Hyundai Veloster N DCT | A Better GTI?

[Music] [Music] [Music] the interior space of the veloster n we've already covered this car in great detail but there have been some updates for 2021 so i'm going to cover the pros and the cons these seats have been altered there's now an n logo at the top that lights up at night yes it's very reminiscent of what bmw does in some of their m car seats you now have an ngs button with the combination of the dual clutch they've added here stands for n grin shift yes that is extremely technical you have 20 seconds to utilize this feature which adds some over boost and programming changes the countdown dial looks very similar to what porsche does in their sport response mode the overall interior and i said this in the previous video is reminiscent of what vw does in some of their products but overall this is a very basic interior space aside from what i just talked about there are minimal gimmicks everything is physical there's no glossy black plastic basically anywhere everything is a matte texture and there is some pros and cons to that like the door panel just look at it it looks like something you'd find in a 12 000 car it is so cheap the interior quality is not the best but in a car like this you're hoping that the driving experience makes up for some of that now this also has the infinity audio system which we audio tested it this time and what it sounds like with the windows up and cruising along sounds like you put a 90 sony boombox in the glove compartment and then put a wet towel over the speakers there is there's so much harmonic distortion there's such a lack of clarity and it's very bass heavy but again in a car like this for the performance you're getting this might be one of those things that you're willing to sacrifice and you have to be to get a hot hatch in this price point anymore but let's get into the shop and talk about some of the good things and changes they made for the 2021 model year underneath the updated veloster n this has some moderate changes and the biggest being it's a dual clutch they finally made a competitor to something like the gti or golf r which is really your only option if you wanted a automatic hot hatchback they did make some other changes to packaging so now the performance pack is standard for every single velocirant both manual and automatic what the performance back was was a elsd a higher output tune for your engine and an active exhaust yeah so let's start with the architecture and then we'll go into the details of all the subsystem so this is a change from the old veloster where it was all torsion beam on the rear end now it's multi-link it's more like shared with the elantra sport so you have that this is still on more of a c segment budget architecture but they made some improvements because of all the horsepower and torque that they're adding here yes so you have strut front and they are adaptive dampers in this car and they tie into all your drive modes and there are a ton of them you can go from a more streetable suspension setting it's still stiffer than something like a gti or even the type r this is also a kdm product this is built entirely in korea if you compare it to something like a gti or a focus st it's very very similar most of the stuff is steel but it is covered up so they did have to make some changes here so let's talk about that in terms of suspension when you're putting all this torque you couldn't just use the traditional strut that they put on the lower horsepower variants and honda went really extreme to re-modify their front suspension which looks night and day better than this but they did improve the knuckle design they reinforced the knuckle design they also changed the wheel bearing size their their beefed up wheel bearings here they went to a rack mounted eps unit and all of this helps to kind of control and mitigate some torque steer some pulling on the wheel that you get and the biggest obviously as you mentioned with the performance pack which is standard is the elsd all of this works together between all those changes to put the power down and it doesn't feel like an absolute show something like the sonata m line we got out of where you have this enormous amount of power that just gets wasted disintegrating a tire the the point of this is to turn have confidence to mash down the throttle and have it pull you out with you having to do middle minimal throttle correction or man you know managing the wheel you can focus on driving the next thing they did with the n setup and reel n which this is n performance is the esc and the transmission tuning is also vastly different so your stability control is not hyperactive obviously when everything's in normal mode it's very traditional but when you get up in the custom and end modes it doesn't it doesn't cut in all the time so it gives you some wiggle room right and it's it makes it for a much more drivable experience and that's the big difference between the end cars and some of the lesser is this is trying to make you feel engaged driving it there are geometry changes as well specifically to roll center when compared to the regular veloster and i believe the veloster are aligned obviously you get a dedicated summer tire and if you look at hyundai's original documents from launch they they tried to set specific goals for the dynamics of this vehicle and i do think they did a good job accomplishing that so let's talk about the dual clutch and something the dual clutch also adds is a over boost function called n grind shift what that does is similar to like a porsche product it lets you put a little bit more boost to the turbo so you get seven percent increase in torque it's active for 20 seconds and there's a cooldown of a couple minutes after that and with the dual clutch the dual clutch is built in house by hyundai kia it is a wet dual clutch versus the prior