Fake Rolex with Cloned Movement Versus Real

guys we have a worrying development in the whole business of counterfeit Rolex and you know the evolution of that game because until recently that was all about copying the outside of the watch but my man Andy has sent me and thanks for that has sent me this little fake Rolex Submariner Kermit which is you know reasonably convincing from the outside but he tells me that inside there is a cloned Rolex three one three five now guys you know that's a movement that I'm very familiar with that I service all the time in fact I have got one on my bench this week so I'm gonna use it to compare with whatever is inside this counterfeit Rolex so you may have heard about this whole issue of cloned Rolex movements but in this video I'm actually going to show it to you in some detail less cracker [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] now here is the real deal guys this is a Rolex one six six one zero made in 1997 a nice little black Submariner off its bracelet because it's about to be opened up for a service now these these submariners are just so classic and so beautiful and so functional that you know they're a joy to work with in the 3-1 35 movement inside it is you know it says on the dial their superlative chronometer it is guys a superlative movement by Rolex that will last for decades and decades the quick change they change on this watch has been working since 1997 to see if I can invoke that quickly here they go you know nice and positive you know it's just Jessica Rae is a great great watch and it does cost the owner some money you have to drop about eight or nine thousand pounds for for one of these issues a hell of a lot of money but you are getting a hell of a lot of watch now here's the danger this looks pretty convincing I would say and as you can see from the outside at least I don't think yeah average punter is gonna be able to say whether this is a real or fake Rolex so you're gonna have to rely on someone like myself any expert in this area to you know what you are getting and if you've got you know five six seven eight twelve thousand fourteen thousand now if it's a Hulk in jeopardy you really really want to make sure you're getting the right thing because you know just look at this watch this guy's is a fake but it is very very dangerously convincing that if you really want to make sure that you are getting a genuine Rolex guys go to an authorized dealer that would be my advice but if you're in the vintage market you are going to have to spend part of your money on getting some expert advice am always buy the seller as much as the watch so in a minute we are gonna open up this fake Rolex and have a look at this suppose it cloned a movement because it is one thing to write Rolex three one three five on a rubbish movement but it is quite another to recreate the really very fine work that Rolex do so keeping an open mind let's open up these watches and see what we've got all but before we do that do you want to do a couple of things I want to put them on the time graphic because that will tell us a lot even before we open it up and I want to do a quick wound check because I've noticed on this fake Rolex that the bizarrely that the loom does seem really really good so I wanna check that out actually so there we are let's crack on and starting then with the real Rolex on the time Grapher which has been beating away with its genuine three one three five movement for over or about at least twenty three years and if we pan over to the time graphic to check out the trace and focusing on that now you know you can see immediately that this is a real Rolex is beating away at the right frequency we've got twenty eight thousand eight hundred beats per hour okay the amplitude is a little bit low it is down at two three two then i would prefer it to be above two seventy and the beat error is a little bit higher at point seven but as you can see the watch is losing less than five seconds a day and it hasn't been serviced in ages and it is running there like it's on Rails like a real Rolex after 23 years so let's compare this now with the trace of the sub close it cloned three one three five and here it is then the little rolex submariner fake with the supposedly cloned movement inside and what does the trace tell us this time so to sweep across there and bring that into focus and as you can see we have got a significantly different thing going on here interestingly the frequency is actually you know the correct frequency is beating at twenty eight thousand eight hundred beats per hour but as you can see the accuracy is not good we are at plus 41 seconds a day and this guy's is a new watch and the amplitude is really very low at 170 and I did give the watcher very good wined before starting this test to give it the best chance possible and the beat error is also pretty high again getting too one millisecond there so you know not a complete disaster but not the sort race that you would expect to see from anything that's supposed to be a chronometer and here then is the real Rolex three one three five and we point out a few things on this perfectly lovely genuine Rolex movement so first things to note is and really importantly here is that we have a balance bridge rather than a balance so the bridge comes all the way across and the balance is secured of both ends okay and also that there are no regulation pins okay because there and also there are no regulation pins because the row next three one three five of course has a free sprung balance and we manipulate or we adjust its timing via thing called a my cristela wrench and if you want to learn more about that then look at my videos when I actually serviced this this movement or the to 135 I think where I actually show the adjustment of the free spring balance but just looking around this part of the movement let me just move the rotor arm here a second so this is the automatic works at the top here we have these two Teflon covered reversing wheels and this component here is the balance hack and we've got the three one three five here we've got some intermediate wheels around so now let's take a look at the inside of the cloned movements I'm just going to swap them out now and here is the cloned movement in a minute I think I will show these two together because actually when I open this up I have to say that I was a little bit taken aback by you know just how cloned this movement is because as you can see the I mean they basically have copied the movement but importantly there is a very very big difference and it is in the most important part of the mechanism of that is the escapement and particularly the balance you can see here that unlike the real Rolex we have some regulation pins we have a very ordinary balance a very ordinary balanced spring and a set up here where we like most mechanical watches that we change the effective length of the spring by moving this regulation here now in fact actually it's this one here if we move this one it will set the watching beat and these are the regulation pins here let me just check that out now through my loop hang on yep that's what we've got going on there but the rest of the movement does seem to be pretty faithful for one of a less honourable expression to the real Rolex three one three five the geometry the morphology of this is you know pretty much identical but we do have some big quality issues which I am going to come on - in a minute because when I opened up this watch I made a discovery immediately that gave me a indication as to the actual quality of what I'm looking I'm just remove that for a second so yeah this but before I deal with this issue just just summarize on this so you know what we have here is not a clone it is a you know for it to be a clone that everything would need to be identical and the most important part of the movement the escapement here is not identical this is a very standard and low quality in my opinion component