Rich Roll: Story of Redemption, Personal Triumph and Ultra-Fitness

hi I'm Monica fields and this is good life project so my guest today is rich roll who owns the title of fittest men in the world and he's the author of a really good book called finding ultra we're gonna kind of go into his journey because this wasn't always his existence so awesome me hanging out with you today yeah thanks for having me it's great to be here yeah so you are now according to the ultimate resources the fittest guy in the world certain dubious resources right aka my best friend um that ultra marathoner extraordinary athlete and you've got built a really fascinating life for yourself but I want to take a step back because this actually was not your life and was not the way that you were living in fact it was pretty close to the opposite so before you sort of embrace this complete commitment take me back to what your life was like and what you were doing sure um well I guess my my life started out quite good I was a I was an excellent student in high school loving parents that are still married and kind of had all of my needs met and ended up getting into all the colleges I applied to and I was a swimmer in high school and in college and you know had achieved a certain level of proficiency with that ended up going to Stanford University and that's where things kind of started to shift because I discovered the wondrous effects of alcohol which over the course of the next 15 years sort of led to my personal decline and took me to some pretty dark places so I had a kind of protracted battle with drug addiction and alcohol that really kind of disconnected me from myself I mean not only you know did I become alienated from my friends and family and unemployable and and you know one step away from homeless really just disconnected from who I was as a person so from there was were the people around you sort of aware of what was going on or certainly you know my family was very concerned had been trying to help me and I had not kind of hit my bottom yet and wasn't ready to accept help and it got to the point where you know my parents were like we don't want to talk to you anymore you know when you're ready to address this problem you know are you can call us anytime but until then like we don't want to hear from you and my boss I was I was a senior associate at a big corporate law firm in Los Angeles and he was ready to fire me he knew what was going on everybody knew what was going on but you know denial is a very powerful human emotion and exceptionally powerful in an active alcoholic so it took some time before I was really ready to grapple in a real way with this problem of course I knew I was an alcoholic but there's a there's a gap between self-knowledge and taking action to address the problem well I mean so there was a little bit of a leap to you go from Stanford to be a lawyer mm-hmm and large law firm right all the while sort of like living this can almost double life yeah for sure very secretive life I became very good at lying and deceiving people about what I was really doing and was able to kind of keep it together for a while I mean I was able to graduate from Stanford and I was able to by the hair of my chinny-chin-chin get into law school and somehow you know to this day I look back on that experience and wonder how the heck I actually graduated from law school but somehow I did and you know was able to get a job so I was you know I was able to kind of get get my life together enough to put up a face that I was a responsible member of society but kind of pulling the curtain back if you were to look at kind of how it was actually really conducting myself it was a very different picture and so when you're in active drug addict or alcoholic and you're trying to navigate the world you have to spin a lot of plates to kind of keep the facade up and it's exhausting actually yeah I mean for you was was the draw was it something that you were escaping was it or was it more of a chemical was a genetic was it some blend of was there something that you were self-medicating for what was it that drew you into this place um you know asked myself that question a lot and I don't know that I have the answer I mean I know that I'm a drug addict and an alcoholic and why on that way is kind of you know something I'll probably continue to explore for the rest of my life well nobody in my immediate family is an alcoholic so I can't say that I had a genetic predisposition to it and of course I can say well you know I was depressed about this or whatever but I don't really find that to be productive you know I know that I am and I know what the solution is for me you know I know how I got sober and I know what I need to do to stay sober and so sort of pondering the that you know the wise kind of leads me down a rabbit hole that I don't feel necessarily serves me well justing so you reach a place where you're working at a large law firm which very often is insane hours also yeah high-stress didn't help right because you picked a career which is like pushes you to the edge so what's the is there a big moment is this is it is there like a gradual waking it happens was there a moment where there was definitely a moment I think the sort of defining bottom that I had was a marriage that went awry and I talked about in my book it's a long story and kind of too long to get into the details of it for purposes of this interview but essentially I had a merit I had a wedding that did not culminate in a marriage ended on the honeymoon and it was quite a dramatic event in my life that shocked me to my core and I think that was my bottom as an alcoholic but it was such a painful moment for me that I you need to medicate myself with drugs and alcohol for the better part of like the next nine months before I was ready to kind of deal with it and then it was just I woke up one day and I was like I've had enough I'm ready to go to rehab and you know booked a flight and