Nuremberg Trial (Court TV, part 7)

lies in ruin Nazi leaders take the stand at Nuremberg to explain their parts in the defeated regime a senior official of the SS I consider the statement that I ever saw a gas chamber either in operation or at any other time wrong and incorrect a navy admiral may we take it that you were familiar with the effect of the existence of concentration camps never denied it end a tenancy on basic principles throughout my entire life I was a pacifist three men from diverse backgrounds are asked the same questions how and why [Music] fifty years ago judges and lawyers from four nations met in a courthouse in Nuremberg Germany their goal was to bring 22 of the top Nazi leaders to justice to try them in a court of law for crimes committed before and during the most devastating war the world had ever seen at the end of the war the victorious nations the United States Britain France and the Soviet Union were at first undecided as to how to deal with the Nazis who were responsible for the war eventually at the urging of Robert Jackson an Associate Justice of the US Supreme Court picked to head the American prosecution team the Allies agreed to put the Nazis on trial the trial took ten months and brought to the world's attention the horrors of the Nazi hero tonight we'll see the testimony of three of the Nuremberg defendants Ernst Kaltenbrunner a senior official of the SS and Gestapo the secret police charged with supervising the deaths of millions karl dönitz the Admiral of the German Navy and one of Hitler's top military leaders and Hjalmar Schacht a banker who helped Hitler finance the Nazi war machine the for prosecuting nations had captured these men and the other defendants as the Third Reich disintegrated before the advancing Allied armies they were charged on four counts conspiracy to wage a war of aggression waging that war and committing war crimes and committing crimes against humanity court tv's terry moran takes a look back at the end of the war and shows the courtroom and the prison where the nuremberg defendants were held and tried in july 1945 the american chief prosecutor robert jackson toured the bomb damaged cities of Europe searching for a place to hold the International Military Tribunal but nothing prepared him for Nuremberg of all the enemies leveled cities none reflects greater destruction than Nuremberg historian Eckert ETL Binger describes the devastation they kill by night oops it was a dead City giving off the odor of the tens of thousands of bodies trapped under the rubble Jackson chose Nuremberg because this courthouse the Palace of Justice this jail with the capacity to hold 12,000 inmates and this first-class hotel remained standing despite the eleven Allied bombing raids dates bellringer says the city was also picked because it was a symbol of the Nazi Party they held a first party rallies in 1927 in 1929 in the Macy's say they'll take number make it to a place for our organization the Nuremberg Laws promulgated from this structure what were they what happened [Music] construction work began to renovate the court room to accommodate hundreds of people but few of the spectators were German when the international tribunal was set up in 1945 did the German people support it no they didn't the Germans in the maturity they've used the message this is the last remaining cell block in the old prison in Nuremberg for more than a year this prison was the home of the Nuremberg defendants one to a cell isolated from each other during tests Speer and the others waited every day for the call from the American jailers as the trial wore on the typical day was very early up in the morning about six six o'clock and then breakfast crimes example and then the defendants were proud to say Palace of Justice the Nuremberg defendants were given individual cells with their names plastered on the door each was vice-president of the palace of justice class Costner says Goering and Speer were the favorites of the prison guards Speer because of his intelligence going because of his war record and spirit Kastner says during was addicted to painkillers he was very fat when he came here and he was always more film and under the conditions of the prison he got smaller and also the American medicines brought him off from his mafia illness so that he was in a better situation stages set in former times into churches or NZ forties so that it was good for us it was good for him before the trial started Hitler's Labour leader Robert Bly committed suicide by hanging himself in the toilet area of his cell Kastner says security was then tightened the Glock and all had asleep on the right side because then the face to the middle of the room and the soldier can always see how it is now a person might assume that convicting the top Nazis of war crimes would be like shooting fish in a barrel but as we're going to see over the next three hours it was not that simple because we will see an illustration of the spectrum of different types of defendants that were among the 22 on trial will see Ernst Kaltenbrunner an SS thug he virtually convicted himself Admiral Karl dönitz career military man questions though about whether his tactics violated the traditional rules of war and finally harm our shot a financier was found by the Allies in a concentration camp had been implicated in the attack against Hitler said he was innocent and indeed he was acquitted to help us understand what a which is a more subtle and sophisticated and complex situation than we might have thought we have as