>> DAVID NASSER: I believe that if the Son
has set us free that we are free indeed. Do you believe that out of Galatians 5? That Christ did not just set us free from
sin, right? He didn't just set us free from sin; he set
us free to love, to worship. What an incredible truth. Tonight we're really unpack that again. Make sure you're here for Shane & Shane tonight
at Campus Community at 7:30. I really believe that this morning the Lord
is going to unshackle; the Lord is going to set free some people from bitterness. There are times in your life where you find
yourself waking up in a day knowing that what's on you iCal is probably not going to be the
very thing that you’re going to remember. There are so many times you wake up, and as
the day begins to play itself out you realize that God had predestined, God had ordained
a very different route than what you thought. And until a few years ago, I would've said
to you that one of the most charmed lives I know, one of the greatest opportunities
to live a really blessed life that I know would be our friend who's going to be with
us today: Rick Burgess. Rick can be heard every morning on the radio
airwaves of the world over 50 stations across the world. That's not including XM and the Internet. Over 17 states- millions and millions of people
listen to what they call the two sexist fat men alive, The Rick and Bubba Show. And for about four hours- this is not a show
that there's music usually- this for about four hours a day these guys get up and just
talk about whatever is happening right in front of all of us. So whether it is the election, whether it
is at that moment the economy, whether it is. Whatever at that moment- ACC Football- or
whatever the world is facing, these guys just talk about it. And honestly, millions and millions of people
just listen in. If you were to ask me about this man I would
say to you that he just gets to have a lot of fun, and gets paid a ton of money for it
for four hours a day. It's basically a show where two Christian
guys, Rick Burgess and Bill Bussey- they call him 'Bubba'- just get to be out there, just
out loud about the very things-- and sometimes honestly they say the very thing a lot of
us are thinking but are afraid to say. They get paid to get to say it. So it's what a lot of people phrase 'country
smart.' It's just one of those shows that's witty,
and you'll find yourself listening and you’ll be late to what you're going through, because
you'll be in the parking lot and you need to go in, but you stay on the radio because
you want to finish that segment because it's just that good. Well a few years ago the very thing that Rick
was known for, which was really being a commentator of life, became a very surprising moment in
his life where tragedy just took place in their life. And at that moment, although Rick had an incredible
platform, God just widened his platform to a whole other level. Rick’s going to back with us at other times
to speak. You'll want that after you here him open God's
word for us on different topics. But I've asked him to come, and the very first
time he's with us here today I've actually begged him to bring his beautiful wife Sherri
Burgess with us to hear, for us to hear as well, because I wanted them to share a little
bit about the journey that they've been on in the last few years of their life and what
God has been teaching to them and through them just through tragedy being turned into
testimony. They have a brand new book that's being released
right now. Rick is already the author of seven books-
several of them on the New York Time's bestseller list- but today I really do believe that the
topic that they're going to speak into your life is very timely for some of you right
now who are in the valley, in the valley. But if you're not I do want you to bookmark
this theology that's going to come out of this moment, because the Bible always says
to us, right, reminds us in all honestly, that in this world we will have trouble. The question is not “if” but “when.” And when that moment comes, you're going to
want to be reminded of what God is going to teach you at this moment. Can we just put our hands together for the
great Rick Burgess? Come on up, brother. >> RICK BURGESS: What an honor it is to be
here. It truly is an honor, and it's interesting
what David talked about and mentioned a few words from John 16:33, which, you know, if
people ask me what my favorite verse is I almost want to say it's according to what
time of life I'm in in. You know, I mean, some people say they have
a life verse, and there's nothing wrong with that, but I have found that the Bible speaks
to everything that we face. So if you ask me what my favorite verse is
I always have to say, well, it's according to what I'm going through at the time. It was 2008. I had been asked to come speak at a student
conference, and David's done many of these, and others here have, and I'm sure Shane and