got a bed at a treatment center in rural Oregon and you know just somehow found the wherewithal to board that plane and that was the first step in changing my the trajectory of my life forever whoa what say you a residential that for a month or something like that actually well I showed up thinking I'm just gonna spend right here for a couple of weeks and get back to my job that was my plan right and the counselors there once they you know I was able to get to a place where I was able to be honest with them about what I was doing and they kind of looked at me and said yeah you know I think you might want to stick around a little bit longer they essentially said you have a your alcoholism alcoholism is is sort of progressed to the point of a 65 year old man and we think you should stick around and I could have said no nobody was forcing me to be there but I ended up staying for a hundred days so is there for quite a long time and it really was a process of rewiring my my mind body and spirit completely and learning new tools for living that so where do you go from there because I mean you're licensed you're skilled you could go back in this profession and the same pace of life in the same things but right well I actually did when I got out of the treatment facility I did go back to the law firm they had been my boss had been actually very supportive of of this move and and I felt that the right thing to do was to go back even if I didn't want to and I knew that life was not right for me to go back and kind of honor the commitment they made to me by by going and working there for at least as long as I had been gone and and really and so I did that until I reached a point where I realized this was not right for me and I ended up leaving and starting my own private-like sir boutique entertainment transactional practice and pursued that for the next number of years and really kind of getting out of rehab and embarking on this new life that really was monopolized by recovery and creating a foundation of sobriety I was able to get back all of those things in my life that I had lost I was able to repair the relationships with my friends and my family I was able to show up and be a responsible member of society to be a worker among workers to be honest to look people in the eye and all these things that had been challenges for me when I was active in my alcoholism but the one thing that I did not attend to was my health with Fitness and you know I had gained 50 pounds and was a very very unfit by the time I was about 39 years old oh yeah which for high stress a lot of hours attorney almost no matter where you are I mean I've lived that a much shorter amount of time and I remember I was I was a disaster physically health i'm ended up in the hospital I was an emergency surgery wagon as I was on a deal and we worked like the better part of three weeks without sleeping and I was in horrible pain for the last few days and I had a raging infection in the middle of my body that literally ate a hole through my intestine from the outside edge so we literally hit the button on the deal and I went to the hospital and they like was wheeled into emergency surgery but I think so many extreme examples I think so many people not just in law I think law is particularly sort of acceptable to people just completely tuning out the visceral signals that their body is giving them absolutely and while also there's a culture in that environment that that is supportive of that lifestyle you know and there's a kind of weird false pride that goes along with that like what you're not eating dinner at the law firm like what are you doing that are you weak and I remember one incident in my firm where I was it on a Saturday morning or Sunday morning quite early and there was a guy who was on the cusp of being named partner who was working on a summary judgment motion and his his wife had just given birth like hours prior along I was in the he was in the law firm like cranking out this brief when I was like why aren't you at the hospital with your wife and your babies how to get this done you know and that was one in many moments where I thought yeah this is not this this is not a good law something's not right yeah so yeah and edit Leigh said I don't mean to slam law but it is one of probably a number of professions where you know like because a lot of the times we work with Investment Banking also it's built around a culture of you know like if you're not suffering if you're not feeling the same amount of pain as everybody else around us you're not sort of like 100 miles an hour right you're not really practicing now remember like one day being in an office and I think I was leaving around 6:00 at night and like that and somebody walking by and say ah half day huh yeah exactly like okay that's how it is so so what do you do about it so what happened in my case was on the eve of my 40th birthday I'd been up late I got home late from work and I stayed up late watching television after my family was asleep and I think it was eating a bag of jack-in-the-box cheeseburgers I had like what you call my friend of my calls the window diet if you can roll down the window and somebody hands it to you you eat it and that's kind of how I how I was subsisting at the time and you know it was time to go to bed was walking up the stairs and about halfway up the staircase like I had to stop like I was out of breath I was buckled over sweat on my brow tightness in my chest and it scared me I thought that I was on the precipice of having a heart attack and I thought you know I'm 39 like I had to take a break walking up a simple flight of stairs you know I need to do something about this and I think this is kind of where the sobriety story plays into what happened next because when I made that decision to get sober and on that airplane and go to that rehab it was like a little crack on the door you know the door cracked open and I had a choice like you're going to walk through