Bad News BMW: Vanos 2A82/2A87

everyone welcome back to pine hollow auto diagnostics today we have a fancy german in the shop a 2008 bmw well bmw something 328 i think xi all wheel drive and again long story with this one customer got it real cheap it didn't run now it runs but said sometimes it doesn't like the idle and it's setting a p0012 trouble code which thing has to do with the variable valve timing so start this one from scratch plug in our launch scanner since it's good on european cars see what comes up got our key push into the little fob there [Music] there's engine on [Music] and turn this guy off place your bets now is this going to be easy or impossible that's the way bmws are you can ask keith defazio you know if it's a communication problem look for the water but in this case it's a drivability problem so we have to do some research but again start from scratch let's do a full health report unfamiliar vehicle just do automatically search okay 16 pin see how fast we can fly through this by the way has a hundred and fifty three thousand miles so not too bad for 2008 yep correct identification next all right here we go health report so launch is very fast on bmws it just breezes right through it and we're done wow fault report okay so this is the full report i usually just hit save right away all right here we go so we got two codes in history 2887 exhaust vanos mechanism to a 82 dme vanos intake all right and then transmission has no message from j b b f vehicle mode receiver dkg gs man that's all like greek or something abs history code there engine start starter operation so i think you might have had a bad starter on it instrument cluster power supply so it has been switched off so we're going for this vano stuff [Music] again remember those codes let's just look at live data go right into our engine control module again fault code we got two right there i wonder what happens if you hit a little magnifying glass cool so it brings up some youtube videos we'll make one so we'll add that to the list hey new level auto did keith post a video on this let's check it out yep keith is going to help us here okay you got a 2 000 i think 2009 okay very similar 2009 bmw x5 i got here it had a code 287 to apple 87 for the vanos being incorrect one of the things here i'm going back to the auto logic again because it's out and we're just rolling through the cars today so one of the things i want to point out here is how do you actually approach this car how do you approach this code if the car is not actually acting up as it right now showing no faults in there [Applause] a couple of things you want to do come in here look up your oil level let it sit there and read your oil level you might have to wait for that to read you're sorry to hear will actually sit there and tell you that it's actually going through its process and figuring out where it is the very first thing you do for any vanos valvetronic any kind of system like that at all you want to make sure that your oil level is full if it's not full you'll have a bigger issue the second thing that you'll want to do and let me shut this thing off real quick and i want to show you something because something that's commonly overlooked and people don't really pay much mind to it by the way this car is fixed already but keith already fixed it if you come in here and you start removing your oil filter carefully that's how you don't get it everywhere and your oil filter is laying behind and that little cage inside there that little stem that's inside there is no longer there you are going to have those vanos codes that oil pressure will bleed back off as the car is running [Music] right there which i can't really point you with anything let's see if i can get in there and point right over and pause this in my bay right now this thing will be getting a set of vanos solenoids on there simply because of the price that they are right from the oem they're cheap enough and i will pop them in there and verify that everything is okay that that high failure of an item that that's one of those moments in time where you can sit there and take an educated guess and probably be right ninety percent of the time so just figured i'd share that with you all right that was brilliant keith clear cut straight to the point oil level oil filter solenoids now this car has coats for both intake and exhaust so again i know uh the history is not known in terms of the maintenance um you can't really you know there's no dipstick you can't see what the oil looks like so i'll contact the customer we'll do an oil level check using the whatever the engine computer and check that oil filter and if that checks out then yeah it's getting solenoids the parts can boom but in this case if keith says it's okay that's what we're gonna do all right under the hood on the bmw let's take keith's advice do a visual inspection here so the vanos solenoids actuator solenoids are right on the front of the engine block and i can see that there's one new one up here and this one down here looks original now i think the owner said uh he replaced the intake cam solenoid up here so we have one new solenoid and then let's pop off this oil filter and take a look inside i actually have the right adapter surprisingly right tools make all the difference okay the oil looks fairly clean i'm gonna let that drain off a bit i don't know if we see any particulate matter in there or not i want to pop this filter out and see if it's an oem unit doesn't say anything oh made in china you guys see that it says napa pro select so that's a variable and let's see if this cap actually you know that o-ring on the tip is very important that it seals