How Netflix Reality TV Almost Broke Joey Sasso

I'm not a sensitive dude like I love having discussions with people who disagree with me on everything because that helps me learn that helps me grow where I feel like people say that but they don't they want people who agree with them Circle up folks it's time to welcome Joey Sasso to the checkup podcast he's the winner of the circle season one reality show on Netflix that was a huge hit right before the pandemic now he's on another hit show called the perfect match and if you haven't watched it it's been top 10 on Netflix but the last seven weeks and it's continuing to rise a lot of drama on that show and he talks about the health and wellness implications of being on reality TV he's very open about his mental health and physical health struggles so I think this is a very Illuminating conversation that I hope you enjoy as much as I did let's get started with a checkup podcast see I always say I'm like Travolta training for the remake of Saturday Night Fever just waiting for that day to come can I actually dance no do I think I can dance yes it's about your enthusiasm confidence is always high yeah that's all that matters for dancing Rhythm no you don't you don't need it you're not competing this isn't a competition when you're on the Dance Floor I want to see Dr Mike on Dance Floor I'm enthusiastically bad but that makes it good but that's why like you're endearing this is why like people that's a good term that's a good term I don't know if people love me there's Dr Martin there's haters here's the thing everyone has haters I don't see any for you I really love do you know Joey you'll be surprised really yeah I'm curious where you see the love okay everything I see you post everything I see anyone talk about you okay it's so positive and like you're handsome you're educated you take care of this is like the nicest therapy assessment you drive I need a dope content like you're on top like you check all of the boxes and like I don't know what personal life is none of my business I would just imagine okay that if you were a single man you would have a lot of suitors single man and uh you know what's funny checking boxes you think that would be the formula for Success it's not really I'll be the first to tell you yeah because a lot of times when people see check boxes and then the last box of being single is also checked it's like a warning flag for people so everyone comes with preconceived notions well let me ask you this do you find it difficult to get serious with someone because you're so career oriented no no no I think I have trouble finding the perfect match because I don't want to settle and I've learned from past mistakes of getting into something too early and this has been the longest time in my life that I have been single uh the last few years and it's taught me that maybe taking it slow is the right path and being selective is smart because you're choosing something for your entire life well and that's the thing though I feel like there's such a pressure with dating today I don't know if it's always been this way but at least today from what I see from Friends people that like you go into something with an intention of this is forever yes where I feel like it's so much more healthy to really know what you want date around figure out and let things evolve because I feel like when you when you put an expectation on something you're only setting yourself up for failure and I feel like there's something to be said of forming a beautiful friendship with someone sure that can evolve over time because I feel like there's always a thing right I think we've all had this where you date someone you're open with them yep but you're not 100 open with them but you'll be a hundred percent open with let's say a best friend okay about things that you really feel things that you think about things like that where I feel like having a friendship first to me is the foundation of a beautiful relationship I think that's true you also said something interesting you think most people know what they want you think that's true I'd like to think so I like to think that a lot of people have a direction of which way they want to go and knowing where they want their life to be as far as people being honest about that I think is Up For Debate because I think sometimes you can have people who really are saying like it's like sort of like you're meeting someone and presenting yourself as this perfect type of thing like I always tell people if I'm on a date let's act like this is [ __ ] date number 12. oh like let's get [ __ ] real what changes on date 12 for you you're comfortable you have a sense of relaxation I don't date like dating for me is extremely awkward and so you just said screw it I'm gonna go do it in a public setting now yeah I was like you know what yeah like I don't date so let's go do this on camera and just say [ __ ] it and see what happens roll the dice here but for real because I feel like you go on like I have all friends you go on dates and they're like oh it was terrible I'll never see him again or I'm never doing this again and I'm like okay um what if you were just vibing with someone and you just were friends and there is no expectation of it am I gonna see you next week yeah am I gonna hear from you like it just lets things evolve more naturally where when I feel like you put the stigma of like a date on it it leads to an expectation so you change it to be a hangout as opposed to a date yeah I mean I would say um you know I feel like in today's world like there's always people vibing on socials things like that but I like to just meet people organically like I tried the dating app thing in the past not for me I'm so what what went wrong for you on the dating app scene I I feel like I'm such an in-person type of dude like I like looking at someone shooting the [ __ ] really vibing where it's like all I hear from all of my girlfriends is how dudes are So Thirsty okay and it makes me feel very excited I always grow up to like respect women so I'm like okay in what way am I going to slide in a DM that's gonna be a stand like I don't put that much thought into it I'm Joey I just say what's good how are you like let's Vibe let's but what honest thing can you really say besides I think you're hot yeah and that comes off Thursday yeah it comes off like you're an [ __ ] you're a [ __ ] boy you're all of these things so it there's so much pressure and especially in the world today of social when you're seeing people weigh in I feel like there is such a way of trying to go about things because you don't know what's appropriate for someone because what's appropriate for someone is not appropriate for someone else and even like for me I love an aggressive woman I love a woman who who makes the first move oh okay so now like physically aggressive no not physically aggressive just like makes that first move confidence yeah because I feel like here's the thing men for the most part will go with anyone who'll give them the time of day really I believe so okay for the most part it makes men wanted uh validated were women like my father grew up telling me this when I was growing up it was like a woman can go out every single day have whoever she wants the drop for dime a man can be married all these things loyal faithful but one day one woman Smiles at him and he is ready to risk everything okay that he has so you're saying men are horn balls I think men are horn balls for sure but I'm also not on the the track of [ __ ] men because I feel like there is so much of that today where I feel like I feel like men should just be more mindful of being respectful and going about things the right way because I feel like that does go a long way I mean also you got to think historically speaking men have been Savages yeah of course behavior in cultural aspects in uh professional settings so I can see how that label starts sticking to men after a period of time yeah because unfortunately it does happen I'm curious from your perspective and meeting people who are let's say popular on social media yeah the image they put out of themselves does it oftentimes match up to what you see in person no and I could say that for myself personally you mean about yourself yeah I think a lot of people who meet me and actually get to know me are very thrown because I think people see me for the most part is this uh cocky Jersey Shore type of dude censorship like I always hear that but people are often very shocked they're like dude I'm a [ __ ] nerd like I grew up being a film lover and when I say a film lover like I am a nerd I collect physical media vinyl records vintage posters movie props I'm typically decked out in horror memorabilia I'm a huge horror movie Nut so like this for me is like I dressed up I went I went to that I had to for doctor I had the jacket yeah but you know I think that there is a struggle as well because I moved out to LA to be an actor that was my love I was never chasing social I was never Chasing Reality television it happened and I'm so blessed for that but now I've been put into a realm of you have to be an influencer a content creator and I don't know how to do that because I've never been that type of dude like I always thought my wildest dreams I would play weird avant-garde characters and maybe people in the film Community would take a liking to me I never had a big enough ego to think I'm gonna take over and be the biggest star this time yeah I mean of course idolize those people but I was also realistic that like the odds aren't in my favor and my uh term of success would be making a living at doing what I love so with that being said when it goes over to social I think that a lot of people who have met me are very taken by how quiet I am more so than big and energetic because like that is a part of my personality but I think people think that's just me 24 7. do you think your personality is different on Netflix versus social or it's the same no I think my personality on Netflix has definitely come through but I do think like anything there's editing sure you know like so do you are you saying those shows are unfairly edited no I think that they're fairly edited really I do I I think that here's the thing I cannot stand when people go on reality television shows and [ __ ] and complain about the edits that they get because here's the thing you give footage and editing is part of the process like they are there to make a show so I'm not gonna sit there and complain about things like okay there have been things I don't think I look great with that I would disagree with but I also know we're there to make a show and my job is to be a professional show up and give a hundred percent of myself every single day that's the job so I I feel like it's very contradictory to go and do that and then sort of go on your socials and start blasting and doing things like come on man like I always say if you're really that upset go in La go into any bar any restaurant and ask the bartender or waiter what they wish they were doing right now to make a living because I guarantee you they're trying to be in the business trying to get somewhere and I was that kid I struggled for so many years so I know what it's like to really grind and hope for an opportunity so I'm not gonna get an opportunity be extremely blessed for that and then go and blast those people who gave me that opportunity I think that is just so unprofessional just not right what about the idea that if they turn a situation or tell a situation from one side more than the other and that leads you to getting attacked on social media then it takes a toll on your mental health do you see that ever playing out I mean it happened to me on perfect match okay for sure like I I had to log out of my socials because um the circle was just love and I never expected that show to be a hit like when I when we were making it I remember uh telling people on the crew I'm like [ __ ] he's gonna watch this like we're set up the show for people who haven't watched them this is my go-to show by the way at Peak pandemic time so the circle is a reality competition show the first Netflix ever did where you take starts out with eight contestants who are locked away in an apartment and you're communicating on a social media app called the circle and the entire pitch of the show is you don't know who you're talking to is real or fake it's essentially a popularity contest where your goal is to get to the end if you're ranked in the top you're an influencer which gives you the power to block people I can't believe I got all that out holy [ __ ] you got it out accurately but it also paints a picture of a very narcissistic show where you're blocking people trying to climb the social I didn't understand anything with this show for the first two weeks of filming because I don't watch reality television so all that made sense to me was some people are real some people are fake imma find those [ __ ] we're gonna get them out of there he thought it was clue bro 100 like I remember go back and watch those first few episodes and it's just me talking [ __ ] to people okay because I'm like yo my job is to find these scumbags and get them out the game where then I realized oh wait this is actually about making friendships and accepting people for whoever they say they are okay I could I could get on board with that but again in theory imagine you're being pitched this show yeah you don't know what the hell because they're like it's a competition show some people are real some people aren't fake but it's also people get eliminated there's ratings blockings and I'm like yo yeah that's scary how accurate is it from what they pitch you the concept is going in versus to what it ends up being is there any difference between a circle 100 really yeah 100 accurate I would just say I remember telling all of them not to tell me much because I'm the type of dude if you tell me too much I'm gonna stress and I'm gonna overthink and I'm gonna have an end goal of mine which is gonna make me not be authentically myself so I'm the dude that's like yo throw me in deep water like okay let me learn how to swim like we both were Boxers yeah I was a fighter growing up oh wow okay so that's uh you know how I learned how to fight was they didn't prep me I was the only white fighter in a 400 mile radius it was we're throwing you in you're gonna get your ass beat and you're gonna learn how to take a beating and sometimes give it so that's how I've always been brutal okay so that you did that but then you said the circle was honest where other shows not um perfect match what was I would say perfect match it was just it was again a first season of something bigger that you know Netflix has spoken openly that they want to do a sort of reality Universe of of shows and this was their first show to do that of bringing their most popular people together so there was so much more mystery to what we were actually doing we knew it was a dating show we knew it was a competition show that's really it so there was so much speculation about what's actually what is this gonna be like what what like what's happening and like I gotta give all the props in the world to kinetic and Netflix for keeping everything under wraps yeah and keeping the mystery alive because when I go back to that first episode of the show I could see the excitement in my eyes when Nick Lachey walks out which by the way we [ __ ] love Nick Lachey love that I believe it I could see it from all you guys bro