Mystic Mentoring Thursday 13th May 2021 U.S Eastern

in chunks and going through and reading a small portion of it and thinking on it and then picking it up again so it'll take me a while to get through it it will i would imagine well you are you are a reader and sort of studying so you're sort of used to reading things that way i mean i'm i'm not a reader really in that way so i tend when i do read something that's actually quite interesting i really struggle to read it fast because i do something similar but it's like i tried to get into it and experience it so i'm not i you know i'd rather listen to something we'll see with this one i think if i read it really fast like i normally do i'm going to miss out on a lot of it and that's why i'm purposely slowing myself down and taking at a portion at the time to really pay attention to what i'm reading to because otherwise i can rip through something really quickly and normally do read that way yeah i i to be honest i really struggle to to read things fast just because if they're interesting i want to absorb it so i do sort of ponder over what i'm reading quite often um but generally i'll i'd rather see something or listen to something because i i i take things in better by listening and whatever and i like making notes so you know it's easier to make notes i think what i'd find when i'm listening to something rather than reading it but yeah so yes it's uh it's it is quite a um big book 444 pages i think i think the next one is going to be bigger than that so how much time are you allowing yourself to root to write volume 3 well i'm i'm on just about finishing chapter seven and i think there may well be nine or ten chapters possibly okay so i'm pretty a long way through it you know and i'm you know it's already yeah quite quite a lot um and and a lot more bible verses in it because there's a lot of okay trying to unpack why people believe what they do about certain things that i why i don't um well because i think it says this rather than that so there's a lot more of that um in a sense sense less there is there's obviously some testimony and there's some journey of my story of coming into all of those things um but less just lots just journal entries or things that describe that um although you know there's there's some things where god has told me what to do about it or encouraged me to write it which i was a bit slow on the uptake of doing to be honest because you know it's it's controversial but yeah probably as controversial if not more than what the last book is you know because it it some people read that and think now i don't believe that so when it hits into some of the deeper rooted things which are part of the deception that a lot of us have been under um then that tends to provoke a more emotional reaction you know um which you know yeah i'm prepared for yeah because that's that's the reason really is to help get people to think why do i believe that is that true why have i always believed that and you know particularly when it comes to the restoration of all things and it's okay saying we believe it but what contributes to our believing it and does things that we think about the future which is not restorational hinder us believing it because it does if you think the future is laden with doom gloom and misery and destruction it's hard to really believe in the restoration of all things because it just creates double mindedness you don't want to believe in the restoration of all things yeah but in the earth going to get destroyed by fire or all of that type of thing you know you have that in so many people and they're on this journey of coming out of a lot of that but they're not fully there yet and some of the things associated with that they won't have probably realized or heard you know and that will be the challenge because yeah people oh well yeah i don't believe in the rapture anymore but they don't actually realize what else is associated with that root of eschatology which also contributes to a lot of other future based perspectives which are also hindering you know fully embracing the restoration so yeah it's it's it's a it's an interesting process journey um doing a lot more sort of research on it in a sense um and what do you believe you know this you know this is this is the problem you research something well who do you believe you know do we believe it's because it's in an encyclopedia or on wikipedia or or any source or is are there deeper educational sources like education.net and things like that which do have a lot of references and are much more academic i don't want the book to be a dry academic book obviously but in some senses you know if you're going to be looking at facts and what happened and history and different things whose version do you believe because there are various versions out there the popular version the grade school version the university version the conspiracy version i mean there's there's lots you know oh yeah yeah of different perspectives on the same thing and which one do you believe which one are you going to believe mostly people believe what already aligns with what they already think is true so they don't really do an awful lot of research they just oh yeah that fits in um without really engaging it and i think when i was looking at all this and all the misinformation and all the different versions you know i had to i took it back to to god to the father and asked you know what what do i do with this how do i make a decision on what i believe or what version i think i believe you know what do i do when there are five different versions and they're all coming from you could say reliable sources um but every version who contradicts each other are potentially reliable sources to those who believe in that version you know um and they will be discredited by those who don't believe in that version for some reason um and in the end the father really sort of said well you've spent enough time with me and you have spent enough time with the truth and you know he joked about jesus being the greatest fact checker that there is and in a sense then really put me down to what frequency does it carry does it carry a resonance which is what you have felt when you're in my presence or not and actually that's what i've gone with in where i can't categorically say historically or in any other way this or this i've gone with that and if i'm really seriously sort of like i need to be really clear here i'll go back and ask him and say is this give me your version