i thought he would have been a good appointment but again we hit um we had a bit of a rough patch under him and he obviously the chairman at the time wasn't uh wasn't into giving managers um very long to turn it around so he was another one who went by the wayside unfortunately we had the fa cup run though didn't we yeah fantastic yeah and like i said well i'll probably talk about the man city one but everyone everyone's asked me about that but for me like that yellow [ __ ] in the background it was a sunland sun underway obviously me being a big buddha fan i had there was probably not as many seasiders in the way and that they are the nuts fans um and it was that that's probably one of my best memories to be honest not just that not but me all career going up there in turn and then turning their machines over it was it was a great day like i said uzi brilliant we were really good that day we were well we were fantastic that they thoroughly deserved the win i've forgotten sunderland yeah remember up there on the saturday afternoon wasn't it yeah yeah yeah i remember it now remember again yeah yeah brilliant two two one two little there got one back to one and we held on rightfully so because we've done really well you seem outstanding as well like the amount of friends and family out there to be a big quarter fan it was a legacy it's it's definitely up there with one of my best memories okay so then we get manchester city and you couldn't really you've got a plumber draw than that with all of their names uh i think roberto mancini was in charge there uh and kind of he played the full team virtually didn't remember it wasn't like they put put 11 of the shadow squad out they had the full team um and again there's a lot of ifs but some maybes here but you get the first goal yeah it was just the day itself was just outstanding you know sell out i remember the tunnel and that before the game the amount of backroom staff they have it was almost you know you couldn't move in the tunnel it was ridiculous honestly you couldn't you couldn't you couldn't work out you couldn't give jobs to the amount of people that are in that tunnel with man city attracted to that crazy and then just getting on the pitch and you see and then that's obviously the team sheets come in and you think oh well i've got they've gone big here would you be better than i'd say the respect it doesn't put a full team out um and i remember the goal of the chat well yeah i remember i would think remember the gaffer inc he said basically i think i was maybe going around the back course at that point i don't know why i was around the front post just probably not listening to getting done because it's just he's had to do my own thing and i don't even know if he was a good corner under hit corner or what but i've just i've got there and like you see it was almost a dream to see a drop in um just just again another surreal moment it was just a fantastic fantastic feeling again one of the problems i'll never forget and it's just thanks it's just a shame we couldn't hold on because and nelson nelly made some good saves but we more than matching for the majority of that game yeah i mean i'll always remember uh aside from your goal uh because edwin jekyll couldn't score could he he he got a lot of money he couldn't score and then and and christian pierce wasn't it center half he'd just give him a yard didn't he when that cross came in yeah he just slipped or he just gave jekyll and he just got that yard drop on him to get the goal hadn't he because there was a great chance we could have held down there great otherwise there wasn't nothing after that i think you may have had a chance after that um because it wasn't if we're they conceded then we were back to the wall i think i think usually i have decent chance after that and like you see we gave it give a very good camera ourselves out there it's just it's just a shame because like you see with the team they head out and it would have been one of the biggest biggest upsets ever and obviously it was live on itv um before i've seen so many messages and calls after the game so it was i was just fortunate enough to get the goal but the lads from everyone involved that they had done theirselves massive credit and like i said it is just a shame it just shows you the difference between that level and that level it can be done if they drop a couple of percent re-raise hours for one day for one game for 190 minutes you can bring jackal did you swap shirts after the game whose shirt did you get i got here i didn't have to the first one because um no because the gate i was i was a man of the match that day but they gave me on the telly there was there was people who played better than me that day um i'm quite happy to admit that but obviously because i got the goal of the game here so they grabbed me straight away and i had to go in the tunnel and do gutly one and done an interview and by the time i got back the dressing room everyone had gone um but i couldn't get one well i was quite a repeat mine for that day anyway uh i said it i said james i'm keeping this you know i've got i'll get a four off he said yeah this ticket and i got gareth barry's from the away game um when we obviously went there for the replay so i got a memento from it uh but like i was more when i thought about it i thought i didn't i'd rather keep your own shirt actually because obviously somebody's sure might let them when i'm older i like to say i got one