Mindrolling – Raghu Markus – Ep. 289 – Yongey Mingyur Rinpoche

so you hola in the USA yeah we're in the USA I think you've met krishna das before yeah I joined your concert I think yes you did yes in Boulder yeah yeah yeah yeah many years ago yes yes wonderful I'm Raghu and Krishna Das and I were in India long long time back nineteen seven with our guru neem karoli baba oh yeah I heard of him a lot yeah so okay here we are and I've been reading your book Rinpoche so Rinpoche has a wonderful book in love with the world I love that to the test yeah and amongst journey through the Bardot's of living and dying and I of course you did that YouTube video where you described your whole journey that was just wonderful so this book is really details out everything that happened on your on your trip that you took throughout India as asado and it's pretty amazing but you know Bechet maybe we would love to hear about just your growing up with your father alright and for everybody out there rinpoche his father Tulku organ rinpoche and there's he had four sons and you are the youngest right yeah and there was soaked near Rinpoche CK chuckling Rinpoche and chokan emia Nima Nima Rinpoche's so this is quite a family amazing dings can you just tell us a little bit about how you grew up and and your being with your father who is this extraordinary being yeah so actually I was born in the the mountain man a salut the right bottom of the mountain Mauna Sol in the path which is at highest mountain in the world so in my hometown the culture the language everything is like Tibet is border which in Japan in a part so my my mother normally don't want to stay in the summer in Kathmandu so they're hot so every time we spend with mom grandfather grandma summer in every and whole winter we spend time with my father in the Kathmandu in magic khumba so every year we go like back and foot and the journey was wonderful so first time the I learned meditation from my father when I was 9 years old so yeah it's a really really amazing to have such a great meditator as my father so many people they've been born and after that they look for them meditation teacher so I'm lucky it's just give birth and there's a teacher yeah and and then but you were groomed from an early age as a monk is that correct I really formally become colorblock go into the monastery when I was 11 years old in ensure a bling bling monastery which is northern part of India near Dharamsala oh yeah so my men the head of the shelling monastery is like a guru budget that I said Ruby stuff I bet yes I've been there and that that time I was 11 years old and and then all the way through until you you became the abbot not of that monastery but of of the one in Nepal that you're nearby now yeah yeah I have here I we have two monastery one in the park at Montreux right now I'm in the park at Monroe so he this monastery here is more like a school traditional the college the monastery monastery college chatter what we call theta it's like ashram yeah but it's really kind of like cultural truly study and debate and contemplation and also meditation we combined study and meditation together here in this monastery so both together and in Buddha Gaia I have another monastery and the Buddha Kriya is for the more younger monks so we have the school there from gray one to eight so there's two monastery yeah I'm only 70 can I can I enroll there in Bude gaya welcome here in Nepal now we are really developing really new way of the education try to bring the engine wisdom and modern knowledge together not just intellectually study from the experiential level what we call abiding art so this is now forming in Nepal monastery and this I'm very exciting this really life what we call the head heart and the habit to not form three into the from kindergarten to the gray eight so it's a this is a really exciting now yeah formative years for children and if you wanna welcome I started kindergarten so will be beneficial for all the young kids so rachet tell us what happened what was where is the moment that you decided that I am going to leave all of my my roles as Abbot and all of the things that I have been habituated to for so many years and just set out with virtually nothing a few rupees basically how did this come into your mind when I was young around seven eight years old my mother used to read a storybook great story like malaria a great yogi in Tibet and there's some other teachers great teachers in Tibet so every day we in my hometown the temple says qui call so in the evening normally we will have so you know Tibetan stupa and then we all get together around the fire the wood fire in the middle of the house then we will have so and finished the gnomon of my grandfather got to do practice meditation and me my mom and my grandmother three of us together and my mom then we'll read story so I heard a lot of story about the these Yogi's who go into the mountain in the caves and then there's a lot of song about the realization the meditative experience so sometime my grandma when when you read my mother read this story my grandma will cry and then my mom cry and then I cry a few of us cry so and these are really really stuck in my mind this is there in my mind and I like the mountain I like the cave I like the kinda like wandering to explore different part of tub copy wand and my circle you know yeah hmm so there you were and you you snuck out of your monastery so that's that story yeah yeah I was I want to do that to do like wandering kind of a retreat and I asked my father people he died so I explained this everything to him and I I thought what he will tell me I thought maybe he said oh this is quite danger you have to be careful normally he's a care about me but that time is that worked great oh I was a little bit surprised if you want to do great and don't tell the real plan do anybody he said that yeah other what the people