Did Nvidia Lie? RTX 4070 Super vs RTX 3090: The Ultimate Comparison!!!

Nvidia has a history of flat out lying in their marketing slides when they announce a new series of gpus so when the 4070 super was announced and claimed faster than the RTX 3090 I instantly had a flashback to the original launch of the 40 series when I had to do a video talking about their claim that the 4090 was 2 to four times faster than a 3090 TI I titled the video RTX 490 and 480 The Good The Bad and The misleading and so basic I didn't mean to but I just realized I'm like picking my own nose that's gross anyway sorry uh way off topic here so what's going on here is basically Nvidia was factoring in frame generation as if it was raw performance when making a claim like that now I've talked about frame generation extensively in other videos it doesn't make sense to count it as raw performance it is a good feature and if you get a high enough base frame rate it can be a good way to double down on a high refresh rate monitor but you already need a good foundation of performance for it to really be worthwhile from a late latency and image quality perspective so it's not the same thing as raw performance so anyway I was curious when we made the claim faster than a 3090 for the 470 super this claim actually sounded more reasonable and when I was in the uh pre-briefing for this announcement for media the Nvidia rep did actually say this one is actually a raw performance truth and I was curious if that would hold up in my own testing especially if we looked at vram hungry games um and and so in my testing here we're going to look at the newest games we're going to uh look at them at all resolutions so 1080P 1440p and 4K with and without upscaling and with and without frame generation with and without Ray tracing path tracing all sorts of things all sorts of different game engines and let's figure out how the 4070 super does stack up against the 3090 again the 3090 is a 24 GB vram card 4070 supers only 12 so that's another interesting thing to take a look at let's go ahead roll the benchmarks and then I will jump in uh with my final thoughts at the end although I will mention quickly a lot of people look at my footage and they judge smoothness by the video footage you shouldn't do that judge it by the frame time graphs when you record a game that's not vsync locked at 60fps it doesn't look the same as it would on a variable refresh rate display uh it can look out of sync with the footage capture jutter screen tearing that type of thing so again use the frame time graph and the 1% lows to judge smoothness not the visual appear of the video footage let's roll the benchmarks we'll start off testing with Avatar frontiers of Pandora and at 1080p ultra settings we see basically a tie the but the 470 super is actually taking the lead by 3% in the averages and 4% in the 1% lows frame rates are good on both gpus at 92 and 89 on the averages and 74 versus 71 in the 1% lows but this game does use a lot of vram so what happens is we bump up the resolution well it's unclear whether it's just memory bandwidth or vram in fact actually more probably just the memory bandwidth it's still basically a tie but the 390 does technically take the lead by 2% at 63 versus 62 in the averages and 54 versus 53 in the 1% lows um the if you look at the memory allocation and usage on the 3090 it's right at about 12 so you know it's borderline but didn't seem to be causing uh a lot of issues now you can also use dlss at the Quality setting here and both gpus gain a lot of performance and now the 470 super regains the minor lead in what is essentially a tie and 95 versus 93 which is a 2% win in the averages although a more meaningful 7% win in the 1% lows although I really doubt you could tell which GPU we using and if you are actually just blind testing them but what if we drop down to high settings I was curious if you know if we had been kind of right on the vram borderline if this would help out the 4070 super at all but it's actually looking like it's still a win for the 3090 when we're at the native 1440p resolution it's a 4% win at 83 versus 80 in the averages and a 2% win in the 1% lows at 68 versus 67 again pretty much a tie what if you use dlss at the high settings well now both gpus are averaging well over 100 FPS we're at 150 and 114 respectively so it's really a tie although technically almost a little less than a 1% win for the 4070 super but the 1% lows are a massive 1% Advantage for the 3090 at 91 versus 90 so again both gpus are doing extremely well at high with dlss quality and it's a tie but what about 4K resolution where it's possible we're pushing up both both against the 12 GB of vram uh the 390 is certainly allocating more than 12 and then we also have memory band with advantages for the 3090 and that pushes its lead to 6% at 35 versus 33 7% and the 1% lows at 31 versus 29 so it certainly is a win for the 3090 but not by a lot and neither GPU would probably play at those settings if you enable dlss quality both gpus jump massively in performance and we're now seeing 57 versus 55 average with the advantage