our guest commentator Burt newborn professor of constitutional and civil law civil rights at NYU Law School and it wasn't that simple was it no it wasn't it wasn't first of all because this is the first time it was ever done in history as late as 1944 Churchill wanted to shoot the leaders of the Nazis he said no he said Victor's justice is the barrel of a gun and what we'll do is we'll shoot them Robert Jackson who was the Associate Justice of the Supreme Court vigorously argued that we should try to do something that at the end of a war that was after all supposed to end all wars it was naive that we thought that but we thought that that by by putting them on trial and attempting to do justice on an individual basis we could somehow create a precedent that more would triumph over force in the case of dirty he made a pretty good case that in permitting Allied sailors to perish in the water after he had torpedo the ships he was protecting his submarines from attack however he was a virulent and heesu medic and and so that in a way put him in a bag with the rest of the night i think i think that's right i think i think what two things were going on here first they were being tried for doing specific things but secondly they were being tried for being the men who allowed the most beastial regime in history to flourish and so keeping them apart was very different turn-ins try to argue that as an admiral i behaved like any other military man would babe just like Admiral Nimitz would behave who was the head of the American forces but as a human being his behavior had been so wretched and dreadful that it was almost impossible to take him seriously when he put his do I think one of the things they proved at Nuremberg was that evil acts do flow from evil thoughts and that's part of what was happening in the case of dirty now in case you missed part of our week-long coverage of the Nuremberg trial will be re airing our complete coverage on Court TV this weekend November 18th and November 19 that'll take a break and when we come back defendant earth skirts Kelton Bruner charged with responsibility for the murder of millions and ostritz he takes the stain Adolf Hitler's Third Reich was funded by sophisticated bankers armed by efficient industrialists and led into battle by accomplished military commanders but there was a thuggish quality to his political and security leadership right from the start and this was obvious among some of the defendants at Nuremberg five months after the trial opened at Nuremberg Ernst Kaltenbrunner took the stand in his own defense he was the highest-ranking official of the dreaded SS and the Gestapo the secret police to have survived the war Alton Brunner denied any knowledge of the crimes committed by Hitler barbarous security police the towering Scarface turns Kaltenbrunner was a third-generation lawyer who joined the Nazi Party in the 1930s an alcoholic who believe that all German women a fertile age should be required to bear children houghton Brunner was ruthless in his bribe to please Adolf Hitler on the Nazi organizational chart he was chief of the Gestapo and overseer of the concentration camps jobs he claimed really belonged to his late boss I'm McKinley but witnesses said he had personally ordered the torture and deaths of hundreds of thousands of Jews by the time Carleton Verner got to the dock and Nuremberg he had suffered a stroke but maintained a sinister appearance now this as I said earlier is really the classic Nazi defendant and one of the interesting things to me is that his defense was so inept his own defense lawyer called a witness at least one who testified about these atrocities yeah well one of the things that was interesting about some of the German defense alerts in this case is that they they had never experienced cross-examination this was the first time because both in civil law you don't get much cross-examination and in Nazi law he got very little cross-examination so this was the first time they ever did it and a lot of the most damning evidence against the war criminals came out during the defense phase because they thought they were cross-examining and what they were doing was letting in huge amounts of evidence and you know the thing you see is that these witnesses who came in and in the cases will see with Calvin Bruner just dammed him and defense witness they were of course hanging themselves and in any American case they could have taken the fifth they would never have test exactly exactly well remember that although this has all the forms of the trial there were some very substantial deviations hearsay was widely accepted there was no there was no fifth amendment no jury it was as fair as any judgment of a defeated enemy has ever been but it was far from a formal trial with his father now the video that you're seeing here was filmed by the US Army for uses soundbites in the movie House newsreels of that era and in order to present it in a longer form Court TV filled in the blanks with the audio tape actual trial record supplemented by freeze frames of the courtroom we begin today's testimony with excerpts from the cross-examination of ernst kaltenbrunner by US prosecutor john amon on direct examination captain Bruner who was second-in-command to the man who supervised Hitler's plan to kill the Jews house the burglar had declared that he knew nothing about what was happening in the camps where millions died no I do not assume any responsibility regard I was already told yesterday of the testimony of four latigo I consider the statement