Shane have done these where they move you around into different arenas and you give
your message and you're whisked of the stage, you get in the van, you drive to the next
one, you walk in, you teach to a different group, and this repeats itself two times through. And you know at the time I was looking at
John 16:33 much differently then, and let's just land on - this is the last verse that
I was talking about before I would exit the stage. At this time my wife and I had been married
since 1996. We had five wonderful children. Our youngest was William Bronner Burgess. I had nicknames, and still do, for all my
kids. And we have five, and to many that's Brandy,
Blake, Brooks, Brody, Bronner, but for me it was Jojo, it was Boomer, it was Big Love,
it was Taz, and it was Cornbread. And they all had their Daddy nickname from
me, and so I left my home to go and speak at this conference. My wife was at home, and it's not like we
had been on some free ride to that point, but to the rest of the world, as David mentioned,
it looked like God had given us this tremendous marriage - which he had. He'd given us this beautiful family - which
He had, He had redeemed us from our sin. When Sherri and I were married we both went
from being believers of Jesus in some garbage cultural Christianity, we actually had become
followers of Jesus, submitted to His Lordship, and we saw Him blessing that. And we saw even though this secular radio
show, and at times we had different TV deals and all this, and we saw Him honoring that. Every station we're on is secular, and there
is wonderful praise and worship and growth that is provided through Christian radio,
but I just felt like that God had called us into the secular entertainment business, but
to never compromise who He was, but to boldly proclaim what He had done in our life, and
even to talk about the things that we were facing in the world and in our country from
a biblical worldview. And so all this was being blessed, and I was
getting off of one of the sessions, and I was doing John 16:33. Let's unpack that for a minute. I love that the first thing Jesus says is,
"I say this so you'll have peace." Now if I were to ask every brother and sister
in this room what do you really want? Now you might come up with a bunch of answers
that are worldly-like I wish I had more money, or I wish this person would finally go out
with me, or I wish that I had this, and I wish that I passed that test, and I hope I
get this job, and I wish I'd had this. And all that, those things are fine, but deep
down at the core of every single person in this room or watching around the world right
now, every single person, if you said I want you to be honest with me, what do you really
want? If you're honest, everybody would say, Rick
I want peace. I want to know that everything's going to
be all right. And Jesus said, "I say this so that you will
have peace." I think the next thing he says then is pretty
important. He says in this world, not “you might;”
He says, “You will face tribulation.” He didn't say you'll face some tough things. He said tribulation. You know the latest version of the Bible that
I've been studying is the English Standard. It's not as pretty as some of the other English
translations, but it's literal. It is Hebrew, English, Greek, English. And tribulation is the word used here. And He said, but when you face tribulation,
and you will. And everybody in here either has been through
it, you're going through it, or let me give you a heads up. It's coming, because we're in a fallen creation. This is not heaven. He says, “but when you face it, you take
heart.” Other translations say, “Have joy, because
I've overcome the world.” Boy, land on that for just a minute now. The peace that we all should have who claim
the name of Jesus Christ- what Shane and Shane have just incredibly proclaimed- is we're
free. We're free from all this garbage, and He says
I'm going to abandon you in the time of tribulation. You keep remembering, in that time of tribulation,
that I have overcome it. Whatever you're facing, at the end of the
day, Jesus Christ went to the cross, and walked out of that tomb, and He's overcome it! So when I walked off the stage after proclaiming
that for, I think on that day, the fourth time, my phone had been vibrating while I
was up there speaking. This was not uncommon. Having five children and a wife where somewhere
else sometimes the kids would call. "Daddy what are you doing?" Sometimes Sherri would call and say, "Whenever
you get home don't forget to go by the grocery store and get this." I mean it might be something, how you doing? So I really was not alarmed by it at all. I really thought I would get in the van to
go to the next venue and simply talk to the family. But when I called this time my wife asked
me if I could have everyone pray- the 7,000 something students that were there. She said, "I don't know how it happened. Somehow the baby found his way out, has fallen