of this events and sometimes i've gone back into history and he's taking me through history to show me the events so i have actually seen them from first-hand experience particularly the separation and division of christianity into denominations right throughout history of how that happened he took me back and showed me the decisions that were made to separate over certain issues all the way through from the catholic to the orthodox to the protestant from the different protestant versions the different orthodox versions where all of you know what was behind it you know what spirit was behind it well division obviously yeah and so that was quite an interesting journey um because it gave me some insight without um without needing to do a huge lot of reference where i just then checked up you know okay yeah this this did happen this is people divided over this at this point in history when did that happen you know and that for me you know as well as taking me back through history and showing me the the history of empire and the babylonian you know babel build your own kingdom effectively in your own name and where that has sort of come through history with the different world governmental systems and how eventually they all collapsed and another one took their place and ultimately sort of in daniel with the four the statue with the four different you know gold silver and bronze and iron and clay and that you know type thing so it was that all of it was really to say there is an agenda that has been birthed into humanity by the tree of the knowledge of good and evil which is not the agenda god had for mankind and i differentiate between mankind and humanity because humanity is our attempt to create something in the name of man whereas mankind is what god created after his own image that we would be like and reproduce after our kind like god you know that was the whole point but humanity humanism is based in our own agenda to essentially name ourselves independently of god so there's a history of where humanity has subverted mankind which will be part of the one of the next chapters i guess now you realize using the word mankind indicates that you're not very woke or politically correct yeah well yeah but it's it's in the bible oh yeah well because and that's not very vulgar politically correct there's no male or female in the kingdom or with god either so i'll make that absolutely clear when i use that oh i'm just joking with you because because other people will think that oh yeah you know because some people will read something or and it's just like oh don't agree with it you know depending on where they've been hurt and damaged in their lives and if it's particularly women who have had some sort of suppression or abuse or other things then that can trigger you know um but it's just a term that reflects all of who god created you know in terms of people is show all his children you could say children kind if you like because we're all children somebody will come up with a reason though not to use that though yeah probably so yeah um but yeah it's a it's quite an interesting journey to come into a deeper understanding of why we are where we are how we got here and how we can move on from here you know not get stuck you know and not you know support that which is actually opposite to that which god wants because we've been deceived you know and you know all religion is a deception out of the tree of the knowledge of good evil so any expression which is relig is a religious expression which leaves in a sense the relationship from that is in in itself a deception you know which majority of mankind humankind humanity probably humanity has reject effectively accepted essentially one way or another um so yeah yeah i like francois de toys version of humanity yeah well yes yeah yeah because all everything is brought back to that restored innocence you know of this is this is what this is who i intended this is what i intended and that restored innocence then brings that identity and we we become we find our identity in that restored place of sins face to face which then brings us into a deeper revelation of god himself but also ourselves um yeah so yeah very very uh interesting journey so all right okay let's throw it up has anyone got any questions and stuff you want to talk about well since you put the bible out there let's look at the bible okay um you know i followed you quite a bit and i think i have a pretty good grasp of mike parsons as related to the bible so you listen to what i'm saying and correct me uh and i think i'm pretty much anyhow in line with where you are and particularly back to my uh mark verkle and he talks about the 500-year history from the protestant revolution and he uses verbiage uh i think along the lines of you would rather trust in essentially his relationship in hearing the voice of god as opposed to 500 years of rational systematic theology and i think that that's pretty much where i'm at as well having said that uh it seems to me i i sense and i've heard you say the bible was written not to us but for us uh i like ii timothy 3 16 that says all scripture is given by inspiration of god my take on that would be all script that is inspired is of god so whether it is the quote bible writings that are inspired whether it's books that you have written and thousands of others have written where there are writing script that are inspired of god they are of god so a lot of the bible you know you got the catholic with additive books you've got the 66 the typically we think of canaanites israel judaism talks about the 39 old testament a lot of the writings are not of god in the sense that god did not i don't believe inspire be it individuals like joshua moses to go into the cities and kill mommies and daddies and teenagers and babies and a lot of the depiction as i see it of god are maligned in light of fallen humanity's projection of themselves of their own image upon god and then jewish idiomatic expression etc that those things were really not be direct as such inspiration as god given i think there's enough truth in the bible quote unquote that every person on planet earth that has ever lived canada uh know god and walk with god etc etc and um so anyhow share with me if you think i'm pretty much in line with what i think you believe i i think so i mean i would say i probably wouldn't say the bible was written for us i think it was written to the people that it was written to and i don't think god actually intended us to build and