he's the goat but like we didn't know like what is what is what's the concept and like when you're you know in Panama waiting to start filming you gotta do the quarantine period you're sitting in a hotel room yeah and your mind is running a wild you're like yo what could be happening here especially because you've seen too hot to handle so you're like if they're pulling that on people what are they pulling on us I have a confession to me oh no tell me I have never seen one episode of two out to handle out of anger spite just just not interested here's the thing like when the circle came out it was sort of like the three ring Trifecta we had the circle in January Love is Blind in February and then too hot to handle I think April right after and I was just meeting the people from the cast because like we were all coming up at the same time got it so it was more so like oh so and so slitting my DMs what's good bro like nice to meet you you hope you're killing it on the show like I just was never someone who was like seeking the shows out at that point it was a blessing just to get to meet the people which I much prefer because I have friends who will tell me I think I got a bad edit or this didn't look great I don't know just because I know the person I don't really know the show so I feel like that's helped me be completely unbiased when meeting people got it did you um get along with anyone extremely well off of the first seasons of all those shows there like who was your person yeah um for the circle it was definitely shoobs we love shoes and Miranda Miranda to this day but honestly Chris Sammy like I there's I'm not bullshitting this I would tell you there is no bad blood between any of us really yeah everyone's just legitimate good friends like that first season dude like there was something really special that all of us just became really good friends extremely close and we kicked off the reality scene at Netflix which is nuts like because when we were filming it like I said I was like Yo No One's Gonna watch this like this is crazy and I went back you know I was slinging drinks in La at the oldest gay bar in L.A that was my survival job so I won the show never thought that was gonna happen on my mother's life winning to me was making it to the end because I'm competitive as [ __ ] to me I was like yo winning 100 Grand that will never happen in my lifetime but I can try to make it to the end to me like that's winning I'm on the entire show when I actually won I didn't know what I couldn't speak for 24 hours I remember it vividly I could not talk and I just remember thinking like I was going through such a low point in my life that during that time during that time wow yeah I was uh secretly an addict so I'm sober now well going through a drug and alcohol problem which no one knew about uh clinically depressed so much stuff going on and just so miserable with where my life and career was because I didn't think the circle was going to change my life when I got offered the opportunity um how I got casted was the gay bar that I worked at one of my friends who worked there is also a casting director and he told me I'm casting this thing you have to come in for it and I go what is it he said Netflix is doing this reality show and I go I don't do reality because all you're told in La when you're studying and I'd been studying for so many years in my my acting is don't ever do reality because you'll be you'll be [ __ ] like Typecast well they just won't take you serious as an actor where I think that was still very much an old school mindset of you can do one thing that's it where now it's you want to be able to do everything so I was like I'm gonna go to the audition because how many auditions do I go on where nothing happens yeah don't want to burn a bridge I never did a reality audition where it was like you talking to me right now wow and just me being able to talk and be myself where acting auditions is hey I'm Joey Sasso I'm reading for the role of Mike yeah action yeah do your thing you're out the door where my family had always said If people could just see your personality they would really fall in love with you and I was like okay I get to get out of slinging drinks for 30 days and go to the UK yeah that's [ __ ] go like I I was just like let's just go have a good time I have nothing invested I don't think I'm gonna win this thing it was lightning in a bottle in the most pure way and I don't think anything will ever touch that and you think the the low Point came after you finished filming that no I think the low point was already happening in my life I was with someone for a very long time uh went through uh a really bad breakup which I had never been through before we lived together we had so much of our life together and I was trying to at a very young age wear so many different hats and not being true to myself with what I was feeling and just feeling like you're in a hole and then the hole gets deeper and deeper and deeper and I think that success afforded me the opportunity to be able to to play a part so to speak of I got it all figured out I'm great everything's great and I I always say like I was ready for that I had spent my whole life studying the business and being waiting for that door to open so when it opened I was able to walk through it where I wasn't okay with was the downtime and being able to go home I was able to go out and be the best version of myself that I could be but when I went home things weren't good and I wasn't good so I really hit a rock bottom where it was like dude if you don't get your [ __ ] together you're gonna [ __ ] die that's it's going it's not an if it's a matter of when so I knew I had to change my life I think the pandemic really brought that on a lot more because I could not leave home like anymore yeah and I think it just made me really reevaluate a lot and that's why I wanted to go on perfect match to tell you the truth the main thing for me was I know this is a dating show I know it comes with that which is partying having fun Cutting Loose and I wanted to show I can go and do that and be sober so when we talk about things that were edited I'm not going to complain and [ __ ] about it but I talked so much about my sobriety and what I'd been through and why I was there to put myself out there and none of that wow made the show they didn't want that as a storyline no and and I understand to some people it could it could seem kind of minuscule but I would say for me I speak so openly on sobriety and I've had people from all over the world who reach out to me to tell me their stories of overcoming addiction being inactive addiction um suicidal uh trying to overcome that so like for me speaking on being sober was the most terrifying thing I've ever done because I'm like I'm admitting to such in my mind flaw that can be held against me and I know the way people see me and I don't want to let people down but I also want to be transparent and hold myself accountable so am I going to do this [ __ ] it I'm going to do it I'm gonna put myself out there so once I did that it sort of was The Best of Both Worlds of feeling a huge weight being lifted but also feeling a huge responsibility to be transparent with that part of my life because I am extremely private which is weird because I'm in reality yeah I'm in the reality realm I have a following but again I never was sort of going for that so to toe that line has been very interesting for me because I love letting people into my life I love that I have people who support me but I do think that there should come A Line in the Sand where this is for me yeah this is my life it's a private time this is not for you and I think I try to pick and choose very carefully with what those things are can you take me through that private time when you said it was a low point after you come back from a show or maybe the celebrations and you are low what thoughts are going through your head that are taking you to a dark place you know I remember when the circle had wrapped I I was just back to normal life I was slinging drinks and I was just depressed man like I was eating pills all day long uh able to put it put it together to go to the gym it's actually very funny I always tell people I was in the best shape of my life and looked the best that I looked when I was at my lowest because I knew I was suffering from an addiction which I would never admit to anyone or myself but I knew I had to look good so no one would ever suspect that because we have an idea of what an addict looks like so if I'm ripped up in the gym every single day No One's Gonna ever think I have an issue with anything so be able to hold it together go to the gym and to go to work and sling drinks that was it when I was at home couldn't get out of literally could not get out of bed like there would be mornings I would wake up if I wasn't taking uppers I I wasn't getting up and you know such a different cocktail of pills alcohol cocaine um tons of things that were just terrible and were really killing me and it was uh a lot of trauma I didn't deal with in my life a lot of things that I had went through and I got into therapy after you know how did that transition happen what made you decide to go into therapy so therapy was the first thing and that was when I was sort of at that low point after that relationship had ended and I was like I think I really need a life preserver right now I need something to grab onto because I've never felt this low and it's scaring me of course and I think I grew up with a very old school Italian family where it's like you don't go to therapy yeah grit down bear down yeah you're a man you be a man you know you you hold certain things in and and you know I was like I need this and I've sort of found for myself because even as I was walking here today I'm on the phone with my mom what are you doing where are you going like I've talked to my parents 20 times a day but I found that I have to do things for myself first and when I decide to let them into certain things that's when I'm ready so I got myself into therapy but I was dealing with more of my mental problems than dealing with my physical addictions I wasn't ready to speak on those I wasn't ready to admit that because in my mind I don't drink every day so I'm fine yeah so I go out on a bender so you didn't think it was a problem or you knew it was a problem but didn't want to talk about both um you're saying to yourself something's not right I know I have an issue but then you're trying to justify it in your mind with why it's okay and why other people do the same things because again we have visuals in our heads of what addiction looks like I mean we've all seen intervention sure we sit there and go I'm not that [ __ ] guy I'm not sleeping on the street or selling my body or doing this or that for for rocks or to shoot up so I I had to really open my mind to realizing that I'm an addict I've always been an addict and when I go back to my childhood and I look at the way that I am wired it is there I am so obsessive compulsive if you give me something to do I'm doing it all or nothing there is no 50 I'm going a hundred percent and I sort of sometimes will act before I think and just be so into it so part of getting clean for me was admitting that to myself realizing it and then saying I need to put some things in place here to make sure that I'm okay because it's very easy for someone like me to not be okay got it so you needed to create some boundaries for yourself within your life and now you're at the slow point and then you have this huge breakout situation with the circle does that take you out of the low place or temporarily or does it actually put fuel on the fire and make it a bigger problem where you're partying more celebrating more you know I would say it made it better because I've always lived for my career I was at the lowest I had been mentally in my life because my career was not where I wanted it to be like since I've been three years old I've known what I've wanted to do it has never changed I was never gonna take over my father's business like so many people do or go to college I was moving to LA to pursue a career in film and I was gonna die trying to make it happen and I knew I had nothing else I could do and the saddest part of my life would be knowing I didn't achieve what I was put here to do and I could end up being a bartender or waiter for the rest of my life so that added to severe depression once I got a break and door started to open I was so ready for that like I killed it with every opportunity I was given every person that I met and I think a lot of people that I met that were very established were very impressed by the fact that I was as smart as I was about the industry because again you're watching me on a reality show being a loud Italian kid screaming at a screen sure but to sit there and actually talk about the ins and outs of the industry of the behind the scenes things they're like [ __ ] are you like what is going on here so those are some of the aspects I mean about surprising people when they would meet me um but it really helped me be okay and be in a better place and it helped me get sober because now I have my career now I I've started building a name for myself and to me it's like I have something to live for where I truly have always felt that I know what I'm meant to do and if I don't do that like it just it eats at me man like I remember being 18 years old at an acting class in La very prestigious School a kid shows up late you're supposed to do a scene and the teacher starts laying into him and she was a working actress and she always points to all of us in the class and she goes every single one of you [ __ ] are gonna get an opportunity If You're Gonna Be Ready is gonna be on you and that haunted me for years because I'm like [ __ ] what happens if my my shot comes and I'm not ready and that could pass you forever so I think for me it's it gives me something to stay grounded and working towards because I do think that there is something into having a real pride in what you do and loving it like I'm that type of dude that thinks being a workaholic is great I think it's sad that most people don't love what they do and settle for a nine to five like yo life is [ __ ] short find what you want to do find what you're good at what's your passion I don't care what it is I don't care what it pays do that so I'm curious and what would you say to yourself if we're going into an alternate universe where you don't get the opportunity for Circle and you're still doing the job that you don't want to do but you are working towards your thing and you're horribly depressed I would say you need help I would say that you need to realize that you can get everywhere you want to get but you need to be okay first and that was something that I never thought because it was just career career career career like I remember um after that uh that serious breakup there was a conversation that took place between me and that person that haunted me for a long time that was the person telling me I have no doubt you are going to achieve everything that you want in life you are so amazingly talented your personality people love you you were born to do this but I think you're going to be horribly miserable and alone when you achieve that and that [ __ ] with me for a long time because I'm like well I mean you live in LA a long time you see people like that they have everything they cheat but are they actually happy and that's the push and pull