this door but if you don't do it right away like I've had I just decided I was going to do it that day I might have never done it you know sort of that the preciousness of those little moments of opportunity and you're going to act and your life is going to change or if you don't like you may not get that sort of moment again and so when I had that staircase episode I was able to recognize that this was once again one of those moments that was important and I needed to do something right away if I just blew it off and you know kind of perpetuated my denial about my scenario you know I don't know that I would have ever made any change but so at this point you also you have a family so it's not just you that you're making decisions for and it's not just you that this would be impacting yeah absolutely I have two teenage step sons and two daughters the youngest of which had not been born at this point but yeah I was scared for myself and I was you know I wasn't the head of a family it was terrifying and I have my I have a grandfather my mother's father who had been a champion swimmer in college was captaining the University of Michigan swim team and an Olympic hopeful an American record holder who had remained healthy his whole life and and had been you know a swimmer his whole life never overweight never smoked and died of a heart attack at in his early 50s died long before before I was born of course so my mother would always say we've got to watch out about your health and heart disease runs in our family and you know here was a guy who in many ways is my doppelganger is you know I was named after him and he loved swimming like I did and and that kind of you know I thought about that a lot in that moment thinking you know if I don't make a change I'm headed in the same direction as this guy probably sooner based upon how I feel right now and so what I did what the first thing I did I wish I could tell you I went to the library and got a bunch of books and watched a bunch of documentaries and said this is how to be healthy I didn't do that I wish I had it would have saved a lot of time but my wife is a always been much healthier than I at a video go practice in ER into all sorts of you know Eastern healing modalities and and that was always kind of like her thing you know and if you were to look in her in our fridge it was pretty clear like the food she was eating in the food I was eating right um like zoned off exactly skull and crossbones exactly and I'm like that's great for you honey I love you but you know I mean it does and but I was you know I was desperate and the next day I said hey you know that that juice cleanse you did you know six or eight months ago like I think I want to try that and she looked at me like confused of that you know who I like yeah like what she does if I said you know the high heels in the in the closet I want to wear those today you know like it was so out of character for me I'm you know it was the last person who would entertain doing something weird like that I liked toxin remove toxins what toxins you know I'm the logic based guy and you know I understand science and you know I know best I went to Stanford and you know that sort of thing but it was it was a I was in a place where I was ready to suspend my preconceived notions about what I thought was right or my way and again that's very similar to a cornerstone principle of recovery it's sort of being willing to ask for help being willing willing to entertain the notion that you know your way might not be the best way and so I did that I did a seven-day fruit and vegetable juice cleanse so what was that I'm curious though I mean at first the new wife's got the out surprise chopped rare you know aliens have taken my husband yes but was there was there any tension I mean it because it's it's so interesting to me if you have two people who are in relation who love each other you're building a family together but generally if one person is sort of like a real zealot about like the health and lifestyle it's it's a big part of them and then if you have one person who's your partner in life who's the complete opposite was that something that caused ongoing tension it was just kind of an accepted thing it's a great question and and the answer is interesting you know I think for a certain number of years she what she would like encourage me like hey you should you should you know look at this this way or me here's a book you should read and she put books on my book stand and I wouldn't open them and I wouldn't read them and I think that that definitely caused her some frustration and consternation but she's also far more enlightened than I and she understands a key kind of spiritual principle which is non-attachment well and she made a decision after sort of pursuing things that way and realizing that I wasn't biting or wasn't changing to let go like she said I love you exactly the way you are I'm not attached to you changing and kind of you know resolved it was resolved to that and it's when she made that decision to kind of let go and just appreciate me for who I was that I started to change it's a very interesting you know sort of spiritual equation somewhere in there you know of letting go and allowing the person their space and then you know maybe something subconsciously in me was reacting to that like hey why isn't she pushing me to read all these books anymore and then it was on me that I know it came down to personal responsibility like I needed to want it for myself not because she wanted me to do it hmm yeah I mean that's big um so so you decided to actually say okay let's do this mm-hmm and at that point what did she become attached again no actually it was like I had to say you know let's get the stuff like I'm ready to go and she was like yeah yeah like I don't think she believed me right I took her I had to ask her like three times before she actually went to the store with me to get that stuff because she was like she