base our life on what was written in a period of transition we're not in now that's not to say that the truth contained within that um isn't useful because it is one of the things that that which is inspired is useful for it is useful for um but i'm not sure god intended it to be put into the format that it is and been canonized and then restricted as there is no more after this point i definitely don't believe that i think every generation should have their own innocence scriptures that god has written inspired to be written for them and is relevant to them i don't think most of the context of the what was written particularly what jesus spoke to the jewish people that he was audience was really designed for them in helping them out of or what was coming and john's gospel i think was much more speaking to us um not saying you can't draw truth from it because obviously what jesus spoke was true but it may not be still true because he was speaking it into a situation which is no longer here in in a sense it may still be true if people who are jews read it because it still might speak to them about the scriptures and traditions and everything else um and pointing to him um as being one with god and if you've seen me you've seen the father but actually most of the way in which it was written to them doesn't make sense to most people today and then they try and make sense of it by coming up with all sorts of theology and doctrines to explain how it works today when actually i don't think we need to do that because we have the holy spirit and we have jesus who promises to speak to us today so i think as there were letters that paul wrote to the romans and as there were books that we call of the bible there should be books today and each of us actually should be a book a living epistle and our life stories should be part of what people can engage today and whether that's written or whether that's just by engaging in relationship with us you know so you know i definitely think that timothy 3 16 you know which evangelicalism has used to promote an inerran an infallible word it isn't there and what it does say is he absolutely is correct what you're saying is all inspired writings because the word is just graphe it's not capital s as if it means the bible that's been put in by the translators because they have interpreted it to me in the bible that was written in a.d 50-something they didn't have a bible until 83-8-5 so you know in the 340-30 years in between what were inspired scriptures writings and what weren't and some things which they quoted and were on the list like the apocalypse of peter for instance are not in our present bible and actually the original script scriptures that they did include was the catholic version which had the apocrypha in it those were thrown out by the protestants those were in there in the original so so which one which is the original well it's the authorized version god reauthorized it to king james but that's what evangelicals actually believe that's why they that's why it's called the authorized version to them because god authorized it for the protestants i mean it's just nonsense but it's mythology and so many christians would well the bible's inerrant and infallible nowhere does it claim to be an aaron and founder because it's a collection of books written and letters and things written by people and just because it has the name daniel on it doesn't mean daniel wrote it now it's got daniel on it he's got to be right well yeah yeah or any other sort of book ezekiel or isaiah does it mean that they wrote it or did someone later write down by inspiration what they were told or collected things that may have been written or not we scholars really if and you know biblical scholars and i mean academic scholars would cast a lot of doubt on what a lot of evangelicals believe of who's the author of various things but that doesn't mean that they're not useful or can be useful or that god may have inspired some things but i think for me certainly taking the old testament scriptures which were as you say written from a hebrew perspective with their understanding of god in which was he was not in them and and therefore they didn't have the intimacy that perhaps we now have in the new testament times or in our day i don't think it actually reflects what who god is you know and therefore i would much rather it wasn't included in there you know for us today even obviously i'm not really ensure we should have the new testament included as a book like that yes it'd be great to have a record of this is what happened to the story of people that led up to jesus and it'd be great to have a record of this is what happened in the period after jesus left and then it would great to have records of every age that has happened since and each of us really should be a book so there should be the book of daniel and mike and mary and janice and all of a jackie and all of us we should all have our own we should be a book and actually maybe some of those things should have been written as stories um as illustrations that will help people now to me my journals are scripture i wouldn't expect them to be to anybody else because god didn't speak them to anybody else he spoke them to me um and if they resonate with anything that i've recorded great if they don't great but to me they have the same authority as the bible because they were spoken to me as jesus said i heard his voice i heard the father and i wrote down what he said now of course that still comes through my language style and the way i write and how i tried to get over some of the concepts that he was trying to get to me and sometimes sort of getting things too fast for me to write them down that i'm sort of like slow up you know i need i need to get this you know and actually some of the things i wrote originally in my journals when i went back and put them into powerpoint and i was able to spend more time reflecting over what it was that god was trying to say to me i correct myself to more actually reflect what he was actually saying rather than what i was trying to get down at the time because i was just trying to get it down now it doesn't change the meaning but it makes it more clear and i think that is what should be for all our lives god speaks to us in a certain time and then he can speak to us in a future time which seems to contradict the past time because that was part of the journey that i couldn't get at that point so there were a lot of things that jesus wanted to say to the