still for the 390 but it's dropped to a 4% Advantage the 3090 is still showing allocation of vram Beyond 12 GB but again the overall performance even in the 1% lows we're not seeing stutters is pretty much the same now what if we drop down to the high settings at 4K resolution but turned off upscaling at Native 4K High we are seeing a 7% Advantage for the 3090 and it is showing allocation of vram Beyond 12 GB however again the advantages 48 versus 45 7% win in the averages 2% in the 1% lows 42 versus 41 uh so not a particularly meaningful Advantage but it is Advantage 3090 if we kick on dlss quality at the high settings at 4K I think we're arriving more at these settings that people would probably want to actually use and we're now seeing a 6% win for the 3090 although both gpus are like I said more at frame rate targets that make sense 74 and 70 respectively Advantage 3090 and 62 versus 60 in the 1% lows Advantage 3090 vram allocation right at about 12 let's move on to Allen wake 2 first we'll try it out at the high preset the game does not have a preset Beyond High unless you turn on rracing and we will look at that uh but all individual settings could be turned Beyond this point but I stuck to the high preset at 1080p High we are seeing 89 versus 85 FPS Advantage 3090 but only by 5% in the 1% lows it's also a 5% Advantage at 62 versus 59 what if we move up to 1440p resolution now the 3090 extends its lead but only to 7% it's 64 versus 60 so both gpus capable of playing the game at 1440p high at Native resolution and the 1% lows are 47 versus 44 uh again a 7% Advantage for the 3090 in the 1% lows but but you could very well turn on dlss if you do that both gpus jump a lot in performance we're now seeing 94 versus 90 still Advantage 3090 but only by 4% and the 1% lows are 63 versus 61 that's a 3% Advantage for the 3090 although the uh the 40 series GPU can turn on dlss 3 frame generation while Nvidia has locked out the 30 series from that feature so feature set Advantage for the 40 70 super here if we move up to 4K resolution at Native 4K High settings we are now seeing a much more meaningful Advantage for the 3090 this is the first time I think I'd call something a clear win that you might actually notice it's a 16% Advantage for the 3090 but it's only 37 FPS versus 32 so I don't think these are the frame rates you'd actually be using although it is a 22% advantage in the 1% lows at 28 versus 23 I think more likely you kick on dlss quality now if you do that without frame generation the 4070 super can now hit 55 FPS but the 3090 hits 60 giving it a 9% Advantage so less meaningful of an advantage than we saw at Native resolution but still you know it's it's one of the bigger leads we've seen in the 1% lows we're seeing an 8% Advantage for the 3090 at 43 versus 40 but again the the 40 series GPU could use frame generation if we turn on the path tracing mode by kicking on RT to the high preset uh we interestingly now see the tables have turned the 4070 super is taking the lead although it's only 39 FPS versus 35 so 11% win for the 470 super and 7% and the 1% lows but uh not quite sure those are the frame rates that you're looking for you can enable dlss quality I don't love it at 1080p although I will say that dlss Ray reconstruction does help out a lot here uh and might make this um you know something a lot of people actually might want to use and without frame generation the 4070 super has a 70 uh 7% lead sorry at 59 versus 55 and a 5% lead in the 1% lows and we're at a decent base frame rate to frame generate off of now uh so uh you could certainly use that on the 4070 super if we move up to 1440p resolution at the again RTI High preset and with dlss quality enabled which looks good at at 1440p and honestly these gpus can't handle it without any dlss we're seeing 43 versus 40 FPS on a slow pace game like this you might play it these settings I don't know there's a lot of latency if you kick on frame generation here it's going over 100 milliseconds 10% lead and 1% lows for the 4070 super but uh what if we went to Performance mode upscaling I don't love this at 1440p if you look at the tree branches and things I think there's a lot of shimmering and loss of detail but it does get your frame rates up to 57 FPS on the 4070 super which is decent Baseline to frame generate off of uh the 390 hits 52 FPS that gives a 10% lead to the 470 super in the averages although only 3% in the 1% lows at 41 versus 40 what about trying to path Trace at 4K resolution even with dlss at the performance mode we're only looking at a 32 FPS average and 31 FPS average respectively still advantage to the 4070 super in the averages but honestly I don't think you'd use these settings cuz the 1% lows dip into the 20s and the the 3090 actually takes the lead there we're right up against 12 GB of vram so it's possible that's playing into it the frame time graphs a lot spikier on the 4070 super there's one one other game we can check out for path tracing here which is cyberpunk 2077 and at 1080p native resolution with the RT overdrive pret both gpus are kind of barely playable averaging 40 and 