in the pool, and drowned, and they're trying to revive him." Now wait a minute. So I prayed over my family before I left. Everything that we were doing with our show
and with our platform we were trying - not perfectly, but our intentions were, and we
were seeing fruit - point people to Jesus, and I'm preaching. And my son has passed and they're trying to
bring him back? But you know what I began to remember that
God never takes us through anything that He doesn't prepare us for. Don't miss when He's preparing you for something. Rewind nine years before this moment. The third child was born. Sherri gave birth, was giving birth, to Brooks
Burgess. She had the perfect pregnancy. There was no flaws in it, none. She did exactly what the doctors told; she
was the picture of health. You know women when they're carrying a child,
there's nothing more beautiful. And we go up to the hospital because we know
the time is near, and we think we have so much time because she had not progressed very
much, that we told the family, the rest of the kids, hey, take your time. We're going to be here a while; we're just
getting started. she's a keeper, but she's not very far along. And then they decided they would give her
Pitocin to try to accelerate the labor, and unbeknownst to us she had a bad reaction to
it. I knew immediately this was not normal when
she went from very little labor pain to massive labor pain, and you begin to watch all the
medical team scurry and run, and I remember asking the nurse what's wrong. She said we believe the baby has been cut
off from oxygen. There's been an abruption, and the baby and
your wife are both in danger. What? I'm only three years into being a follower
of Christ at this time. I'd been a believer of Jesus for a long time,
but I'd not seen much victory in that. But as a follower of Christ, I'd seen Him
begin to change my life, and change it radically. And I looked at the doctor and I said, "Well
what am I supposed to do?" And he said, "Well you need to pray." So I began to pray, Lord please, please don't. I know you well enough to know that You're
the giver and taker of life. You have not hidden that from me. I know You're sovereign. I get this, and I'm asking that you don't
take him. I want my wife, and I want my child to live. That's my desire. And as the doors flew open I saw the doctor
holding this beautiful baby boy and he points to the baby and he gives a thumbs up. He points down to my wife and gives her a
thumbs up. He said, “Hey, it's not as bad as we thought. They're going to be all right. They survived.” And I remember walking out in the hall as
they were getting the baby ready for me, and I began to praise the Lord. “Thank You Lord. Thank You Lord. You are great. You are merciful. You are wonderful. You are the giver and taker of life, and I
celebrate you. And I felt in my spirit, nine years before,
the Great I am speaking through the Holy Spirit to someone as lowly as me: “What if they
had died? Would I be any less great? Are you celebrating me because you got your
way? Would you celebrate me just as much if I had
a different plan? Would you trust and obey that I was right? Am I only great in this scenario?” And I thought that was a good lesson, and
I remember sharing it with people, and I thought, you know, this is the depth of this. And it just sounded, and people would just
gasp. And now I'm on that phone, and it's nine years
later. And I hear in my spirit, “what if they had
died? Would I be any less great?” See He didn't do that to me three years because
He knew that my reaction in his sovereignty might not have been what the advancement of
the Gospel needed. I wasn't ready. But after 9 years, from that point 12 years,
of being a follower of Christ, standing at that pool, I can see it in the sovereignty
of God. Because if you don't think that God allowed
my son to come to Him, that you have to believe that you couldn't stop it. Any of you serve that God? I don't. I mean you don't have to look much further
than the book of Job. What's the first thing we find out about Job? He was upright. And I mean it said that Job had done everything
he was asked to do, that he was the kind of man that would be an example of someone who
walked with God, right? But what did Job say at the end of his suffering? You know what we found out? As in sync with God, and as good as Job thought
he knew God at the beginning of the book of Job, we find Job admitting this pain and suffering
has only drawn me closer to God. Before I heard you with my ears, but now after
my suffering I see you with my eyes. Even though he would slay me, I find my hope
only in Him. So can we come off this, “I just don't understand
why we have to suffer?” Hey, can I tell you? I'm nauseous with that. Hey, where are all these good people? I've got news for you. Ain't nobody in this room going to strut into