of what's really most important and I feel like over the last say two years I've been sober two years four months now I would say the thing that I've worked on most is saying it's okay for me to have a private life to have a personal life and to be happy in both career and personal can coexist with the right people and trying to find balance because I don't think I'm a person who's ever had balance that's true true for most of us meeting yeah um I sometimes I see individuals will find a partner and then Define themselves based on their partner and that becomes part of their identity so when the partner leaves they go through a very terrible situation then they find a career that they find becomes their identity and if that career ever something happens whether they get laid off the show gets canceled whatever something outside of their control something nothing to do with their talents or abilities that they then go into a dark place do you feel like you're past that or is that always a potential thing that you're worried about um I think I'm I'm honest enough with myself to know that it can always be there it will always be there meaning what will always be there meaning that I have to be mindful that I could slip into a dark place and it it couldn't be for for being for someone else or anything it could just be because of me of what I'm going through not being happy with where I'm at because I always want more I always expect more and I I set the bar extremely high for myself like I have nothing wrong with let's say uh like I'll use the boxing analogy I have nothing wrong with losing to a better fighter than me if I get in the ring and you beat my ass dude I'm holding your hand up we just went toe-to-toe I gave you every [ __ ] thing I had you showed up today I didn't God bless you but when it's me not bringing my best and I have to live with that that can [ __ ] with me so I think to be honest it's a very it's weird because I talk to people in groups and I do AAA and I like to do meetings and [ __ ] like that that you know I'm genuinely such a happy person I wake up every day with a smile on my face and that's not fake I feel that every single day but I'm also aware that within me there's that voice and that voice can drag me down or bring me up so I try to make that voice my best friend and really lead with my best foot forward but I'm human I have good days and bad and sometimes the bad days can be bad but they are nowhere near as bad as they once were that's powerful because ultimately you know everyone wants to see you succeed and grow with all of the fans that you've developed from all this time on television um do you imagine yourself um kind of as a spokesperson for the negative effects or even the positive effects on Mental Health from reality shows yeah you know because it seems like you're the one that's talking about it most yeah I I would love to um it's actually funny uh I love public speaking in high school it's a great story I would they had public speaking the teacher had to call my father and say we have to fail him he's the best public speaker we've had I've had in 20 years of teaching but he doesn't do the assignments I would just get up and [ __ ] speeches I remember I literally did a speech on how to dip tobacco because I I didn't know today's a how-to yeah but I love I love public speaking and talking about things that are that are you know close to me because I feel like most people don't and I the one thing I don't like in today's society is there are victims who go through a lot of things but I don't like victim mentality I think that it it really takes away from people who try to speak up and should have attention put on them when they go through something and I don't think every person is a victim I just think that you know when we talk about mental health and things I think it's important that even for people you see on reality television or in film or music your people you struggle the same way that anyone else struggles and I don't see a lot of people talking about it and I try to always bring Good Vibes and be positive because that's how I was raised that's who I am and when I talk to friends who go through [ __ ] they don't speak on it they'll talk to me about it I mean about their negative moments yeah about their their mental to held struggles things that are really affecting them like even to turn it over to perfect match there's been I won't name names but a ton of cast members who have really struggled with a lot of things through this experience I struggled with it as well I turned off my my socials and was just like yo I'm logging out for a minute my dad was so mad at me he's like what the [ __ ] are you doing like you need to be present you need my dad I am dealing with crippling anxiety crippling anxiety that I've never dealt with before this was not like the circle for me but I don't blame the show I don't blame the people I just think I had never done something like this where you're putting so much of yourself out there for the world to judge because I had friends who told me dude like dating shows are a different beast and I'm going it's a [ __ ] Netflix dating show with popular people from different how cool you're friendly with yeah like I'm dude I was like legit friends with like almost every person there and then was friends with everyone by the time we left but I'm like how serious could this be people take this [ __ ] seriously oh bro like well that's a great question for you then you've been a boxer you've been a reality star what takes uh everything well specifically with those two I'm interested which one of those two takes a bigger toll on your mental and physical health which is harder oh reality really yeah for sure I mean because I mean so getting punched in the face is easier than that's natural I mean I grew up in a gym I was fighting from the time I was five or six and that just was my everyday life for so many years and learning how to condition myself take care of myself and as you know from doing it like it becomes like you like getting hit at a certain point like it's it's just a part of what you do it's it's an art it's a craft where I feel like you know reality television is such a blessing because it really lets you show yourself to the world but it lets you open yourself up to judgment in a way that I don't think most people could deal with because you're literally saying this is who I am and in today's world everyone has the power of having a phone in their hand to sit there and weigh in on the littlest things you could do the biggest things you do that are a moment that happen in a day which I get in a television show it's like a big moment but like how much [ __ ] happens in your life throughout the course of a day of course you know what I mean and I think that what I've seen that I have to give props again to Netflix kinetic to all them they did really well of letting us do like training courses of being aware for mental health for all these different things like they did so it's part of it part of the preparation oh yeah I mean I I dude I think social media just changed everything I mean I always make the analogy to sometimes I've seen people on shows who go in with the mentality of trying to be the person they watched on reality shows 10 years ago think back to like Jersey Shore we all loved that show that was great yeah look at all what that show was it was guys just hooking up with girls rating girls like doing that would never fly today that was back in a time when the villains were the most popular and loved people where today people don't like that people like people who are genuine and nice and I think being a villain is cool but just not being an [ __ ] to put it bluntly how do what so besides the mental health preparation is there anything health-wise that the shows make you do before going on Circle perfect match um yeah uh again like there's always so many things you have to talk to psychiatrists really and and go through do you have any mental health stuff uh do you struggle with things do you uh have any active addictions like they really make sure that they're not putting someone who's not mentally fit to be on a show so they could potentially exclude you based on a diagnosis uh I don't know how the medical terminology would go but I would assume if you were sitting there saying I'm uh bipolar let's say for example when I'm not on medication it could be a medical risk to put you on a set maybe interesting and I don't know if that's a hundred percent sure but I know that you have to go through those background checks before you get to a stage of filming yeah that's really interesting and you know I'm curious your take you brought up the victim mentality earlier you'll see people will write comments to you and say well you you know Joe you spoke about the victim mentality you're making money off these shows you're incredibly popular people message you all the time isn't what your talk talking about right now how hard it is just you having the victim mentality yeah I mean here's the thing you can't win with anything it doesn't matter what you speak on what you try to advocate for what you try to speak against no matter what you do there are going to be people who are going to say you're wrong you're an idiot you're stupid so my thing is just like when I do speak on things because I don't speak on things very often like you'll never see me talk politics which number one if you're coming to a reality kid for a political point of view there's something wrong with you that's that's first people appreciate it always reach out what do you think I'm like bro I don't [ __ ] know I don't even follow this [ __ ] but I I just think that there's you know something to be said of when you do decide to speak up it should be something that you're really passionate about and have a clear viewpoint on because I think what you see a lot today is let's say something happens today it's a big headline everyone's got a way in they get the clicks well you're speaking on things you don't even know about you have no knowledge about where I just think that's incredibly ignorant so I like to sit back take things in and when I speak on something really have a clear point of view and if someone agrees with that okay if you disagree with that that's fine that's part of being human I don't have any I'm not a sensitive dude like I love having discussions with people who disagree with me on everything because that helps me learn that helps me grow where I feel like people say that but they don't they want people who agree with them about everything well I think it depends on the time of moment in your life because uh if someone's going through something yeah there's usually two types of ways to help that person when I explained further it'll make more sense basically let's say you're going through a breakup yeah and you come to me and you're like Mike this is what happened to me such and such said this I have one of two options I have to recognize are you here for moral support and you just need my ear and you just want me to listen and say wow dude can't believe this happens to you sucks brutal ah or are you in the mood for truth seeking right where if you're truth seeking I'm gonna challenge you I'm going to talk about their point of view I'm gonna see are you really right and if you misjudge that as a person who's trying to be supportive man that could backfire hard yeah but that's the thing is I I could say for myself with that scenario you just gave I'm the dude who always wants the brutal truth that's just how I was raised like I was never given excuses from my parents there was never that thing if you were wrong you were wrong and I I have really tried to keep my circle no pun intended very small of people who are my ride or Dies who are going to look at me and say you're telling the truth you're being a [ __ ] [ __ ] or you're right you're wrong and and not try to tell me what I want to hear because I do feel like a lot of people surround themselves with those I could see how you say that pendulum does swing too far at times but you have to admit that we need compassion for some people who are just going through a rough time where everything's going wrong and you can't give them advice here's the moment I I truly believe every person deserves love yeah and I think not a lot of people have had that and I think that is something that truly breaks my heart because I've been so blessed in my life to have the most amazing family and have uh so much love and support and that's why I do try to speak on things and when people reach out to me and pour their hearts out to me with their stories I mean dude like there will be nights I'm a night owl I don't sleep it'll be three four o'clock in the morning and I'm laying in bed with [ __ ] why don't you sleep oh dude I've never slept I've been ever I've been this way my entire life so you sleep just like a delayed onset of sleep like you sleep from three to ten or something here's the thing if I pass out I'm out okay I crash but getting to that state of falling asleep extremely difficult I've been like this since I've been a kid where I just my body just does not get tired and if it does then I get that second win uh my sisters call me a vampire because I wear all black every day and I'm up all night long watching films nowadays responding to messages doing things like that I just I've never had that Sun's up I'm up smiling cup of coffee like no I want to be up when everyone's asleep and so do you sleep the same uh like seven to nine hours or not no not at all what do you say last night I slept I went to bed at 5 30 in the morning I woke up today at 9am but you know that's not healthy right oh of course it's terrible but that's it's [ __ ] awful it's terrible for you but it's it's it's one of those things where I've just like sort of accepted this is the way that it is like when I got newly sober I did force myself to get into a schedule of going to sleep at I want to say 10 or 11 o'clock and I woke up at 5am every day I'll be at the gym because I just needed that outlet to be like I'm on a schedule I'm on a schedule but because I'm so obsessive compulsive it drove me [ __ ] nuts of like I need to be in bed by by 9 30 on the dot and if you weren't then everything fell out oh everything in my mind just fell off so like yeah have you heard of different chronotypes sleep chronotypes no so basically uh Matthew Walker who's been on the channel before he's a world-renowned sleep expert from UCLA and he talks about how there's different types of individuals who sleep during different parts of the day and his theory and it's supported by some evidence actually is that nature sort of made it this way so that you could have some people sleeping during the night most people some people sleeping a little bit off two hours later some people sleeping a little bit later that way you constantly can have someone keep guard wow and there's individuals who truly cannot get sleepy normally until 4 or 5 a.m and prefer to sleep till 12. and that's their sleep chronotype and they've been unfairly treated in our society because we don't Vibe with that school starts at a certain time work starts at a certain time and if you don't comply with that you're lazy and we label you that just made so much sense to my entire life I'm just going back to like sixth seventh grade right now rethinking everything no that makes that makes complete sense man but I mean I've I've met so many people who are the same way who