of them we've got gareth barry's um when we went up there so it all worked out very good um so back in the league it's a bit uphill down down a bit probably a bit more down um and then and one manager no one's ever gonna forget and i love martin today so martin allen comes in so now you've been around playing non-league and everything i mean what was martin like for you he was again i liked it i every single one of them whether i liked them or not you know i cut along with them all and i remember his first game was jorvil and he hadn't had any time because he stopped us for the services and made us get off the court and we were doing set plays in the services catback with a physio was a goal pause an imaginary football and everyone's going what the hell's going on because you hear the stories about martin jones from other clubs and people texting your eye this happened the other and then he come on the coach and then he mean he dragged me and using the front he goes right here which one he wants is where the armband around uh captains are you two two leaders i said oh you could give it uzi obviously you could get i said give it up doesn't really bother me right yeah um and then that was at that time he just done things a bit differently um he'd always have his dog with him just charging from the training [ __ ] in the end but he was um i liked him there's there's definitely a method in his madness yeah i mean i i i i love martin i mean i i i really do and i thought he was quite i thought he was a good fit for knots because knots kind of need steve cotto knox is a club that needs a strong character who can imbibe all their sort of virtues and physicalities and and and be strong take you know neil warner take the club with with them as a big personality it's a big personality um and he got it down to the last game against brighton wasn't it where you needed to stay up yeah um we did i think we were i think we were not mathematically safe i think he would have took some strangers old staggering would have to be about eight nil that'd be a big goal swing um but yeah he got he got us in there um and i remember i remember the dates i've read i think brighton had won the league um so they wrote for a party and we remember going wild at our time i think he was throwing chairs around the dress room and he he was kicking right off but i think he knew would be okay because i think daddy the results were going for us at half time so even at half time i think he'd even got more in our favor i think that'd be like a 15 goal swing so he knew he was just making a point um but he did what he had to do and then obviously we went in and this i support them brought some bees in the dressing room went up but i wasn't really comfortable they took us up on the um where the ball sitting there on the front yeah because on the pitch and i think i'm not sure we want to be celebrating finishing fifth bottom because i didn't want to do it i said look after i'm not going up there i said we'll celebrate finishing fifth bottom to be honest and he was like no [ __ ] look you're a big part of what you don't go out there and let them clap you they want to clap you i said yeah it doesn't just doesn't seem right enough because i don't i needed a hernia grime was a terrible shape about the last three months i need an operation uh and when he come in it was basically just just get me through just get me through games and i didn't want it i said look i'll i'll get through the end of the season i said i'm not i don't want to get you know i just again bob losing i thought i'm not getting really here can get really good i'm not having this so i'll just go for gafford um because you'll see was saying but he's not right like he can't believe martin so i remember the first time uh i got my scan and it was i've ripped my stomach line and it was on me right side as well so it was me kicking my left leg for standing on so it was me right side i remember martin like you guys keep coming for one [ __ ] um don't train this week coming for one o'clock on saturday and uh we'll do a fitness test and it was him in his suits with the ball and loose army right now coming they said you don't need i said i don't know i've got my boots and said no get out here now and he should have bothered me in the corridor and i just like reacted and kicked it back to him you know as you do because you just like reflex you don't like your feet get back in the dressing room sit there the rest of the lads come in and that was it that was it it goes you're doing it to the end of the season he goes you don't have to trade any days but yeah i'm gonna need you for the games that's fair enough yeah i'm happy to do that and i might i just ticked over just like bikes during the week kept off it the doorstep on painkillers every flipping friday saturday uh and then um and then like i said go through it but i was happy to do it i wanted to do it you know he never forced me i wanted to do it for him and i didn't want a relegation on my cv so i was more than happy to do it i guess one game uh that's synonymous with martin um was the league cup against forrest yeah uh which was a great night uh you know seemed like all of nottingham was in the city ground that night great event we should have won wes morgan's scored a worldly yeah and then it goes to the penalty shootout i think all the people to miss penalties i don't know i know well to be honest i didn't think i'd get a chance to take mine because