GameNight! 2017 Spiel des Jahres & Kennerspiel des Jahres Special

[Music] you yeah it's like on special episode of game night Nikki Lincoln Mark Aaron rusty and me Dave are going to discuss the spiel - er s the three games up for the main prize and the three games up for the kennerspiel this of course is for the year 2017 let's get to it these are the six games that have been nominated views of the main field is ers prize and this is the kennerspiel here this is the more family one we'll start here and Aaron why'd you just pick one and work our way from there okay I think the most invented and exciting and tactful one for me is Magic maze for sure okay it's the kanabi or tying stories of this group where it's just like oh I haven't seen that before and it's exciting and new and it makes for a really interesting experience if you haven't watched the episode where he played it or you don't know you know what I'm talking about you don't talk during the game and you just make your move when you can make your move and you can't even signal to the player next to you that it's here turn on with now he's putting the meatball in front of the bits it's that genius brilliant thing where we're all working towards the same goal but we can't say a single thing except for those pauses in the game where we discuss strategy it's and it's just that one of those where a game where it takes one simple thing to just launch gameplay into a whole nother stratosphere and that I don't know that I'll want to play that game up forever or for the rest of my life but it's just it's really innovative I thought okay Nicki what about you what do you think about magic base magic mains is a lot of fun it's extremely frustrating we all heard my my issues with the banging of the red piece on the table which drives me bananas um I I did enjoy it though and I liked that there are different scenario setups a whole bunch of money in the game box so that the opening game is a lot of fun and and difficult on its own but if you need even more problems they got them for you in there so I had fun with it mark I think Aaron kind of nailed it for me too or it's the innovative choice the most innovative choice in the three of them I think but the same time is probably not one that I would play over and over again in my collection I know what you know Nikki is exactly right I was I only played it once but you showed me how there's this one Ralphie called a campaign mode or whatever it is there's this series of things right away too so it adds complications right and adds yeah but there's even though little quasi quasi story or standing sort of anyway so that part is cool would give it a little bit more legs but the sort of game I feel like if I was a convention or something I would be happy to like give it a try I play someone else's copy or something like that but it wouldn't necessarily be one I felt like oh I've got to have that in life my shelf yeah I understand that I think I love the flexibility a member of players the ability to just say okay we're going to play with two or we're going to play with six it did yes hey hey yeah you want to go crazy it didn't change how frantic the game became it didn't change that stress level everyone was still I've got to be involved and everyone is involved at all times regardless of how many players are and there are many games out there that you go from two to four the game changes so dramatically that doesn't happen here yeah it's a good good scaling mmm excitedly I really like the game I was knocked out the first time we played it and eagerly contacted the publisher to try to get a copy as soon as possible because it really really impressed me I had no I did not think it was going to get nominated because I was told it was ineligible but I'm very happy to get nominated because I don't think it would have made it to next year and potentially get nominated or at least it's got that going for it and I'm you know I'm going to do the Nicki thing is the art is amazing it's really really fun there's a lot of great stuff inside there and it's I just II when I I liked the game but when I edited it a little love the game 3 for y that's where that was going I think they I just freaked out how great and fun it was to even just watch right to see people taking their role and you know trying to communicate that something was wrong like here if somebody does something wrong you're allowed to say hey that's wrong and take it back but it won t exactly not yeah not an incorrect move that it wasn't actually illegal but I really really think it's a great game there are a lot of names I mean you can say about any game then it's sort of player dependent there but there are games that are more player dependent than others and my worry about this was that it might be two player dependent that it might not be like all you need is one or two like people that aren't into it or whatever to sort of kill it and while that's possible the thing I really like is that if you are with players which is the most the majority of players you're going to play with if you're with players that are into it and it's fun it is sort of even more fun the game really complements that part of your personality in the way does that make sense and that the fact that you can't speak is also great because it allows people who are not necessarily extroverts to still be extroverts in this game and so in a way it's like it's a party it's comical partying yeah yeah I mean it has that you have that party game feel there is a sameness to it for me as well mark I don't know I don't know like I have no desire to do the whole campaign situation but that doesn't mean I wouldn't play it every now and then you know I mean I could see three or four years from now absolutely someone says let's play magic my stolen playing it absolutely don't you think I mean and it's cuz a good midnight Game two right here if you were drinking I can be very interesting very welcome to 15 minutes which you know leads us right to a king Domino look at another 15 min again beautiful segue sir I really was I really was impressed with King gum oh it's such a simple concept and matching the tiles to the train which I mean obviously some of us are not that good at it and the method yeah I don't understand I I'm kind of nervous about our space program mark I got a baby but I am really really impressed with that game I I mean I I heard it was really good because you actually reported back that it was fun um but it's it there's there's a lot going on in that actually I mean I love the I love the choice order that you have and when you're going first you get to it last if you're the last place you'll get be the first there's an elegance to this that I really really love spoiler alert I think this is my favorite of the three but it was really we'll get to that it was just crazy hard I agree these are all really tough choices I never liked cities and so my worry was that this was going to be that again so yeah and boy is it not like it's such a better version of that essential that kind of same thing but you can get to that later go ahead let me tell you all my thoughts about King Donald oh okay oh oh that's been talking about something really boring I fell asleep I have like nothing positive to say so I it could be considered elegant but it really nothing about it grabs me it doesn't do anything new it doesn't do anything engaging to me it doesn't it doesn't I would never pick it off the shelf and say hey you guys want to play this it's now and spoiler alert as we get to the heavier side of the table like that's where my tastes lie yeah I prefer a two to three-hour experience than a 15 to 20 minute game in most small actually make way to hours next time well viously it what it just with two sets two is what I heard about that was a that sounds kind of interesting I'm now me and uh you guys played with the basic rule set but talked about the right wing variant with anything officer the caves and the perfect grids like those might make it a little more interesting to me let me add a little complexity on to it but just like out of the box the basic game is just not much of a game - Wow yeah it's funny because I'm kind of the opposite of that what draws me to King Domino is the fact that it is a shorter game it is something that I can get through quickly and I might not have the optimal game experience of building this great long-term strategy but once it's done I can get back into the game and try it again and it's it's 15 minutes out of my life and I can play it again and have a different experience second time so for me the the shortness of it the lightness of it does actually appeal to me more than more than heavier games so we're kind of opposite there some well I agree with you in that like being bitten by a weasel for five minutes is better than that for five minutes so there is I could say the shortness is good for no I I will say one positive thing about the game that the turn the turn order selection going along with selecting the tile they may or may not work in your array is a very clever game mechanic and I think any great game sort of needs one new innovative thing like that so that's new and innovative even though you said earlier it has nothing new no I said it has nothing that grabs me and hilling alright yeah I'm saying that is its new and innovative hook if there is one it just doesn't really work 100% let's get an opposite opinion Nicky I know you love this one I did like it it's appalling game fun I like organizing my world and I enjoyed it a lot and I've been going to something that I had been talking to Lincoln about is I really enjoyed that placement of your pieces determining your yes yeah your or what one turn or oh it's going