are night owls insomniacs and I feel like that's another term I feel like terms just get thrown around so Lucy today oh I've insomnia no I really have insomnia like that's always been a thing so uh maybe you just have this delayed onset of sleep maybe matters goes a little bit later than most you've been unfairly anxious why can't I fall asleep and then that makes you less likely to fall asleep when it's time to fall asleep and also when you're wired like that and you're up all night and you're not sober you should fall into very dark places yeah and anxiety starts peaking and all these things that is exact opposite of what you want for me dude I gotta tell you anxiety for me is a [ __ ] that's a new thing I didn't really struggle with that before but since I got sober and since I like cleaned up my life that's something that is really set in now um tremendously and the only reason I could think of is because I don't have vices to put in myself anymore to numb or you know it's like sometimes you feel a hundred percent of everything and that's still very new with a lot of things well basically those medications or substances used to be a way for you to control this anxiety from coming on and now you're gonna have to learn a new way of controlling them that is a little bit more difficult or new to you oh dude it could and it could really set you back when you're not used to that and it hits you you're like what the [ __ ] is happening right now like it's not what are your thoughts when you're in that anxious spiral what are you what's up so it's funny I remember when I used to struggle with it when I wasn't sober there was a few times I went to the ER because I thought I was having a heart attack and I would have full panic attacks yeah I would have pains in my arm uh my left arm I would walk in think I'm dying they would take my my heart rate and they I remember one time they asked me how much cocaine did you do and I didn't and I was like I just was driving and it just came on but um now I feel like it always comes down to this crippling fear that everything's gonna end everything that I've worked for because now I'm starting to get somewhere now I'm starting to to move forward in my life and and try to really build a name and a brand for myself that somehow some way just all gonna come crashing down do you think that's a normal thought you're having yes and no I think the normal part is I think everyone deals with fear of of the unknown I think the part that's not natural and I always relate this back to being in Show Business entertainment I truly believe most people cannot comprehend what it takes to make a career in that field and what type of lifestyle that entails I feel like you try you can try to explain it to people I think they see the glitz and glamor of Television this and that but to what it really takes to sustain and have longevity and build I don't think people could ever understand yeah I I see what you're saying when when you mean like yes and no that this is a very unnatural situation being exposed to this many people trying to continue that level of success so I think the way that I think about it I'll sort of tell you from my not even being a doctor from just being a person sense is you're in a situation where you worked really hard for something you have it you don't want to lose it that's a normal emotion like if I just got a brand new car to last thing I want to do is Crash it right so the anxiety of that is normal where it becomes pathological and it becomes a disorder and a problem this is my doctor hat coming on is that fear and anxiety and nervousness becomes so much so that it prevents you from living other important major aspects of your life like eating showering having close friendships relationships with family being able to go to work now this leaves a healthy emotion like anxiety that is normal to have with certain situations to the point where it becomes a disorder and we need to help teach some tools coping mechanisms to get out of those situations dude the five senses like what can I touch feel smell like all of those things have been something that's really helped anchor me down in those moments of just like I think the biggest thing for me at least is just you gotta shut off your phone you have to that's a trigger for you oh for sure like if because I feel like just in general you have so much information coming out to Fisher all day sofa it's not natural like we don't know what this is gonna do to our brains like this is still so new I just think um putting that down for me listening to a record big vinyl guy putting my headphones listening to a piece of music that I love and just really focus on my breathing and telling myself you're okay everything's gonna be fine like I've been working on those sorts of triggers but I'm also aware of uh like let's just say for example you're dealing with trolls people want to just come at you the way I was raised the type person I am is who the [ __ ] are you like I'm gonna [ __ ] find you and we'll [ __ ] let's talk about this [ __ ] like that you Liam Neeson but you can't do that and I I know and I'm also like almost a 30 year old man I'm not going out trying to fist fight someone what do you mean by doing that yeah and and but there is that thing of like that's the way I was raised if someone's [ __ ] talking you were coming at you you [ __ ] go with them and when you're dealing with people who just want a reaction out of you who are just trying to get that dude it's [ __ ] hard I can't use that strategy yeah you gotta come up with a new strategy dude it's hard to be the bigger person but but to tell you the truth like I really don't mind like just just like hate like there's different levels of [ __ ] right like if you just don't like me like that's cool like an example would be I love when a new show comes out I love going through Twitter see I look for it this is the problem and I'll and I will look I'll type in my name with the show to see what everyone's saying and I'll find people are [ __ ] talking let's say it's like I can't [ __ ] stand Joey he's the absolute words that I'll be like yo you should talk to my sisters they'd say the same thing like so you make a joke out of it yeah I think but why don't you search up that people are saying good stuff and comment to them oh I do I I see you balance it out yeah I I try to talk to everyone to tell you the truth because I think it's a blessing to have the opportunity that I have and I also think let's just be honest dude you're going on a [ __ ] reality show part of the fun of it is people like what they like and don't like who they don't like you've done it I've done it we've all sat on the couch and said I'm past judgment love him [ __ ] him yeah that's part of the fun I think that there's something different when people take things to an extreme of like really attacking like and trying to and I saw that who do you think on perfect match got the most brutal attacks Francesca really why um I think that she went there to go in and do her thing the way she had to do it and I I could say from myself uh from what I've seen online there were people being [ __ ] vicious towards her calling her misogynistic names hateful things and I would respond to them be like [ __ ] stop dude like it's a show like relax it's not that serious you're attacking someone but to tell you the truth man I can't think of many people who didn't get it in some capacity during the course of the show from what I seen I would say I got to give a shout out to my boy Shane because this was his Redemption show because I know love is blind was a very difficult experience for him this show was phenomenal for him so he had a blast which I'm so happy for him okay um but yeah I think that uh a lot of people were being very vicious towards Francesca very vicious towards Dom um towards Georgia towards myself uh like there was just a lot of just a lot of negativity with this one do you trade the ratings for the negativity or do you want the ratings and you'll take the negativity I think you have to take the ratings with the negativity for the simple fact of you can't run from it this could be whether you're doing reality television or making a film I mean I always look at it like you could star in a 300 million dollar Disney film that could tank it's happened your career is done people hate you you're the worst this no Studio wants to work with you this is part of the risk of what you do you sign up for this so that's why I don't want to seem like someone who's just bitching and crying but like if you're asking me my honest feelings and emotions on it I'll speak on it but like you have to know what you're getting in for I think everyone knows that I just think again at a certain point don't you even if you're not looking at someone you're looking at them through a phone like don't you realize I'm a human being yeah I think we lose that because we feel like we're so used to watching actors that we're like oh these are actors but they're not they're real people and a lot of them aren't as media trained or have experience like yourself in the industry to know what it's about so it's a shock actually Hannah Brown was just here from um The Bachelor and The Bachelorette and she was saying how she was just like a small town girl that came on to TV into Hollywood and then she got blasted by comments like with a fire host she had no idea yeah and we forget that these people are just like us that if you have you know millions of people judging you in a given moment it takes a toll and a unique toll one that that we're not even used to as a society yet but also other people don't talk about with that is with people piling on it could take away further career opportunities that's true too from things that have nothing to do just from public opinion because I know how these people think if they're sitting there casting or looking for people that they believe to lead a show or to do something um ah not very well publicly liked or not this neck because they want everyone to be like you're gonna deliver deliver delivery sure and sometimes they will take that person that they know is not well like because it's going to make people write in and say [ __ ] but yeah man for the most part like I can't tell you how many friends have reached out to me over the years because they have seen how I've been able to handle things in my own career and do things and ask for advice because they were someone who just auditioned for something yeah and they got they got cast and overnight everything changed where I felt prepared for that and I cannot imagine not being prepared for that and then just having it come at you at 100 miles an hour that has to be terrible that's scary uh before I ask you about your health you you mentioned some things that you wanted to Spill the tea on on uh perfect match what happened behind the scenes dude I mean here's the thing the spilling the tea it was just [ __ ] crazy there was so like you watch the show and it seems great there was so much ego going on during this [ __ ] show because you gotta you gotta look at it like it was pitched as Netflix's biggest singles yeah coming together so there was so many things that were happening of just bickering between people and for me I could say what was so stressful is like Shane calls me the middleman okay he's like I can't trust you because you're the [ __ ] middle man he's like you're always in the middle like no one likes someone in the middle but like I am because like I'm friends generally with everybody so if you're coming to me like I'll give this is something that wasn't on the show Mitchell came into the house um at this point I just met Shane we had been boys I'm like yo I'm a [ __ ] I'ma try to get him with Chloe cause I Chloe's one of my best friends I can see that happening Mitchell comes into the house and all of a sudden Mitchell was with Chloe I saw that relationship I was there during that time so I'm gonna talk to my boy Mitchell and be like bro if you have a shot here you better [ __ ] do it right you better get your head out of your ass commit to this girl do everything needs to be done now I'm in a weird position yeah because I'm good friends with Shane good friends Mitch Shane's mad at me for no reason I did nothing besides trying to be a friend of both of them so it was [ __ ] like that that for me like I'm really not a confrontational person like you watch the show yeah do producers come and whisper in your ear and tell you like yo work work this drama and here's the thing I can tell you 100 for my thing yeah everything was real really everything because I've heard from other shows where they're like no I've heard the same thing as well but like I I think the difference with this show is you're working with all Pros so to speak okay I love that you guys are pro yeah like every how pathetic is that like it's not pathetical you would have to laugh at it like it's absurd like and I think that really did make a difference during the making of the show and like I'll give you an example Francesca with that situation she's said not great things about me for every podcast she's done something you didn't see on the show was you saw a snippet in the beginning of me talking to her night one and saying I remember look it I talk [ __ ] about you I said this that and the other thing about you I also wasn't sober uh I got a lot of flack for being an abuser or a [ __ ] boy because I had sex with two women in my life while being a single man like no one has done that uh but I knew nothing with me and her would be romantic because I was friends with her ex so to me it was like let me try to clear the air here and start over so one thing that was cut from the show was it was sort of edited to look like me Francesca and Carrie were like like The Three Amigos where throughout the whole course of the show me and Francesca were really like close about a lot of things and all the things that people were uh picking her apart for she would come to me and talk to me about or carry separately and I'd be like dude do it like you're here to do what you want to do for you and I was watching her do her thing like yo she's absolutely absolutely killing it and you watched the show and she made great television and she's being true to herself so to see people um go on and on about her being a terrible person like really dude like if you're a single person you do whatever the [ __ ] you want to do you don't owe anything to anyone it is what it is but yeah those are things that didn't make the show uh it's unfortunate that we're not on good terms now I don't I don't know why no I I cannot tell you I have no idea we were extremely close uh me and Carrie's relationship ended uh then it's like mine and her relationship sort of and I think she's like being like the loyal friend but she's made a point to go and be like well he wasn't there for the right reasons well like Francesca like come on like who are you to say that like you saw me there everything everyone was entitled yeah everyone's in touch but my I think the difference with me is again it goes back to if that's the way you felt like I again I I challenge anyone to find a clip on that show of me talking [ __ ] about anyone because if I'm gonna talk [ __ ] to someone let's say to you I don't like the whole mic we're boys I'm gonna go for an interview yo [ __ ] Mike like I don't operate that way I think it's unfortunate things that went that way but I think at the end of the day people have to do what's best