that I ever saw a gas chamber either in operation or any other time wrong incorrect you had no personal knowledge of and did nothing personal about the program for the extermination of the Jews is that correct to oppose 9 estimate no I was against it from the moment I knew of this as a fight II convinced myself I raised objections with Hitler and Himmler and the final result was that they were stopped and therefore you assume no responsibility for anything done in connection with the program for the extermination of the Jews right do it and it's the same thing apply to the program for forced labor right yep and the same thing applies does it not and to be racing of the Warsaw Ghetto yeah what are you appointed with Johan kanda who makes this affidavit well you will note from the affidavit that he lived in last that he was an inmate of the concentration camp at more thousand from 21 March 39 until 5 May 45 that besides we work in the kitchen he also worked in the crematorium from the 9th of May and he worked the heating for the cremation of the bodies now if you'll turn to the second page at the top but have you ever seen countin runner at mo Towson on a visit at any time yes do you remember when it was in 42 and 43 can you give it more exactly maybe the month I do not know the date do you remember only this one visit in the air 42 or 43 answer I remember kallenbrunner three times what year between 42 and 43 question tell us in short what did you think about these visits of countin runner which you described that is what did you see what did you do and when did you see that he was or was not present at such executions after countin brother was accompanied by I Gruber shoots Z rice back Mayer Street Weiser and some other people countin Brunner went laughing in the gas chamber then the people were brought from the bunker to be executed and then all three kinds of executions hanging shooting in the back of the neck and gassing were demonstrated after the dust had disappeared we had to take away the bodies is that true or applause the banner what the barrel phone under my oath I wish to state solemnly is that not a single word of these statements is true you may have noticed there that there was almost embarrassment on the part of some of the other defendants that part of touts and runners testimony we're gonna take a break here when we return defendant nurse counter runner has asked more about his role in the Nazi concentration camps as we continued US prosecutor John Heyman continues his cross-examination of defendant Ernst Kaltenbrunner the top SS man to survive the war and the only representative of Hitler's secret police to face justice at Nuremberg as we mentioned before courtroom observers at the time said that some of the other defendants watching from the prisoner's dock appeared embarrassed by Conklin Brunner's testimony here it is concentration camp shortly before the end of the war did you understand the question to Fannin yeah yes you asked me who had given the order for the killing of the inmates at Mauthausen at the end of the war and to that I reply that such an order is unknown to me I gave only one order of this regard to Mauthausen and that was to the effect that the entire camp and all internees were to be surrendered to the enemy without ill treatment this all of us dictated to me in the presence of the witness doctor Whitehall and taken to Mauthausen by a courier officer I draw your attention to the statement of dr. Whitehall in which he confirms a fact a questionnaire has been sent to a second person by my defense counsel I requested a similar statement from him but it is still unanswered ask you about an order to kill all inmates at motels and concentration camps shortly before the end of the war who was responsible for that order were you nine shall be destroyed this time important you this time you are acquainted with the person who tells the story Z rice you're acquainted with him Z rice - yes I knew T rice and now at the middle of the next page paragraph begins according to an order by Himmler I was to liquidate all prisoners on behalf of SS open-loop insurer dr. countin Brunner the prisoners were to be led into the tunnels of the factory workers and only one entrance was to be left open I have not yet found the passage a gassing plant was built in concentration camp for thousands by order of the former garrison doctor dr. press back camouflaged as a bathroom prisoners were gassed in this camouflaged bathroom apart from that a specially built automobile commuted between more thousand and uses in which prisoners were gassed while traveling the idea for the construction of this automobile was dr. with sickies SS Sultan stupid Fuhrer and pharmacist I myself never put any gas into this automobile I only drove it but I know that prisoners were being gassed gassing of the prisoners was done on the urging of SS Topsham Fuhrer dr. Chris Beck paragraph everything that we carried out was ordered by the right security main office furthermore by Estes obergruppenführer Muller or dr. Calvin Brennan the latter being chief of the security police it's fish it is false I have never given an order to the Mauthausen camp with the exception of that one order which I was entitled to do on the strength of special powers and for the contents and transmission of which I have offered sufficient evidence Mauthausen was never under my jurisdiction in any other way and I could not issue any such orders the prosecution was perfectly well and it must have been proved to them by dozens of