will he he want to go like that before he tell his plan to everybody and in the end he cannot go oh really oh yeah so then of course I tell everybody I'm going to retreat but the real plan I didn't tell anybody the real plan and I was in boot gaya time so yeah in a night I am and out from the monastery and go to the train station took the normal Tallulah yeah and then we went to Warren Ozzie and there's no particular plan just there and I had back peg and some few thousands of rupees then when I arrived in Warren as a train station I was thinking where should I go I have no idea I've never been like that before so I found the this small book shop there and I found the map I develop map I'm in the India there's a lot of land map the holy place is something like that I can see so then years the one is the cushion ever yeah yes so then I I i went from what an idea to the question but i love the detail in the book about getting on that train for the first time from gaya varanasi and being finding a place you could even just sit you were on the floor I mean this is all with the the rush of the people and all of the various yeah from the smells to the bathrooms which we kind of well know ourselves from our first time in India to it was overwhelming and you were describing how you kept pushing back into your practice to and getting awareness of that must have been quite extraordinary - yeah that journey that train ride was a really really amazing experience so although I prepare to go to one retreat and I was imagining that I'm on the street and then you know all this but then I forget the train ride so then suddenly this unexpected the train ride which is I never went before like that yeah it was really really kind of like something for the eye back to the practice and again loss again back to the practice so there's a lot of monkey mind story there and then you get to Varanasi station which we also know well oh boy and you just walk to trying to get your bearings is to to work yeah yeah but now the what another station I went back again after finish my trip to I went there now become very nice oh I'm really different than before oh really now they make kind of lorries how to say the renovate and then yeah before it was one of the I mean the diverse train station in India before mmm of us mmm but now it's really nice now if you go there you feel very happy so in this book is wonderful not just for this incredible story of you leaving and becoming Asad do but also reflecting on the different teachings that that you've had and sharing those I found that and there's one in particular that you say Tibetans have an expression for deliberately increasing the challenges of maintaining a steady mind and it's called adding wood to the fire which I've never heard of before can you can you talk about that and that that practice and relating it yeah especially from your this was you put a lot of wood on the fire the minute you got on that train from gaya right so what we call the style of practice is south liberation some antidote some time what we call self antidote south liberation which is we all have this awareness so this awareness with us 24-hour never be separate and this awareness is pure present come it's like sky the sky is always there always free pure but then there's a lot of cloud in the sky you might have nice cloud beautiful cloud ugly cloud and pollution also or fresh air also so a lot of things happening in the cloud I mean in the sky but the sky is still free impressive so we all possess this kind of awareness and this awareness is the bare ground of our thought emotion feeling perception memory all this like thought emotion perception memory is like cloud so Pleasant unpleasant neutral confusion comes and goes comes goes but all I in this awareness and this awareness also infused with the compassion wisdom so awareness compassion wisdom is like sky so it's really important for the south liberation meditation like so deliberate sub liberated meditation is first connect with awareness and how to connect with the awareness there's step-by-step projects like you can use foam is the way to connect with the Uranus with sound with the smell with the test with sensation with taught with emotion so from the five sense everything can be support for awareness everything can be adds to recognition of an awareness with us all the time but if the problems we are not recognized so normally what I call if you have watched the quality of what is the tell your time right but if you not recognize watch even though you have the best watch in the world what cannot tell your time once you recognize the watch then what can you tell what can tell you the time but the word is same as before not getting better so therefore to connect with this boss and a present genuine awareness first you have to practice say place where the right environment and condition so we do the retreat sometime the formal retreat to retreat it's like if you want to make the fire first you have to start with a tiny woods right with not too much wind easy to make set the fire then once if I become bigger and bigger bigger you add more cross I mean the bigger woods and then wind blows better and and more woods more is better so that's the idea that first you have to develop this awareness with the right condition then slowly similar you need to face the challenge and the challenges can be like environment physically emotionally lot of different challenge it's really good so in Tibet someplace the meditators were meditate in the mountain so what I call five-star caves the five star cave meaning the cave where there's a stream of the water nearby the cave and the cave is a dry and there's a woods around that dry wood dry branches and that is the five star case so if you're in the five star cave there's not so much that's a problem sometime then some meditators they come down to the village