to be because that got me a couple times in the game and I played games where that the turn where you place yourself determines the term turnover later but that it got me a few times or was like I knew I needed to be first the next term but I knew I needed this tile to complete you know to get into the actual real scoring of of the area inside the heavier games where there's there's a lot of what I consider to be more chewy games where turn order is determined by stuff that you do and my problem with those is I just I'm so it's so tough for me sometimes I just don't get the fun out of trying to think that far ahead and that's the best one has a simplistic version of that here is what I dig well because of the value of the tiles right the lower number of tiles which you may not necessarily need don't be fooled those can be valuable later on once I established or if you swing for the fences like we did that could be beneficial you know yeah mark so I'm also the opposite of there and in that I always prefer the spiel des jahres type of game over the kinder spiel and we know that about each other so and I really like I really like King Domino I liked it a lot despite my struggles with it I don't know what I deal with it was at the end of a long day I know what a grant yeah let's go with it yeah but we're still on France in your head maybe or do that is that how they end hey you want you got a chief at you one day well I like it feels like a card game to me almost right the titles were really nice and it needs to be tiles it would not be very much fun at those cards but it reminds me of they're the kind of games like Colorado like or say oh and I goes the guy are that have like one clever idea in them and a lot of my friends have always thought like that's really cool I wish it was in more of a game and I usually think no I like it by a little pretty awesome just by itself I'd rather play Colorado pansy Loretto or something like that so King Domino feels like that to me but and this may sound like a little thing but instead of a little pack of cards it's a small box but it's a box and it's a tile and you play out the board and there's lots of times I like filler games but I wish they just had a little bit more presence like for a lunch hour game this is perfect once our game and it being so short it you're saying you liked it it's not cards I like that it's a filler it's a filler board game because what it is yeah and absolutely yeah yeah and but I don't know if a filler board game as much as I like it it's an insta buy for me and I'm gonna play it over and over that doesn't mean it's spiel des jahres I'm not sure but I definitely love it you know and like I said insta play well take a silver out of them or my neck so okay so Eldorado uh you mean wet louse no no I didn't mean that is El Dorado we can we can now use the short title from them right well so why not you know Tia a jailor like if you've been a hobby for a while it just it's instantly interesting so hey what's many kids you do when we haven't seen him for a long time or we haven't seen in a big way for a long I was going to say I think there could be even people watching or have been abandoned a hobby in the last four or five years what I've never heard of it I know crazy you don't think so raised beef I was going to say that not all of us old-timers who've been in the hobby for 10 15 20 years like we know all his classic games and but what has he done lately but yeah it really hasn't done much lately I never look him up I don't know what the stats are I always assume he's got like 15 games every I'm sure that's probably doing that probably donate maybe don't even have his gear and use as long I do mine are things that he's making scads of money if you have that's our game that we wanted to exploit ups because have you had a big hit that's been on all of our radars and on all of our tables in the last few years yes or sir that's true I think because he decided to actually make money yeah yeah hi I'm are okay but besides just the name recognition of that you know it's deck-building which I like it's deck-building blended with a board I like that even better probably and it was it seemed like it had some stuff in the box meaning it's a pretty short game but there were different least map layouts and everything not if I had hoped there was a whole different sets of cards maybe that could come later I don't know but it I'm trying to listen for did did have that like can you see a magic that we used to always see and I don't know if it did or not but it was really pretty cool and I liked it and if this sort of I don't know I was just saying how magic maze was a game that was innovative but not my thing King Domino's exactly my thing but even short for me maybe in terms of spills jars eldorado ends up sort of hitting that middle spot where it's like it's something pretty awesome to play I could play it several times over and over you know year after year it has that sort of quasi evergreen feel to me that could be I'm your only one area in or part of the year in right but and it was surprisingly short actually when we set it up and went through it with the board play I thought oh this is going to be yeah I guess maybe it was the full hour but it felt really fast yeah so I liked it quite a bit rusty I like the title is an English race for El Dorado the game does feel fast it's it's this thing that you're constantly going but the twist on the deck building that I preferred was that you can't add cards together you're actually having to plan ahead for future action you have to get that three paddle if you want to go across that dude he had gold if you play our game but only if your day when you forget your own rules explanation yeah again end of the day is that nice little twist that it makes it instead of just okay well I'll get lucky with you know collecting enough of that one card to get through the section says you actually have to plan for it you have to say I know I'm going to need this and then worry about the repercussions of non going guns in my deck afterwards to get through areas I don't need this for anymore right and so it's that balance of when do I want to pawn forward how long in before I start worrying about the heavy stuff like there are definitely other maps on here though where your plan of like you know I don't need as much gold at the last last tile which we all kind of like in right you know but the thing is that can be changed with the flipping of the tiles there were the map tiles the other thing about this is it's got a bit of salmon run salmon run is a race game if a deck building element they sleep oint it out and I was laughing at it been something I was thinking about when I was editing it and something on you to point that I believe yeah um but what I really like about it is it is very very quick and you have to think on your feet and you have to determine am I going to buy or am I going to just run and I had in a game we played I just had that weird I think I all drew all movement cards and then all gold and yeah first started yeah I was insane yeah right so that you just end up leaping ahead and then blocking everybody else sort of yeah then having four gold backing and the ability to run around people though because of other easier paths and yes is great now because I played another game of this where I hid I stopped on that spot we have to discard just before we have to discard 3 cards or there and somebody just said I'm not waiting and went around and that was actually really really powerful they were able to not lose those three cards I of course used I had the car the the native card guide that let me move on to that without spending it without discarding but I know you guys are frustrated by those natives yeah and I but I feel again after we had played if you're in the lead they're valuable if you're in the back they're valuable but they're not as powerful because when you're in the back you need those cards that give you five a machete stood multiple spaces to black right that's where I think that because it's expensive to get those cards not that it's not expensive to get those of the you know the higher machete cards the higher fold cards and stuff like that or the higher wild the one that would be uh that one powerful wild card which i think is also a burnin isn't it once before for wild burn it yeah but I love that I love the burning card thing because your deck ends up spinning up again if you play it correctly you know maybe and that's how I was cycled through the card so quickly to go they he had such a small day hmm um I liked it I liked the race element on it and thought it was fun there's there was a feel of it to me that it felt like an old-school kind of eighties which I couldn't quite because I was trying to think well what old-school game has the race element in it and I couldn't think of the deck building plus race element so I don't know if that's can Canisius mark is what I was feeling there when I was playing the game or or what but I wouldn't say that's against it I liked the old-school feel of it because lately in recent years it's all been about the new and what's different and this one's too much like this women you know it's it's this constant pushing forward and there's nothing wrong with the older games and there's nothing wrong with the older way of thinking we're playing through a game having said that though the whole race thing is not something that you would really find a no in an older game that I can think of well I mean um Mississippi Queen I was seeing this issue just because the house yeah and but that is a race yeah yeah doesn't racist the race of this Eldorado that didn't fit it to me cuz it in that one there's that Jinky like