testimonies that I had never had any authority over Mauthausen do you recall from the evidence before this Tribunal that some four hundred thousand Jews were first put into the ghetto and then in the final action Stroup cleared out about 56,000 of which more than fourteen thousand were killed do you recall that evidence I do not recall any details of this statement but I know about this matter I have already stated today and did you know that substantially all of these 400,000 Jews were murdered at the extermination plan that trip linka did you know that defender what did you have to do with the final raising of the Warsaw Ghetto nothing as usual I had nothing to do with it as I already stated well let's get on to his affidavit if you have it before you now yeah my name is Cole cholesky I was adjutant to dr. Vaughn salmon Frankenberg from November 42 until April 43 while he was Estes and Pulitzer Fuehrer of Warsaw I remember the case of 300 foreign Jews who had been collected in the Polsky hotel by the security police at the end of the ghetto action kallenbrunner ordered the security police to transport these people away during my time in Warsaw the security police had been in charge of matters concerning the underground the security police handled these matters independently of the SS and Pulitzer Fuhrer and received its orders from calton Brunner in Berlin when the leader of the underground in Warsaw was captured in June or July 43 he was flown directly to countin Branagh in Bareilles are those statements true or false to Fannin these statements are without exception wrong persons that have been read to you today it is not true and can be refuted other statements I have read to you today prosecutor I'm happened to be a fire under thinking yes if you bring false accusations against me I must declare them to be false I cannot say yes to everything of which you accuse me just because the prosecution is wrong in determining who is Himmler's representative here now it's not at all unusual when you have a trial in the United States and Bobby multiple defendants to have a separation between them and saw them appearing to blame the others but Bernie born I don't think I've ever seen as overt a demonstration from the co-defendants as we saw there well of course you had a division a dramatic division both in terms of personality and in terms of the background the person who was most disturbed was Goering he's the fellow at the end throughout the trial he staunchly defended the Third Reich made no apologies committed suicide rather than be hung he resisted to the end he's watching Carlton would essentially say wasn't my fault somebody else did it and he's saying to himself that is a two-bit thug I don't want to have anything to do with two-bit thugs now I want to ask about the procedure here because two people who watch as many of our viewers do American trials it must strike a number of them as a rather odd you have a witness on the stand and to impeach me you don't read too his previous statement which is inconsistent with what he's saying now you read something someone else says that's inconsistent well this is because there was a fundamental judgment made when they were setting up the trial that they would use civil trial rules not necessarily American trial rules but the trial rules that would be used in France and in Germany and there they used depositions in our system a lot of this would be excluded as hearsay but most of the evidence against the defendants in the Nuremberg trial was not presented by live testimony it was presented through sworn statements that had been gathered and brought to the trial and read to the defendants and that's what they're doing to count now they are reading to him the sworn statements a person after person who identified him as a leading figure in the extermination camps now as a product of the American system just bother you at all look all right well obviously if you're looking at it from the front from a strict fairness standpoint he never had a chance to cross-examine he never had a chance to confront the witnesses against him and do the cross-examination of course the argument was Europe the way it was in those days was impossible to bring them there and the pain of asking the victims to stand in that room and look at him and have to go through it was felt to be too much to ask them to bear and so very little that was done when we returned from this commercial break we'll hear from the man who actually ran a sports meet off us a man whose testimony continues to haunt the conscience of the world [Music] between I me not not and not all the lawyers right anymore would be in a similar domestic prosecution of a criminal group that comment on lawyering at Nuremberg came from Herbert Wexler who worked as chief legal advisor to Francis Biddle the u.s. judge at Nuremberg each of the 22 Nuremberg defendants was entitled to an attorney of his choice but the quality of counsel vary greatly many people say that the lawyer for Ernst Kaltenbrunner could Kaufmann did the worst job of all for his client Kaufmann was one of several defense lawyers who just didn't seem to comprehend and understand the adversarial system which was copied from the US and British law that was used at Nuremberg Kaufmann committed a colossal blunder by calling to the stand Rudolf höss as a witness for cotton breath now HUS not to be confused with defendant Rudolf Hess had been the Commandant of Auschwitz during much of the war and his chilling testimony obviously didn't help defendant Carlton