inside the housing this guy right here so i don't know if this pops off yes it does let's make sure that fits in there it seems to and this stuff looks all original so i'm not seeing too many problems here except for the the oil filter which you know that's not a good fit if these o-rings don't seal and that would be a problem but it seems like it fits nicely here and the top o-ring seems to hold as well okay so put that back in and next i want to warm up the car and make sure the oil level is good and again there's no dipstick here so we're gonna have to use the scanner and follow the manufacturer's procedure and how to check oil level then we'll clear the codes and take it for a test drive and try to make it act up look at some live data all right so before clearing codes i went into obd2 data just to check the freeze frame for these codes because if they're intermittent we want to see when how we can recreate these faults so the obd2 equivalent is the p0015b camshaft position timing over bank one and p0012 a camshaft position timing over bank one so those are the codes and if we read the freeze frame let's see 14 throttle 14 grams per second 55 load this is the 15 code commanded throttle actuator 13 closed loop ignition timing advance for cylinder number one minus 14 degrees [Music] fuel trims look okay zero miles per hour 16 seconds since engines start well that's interesting 71 degrees air intake temp what was so why is it saying engine coolant was 69 degrees so it was a cold start okay i want to check the oil level using the onboard computer so use this little toggle let's see here service info oil okay now i push this button and it just says okay um if that's as good as we're gonna get on an oil level check um i don't really like that i don't know if the scanner can be more accurate so we'll do some poking around and uh but not having a dipstick that's just silliness i want to check this oil level motor operating values and we have engine oil temperature engine oil fill level briefly only during engine operation after one minute engine oil level engine off set point let's just try those so it's measurement running i'm guessing it's doing its thing we can oil so it's doing its measurement right now we'll let it run for a little bit okay it says low okay max and it says oil level equals max so i guess it's happy all right test drive time front of the engine there's this weird plastic rattling noise it sounds it's coming right from the oil filter cap it's the weirdest thing you hear it you can feel it wait wait wait so that's a clue let's take it for a spin see what happens uh oh the rpms just went up and the check engine link came on very interesting on a hot start i mean a warm start i guess let's just check for codes thanos intake okay very interesting so the problem just happened again let's see if we can recreate it so so engine on clear fault memory yes okay no fault code stored and data stream i wonder if there's an oil pressure engine oil temperature ambient pressure idle speed smooth running values this is like misfires valvetronic so no there's no oil pressure reading let's see if anything weird happens to these vanos i'm gonna start it up data doesn't show anything weird i don't like that sound coming from the oil filter this oil pressure isn't proper we're going to have all kinds of vanos codes let's try again just shut it off and start it back up okay so you can see why they replaced the intake solenoid right but i really want to put an oem bmw filter and housing on there because that rattling sound at the oil filter has just the red flag so far the car seems to drive really nicely i mean it pulls the problem might only happen at low oil pressure at idle you know i got a stop sign and it's just not happy there or on a hot start so reading the codes again there they are i don't see a check engine light though one says history one says current hmm and the car seemed to drive you know just fine so let me shut this guy off keon let's clear fault memory again fault code no fault code and start up okay oh so didn't like something there intake back instantly instantly so let's do that one more time key on clear fault memory yes okay no fault code start up again boom i bet it came back so instant code especially on a hot start so let's get back to shop and i wish there was a way to check oil pressure on this thing but i really want to get an oem filter and housing in there i don't like that sound just to eliminate that variable because you can be running around doing the diagnostics here we can look up information on the code obviously but i have a feeling it's you know related to oil pressure and by the way on the second star if you don't clear the codes the check engine light will come on so this is a two trip code looks like the other thing i really don't like here is if you take a look at what the filter is catching guys there's metal particles in here shavings in all of that's not good and the oil looks like there's little sparkly things in it i think all right looking up some service info for the two a82 p0012 this is all bmw gives you vanos intake a camshaft position or that's it not helpful whatsoever um oil pressure engine oil pressure let's see what they have here so to check the oil pressure this is the oil pressure switch right here so if we can plumb in a gauge or transducer i think that would be very helpful so checking engine oil pressure on the n52 it just says disconnect the plug right here remove oil pressure switch screw in the special tool connect special tools just a gauge and it looks like okay so diagnosis system or pressure gauge either way so let's see if i have the right fittings and