for them sure and especially given how confrontational and so many outside forces are at play when you're making a show like that or you're deciding what to say in a podcast you know you want to make ratings you want to make views you want to make it interesting there's so many things people are telling you things and dming you stories you don't know who to believe so who knows what's going on it's dude and especially with a show I think we had 22 people in the cast oh it's a lot of people and a lot of people weighing in with personalities with personalities and opinions so I there has been a lot of drama throughout the course of the show's release and again like that gives me anxiety so that's where I don't really weigh in on anything I'm gonna sit back and I'm gonna pick up my phone and call my friends and be like are you okay do you need anything do you need to vent um are you really mentally in an okay space right now because you know when the entire world is weighing in on you with your personal life and something as intimate as dating that can really [ __ ] with someone's mind yeah and I understand it's a fun dating show people just hooking up I wish the audience took it that way and just had fun with it but yeah man I think uh part of the struggle with with this show this time around was I really wish the cast were able to be United sort of like it was on the circle because I know when we wrapped all of us were it was like yo like I always have the mentality we just made something dope like I take the film mentality we went to war together and we came out on the other side we're gonna have something doped that the entire world is gonna see how amazing is that and I think we all felt that way when we wrapped I think since the show has been released has not gone that way at all and there's lots of different camps and people are good with some people other people aren't good with others I think I'm good with everyone for the most part but it's one of those it's one of those things where I I refuse to let the negativity weigh into the positivity that I experienced from the show that's good do you think you received more let's say DMS as a measure of interactions from the circle or from the show um from the circle really yeah for dude the circle was a firestorm that I I remember sitting there dude like I'd be on my phone and I'd refresh and the followers would be going up ten thousand every five seconds right just up and then you go to your messages and it would just keep going and going and I just again have realized at this point that was the lightning that was the the lightning in the bottom moment it's on the Shelf sure that's not going to be touched anything else from now is is super cool I did see though from this show that doing dating shows does bring a completely different type the fan base and people people live for these shows oh yeah it's not it's their livelihood yeah dude do you um who's the coolest person that dm'd you from the circle oh coolest person that you're like whoa I can't believe this person's in my team trying to think I talked to Vanessa Hudgins for a minute okay she was uh amazing I was such a fan of hers and I think I had reached out to her and I think she had DM me back uh which was so dope and she was just such a gracious person and we just talked movies and [ __ ] that we were into like horror films and stuff like that which was super dope uh Amy polar amazing I will forever give my love to that woman um she sat down with me and really showed me so much respect and wanted to help me in any way that she could and and was very open about she's not a big rally television person but you know all the people she works with are like you gotta watch a show and you gotta watch this dude and she was like I remember we sat down and had dinner and she was like you know I was watching the show while researching you and it's so clear that you're an actor and you know how to play for camera and I told her I've studied years of improv and theater and all these things which that is reality television is theater and improv like I was on a show with no one but myself yeah where you have to be entertaining 24 hours a day so to sit down with someone like herself who is such a tycoon in the industry and has done so much amazing work and to have her say yo dude I see you you're doing well keep going like that for me was like oh my God uh just that like Out of Body Experience am I living somebody else's life what is happening right now and I do say that the one thing that's Bittersweet about the circle I know everything happens for a reason I understand that the pandemic killed everything I had going like I had really broken through and had so many doors opened and so many things lined up and it all went away overnight because it was the first time in history no one knew where the business was at like you know when we met yeah we were doing a show on on Zoom so everyone was trying to do their own thing so there is something there that is a little Bittersweet about the experience for me just because I'm like I work so hard for that opportunity to really have my moment and try to go with it as far as I could and as far as other people I've DMs I I've damned so many I can't tell you how many times I DM Pamela Anderson being like I loved you your posters were on my wall my entire life you still look great you're doing great by the way the documentary oh dude I would oh my God I have to I have to say something else this is nuts you know who followed me the other day oh Carmen Electra wow dude that's like us my family there was two women I loved Pamela Anderson and Carmen Electra okay so yeah I'm assuming you messaged her after she followed you no I didn't Mike let me tell you are you scared Dr Mark I messaged this woman like 10 times over the last three years tagging her stories of like who's your celebrity crush who's your person I'm like I can't DM her again like at this point she knows I reached out like this is just sad and depressing if I'm like hey Miss Elektra thanks for the follow that's awesome dude I got so nervous when that happened my face got beat red and I was like to my friend I was like Josh Carmen Electra just followed me he's like why I'm like I don't know so like this is my mom that's why you were rapping Lose Yourself when you walked in here bro here's because this is the moment I don't know if you notice about me I am the biggest Die Hard Eminem fan really okay I was too growing up I'm still in I love everything I mean I love having one too but that's how I started like obviously some shady days so I gotta ask what's your favorite Eminem record I I never did it by records because uh when I was young I was really poor growing up and I would get my CDs illegally purchased on Canal Street so like they weren't the real records right they would a lot of times either be singles or like randomly someone burned the disc with like three songs on it um but Lose Yourself is definitely one of my heroes like actually for my boxing match I wanted Till I Collapse to be my song to walk out to yeah but it seems like every boxing guy does that song so I'm like all right I can't you could do the Till I Collapse remix which is not an official remix it's a fan at it but like it's become very popular oh bro it's Eminem 50 Tupac it's do you know what my walkout song was for um Showtime boxing my last match on Jake Paul's undercar what was it it was uh I Need a Doctor oh my god dude that's so appropriate dude that song goes so hard if you're ever in bed and need to kill like 10 minutes watch M and Dre's performance of I need a doctor at the Grammys oh I gotta see that I know the music video by heart but not that dude the grand Emmy performance really oh dude it'll give you Goosebumps like that was in an era of his career where he was sober but back because like it took him a while to get his bearings back and every performance you just saw a man who was determined to just knock you out so I I love that whole era of like recovery uh I think that was around 2011 2010 2011 like something special was just really happening in his career at the time that was really cool um about your health I've read before that you were following a keto diet are you still doing that on and off um okay what I'm curious what drives that choice for you dropping weight okay uh drops way easy when I had to get in shape for my movie uh that I made before the circle I I was searching all different different things on so many different supplements and that's when keto had just become like a thing I was like wait I can eat [ __ ] burgers and steak like everything I live for every day and it was crazy how much weight I dropped and like felt absolutely fantastic I've I did that before perfect match as well I basically uh ate nothing but Texas de Brazil which was in the hotel so every day I was just crushing sausages uh ribs things like that well you know keto's supposed to be moderate protein high fat bro you were high I was I was all in I went all in like here's the thing about if I'm like at a home base I'll do the whole meal prep I weigh everything out to the exact ounce and and in the gym doing everything the thing I've struggled with since getting sober is gaining weight because now your meal your your appetite comes back sure and I'm in a family that loves to eat and when I lived in La I was very disciplined because I could shop for myself do things so I've tried to be better of like doing intermittent fasting I'll fast for 18 to 22 hours I'll drink a gallon of water every single day that's a big thing for me um but as far as proper eating and keeping my stomach down that's something I've definitely struggled with now because my body's changing I'm gonna be 30 years old this year it's not the same way as I was in my early 20s so I do get worried with the keto thing my sister mainly yells at me because she's like we have bad hearts in our family yeah well that's about my warning that I was going to put out for you it's awful for you right uh I don't want to say awful um I think that first of all it's hard to keep on such a restrictive diet for that long period of time you also got to be really really well planned on it to make sure that you're not losing a lot of nutrients because some of the vegetables you can't eat some of the fruits you can't eat and as a result you're not getting vitamins and minerals that you need and then also because you're consuming such a high fat diet long term it's not clear what happens to your cholesterol profile because we've seen the cholesterol profile go up yeah and we know that a high cholesterol is really unhealthy for you and creates risk of heart disease Strokes all this stuff we don't have perfect evidence to say if you eat specifically keto and your cholesterol goes up does that equal the same risk that if I eat really unhealthy diet American Standard diet right and have my cholesterol up and have those high risks does it still play out maybe not one to one but it's probably not ideal I think it's safe to say that it's not well let me ask you what what have you found for you is a is a good balance like for your diet I don't like even the word diet because I think it implies that you have to be restrictive in this sort of conversation and yes it is the calories in calories out people will like you have all these weight coaches that are like screaming at people and saying discipline discipline yes discipline is part of it but really needs to be more of a lifestyle thought behind it because anything that you're going to create a restrictive plan for yourself like how you did with your sleep yeah that's only going to last a certain period of time until you burn out of that motivation of course so it has to be some sort of creative long-term solution that you're saying okay I'm gonna eat during these times of the day because this makes sense with my lifestyle and I don't have to cut a lot out and maybe I start with a small change and work my way from there are you a small portions guy um no I'm a big fan of intermittent fasting with the exception of when I was training for my boxing matches because for those you need energy for training in the morning and at night so I like intermittent fasting I'll monitor my caloric intake just so I don't overdo it but in general once you study like weighing out your food for a period of a month you kind of have a sense of how many calories are in there dude it really shrinks your stomach yeah like and there is no better feeling than when you are being on the ball with your eating and you feel you yourself eat a meal that really fills you up and you feel full and you don't feel that because like again with me it's it's overeating oh bro like if I'm if I'm doing like the the restrictive stuff and I'm on the ball with it I'm so I won't cheat I won't do nothing if I'm not I'm corrupt like before I came in here homie grub two hot dogs and loved every minute of it and it was fantastic all right but those are the unhealthy foods and I don't just say unhealthy because of the cholesterol yeah there's like preservatives in in these foods that if we know we overeat them they cause legitimate risks in cancer and I'm the one that actually downplays some of these things for example people say red meat is a potential carcinogen it's on the wh Joe scale of carcinogens that is uh on par with some of the evidence for smoking and Etc yeah that risk needs to be understood as an absolute risk in your life so if your regular person just taking a random person plucked from the population your risk is four percent yeah if eating red meat brings you to five percent that's a one percent change but that's really a 20 relative risk bump yeah so they'll say raise it eating red meat raises your risk by 20 yes it's 20 but really because it's small it's one percent right so then you have to weigh it into how that impacts your whole life but the hot dogs and those like hyper preservative foods are worse than the red meats so have you have you ever been a smoker no never never I've never tried that God bless you that I've been a lifelong smoker okay it's terrible so what what does that mean I was just when you're sitting there talking about eating all this and that and and the meats and stuff I I think about how this is so bad to say but like for so long I was just like oh thank God I smoke so I don't have to eat a whole bunch of shitty food I know it's it makes no sense no it makes sense okay I see what you're saying but uh but like again when you quit smoking and then you try to come off of it yeah come off of it and put yourself on a better diet and taking things in like for me I I tell people all the time you really do feel so fantastic when you're on a really good food intake of eating I love salmon I love fruits love vegetables of all those things but dude I love me a Wendy spicy chicken combo it's [ __ ] hot so you know mental health plays a huge role in this oh of course because if you're in a nervous place if you're in a sad Place extremely to the point where it's disordered now you could be almost medicating yourself with the food oh of course yeah I mean I've known people even very close people in my life whose drug of choice was food yeah and I think it offers a high like anything else and I think that's the interesting thing I've seen in in the last few years is I think that everyone has their vices I really do I feel like sure that's everyone has their vices but I think that we're always so used to seeing those vices as being a few certain things and not a