Brunner or any other Nazi leaders on trial at Nuremberg one note until this point in our coverage of this historic trial we shown only film and still pictures taken during courtroom testimony plus documentary film shown as evidence at Nuremberg however when HUS takes the stand you will see cutaways to the subject of this testimony Asheville's and as with all of the concentration camp footage that we have shown viewer discretion is advised what happened at a schvitz is not in dispute here what's issue is is who was responsible witness your far-reaching significant your perhaps the only one who can throw some light upon certain hidden aspect and can tell which people gave the orders for the destruction of the European Jewry and can further state how this order was carried out and to what degree the execution was kept a secret will you kindly put questions till 1933 who where the commander of the camp at Auschwitz is that true and during that time hundreds of thousands of human beings were sent to their death there is that correct yes is it true that in 1941 your order to Berlin to see him live please stay briefly what was discussed yes in the summer of 1941 I was summoned to berlin to I feel Himmler to receive personal orders he told me something to the effect I do not remember the exact words that the Fuhrer had given the order for a final solution of the Jewish Question we the SS must carry out their order if it is not carried out now than the Jews will later on destroy the German people he had chosen outlets on account of its easy access by rail and also because the extensive site offered space were measures ensuring isolation did Himmler tell you that this plant actually had to be treated as a secret right matter he told me that I was not even allowed to say anything about it to my immediate superior gruppenfuhrer looks this conference can turn the two of us only and I wish to observe the strictest secrecy you have just mentioned the inspector of concentration camps at that time and he was immediately subordinate to the right does the expression secret right matter mean that no one was permitted to make even the slightest allusion to outside us without endangering his own life secret matter means that no one was allowed to speak about these matters with any person and everyone promised upon his life to keep the utmost secrecy I'll take a break here and then we'll return with more of fusses testimony welcome back as Rudolf höss continues his punishing testimony oddly presented as part of ernst kaltenbrunner defense case he tells a matter-of-fact story of atrocities and murder no this was not on trial at Nuremberg and the defense theory seems to have been that he would take responsibility for the mass murders committed by the Hitler regime therefore shifting it away from Kaltenbrunner during the testimony that we did not see here HUS told the court he did not believe Calton Brunner's claimed that he knew nothing about the death camps HUS said kallenbrunner had to know because he was the right-hand man to Heinrich Himmler the man who ran the SS and Hitler's program to exterminate Europe's Jews so here thus explains why a schvitz was chosen as a concentration camp location will you briefly tell us whether it is correct that the temple ash which was completely i describing the measures taken to ensure as far as possible the secrecy of carrying out the task given to you was about three kilometers away from the town about 20,000 acres of the surrounding country had been cleared of all former inhabitants and the entire area could be entered only by SS men or civilian employees who had special passes the actual compound called Birkenau where later on the extermination camp was constructed was situated two kilometers from the house camp the camp installations themselves that is to say the provisional installations used at first were deep in the woods and could from nowhere be detected by the eye in addition to that this area had been declared a prohibited area and even members of the SS who did not have a special pass could not enter it those as far as went to church it was impossible for anyone except authorized persons to enter that area during what period did these transports arrive and about how many people roughly were in such a transport until 1944 certain operations were carried out that irregular intervals in the different country so that one cannot speak of a continuous flow of incoming transports it was always a matter of four to six weeks during those four to six weeks two to three trains containing about 2,000 persons each arrive daily these trains were first of all shunted to a siding in the Birkenau region and two locomotives then went back the guards who had accompanied the transport had to leave the area at once and the persons who had been brought in were taken over by God's belonging to the camp they were examined by two SS medical officers as to their fitness for work the intern is capable of work at once marked two outfits or two the camp at Birkenau and those incapable of work were at first taken to the provisional installations then later to the newly constructed crematorium font and after the arrival of the transports were the victims stripped of everything they had did they have to undress completely did they have to surrender their valuables is that true yes and then they immediately went to their death according to your knowledge did these people know what was in store for them the majority of them did not our steps were taken to keep them in doubt about it and suspicions