okay I got a wheel back this many right yes yeah so um but I enjoyed it and I enjoyed it I don't think we talked about the brakes that are in yeah the obstacles that was that to meet element to that it can be a equalizer if you don't have the right cards to get through that and you're trying to get the right things and people are catching up to you so there was a lot of interesting things to it I liked it I didn't love it it you're talking about it's you know a lot of games basically do the same thing every time so when you say sometimes well this game feels kind of say me to me it's like now there's plenty games I play like I love playing emerald for example and emerald is the same thing every time I mean it'll be different yeah it'd be different based on what happens but I'm trying to do the same thing every time you know so I think you mentioned this when we played it that day the idea of having all the cards available was yeah now that might go away if I play it a few more times and I'm sure that expansion cards can also come out which is kind of neat but there was and again I think that was on purpose I don't think that can you see necessarily wanted people to try to figure out okay what combinations work well within this set of cards right which is the thing I think that's really cool about Dominion is every game you're like okay here's the set I have to work with like what's my potential path here but also I had that thing where you know I didn't realize how much of a race game it was when we played it and the notion is sort of hanging back to catch up later just didn't seem like that was going to work regardless of my cards but that's not I don't think I hope I'm not using that as my experience as sort of adding against and it was just I don't know the same yunus of it to me I don't know on the seventh or eighth they just changing up those maps would be enough for me but I will absolutely play it again and it was very cool and I like that you only have four cards instead of five I like that your deck is actually not that big by the end of the game your deck is really not that huge no no yeah partly because you are buying some cards that go away but also partly because you just don't buy as many cards in the game a game is over before you can sort of make too thick a deck which i think is actually kind of cool Aaron um I think I've seen the English title now translated as quest for El Dorado that's probably I think that's what they're going to go with but um I feel like this is maybe not a home run but it does a lot of really interesting things pretty neatly I think yeah um I unlike mark who might prefer Colorado without all the zoom Loretto chrome around it I don't like a deck builder that doesn't have anything else going on with it so I like that this is a deck builder with a race on the board going onto it and I like I think it's signature a little bit of brilliance of that market where when something runs out the next purchase or chooses the thing to slide down I think that's kind of brilliant and it will only get more interesting as expansion cards likely add more cards to that I love I love a game it's not the same every time I do like emeralds but I don't want to play it that often because the board doesn't change it was just a game of it I know I think personally like truth it's different taste it has a lot more more playability to me because it might not ever play the same map twice on this right you might be five texts as long that might be seven and a half X's long and it might have lots of villages and it might have lots of jungle and there's there's just so many different setups here and I appreciate that modularity I also I like the obstacle thing that Mickey mentioned it's a way of not letting somebody just lead the pack forever because they have to pay all those extra costs across the obstacles I like the blocking and positioning you know I think there's like I said it's not perfect and doesn't make me go this is a fantastic game but it's got a lot of little neat you know shining pieces that work pretty well into it I think interesting I found I felt like the obstacles were not really ultimately obstacle Li and their tie breakers and it seems like the game is going to end with a lot of ties so there's almost your you almost have the incentive to break through those obstacles yeah now maybe well it's likely do you want to spend but I hands right because it it advances your deck right you are spending cards to it whether it's discarding two cards or just getting a card or actually spending one of the types of movement that's something that I think is different that is one of the more important different things about this is that you are collecting types of cards to move on certain types of terrain would you feel different to me then you know I don't have the breadth of playing billions of games all the time but that is something I'm not used to and the way that you use them is great too I love the not being able to stack them I do wish that you couldn't stack them to purchase only because it's frustrating in that that happens in our play it's just could you combine gold to buy card yeah so it was hard for me to remember but you don't hang up I hope it's just a common thing you think about doing right but one unit one more point about El Dorado are you mentioned during your play of it and I think a couple of you kind of mentioned it that it sort of seems like it might be over too quick like it's one of those where at the end of the game already yeah but that's another thing that makes me appreciate the modularity of it like maybe that's not a knock against the game at all actually I've had a lot of sort of I find a lot of dick builder games are that way but I and but that's why I'd rather just play a longer race I yeah I'm someone who wants that that that end game to go on just a little bit longer so that's a reason that I would almost say let's break out this game and add a couple hexes to it not have it end right away from like base setup so you know I appreciate that you can adjust that I don't see that as a negative thing I actually find that that's I mean the very first time I played Dominion it was just all of a sudden over but that's because I was so focused on okay if I do this and I get to there oh wait it's over oh yeah oh yeah but if you do see that as I did it I doubt it actually but I do and I can fix it one more thing on Eldorado I was thinking about it this is spiel des jahres this family-focused right they all certainly would work with families I think nothing that's a good trick in Eldorado it seems to me like you can't look like what Lincoln says you can't really get blocked or stuck not really I can't remember when we played anyone had a turn worse what was nothing I can do good my turn I do it I mean does he had a lot of one hex moves the Run was blocking her best pass I mean it wasn't yeah she wasn't screwed but I definitely know her day but I grieve you that the the ability to just count any card is half a goal for example we can be like well like I'm blocked and I can't do this well alright I'll buy something with this it still hurts it gets like a three green and you're spending it for half a goal but at least you gave me something a baby I linked take us over here okay well I guess we'll start with Raiders the North Sea which we just played and it's really kind of a neat game it's a worker placement but with a neat twist in the placement where you place a pawn and pull up a pond yeah and I really like that I you know it's it's a weird one where the economy is tight right because things come out of the game and there's only so much you can gain on the board if you're not conquering a rating which is crazy so it seems like there's a an arc of like your engine and then it kind of Peters out because you can only do so much to rebuild your goods right and that's really kind of interesting where it doesn't it doesn't necessarily steamroll to an end right it's kind of like a three steps forward two steps back Fang as opposed to slowly building an engine that just gets better and better right or the gang goes well especially if you had I in the game I played at it there was a I had a lot of the Valhalla so there's no no I'll have you killed a lot of crew members yeah yeah yeah I killed a lot and that was an interesting strategy I don't know that it was ideal but it was still interesting you know right well it's a trade-off it gets you a lot of points on that track but you lose your guys understand spending our money means all the money you spend I think that really value boys you know the one that discounts one yeah yeah that would make that probably more powerful that's true or or just set yourself up to kill cheap ones yeah I played a game where I had the one that the sage which has got zero strength to it but give me like a special double power and then when I killed someone it was like okay well I used him already yeah and he only cost me two but yeah it's it's a balance of that's right thing what do you think oh I enjoyed it's an engine builder so I had problems for Jesus but I liked it I liked the cards I liked the art on the cars are like that all these Viking dudes are hilarious and and went in there were Viking women in there - I liked the board I liked the back beautiful the idea of this is your starting area this is another area this is another area and you can go to any of these sections in the areas that's a raid provide you of this versus some straight path so that was interesting and different photographers yeah to me in that way I like the whole pond thing where there were three colors of the pond was done colored different did DiFonzo else another color did a bunch of stuff and then another color was