and town look for problem hmm so therefore it's challenge normally is really in a way for the sub sub transform a transformative meditator self liberated meditation is a eventually is really beneficial but for let's just talk about just for laymen or people on the family who kind of people and so on just this idea of bringing in your piling I get the the wood up and getting that to the point where you're not running away from it and you're getting closer to it you're forming some kind of say friendship with it what how do we approach that talking to householders in terms of yes concept yeah I think for the south liberated style of meditation is you can meditate everywhere anytime under any circumstances but of course first when you begin to learn meditation you need to have kind of low right circumstances you need to do a formal session every day a little bit maybe begin with the 10 15 minutes just full-time to education for only meditation and then apply meditation in your life while you are having whatever your normal life happy no at your workplace why are you having dinner lunch breakfast so you can practice everywhere anytime as you develop more and more experience then actually nowadays in our model right there flop challenge isn't it yeah so normal ah what I said maybe you don't need to look look for cave or go to some particular places like even children when you become 18 years old you have to away from the family and you have to start everything by yourself right your life is like wandering wandering retreat you can be like or in our life there's any time they might have some challenges challenge from this environment physically mentally a lot of things later these are really great opportunity I think if we yeah transform yeah you know actually I'd like to talk about courage because I think that that plays a big role in what you're talking about in this particular practice yeah crucial nuts maybe tell that story of your being with Maharajah and courage I had been in India for two and a half years yes with neem Karoli Baba yes from 1970 to 72 and he had just told me that I had to go back to America and I said bah bah bah I'm just learning Hindi he said too bad you have to go ciao one day we were sitting together and for a long time it was very quiet he was just lying on a bed sitting up lying down sitting up and then all of a sudden he sits up and he looks at me and he says courage is a really big thing and I went what's gonna happen you know and then there was one Indian devotee there who said Oh Baba God takes care of his devotee he just looked at him like this and he goes again courage is a really big thing and then he laid down again and went back to sleep and there were times in my life that I I all I had was the memory of that moment that was enough to get me through terrible times right yeah yeah it was very it was very extraordinary that he gave me that he kind of sealed a place off that I couldn't go past that place I I was safe even though it was terribly difficult yeah yeah yeah my father also used to told me about this yeah like courage and hope it's really important so whatever external problems obstacles seeming like obstacle problems mistakes whatever we do but important is we can learn from this things we can grow from these things and don't give up letting go is not giving up right right what my father told me and he he said if you are going somewhere and then you reach the dead end they wrote what do you have to do is first check out your backpack and cross through the other side uh-huh once your backpack is gone then you will use your capacity oh you will cross that that laundry so yeah this is in my book I mean when I first coming out on my monastery I I throw my back first over the wall yeah and once I throw the bag oh then I have to go out so then I went a gate and open and come out yeah yeah yeah yeah it's almost like we're part of us is the backpack and we've been thrown already and we have the rest of our hardest yeah I think the one of the most important lesson that what I learned from my father and my teachers is we all have great potential we all have awareness wisdom compassion skills capacity lot of great things within us but then what we have to do is as you said courage and go forward yeah and try to guide our use our knowledge and capacity and wisdom so I think it's really really important yeah in another part of the book you describe Bardot yes and you say it can be understood to mean quote-unquote this very moment the nowness of this moment is the continual suspension or pause in between our transitory experiences both temporal and spatial such as the tiny halt that exists between this breath and the next love that did you talk a little bit more about Bardo yeah so the Tibetan word Bardo meaning in between or intermediate so what we believe is we all have this great nature what we call basic goodness our enlightened nature and there's a lot of word about that but the best opportunity to connect with our fundamental nature is this gap so for example if we really want to grow if you really want to go out of our normal circle of course we all have some kind of raccoon we are living in the bubble we create our own bubble and we put ourself in there in order to cross the beyond there we have to go through some kind of gap and this gap sometime there already exist in your life but we don't know then the gap become not so much beneficial but some people during all this great insight all this great inventions comes from this this gap so for example for me when I leave my monastery I live my normal life and the first what I feel is the moment of when I when I cross the monastery gate my mind becomes like it's kind of like a moment where there's no concept and then kind of a little bit like present but the sense of openness but then I remember my meditation the part of meditation how to be with this