would not arise that they were to go to their death for instance all doors and all walls were inscriptions to the effect that they were going to undergo at the lousing operation or take a shower this was made known in several languages to the in attorneys by other intern EES who had come in with earlier transports and who were being used as auxiliary crews during the whole action and then you told me the other day that by guessing said ended in a period of 3 to 15 minutes is that correct also told me that even before death finally said in the victims fell into a state of unconsciousness yes I was able to find out myself or from what was told to me by medical officers the time necessary for reaching unconsciousness or death varied according to the temperature and the number of people present in the chambers loss of consciousness took place within a few seconds or a few minutes your self ever feel pity for the victims thinking of your own family and children in spite of this all these doubts which I had to only one and decisive argument was the strict order and the reason given for it by the reichsfuehrer Himmler us himself by the way was hanged by Polish authorities in 1947 now you may be asking yourself why in the world was this personal testimony about personally supervising murders presented in this case by a witness for one of the defendants and to try to help us explain that we are now join the alan ryan he was known in the sort of with the short title those of us who covered the justice department as the head Nazi hunter for the Justice Department from years past he's now an adjunct professor Boston College Law School how'd that happen well the I think as you said earlier afraid that there was no concept of cross-examination in the end the adverse to the testimony that that came out I think Calvin Bruner Caliburn his attorney Kaufman thought that that by bringing in this this comment down about rates that he would shift attention away from from Calvin burners it was more or less bureaucratic why wasn't he a defendant it's a good question he could have been a defendant he was at least equal of most of the ones that were I think I the indictment in charge for crimes against humanity doesn't even mention outfits it mentions a number of sites in Russia where Jews were killed what never mentions Auschwitz and I think it would have been taking the focus away from the from the defendants who were there to get deeply into the deaths is there any feeling that the Americans particularly Robert Jackson we're being a bit too theoretical in their approach to this it was a there was a sense that Jackson saw this as an opportunity to create a law that would govern nations and that was to be at a level of theory and that he didn't want this soil bye-bye lots of testimony about individuals doing bad things he really wanted to put the German system on trial not German people on trial that's why he took the first count of the United States prosecuted the aggressive workouts and left all of the other stuff to the other nations and in retrospect now it was a terrible mistake because we missed the chance to be able to get an absolutely irrefutable documentary about what happened there because that was the last chance to gather all those facts wasn't there a danger perhaps though that the story presented to the world might have been not these are the perpetrators but these are the victims yes there is that danger what had the analogy that comes to mind when I think of this is Cyrus book the rise and fall of the Third Reich which came out 15 years after these trials that book is 500 pages long it is a minut look at the diplomatic and political history of the Third Reich and says barely a word about the about the death camps and the victims and I think that was that was the approach that the Jackson and his particularly the French and British prosecutors were taking here and the the Russians were interested only in what happened in Russia it would have taken attention away from the from the diplomatic military the political side we left it to the post we put on Fritchie who are complete weapons we're gonna take a break at this point and then when we come back you ask Colonel John amen the tenacious lawyer who cross-examine Ernst Kaltenbrunner takes on Rudolf höss coming up next such a method of collective action was naturally necessary than a formation was to be attacking the tribunal considers Nazi tactics in sea warfare as the Navy's highest officer offers his defense and later a Nazi financier is tried for providing the cash that fuelled Hitler's war effort coming up next on our look at the Nuremberg trial welcome back on cross-examination u.s. prosecutor Colonel John Heyman reads to witness rudolf us from an affidavit US had given to the prosecution again is a witness for the defendant ernst kaltenbrunner the highest-ranking leader of the SS the organization that ran the concentration camps and he was the highest one to survive the war the cross-examiner john amon was the associate trial counsel to chief US prosecutor Robert Jackson he was one of the leaders of the u.s. prosecution team at Nuremberg we're gonna take a quick look at this important player in the Nuremberg trial Amon was a feisty New Yorker who'd been a Marine during World War one and became a racket busting attorney in civilian life and then served in the Army during World War two Robert Jackson had assigned Amon to supervise pretrial interrogations for the Nuremberg proceedings and then when Jackson eventually decided to base the