heaven. At the foot of the cross every single one
of us become equal at the foot of the cross. There ain't nobody here going to earn there
way to heaven, nobody. When you get to the foot of the cross everybody
in this room has to be redeemed exactly the same way. Exactly the same way. Let's look at Romans chapter eight if you
have this with you. It's a very incredible book of the Bible. As a matter of fact, I'm going to bring my
wife up here in a minute who God has spoke through in this book, about what we went through. And I love this, called A Journey to Understand,
and you'll here from her in just a few minutes. And she is a masterful writer, and just loves
the Word of God. Her Bible, her book has 230 verses in it,
so it won't be a lot of commentary. And you know why it has 230 verses in it? You know why? And y'all get this today. When it comes to the topic of pain and suffering,
and why we suffer, God has never been silent on this. Why do we act like He's silent on this? He has never been silent on this. Can I tell you, when you're standing in front
of a baby blue coffin, that’s not very big, and here come your brothers and sisters coming
to you - Not the lost - Your brothers and sisters in the church are coming down the
aisle and you're saying, “Come on, brother, come on, sister; give me something. Give me something right now. Hey, I'm broken. I'm crushed. I am seeking God's face, and here you are. You're ready to bathe me in the Word of God,
tell me what the Lord has to say about this.” And what do we hear? “You know sometimes we don't know why.” Hey, can I tell you something? That falls a little flat. You know what people say that say that, “Sometimes
we don't know why?” They might as well say, “Sometimes I don't
read the Bible.” That's what they should say. “Sometimes I haven't read the word of God,
and I've got nothing for you. I didn't know this was going to happen.” He's never been silent on this. And you'll see that in the book, and you'll
hear some of that of what we're going to talk about tonight. Let's talk about Romans chapter eight. Many people say if they had one chapter that
they could have from the Bible if all else was taken away they'd tell you Romans chapter
eight. And my beautiful wife on the morning after
our beautiful son went to heaven- she was sitting at a couch with our older daughter
at one end. She was at the other. And to see this beautiful scene of my wife
telling our daughter to read her Romans chapter eight, and when she would finish my wife would
simply look with tears running down her face and say, "Again." And she'd read it again. And when she'd finish my wife would look at
her and say, "Again." I remember our pastor at the graveside service. Sherri wanted our daughter to read Romans
chapter eight, and the pastor said, "Which part?" To which our daughter said, "All of it. What would you like us to leave out?" But for time's sake I will skip to some of
the points that I want to make. So let's look at heirs with Christ. Verse 12 of Romans chapter 8. Because this is- we get fired up. "So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to
the flesh, to live according to the flesh. For if you live according to the flesh you
will die." Don't miss that. "But if we live by the Spirit you put to death
the deeds of body, you will live. For all who are led by the Spirit of God are
sons of God." Hallelujah. "For you did not receive the spirit of slavery
then to fall back into fear." Back to Shane & Shane's song that we declared. "But you have received the Spirit of adoption
as sons, by whom we cry, 'Abba! Father'" Meaning we have a relationship now with the
great I Am that we can call Him Abba, our daddy. "The Spirit himself bears witness with our
spirit that we are children of God" Hallelujah! "And if children, then heirs- heirs of God." With Jesus, hallelujah! "Fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer
with him." Uh, oh. Uh, oh. The health, wealth, and prosperity gospel
just left the building. You know the only problem with the health,
wealth, and prosperity Gospel? There's just one problem: It's not biblical,
but other than that it sounds fantastic. "Provided we suffer with him in order that
we may also be glorified with Him." So how will we be glorified with Christ? If we're willing to suffer with him. So we're going to be exempted something that
was not exempted the Son of God? And look at 18. "For I consider the sufferings of this present
time are not worth comparing with he glory that is to be revealed to us." Praise the Lord. 1 Peter. I know the point about where the Bible is
not silent on suffering. 1 Peter, 1:6-7. Who's with me? 1 Peter, here comes the why. Never again should you leave this convocation-
never again utter the words, "You know sometimes we don't know why." Now we might not know every intricate detail
or every situation, but to say we don't know why we suffer is not correct. Look at this: "In this you rejoice, though