disciples that he said you can't bear there are things he was talking to nicodemus about that saying you're never going to get this you know you don't even get it when i'm using earthly illustrations of heavenly things how are you going to get stuff that doesn't have any earthly illustrations you know and i think today you know we have illustrations from quantum physics and science and other things that god is using to help convey another level or depth of understanding about creation and creativity and miracles and everything else which they didn't have then paul saw things in the realms of heaven that he couldn't express you know it didn't mean that he wasn't allowed to it just meant he couldn't didn't have the language you know how would a first century jewish person you know writing in greek express quantum physics or any other thing that he might have picked up in the realms of heaven he couldn't he didn't have the words you know be like asking you know stone age man to describe a an iphone they wouldn't know what a phone was or an eye because they didn't even have language so you know what i mean it's like so i just i my encouragement is for people to make sure that they build their lives on the foundation of their relationship with god rather than a book or the concepts of a book or the theology of a book because theology is just the study of that book by other people who put their spin on what they think it means and you've got reformed theology you've got evangelical theology you've got charismatic theology you've got pentecostal theology you've got all the theologies and they all probably agree over quite a lot but disagree over a fair bit as well you know so i'm i use it a lot still in teaching i don't read it there's no point reading a book when i can talk to god um i don't read it in that way i use it because it's a reference point and it gives people who still do read it and still value it in a way a point of okay let's we can we can talk about this because it gives us a reference point to start with at least um so i still use it and i've got no issue with that i just don't read it for relationship you know i don't study it but sometimes god speaks to me and it reminds me of things in it and sometimes it inspires me to go and find something because it's helpful you know the other day we were engaging in a in a governmental thing and um we were we were engaging and there was this thing about revelation and stuff and you know the scripture from isaiah let's see 45 i think somewhere there about you know the mysteries hidden in darkness and the treasures and all that stuff being revealed you know and actually expressing it that way really quite summed up what we were encountering in a very succinct way you know so it was helpful now yeah we want to get stuck into it and stuck with that but it gave us a starting point for further exploration and engagement and so i think that happens quite a lot now i'm not saying god won't speak to people through the bible actually it's the only way you can speak to some people and they have so such heavy filters that it's so hard for them to discern what his voice is even when he's trying to speak to them through it because it's framed by what they already believe you know so and i had that over and over and again in my life god started to challenge me or speak to me about certain things and i could not compute what he was trying to say in context of what i already believed and for years he was trying to i guess renew my mind but it was such a difficult process until i had encounters and as soon as i had experiential encounters that was like i can no longer believe what i believe because now i've experienced the the opposite or the truth rather than what i thought was true you know so i think god will still use it the holy spirit will still try and interpret it for people or help people to understand it and apply it to everyday life and i'm not saying any of that isn't valid but i think it becomes less and less valid or necessary let's say when you can encounter god face to face talk to him he can talk to you you're engaging in a realm which is not limited to this realm when all of that those things are true then sort of it isn't a mystery in the same way you know you know god is still way way beyond my capacity to understand everything but my capacity is increasing because he's increasing it you know and in a sense i think some of the mystery and the gnosticism and some of the things around knowledge and that's linked to the bible and linked to mysticism and particularly the jewish mysticism and kabbalah and all that stuff is actually very much based in you can't know god he's unknowable which is the basis of kabbalah in the first place this is something revealing something but it's actually revealing you can never know god anyway because he's unknowable but he's sort of tried to make himself known for all this stuff but he's really unknowable so it's like no he's not unknowable at all is very much knowable and we get to know more and more and more and more progressively through our relationship with them you know so some of the mysticism stuff we're going to be very careful it doesn't get into esoteric hidden stuff that is just all about pursuing hidden knowledge and actually not about pursuing the who he is him you know i don't want to pursue knowledge of truth i don't want to pursue understanding knowledge i want to engage the truth him in a relationship which will bring understanding but i'm not seeking understanding because i think you can that can lead you into all sorts of dangerous paths when you start to seek the mysteries rather than the truth the father you know and i think a lot of mysticism gets lost and it ends up going round and round and round because it's just looking for more and more hidden mysteries and truth and actually it's missed the fact that god wants to reveal himself you know and it doesn't really want to make it hard for us you know we make it hard for ourselves i think a lot of the time because we over complicate it and try and figure it out i'd rather enjoy it than figure it out and understand it in in one sense now i know i'm wired to try and understand it but i've learned to enjoy it which brings the understanding rather than because i've got experience rather than i'm going to intellectually trying to figure out what all this is who god is how he works how all this stuff works and everything else yeah so so yeah i agree with most of what you were saying of your assessment