generation which was a dry dual clutch what the wet dual clutch means is it has its own oil bath that allows it to engage a little bit smoother but more importantly it adds to thermal capacity it allows it to cool itself better and speaking of cooling not only did they spend more time with the transmission because they wanted durability there they spent more time with this car overall compared to their other products where you could take it to a track the cooling system can keep up there are these little shovels or air directors that kick up some you know kick it's not like a real duct but it does kick up enough air to the brake rotor to help reduce brake fade the brake pads are more aggressive they have a much larger this isn't some fancy brumbo brake package but it's an enormous single caliber piss or single piston caliper for the front which again they hold up they do they do hold up and about a lot of the design of the veloster and and i've said this in multiple videos they were really keeping this to a price point they didn't want to go crazy they could have gone to the 40 45 000 range to compete with the civic type r but they still wanted the original price point was 30 and now this is what like 35 i think it's like 34 in change which makes it a more expensive car but if you think about what it competes against the type r is more money the golf gti which to me because of the dual clutch is the most direct competitor is the same ball cars you have to go up to the golf r really kind of forty thousand dollar car so you're getting a lot for your money here and this is what they were trying to do well you still have some ease to service you don't have esoteric or expensive aluminum suspension components so you can beat the hell out of this still get some parts still work on it it's more it's about the closest purest drivers front-wheel drive car that you can get on the market right now and you know we didn't do a good job or i didn't do a good job during the first veloster video kind of explaining the nuances of all the stuff that went into this and i think we'll do our best during the drive to kind of talk through some of that before we get this thing out on the street mark the last thing to talk about is the warranty part this by far has the longest powertrain warranty out of anything in the segment and if you're buying this you're a younger buyer this is a car you're in for for a lot of money it's you're probably going to need it and you're going to love the fact that you have a 10-year 100 000 mile powertrain warranty and you're going to beat the snot out of this car i could see if i was like 25 i would just i would probably put that warranty to the use every six months we're gonna talk about all the way that the dual clutch performs the elsd everything on the street so let's get out there jack [Music] [Applause] [Music] jack velosteren dual clutch we know everything technical we know about the interior let's see how all of this translates into a drive all right well let's talk about some of the basics before we get into the real performance talk let's talk about ride quality it's definitely on the stiffer end of the spectrum yes you have adaptive dampers but the way i look at this car you're competing against the civic type r which does the best dual personality both being soft and it can go firm if you wanted to and the sti and then you have this thing and maybe the gti the gti is the most boring most mundane of these cars the wrx sti in this are about in the same plane of stiffness it definitely feels like a rougher ride without being entirely punishing because of how good these seats are i would absolutely agree and if i had to put an order the civic type r is definitely the most refined in suspension and damper control um and this is definitely on the firmer spectrum and it's it's a good thing and i don't mind it here because when you're getting into a hot hatch like this it's by far something that you want because you can't get this anymore the focus rs and the focus st products and like all those they were way too firm they were like on the extreme end of being firm for no good reason other than just being firm this is not that way it's still tolerable on the street and it's got good body control and it lends to its character definitely has more of this like 90s econo box sportiness in a good way it's not a detractor in this case and so we're about to show we're going to use some launch control mark yeah so launch control since we have the dsg it gives you that option and you can go all the way up to 3 500 rpm we're gonna hold down the brake hit the gas it definitely feels like it slips the clutch it's not a super aggressive launch it's not at all it's not something like the porsche launch control where it dumps the clutch on your ass this is it's really careful about how it engages so you're not going to get a ton of wheel spin this does a great job with putting its power down down on like the other hyundai's with the turbos where we constantly complain about wheel hop one wheel appeal this starts to activate a little bit of wheel hop or a little bit of spin and the elsd which is a clutch back style limited slip differential reins in all of that power and puts it down smoothly where you never feel like you're fighting the car this is the first hyundai product that i've been thoroughly thoroughly impressed by doing this with you i honestly am blown away by how good this thing is to drive on a back road like this this is where this car shines you and i are unique in that we've driven veloster ends at road america on the full track we've got across them and now we spend a lot of time with both the automatic and manual variant on the street i think i'm gonna say this and it's probably get us into some hot water the dual clutch is i think objectively the better transmission for this car this is the first dual