now for a little while." Don't miss this: "If necessary, you have been
grieved by various trials." Let me land there for just a minute. You know what God said about our situation? You know this little boy that they love so
much that I gave them, that was really mine anyway, that I'm allowing them to have for
a time? That when I wove him together in his mother's
womb, Psalm 139:13-16, I knew the number of his days before he had ever lived one. I had them written in my book. So when people say, "You know, you're son
was taken too soon." No he wasn't. He was taken exactly when God was going to
take him. And God knew that when He wove him together
in Sherri's womb. He came for two and a half years so I'd be
standing at the convocation right now, and this book would be going out all over the
country. That's why. And you know what He says. He says, “Rejoice, though now if necessary…” You know what that means? God found this necessary. Don't miss that. Do you trust and obey him? Do you want God to be who you want to be,
or do you want to worship Him for who He really is? Do you trust that He's doing what is right? I've got news for you. My wife and I pray every night. We lament over the four children that are
still with us. We don't lament over Bronner. You know why? He's where the rest of us are trying to go. You know, I don't have to worry about him
getting his heart broken by some idiot at school. I don't have to worry about the coach not
letting him play when maybe he was the better player. I don't have to worry about what disease might
grab hold of him, and him slowly die through some horrible, just grueling situation. I know where Bronner is. Are we separated from him? Yes. Does that hurt? Absolutely. Are we being refined by it? Let's get to that. Yes we are. "So that" - look at seven - "So that the tested
genuineness of your faith- more precious than gold that perishes if it's tested by fire-
may be found to result in praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ." Why do we suffer? To test your faith. To refine you. I will tell you this. David talked about it. On a worldly stage I have been greatly blessed. I'm a, hey, I'm a small town boy from Calhoun
County. Sherri's a beautiful young lady from Guntersville,
Alabama. We ain't ever had anything. Because of what God allowed us to do through
the show I have experienced things I'd never experienced before in my life. I've been a lot of cool places. I've been able to buy things that I never
could buy before. I've been able to advance the Gospel like
I never could before from a monetary standpoint. But you know what? I will tell you this. The affluence He's allowed me to experience
has taught me very little about God. My pain and suffering has taught me much,
has taught me much. My affluence hasn't taught me very much at
all. The affluence is a stumbling block. The pain and suffering actually gets me back
where I have a proper perspective on what matters and what doesn't. Do you think that we worry about the little
things? How many times do you think we say at our
house, “Oh my gosh! This is a tragedy!”? We stop and go, “No. No, it's not. I've seen a tragedy. This isn't it. This is not it.” He cares about our pain and suffering, but
there's a reason that it happens: to refine us and test the genuineness of your faith. All right, let's talk about this: who thinks
I'm more effective of a speaker? When I go to men’s conferences- I do a lot
of those- do you think I have more impact when I talk about burying one of my sons or
less? Much more. You think when I went back on the air the
first time after we buried our son, you think anybody was listening? They wanted to see if it was real. They wanted to see if it was going to result
in the praise and the glory of Jesus Christ or we were going to reject him. Just like with Job Satan says, you take this
stuff away from him and he'll reject you. You know what? Satan was wrong. Satan said to God, you attack this family,
they'll reject you. And the angel's standing there at that pool. Here's the demon standing at the pool. God's sitting there, and He's got the call. He's sovereign. He says I'm going to allow it, and I'll be
glorified. I'll be glorified. Satan and his demons said, they're going to
turn against you. How about this: Satan doesn't know the future! So let's stop acting like Satan and his demons
are the dark side of God. No they're not. Lucifer was created by God. He don't have anything like God does. Now I'll tell you one thing; you don't want
to battle him without Jesus Christ. But as far as his comparison to God, he's
dead! He's going to be destroyed. He's trying to take you with him. And pain and suffering is one of the ways
you'll leave- how about this. And my wife said this. We're about to bring her up. One of the things she said in the book, and
this is really it. When you face difficult trauma you've got