of where i am with the bible he is i guess i i meant to bring up the law so let me bring it up okay my take probably is still a little bit different than yours as i understand yours uh you emphasize where jesus said grace and truth came with jesus christ scripture says that the law was given by moses hence uh god did not give the law so i would look at scriptures such as the law was given uh in light of transgression it was added the scripture says paul says because of transgression talks about it being given in this yeah this is a crazy expression it also says there would be most of that law so you know um yeah i see those scriptures i'm just asking i'm trying to give you your thought i see specific scriptures though saying essentially that the law does come from god would you look at those scriptures more or less again as i pointed out earlier jewish reading into idiomatic projections i think you can answer might yeah if i could say a little more i would say that the word law can mean different things in different contexts so the law of love or the law of faith is more a principle and the word law there is like the the law of charles's law or boyle's law in chemistry they are principles they're not some they they work whether you believe them or not in one sense they're just built into the fabric of creation and they're nothing to do with what we call the law of moses or the law that israel was trying to follow uh in in that way so in my perspective the gentiles were never under the law that was given to israel anyway so you know the noahide law movement which is really trying to bring the whole humanity under this set of laws and actually it's actually in it was introduced into congress and is actually in some of your congressional documents because i was only looking at that half an hour ago because i'm i'm actually writing about that right now the whole thing of the law and coming from a you know hebrew roots movement perspective of what is all this and what's behind it and what's the agenda to try and get us back into the law i think the the key is that we were never under the law if we weren't actually a follower of judaism in jesus day the law in a sense linked to the old covenant according to hebrews became obsolete and faded away during that period when there was this two systems in competition like you know the opposition the the attempt to get them back under judaism with the judaizer party and all of that type of stuff there was a huge you can imagine uh confusion and because you know the early peter and the disciples still carried on doing their jewish stuff went to the went to the temple courts you know carried on doing stuff because they didn't get the fact that this was for the gentiles i mean unbelievably even though they were told to go into all the world and preach the gospel to all nations they still didn't seem to get it until there's this vision comes out of heaven that says hey nothing's unclean anymore this is for everybody which seemed to sort of do the trick and peter sort of grasped it particularly with cornelius experiencing the spirit coming in the same way in that way now all that was obviously in this transition i personally don't you know i think paul makes it really clear we're not under the law we're under grace i think there was no obligations for the gentiles that's why the judaizers kept going to try and get them back under it and the council in acts in jerusalem jerusalem in acts 15 seemed to agree that there was no requirement for the gentiles to fulfill the law other than hey don't do some of these things which are going to antagonize your jewish neighbors which was which obviously they did and paul did every time he went into a city and started going in the synagogues and bridging which i don't think was very wise you know i i think he should have stuck to his mandate to go to the gentiles then he wouldn't have stirred up all the trouble and got stoned and beaten i think he created a rod for his own back there really you know which which was unnecessary if he'd stuck to sharing the good news in the way he could have done in a way so irrespective of who gave it we're no longer under it and therefore the ten commandments we're not under now that does not mean we've got the right to go around killing people stealing whatever because now we're given a new value system by jesus that he called commandments which was not the same as the law i know those who followed hebrew roots and all that stuff was oh no jesus affirmed by giving the commandments that actually we should stick to them and all that but actually that commandment was a different word and really it was very much summed up in what he said you know a new commandment i give unto you love one another as i've loved you so now this was not an object of obedience but more a response to being loved so as i've loved you now you can love other people and if you love people you'll do nothing that counteracts the ten commandments or any other thing that might be contradictory to god's heart because what how could you if you were being motivated by love so now love is the fulfillment of the law and the prophets and all of that is all now fulfilled in jesus and he really tied it all up in love so that really is what our i think object should be just engaging in unconditional love and then unconditionally loving which will be a full expression of the heart of god for how we would treat each other because you know the golden rule and all of that stuff really they're all summed up in love it's like you want to be loved well then love people you know it's like it's like and i would say rather than do unto others what you would have them do unto you i would say do unto others what god has done to you you know i think that was that's a much better way of expressing it what we've received from god freely give which is what jesus told us to do you know so yeah i wouldn't want to argue over you know the the law whatever the law never had any power to bring anyone into a relationship and god and make them righteous that's obvious that's absolutely clear from paul's teachings so it was a school master at best to bring people to christ well what sort of school master i think it was you cannot keep this this is going to bring abject failure so stop trying to do this yourself and engage and become righteous because he's made you righteous rather than trying to get righteousness through the law so the purpose of it do you look at the purpose of it from our perspective now because