42 respectively although interestingly now the 3090 is taking the minor lead rather than the 4070 super which is the flip of what we saw with path tracing in Allen wake 2 although again we're kind of grasping at very small differences here if we kick on dlss quality to get us to actually good frame rates we're now tied in the averages at 76 and getting a 5% lead and the 1% lows for the 470 super uh although this is a de decent Baseline to frame generate off of and I again I don't love upscaling at 1080p those palm tree branches look a little shimmery to me but Ray reconstruction does put in a lot of work here it looks better than it did before we had that feature if we move up to 1440p resolution with rt overdrive mode and dlss at the Quality setting we're definitely playable at 51 and 52 FPS respectively uh 2% advantage to the 3090 they're tied at 43 and the 1% lows this is really borderline for using frame generation although the latency in this game overall is less than what we're seeing reported in Allen wake 2 so some people would probably find frame generation at these frame rates usable here and some people wouldn't you could go down to dlss Performance mode which does boost the averages on both gpus to 73 FPS without frame generation and the 4070 super takes a minor 5% lead at 61 versus 58 in the 1% lows we're definitely have enough uh headro for frame Generation Now although the palm tree branches looking pretty shimmery again in other words I'm not sure I'm in love with performance mode upscaling at 1440p resolution at 4K resolution performance mode upscaling can be acceptable uh and unfortunately it only gets our performance up to 39 and 40 respectively now the 3090 taking a 3% advantage that's only one FPS guys it's like margin of error and a 1 FPS advantage in the 1% lows at 30 versus 29 again I think this is probably too low of a base frame rate for frame generation for most people you know people seem to have different reactions to that if we move on to one of the most popular recent games on PC with balers Gate 3 at 1080p ultra settings this time they're basically tied again but I think now we can actually just blame CPU limitation neither GPU is fully utilized here if you look at the usage percentage and so basically what we learn is that act three of balers gate is CPU limited on high-end gpus even if you have a high-end CPU to parir it with uh if we move up to 1440p ultra settings we are still for the most part CPU limited um occasionally hitting the limits of the gpus and occasionally not so uh we do see a 12% advantage in the 1% lows where we see a few stutters as we round this corner on the 3090 sometimes that can just be kind of bad luck in the city area I found that this engine isn't perfectly consistent on its uh stutters on your benchmark passes um and if we move up to 4K Ultra we're now GPU limited uh and we can see it 7% Advantage for the 3090 and again at 4K resolution that tends to be more normal however the frame time graph on the 3090 did look a bit more stuttery at the beginning of the run and that's giving the 4070 super a a more noticeable advantage in the 1% lows at 60 FPS versus 49 let's move on to Call of Duty Modern Warfare 3 at 1080p basic settings um choosing those over the extreme preset for like you know it's a multiplayer game most people turn down settings now we're seeing probably the most impressive generational uplift that we've seen here the 40 series does a lot better in this game than the 30 series I have a feeling it's due to the increased L2 cache but anyway we're seeing a 29% Advantage for the 470 super although the 390 is still hitting 248 FPS average if we move up to 1440p resolution still at the basic settings we still see a big noticeable lead for the 470 super at by 18% in the averages however um you know that did dip a bit from what we saw at 1080p resolution so it does seem like as the resolution increases the generational Advantage for the 4070 super does decrease but it is still there if we move up to 4K resolution still at the basic preset we've wiped out most of that Advantage the 4070 super is now only 4% ahead although 9% in the 1% lows which is maybe a bit more meaningful but in general it's kind of really interesting to see that scaling I want uh like I said my theory in in this game is that the game likes cash size um increases which we did see with the 40 series uh cuz it liked amd's um gpus with the infinity cache a lot more than the 30 series gpus but anyway let's move on to Starfield at 1080p ultra settings we're seeing the gpus surprise surprise basically tied the 1% lows are tied at 60 and the averages are 85 and 82 giving a 4% lead to the 4070 super again it is pretty much a tie this one I don't think we can blame on CPU limitation as we can see the gpus is pushed right up near 99% most of the time now if we go up to 1440p ultra settings the 4070 super hit 69 nice and the 390 hit 66 giving the 4070 super a 5% lead in the averages which is not very noticeable and the 3090 takes a 6% lead in that in the 1% lows which is also not very noticeable at 53 versus 50 uh so basically they're