whole wide range spectrum of things like even talking about going to support groups there are support groups for everything like for people who struggle with addictions to a ton of a ton of different things so I think shining a light on those people and those things feeling a little bit more open because I feel like there is still a stigma of saying I have a problem I need help with this as something as simple as eating because some people cannot control themselves with how much they intend anything that impacts your neurotransmitters the feel good ones the dopamine the serotonin that can lead to a an addiction whether you're talking about video games sex gambling all those things and a lot of times like I had a patient the other day a young gentleman who has a true gambling addiction can't stop betting on sports and he wants to stop very passionate very very driven wants to stop now with him we had to figure out why is he gambling why does he continue to gamble despite the fact that he wants to stop and when we started figuring it out he started seeing on his own this is his own recollection and understanding of the situation is every time he would feel feelings of anxiety or worry about things that were outside of his control that he really shouldn't be worried about like his mom would go to the grocery store in a very safe neighborhood driving a very short distance he would worry about her losing her life so it was extreme anxiety yeah and then uh he would worry about failures at school when he was doing great in school so it was all these really heavy almost irrational he called them anxieties and then he would have components of OCD as well obsessive compulsive disorder with doing certain compulsions to quiet them down when he put a bet all those things went away because his worry shifted to the game which he could watch and that's kind of enjoying and then he forgot all about the anxieties the second the game ended back to the anxiety how terrible did this make his life destroyed his life which is why he wanted to stop yeah but we could only stop not by talking about the gambling but by talking about the things that were he was trying to hide with the gambling and at that point when you have a vice let's say gambling I've I've known some people who've also struggled with that is it even about the money no it's about in for example when we treat gambling addiction yeah the things that we're really trying to treat at least from like a pharmacological perspective medication perspective is what's driving the gambling and in his case it was the OCD component anxiety component treating that will treat the gambling well and it's crazy too how sometimes the highs you get from things aren't even from the things that you're doing like for an example I once heard someone say in a meeting you never get more High than on the way to go by your [ __ ] which is a hundred percent true of like it's about the the ritual making a phone call picking something getting in the car going to do something and yeah man like I just feel bad for that dude that's rough I mean yeah a lot of people are struggling so this is why I'm very conflicted with the gambling sites being everywhere it's very triggering from him I also found him groups to attend so it's like a 360 approach it's not just oh yeah here's some medication it's I hope the girls can help them yeah I'm hopeful too we're right in the middle of it yeah like therapy there therapy for me was again just for me Lifesaver I had never been in a space of just being a hundred percent open honest and I am a person who is very coachable so like if you tell me to do something like your word is God like Dr Mike says I gotta do this [ __ ] I'm gonna do this [ __ ] so I I think for a lot of people from when I've talked to friends just some people are very difficult to hearing other people's advice you know well again it's if they're in truth seeking mode or they want compassion that's it goes back right yeah it goes back right to that have you seen any health claims or anything like on social media or in the reality star world that people are doing and you're like why are people doing this to their health like to be fitter Stronger Faster I would say if I've seen anything sometimes it's Hawking products that you know are just like [ __ ] and I I I'm 50 50 on that like what are the claims that you've seen well not you don't have to say them no yeah just just things you see of like take this to lose x amount of weight in in 20 days where I've worked I've been in shape and dieted my whole life and done this I'm like bro you ain't taking [ __ ] that's good it's gonna [ __ ] do that the only way you're doing that is hard work and dedication putting it in or if you are it's really unhealthy yeah and and again like I see people who have gotten in shape very fast especially like I know you're in the boxing world with things uh I grew up in the fight game and seeing that I call [ __ ] and a lot of these fighters who are out there because I think they are 100 steroid users there is no way you're getting someone who hasn't been a fighter putting them in a gym and putting them into fight and actually fight the way some people have like who who's like I I've just watched these influencer boxing cards and I think you can watch the kids who are getting in there and really you can tell I've been working and doing things but versus other people who I think are clearly on steroids and I don't I want to know who it is no I will bleep their name no honestly I don't I don't know people's names like I've watched like like my friend Chase for example he he fights on uh the zone and I've watched his fight cards and because the influencer boxing thing has become such a thing and I'm very mixed on it because I grew up in the gym with kids who had nothing fighting was the only thing they had it's the only thing I had but I don't say I had nothing because I didn't I had a beautiful family and my father did well for himself um and you watch kids train their entire life fighting hundreds of amateur fights traveling all over the country all over the world to hopefully have a professional career that goes somewhere to watch someone with a following on social media get in and just talk [ __ ] do this that like I get you're trying to make money and I get you're trying to sell a fight but like for me it is the love of the sport I would love if it brings more kids to picking up boxing I'm not a UFC fan personally it's just too barbaric but I just think that there's something lost there because I go home to Rochester and I still see friends who grew up with that fight with that dream in them and it never went anywhere so it kind of really gets under my skin to see I see what you mean opportunities come for so many people who have never worked for that yeah it's funny because they'll say they worked for the following and from the following they're getting people to buy and they're creating the business and dude you know what maybe they did I that's that's the thing I don't know still to this day I don't know the influencer world well I'll full on bring this on me yeah I'm a doctor I have no place on a Showtime pay-per-view card right like I did not have an amateur career I did not train boxing legitimately for 10 years like I hit pads with a trainer once a week that's not boxing training um why am I in a pay-per-view Showtime maintenance card you're bringing people in well yeah but you're saying I don't deserve it yeah I agree with you I think whose card were you on Jake Paul's okay Anderson Silva that's the whole thing but the whole Jake Paul thing right I think you can go 50 50 with that there's the part of me that says um he's brilliant business God bless him for what he's done because the Public's been stupid enough to buy it insane that he's been able to do that I think he took his Playbook from Connor who took his Playbook from Floyd who took his Playbook from Ali it's just gone down the line every single way make yourself the most hated man which is gonna make yourself you know sell all the fights and do things so the fact that it's worked as well as it has is insane I just think even with Jake um he's fought old men who weren't Fighters well Tommy's younger than him well well for exception of that fight in all the fights he's had leading up and when I say weren't Fighters I know people will go crazy they're UFC fighters they are older they would kill a fighter in a boxer I should say in a normal setting I just think that from growing up in the gym with nothing but my hands you see how boxers learn to fight learn to punch when I watch how a lot of these guys punch they don't punch the same exact way and there is that part of me that's like it's it's really sad that Jake Paul is bringing the sport as much as it is because there should be up and coming names and Fighters but so much of the business now is social media doesn't matter if it's boxing doesn't matter if it's film and television it all goes back to social these people have numbers they're going to bring people in and I think that's hard when you take someone whose only skill set has been be in the gym every single day and be the best fighter possible it used to be that's what brought the audience yeah and now it's changed but that's the audience to blame yeah I mean the talent it's it's it's the audience I think it's I think it's like for me when I'm being a prick about it it goes everywhere sure let's [ __ ] the fighters [ __ ] the audience [ __ ] everyone because it's just it's just hard man like I have a friend to this day who's in prison who I grew up with for was in prison for years for attempted murder I was back in on a gun charge and still to this day we'll we'll tell someone that when he gets out he's going to be champion of the world which is heartbreaking because the only thing he didn't have a father my father was like his father my family was like his family all he had was that gym so I feel it on such a deeper level of it's not just like [ __ ] these people because they're not Fighters it's just like man I've seen what this gives to people in their life who don't have nothing who come from the ghettos and and I I completely see that that it's not earned yeah and I but again I think the fun of it is just like this is like the prick part of me where I'm like I don't I think you keep giving it a negative label it's it's a nostalgic yeah but like I always have to be another excuse be honest about should have like you know when I I think I was angrier when I was younger when it came down to because I was the kid who loved to fight love to fight and had to be mindful of that because like I can't I don't know if you can see my wrist was broken right here my all these are permanently cracked from just years of growing up fighting I'm I can't fight anymore there's no more training I'm not getting into any anything it is kind of upsetting because I feel like if there was something I would have done well with it would have been this time of this influencer fighting because I have no doubt in my mind I would have [ __ ] destroyed people like so you think you'd be Jake Paul I would say this um if I was in shape like in shape and really on my game I think it would definitely be interesting I called him out two years ago and that was in a that was when I was newly sober not a good time to be doing anything but I was just trying to grab on to something and like all I've ever had was the boxing so I immediately went to that um I think if I was in shape truly in it for years no doubt in my mind I was a nasty fighter and I had a great chin never went down so we're gonna have to do a Netflix boxing series with you first Chase here's the thing Chase is a [ __ ] big man uh he's a big man that's the one thing I don't I don't have going I I wish I hope in his next fight he sits on his punches a little bit more so one thing I just feel like I see from the influencer boxing that's so frustrating is does no one work with these [ __ ] kids on fundamentals I think it's hard when you're picking up a new sport and you have a vision of what you think you're supposed to do and you've never trained for it it doesn't come naturally like you did it when you were five six years old yeah it's very different like even now uh now I've been training for two years pretty religiously and even now my trainer will have me come up to a bag and say okay I want you to double jab stepping in and then give me a like a gut punch uh two straight punch come back step one step back and then step one side one step to the right and then come back in with a double jab again even doing that the awkward foot work is really hard to master really yeah like it's an awkward movement because you're just not used to being in that position I remember when I grew up when I was in I was in a predominantly black gym and it was we got to teach the white boy how to dance okay so it was you're throwing hip hop and you're gonna Bounce Around The Room shadow box and get that footwork in and I would say for me like the one thing I've always had still to this days is a phenomenal jab phenomenal jab terrible right hand okay uh not as strong as anything else but I think it's it's just crazy to me when I see a lot of these people get in the ring no foot movement do not know how to throw a proper punch squared up just [ __ ] lunging and I'm sitting there like well that's why it's entertainment it's not true sport of boxes yeah no I and they have brought viewership to the traditional sport of boxing too which is great which is which is no doubt but I think that leaves me more scared of okay what's down the line you know know what I'm saying because besides Davis and Garcia like who are real up and coming last plant and uh David benavidez but I think UFC has just completely taken over it has it has for sure there's not a because before the heavyweights were big that means like Tyson Fury um fight was supposed to happen sad that it's not anymore yeah but music you know I think it goes into the audience's bloodlust I think that when you go to a boxing match typically people want to see someone get knocked out they want to see that let's be honest when you have a [ __ ] six foot four 225 pound man fighting another guy like that with no padding and gloves you're gonna see blood yeah you're gonna see someone get knocked out it's just for me it's no disrespect to the sport the art of boxing of standing Toe to Toe with another man and giving it a hundred and ten percent like there's no hatred there there's no anything it's it's you guys are putting both of yourselves to the test I don't know if you've ever seen um who's your favorite fighter of all time I don't know I don't have an answer to that do you know who Arturo Gotti is of course yeah okay have you watched yes with Mickey yeah of course round nine yeah that's the most ridiculous round of all time it is I mean uh there's another one with what's his name who got into the motorcycle accident who uh tall guy I forgot his name anyway he gets like knocked down three times then he ends up knocking the guy yeah I know yeah you know what I'm talking about yeah but yeah okay so aturagaria yeah I just I just think like you watch Arturo Gotti and that wasn't a guy who was meant to be a world champion that was a guy who had a bigger heart than anyone had ever seen same with Mickey Ward and that was greatness and you could see them coming together at the end of that and that's what it was about it wasn't about it I think a lot of people misconstrued that with with