that's the perspective we're looking back at do you look at it from the perspective of what they were believing about it at the time which was we need to obey this or in reality we're not going to obey this because they didn't over and over again so it didn't work did it you know it didn't work even for them don't don't worship other gods well uh the history of the judges uh and subsequent really doesn't bear out that they did their part of the covenant that was made on with them you know that moses made with them because moses did make the covenant it says moses made the covenant with them uh so there's different versions i think there are different places where things happen and actually the original tablets or cube that came out of heaven that god gave moses to establish the kingdom moses destroyed because of what they did with the golden calf and then moses wrote the next tablets now did he write exactly what was in the the first thing i don't think so i think he wrote that which was his interpretation to help keep israel from being destroyed by god from their perspective because it was like don't do it don't do it don't wipe them out you know because moses was pleading on their behalf but i don't god would never have wiped them out anyway but they could have succumbed to the consequences of their own choices to walk independently of god which is what happened in judges don't foreign follow our foreign gods ah we're following foreign gods so god basically says well okay if you want those gods to look after you well i'll let you let those gods look after you and then all of a sudden you say oh no the philistines are upon us or they have you know it's just like well why because in a sense you walked out from under the protection that god was giving you when you were walking in the covenant that that you had and over and over again and eventually there was a divorce you know now you know i know there are all sorts and a lot of jewish rabbis today don't believe that jews have any right to palestine and also here at the moment there's a huge stuff going on over there and sort of potentially very serious consequences a lot of jews particularly those who call themselves jews against israel don't believe that they have any right to a land because they're divorced and without the messiah they haven't got any right you know and they see modern-day israel as a nation that and nation-state of israel as a western zionist plot and there was a jews you know there was a rabbis who no that's not all of them obviously but there's a thing you won't really get to see much about what they say because most of the media is controlled by those who don't want you to see that but they did regularly have protests in jerusalem with banners basically saying you know we shouldn't be in here occupying this place so it's very very complex and a very complicated situation that i don't think is helped by christian zionists who who are promoting war in the middle east because they see it's going to bring jesus back so they're very happy for war in the middle east and i'm like i don't really think that's the prince of peace much you know that you're taking the perspective that you want armageddon you know because you want jesus to return and sort it all out well it's like i think actually our responsibility is to increase his government and peace not war you know so you know the conflict going over there i'm sure there are wrongs on both sides at the minute and i'm sure they're all blaming each other for what's happened and they're retaliating against what's happened which is a terrible state because there's division and there's conflict and there's war mongering going on who benefits from that and i think that's where you look and see who's promoting that it certainly isn't god you know i i i i once we had a guy come into town and he was preaching zionism and all this stuff and i didn't go but i looked him up and he was from some messianic congregation in jerusalem so i went on their website and i looked at what i could find and they had the notes of their prayer meeting all recorded and they were calling down fire from god to destroy the commit genocide against the palestinians and wipe out this group and wipe out that group and i'm just thinking you seriously believe that that's the way to pray but they did and they felt they had a right to pray that way because this was their land and god had given them this land and therefore they had a right to defend it and just kill anybody and they were christians supposedly and i'm like this this is how it's so messed up and the whole of this eschatological picture is creating this tension in the world which is all about war and destruction and not peace but it is a very complex issue i understand um and i'm you know i don't want to see people hurt or killed or maimed or destroyed over any issue let alone you know something that christians are supporting or not i mean i just think yeah i would be the same with muslims or anything else you're never going to defeat them by trying to wipe them out and destroy them it's just contradictory to peace forgive your enemies bless them you know so i'm really not get not for war really now you could say okay well if we didn't have the first war in the second world war where would we be in all of that well if we didn't have those behind in promoting what was going on in the first and second world war for their own agendas to make money or for political and spiritual gain then you wouldn't have had the wars didn't just break out there was an agenda behind it you know and you could say well okay you know would i fight for you know my home whatever no not in that way i wouldn't take out a gun and shoot somebody hey because i've got a gun we don't have guns in the uk well i do have an air rifle um but no i wouldn't but would i stand in authority and stop anything going on yes but i wouldn't do it in any sense of vengeance or anger but in the sense of i have authority here this is my home and you have stories and testimonies of people saying no you can't do that you can shoot me and it not happening because they knew god's provision and protection on their lives and they weren't in fear and trepidation for things so they stood and things changed because of their stance so yeah it's a yeah it's a complicated issue but i'm sorry i was interrupting earlier i was looking at the origin and i agree it's not worth arguing i also see it as not god's original purpose i see him giving israel the opportunity to