really was not attached and she maybe she didn't believe that I was serious I don't know it's funny how that how that played out but yeah I I did it and the first couple days I remember being buckled over on the couch and I felt like I was back in rehab detoxing and you know weathering a detox is something I was familiar with it was sort of you know I know how this feels and I know that it will change like if I can just get through the next couple days it'll start to shift and that's what happened it's kind of interesting then the fact that you had had really the detox experience from like drugs and alcohol gave you the understanding what the process would rate and that you would actually come out the other side this was actually okay to be it was not great place yeah there was an extreme amount of discomfort or a couple days but you know I was like okay I know I know what there's almost like okay bring it on you know ready for this like let me let me weather this well and it did shift you know day three I felt better day for starting to feel really good you know the last couple days of the Klan's I experienced a resurgence and vitality and energy levels that I couldn't ever remember having and it was profound you know it really hammered home this idea that that food is medicine indeed that we do have the power to heal ourselves and and the fact that I could have abused my body for so long with drugs and alcohol and terrible diet and then in a mere seven days feel great well is you know a testament to the resilience of the human body when you treat it right that so that becomes a springboard I guess sure yeah sure so then of course being a good alcoholic I'm like well I'm just going to drink juice for the rest of my life I'm never to go back to food you know but of course you got to start eating again and I thought well what am I going to do now like I feel so good I want to keep feeling this good and once again I wish that I'd gotten a bunch of books on the subject and set myself on a proper trajectory again it everything goes back to recovery for me and in recovery they teach you that you're either using drugs or you're sober you're either drinking or you're not there's a very black-and-white sort of calculus to the whole thing and so I think vegetarian is an appeal to me from a health perspective because it's black and white I could wrap my brain around it's like oh you're immediate you're not eating me I understand that yeah that's like a language that that makes sense to me but I can I can I can grapple with that and so I tried it I tried a 100% whole food plant-based diet really thinking this isn't going to work either but at least I can say I've exploited all that avenues and that's where you know I experienced literally nothing short of a miracle I mean it was again within seven days of making that switch I felt like I did on the latter days of that juice cleanse and I felt amazing and that's when I knew I was onto something and then I began to educate myself so that was sort of the beginning of my journey towards you know returning to athleticism right and at that point had you started assuming when you were sort of like working crazy hours that exercise was wasn't a part of your life right no not at all so this does the change in food and this whole thing also coincide with you starting to move your body more yeah absolutely I don't think that I would have returned to exercising again had I not changed my diet I mean the diet comes first and I had so much energy all of a sudden that I need I just needed an outlet for it I was bouncing off the walls literally like I need to do something with my with myself and it wasn't I had no designs on returning to being a competitive athlete I just I wanted to lose my gut you know and I wanted to be able to enjoy my children at their energy level and that was really my aspiration yeah on a pair of running shoes my wife bought me a bike for my 40th birthday and you know I started jumping in the pool once in a while and going on a casual bike ride on a Saturday afternoon with some friends certainly nothing competitive it was really just again burning off this out of energy and and then in reconnecting with a part of myself that I feel like I had lost of the youth you know how much I love swimming how much I love being outdoors and pushing my body so it really started something which was I mean it wasn't a concerted effort to compete or become great at something was just not at all you were vibrating he needed a way dissipate the energy it was like yeah I was I was vibrating I was taking in a different vibration and my body was responding to that vibration by directing me on a new path right so how do you make the jump from just burning off the extra energy that you have to being this extreme athlete and a lot of people's minds that's a pretty huge jump yeah and it didn't you know it seems like it happened overnight it was over the course of you know maybe a year and a half I suppose it started ice it first started when maybe four months or so into this kind of dietary experiment and this you know resurgence of kind of feeling my body again I went out for a morning run it was a weekday morning my plan was just to run for 45 minutes or an hour on a local trail and was one of those days where everything just felt great like anybody who's a runner knows this or athlete and everything just clicks and you feel bullet bridge just go for it just go and and that's what I did I just kept going and going and going and till I realized I'd been running almost two hours away from my car where I'd parked at the base of the trail I didn't have any water with me and I was like what are you doing I was like I feel so good but like this is really you're responsible I could like collapse and then on this trail in the middle Miller turned around and ran back and felt you know great all the way to the end and ended up running like almost you know the better part of a marathon that morning like