a choice. You can turn your back and run away from God,
or you can run to God in that pain and suffering and be transformed by it. That's the choice. It ain't nothing grinding you out like pain
and suffering. Ain't nothing bring you closer to Jesus like
pain and suffering can do. Before I bring her up I'll tell you one of
the things we'll talk about. Another thing that pain and suffering does
according to the Apostle Paul, and I've seen it in my own life- it humbles you. Think about this, back to the health, wealth,
and prosperity garbage. Think about this for a minute. So the Apostle Paul didn't have enough faith? The Apostle Paul says to God, "Hey, this thorn
in my flesh- I'm tired of it. This demon that keeps harassing me- I'm done
with it. I have asked you three times to remove this
thorn in my flesh, and to remove this torturing demon from me and you haven't. So if I believe the health, wealth, and prosperity
gospel I go, well, gosh. Paul didn't know how to pray. He didn't claim it. So the Apostle Paul didn't have any faith? He didn't have enough? But see Paul didn't leave us hanging. What did he say? See this is back to this. Why don't we just look? It tells us. What did Paul say? You've done this to keep me humble, to remind
me that Your grace is sufficient. It's a reminder for me. Well I will tell you, when I was sitting there
ready to go back on the air for the first time after we had buried our son I was just
sitting there and I couldn't tie my shoes. Couldn't do it. And I said, “I don't know who you think
I am.” See that was my first mistake. It's not, wow, what a Rick. It's, wow, what a God. It's not, wow, what a Sherri. It's, wow, what a God. It's not, wow, what a book. It's, wow, what a God. And I said, “You want me to go do this show. When's the next time I'm supposed to say something
funny? I've got to go out there and stand in front
of all these people again, and I can't even tie my shoe.” And I felt in my spirit God saying, “Now,
you're ready. See you problem, Burgess, wasn't that you
weren't strong enough. You were raised by a football coach. You've got all this toughness. Your problem is that you were never weak enough,
and now I've broken you down to the point of weakness that you need me to tie your shoe. Now I can use you like I never could before.” So the Scriptures are not silent on this,
and my wife- you will see I have married well. One of the things that is also a misnomer
is that somehow this pain and suffering destroys marriages. Well, it destroys weak marriages that are
not biblically bound. But you know what? Strong marriages that are based on the word
of God- they don't get weaker. They just get stronger. And you know, Sherri, you've written this
incredible book, and I know we have it here today, and it's changing lives all over the
country. And you call it, “A Journey to Understand.” We've been on that haven't we? So tell them. What's some of the things you've learned >> SHERRI BURGESS: Well, you know, that night
as I saw my baby there lifeless I knew where his spirit was. I knew that his spirit was with God, and that
God had the ability to send him back to me. And so, like you say, instead of running away
from God, oh, gosh, of course I run to God, and I say God please. Please don't do this. Please give him back. All I wanted was my son. As a mother that's all I could pray. Father, please give my son back. Don't do this. Please send him back- over, and over, and
over again. As we were rushing to the hospital, and when
we got into the emergency room I fell prostrate before the Lord on my face just continuing
the same prayer. Lord God please don't do this. Please don't take my son. And I would look up at the heart monitor to
see if they had gotten anything, and they never did. But that last time I leaned down over a chair
and was praying again that same thing, but this time something started stirring down,
like deep, within me, and it came up into my mind almost as if I were hearing it rather
than praying it myself. And it was this: “Not my will, but Thine,
O, Lord be done. Not my will, but Thine, O, Lord be done.” And at that moment there was a peace that
came over me that did transcend all understanding, and I stood up. I looked at the doctor on charge, and he looked
at me and he said we're going to have to stop. And I just looked at him and nodded and said,
“OK.” That's how I knew that this was God's will. I believe that the Holy Spirit prepared me
right then and there, knowing, yes, this is God's will. But my thing was, why? Why was this God's will? Why would He do this? Why would He allow it? I knew that this was from His hand right then
and there I had confirmation. But the Bible speaks to that as well, that
not even a sparrow falls, apart from the Lord. And Psalm 139 tells us that all of our days
are numbered before there were even one of them. So I knew this was from God's hand, so I begged