be a priesthood no meteorship that they would all know him from their beginnings and they rejected that and then god as i see it speaks our language he condescends to our low estate just like later he gave them the king that he did not want them to have he gave them the law as such yeah yeah i agree i don't think he ever really intended it that way he didn't want sacrifices and offerings that's clear from the psalms it's clear from hebrews it wasn't something that he wanted but he let them have it because it was it was better than killing children which is what the pagans did to their sacrifices and actually what some of these i mean some of them did you know that was what what he was trying to stop in a lot of these things you know but it's very interesting when you actually see from a new testament perspective some of the things that they did even when they were wandering around the you know the desert in the wilderness and when they went into the promised land they still carried the star of renfre and worship and the and their those gods that they brought with them out of egypt i mean as as stephen said as he was being stoned i mean it was like you know there was something really still inherently there that separated them from from god whether that was their own loss of identity through being in slavery for 400 years or well they were in lost identity before they ever got there with the rest of mankind because we've all lost our identity i'm trying to find it in something and they tried to find it in we are the children of abraham or children of israel you know abraham was our father grandfather whatever i mean there was a sense where they were looking for identity but they were still trying to make a name for themselves and of course god promised abraham that he would have children that would be like the stars of the sky or the sound of the seizure and all of that which to me is just a reflection of that's all of us you know we're all children of abraham you know the whole of humanity is the children of abraham the whole of mankind is the children of abraham we're the children of god which is really all the families of the earth being blessed god i mean according to galatians god preached the gospel before hand to abraham in the all the families of us we bless and actually that's god's intention you know and yeah it would be wonderful if they had lived within the hedge of protection that god brought them into and they'd stayed there and they were the light to the gentiles and they did bring hey this is what it's like in this amazing place in our relationship with god and what did they do keep going outside of that hedge of protection trying to get the favor of foreign gods or we know they're not gods but whatever deities or demons or fallen angels that happen to be behind there that system you know so sadly their orphan spirit or their loss of identity caused them continually to not really know what god was like you know and send moses instead and set up a mediatorial system because of fear or unworthiness whatever was going on with them and i think there was a sense of unworthiness i mean it must be so hard if you lived all your life a slave in in egypt with sort of stories which may have been sort of there of what it was like when we used to live over here you know before we came down to egypt and all the sort of joseph and all that story it must have been very very hard to maintain any sense of hope but you know i think that was part of their the way they missed what god was really like sadly you know so yeah mary you got your hand up there patiently waiting that's okay just to quickly going back to paul you were talking about how paul was told to go to the gentiles but he went to the jews and what he did every time it was just a mess uh and the fact of like if he had stayed on track he probably wouldn't have had half the grief and my when you were saying i'm thinking that isn't there a lesson for all of us especially you know because because he he makes it very clear that he had a great love for the jewish people he wanted them to have what he had i mean he was broke maybe really brokenhearted that they were so resistant and i think that how many of us hit that wall with our families you know especially if we have family members that are resistant don't want to don't want to hear or anything and your desire is you you know you so want to be the ones that are the ones that see them come into a relationship with the lord and how hard that is and can be to take a step back and if the lord is is not directing you to be the one to minister to them to let them go go where he has you is directing you and to trust him that somebody else is going to go in there he's already got something else planned for them and that when we when we step in like paul did when he stepped into the role trying to get to the jews it always blew up and how many times possibly do we step into a role that he has not given us and it does not go well and it only makes things worse yeah no i totally agree i think there are things that are within our destiny that we should fulfill and we should pursue but when it comes to people we can't force people into an acceptance just because we want them to accept a situation whether that be god or any other favorable situation um and i i believe that's true and i think some people when you you know we talk about the restoration of all things some people think that means every minute detail of their lives that they would like in the order that they want it you know and actually it's not like that it's like if someone does not want to be reconciled to you in relationship you can't make them you can't force them even though you might think well this is best for them you can't make someone do what you want them to do and even you know and actually the restoration of all things isn't talking about those minute details you know a lot of those things are things we've done you know not what god necessarily did their decisions we made or we entered into relationships with people which for him it was that's okay yeah and when people don't want to be in that relationship any longer you can't force them you know and you can't say well and you can't go to god and try and manipulate them into doing what you want them to do on the basis of well this is this is your will and it's like well no actually it's your will you want it and as much as that is so hard but even when it comes to broken relationships and repairing relationships and everything