let's do an oil pressure check all right oil pressure check i got the oil sensor out and the only thing i could sort of adapt to this housing is the thread is not exactly right so i just kind of shoved it in there and regular old-school oil pressure gauge i had to use the adapter from my ac manifold kit that's the only thing that would remotely thread in there but let's give it a shot ready oh yeah put the key in [Music] wow that oil pressure is so slow to rise no wonder we're having issues here and yeah it's leaking pretty bad there so i don't want to run this for too long but 15 pounds okay so very slow oil pressure buildup let's try one more [Music] time okay and back down [Music] so i don't know in this case with those metal filings in there in the oil filter best we can do is put in an oem filter and some mobile one zero w40 do another check run it but other than that you know it's a mechanical problem if there's any engine wear those metal filings if some of the bearings are worn or they use the old wrong oil or something that's not a good sign this problem is not going to be fixed with solenoids or phasers or anything so my question is why doesn't the oil pressure go up as you rev the engine let's try again if it comes up to like 10 or 15 or there's like no oil pressure that's messed up so here's a technical specs oil pump with strainer and drive minimum oil pressure is 1.5 bar which is 14 times 1.5 which would be 21 control pressure engine at normal operating temperature four to six so four times 14 is almost 60 psi that's believable we're we're not breaking 20 psi even at a high idle or you know racing the engine a little bit engine at normal operating temperature this is crazy all right so i called up keith defazio on the support line and told him the story here what i found we have some metal shavings we have really low oil pressure that doesn't go up with engine rpms and we discussed it and he sent me some pictures over of what happens to these bmws let's take a look this is the craziest thing so you know 150 000 miles he said you know there's some oil leaks he gets on the tensioner or the tensioner brakes or something but the belt slips off while the car is running and gets sucked into the harmonic balancer right between the engine and the harmonic balancer into the engine seal and then these pieces of shredded belt get into the engine and clog up the oil pickup in the oil pan you would not think that's possible but apparently it happens pretty frequently i've actually seen one before if you remember the bmw x3 with the belt and the oils there was like the oil seal was destroyed that's what happened so it's real so what now you know he said if it still runs okay you can pull the oil pan off clean the strainer out do an oil change with the proper filter and cross your fingers however we see metal filings in the filter already this thing's been running at you know 15 pounds max oil pressure at high rpm uh oh not good so even if you do that you might still run for a while but the engine life is severely reduced um so what do you do what do you tell the customer obviously tell them what probably happened and he bought the car for cheap wonder why hmm so you can quote him on we can take the oil pan off remove the stuff do an oil change however the engine might still grenade soon after if the bearings are shot and the oil pressure might not come up that much and would i do this job honestly do not marry a bmw even though your wife might like it don't do it i looked up the you know the at least the labor times it's a 10 hour job and on a bmw you know you're going to need a pile of special tools you're going to i i don't want to marry this car so and then the engine grenades and the guy paid you you know thousands of dollars for the repair how are you going to feel i don't want to put you know i don't want to do that so we're going to give them the just charge him for the diagnostic you know a couple hours for diagnostic fee and i think just tell him hey man get this job done if you feel lucky or just cut your losses you know um it might not be worth it so i think we'll we'll leave it at that and that's it bmw i mean the engine seems like super smooth and it runs awesome but it's a i think it's on its deathbed which is sad so thanks a lot for watching and we'll see you next time bye-bye a little bonus footage the car cooled down a little bit when have you seen oil pressure go down as you rev the engine up it's about 4000 rpm amazing a quick update on the 2008 bmw 328 xi with the low oil pressure problem wow so the owner he took it back to the whatever little shop or dealership where he bought it from and said hey you guys sold me this car and the engine is no good so they you know arranged the deal he was going to pay for part of the engine they were going to put it in no charge and i think a month later he finally got the car back he said it runs fine no check engine light hopefully good oil pressure for a long time to come but that was a crazy case study i mean a check engine light usually doesn't mean any severe problem but in this case on this bmw scotty kilmer wasn't kidding as they aged they turned into money pits don't they yeah this one needed an engine so that's that hopefully it stays running for a good while longer and appreciate everyone watching stay tuned for the next one see you guys next time bye

Channel: Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics

Views: 135,253

Keywords: BMW, Vanos, codes, pressure, seal, filter, housing, engine, used, cheap, solenoid, camshaft, junk, belt, tensioner, failure, diagnostics, oil

Id: D6OgkZaT_K0

Length: 32min 45sec (1965 seconds)

Published: Sat Aug 15 2020