kind of more specialized and did some of the higher level of things that was interesting too because a lot of times I was stuck with a higher level pond and I really wanted below a whole one just like I got Jeff I know it would be better for me but I was stuck with the high level or mid level one so I thought that pond idea was interesting and different I liked that the decision wasn't in you complex like if someone had put down a white or a great pond down in the work area and you were next or like oh well I could get that now but maybe that wasn't the action you want to get right but it wasn't or maybe it was you know what am i a ghen izing it was like shed you this should you that it was more like that I'll do this more okay I gotta take advantage of that it wasn't overly complex do you mean um I enjoyed that game quite rough Raiders of the Northeast quite a bit I think you guys have covered most of the good points about it okay ever see mechanically it's a fairly simple game it's a worker placement game yeah some resource churn and and victory point earning but you know the geniuses of it is the you have to put one down and pick one up every term and people may not have left the perfect sequence of actions for you in okay I think we mentioned this but you can always take one of the actions you want but you may not to be able to take both or in the proper order that you returned the man yeah there's there's really genius there and in the genius of the black gray and white people's having different results or even being able to only go on certain spaces those are both really clever game design elements that really you know form the gameplay experience it's really and I honestly don't think that Raiders is much more complex or really more and much more involved than than the regular I would agree actually it's just it may take a little longer I mean you might not bust it out for a family game but it's possible that to take that curtailing and you'd stop it from being a fan might be it's just a little morning I don't know yeah what you think arrested um I was thinking along the same lines that Raiders is kind of like the feels it the funny thing is that to me it has a little bit of a race feel to it and there's ways to slow other people down is by getting to a location before they get to it but also a bit of that take Matt mechanic with the cards in there I'm not a big fan of take that mechanics but this game didn't feel that heavy with to take that no they're not they're not hugely damn held it was it felt a little more balanced yes there's a couple in there that can be you know pretty devastating to one person but for the most part I didn't even notice it very much very light very light so I liked that that I had that ability and that things were happening but I didn't feel like I being knocked out of the game right so it was well balanced in that fashion for being a lighter but heavier game at the same time I and I enjoyed the flow and it seemed to flow really well for me so I like Raiders pretty well - I mean I like rusty was talking about I take that as like a dirty word I mean that when I heard that about the game I don't think I'm going to like this then we when I played it I put it a couple times it was oh that's not such a big deal that's not really a problem I still don't like it so it's is having area let yes stays beef about having to select the person yeah I don't want to take that card it sort of hits everybody equally at but when you choose a plate or do something you fall into two potential traps of yours you might not know who the leader is like or worse you might need a specific thing and the person who has it could be the last place player and it's still your best move to take that thing freeing your game but the thing that mitigates them which is nice is that the take that side of the card is usually paired with a really good crew ability yeah and often you don't want to necessarily play the tank bed card because that credibility might be like who I really want that but are you but my issues with the game are different and it's really just a matter of style is that I think I've heard it compared to Lords of Waterdeep I think that's a pretty good comparison okay um I'm kind of done with work replacement games I never really got on board that in the first place it's not something I really enjoyed you know is that space was blocked and you couldn't no no nothing any bitchin resource sure there's a lot of games to do resource turning people other people like that I I don't like that when the game gets set up and I just see this a bunch one correlation of cubes and I know I'm going to be converting other cubes and other cubes and I think like not really I don't like that so much that said it does flow it flows really neat it's got a little sprinkling of theme that really kind of matters and always helps right right man you know like I said I played it twice and I did appreciate that and just the way those cubes that also sort of bothered me the way have to do with them the way they just the random initial population it is random right yes they made the game skew different in one game that was like all that gold victory points for the easy harbors and the other one I you know you had to go way up there and the iron I'm telling you get to this area yeah so that part was kind of clever so I mean it's it to me it's pretty not to us as a worker placement game goes but it's not my favorite kind of time well you've been marched let's talk about terraforming Mars Mars what mark you haven't been to Mars oh no it's true though I I'm in the Mars business and it is funny people anytime there's little on Mars a space game everyone - oh you must love that no and I haven't implied it in many cases because if it's deeper too long because I don't like deep into long games all the space games are that way because they're trying to be realistic like which is no fun but terraforming Mars was in that way honestly I was a little hesitant to play it because of that sorta Mantid in my mind about that and not as complicated as it seems though it isn't and now it's got several things going for so when I finally played it it was like oh it wasn't as complicated yeah it wasn't as long which is that thing I'm worried about and we play a three player which I hear is probably maybe a sweet spot for the game it doesn't it's interesting because the end game condition is the same and with a fourth player you can get to that faster so it's a trade-off of is that fourth player's extra decisions sure drawing it out and if it isn't it actually could be faster before players could be right I was led to play with three though just the same and you know it did feel what's the office of generic I mean guess the matter oh yeah I felt when the cards I mean I definitely bought cards that I thought this may not be the best play for me but man that is cool in my eyes just team game they're my opening man I get the Mars rover I mean I'll keep them that one a later on giant fake mirror oh so I couldn't help it yeah duh and then I hear about you know astrobiology I was like I probably need to keep that one too so you know I I fell for the theme way more than I thought I well I guess not much as everyone else thought I would I actually finally allowed the space game so I like to quite a bit that's it it's still big and long it's not something I need to own but you know at a Saturday game day or at a game convention sort of thing if I got you know the right set of three people who are going to play fast enough and man you know I have the right player aids and everything so it moves smoothly I think oh yeah I would definitely play it again which is not what I expected when I first played it that's kind of the science check out a one yeah okay ah I'm kind of in the same boat where I was not quite expecting the level of enjoyment I got out of terraforming Mars I I played it for player it wasn't as long as I expected I did enjoy it in that it had that engine building to me I like engine builders uh but I felt like it had some things that held me back there were cards that were in my hand that I'm looking at blank okay well this is just clogging my hand I'm not able to do anything with it no you examined it first aired for a dollar yeah I network for network yeah I don't le me I had that game and it just they don't mean right Holika team was theme theme theme and they did an amazing job on the theme but I felt more like I wish put pushing cubes around yeah and I wasn't really getting enough done out on Mars that I wanted to get nothing I think if I had more cards that it's possible that my starting hand didn't work well right and so I just didn't get out there but it felt like I have things that I'm like wow this would be a great card later but it doesn't do anything for me now yeah but they they did a very nice job getting the seem to work together and getting all the components to work together so I I think it may have just been an experience with my hand it's possible it's one of those games where I mean there's a you can draft that's why people allow to do the draft I don't think I ever want to play to draft just give me ten cards and let's just start right I think one could have a similar story if I played the game with the jury at media teespring with two jurors who had either not plated or played it a little and for me I ain't got stuck in a weird I know I like the game I think it's really really quite good and it's actually got some fun stuff going on but I had a hand of cards that were unable to build for a long time I had seven cards that would too many elements had to happen for me to get to that place and I wasn't going to be the guy moving advancing those things to get to that