a blue you know just and I thought what is going on you know either I've unlocked some dormant gene or this you know this diet is working for me in a way that I could not have imagined or you know I don't know what but I felt like directed to exploring this part of who I was and in a new way and that kind of led me to thinking about a challenge and you know and sort of exploring further that question of how resilient is the human body and you know having come from a place of abusing it for so long what is it capable of now like at age 40 to 43 I wanted to answer that question for myself and since either already essentially just run run a marathon right was the victim it wasn't it and it didn't feel like any big deal so I thought well what if I could do that like what would happen if I actually prepared for something you know in a away and set my sights on a goal and I thought well you know I can I can enter this marathon or maybe I'll do an Ironman and just nothing really clicked as being super you know as giving me that like feeling that you know of being inspired yeah and then I and then I read an article about this race called Ultraman which I'd never heard of which is you know people most people know what an Ironman is but if you don't an Ironman is a is a very long triathlon race which during the course of one day you swim 2.4 miles you bike 112 miles and then you run a marathon yeah and this Ultraman race is essentially a little bit more than double that and over the course of three days you circumnavigate the entire Big Island of Hawaii which is like roughly the size of Connecticut some big island and the first day you swim 6.2 miles and then you ride your bike 90 miles the second day you ride your bike 170 miles and the third day you run 50 2.4 miles a double marathon Wow and I was reading this article about this race that I'd never heard of that apparently had been around for 25 years there's no media coverage there's no money there's no prize money there's nothing it's sort of a very grassroots kind of a vet that is probably what Ironman was like back in 1980 I want to started all right and there was something about that that I found really appealing and in the description of this race it made it sound like this spiritual Odyssey there are only 35 athletes that are invitation-only from all over the world they're invited and compete in this race everybody has to bring their own crew a vehicle like a van that drives with each athlete to make sure they get from place to place and there's this in why they call it Ohana it's the spirit of family where every athlete and their crew is making sure that all the other athletes are attended to and the idea is that everybody crosses the finish line and of course it's a race and there's people that want to win but it was really that this kind of core kind of communalism about this race that real captured my imagination and was one of those things in life where you see something and I switch flicks and you're like well I'm going in this direction you know it made no sense logically that I would be any in any position to participate in this event but there was something inside of me that knew that I was going to be doing that race well so you just went all-in I did I you know I read that article and I couldn't stop thinking about it for a couple days is crazy as it sounded and I called up the race director it was some months before this race was open to receiving applications called her up and I said I just read this article about this race and I'm really interested in it at night and I want to do it and she said well what have you done yeah existed this really what are they eating cheeseburgers on the couch for a long time I was like I haven't done anything and she should have said well why don't you run a couple marathons or do an Ironman and call me in a year or two and we'll talk but she didn't say that what she said was well it's it's interesting that you called and that you're expressing this interest and there's a little bit of time and why don't you check in with me in another couple months and we'll see where you're at well because it was a it was a really I was only 35 people only 35 people and the races gained considerable popularity over the last couple years so at this time you know this was prior to the 2008 race there was a little more flexibility and being accepted to compete right but it was another prep another crack in the door you noticed I've you know continued the theme where she gave me a little glimmer of hope and I and I grabbed onto that and I knew that if I took the opportunity seriously and kind of walked through that door that there was a good chance that I would be able to line up the starting line for that race and so I proceeded accordingly you know I hired a coach and got a training program together and had about six or seven months to get ready for this race which isn't a lot of time for me oh I haven't been doing my athletic yeah yeah yeah I mean the ironman alone is something that people trained for of course yeah huge amount and very often after years of working up to it absolutely so to do double that is pretty tremendous so so eventually I'm assuming you call her back and she says yeah exactly so I stayed in touch with her and eventually wore her down and office I said okay okay I'll let you in right I said thank you I will not disappoint you and and I and I trained you know really hard because I didn't want to you know that meant a lot to me that she showed me you know that she showed some faith in me I was taking a leap of faith and I wanted to honor that by making sure that I was as physically and mentally prepared for that race as I could be in a short period of time they which is tricky because you can't rap if you ramp up your volume too quickly for something like that in your training you're going to get injured or over trained yeah I mean which is the other the flipside I was thinking you like because it's so extreme you