when hughes he was setting up stepping up he was huge to win it it was sort of like wrote for him and you thought he's not going to miss this um and then when he's missed it and it's just you can hear the cheers and it's just like oh oh like christ and i think that like sort of knocked us a bit to be honest because you're just expecting usey to go up and and and like you said just wrap it in win it and what we deserve i mean we we were better you know better than him on the night we passed we outplayed him we are passed them we ran them the energy from the end was ridiculous it was it was non-stop it was like he was dragging us through and like you see your throw was more than 100 balls and he never hit that top corner again it was it was just one of them things and then to be fair the lads have dug in they've talked in and flipping but i don't know like i said then my penalty was just to be honest i was absolutely exhausted i was lucky to get up to the thing i was getting cramped because by the last five minutes i've got up there and like i said i've just tried to hit it as hard as i can in towards the roof of the net i just thought i'm gonna try and lift it and obviously technique was well [ __ ] technique i got i was knackered it just flipping i think he's probably still traveling ah it was it was there it was it wasn't meant to be that night there was so many things that happened like i said that was morning would be using thing it was just even that mcgoogan free kick was it was an absolute world you like to see everything the it seemed to go in that night but yeah there's no one who can watch that game say we didn't deserve that yeah such a shame because the lads put everything in it for the support it's behind the call it was outstanding the best the best i've ever known to be honest and i can see the energy they were giving us on the pitch was just fantastic so it wasn't that long before we have another manager um and keith curl his results were actually very good you know i think he put together the long the club's record unbeaten run away from home something like that he added it all up but it was kind of the home form i think that did for him ultimately when you looked at it but results wise and and there was the big run to the edge of the playoffs wasn't it yeah well we missed out on on on goal difference at that that year when he come in we remember some goal difference i think we were home in the last of the season it was the berry game that did us do you remember when it was a very game the beaders yeah yeah with nothing to play for and they've absolutely turned us over that did for us um and then but when he got sucked i don't think we were too far outside the playoffs i think we'll certainly top 10 maybe 11. i mean correct me if i'm wrong but we weren't far away but as things seemed to happen things had deteriorated with his relationship with um with the chairman like i say it was i think when he went i think that sort of that was me made my mind up that that was that was probably going to be me the end of that season as well i was going to come on to that and we've had various questions as well the the the manner of lee's departure was paul yeah the the whole 919 which he's talking to us at length about um did that so one or two seeds of doubt in your mind as one of the senior pros i mean been there with lee for for this period yeah it did because i i loved uzi uh he was fantastic for us whatever you might think about him he's he's great in the dressing room fantastic around the lads and you see that up and you think it's not right and you don't like to see it happen to someone you get along with so well um so it was and it was just it was did you seem to be a never-ending segment you manage a new player start again challenging you manage new players let's go again and like i say i think i've been there i was probably last man standing now and enough from that championship team um i kind of gave more like i said played injuries illness like say people didn't know about because you don't want to put out there i played when i was like you said i think to be honest i think playing without hernia i mean i remember i went for the operation again that season and uh the physio had left and i got no aftercare and i was i've missed a lot of that pre-season going into it um the first one under martin allen's first one i missed i missed a lot of time i wasn't right i wasn't ready for ages i was getting paid to be stumbling and shooting pins from me grinds and i think that come from put for playing so long with like the ripping there because then other muscles were compensated for it around the groin area and it really knocked me actually that really put me back a bit and i did struggle to get over that and then like you see you come back and you see maybe didn't get i don't know i don't know it just seemed it just seemed like it coming it was coming to a natural end that season um and like you see it was yeah i suppose it did saw so a bit of seed in my mind but i'd sort of so even though i had a year left um obviously i it felt at that age i didn't have time for another rebuilding program a new manager new players coming in bla dubai where i think i didn't think we were far away to keep i think one or two changes obviously uh but i didn't think we were far away i didn't think we needed to start again i didn't think we needed to to sack him so so so what actually um led to you to lead to your departure we've got