point and then I had three other cards one of which turns out I shouldn't have had was one of the expansion corporation cards or something like that and I didn't know that and the other two were very expensive and those are two cards I saved because those will probably be good of course they happen at the end of the game and I ended up winning that game because people were doing things that we're benefiting me and like are you sure you want to do that ward because I'm Way ahead of you you're never going to catch up to me on like the banking or whatever it was but I really I think it's great my disappointment I'm happy for Stephen bonocore because this is a big hit for him and it's selling really well it was very hard for us to get a copy to actually get on the show but I'm super glad we finally got a announce five expansions already or something because there's supposed to be three coming like I so stated origins and now how many I've title time he means is on our side as it has moved to two so there should only be two if they're already in there maybe there are more the I think you look hard but the thing that I don't know what let me just appointed in this game in because it's a $70 game you know if you can buy it and I really don't like the components I the mat is terrible arable and that's why we played with these acrylic sheets over them that let you lock those pieces in place impacts the play of the games I bump it and there's no way remember ever and it's too easy to bump things in it I don't know what the situation was on that because Stephen does not do that normally so I don't know if his partners or what the deal was because it looks nice the you know the cubes are neat looking but they're not perfectly flat and so they're kind of rocking and all this stuff is just so bizarre and you know when you compare it to scythe which is not that much more money the production on that were well for doing exactly there's no bump in those cubes because they are in there now again I it's a minor thing in what all I feel is he should just print some stuff out but let's people buy those for ten bucks so they can just replace them out if you just replace the mat it will make us such a huge difference part against my experience my first play of this was like a tricked out copy and there's absolutely no doubt in my mind that that helped me like the game absolutely but just playing with the tricked out copy and the was just fun in the same way that any game that has kind of cool components is just fun right nice experience too because I play with the the trays yeah please walk that's what happens a trade had I not yeah I think it would have been not nearly suited yeah downer Eric Martin made a joke that he will wait five years for the deluxe Taniya got new art and better components you know to help let me boil down the essential edition of the 17 expansions into the yeah yes what are the good things yeah all right Nikki what you think about terraforming Mars um my first play was kind of rough um we had the full complement color delicious people and it was late at night you know that's tough mm-hmm and I was in the game with Lincoln where he had a really horrible starting hand so I don't know how colored all this is he did end up winning the game which was great because he managed to come out of the hole my starting hand was wonderful but for me there was a lot of fiddly note keeping on that bored and that just I was always asking for wet okay that goes up that goes down I mean some of it of course I got it was pretty straightforward but some of it was a little like okay wait I did that are you sure I'm supposed to do this oh wait no you weren't that sort of thing and then to have it knocked by dropping a cube in the wrong place I'm having they kind of scattered a little yeah so that was difficult I mean I pretty much got him back with where they needed to be but so but and then the art was was difficult for me as a designer to see like this clip already come with there are some clip art thing photos that were not great yeah I do it it's a lot of art for yeah the family put this game together basically yeah I mean considering but I my game we had an artist playing to Greg you know Greg mm he had the same comment I didn't even notice I'm playing I'll stop right so yeah I wish there was a little yeah there I mean you know there are game players that you can just give them Xerox pieces of paper and they're totally fine with it as long as the mechanics work and it's a great game I get that I do and the mechanics in this are really neat but but let me I looked at the cards and some of them look like clipart and I went up cubes colors or weird old was coming off of cubes and that sort of thing that got a little to me but just because those are things that I look at and I care about the whole experience right right so I I do want to play it again having said all of that I want to give it another try and and I and I want to like it more yeah it's very good when I was finished with the first game I don't remember what I said but I said something and then the next day I came up to the guy that I told it to and I said you know what I think I was just I thought about it all night and I really ate that opinion I don't remember I was pretty harsh um because I ended up thinking about the game like all night that means something I did something and so I do want to try it again I do want to play it better I like I liked all the different things you could do you were worrying about the plant growth and the people in the air and the animals I liked that it wasn't just your building bubble on Mars and blah blah blah you know and do you have the money to do that there was a definite path that I was trying to take that was different from everyone else and it kind of hindered me because people didn't get like the water going the direction I wanted to go you know it was still um overall I want to try it again yeah I enjoyed it after I took a few steps back from it and a lot of that make sense there I feel like there are definite Heights to this game and definite disappointments like we're all sort of covering I agree with Nikki that it definitely sticks with you good or bad and makes you want to think about it afterwards and maybe play it again even if you didn't have a great experience the the components are the component quality is a big drawback but I think they're like we've covered that the the card deck I feel like is a strength and a weakness in this game I played a 5 player game which may not be the best way to jump into it it was sort of a long drawn-out game but the card deck in this game is like yeah yeah and you know we got like 30% of the way through it so there's still a lot of stuff in there I have not seen when she could not get weird could be cool right in our game we we burn through that deck really I have usually was seeing cards that were nothing there were things that people had discarded Wow when you is close to halfway so maybe that's just the style we played or something but I feel like there was a lot more to discover still but that also you know to jump back twelve or thirteen years to Agricola it's that some you here's your cards and maybe they work together and maybe they don't yeah you know sometimes in Agricola you have a plow and the guy who plants extra vegetables and a thing that gives you extra money for vegetables and that's a perfect all right they all work together and that's a perfect strategy laid out for you and sometimes that's going to happen in the cards you get in this thing and sometimes you're going to end up with Lincoln's hand where these cards are 15 turns away from being useful right so the only thing you can do is sell them off and hope to get better cards oh wait you're making a case for drafting in a weird way right yes I maybe I am maybe I've just had that experience but I'm just saying the the size and variety of the deck is both a blessing and a curse in this game I I don't know the thought on the deck after I'd played that perhaps some of these endgame cards that could be set into two or three decks and you hit a certain point you then shuffle those cards in the deck and the good thing is is that it gives you when you have those you can plan a hit yeah having those in your hand I think is actually essential I mean I had the same problem you had I didn't do enough on Mars like I felt like I'm barely putting anything on the board and that was just the nature of the cards that I had and when I finally was able to do that most of the great stuff had been taken up right there was not a any of those really fantastic wood spunky touch for water or you're going to do this right you know it would just wasn't happening well the thing that I really liked about the game is sort of runs counter to what you said the thing that surprises me about this game is that there are actually genuine sort of multiple paths to victory that's that you can you can absolutely win this game and build almost nothing on Mars like there are ways that was my game yeah and and you want no part of the redone one because other people do heretic told me he'll I had in a weird way one of the games I played was the same to you I had a hand of cards that were all big huge powerful cards but I just thought okay let me just sit here with these cards and just do the thing I need to do let me just increase my money every turn and see if I can get to that point and I just watched everybody else slowly sort of build their engine but I was able to then just put the hammer down later them now again the people I was playing with it was their first play and if they were experienced players I didn't I was probably dead but but I was sort of hardened in a way by the fact that starting