know you get concerned about going the opposite direction of you know that you become now addicted to this other thing which actually destroys your body but in a different way right yeah and I get that question a lot like haven't you just transferred your all of your you know addictive behavior on to this extreme sports template and and you know it's a it's a valid question you know and it's something that I that I have to soul search over and I certainly think that that you know this the extreme nature of ultra endurance sports is a perfect sort of vehicle for an addict because there's no end to the amount of obsessive you know kind of training that you can pour into it and I have to be careful about that I mean I would imagine that that's part of the allure for me but at the same time you know I have so many other things I'm doing in my life you know and husband and father of children and so for me you know balance is the thing that I'm always trying to focus on like how can I pursue this thing that for whatever reason I'm attracted to and still maintain balance in my life because if my relationship with my wife gets derailed or I'm not seeing my kids like what is the point of all of this you know so I always you know I'm always kind of making lists making sure that my priorities are in check mmm it sounds like also to a certain extent I mean the level of competition that you're doing is it becomes a metaphor for other things mm-hmm yeah absolutely I mean I think that that on some level I believe that you know I'm kind of meant to pursue the sport I certainly have a you know an acuity for it and I'm a happier person when I'm doing it and I feel that I'm more fully expressed and actualized when on when I'm doing it to the extent that when I'm not training my wife will say we please go ride your bike you're much better person I like you more when you're yeah and yeah it's it's a metaphor not everyone is going to want to go out and and race Ultraman or or you know participate in extreme sports but for me I feel it is kind of the manifestation of this journey towards reconnecting with myself and and being able to kind of express more fully Who I am and be comfortable with that in my own skin yeah that's powerful to find something like that that allows you that maybe life I think so many people are looking for it like the thing that lets you be so fully expressed that it's just you know it's almost like it becomes a part of you you know yeah I mean I you know Henry David Thoreau said the mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation and it was true that and I think it's just as true if not more true I know and you know I relate to that a lot and I think about that quote a lot and I certainly live that life for a long time and it's been a hard rot journey to kind of figure out you know how do was you know some escape path out of that and I feel very fortunate and I'm very grateful that I found that but I am also very empathetic to people and in particularly men who struggle with this because you know life is difficult then you got to put food on the table and all these sorts of real life issues that we have like I don't have time to figure out what makes me happy because I'm so busy in the day-to-day of my life but I think that we all have dreams defer that are locked inside of us and we all have like a more authentic version of ourselves that's yearning to come out and I think you know the the natural healthy state of man is to be more expressed in that well that's powerful I completely agree you've done it I'm on the road hmm yeah I mean I wouldn't say I'm but yeah I mean it's a struggle it is I mean to me one of the biggest sort of awakenings is that there is no there there mm-hmm you know it's kind of like it's just it's funny like what people always asked me because I was ask them you know like you know like art you know can you live a good life if you don't know or if you're not at that place you know where you feel like okay I'm finally living a good life and one of my big awakenings through a lot of these conversations and just introspection and living and doing things is that it's it's not a place that you get to it's a lens that you bring to where you are and you know like the moment you decide you know it's it's that's what it's about because there is no place that you get to write you know it's disappointing to hear that and yet you know but that's that's the reality you know not a true I mean it's disappointing but it but in a certain way also empowering because really like you know what that means that I can actually flip the switch right now today I just need to I need to figure out now I need to explore different set of tools that allow me to figure out how do I swap a different lens now for me the most powerful tools are practicing gratitude which is not my natural default state by any means and it requires a lot of focus on my part and attention in order to get to that place and being of service and when I'm in gratitude when I'm in service then my life is good and other people's lives are better today right good kind of guy was going to wrap up saying yes this is a good luck project in your mind if I asked you what does it mean to live a good life that's part of it being in gratitude being in being of service and being connected with yourself in a way that allows you to be fully expressed as your unique self I like that yeah so so enjoy getting to know a lot more about you and your journey and thank you for the conversation yeah thanks for having me it's great to be here yeah my pleasure so cool and I'm Jonathon fields my guest today has been rich role signing off for a good life front

Channel: Jonathan Fields

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Keywords: motivational, quotes, inspirational, videos, live a good life, jonathan fields, success, happiness, meaning of life, purpose, Rich Roll

Id: 9s5vl2KGGK0

Length: 37min 50sec (2270 seconds)

Published: Wed Jul 24 2013