a few questions from fans here so this this is one that several people have asked this this was from rob rob davis um you know what what was it led to you why did you leave your contracts early because you've already mentioned that you still had a year to run didn't you yeah if that was it i think obviously at that time chris had come in um and we drifted off and we were just finishing off so i spoke to jim roger i just said look because there was there were rumors of him cutting the budget and chris was coming in and we're going to try and bring through younger players or sign younger players and this and that i'd had a bit of interest from from decent side good good clubs in in league one and obviously and obviously blackpool was mentioned then i just said look i don't know if i've got time to to to hang around for another rebuilding job um i just went to him and spoke to him because i didn't want to do it behind my back i didn't want the agent to do it i thought look i'm just telling how i feel um i just said look obviously i was on a relatively big wage at that point for that club i just said look if there's any way we can we can work out something because these clubs wanted me but obviously because of my age probably the type of person i position a player um like i said i'll do myself down we sort of tend to penny you know defensive midfielders these comes wanting to take me but obviously they weren't going to pay a fee for me um so i said look i've got good opportunities it's probably going to be one last chance to kick on or at that age well i thought i played a lot longer than i thought i was going to do but oh yeah i've got i've got a real opportunity to teams will be challenging to the top of league one next season or even if blackpool comes off to play the championship at my age it'll be it'll be you know again someone i won't get that opportunity to do unless obviously we get promoted which i couldn't see that happening um because again they're cutting the budget and trying to bring through chris kawami a rookie manager um and they were bringing him sort of trying to lower the age of the squad so i kept speeding on the end of the season and we just agreed that you know i wasn't obviously with the left i just come up and sign a mutual termination and that and that be it they didn't want to let me go to start with jim just said look i know you're frustrated i know this isn't your but i have a couple there's a month left to the end of the season or whatever take time just keep speaking to us there's anything we can do for you um because you haven't seen yourself you're around the place we can see but and if yourself if you still feel the same in three or four weeks and then we'll do it for you and to be fair really stuck to his word that's interesting because i think the words from some other questions there was there was some sort of like conspiracy theories abounding where you were almost forced out but it was kind of you thought that that not sort of run its natural term and it was it was you as much as anyone trying to be honest with the club and saying i think it's time for a new challenge for me yeah i loved it there i mean don't get me wrong it's not this is what i just think that our my performances weren't as as as where i wanted him to be um obviously chris cowan could come in i wasn't personally sure about him as a manager that he was going to get the best out of me as a player and it's just four years i just don't thought i need a first challenge like you see i wish it worked out differently and not to me really wish well we've already covered it if certain things had worked differently and i wish i'd still been there now like i said i love today i love living in the city uh my son was born there so it was it was not as off so i've had enough now you you've done you know what i mean dumping the club in it was nothing like that it's just for the at the time it just seemed like the the best for both parties um i'd like to say i i did i approached him um because i wanted to be honest i didn't want to get to the end of the season spit my dummy i'll get my agent and phone up to say look he wants to be released none of that look if they if they told me i had they told me that they were going to make me still they would have asked for a transfer fee then fair i wouldn't say not the last year my contract cracked on it would have been that but i could see i think obviously they could see i wasn't happy my performances were good weren't good enough and for me for that for what i expected for myself and like you see it just seemed like you running a natural course very honest very honest um and i guess by your own admission you know you you've played after leaving knots for many many more years i mean you went to the championship in blackpool you know you you were were you club captain at schoonthorpe you did very well at scunthorpe um see although you didn't come into the game football league-wise still 25-26 i mean you've been playing and obviously will come on to mansfield as well you were you what 38 when you retired 38-39 39 yeah yeah 38-39 um yeah after that went to blackpool on the short deal obviously carlos is a strange guy but you know three months uh uh yeah chief of united and a few other ones in league one who wanted to take me but i just thought it's a championship look after three months or whatever it doesn't work yeah um then i'll i'll take my chances of finding another club i thought look