u.s. prosecution case on documents rather than the testimony of witnesses Amon was not pleased to a mentor trial was about witnesses not about taping here Colonel Amon takes on a schvitz manager rubra rudolf us asking him about the Nazi plan to exterminate the Jews I command a touchless until 1 December 43 and estimate that at least two million five hundred thousand victims were exterminated there and at least another half making a total of about this remainder and used for slave labor the [Music] from 15 to kill the people in the death chamber depending upon formatic condition we knew when the people were dead because they're screaming stop we usually waited 1/2 hour before we open and gold was melted down into the cap others were sent immediately to the extermination class children of tender years were invariably exterminated still another improvement we made they were to be exterminated and at Auschwitz we endeavoured to fool the victims into thinking that they were to go through a delousing process of course frequently they realized our true intentions and we sometimes had riots and difficulties due to that fact very frequently women would hide their children under the clothes but of course when we found them we would send the children in to be exterminated we were required to carry out these extermination and all the people living in the surrounding community knew that exterminations were going on it was yes Alan Ryan our guest commentator was it one time had the job for the Justice Department of hunting down and prosecuting the Nazis that were still at large do you find it incredible that this testimony sort of just fell into the trial by accident it did come in almost as an afterthought because if Hearst had not been called as a witness by Calvin Bruner a defense witness there'd be no place for this evidence to go it surprised me that there was some footage there that you could not see from from Auschwitz yes there's some that's very familiar there's others that that has not been shown before either because it's very strong or because it's you were the first ones to dig it up you recognize someone in one of those things there's when in the scene where the twins are walking around the corner there are two seven or eight-year-old girls one of them survived and there's now I think I believe her name is Eva Kor she's now the head of the survivor twins organizations the twins having been selected dr. Mengele they thought they could in conduct some sort of yes his his his thought was that twins were the perfect scientific method because you could do different things to different children who were genetically the same and then see what your results were and the experiments terrific don't you think you need to have a human face as grisly as this was in a trial I have to tell you that just after after having seen these films more times than I ever wanted to even imagine seeing them again the notion of using the law to deal with barbarism of this in Normandy is itself very difficult I mean how do you try are you saying that Joe Chill was right but sure Churchill was wrong I mean you look at these feet and say well Churchill said that that should simply execute the leadership of the Nazi or the Nazi regime because because Victor's justice is all they're entitled to the truth of the matter is Jackson was right by putting them on trial this way and by forcing a record you really have a record that the world can't forget Jackson was right and the thing that is eerie about Jackson's closing speech which I think is one of the great forensic speeches in the history of law is that he says one of the consequences of this of this trial is that no one will ever be able to deny the enormity of these crimes now it wasn't until 35 years later that anyone even thought and yet what Jackson was doing with films like this was making a historical record and and and here we are 50 years later the beneficiaries of that well a historical record yes but the thing that you see here is that the state of communications in those days that is no television pictures were presented only in sound bytes of half a minute or so in movie in in movie houses probably when you were out getting your popcorn at the start and I guess that's why this powerful testimony I mean I was young but I don't remember this at the time and I really don't think that he got much exposure I think Jackson was ahead of his time I think Jackson at the dawn of the television age realized through the use of the films that have been taken upon the liberation of the camp's just how important that would that would be from the historical record whether it made an impression on the Saturday afternoon moviegoers or not as a different question now saw that right for now we'll take a break coming up next the case of Navy Admiral Karl dönitz one of Hitler's chief military leaders Admiral Karl dönitz was the head of the German Navy he was a colorless lifetime naval officer who probably never imagined that he would someday be on trial for his life as an alleged war criminal but two things happen he developed the German Wolfpack submarine strategy an innovation in warfare that caused heavy allied losses and was accused of sinking merchant vessels against the traditional laws of sea warfare and he was surprisingly chosen by Hitler to succeed the Fuhrer at Germany's head of state thus he became one of the seemingly least sinister of the defendants in the docket as head of Germany's submarine service called der Nets invented the wolfpack submarine strategy a plan credited