here which is made to look like the very high quality equivalent in the real Rolex movement but yeah and here's the really really dangerous thing to look at to the untrained eye it is you know unless you really know what you're looking at it is it's pretty much the same all of these components are on it you know identical place because they have to me it looks like they have copied the rest of the movement but they've dodged the difficult bit and what you can see in front of you now is the balance of the real Rolex and the things to notice here are firstly you know just the absolute superb finish that we've got on the balance bridge the purling that you can see there you can also see that the hair spring has a breguet over coil and it's difficult to point out but if you look at the capstone the purple capstone which is in the center of the frame about now and go to the 7 o'clock position if that was the center of the clock you'll see that the hair spring has a strand a sort of terminal curve that comes in and terminates on the big block of steel that you can see actually in real life it's tiny that you can see at the six o'clock position now you can't see it because it's moving at the moment but the balance has some screws on the edge of it that we use the my cristela wrench to actually adjust a position of those screws and that gives us the mechanism by which we adjust and make more accurate the timing so I just want you to really focus in and look at that balance because it is the balance where the difference is on this movement compared with the cloned movement so if we just go over now and look at the cloned movement or the copied movement I'd like to call it you can see that it is very different we still have the balance bridge if you look at the work on it though in fact I'm going to skip back to the Rolex you can see that the sort of damask in in the purling on the bridge is really very very fine and beautiful okay they've had a go with it on they copy but it's very very rough in fact as you can see the whole finish is very very rough but the key thing is the escapement and it is just an ordinary balance this time at the seven o'clock position you have the termination of the hair spring and at the four o'clock position you can see the two brass pins there which are clamping the hair spring and you move those back and forwards you know clockwise or anti-clockwise to change the effective length of the hair spring and that's the mechanism on that watch for changing and adjusting the time it's difficult to see through the camera but the balance the amplitude of the balance on this fake is you know very insipid very lackluster and on the real Rolex it's very very fast in fact you can see it a little bit but I just wanted to focus in on that now it's probably unlikely that you'll even be looking at these when you buy a Rolex but you know should you ever have the back open you can see here you know just how easy if I just compare these two together it is you know for somebody that doesn't know these things very well you could forgive them for mistaking the copy for the real especially if the real wasn't beside it and of course you know that is normally the case when somebody is buying a watch so guys remember what I say you want to buy a Rolex then please please PLEASE buy one from an authorized dealer or enlist expert help and always buy the seller as much as the watch because this stuff you know is dangerous ok now if this doesn't demonstrate the point that I am trying to make with this cloned Rolex or copied Rolex movement then I don't think anything will because as I open the back of the watch I noticed as I laid the case back down that there were some debris inside it and I had a look with my loop and discovered this and this is the shattered remains of the case securing screw and it's a little sort of washer there that tucks into the side of the case now the real Rolex doesn't use this mechanism it uses a much better mechanism and also Rolex being a very very high quality organization do not put components in that do this right now this as you can see I mean this is supposed to be metal but you can see there that the screw has literally just sheared into the observant amongst you will notice that the reference number is also not accurate okay so here we go I mean this is the point if this component just falls out the back of the watch which basically means that the whole movement now is not held securely in the case then you know what else is poor quality well the answer is that you cannot guarantee the quality of any of the watch because I mean look at that gee essentially this watch is all about conning you that it is a Rolex and you know deviously these guys are making you know a stab at doing their and ultimately you know they're conning people out of money the person that buys the fake Rolex wanting the clone movement thinking the clone movements any good well this movement is not any good it doesn't perform very well and as we have seen has you know is made out of dodgy components that might break at a moment's notice in contrast the real Rolex is an utterly gorgeous piece of high quality engineering and high quality control and that's why it costs money so anyway I hope this was useful and I'm just gonna kind of sum up now I guess there's one last look at this you know really doji looking three one three five copy ting yeah there yeah now I have a really bad habit of saying I'm gonna do a luma shot in the video and then forgetting to do it so here we are we are poised for the luma shot so after three I am gonna turn off the light with the fake Rolex on the left one two three oh now that's interesting I saw this the other night when I was putting the watch away and I thought cool do you know what that loom on the fake Rolex is bombchus ly good I mean it's really good it's the other way around to normal normally the hands are pretty bright but the indices are rubbish in this case you know compared with the real Rolex you can see just how good that is but we have to bear in mind guys that the rear ELYX on the right is 23 years old and the watch on the left will not be around in 23 years to do a loom check on because it will fall apart way way way before that so this is not a fair comparison but I thought it was interesting nevertheless and I like to give you guys the whole picture so there we are the loom shot we did it let's sum up so guys I hope you found that enjoyable and interesting and to sum up what I would say here is that we don't have a cloned 3 1 3 5 movement we have a copied 3 1 3 5 movement with the really tricky and very important probably them important--but avoided and also for sure we have a copy of a movement which is poor quality I mean you saw it right there's bits falling off and you know guys are spending because this movement is supposedly cloned they're spending proper amounts of money on this like you know hundreds of pounds you'd be way better off going and getting an input to produce more you know the new Pagani design which that I've seen the spec of recently probably going to be doing a review on that watch myself soon those are you know that there they are Rolex on Marg's but they're honest they're not saying you know this is a Rolex which is a dishonest thing so guys if you're buying a Rolex save your money up go to an authorized dealer and get a new one or if you're in the vintage market by the seller and get expert advice because as you have seen although the stuff is really poor quality it to the untrained eye it can be really really convincing so guys I hope you like my videos please subscribe please hit the bell icon there down there wherever it is so that you are informed every time that I make a video now I know a lot of you out there are watching my videos and you're not subscribed then I'm watching you so please subscribe and there we are so from Pembroke doc here on the coast of South West Wales in the United Kingdom good night and God bless