back myself i thought i'll just go away i'll get myself into the best physical shape and i'll go and then luckily enough it worked um i was playing right back i was playing midfield and we we were flying i think that it was the best ever start um blackpool have had a season at any level and then so obviously at the end of the season um things went wrong and she got sacked obviously the chairman there you know didn't need me to sit here and see how difficult one was basically pulled several one players back in january uh moved down the papers survived um and then obviously at the end of that season um he released everyone and he offered four five was new deals um and i was one of them but i was aware of scumbags interest in league one and they were offering me basically a three-year deal blackpool again earlier for me a one-year deal you could see what was going on with blackpool you know it didn't take as a rocket scientist to work out what was happening they didn't have a manager the chairman they had four players they brought in a foreign guy but they say it was chairman who's offering the money and i just you wouldn't have had a fighting chance to survive which obviously i think they got relegated by martial able that season you knew what was coming and it was it was a big decision because obviously you work on your career you get you get to play at that level but then to walk away from it it was hard but it wasn't hard um because obviously scumbo was coming through being very ambitious and i just thought that that's going to be best for me and obviously i had my little boy at that time it's going to be best for me going forward there's more security for that decent teams come thought once and they went you know with the owner there um they went for it didn't they good players and i remember watching uh there's so many games of football you can watch on the telly but i remember watching the playoff game you were playing millwall yeah yeah yeah that's uh and and mill was called right at the death or got a couple at the end or something i just remember getting there and then stalling wasn't it yeah i mean we should have got automatic promotion we we were up there all season it the bad patch in january and didn't recover quick enough got the playoffs went down the middle wall and got a nail mill which i think great results even scored first one they look at home and then we were three one down before you know it and then i think we got one back and then it was like the alamo last few minutes and then and then we missed out so yeah that was that was devastating actually absolutely devastating because um not only did we not get away with to miss our promotion we didn't even get the chance to go too good to get the player fan at wembley and then obviously the season after pretty similar story um copy off rather than the playoff semi-finals and like i said i think well i went to the mansfield after that i'm going to be in the playoffs that three years three years three players semi-final defeats uh not a wedding trip but um no i've again had four years it's gone up really enjoyed my time there really really again uh probably not probably one of the well the joint probably most uh time where i've enjoyed my football most you're kind of um may well be to you with your upbringing and not coming into the league till later but you're kind of one of those throwbacks because you know sports scientists are bound now in football don't they and everyone's checked to the nth degree as to whether they can play you hurt you hear all these phrases don't you about minutes in legs and all of this you know you never heard it 20 years ago and i appreciate science moves on but if you look through your stats and you've admitted yourself you've not always been fully fit you know every season the number of appearances you make it begins with a ford at 43 46 42 45 you know you know warrior type mentality i just want to play i just love playing that's what that's what you do i've never i don't i don't want any time the physio rooms i don't like missing training i don't like missing games and i can say unfortunate touch would i never apart from a couple of hernia operations i never had any major injuries like i just i just i just love playing love love the competition love the challenge every saturday i love getting abused from the stands every saturday but you know yeah i i always pride in that competition and that's what spurred me on i don't i hated being injured i was i was over when i was injured i was i was the right movie songs i was awful to be around if i see him losing games i just i just said just love playing i don't think i don't if that's a throwback but i was i suppose built for curability he sees some players and and that probably that highly tuned that you know they need to be at the peak to perform i was never like that i could just i could i was ready to go on like you just i did not parachute my live roof and send me out and play um and crack on and like say i've been fortunate i've been really fortunate that i've not had any injuries and i've managed to play the majority games every season i've been a professional um likes i love playing and i can say i do i do put pressure on myself to be fit and to be available for as often as it could be even like i said 38 39 um doing every day pre-season the managers of company going you can miss issues and no well i think it takes it sort of takes away the excuse if i can do these runs