with that hand didn't hinder me as much as I thought it was going to and that you can build tons of cities that win the game you can build no cities and win the game you know you can plant a lot of trees you don't have to plan a lot of charter the game is terraforming Mars right yeah and not doing that is disappointing like I had fun I do enjoy the game my thing was is I'm not doing anything right I don't I I some cards I I don't like doing that and then I blew all those cards as soon as I got the sixteen because I did that achievement yeah I sold them off for $1 apiece which is really sad and you know just whatever I knew I'm not going to be able do this and I can go do this because I it was tough I it didn't come to I didn't get 16 cards very quickly and you start with 10 a long time to get to be able to write and do that that achievement which is weird I mean I did play some cards yeah I had I had two or I know you're saying now when you when you're watching everybody else in the table doing all these things in their turn and you're sitting there going well I can't do those things like I thought it might gain the same thing you thought I thought wow am i dead can I possibly be dead by just sitting here and whatever and I thought well let's just see let's see if I can get there so it worked out but why isn't it a case for better game development I mean they could have Rusty's already thrown out one idea another idea is that they have the little icon to the bottom of cards so here's a starting hand here's five different scenario media thank you everybody start a deck at Martin I didn't top it a lot like if you don't want to play with it just yeah I'm up with like normal but here it is and along with that development do the production of the physical production a little bit better it's just like that's a little bit polish you expect from a prize-winner idea I hate to criticize this much but I feel like it's underbaked I think there there needs to be a little more powerful I thought all to it I feel there's a lot of great game in here oh I do have knowledge of it does I'm gonna play right now but what I really think there's things that need to be smooth them you know there are local people and you know that I was going to mention there at least three of them they this calendar year already have 50 plays of their 100 yeah yeah but they're crazy they really there's something there it right there is something they're like no it was a corollary to this but these are also race for the galaxy people and I found something like an efficiency engine well because of the big deck of cards and of course they played rafting so and I feel like that's it's got that kind of scratches that race age for them but in a much complicated way right like in the way that in the way that this is deck building but have stuff added like this is potentially maybe a little bit of that big deck writing more thing than game at it anyway chewy enough for them right yeah a lot yeah and they they love that stuff it's also tough when you have a big complicated game like this your first play is always going to be tough anyway especially if it's late at night and you've got maximum people may not do it what do you like yeah are that let seems to be harsh as opposed to play a B's it for we the game yes go ahead do one more thing yeah go ahead before we move on to our final game here in the kennerspiel group I want one question for the table about terraforming marks maybe starting with mark and Nikki I'm surprised nobody mentioned this yet do you feel that there are too many take that cards in terraforming Mars and did that detract for your enjoyment of securely not remember it's a complaint that I've heard from several players yeah you could lose a lot of plants and again and when I wasn't in that games you out of your base production and really get answer difficulty playing cards Ruth didn't really affect a good point because and it was kind of weird talking about it and it has that your problem is you would take a player targeted right now and those are admired by the way there you don't have to take that is not mandatory but there's a lot of them in there there's a lot that probably would not be my favorite thing either and it was the games complex enough that you can't really tell who's gonna win the game I know how like you have it mark if you leave unless you have a great composer yes I'm never even on games oh there's not normally going to get to that level ready for me so yeah I didn't like that part as much either but it seemed necessary so it's like you can't just pull that out yeah because you need to pool players backwards it's interesting that didn't bother me as much in here for a weird reason and that was that everyone because the people knew that was there a lot of people were certain would happen to you by accident but a lot of people were sort of just avoiding plants for the longest time because you just didn't want to lose them I don't know why you keep saying plants there are lots of take that card that affect all kinds of productions what I was thinking about I didn't in our game it was mostly the asteroids out there the event and they mostly stole plants cause everyone kind of knew that's what with the standard take that was people again and again I played avoided plants for a while and then when you increase your plant production to be big enough losing some plants and then not as harsh see the deck is so big that we could have played completely different games I'm talking about I had a little game with a lot of like increase your production by one and decrease recipes by one right crease do this by two and the decrease somebody else's so much especially for like starting to build up your engine which a lot of people have difficulty with or maybe the cards aren't letting you to knock back your production earlier in the game can be a killer and it really yeah I had players who were like this is not that fun because I worked for a long time to get this production up and now people are hammering you could always explosion to take those cards out you could but it might throw the balance of the game off for me because there was the drafting at the beginning of each round I just didn't choose card reading or just throwing three columns the drawing three ends and buying from me I was going to keep yeah I just wouldn't buy those cards and I did play one or two get get you cards because I felt the guy was totally the leader but I just crafted my hand of cards to the way I wanted to clay yeah I played a lot of them actually sir the guy who said what were these I didn't even invite up because I forgot his owes me 20 on different did you hear again no and in the beginning I like you know I hit you I hit us or toggle and then we forget right and we kept hitting what turned out to be the game later all the time which is why I think maybe you can't pull about because you need some way to pull a better one yeah so you're right though to point it out not my favorite mechanic okay well in fairness to terraforming Mars a lot of us have only played this maybe one or two times yeah so we have it necessarily I'm sure would benefit from well and exactly what you said earlier Nikki there's definitely I was surprised at how much I was thinking about it afterwards and like oh that could be I could try that Erica trip there's definitely something here and it's tough when you play a kennerspiel game the the in theory sticker chewier games the first time if there are rules like that that you're trying to grasp which to me is with buoyant about exit to gaming abandoned Kevin a game you're going to play once so you don't have to worry about well I'll get the rules this time and then the second time I'll really know what I yeah you just got to do it it's this beautiful escape from in a box game spoiler alert as you can probably tell it's my favorite under three and I really I really like this as a kennerspiel choice it seems not like a kennerspiel choice to me in the good way it's it's not this big thick chewy complicated or not really it's just advanced right yeah I'd say that's what's great I think it definitely doesn't belong over here the exit does not belong with regular she get the in their head but they consider to have your longer area x-ray and and this one is kind of like a teeth right conceive like oh but it really isn't that deep it's definitely deep but it's not chewy more difficult yeah we should mention that the entire series is up for the award yes not just this one game there's two others remember episode so they're nominated Assyria exit the game with the three together anyway yeah yeah and you can board yeah having not played the other two I believe you told me right this is the easiest of the three that's what I've heard I've only played total two of them now I've not played the most difficult one which playing its puzzle-solving so I can see where that would not necessarily be also a family game regardless of I think that was what I was van door mom but I I love that they did it more importantly I think the incus and marker brand and Cosmo Sarah Anka and Marcus Brennan cosmos did a spectacular job yeah it was I was in the same way that I was sort of surprised because I was thinking wrong I know like Terry Morgan Mars not my kind of game and I was like oh that's pretty good I had that chip on my shoulder like I'm a puzzle guy who's gonna be gum and I thought it was not it was terrific but the level of puzzle was really great they were creative and interesting and fun and and the when we played it I mean it was it couldn't been more of a group effort you know everybody you know you had at least two or three contributions that were going to vital for us to move forward and