Him to tell me why. I needed to understand this. And I, like Rick said, love the Word of God
so much, and I ran to it. And I saw, that as Rick said, the Bible's
not silent on this subject. For some reason those Scriptures, like in
1 Peter when it says, “expect the fiery trial when it comes to test you,” when right
over my head until I needed it. And then I went back and I saw the Bible talks
about suffering from Genesis chapter two all the way to Revelation. The Bible is covered with it. From the sacrificial system to Christ's suffering
on the cross. The Bible tells us in Hebrew 12:1 and 2 that
Jesus went to the cross for the joy that was set before Him. Joy in knowing that He wouldn't be the only
one to come out on the other side of it rising from the dead, but that all of us would as
well. So what I learned through scripture was that,
yes, we're going to have to go through suffering in this life and in this time, but this life
is not what it's all about. There's something greater, something better,
something higher out there waiting for us. And the Bible tells us to be behold it. To hold it in our hearts. Heaven, the great promises of God. Yeah, we've got to walk through some bad stuff
here, but, as Rick said, in the end we can have peace because we know that God is going
to work all of it together than our good here and now. To me, for me, it was refinement. I saw God melting away the dross of worldliness,
pride, self-reliance. I thought I was the best mother in the world. How could this happen to me? But see, in that moment when I saw my baby
without life in him- he was two and a half and he was gorgeous, beautiful child filled
with life- the apple of my eye. I saw that I could do nothing about this. I can't change it, but God can and He will. You know death, real death, is separation
from God. Bronner's not dead. I hate that word, and I hate when people say
that, because he's not. He's in the presence of God. That's the opposite of dead. Sin separates us from God, and what God wants
to do through our suffering is to refine us, to make us holy like Him. I looked up to heaven, and this was one of
the ah-ha moments for me, and I said, “but we were so happy, God. We were so happy!” and I heard that still, small voice say to
me, "But I want you to be holy. I want you to be holy." And then later on God took me to 1 Peter 4:1
and 2 that tells me that, "Those who have suffered have ceased from sin, so as to live
the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for human passions, but for the will of God." For the will of God. So I am to walk this out with God, going wherever
He asks me to go, writing whatever He asks me to write. It took me five years to hash all of this
out with God. Rick kind of got it right away. He was just ready to go and ready to take
on that warfare. But as a mother, I was crushed, and God had
to pick me up and nurse me back to health through His word, through His scripture, and
through prayer, and lots of time alone with Him. And I learned
the big picture is eternity. It's not about the here and now. You know, again, it takes a long time to process
something like this if you're a mother. I know, probably, not many of you are mothers
and fathers just yet, but you will be. And you will understand what I mean, but this
is a crushing blow to lose a child, very crushing. And so, you know, even though I knew that
this was about refinement, about making me holy like God, making me be in awe of the
One who can make all of this right again - fearlessness and boldness for my husband. I knew all of that, but as I'm searching and
seeking God's face in this I asked Him, “Lord God, why the children? You know, couldn't you have done this some
other way? Why did it have to be the baby?” I got this book in the mail one day by a pastor
whose son had also drowned. And I just couldn't believe it. I burst into tears and I thought, “why,
why this man's son who had devoted his life to you? Why my son who I loved and wanted?” I looked to God and I said, there is nothing
worse than losing a child. I know you lost Your son, but You got Him
back after three days - three days! And I heard, again, that still small voice
of the Holy Spirit speaking to me. “But what about the others? They're all mine. You're going to get this glorious reunion
with your son, but I don't get that with all of mine.” And at that moment I understood. At that moment, I think for the first time
in my life, I had compassion for God. I know what it's like to lose a child. It hurts. It doesn't matter that I still have Brandy,
Blake, Brooks, and Brody. Bronner's missing. He's not here with me, and that hurts. It's the separation that hurts. I know I'm going to get him back, and that
is going to be a glorious reunion. I can't wait for it, but it hurts to be separated
- even for a short time. And I know that time for me is going to be
short, so I understood that my broken heart must pale in comparison to God's broken heart