Channel: Richard Perrett Watchmaker

Views: 330,468

Rating: 4.8306212 out of 5

Keywords: fake Rolex, Counterfeit Rolex, Rolex 3135, Rolex Submariner, Fake Rolex Submariner, Fake Rolex 3135, Cloned Rolex, Cloned Rolex Movement, Cloned Rolex 3135, Richard Perrett, Watchmaker, Richard Perrett Watchmaker, Watchmaking

Id: mrWonCQtEWk

Length: 24min 34sec (1474 seconds)

Published: Sat Jan 04 2020

Reddit Comments

[u/pp_amorim]

The comment section of this video is a Cringetopia. "Fake watches are fake people" ughhh

[u/SunCap54]

I’ve seen and heard of good quality reps running at chronometer standards. -4 - +6 s/d.

[u/Saccs]

I don’t think anyone who is on these subreddits or on the RWIs expects the movement to fool a professional or fool anyone really. What rep ppl are looking for is accuracy on the exterior components and quality of movement.

I would say the biggest takeaway from this for anyone who is planning on buying a rep is to get it serviced as soon as it comes from the factory. I’d love to see this or another expert run that diagnostic device on a rep that has been professionally serviced.

My second biggest takeaway of this video is that while reps are a great way to try and buy and have diff styles that loo k good, there is a unmatched beauty and quality in a genuine watch and I still plan to get 2-3 sub 10k watches in the next few years to add to my gen collection.

Thanks for posting this video!

[u/geniusghost07]

I'm still off the opinion that there are much better reps he could have used, I've seen and own reps with a much better Rate (s/d)

[u/s1ckopsycho]

I can't believe I watched that guy suck Rolex off for 20 minutes straight.

[u/WatchYoda]

The bench numbers that he shows are so bad for his rep...even for the 3135 which I'm not a fan of...yet, but that's another discussion for another forum post. It seems that I agree with the smithy on that point.

Granted, most purchasers are oblivious to what good numbers are on a timegrapher scope, but the QC people at the TD's certainly do. It would be highly unlikely for them to even send out this as part of a QC package. I wonder what motivated 'his buddy' to even accept this...unless he was specifically looking for a questionable movement. In the actual YouTube comments, the watchmaker states that he wouldn't spend the time to regulate the watch because the low amplitude number makes it not worth the time. Arguable, but OK. However, he could perform a quick adjustment to bring the accuracy back to something more reasonable and acceptable for his comparison. Note: Adjustment and regulation are not the same.

As a reference, my latest watch made by ARF purchased from Jtimehad numbers as follows. Freq: '28800', Accuracy '0 s/d', Amplitude '295', Beat error '0 m/s'

Not too shabby...

Nonetheless the video is interesting and worth watching even with the expected, and understandable bias.

Thanks for posting it!

[u/ffuhcu]

Unfortunately running a bit rougher than we’d expect with our reps but an interesting look nonetheless.

[u/SunCap54]

I need a UK based (London would be amazing) watchmaker to help me keep my reps in check... been holding off buying any new reps because I don’t know any.

[u/mdotmania]

His comment about the rep not being around in 23 years is bulls**t, I purchased a horrible Bell and Ross about 10 years ago from a market in Malaysia for $20 which of course I don't wear, but give it a shake and it works just the same as the day I bought it 🙄🙄🙄