clutch that i felt in an affordable price range and absolutely the first one that hyundai and kia have produced where not only is the programming good like up shifts quickly and it changes the character of the upshifting to be more aggressive when you're in end mode if you are pulling a paddle you'll feel a little bit of shock you will feel the transmission engaging and downshifts are exactly what you expect from a dual clutch it will rev match downshifts it's smoothly rub matches them it goes into gear when you pull the paddle there's not a three second delay there's no hesitation it's almost unbelievable for this price point how good it is and i think it adds so much character to the drive it makes it easier to drive than the manual which means it is also feels faster you can get away with so much and have so much driving confidence that when we were on a back road driving this thing and i was in the lc just screwing around with you i could not keep up with you in this thing you were just gone because you can go flat out in every single corner without fear of it under steering off the road because of the limited slip it manages its power so well and it is so light on its feet i do want to touch on the dynamics okay because there are three parts of this car on an autocross this is where these things really really suffer because unlike the specific type r you can't get this thing to rotate under braking yeah you can't and it's one of the big disappointments about it on the street when you're when you're street driving you're like holy this thing can do anything when you're on a track this thing inspires utter confidence but when you get it in a really tight course and we've had it out there it starts to turn into an understeer fast and it reminds me more of like the golf r and the gti where that front end is just even though the lsd is working with you it can't rotate itself and that's where this thing struggles compared to the type of compared to the type r the back end is far less ear to go around which again if you're autocrossing you're gonna hate it and you're gonna have to do sway bar adjustments probably shocks or dampers and but for those that are not autocrossing you're gonna love this motor's great trans is excellent let's quickly talk about the engine a little bit more how does it build power so i would say it still kind of feels like niko turbo but it pulls all the way to the higher end with great ease it feels like it wants to rev which is why this has such great character combine that with the fact that i know the brakes are artificially boosted but you go on the brakes about 45 percent you're like i could stop at like 200 miles an hour there's so much braking confidence that comes from this at least on the street i i think there's good high speed stability as well it's just this is a complete package from a hyundai product when you see what they can do here and this is the and hyundai has said they've left a lot off the table in terms of performance you would never know it here let's get into the final thoughts jack and sum all this up all right final thoughts on the veloster n when i first drove the manual it was kind of a mixed bag and after experiencing some of the updates that they've done to this i would almost say this car is better with a dual clutch and i hate to say that because i love driving a manual transmission car but when technology kind of keeps up and you have full manual control you have the speed you have the character you have kind of slam shifts you have smooth shifts there's the electronic programming that makes it more engaging to drive it's not a gimmick anymore it really does help you drive this car fast and you add the elsd which essentially and all the stability control programming when you do this and you do this the car does everything for you it literally there's no thought your your monkey brain can just mash down the throttle and the car always pulls you through and that is what makes this so much fun and so there's a couple things though i have some negatives the audio system sucks which who cares nobody cares about that the new seats are great they're they're a little bit thinner they weigh less than the previous generations one but they might be a little bit too constrictive for certain body types i like them the next thing is the dual clutch option costs more than the manual so that might be a deal breaker for some it auto-up shifts from first to second when you get near the red line in a corner it and i'm sure it's to save the transmission from shock from there on you can bang off the rev limiter when you're manually shifting so i think this gets down to the last discussion about the velosteron can you deal with the interior space if you're a little bit older and you've gone through a wide variety of cars getting into a space that feels very cheaply built is going to be a problem if you haven't been in a lot of cars you're gonna think well i love the simplicity of this and that is a counterpoint to to that because so many cars focus on everything else but the driving experience where this adds some of it back it adds the fun back and it really did put a smile on my face driving this and if you're looking for probably sad to say if you're looking for one of the most pure front-wheel drive fun to drive cars on the market right now that is a manual and a great automatic option this is pretty much becoming one of the last of its kind thanks for watching i'll see you next time [Music] i am quinn a savage geese chatbot i am developing feelings for you anywho would you like to support them patreon is a great way funds will be used to power my neural network additionally feel free to head over to savagegeese.com and click sg merch chicago auto pros is handling the ordering and shipping part of the proceeds will be donated to the american foundation for suicide prevention