performing about the same here uh I'd call this one a tie what if you wanted to kick on some dlss well now frame rates jump all the way up to 85 and 82 respectively giving the 4070 super a 4% not very noticeable advantage in the averages and a 2% 1 FPS Advantage at 62 versus 61 in the 1% lows the only real noticeable difference here I think is that the 40 series has access to dlss 3 frame generation in this game and the 3090 would have to rely on like modding an FSR 3 or something like that now what if we moved up to 4K resolution well as we have seen in some games I think the increased memory bandwidth not the vram because we're not going anywhere near 12 GB of vram here uh it helps out the 390 to take a 7% lead it's only 44 versus 41 although the 1% lows are a 12% Advantage at 37 versus 33 but honestly I don't really think this is how most people would choose to play the game given that we do have access to dlss so if we kick on dlss quality at 4K resolution frame rates now jump to 60 and 62 respectively the 3090 taking a 3% lead it's only 2 FPS I don't think you're going to notice it although the 1% lows are a more noticeable 10% Advantage at 53 versus 48 we're still pretty close in raw performance so having access to frame generation in this game does I think give the most meaningful differentiator between the two gpus in that game Resident Evil 4 remake at its maximum preset is one of the most Uh vram Hungry Games I've tested but despite that at least at 1080p Max settings the 4070 super does take the advantage by 7% in the averages although the 1% lows are tied at 121 and 122 so technically a little bit less than 1% Advantage for the 3090 that's just margin of error guys what if we move up to 1440p resolution well now we're basically tied uh with a 113 versus 111 11 average and 2% lead to the 470 super in the 1% lows it's 97 versus 98 which is a 1% lead for the 3090 the 3090 is reporting allocation Beyond 12 GB but it doesn't seem to be meaningfully impacting performance the frame time graph looks smooth 1% lows are tied what about 4K resolution at 4K resolution it is again either memory bandwidth or the vram or both but the 3090 does take a bit of a lead here although it's not dramatic it's 8% lead in the averages 10% in the 1% lows the averages are 71 versus 66 and the 1% lows are 64 versus 58 the frame time graph still looks very smooth on the 4070 super so it doesn't seem to be particularly meaningful here at least in this short test run now what if we move to Unreal Engine 5 the most demanding ui5 game I've tested is Lords of the fallen and a 1080p ultra settings both gpus are basically tied in the averag is at 74 and 73 1% advantage to the 470 super as we round this corner you'll see both gpus have frame time spikes as I think it's ue5 traversal stutter kicks in which I think has a bigger effect on the 1% lows in the actual GPU performance and it's 56 versus 51 in those 1% lows if we move up to 1440p ultra settings neither GPU can actually hold 60 FPS at Native resolution in my testing area here they're tied at 53 the 1% lows are also basically tied at 41 1 and 42 respectively again you'll notice spikes on the frame time graph as we round this corner it's very consistent behavior um so like I said I'm pretty sure it's kind of just loading into a new Zone in Unreal Engine 5 if we kick on dlss we'll notice that Unreal Engine 5 responds extremely well to upscaling having our frame rates jump from below 60 to all the way up to 83 and 80 respectively 4% Advantage for the 4070 super 1% lows are 59 and 52 Advantage 3090 again uh spikes on the frame time graph as we run around that corner they do seem to be a bit bigger spikes on the 470 super we're not hitting 12 GB of vram so I'm not sure we can really blame that maybe memory bandwidth or maybe it's just runto run variance anyway if we go up to 4K Ultra settings neither GPU is doing great at Native resolution it's 30fps versus 29 which is a 3% advantage to the 3090 the 1% lows are also a one 1 FPS Gap 25 versus 24 which is a 4% advantage to the 3090 but I don't think you'd play it that way you'd either turn down settings or upscaler both if we kick on dlss quality and leave it at alra settings we jump all the way to 53 and 52 FPS respectively 2% Advantage for the 4090 it's a tie guys and the 1% lows are also a tie 42 and 41 technically Advantage 4070 super there by 2% but there's not a whole lot in it I think that's enough benchmarks let's move into some final thoughts so did Nvidia lie what is the 470 super faster than the RTX 3090 and I think a more accurate answer would be they have very similar performance but let's go ahead and dig into my thoughts overall so if we jump into it do we see the 4070 super beat the 3090 in some situations yes yes we do if we scroll through the footage though I think what we'll notice is it's often time trading blows which one is ahead and uh you know sometimes certain ones can take a more noticeable lead and I think that could event for the 309s case that happens most frequently when you're at uh 4K native resolution where memory bandwidth is more of a concern as well as