who has to send some of His - people that He created, who He breathed His very life
into, His spirit - He's going to have to say goodbye to forever. Forever! I can't imagine that. I couldn't imagine if I didn't have hope on
the other side of this saying, “Bronner is going to run into my arms, and I'm going
to hold him again, and he's going to be my baby.” I know that day is coming. But for God it isn't. And it made me see that this wasn't just about
me, and making me holy, and refining me, and melting this dross of sin away from me - although
it was. It was about that, my own personal growth,
but it was about so many other people as well. It was about bringing people to Christ. It matters. It matters, because this is about eternity. It's about forever. And, if I have to give up my son for a short
time so that some other of God's children could come back to Him for all of eternity,
it is worth it. It is. >> RICK: You know, one of the things that
we, Sherri and I, have talked about, and you'll see this, is we feel we've been called to
prepare you for what's coming. That the time we're living in right now as
Americans, we have pretty much been exempt from being persecuted as a church. That time is changing, and it's changing rapidly. And it's only going to get worse. Your generation will be persecuted in this
country like no generation before you. And frankly, you need to get ready for it. You need to understand what it all means. And the Scriptures are not silent on it, and
one of the things, and we'll get ready to close, is the point that the Apostle Paul
came to in his life. This really is the key to life. >> SHERRI: What I think, Rick, this has made
for both of us come, just the truth of this word, come back so clearly is Philippians
chapter one. And Paul's words to us: "To live is Christ,
and to die is gain." I believe that. We believe that. We believe that Bronner is in a place that's
far, far greater than here. There's no darkness. He's in the presence of God. It's the Kingdom of light. No evil can enter there. He is surrounded by joy, peace, and love constantly. No fear, no persecution. So, yes, that place is a far greater place. And I see that, and I'm looking forward to
that, but as we know that if we are in the flesh, if we are still here that means fruitful
labor for us. That we are continuing to work for the Lord,
and I just pray that for you today. I pray that you will see that. I pray that you will see that to live is Christ
- meaning that we're living for Him. Everything we do, everything we say impacts
this world either for good or for bad. And I pray you don't miss these opportunities
to help bring some of God's children back to Himself. Anytime you can go, go. Anytime you can speak, speak. Anything you can do for the least of these,
do it. You are the hands and feet of Jesus in this
generation. We're it. Be His mouthpiece. Be His hands and feet. >> RICK: Amen. Now some of you here though, the reason you
haven't been able to get there yet is you don't know Christ. You don't know Him, and I want you to listen
to what the Apostle Paul is saying. That's not a “give up” verse. That's not. To live is Christ, and to die is gain. Now God will decide when your life ends. It's not up to us to decide when we're done,
but He said as long I'm still taking breath, the Apostle Paul said for us, then it's going
to be about what my wife just said - Christ. And I have found that I'm not afraid to die. That has completely been taken away. But you know what is difficult? To live. I don't ever say this thing - hey you better
watch out; you might die. You know what I say? Hey you better watch out; you might live. But because now you've got to endure. We'll close with this, Phillipians 4:13, one
of the most misunderstood verses in the Bible. There's nothing wrong with using it to be
a motivator. There's nothing wrong with that. "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens
me." That's fine, but it's not about winning a
ball game. It's not about doing well on a test. It's not about getting a job. It's not about doing well. It's not motivational. Paul's in jail. He's suffering again, and you know what he
sees that as? And opportunity to what? Bring the guy he's chained to to Christ. What he's saying is, the proper interpretation
is, I can endure all things through Christ who strengthens me. And I pray as we get read to wrap up and give
it back, that you'll take an opportunity to get to meet Sherri today. And you know, I think this is a book that
can be very beneficial to the church. It's not a grieving book, even though that
is part of it. It will definitely help. This is about what we've talked about today,
that the Bible isn't silent on pain and suffering, and if you will embrace it and be transformed
by it, it actually draws you closer to Christ and makes you more powerful than you were
before. Thank you so much for having us here today. We appreciate it.