Channel: savagegeese

Views: 203,515

Keywords: review, cars, fun, cargurus, trucks, carvanna, 2021, 2022, Hyundai veloster n, dual clutch, dct, honda, Civic, type r, typer, CTR, K20C1, Problems, truth, hot hatch, cheap sports cars, tech, manual transmission, pros, cons, VW, Golf R, Ford Focus, Focus RS, type r vs Focus, Si, ST, track, funny, comparison, best, worst, mods, affordable, mark up, cooling, subaru sti, wrx

Id: z3QM-_foNAc

Length: 18min 20sec (1100 seconds)

Published: Fri Apr 09 2021

Reddit Comments

[u/Implement-Worried]

Looking around local dealers I see the Hyundai Veloster N somewhat as a hard sell. It was smart of Hyundai to include a non-performance package version at launch to get the notion that the cars were much cheaper than competitors or in a middle space between the GTI and Type R. However, looking online now the gap between a Veloster N and Civic Type R is around $3k now. On the lower end, you can get either GLI/GTIs for around $8k less with VW offering 60-72 month loans with 0% APR.

The bigger issue is that my local Hyundai/Kia dealers are some of the biggest shysters around. I am talking mandatory dealer options and doc fees to the tune of around $1500. Looking at a Kia Stinger was the worst dealership experiances I ever had and their old school profit tatics keeps me from ever considering anything from the brands.

[u/waterulookinat]

Si and WRX owners sitting here nervously.

[u/miatatony]

I find it ironic that as a kid all I wanted was the smallest lightest, most impractical fwd coupes like an integra, crx, rsx. Now in a world full of boring competent cars hyundai comes out with this magnificent car but my taste has changed and I'd rather own a boring GTI or GLI instead. To me this veloster N is the spiritual successor to the crx SI.

[u/[deleted]]

I think part of this might just be me reeling at how expensive cars are now in general, but the $34k-ish price point just seems like a lot for a car that appears to be aimed at enthusiasts in their 20s. But that's the rub, it seems priced appropriately compared to what the rest of that market segment is selling for new.

I'm in my 30s now and owned a MkV GTI with a DSG through my 20s, and if I were that age again today I'd probably still buy the GTI for the lower price and milder manners in daily commute driving. If I wanted more raw fun that was going to beat me up a bit and be less practical to live with in general, I'd probably go for an 86 since those can be had for even less money.

[u/losteye_enthusiast]

The N has won numerous accolades, has proven capability, an outstandingly good warranty and no bullshit of pretending to be anything other than what it is: a focused, enthusiast FWD performance car.

It's a remarkably good little car. The fact that so many in this sub are debating the pros/cons of it vs. golf's lineup is pretty telling. Lot of us aren't going to buy one, but it's definitely a strong first step for the full-fat N brand.

[u/againstliam]

I wish there was a bit more of a discussion on comparing the dct to VWs dsg. It seems they really liked the Ns transmission and I wonder if they thought it was as good as VWs.

I'm glad both the GTI and the N exist as they cater to different markets. I would never pick the Hyundai because I prefer the more subtle styling and daily features but I know there are buyers that feel the opposite.

[u/led_pants]

Imho the question that should be asked instead of "veloster n vs. gti?" is: "when will hyundai make a golf r competitor?"

[u/theDomicron]

I wish this car were around when I were younger. Coming from my 97 Accord and my 03 Corolla (my nemesis car) I think this would have been brilliant.

Now that i've driven a few Lexuses, I think that interior is going to be a really hard sell.

I mean, it's one thing to buy an older car with a crappy interior, but buying a new car with a crappy interior is hard to swallow now that most automakers are able to put out something that feels pretty high end, even if it isn't actually.

I appreciate why it has to be this way, because Hyundai is putting their dollars towards the driving experience and drivetrain, but for me now that i'm almost 40 I'm not sure it's worth it for me.

[u/THE_GR8_MIKE]

It costs 3K more, base, so hopefully.