boxing it's not a hit when you have to sell a fight that is yeah it's not about a hatred it's not about [ __ ] you it's about like we've worked our entire lives for this and I am meeting my best opponent my dancing partner and when you watch those three fights I mean I think someone might look at it and think of it is barbaric I look at it and see like it's beautiful these two guys are giving each other everything I mean dude round nine yeah but you could see how someone could see that as barbaric no there's blood everywhere but honestly put yourself in their shoes I can't though because that's questions I'm so narrow-minded there where I just I grew up with it and it's normal for you it's normal every single day like that was that was normal and and to sit there and I I think every I think boxing is the most racially segregated sport like [ __ ] Italians love Italian Fighters Mexicans love Mexican Fighters and I think you see crowds who love going against each other when you look at that matchup of Irish versus Italian that that brought some some serious heat back in the day man but it's interesting even even with Jake Paul um I have a ton of respect for what he's been able to do for him as a businessman because he's made millions and millions and millions of dollars and after I did watch his fight with Tommy and I'm happy he wasn't trying to make excuses trying to say anything he lost it is what it is and like you said it's about coming back and doing things so I think it'll be interesting to see to see that rematch between them yeah my biggest thing that I really like that Jake has done is the the build up of women's boxing bringing in Amanda Serrano seven times well and also trying to take care of Fighters and and exactly things like I think that's the thing like I think I bought into originally the [ __ ] Jake Paul [ __ ] because I was buying into the videos I was watching with no contacts so that's why you were being a reality that [ __ ] guy exactly right I'm like [ __ ] that dude yeah and then you give it some time and you sit there and you look at it you're like oh I see what the kids doing him and his brother like they're smart businessmen and they're they're trying to now and it doesn't mean you're co-signing everything that they do that you disagree with no and honestly there's there's no hate there at all I just wish that boxing in general had more names to get people excited for and kids in gyms but I think it's cool if someone sees Jake and goes I want to pick up a pair of gloves I want to go to a gym I just think it's hard with the stigma of social media today being tied to everything would you let your child box oh absolutely my kid's gonna be in the gym so no worries about head injury no I mean here's the thing get head injury walking out and slamming your head into the door like not the same thing but it is though but it's like the chance of that happening versus getting in a ring but everyday sparring when you were a kid do you have cousins friends well I hope I have a friend well you know what I'm saying like like did you guys you just released that to me do you have friends did you guys beat the [ __ ] out of each other you guys ever do that [ __ ] yeah of course I mean I did Taekwondo for nine years okay so like [ __ ] like that where I feel like you can get injured anywhere like when I was a kid my dad's thing was kids are little pricks you're gonna deal with a lot of [ __ ] [ __ ] you're gonna know how to defend yourself take care of yourself well there's difference to learning self-defense versus becoming a professional fighter yeah and I I would say to that that's where me having a father changed everything for me because none of my friends had that so the only thing they had was boxing and that's what they were going to go and do my dad's thing was you are never doing this for a career I'm not okay I'm not putting you in here for that oh yeah I'm not saying don't teach your kids like taking a boxing class working pads I mean to me I want my son or daughter for that matter in the future to have the same upbringing I had which was uh I was in the inner city I was in the ghettos of Rochester New York and uh that's where we fought that's what we did and my dad told me you are never going to judge anyone based on their skin color or what they have or don't have in their life but you're gonna see how some people have been [ __ ] in life with what they were born into and you know really see where people's lives go because of that and I and everything my father always told me always came true so are you saying if you continue on your current path to success keep making lots of money despite your financial success you will still move into an inner city Community to raise your kids not move into an inner city I wouldn't say that I would say my kids are going to be aware of it my kids are gonna do Sports there do things because that's what I did like I wish I had the football photo of me with the bay industry Bulldogs being the only white kid in the entire community and I feel like that set me up for a lot my life because in that aspect I was the minority and I had to earn my keep and self-respect from our community of people that I was different from and I went to school I went to Catholic School kindergarten through 12th grade and all white kids [ __ ] hated it hated every day of it every person why the little kids were like little [ __ ] like just entitled Suburban little pricks okay spoiled kids to tell you the truth okay and truthfully some of the most racist people I ever seen really and these are people who are supposed to be god-loving and we love everyone this and that but throwing the n-word around about me with my friends when I come to play basketball but if they could throw football on the Suburban team if they could draft them they love them then and it's just I've seen so many shades of racism in my life and I mean that's where even going back to social media [ __ ] like I remember at one point I was getting accused of being racist because of something on the circle someone I went at I was like bro like that's say you [ __ ] hate me say I do not say that about me because that's something that hits so close to home for me with all of my friends I grew up with and it just was so interesting to go to school during the day and be surrounded by certain type of people and then I go to my dad's car dealership and then at night I was in the gym with all of my friends and that's who I was with on the weekends and to see where some of their lives have gone and to tell you the truth there's only one person shout out to my dude Lawrence King we love him he's still fighting today who has really done well for themselves and that's because he had a father who was there every single day all of my other friends have fallen by the wayside whether it's you know prison death uh being caught up just doing not the right things like no one has really done well for themselves besides Lawrence corrections officer police officer still fights does his thing and you know the best kid you'd ever meet yeah that's great something I've seen people talk about is the idea of having a family in place improves outcomes for children and that's absolutely true what has changed is now our research started to look at non-traditional families a mom and a mom a dad and a dad and what we're seeing is it's really the fact that there's two people not so much that there was two different people like a mom and a dad just the fact that you could split roles and someone could be attentive Now versus later and you could split the attention between a child that's where the biggest benefit comes from so I'm hoping that we can further that message out there because right now people are so quick to be judgmental with certain situations and as you said whether it's racism sexism yeah against lgbtq community some of it's so unwarranted and evil like I just don't understand it it just I'm it's from the understanding comes from the fact that they don't understand it that they're not exposed to it and figuring that out is a civilization problem that we're gonna have to attack it's so sad though man because like there are so many [ __ ] beautiful people in this world who uh just have the biggest hearts and yeah they're different from you who cares man like I I just don't understand the closed-mindedness like I know what you're saying if they don't understand it like that makes sense to me but I don't know I just I love humans like when I walked in today first thing I'm doing is I'm hugging you like that's I think there's something to being warm and and abrasive and that's why even for me I don't know if kids are gonna be a thing for me like I would love to be a father I know I would be the best father in the world because I've had the best example of a mom and a dad who gave us everything but at this point in my life I want to be extremely selfish and I think that it terrifies me to bring a child into the into this world with the wrong person okay because I I really want if I have kids for them to have something as close to what I had growing up like my mom and dad have been together since they were kids truly in love respect each other best friends any problems they've ever had in their marriage which we know every marriage has them I've never seen my dad was my best friend my entire life my they moved me out to LA when I was 18 checking with me 20 times a day with everything I have going on like they dedicated their life to their children and I think too often you see people having kids when they're not ready and it's not fair interesting I'm curious to see how your perspective changes over the next five to ten years yeah I mean here's the thing if it changes I hope it changes for something that uh like I wanted to do versus it just happened sure because I think that to me is is terrifying and I I don't ever want to be there like my dad would tell me when I was a teenager when I was starting having sex and doing things like the worst thing that could ever happen to you is being a father every other weekend why everyone oh because you're divorced yeah well because you don't have your kid and you won't have your kids and like you know I can't imagine like if I had a son or daughter like I'm there every [ __ ] day and to imagine someone telling me no you get them three days a week or you know and this schedule no I it's my job to be there every single day it's my job to discipline them and and teach them things and laugh with them and that just it really really scares me yeah understand your fear totally yeah are you ready for the reflex round let's do it okay here we go boom what's the healthiest part of your body my dick had to do it first in the camera okay no that's this is beautiful reflexes should be automatic what's one part of your body you would replace my stomach let's check your temperature what's something that got you heated recently [ __ ] all right I think about this something got me heated recently what if something I got me here recently oh my [ __ ] my my Bose headphones on the flight over [ __ ] one of the things stopped working which I've spent first world problems I have spent [ __ ] over what are you heated dude forget poverty right boys here's the problem you spent four hundred dollars on Bose headphones these things should work I've had to buy them three times because there's a noise canceling ones but I'm done I'm done spending money on the Bose headphones okay so what are you moving to what's the next brand I don't know I was on Beats for so long which ones the Apple Air Max Dan what are they called airpod Max yeah but the problem with the those that they those are the things that hang from the ear right no no they're the giant ones that's very aggressive I don't know how I feel about those I gotta weigh it out all right so Bose fixer stuff all right I'm gonna give you some names of reality TV shows and you're gonna tell me whether you would win or lose on them okay Survivor how will lose immediately first day I'm gone Who Wants To Be A Millionaire lose first question I'm Gone the first question is like what's the animal I have like a third grade education I'm faking it all the way to the top okay American Idol oh my God I would win wow no I would not I would lose but I would like to think I would win okay Top Chef lose I can't even [ __ ] cook SpaghettiOs oh no hot ones oh I'd win I'd win hot ones I could eat hot [ __ ] I'm about that okay um America's Got Talent uh lose Deadliest Catch [Music] you know what I'd win I'd take me out to sea okay let me get those [ __ ] crap love that show I'm clipping that give me those craps um Dancing with the Stars oh I'd win Dancing with the Stars I would dedicate everything in my life to [ __ ] destroying that show naked and afraid lose immediately because you can't have sex right no Naked and Afraid can you have sex there's no rules against sex but like here's the thing if I'm out in the wilderness with another person and you're just like all naked but you're allowed to have sex are you though yeah oh I'd win but the person has to like consent well obviously oh yes doctor I don't know I don't want to make sure if you're both naked and afraid I think you're both looking for companionship okay uh you never know um America's Next Top Model Blues okay oh God last question have you ever almost died yes how um too much pills okay um too much pills and also there was a point in my life where I was severely suicidal wow severely suicidal and I was very close to not being here anymore wow and uh no one would have ever saw that coming most selfish terrible thing I could have done to my friends and family and uh you know they say God higher power whatever you want to call it works in mysterious ways there was someone uh who unexpectedly reached out to me that really saved my life at a time when I needed it that should have never been there for me should have never helped me and that really pulled me back to life to say uh I need to get help I need to uh pick myself up and really tackle some of these issues in my life and I need to stop trying to act like I have everything figured out and that I'm good because it's okay to not be okay so yeah I was I was very close to not being here anymore at a certain point well that's a good takeaway message be there for your friends even when they don't expect it Dr Mike I [ __ ] love you buddy yeah I love you go thank you for coming on I'm glad you are here today spreading your wisdom and uh we wish you continued success in not just the reality TV space but in the film space and potentially some other places where you may see Joey's potentially very soon but yes keep taking your wisdom from Netflix reality stars it'll serve you very well where do you want people to follow you follow me on Instagram Twitter the Facebook all that Joey Sasso watch out for my movie Young Lion of the West which should be coming sometime in the next six months okay young line or the West we will be tuning in it's a very dark one you're like okay Joey Sasso Joseph Sasso reminds me of so many folks I grew up with uh back in the day in Brooklyn Staten Island I was surprised he's not from Brooklyn yeah Rochester is that what your impression I don't know anything about Rochester that's like Upstate New York yeah I need to learn more that I've grown up as someone who's like from the West Coast I imagine like yeah that's a New Yorker I don't know where Rochester even is I mean like we're like Mike here's a million dollars if you point to the nearest