at 38 39 and then everyone else can do them so i just i just love being on the job so i love being on the training ground i love the competition so so you the the the the curtain closed on your career um at manchester united a few questions uh um so paul smith has said um did you ever think twice about playing for mansfield given your knots connections uh and andy whitley has said and it's kind of allied to this um were you ever close to returning to knotts as a player for a second time yeah well then for the first one no not really because the only times manchester united we were looking at forest when i was at north carolina rivals not mansfield and that's not denigrating anyone at the time but we played mansfield preseason once and that was that was all i knew about them to be honest like i said we were we we were looking up to be honest uh i'm working for mansfield's have to be careful i'm not i'm not running them down it's just at the time both clubs are at different levels um that's not that's not what i'd say that's not being disrespectful that we were looking to catch foreign look at mansfield's rivals i always thought it was nuts and forest and then it was mansfield and chesterfield i thought that was like the local time he's on there um yeah but then that's absolutely right yeah absolutely i couldn't agree more it's a it's a modern phenomenon i grew up you know when knots were a top flight team and it was not some forest yeah absolutely so i i always struggle with it a bit to be honest and clearly now we have to be honest and uh mansfield a good level above knots you know a good level of knots would you say um what about the andy's question about we ever close to returning to knots as a player were there any opportunities it was yeah i had a couple of calls um but nothing really came majorly i was i would never go back i don't think um like you said i i've got that many fun memories of my first spell there and then when john showed him was there there was there was a few bits of pieces but apart from that there was there was nothing look out i enjoyed my time there um and i wouldn't rule out coming back further down the line no i wouldn't have my coaching but as a player i just it wouldn't have seemed right from my point of view anyway legacy i wanted i wanted to to leave that way it was packed um not really like saying that tainting i suppose happy memories while i was there so at the minute being right bang up today you are employed by mansfield now yeah i'm doing the um the college uh elite development program where they it's just the one below the academy the to go to college um three or four times a week in the train of those mornings and playing the national youth alliance league um which is like you see it's it's probably it's just below the 18s probably on the system that the pyramidal that they go up just below the actual full-time ride yes as we try and bring them through here and the good ones we get we can feed them into the yds's and and go full time there but we would like to say we uh to go off our recommendation for that but it's it's like you see it's rock bottom from the coaching ladder but i've got my badges i've got my air license um i'm going to do my pro license soon but actually i was on the grass coach and i was very very inexperienced because obviously when i was a player i just wanted to commit everything i played especially the older you get you need to get your rest in you want i didn't want to be like unfair to mansfield but i was out coaching thursday fridays and then turn up like sat there tired for the games i thought no i'm employed as a footballer i'll do it so a lot of my badges are packed i basically parked it so um but i'm in now uh i'm loving it i absolutely love coaching love working with the lads every day um i like to say i think for me it was the right time to retire uh especially what's going on at the middle of the wheel in the world but i'm absolutely loving it honestly i really i really enjoy it and i'm ambitious i'm not gonna lie i'm ambitious i've had to start at the bottom of the power but i don't see myself staying there for long i want i want to crack on i want to get into men's football um i want to get to the first team level i know i've got to save my apprenticeship but i want to fight through it like i say i've started starting a good time just below 40. i've got lord hopefully loads of coaching years left in me and some i'm really ambitious and so i want to crack on with we wish you every success with the coaching you've not quite given up on playing yet though have you yes they'll try and kick up all the rounds uh well i can because obviously our games are played on wednesday afternoon so i've been turning up for scarborough this season in the northern premier league and like you see that's that's more just for the crack with the lads and um just shakes it he gets me out the outside of the weekend though sakta soon they're off i can't go watch a football match in the current climate so it's a lot i still enjoy it i retired obviously from playing professional football but um you look i i love the game again it's just i love i love challenging myself i love love the competition of a football game and you know while i'm fit and able to do it i'm going to continue at whatever level um quick few random questions that i've not asked um from pythagorean um we should have mentioned it but we've not uh members of turin i mean hughsy tells some great stories