moment how to embrace that moment it helps me to really become like find courage like you said and find really nice openness spacious and there will become the flat form that I can really connect with my inner capacity awareness wisdom all this so then I can transform this for my next journey so normally what what I call us is if you really want to grow we have to die so if you even if you don't die you cannot reverse again so that death is not only the last you know last opt our lives yeah actually - is happening every day so sometime the first time I thought my book title will be dying every day you know so this this moment to accept that and to to be in that moment in our life I think it's really really important so then yeah and this Bardo is not only the moment of the time and right now in between special when you are like when you become 18 years old you move then you lost your job another big gap there Bret Hart broken heart one way is the problem but then this might be another transformation may comes yep you also taught I think our listeners would really appreciate because we're talking a lot about going back to meditative practice and of course your father was the most incredible meditation teachers and he embodied this in such a great way I only know this by the way through that fantastic book blazing splendor blazing splendor wonderful boy and so you talk about gone meditation right I think this is a very very good thing for for all of us to hear as a practice and understanding the idea of becoming familiar with which i think is what go means can you talk about yeah yeah so in tibetan term what we call gum gum for meditation so tibetan term gum meaning meditation so what is the meaning of gum is like getting familiar with so getting familiar with your own mind getting familiar with your self so that's the meaning of gum so how to get familiar with yourself through recognition through awareness so as i mentioned before we all have this great awareness always there with us present twenty sometime what I got 24/7 handed 365 days of the year isn't it that's race good yeah always there but the problem is we are not recognized and then we don't know how to connect with that so how to connect with that awareness test step by step practice so first we can begin with the breath in a breathing meditation normally this very famous meditation sound meditation can you hear any sound now is there any sound I mean I mean a Katmandu should have a lot of sound here can you hear yeah we came here yeah yeah that's all that's the awareness oh yes yeah once you recognize awareness then you listen what is awareness awareness meaning knowing so knows what you are thinking what you are feeling what you are doing what you are seeing very simple gesture there's a cognition and that awareness is like light so when we look at the sky you see the light in the sky but in the empty sky in the empty space not easier to see light if the light reflect on my face now on this video on the wall on the tree on the house we can see light easy to see so therefore we have this light awareness light light but in order to connect with that we need to use object versus so object can be breath can be sung so how to focus on the breath just knowing the breath okay breathing in breathing out again waiting just like that and there's a lot of other thought comes the millions of other thought to do list you know many people has a lot of lives okay so when you be with the breath or with the sound all these different thought comes what do we have to do is let them come let them go the main important thing is if we remember our breath then it's okay if we are not forget our breath then there's a lot of other thought comes like normal of what I said Peter if you not forget your breath still you remember your breath if the PISA comes in let them come not only one piece our troupe is a three piece or 4 piece or five piece of okay kids are around all over you if you forget your breath huh like that the most of the time many people got miss understand about miss I'm just mister understanding our meditation is they thought oh no Pizza breath don't think anything else concentration but they knew thing about pizza more so yeah real thing is yes don't forget your breath if you're not forgetting your breath please I can come in peace I can go so then slowly slowly then in the end you can connect with awareness itself the Indian no need support you just let go the support and just be with the present not get lost their sense of present sense of being but there's no object nor even particular meditation also mm-hmm so this step-by-step practice but one has to start with the concentration or the schemata yes at the beginning you were saying about the light in the sky you don't actually see the light until it's reflected on something the light itself is invisible to the eye yes but light light like space here yeah in this empty space not easy to see light you know you see light on the on the wall like that right all right but the space of course is there yeah like light is there in the space yeah so yeah so this priest this this pristine awareness it's actually so vivid so peaceful so pure also present but we are not recognized just like watch if you if you have watch you will not recognize your own watch and watch cannot tell your time hmm I have same watch Rinpoche Wow this is the best watch in the work time its awareness watch yeah so one other concept that's very difficult for Westerners is certainly around emptiness which is so important which is throughout this your book so I think it would probably help to give your interpretation of emptiness thinking of us in the West particularly right right so uh how to connect with the space light in the space itself or I I usually said we have this awareness and awareness like space but do we have a lot of clouds so normally what we what we do is