with sinking more than 2,400 Allied ships in January of 1943 at off Hitler put the strong-willed sailor in command of the entire German Navy Grand Admiral der Nets made Hitler his political compass mirroring the viewers anti-semitic views so much so that Durnan says nirenberg lawyer Otto Krantz Bueller worried about the content of some of his client speeches I've made when this was a first-rate military leader this fantastic memory for persons and for events but in my opinion rather of political insight I really didn't didn't is to miss his speeches and I was when I was asked to defend him I had some in objection because of his speeches but I nevertheless I did because he was my commander in one of the speeches during its said I would rather eat dirt than have my grandson grow up in the Jewish spirit and faith before he committed suicide Hitler's surprise the other Nazi leaders by naming der nets to succeed him he was Germany's new Fuhrer upon Hitler's death and at the time of his arrest we're presenting the prosecution case against during its along with his defence case and tonight's coverage in its case against der it's the prosecution that tempted to show that the Admiral submarine tactics violated the rules of war by calling to the stand one of his u-boat flotilla commanders Carl Miller we will repeat yourself I swear by God I swear by God the Almighty an omniscient EMI msti dissident but I will speak to pure truth that is defined as our power Heights are and will with home and have nothing Suzette's about it sit down if you wish karl-heinz Mela you held the rank of Corps veteran Capitan in the German Navy cowboy yes sir and if you served in the German Navy since 1930 yes sir in the autumn of 1942 where you head of the tip you you belt turtle ah yeah boy yes what were your duties as commander that Litella my main duties as flotilla commander consisted of the outfitting of you goats which were to be sent to the front from home bases and giving them the orders of the u-boat command had you any special responsibility to u-boat commanders in respect of the orders yeah boy yes sir it was my responsibility to see that outgoing you votes were provided with the new orders of the u-boat command any responsibility in explaining the orders Kiba feeler there who votes Bureau Darin Yuma see a claw would I enjoy take the orders of the u-boat commander always very clear and unambiguous if there were any ambiguities I used to have these ambiguities cleared of myself at the staff of the commander in chief of u-boats now do you remember an order in the autumn of 1942 dealing with my face yeah boy in September 1970 yes in September of 1942 I received a wireless message at the rest to all commanders at sea and it dealt with that question normally where did his orders yeah boy now I know we're better yes never fear in my opinions you aura need only have read like this it is pointed out on you that the rescue measures have to be discontinued for reasons of safety for the submarines this is how I think the order should have been worded if only rescue measures had been forbidden are you are you saying that if it had been intended only to prohibit rescue measures it would have been sufficient to refer to the previous order yeah boy pathetic induced yes sir that would have been enough from your knowledge of the way orders were worded can you tell the tribunal what you understood this order to me never fear is that diamond presentation the ornament in my own opinion that or ZOA rescue measures remain prohibited on the other hand it was desirable in the case of the sinking should be no survivors yes because when I was taken prisoner it was claimed that I was the author of these orders and I do not want to have this charge connected with my name Lord the witness is available for examination from a colleague and cross-examination now after this break Mira's testimony focuses on whether Admiral dönitz ordered his u-boat commanders to kill the survivors of torpedo attacks the prosecution has attempted to show that Admiral donitz ordered his u-boat commanders to kill allied sailors in the water of cross-examination his defense lawyer Otto Hans Muller attempts to show that during its intended something far less sinister transfer any defendant wish to ask the witness any questions chuckles at my Donuts invasion that's just pathetic in which sentence of the order do you see a hidden invitation to kill survivors or to destroy the rescue facilities Indian facts in the center the second I shall read to you each sentence of the order separately very well I read from the document d630 yes for Unger's I think the stripper women won no attempt of any kind must be made at rescuing members of ships sunk and this includes picking of persons in the water and putting them in lifeboats riding capsized lifeboats and handing over food and water these are absolutely forbidden do you see it in this sentence No carefully mode you want to reexamine when you got this order of the 17th of September 1942 did you take it merely as prohibiting rescue or as going further here feel fine I'm sunk Jesus repeats oh that's tell Nick hi when I received that order I noticed that it was not entirely clear as orders of the Biddy you normally were one could see an ambiguity in it

Channel: RobertHJacksonCenter

Views: 35,978

Rating: 4.6313992 out of 5

Keywords: Doenitz, Rudolf Hoess, Karl Doenitz, Burt Neuborne, Herbert Wechsler, allan Ryan, Nuremberg Trial, Auschwitz

Id: 1gSJkKxaWYw

Length: 67min 15sec (4035 seconds)

Published: Sun Feb 11 2018