area where Rochester I have no idea I think it's like two hours East of Buffalo so it's like you're making it up it's a way far you don't know where it is a far-off spot um remind me of uh had you met him in person before no never so uh I watched the circle right at the beginning of the pandemic and then I got an offer to work with a company uh that was promoting some kind of Zoom talk show that he was hosting where he was interviewing different experts I happen to be the medical one we got along we exchanged a few DMS after uh he's a really nice guy and then um he hit me up and said yo your podcast is doing great I'd love to come on I was like that's amazing yeah let's do it let's talk about it I didn't really know him uh but I have a friend who was a huge fan of the circle and so I reached out to my friend Brian shout out Brian and I said hey I know you watched the circle what's your impression of this guy and he was like honestly really liked him and he always seemed really sincere and authentic and after just spending two and a half hours with him absolutely like that that is Joey Sasso he's not playing a character he's not playing up that's who that guy is he just texted me bro thank you to you and your team for everything today you guys are so fantastic had such a great time with you so happy we're finally able to make this happen he also clearly like sincerely was excited about coming on this show he got here 30 minutes early yeah he was like sitting downstairs I used to have people that want to come on he said he wore his that he picked out his special outfit for you and it was awesome he's a big Dr Mike fan he's a he's a cool dude and I'm curious to see how his acting career plays out yeah you know what's interesting I think this is actually great that he had a he was trying to be an actor and then he's fallen into this like you know path of being reality he's trying to say no no don't fall into it like let that be the direction you go be a reality TV uh star yeah you know what it means to be a reality TV star though besides being on some reality TV shows what do you do from not like he was a perfect match now what well it also sounds like privately as we were talking outside of the Pod that he is working on maybe some original project that he would be in a a Creator producer role of so I think that's great like make that your entire identity brand business it's incredible yeah I think he's doing it I think he's doing everything as he wishes so I'm happy for him he has had a lot of success on reality TV you asked him how you think he would fare on a number of reality TV shows I want to ask you the same exact question I want to see how you think that was Sam's baby that question that was I was I came up with that about 10 30 last night and then I went oh I'm good it's okay um so uh first off first of all have you ever been on a reality TV show Who Wants To Be A Millionaire and I guess it depends what you mean by reality TV show well um I I guess that is a good question what do I mean by is Rachel Ray a reality TV show no um but Who Wants To Be A Millionaire is like a reality TV show or a game show so you were on Who Wants To Be A Millionaire how did that go I won five thousand dollars because they asked the audience Lifeline which is traditionally the best lifeline failed me wait why is it the best lifeline uh because usually it has the best way of giving you the answer better than 50 50 and well 50 50 only narrows it down phone A friend is like hit or miss do you have a phone a friend when you did it you bring a friend and I brought Dr Robert fish for a cardiologist that's right and he helped me and the reason I brought him up for the previous question before I got this one wrong was because I didn't want to get it wrong and then he came and flew out to Vegas to The Show for no reason so I'm like let me bring him out earlier rather than later to make sure I don't get something wrong and that way he could have some stage time and then the next question the one and then I ended up getting wrong was his favorite song of all time get out of here American Pie Miss American Pie uh by Don McLean McLean uh great song the longest length song to ever be a billboard number one hit that was my question the song the song of 70s um let's see how you would fare on these other reality or game shows number one how would you do on America's Next Top Model what is it what is the competition there you're you're competing to see if you're a Top Model if you could be a model and I remember one scene from that show that I actually watched it was a Russian dude that had to be on like a treadmill thing and it was like who can last longer on the treadmill and he failed so I think I would I would lose you would lose I'd lose okay um uh how would you do on Dancing With the Stars I think I would win I think he'd do pretty well I think I was doing even though I'm a terrible dancer bad footwork I think I could learn I think your last few years dabbling in the boxing world has shown teachable yeah yeah and you I know you would you would practice yeah you really would you would put in the hours and me and bear we would dance oh that would be yes we need a dog version of Dancing With the Stars barking with the Stars uh Naked and Afraid fail instantly instantly instantly can't bugs rashes the bugs man dehydration okay what if uh would you fare longer in a warmer climate or a colder climate do you want to be in the hot sweaty dehydrated place or maybe the colder they're both terrible and the hot ones have more jobs it's probably cold probably cold yeah okay the bug thing would would ruin it the bug thing is the big thing the bug sleeping the buzzing in your ear when you think of like bugs and not being interested in them what is the bug that comes to mind is like oh I don't want it's not even a bug it's a scorpion scares living oh Scorpion and mosquitoes like full body mosquitoes fleas oh my god dude oh the bites ants fire ants oh did you climbing in your butt did you see the staff they said there's like 40 quintillion ants on planet Earth there's like eight million per person why are you counting Anthony's too yes I am then yeah how many ants per Anthony's are there is a more interesting question um hot ones uh I would want to win you would give it a go I would throw up on the show but I would do it yeah you would try I would win I know from having shared many meals with you are not very good with the spice I'm not but I'm willing to sacrifice for the sake of the views you know what's interesting I I think when that show started there were more people who like tapped out they're like this is too hot it was sort of like who can make it to the end and now I as I see it everyone makes it yeah it sounds like it that's why I feel like I would win also by the way when I was reading these shows to him and I said hot ones I was my whole mind thinking too hot to handle oh sure so when I said hot ones oh you've never watched that I meant because he said he never watched too hot to handle so I didn't realize I was saying hot ones next too hot to handle how would you do on too hot to handle uh what the premise of that shows that you're too hot but you can't sleep with somebody I think it's like a bunch of hot people but they're not allowed to engage in any sort of physical I don't know I think I'd win I think I'm okay controlling myself yeah that's um I don't think Dr Mike's gonna wind up being on that no how about like a general any other sort of dating reality I can't do it I would lose just because I'd want to be there it's so fake sorry Joey I know but you said he said blind date was like for fun oh actually that's a good that's another one blind date how would you do on that show that's just 20 years old that's reality TV stars I'm not I don't belong there okay okay oh wait you said blind date yeah blind date oh sorry that remember that show from 20 years ago thinking of uh perfect match bro why can I not hear it's a long day it's not that long I don't understand what's going on no um blind date I remember what was that show about uh it was just like a blind date they took two random people and put them on a blind date I would do that for fun but I don't think I would win that's yeah that's why I like I thought you might handle that one better because it is just like going on a blind date yeah I think I would do okay yeah and you know what's interesting about that show I just realized that shows like a precursor to a lot of YouTube content as you well remember on that show they had a lot of little commentary pop up as text on screen and I think there was like Dr love and it was like a little cartoon Dr Love would pop up and he would have a little thing to say and it was like adding text on screen for a comedic effect wow that's what my essay is going to be about in The New Yorker uh the blind date is the precursor to YouTube and Tick Tock or just all those VH1 shows where all those celebrities kept popping up and giving reactions huge Next Top Chef lose instantly can't cook to save my life um can try but not very well I really don't think you're gonna farewell on Top Chef no easy loss yeah you're gonna be overwhelmed uh American Idol terrible loose what I'm I'm they'll highlight me on the show as the example of like the failures you know they have like a big story and then you turn out to be terrible that's me so Ryan Seacrest introduces you they're going to do a whole big profile this doctor he's from Russia and he saved some ice block on an airplane line before for the blue jacket you modeled Ryan Seacrest suit line yes wow what did I learn today um so you're gonna go in there do a big profile they're gonna hype it up you're gonna get in there first what are you gonna sing Lose Yourself okay you're gonna do some hip-hop yeah great good song and then yeah and then give me what is the feedback they're all going to give you first what's Paula Abdul gonna say she's gonna be so so nice this ain't for you stick to Medicine okay uh Randy Jackson that's a no for me dog that's enough for me dog and our our friend Simon Cowell palliative care that's all he'll say oh he'll say he needs to refer you to palliative care which is like end of Life Care oh that's he'll need it because you've damaged his ears with your singing no for me because he's going to put me down I understand okay got it uh we already talked about Who Wants To Be A Millionaire if you had a chance to do it again how do you think he would do I think I would do I don't know there's nothing I could have done I think I played it optimally they told me backstage you're like if you have a question about pop culture for people who are their 40s or 50s that's who's in the audience ask them I had a pop culture from the 70s and they got it wrong Deadliest Catch loose too cold seasick I don't even really get seasick but I feel like it gets cold that would freak me out man I just the fear of falling into the ocean if you fall off the boat if one of those Wicked Tunas hits me it's over game over it's done it's not a sushi no Survivor win you think you'd win I think I'd win Survivor it's not naked or afraid it's not as extreme I can use my medical skills to get me a little bit ahead there's some people things that I've learned from medicine that I can make use psychologically and I think I could win Jeopardy lose terribly I play the Jeopardy app on my uh PlayStation you don't think you do we watched a lot of Jeopardy for a little while here I mean compared to the like the Champions and the people who you're not gonna be like you're an average person yes I might do well but if it was like this is jeopardy for Average Joe's I do well uh one that you have sort of played before are You Smarter Than A Fifth Grader oh yeah I would lose instantly they would make me look terrible and I would have to hand in my medical license at the end yeah yeah they would ask me medical fifth grade facts that I wouldn't know the answers to that was enlightening to watch because it's such like General Knowledge Questions on that show and it's surprising to learn like what people don't forget because everybody misses stuff on it and it's always like wait you don't know the order that the planets go in or something no people have gaps in all sorts of knowledge like that um you don't use it you lose it you lose it uh are there any other game shows am I crushing on Wheel of Fortune oh yeah I don't know I just think I spin well uh how about uh the game show where everything's made up in the points no matter Whose Line Is It Anyway I would kill to be on that show we'll get you in an improv show we'll get you in a comedy sport show someday it was so bad we'll put you in an environment where it's like very safe and you'll do some games that we'll practice a little bit with you and okay we get you to do a show I think you'll have a good time um I have a question for you that comes from a podcast review if you're listening to this right now please go uh to Spotify or apple podcast reviewing your podcast and leave a five star review for this episode it is so important to helping this pod reach more people um and when you uh have the opportunity to write a review please put a medical question in that review and it may be broached to Mike just like I'm going to um right now so this first five star review comes from comes from Sawyer Patterson uh the title is love the Pod and Sawyer's question is what is the best post workout stretch for swimming I would say it's too specific of a question given the nature of a general question needing to be answered well okay so let's talk I'll just talk about it this way I'll answer it generally in swimming one of the the biggest muscles that you use is the latissimus dorsi which is the long back muscle that attaches to your humerus and then to your spine this muscle uh is a lot of times tight in swimmers and in people who lift so stretching um stretching your obliques stretching your abdominals all of those are important muscles to focus on I don't think there's one best stretch um for example like if you have recurring shoulder issues maybe you need to be doing some shoulder stretches so I can't give that kind of detailed advice but I would say focusing on the core muscles like the oblique muscles the abdominal muscles the latissimus dorsi those are probably the most ones that get utilized and under stretched while swimming the question also implies that it's advantageous to stretch after you swim what sort of stretching would you recommend you recommend people stretch before they exercise after they actually I think in general before exercise especially competitive exercises about Dynamic warm-ups and going through range of motion as opposed to just static stretching where like you just stand in one spot and you try and hold the Deep stretch that can actually cause some damage especially if your muscles are cold um or even potentially wear you down and decrease your performance so Dynamic warm-ups is the way to go okay that's very good thank you Sawyer I hope that answers your question yeah thank you for joining us on the checkout podcast with Joey Sasso hope you enjoyed watching as always stay happy and healthy

Channel: Doctor Mike

Views: 67,350

Keywords: doctor mike, dr mike, dr. mike, drmike, mikhail varshavski, doctor mike varshavski, dr mike varshavski, dr varshavski, dr. varshavski, mike varshavski, joey sasso, the circle, netflix, perfect match, dating show, reality show, game show

Id: 1sYTvJQ4uZA

Length: 118min 57sec (7137 seconds)

Published: Fri Apr 07 2023