FUELING WHAT IS THE BIGGEST THREAT TO EUROPEAN SECURITY SINCE THE END OF THE COLD WAR. >> JOINING ME NOW IS DISTINGUISHED VISITING FELLOW AT THE HOOVER INSTITUTE AT THE FOUNDATION FOR DEFENSE OF DEMOCRACIES. HIS LATEST ARTICLE CO-AUTHORED WITH A REPUBLICAN FROM WISCONSIN ENTITLED NO SUBSTITUTE FOR VICTORY. MATT, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US. SECRETARY BLINKEN'S WARNING WILL SUSTAINING THE WAR IN UKRAINE, SUPPORT FROM CHINA, FROM RUSSIA, THEY HAVE NOT CROSSED THE RED LINE OF WEAPONS BUT THEY HAVE DONE JUST ABOUT EVERYTHING ELSE AND CERTAINLY THE OIL EMBARGO GETTING AROUND THAT THE BANKS BLINKEN WILL BE DEALING WITH THAT. YOU CITE IN YOUR ARTICLE A FEBRUARY REPORT THAT TIKTOK ALSO ACCOUNTS -- TIKTOK ACCOUNTS FROM CHINESE PROPAGANDA OUTFITS REPORTEDLY TARGETS CANDIDATES FROM BOTH POLITICAL PARTIES IN 2021. HOW COULD THEY INFLUENCE THIS FALL'S ELECTION? >> THANKS FOR HAVING ME AND WE'LL TALK ABOUT TIKTOK IN A SECOND. BUT JUST ON THE NEWS THAT YOU MENTIONED WITH SECRETARY BLINKEN RIGHT NOW IN CHINA, THE RED LINE THAT YOU REFERRED TO THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN DROOU RATHER EXPLICITLY TWO YEARS AGO AFTER THEFUL FULL-ON INVASION OF UKRAINE, WAS NOT JUST LETHAL BT HE SAID ANY MATERIAL SUPPORT. AND HE THREATENED WIDESPREAD SANCTIONS. SO I WANT YOUR VIEWERS TO REALIZE HOW IMPORTANT THIS MOMENT IS. THIS IS THE MOMENT WHERE PRESIDENT BIDEN WILL EITHER ENFORCE THE RED LINE HE DREW TWO YEARS AGO OR FAIL TO ENFORCE IT. AND EITHER HAS SIGNIFICANT CONSEQUENCES. IF HE ENFORCE IT IS AS I HOPE HE DOES, THAT WILL MEAN THAT HE WILL HAVE TO IMPOSE REAL COSTS ON THE CHINESE ECONOMY. PROBABLY ON ITS FINANCIAL SYSTEM SANCTIONS BANKS AND SO FORTH. IF HE DOESN'T ENFORCE IT, THE CONSEQUENCES WON'T BE IMMEDIATE, BUT THEY WILL BE FAR MORE GRAVE AND THAT WILL BE THE BEIJING WILL KNOW THAT IT HAS A GREEN LIGHT TO CONTINUE WITH THESE SORTS OF ACTIVITIES, YOU KNOW, DRIVING THE WAR IN EUROPE AS THE MOST SIGNIFICANT MATERIAL SUPPORTER, THE MOST SIGNIFICANT DIPLOMATIC AND PROPAGANDA SUPPORTER. ALSO THE MAIN SUPPORTER FOR IRAN'S WAR IN THE MIDDLE EAST RIGHT NOW. THE MAIN SUPPORTER FOR THE VENEZUELAN DICTATORSHIP. SO THIS IS A REALLY CRITICAL MOMENT. TIKTOK, LOOK, BEIJING -- IT IS CLEAR BEIJING INTENDS TO USE TIKTOK AND ACCORDING TO U.S. INTELLIGENCE OFFICIALS ALREADY USES TIKTOK TO TRY TO INFLUENCE VOTERS IN THE UNITED STATES. AND SO BECAUSE BEIJINGGORITHM ALGORITHMS, THAT MEANS THAT THEY CAN INFLUENCE WHAT GOES VIRAL AND WHAT GETS SUPPRESSED GOING TO HALF OF THE AMERICANS. SO THIS IS THE MOST POWERFUL MEDIA COMPANY IN AMERICAN HISTORY AND YET CONTROLLED BY THE PARTY. >> AND THE U.S. SEEMS DETERMINED TO TRY TO ESPECIALLY AFTER THE CHINESE BALLOON INCIDENT NORMALIZE RELATIONS, YOU KNOWS GET THE MILITARY TO MILITARY COMMUNICATIONS GOING AGAIN, THAT WAS VERY, VERY IMPORTANT. ARE THEY TOO EAGER, DO YOU THINK, TO KEEP THINGS CALM IN AN ELECTION YEAR WITH CHINA? >> I THINK SO, AND HERE'S WHY. THERE'S A HISTORICAL PRECEDENT FOR THIS, AND I LOVED YOUR INTERVIEW A MINUTE AGO TALKING ABOUT THE 60s. THE MOMENT WE'RE IN RIGHT NOW IS A LOT LIKE THE 1970s. IF YOU REMEMBER THIS PERIOD WHERE WE WERE -- HAD SORT OF A HUMILIATING RETREAT FROM VIETNAM, THE SOVIETS WERE HELPING THE VIETNAMESE. SOVIETS WERE DRIVING CHAOS AROUND THE WORLD. THEY KEPT SECRET FROM US AND FROM ISRAEL THE SURPRISE ATTACK BY THEIR THEN ALLY EGYPT IN THE 1973 WAR ON ISRAEL. THEY WERE LAUNCHING CUBAN SOLDIERS INTO BATTLE ACROSS AFRICA, THE HORN OF AFRICA, AND ANGOLA, AND WE WERE PURSUING A REALLY -- A FAILED POLICY TOWARDS THE SOVIET AT THE TIME CALLED DETENTE, AND THE MOMENT WE'RE IN RIGHT NOW IS A LOT LIKE THAT MOMENT IN THE '70s WHERE, YOU KNOW, IN THIS CASE IT'S CHINA IS THE MAIN ADVERSARY WITH ITS PROXIES, RUSSIA, IRAN, NORTH KOREA, VENEZUELA. THEY'RE DRIVING CHAOS AROUND THE WORLD, XI JINPING HAS BEEN VERY OPEN ABOUT THE FACT THE WORLD IS IN CHAOS. HE USES THAT VERY WORD, AND HE ALSO SAYS THE CURRENT TREND OF CHAOS WORKS TO BEIJING'S ADVANTAGE. HE SEES HIMSELF AS AN AGENT OF CHAOS. HE THINKS THIS CHAOS IS USEFUL, AND YET, WE'RE USING THE FAILED POLICIES OF THE 1970s, AND I'M NOT JUST BLAMING THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION FOR THIS. I THINK THEY DID PRETTY WELL IN THEIR CHINA POLICY FOR THE FIRST TWO YEARS, BUT THEY'RE SLOUCHING INTO SOMETHING THAT IS NOT -- THAT IS TOO DEFERENTIAL AS YOU SAY. >> WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO LEAVE IT THERE FOR NOW,