everybody did it was really neat yeah but does it have in a game see that's the biggest complaint a lot of people have about this is it again yeah that's coming a game you mean as opposed experience it's a puzzle no it's a bunch of puzzle game i agree into a game i agree yeah I see what you're saying behind is room it is time story's a game it's a bunch of minier turn mazes or story link puzzles you know crammed into a game experience I I see what people are saying but yeah I'm with medev on this it's amazing all of the puzzle games I played so far escape room game have been great there are things to nitpick about some of the other ones but I like that this one does not use an app even though I enjoy the app in unlock I like that it's self-contained there's something kind of cool in old school about be figured out a way to have this like deck of cards that does the thing it needs to do for you mm-hmm and just the inventiveness of that was really cool absolutely it says right there exit the game it's obviously and I don't know if I have too much more to add either I really enjoyed this exit the game experience and it really surprised me I thought escape room in a box come on like that yeah I'm really going to be anything like an escape room are really that enjoyable and it really blew me away sort of with the experience I you know I think I said this on our show maybe was after we stopped the cameras but like when we played it I had just had like five or six people over to my house and it would have been perfect to like play after dinner with those people and I wish I had known about it at that point although then we would have had to play a different one on the show but still you know it's not that often that a game that I don't have any expectations for makes me go oh I I really got to get some of the other ones and try them that was really fun yeah I loved the destruction element where you're really gotta cut pieces up and don't get really too worried no no they tell they tell you right really you might have to do some you might have to do stuff it's a one-shot game you know you could try to play the game with me a lot you can't play it again necessarily no yeah unless you were just kind of sit there and go forever ago watch people do it yeah but I like the one use item essentially you're going to use it up when you play it again electrically and it really was impressive on a you know surprising level where I didn't expect much from enlisting my wheelhouse this is this is probably my favorite of everything I've played probably in the last year Wow I mean this if they had a hundred of these I'd be going through this I want to know that should give you the next one because it's the attention to details the artwork and the detail and that the way the game forces you to pay attention to that detail that it's not that they went to all this work and you're going to miss it you have to see it they they make sure that you don't mess anything in here and that you get the full experience and every time you open up one of these boxes and there's nothing wasted right like you're never going to not get to a certain part of it right it is you will they find a way to help you complete this yeah and you never feel like you never feel like oh I didn't finish that I didn't get my monies well there's no limitation on time on it right which is not normally for an escape room because I need to get something that I do but a really smart choice in my opinion or degree just let people have the fun they want to go with it or the clue cards either right like I mean you might not feel like you did a great job if you had to read every single clue card to win the game but you you you're going to win the game eventually right you can always get a clue for a puzzle you're just not getting so that's another great decision like you can always get there in these games eventually do you need to I'm going to ask you and Nicky what you thought about this in a second but to just to jump all the way back to the very beginning of the show where I said that magic maids with the innovative and interesting and new choice of the spiel trio this I think we're all agreeing is the innovative and inventive and like new experience choice of these three well I didn't think about it till just now but it occurs to me that last year's choices you know this is this is pandemic legacy and I'm stories smushed together having a simpler form with a shorter running time I'm in a way it is kind of it takes me not not on purpose I'm not saying anyone said let's take Mel to great but it kills that that Mitch perfectly well Nicky what did you think of exit the game with the game I played two of them and the first one was snare and then this the cabin winners enjoyed a lot what did you not like as much about the secret lab the secret lab I think part of it was we were trying to save the game for other people to play so we were tracing and holding it up to the cyanide your cell phones everything right maintain you know do that perhaps incorrectly writing Gouda with our game it felt like real group effort we were all trying we were all trying to let each other have a chance to to do something and the other day my play that kind of I felt like I was sort of locked out and there were and we were all locked in Marisa yeah yeah there are the other players in the game we're very and I wasn't aggressive enough and like let me do this a little frozen attic and I felt like I was kind of locked out excuse me um but I want to play the third one yes my Bennett I'll open the Sara Lee ro Joon is the hardest one and then there's three more coming in yeah okay I think there's already three more after that the high nine already the whole thing was three English coming Gaza in September October I believe ah so I'm not a total person as you may be remember and so when I I played the other two as it turns out I'm not a banach Adam and I played one with gamers one with Tama of all things and and partly is I just wanted to see what it's about because I'm curious I've never been to an escape route probably because I knew I wouldn't like that kind of thing I thought anyway and so when we played I had this experience that you were alluding to where how the scoring goes how many Surabhi we went to here everyone was like a whole bunch of clue cards we know scored in the basement but we had a pretty good time doing that yeah but I thought it was a clever design thing that's like it didn't need a referee no no it doesn't require one person to stand back and read the rulebook and know how it all works it happens with cards in the game doesn't stop it doesn't get lying even if you're a bunch of dummies sitting on the table exactly turned out that was really clever I thought and so based on that experience we did that what supposedly is the toughest one first then we did the lab one with family and that was interesting experience too because it was so bizarre accident because my my wife is had told me like oh we're signed up we're going to do an escape room with this other couple some time I thought I don't think you would like that actually so we played it and we got probably threw eggs and she says I hate that she quitted that's what this whole should be like you notices well I'm not sure we're going anywhere I'm not a hand my son who hardly ever played games where this was locked in I mean it's really into it and I said well we got to Douglas to the clues we don't need a clue you know we can figure this out right and everyone else had drift away it was he and I doing it so it was a great and interesting experience and just like Aaron said it was very different for any sort of right other type of thing I've had in all these degree I got you know hundreds of games in the garage this was very unique in terms of the player experience so it's very innovative I don't really care a doctor or anything about whether it's a game or not it no no I really if I'm with you I like you're doing spiders from October that in Germany and Essen because it was already out and they were going crazy for it already everybody I talked to really really love these games and we're freaking out so IV a listener definitely got some in its favor potentially for winning too and I love them they packaging they're just the whole production that's a small game it's cheap its disposable yeah I really have a big box yeah it's always hard to be a cheap to be disposable right right right I mean they could have done something different where you had a way to reduce kill looks like yeah you had a big producer man yelled in the cards or something I like it it's like an impulse oh yeah terrifically produced yeah it's surprising to me how gorgeous it is for that whatever $15 yes amazing yeah really well and though there's a lot of development in that I would think as a mean you're a puzzle guy you know you've done it stuff yeah there were you know when escape rooms for took off there were a couple of escape from a box things that sort of first came out and those were like real escape rooms in the sense that they were sort of hit or miss and this definitely has the feel of that kind of next generation where some of the bugs get worked out as many here is kind of like the better elegant professional more enjoyment yeah not that some of those weird lostalready escape them in the boxing not that some of them aren't really cool and great but they're definitely I played one that itself comes with like three or four different things and one of those was like oh my god and then one of them was like if I played this first I would never played the other ones in the play it's a very in that regard but you know escape terms in the real world like that well exit had one thing that you were that we were