we are lost in the cloud we are one become cloud so then our life our emotion our feelings become like stock market up and down up and down so now what what we need is we have to step back be with the space itself so how to be with the space itself you don't need to gauge it or cloud you don't need to change the cloud so the emptiness meditation is actually how to be with the space itself without changing the cloud so there's empty and mess so what we call samba me so when I was young my father sir tomba meaning beyond concept but the new meaning not nothing there is awareness there is perception there is phenomena everything is there you can proceed everything but beyond grasp it so that's what appeals to you is not the problem how you related with that the grasping a succession of mine that is the problem right so emptiness practice is let go of the fixation of mine so our mind become open up open up open up be with the space and then everything allowed although everything is taking place even the tornado hurricane the cloud change yeah become donator but this tornado and hurricane cannot change space cannot change sky isn't it right yeah yeah that's that the men I think man meaning of emptiness so many people misunderstood about emptiness that the eminence meaning nothing yeah void voidness so that's not a real meaning about the emptiness yeah I think I think I heard that it was DT Suzuki the Japanese philosopher who translated shoonya as emptiness first whereas some people say it could also have been fullness yes yes right that's true and our friend Robert Thurman okay talks about it a lot about it around bliss some he has that term that relates to you know he really rails out against people think nothingness this is nothing void he gets very angry about that and nothing's not nothing yeah yeah right and he relates he said it's about bliss and freedom so that this is more like taunting tradition that Union of emptiness and bliss so meaning is when you meditate there's some different stage of the mind some practice with the energy in your body the prana bindu Nadi supreme' meaning energy Nadi meaning the that the nerves the channels and Bindu meaning the cells the dot so when we practice with that and then that really kind of somehow our how to say the energy you go into the center channel and your mind reach the blissful experience which is beyond concept yet let's example about a child when the child having sweet and if you asked child can you describe child cannot really describe it but can experience it so the the joy beyond word aha a joy beyond concept beyond concepts empty but the experience of joy is that not nothing so union of emptiness and the bliss so that's the different way to connect with awareness itself to our the fundamental quality of awareness and there's another term is what we call emptiness union with the luminosity so the luminosity here is the awareness sometime what we call awareness clarity luminosity pristine awareness same meaning so the mind beyond concept yet everything is a present some people they said or you meditate you be if your mind beyond concept when you become like zombie right I don't know them and I don't know who you are that is the not the case so remember so retreat years ago and Minneapolis I was there and one student there said asked you say is that Rick toe and this and this in this and you said just think not sleeping yeah I went oh it was like wow yeah yes not sleeping is different than thinking awake awake as a concept yeah not sleeping stops your mind it's just yeah as long as if you are conscious and you're okay yeah as long as if you are not fainted yeah the sense of the sense of being conscious although you don't know although you cannot really find what can just about not necessary to find them but there is self what we go subliminal subliminal City you know there's always sense of being present continuously so when you meditate many people think all please look for peace or opinions or non-conceptual all these are experience comes up and down some days piece next days you might have waterfall experience what we call waterfall meanings mind become crazy don't like but the really important thing is the just sense of being present connect with that one and then if your mind become crazy the crazy is another cloud and this craziness doesn't - doesn't stop the awareness event is still free so you were traveling and you went I think you first went to Kushinagar and did you not then start moving towards him alia yeah and I've got a question ever yeah so just tell a little bit of how you started to integrate this new life completely separate from from your old life and you started to integrate being there and being and you're talking about being present what was what was that evolvement of your moving through all of these different experiences which were completely new including begging for food right yeah I mean you ran out of money at some point you ran out of rupees so how did this progress where you started to integrate this completely new world and it related to your training yeah so at the beginning I a few thousand rupees so that I'm buying the train ticket and then when I reached Krishna Nagar I ran the Dharamsala like s house and then I prepare to go on on the street preparing after three weeks later all my money is gone so now no choice I have to be on street so then I was on street no money to buy food there's one simple restaurant on the street and before I'm getting could buy food from there so then I went there so now all my money is gone can you give me any leftover food so they they come they asked me to come in the evening once once that they closed quite early so before the Trent Claus they asked me to come so I went there and they give me some left over food then I hate this left over food so then I have this diarrhea oh that night maybe put poison or maybe some virus