else it's so hard not to become controlling i want to control this situation it needs to turn out the way i want it to and that doesn't always happen you know and you can't make it happen even by legislating in heaven or doing things you can't make it happen i've tried it's like sometimes i'm still trying you know but because it's like wow i want this to be the best but actually you can't make someone align with your best and they may not be following god's desire for them and maybe walking away from god's desire for them but you can't manipulate and control them to choose to do the things you want them to do even though they might be the best things for them so you have to come and it's hard you know i you know i think the emotions of that and the sadness of it of broken relationship or on relationship aren't reconciled or things that go on are really deep you know and they're painful when it comes to family and children and relationships and all of that you know and where there is a bright breakdown of relationships you know in family with parents and children and you know all of that you know it's such a deep wounding place because they're the people who are closest to you you know and therefore you are more and susceptible you know my children could hurt me much more than anybody else you know what i mean because it's like well my heart's open to them yeah and it's painful you know and i think when you're dealing with family stuff like that you have to acknowledge the pain and live in an attitude of forgiveness and want the best for your children whatever else but you do have to you can't carry a burden which was never intended for you to carry you know i think this is where we've got to cast our burdens on the lord and let him do what he's going to do and if the person continually rejects what he wants to do then as much as i would not want them to suffer any consequences as a result of that and i would be merciful to them if you don't receive mercy that's the choice that you make yeah and and that's not one that i would want people to have to go through so i would be merciful even though in a sense it's like well they deserve the consequences of their own justice i still want to be merciful because god's been merciful for me yeah and i want them to accept the mercy even if in a sense it's like they're rejecting it because i don't want people to suffer no one even if people make me suffer why would i i don't want them knowing jesus was suffering because of what how he was treated but what would he do father forgive them yeah don't really know what they're doing you know and i think when people reject you and reject god they don't really know what they're doing yeah something's driving them they've got some pain hurt whatever's going on and i think we have to acknowledge that and but it doesn't mean it's any less sad or painful when you're in the midst of those type of things when there's projection and where there's you know people walk away from relationships and all that sort and i think but the importance is is looking back and when paul tried to make stuff happen it really didn't work as much as his heart was probably really in the right place and he was really motivated by love it it just didn't work and part of it was because that wasn't his mandate he wasn't called to to be the jews maybe to a lot of them he was such an apostate what he had to say it just was not going to resonate no matter how much he he loved them uh but going forward is to realize that you know hey if when we have those situations be it family or friend or whatever and those walls go up as much as we want to see you know them in a relationship with the lord even maybe back in relationship with us unless the lord really gives you the clear mandate to to actively pursue and go after that it's best to maybe step back and go in the direction that he is sending you in and allow him to take care of that and that means he probably has to use somebody entirely different and that doesn't necessarily say that you're going to see any kind of a change in your lifetime you might you might not but you can just commit them to them pray for them and and again you know assign angels speak into their lives but take your hands off and don't try to be the one don't try to be the holy spirit for them don't try to be the one that's maybe so they're going to get going to get the notch in your bible that yay they're finally in the fold no step back and leave it alone and i think that's really what demonstrating unconditional love is it's loving even in the fact of rejection which is exactly what jesus did you know he still wanted to like a hen gather the chicks under the wing even though they totally rejected him it was his desire was no i want to gather you and you're saying no but i still want to gather you i'm still warning you of what's coming i don't want you to go through what's coming you don't have to go through what's coming i wanna i want you to come into this you know salvation safety security and yet they continued to reject some of them and some of them turned and then discovered that what he was saying was true after all you know but unconditional love is saying well no matter what you do i'm still going to love you anyway you know and for some that's very hard when it they people see christians as you only want me saved you don't really care about me you just want my salvation and i think there is a sense where i i would have been that way in the past an evangelical perspective to it well you know just want you saved you know whatever now and now obviously i have a totally different perspective and god's at work and he will get his end in the situation eventually anyway but i want would love that to be for people everyone to be now obviously but it's not always you know what happens because people choose their own path you know and sadly when that happens if it results in you not being able to walk together for a period of time that's where the sadness comes in you know um but yeah it's it's not a no no not easy any of this stuff really when it comes to relationships and people things aren't easy you know because we're people you know but anyway all right i need to leave it there nice seeing you all again today have a have a good rest of your day keep safe and i'll see you catch up with you next time thanks mike all right

Channel: Mike Parsons

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Id: 6Fep1jLoOOo

Length: 62min 20sec (3740 seconds)

Published: Wed Jun 02 2021