about swapping shirts with pirlo and you know i think we all thought didn't we that when we saw that sort of pre-match uh entertainment they laid on which was just out of this world unbelievable different world yeah uh i could tell you every [ __ ] cuz again i've been lucky i've been so lucky i was i was lucky enough to be captain that night so obviously we went out and doing the presentation the shirt swap and i was calling off and again like you said we'll just you just chalk and go oh you're having a nice chip and no christ what's going on here um and then obviously we've got the tunnel and he said oh you want shirt and then he took my he actually took my hand and he gave me his and i thought something i didn't tell any of the lads i put me warm up top and i thought if someone will have this away um see i've got this i just put that in my bag and i've got it framed i don't think it's in the adage it's not it's got del piero's shirt top man yeah from that night yeah so i mean that's that's incredible to have his shirt from from the first night of the stadium was just obviously the privates yeah i've been using we've got the private chat out there five-star hotel it was just it was absolutely surreal i remember matt and i'll bring me up and asking me about he's going he again he won't be saying our [ __ ] well we've got we can go to the event it's on a thursday but because we play once all the saturday we're thinking about saying no we i'm not sure we can swing it and what do you think i was like because i know what he's like i didn't know what to say just went back he took he's not really up any gaffer obviously i might be either whatever and he just started bursting his space out laughing down the phone he's going to cause we're going you're an idiot and then uh but yeah we see it was ridiculous obviously clem come with us from football focus he traveled with us uh i met ravenelli over there he was coaching their academy obviously forbids your legend middlesbrough loved him got me picture taken with him i was like a fanboy jumped off the coach i can't give you a picture can you picture and i said middlesbrough his english was a very good boy he understand the butter right it was just it was unbelievable it was it was fantastic got a train on there on there on juventus training ground obviously the day before the afternoon before camera which it was but just some of you don't you you you don't think you'll ever get not at least two leveling just something i'll always be grateful for and like i said it's a memory i've got the dvd never watched it never watched the dvd weirdly enough but i've got i've got it um like i said it's memories you love them forever and for me to tell my son it's obviously i'm so just so grateful for now what i was there wonderful unbelievable night and made all the more special because of the way juventus did it properly because we weren't quite sure what to expect were you eternal 90-minute executive name a few players here or you know but it was a full house that the people that did the pre-match entertainment they did the turin winter olympics i spoke to juventus cost them over two hundred thousand pounds that presentation you know what on the pitch with those animatron zebras at the time and i was checking the videos on it and obviously i've kept that obviously have kept all i need to get it put on the worm some type of disc or what i don't know what to do now on the hard drive like you see you'll never you never experience anything like that again for us it was it was once in a lifetime no top draw um what i'd forgotten about uh daryl uh with some uh hyperglyphics for his twitter handle did you really mean to score with your backside against charlton oh no absolutely not i think i was even facing the wrong way someone's with the free kick in and it just hit me yeah i mean again one in a million shots just he tipped me and got in well i think we won one there last night so yeah it was it was a strange one certainly one of the more strangest goals i've ever scored um rob davis again um who would who would have been your most underrated teammate at knots um well there was a few obviously i think mike edwards um when i was there even someone like ricky ricky ravenel um i think luke rogers done a lot of the donkey work done a lot of the leg work for hughes um it's out of the top me head but yeah going off the championship season i'd probably go for i'd probably go for them three um we had a few um obviously like to hughes he been dave he's got even spike to a certain degree we've got all the headlines but they were the ones you know that the base the base for these lads to go and play and go and do the things while you're just remembering all your teammates we ask each one to name um each guest to name their best uh five six site team um from the players that they played with at knots so if you think of all the players you were there at knots four years pick your five aside team that can't include you so goalkeeper i'd have to be casper yeah got to be passed but i'll have to stick him in um well we got two defenders you have to put solid how can you leave out campbell um god you know it's hard because when i look back there must have been hundreds i guess we talked about turnover management lazy it was ridiculous actually for four years even the turnover players was yeah was ridiculous um five a side five-sided defender uh uh we're putting chief in oh my god i'll get along really well with