or whatever yeah but that diarrhea continued next day and I'm become weaker and and I don't want to eat also there's not there's no how to say yeah lost appetite other guys there's a way I'm staying there's a pom real or equal to your water pump whatever yeah like a hand you know and like this and this water come and when you go there water already gone you have to be very fast yeah I did and I didn't this water and this is what I say quite good come from deed from the deep ground yeah doing a lot of water then after few days later really become weak my body and then one afternoon I had fear so now I'm going to die what should I do go back my monastery back to my monastery but then just let it be see what except so then I just let it be for a while for a while then one day in the morning around maybe around 1 1 a.m. or something then I'm begin to lose now the census I cannot see slowly cannot hear and I was meditating in Romanian awareness dissolving there kind of like what we call the experience of the disillusion of element where you feel like falling all this but then in the end my the sense of awareness become more and more clear the conceptual mind dissolves and my body become paralyzed try to move my finger cannot move Wow and you're all alone and my mind is really become peaceful there's no time no from no bag no no down so peaceful joyful but this joy but not really like physical sensation joy normally you know I've I know everything was going on but it's not like normal what are you thinking no more thinking is our minds looking for their thought go to there and and look for oh yeah something like that now here's everything appears like a mirror the lake and everything reflect in the pristine lake right so I was there for long time maybe around six seven hours something then in the morning I feel like this this is not the time for this is not the end it's not the LA I mean the time for me to die something like that kind of feeling and that feeling becomes stronger stronger then I fell my body and into ooh first here some saw and then hear the sound so then when I back I feel so happy so fresh before that I feel like oh why I come here streets very dirty there's a lot of box around there date time we have friend 90 time it is a Kamino if I got to if I want to pee you know you can pee on the bush neighbor position they all chase up to me and the night but after that back i feel wow there's a tree in from me and when i look at the tree the tree looks completely different now it's more alive the leaves are really shining and so appreciate that being a lie the street become line my home but then then i feel thirst thirst want to dream something they look at the palm water i stand up took few steps then I become unconscious I think oh I find it the someone took me in the hospital nearby there so I woke up in the hospital with what he called ID by the IB IB yeah yeah so I stayed there for I did one night doctors say you should stay there even longer but then I feel very good I do a lot of kind of water with the funny taste yeah so then after that I thought oh maybe I should move to the Himalayas so then I moved from question Alka to lappa and someone someone give me some money also AHA that person took me in the hospital and gave me some money but another ticket and eventually went to LA and then baking food you know in in the book you say is this wind part suddenly boom awareness and emptiness became one indivisible just as it always is but the recognition had never been this complete before the last shred of cohesion slipped away and the entire universe opened up and became totally unified with consciousness right so this is Wow Wow beyond Wow it's a great experience for me it is the most difficult one but that is the best experience for me I think this is really really wonderful kind of like experience for me that after that then then it's really become kind of like before the I have a lot of fear there's a lot of unsaved a lot of things but once you lost that and you are really you know what I call if you love the world the world loves you back mmm so then after that my journey was really wonderful and then you wrote a book in love with the world this whole experience yeah this is about this experience yeah and you've been doing that spending time with us here in the West too so that's great I'm hoping I know Christian das has been to several of your teachings and it retreats and so and I hope to be there too and we are going to let everybody know are you are coming back to America this is coming to America in May this book will release on May 7 mm-hmm and I will do some book tour and also I will teach the meaning of book how to practice mmm the part of Barto meditation I will I'm going to do a lot of course around the Bardo meditation yes Oh wonderful so we hope to meet up with you there and we'll put everything up so people can know where you're going to be and join you that would be thank you fantastic and so everybody listening will will have all of these links and links to ripich's book and not only this book joy of living which is a wonderful book as well and schedule and websites all of that and not to mention his brothers who we have to connect up with them as well and yes thank you so thank you so much for being here yes thank you very much something just just wonderful thank you very much for both of you thank you so much the most [Music]

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Keywords: raghu markus, mindrolling, david silver, mind rolling, podcast, mind rolling podcast, mindrolling podcast, spirituality, eastern spirituality, be here now network, be here now, bhnn, meditation podcast, spirituality podcast, love podcast, loving podcast, mingyur rinpoche, tibetan buddhism, yongey mingyur rinpoche, how to meditate, joy of living

Id: AJn5EWS7oAU

Length: 60min 26sec (3626 seconds)

Published: Tue May 07 2019