talking about earlier that makes it kind of better than a real escape room in that it everybody can see everything yes now summit yeah so most gay groups are really nicely designed so the number of people almost don't don't matter and but yeah there is something that can happen in a physical escape room especially the rooms that have a max of like 10 or 12 in which for completely understandable financial reasons the room is going to fill that so if the six of us want to do a room and it's ten people max and we might be with four strangers that day because they want to sell those tickets and I can't blame them for that but now you're in a room for other people you don't even know and the puzzles themselves can be designed in such a way that you don't see like half the stuff you're doing this thing over here and someone goes hey I got this gizmo and you're like oh where did that come from I was really cool there was a thing and it opened up and we did this magnets and oh I didn't get to see that right and you can see it afterwards when they do like a little walkthrough but that's not the same thing and you're right what's nice about this is it's not I don't know about the other ones but this one specifically is not completely linear it is for the most part linear but there were definitely a couple of times in which we could spread out without yeah yeah yeah we could sort of spirit okay I'll do this and you do that and I'll do this and you get and that's what I want like who - for active tasks in front of you well that escape rooms have that as well as they do is the good ones - yes but you're right this one had that feel of I never felt like there was anything I missed yeah while we're doing this even if I didn't solve something or even if I wasn't the one contributing to it I at least saw it happen like if I don't see whatever the weird gizmo is over here I least want to see it yeah I can't be I'm not the one doing the magnets or whatever I want at least see when it happens you know I learned it has like some piece of cool tech ah less since we're here let's do our voting thing that don't even have anything else they need to say want to say fully get to the voting all right so the first thing we're going to do is we're going to three to one point and we're going to vote for the game of that I want to win mm-hmm this is my between the walk to it yeah basically your favorite of the three everybody ready all right I think that she really gonna be tough I think I agree we all have my sides have something other than I guess arrondissement in Domino but I think they all have something really really great - oh I agree anybody I know it's just not my style but I agree that all these games have really good things go pretty sit up I mean I already spoiler alert but I felt like last year's kennerspiel was the hard choice for me those games were like wow this for me is he that's right right it's totally easy okay don't we want what we this is your favorite of the three is what you would you would what you would give your word to which is not necessary your favorite the probably here we go three two one three two one quick all right way that means it's for eggs and one Mario Marlins here Nikki Raiders all right all right here comes the real look now for what you think will win what a jury but when you think this very very I really don't injuries mind that's always harder this is where points are were lost only three years you don't a spreadsheet right according I like it is about her dearly managed okay Harry there it was hard to he'll agree ready three two one point Wow the rest of us you think writer them Raiders and then everybody let you see crazy and I need a I think the point that exit isn't quite so much that standard game it doesn't have the replayability it it's a one-time shot and then you've lost to those players you're going to get this you're going to get the word of mouth of how great this is but I think it's it's a limited item whereas Raiders there's nine of them right now right now you could be right because pandemic legacy did not win list here and time stories did not win last year but I think part of the reason maybe they didn't win was they were too big and long and complicated sort of for what it was there's a lot of things I think the symptom I think the simplicity of this might help it in that regard I think it might be a you could be right I like your SQL so I always a great as well the most mainstream circuitry it's a sick thing well ask you this would end up being eyeless sky which was the most mainstream right right again I think because pandemic legacy you're right maybe they said look we've brought awareness to these two and now let's give it to the game right well anymore I don't think there's that discussion going on that maybe what each person might have thought but what ultimately you know there's I I thought like it always seems to us in our community that have that dynamic legacy and time stories have that buzz and that like oh it's the new like game here about and like I feel like well doesn't that was what I said last year I think about pandemic lately I heard right a pot I listened to a podcast of screenwriters and they were going crazy for the game I don't find them glazing and all the stuff so to me the reach of that game was already great and I didn't necessarily need to win but I sure was sad didn't win I also I felt it was the one game that was like you're gonna play at least twelve of these I know I'm still handing it out on that one day before but this but the thing was is this like I'm done with Iowa sky I think in that game I like the design that I think the designers are actually very very talented and there's a lot of great stuff going on there but I have no desire to pull that out and I was ready I was waiting to go for the rest of pandemic legacy mm-hmm this one has me wanting to buy more copies of these get you know give your hand totally oh yeah totally I also we I think I said this last year but I also felt like that you know you win your Oscar for likely thing you did two years right right I felt like pandemic didn't win anything and I felt like it could the original pandemic maybe the legacy would give my agenda me was nominated yeah yeah and was turns it as the point of vision Wednesday on that one because I thought wow this is amazing I mean it the deck and that thing is amazing yeah right every year we do this the whole hobby does this is a meta game yeah yes okay the jury picks yes and I'm not so sure there I mean I'm not sure how much gaming is going on no I mean yes the spreadsheet has already proven that I am consistently wrong so arguably I should change my thinking but I'm not interested in that I'm interested in staying true to myself mark John free or jury if what you think the jury that's my problem is like thinking like what the jury might select yeah I always I never I'm always picking what I hope the jury will pick what about it let's move over here guys this is a drum roll Oh run well for the big prize yeah we're okay for which we're voting for the one that we would you would be in with your the way that we would do in the I know I mean this is harder than oh yeah but obviously because like you said this is in my wheelhouse too so it made it easier for me but I had no idea Oh knowing okay I'm ready this is what we pick yeah this is what we this is what we would avoid ready three two one point wow there's all over the place Wow okay you to kneel in many came rusty and mark and a pick back wow that is it we've never had an even exact split that I know and that thing is I don't know that this is my chair buttock well well good we're gonna be talkin like okay yeah be great all of us take a different picture it don't you two come on folks mind up we can make it happen I already know re2 one time now it's three q1o they can you think this will do it I think it has a great - and I hope this wins obviously because it was mine we have a slight jury mind-reading pick for El Dorado well slide but pretty spread around yeah Harry's Red Army I almost think that if for nothing else because it's from Robins burger and it has Canadia and there's sort of like that this is knob it's the base the mainstream but yeah that's why I think it's the safe pick that's why I've been don't know it's tough I almost think I don't like it don't you have a little too calm thing that's wrong one I feel like calling you one of the games in this one is very difficult because they each have something wonderful to offer I don't know I really don't know what's going to know it so I need a lot of pitting might the one that fits my favorite like magic means like I said in editing that I was like wow this is just great it's just great to see people working together and those the struggles it was just amazing it's so amazing to me for me excuse me for me I picked it because it's the one I hope the jury picks yeah [Music] yeah I think this would be a really cool pick but again it's well I hope so too I just this isn't this isn't a bad my choice of this it's just I think that it's got something there for people like since it's the family game yep this one's going to be like the easiest one for people to get I love this game that's a hobby grower yes yeah I don't I'm a change I don't know I know the anti driver is going to think about it but boy I think that that's got exactly what Marx is the ability to grow a hobby okay well we will find out on July 17 17 all right we'll find out on July 17 well click stay for leading us around absolutely thank you [Music] you [Music]

Channel: BoardGameGeek

Views: 30,597

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Id: -QvQnGpERqc

Length: 79min 34sec (4774 seconds)

Published: Tue Jul 11 2017