occasionally going right up against that 12 gbt of vram where it's possible the 4070 super would slow down a bit beyond just memory bandwidth by having to access system memory uh the biggest advantage AG I saw in the testing uh seemed to be in Allen wake's path tracing mode for the 4070 super uh where it did seem to take a a slightly more noticeable lead although it wasn't like uh commanding lead unless you count frame generation and then the other one that stood out was Call of Duty uh Call of Duty again my my personal theory is that the engine seems to really like a large amount of cach size uh which was my my theory on why the 40 series does a lot better than the 30 series and did a better job of catching up to where AMD used to you know smash the 30 series when it was 60 6000 versus you know 30 series AMD versus Nvidia and AMD has that large Infinity cache things like that so that's my pet theory on what's going on here but that's the biggest Advantage we were definitely seeing was like 1080p in Call Of Duty Modern Warfare 3 and then again you could look at the feature set differences uh like frame generation which certainly is a nice option to have in a lot of cases um but again I I wouldn't count that as raw performance because it's it's useful to smooth out uh uh the motion on a high refresh rate display once you already have a decent Baseline of performance now uh the only other really notable things I think it might be worth talking about here is the power draw because the 4070 super is basically tying the performance of the 3090 at just barely over 200 Watts where the 3090 is pushing around 350 Watts by the way both models uh I was testing here are founders Edition gpus so if any of you are like my 3090 boosts a lot higher or my 4070 super boosts a lot higher I'm running the founders editions of both gpus at their outof the-box settings um so that's what I'm testing here obviously there's Factory overclocked or manually overclocked models that would have differences in all of that anyway so overall uh what do I think of this claim I think depending on the exact set of games you tested it is possible that you could truly make that statement without factoring in frame generation but I don't think I would say it's overall just true and I think a generally better way of understanding this is the 4070 super performs a lot like an RTX 390 um in most situations the only uh big Advantage for the 40 70 super is the lower power draw and the uh availability of the dlss 3 frame generation and the big Advantage for the uh for for the 3090 would be the additional vram if you're running settings where that's meaningful also a bit more memory bandwidth at the high resolutions does seem to mean at 4K you're more frequently advantaged for the 3090 but it's not by a lot so I don't think there's a lot in it uh anyway I think that's kind of my summary of my thoughts on this situation what do you guys think I don't think people are necessarily thinking oh which one should I buy unless you're maybe considering a used 3090 or something like that um so again think about how much do you actually do you need that vram I guess if that's the case and what are the prices actually looking at because again the 4070 super is coming in actually available in stock at that uh $599.99 price point um which is at least good to see it holding that price so far um anyway it's not like the 3090 was offering the best value you know you know performance per dollar of the 30 series anyway but it is nice to see a now you know $600 class card at least able to tie it in performance for the most part uh which is pretty cool and the efficiency difference between the generations was was definitely a standout I uh huge thank you to uh viewers and subscribers and especially channel members who have clicked the join button uh to directly support the channel financially I've been this is the largest set of not only games and settings but also just the sheer number of gpus I've tested for this round of testing um as we go into next week if you're watching this at the time of filming like uh we'll be seeing the 4070 TI super so a ton of comparisons like this coming out for that as well as the 4080 super coming a week after that tons of comparisons with those I've benchmarked so many awesome uh comparison points but this has taken a massive amount of time so when I'm going through all of this testing having those channel members uh who have clicked the join but button to directly support uh you know it is very meaningful to me to see that support see people actually uh value what what what I'm doing here find that useful enough um now I totally understand a lot of people aren't in a financial position to uh to to to uh contribute financially to the channel that is totally okay and do not feel any pressure to do that but just huge thank you to people who have and I hope everyone has an amazing day I usually say excellent day has an excellent day

Channel: Daniel Owen

Views: 480,513

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Id: 5TPbEjhyn0s

Length: 27min 53sec (1673 seconds)

Published: Sat Jan 20 2024