chief at mansfield he was he was a really good football you know top five aside maybe not 11 aside but certainly father said he was good with his feet and on the training ground um two midfielders ben davies obviously been technically unbelievably ben again one of my good mates i i really got along with um who else would go for obviously i put using up front of it could you no i beat me so put him in there and one more um probably judgey allen judge five sides felon judge yeah technically brilliant judgey little five side player diminutive you know low center of gravity uh definitely probably there that's not a bad team um one last question you've kind of answered this in a way or you're gonna you've answered it as much as you're gonna i would suggest giving you currently at mansfield uh kyle i think it's watson uh would [ __ ] put his hat in the ring if the knots job became available in the future um in the future certainly in the future whether that's the future as in two three five ten years time i'm not sure um i think you i think you've got to be so careful now if you want to take a number one job um you see managers ten years uh can be as short as two three months if it goes wrong and then and then throughout the game or they don't get the opportunity again to be a number one so um i'm taking i'm very relaxed as to when i want to move up or low i don't want to i don't want to be pigeonholed as i can under 18's manager an academy coach i think that can happen maybe if you if you stay at that level for too long um i've seen i've seen that myself um i've worked with some really good managers i've got i've got loads of ideas i've got loads of things like i've got books down the years trickle training sessions training sessions i thought were okay but i could improve on that just make notes you know and just because you don't forget down the years and i i got to i always got told that um you know make no training sessions you like if you want to go that way make notes write stuff down so you don't forget it what makes a good dressing room what makes a bad dressing room so i've got i've got oh i've got all that but look there's just ideas and i can say i'm a complete novice and who knows it might all be rubbish it might not work but that i suppose that's why you you you go in at the level i've gone out because then you can trial and error sort of thing what works what lads don't like what sessions looks like when you actually set it out rather than just in your reading in a textbook because it's it's completely different things um you can have the same session and two different managers putting on and you think it's rubbish on the one manager and one manager puts it on you think it's brilliant because i think the delivery is important of your session uh the enthusiasm um the tone you use with the players all this and like i said some of them just i'm really interested in i'm really interested in learning and developing myself as a person as a coach and i see it for me it's fantastic but i know i've gone a long way around here but yeah if if it ever it'd be brilliant to come back in some capacity in the future and i think what one characteristic that i did is you have in abundance and and talking to you you know you you have a rounded experience of football don't you you know you weren't in the academies at 17 18 19. you know you've done the hard yards and i think one of the most important things is man management you know managing men managing men you know what we spoke about what he's doing at middlesbrough he's basically got the same group of players wood gate and he's turned it around he's doing it all through his career i think there's a lot to be said for for the old school man management look time evolves if things evolve you've got to take about on the on a board like you sell the data the the gps all this business but i think there's there's a lot to be said for for old school values of hard work organization and getting on the training ground and spending the time and developing players not just saying oh these are you know we spoke about we touch on it um turn over 20 25 players yeah i don't think it works you know get on spend some time with them get the right you might you might need tweaks you might want tweaks but if you if you're with yourselves of course you've got to back yourself to go into dressing rooms and improve them and like you say that each idea is like you say i'm not saying i'm not saying i can do that because at the minute i probably couldn't look i'll be honest i'm a novice coach you might but i want to get to that level where i think yeah i can go and it would address him and make a positive difference i'd like to say something like neil warnick you see doing it yeah year in year out hopefully someone like that's in charge of my club middlesbrough neil it's been fantastic talking to you thank you very much indeed all the very very best in uh your coaching and ultimately i'm sure managerial career good luck if you're turning out for scarborough athletic uh this weekend uh and on behalf of all knox county fans thanks for the great memories you gave us over four years at madeleine no i was a pleasure top man thanks for having me on

Channel: The Magpie Circle Podcast

Views: 1,134

Keywords: notts county, Neal bishop, Paul mace, nottingham, notts, football, sven, del piero, juventus, Mansfield town, scunthorpe

Id: PsBLzSEJJ5A

Length: 85min 24sec (5124 seconds)

Published: Thu Nov 12 2020