Answering Objections To Calvinism

over the past number of months we have been looking at what is called the doctrines of grace a lot of people do not like that terminology by the way obviously there are many people who disagree with this understanding that would say they believe in god's grace as well but that is terminology that i think is fitting because we seek to exalt god's grace and we seek to present the belief that god's grace is powerful it's not merely something that helps us to do something god's grace actually accomplishes what he intends that grace to accomplish when it comes to the salvation of his people grace is powerful not failure filled and unfortunately a lot of people do present the idea that god is trying trying trying trying but it was as gracious as he is he is failing over and over and over again we do not believe that that is how god's grace functions when he is seeking to glorify himself in the salvation of his people now i believe that the great power of reformed theology is found in the fact and certainly this was my ex my personal experience i think many of you can echo this is found the fact that it is derived from the consistent interpretation of the text of scripture there's something called hermeneutics hermeneutics is the mechanism of interpretation it is how you handle the scriptures consistently from beginning to end this involves we could spend the whole day and in fact many weeks discussing the issue of hermeneutics it is a proper field of study it is something that i can assure you all the elders seek to model for you as we preach and teach a proper understanding of hermeneutics we want to be consistent in our presentation our handling of the word of god if you do not have a consistent system of hermeneutics you cannot say thus saith the lord instead what you're doing is you're taking your thinking and your ideas and inserting them into scripture and then saying thus sayeth the lord and that's not an appropriate way of approaching things and so when we defend the fact there's only one true god the deity of christ the resurrection whatever central christian doctrine it might be we utilize a particular kind of interpretation and when you use that same kind of interpretation and apply it to the issue of the gospel and how people are saved you come to conclusions of the doctrines of grace about five years ago i was doing a debate with a southern baptist minister and professor in dallas and one of the things i asked him we were supposed to be debating romans 9 it ended up going every prayer where but romans 9 but one of the things that i asked him during the debate was do you believe you're using the same methodology of interpretation to come to conclusions you come to on this subject that you would utilize in looking at the deity of christ or the trinity or other issues like that and he was honest enough to go no and for me that was the debate that was it right there if you have to use a different method of interpretation to come up with your conclusions then you're not honestly dealing with the text and so we've presented between jeff and i literally hundreds of bible verses but lots of people can produce can present hundreds of bible verses the issue is are you being consistent in your handling of the text now we want to illustrate that i want to illustrate that today by looking at four texts that i have found are the most common text that are thrown back at us when we make any kind of statement about the sovereignty of god and salvation the power of his grace however else we might express things what are the four verses that people say well that can't be true because the bible says this some of you have seen a book that i wrote almost two decades ago now called the potter's freedom the potter's freedom was a response to the now late norman geisler he wasn't the late norman geisler then i can assure you but dr geisler passed away fairly recently but he had written a book called chosen but free which was his response to rc scrolls book chosen by god and in the process of reading that book numerous times very closely and very carefully dr geisler's book in preparation for my own i found a pattern a regular pattern in dr geisler's book whenever he would be looking at a verse that reformed people refer to an exegete to present the sovereignty of god he would say well it can't mean that because we already know that and then there were three verses i called them the big three there's an entire chapter in the paris freedom called the big three verses of chosen but free three verses sometimes you quote all of them sometimes just one sometimes too in a different set but he kept going back to these three verses that he felt made it absolutely impossible that reformed theology would be true we're going to look at all three today but right around the same time i had an encounter with also this is interesting i hadn't thought about this the now late dave hunt maybe debating me is not a good idea now that i'm thinking about it um not not out of malice or anything but um both dave and and norm have have gone on to find out whether their exegesis was consistent or not and so if dave hunt and i uh did a radio program how many of you are old enough to have heard the radio program that dave hunt and i did on kpxq in phoenix when i filled in for marty minto is there anyone in here who heard that no one i feel like moses wow okay well it's still out there it's online i think we have it on sermon audio someplace it was in 2000 if i recall correctly 2000 2001 something like that [Music] and there's one verse that dave hunt now dave hunt used the big three as well but there's one verse that dave hunt feels is absolutely central to this issue as well and so i took the big three from norman geisler and the one from dave hunt in my experience these are the ones certainly there are others we could go to but these are the most common verses that are going to be thrown back at you we need to understand what these verses are saying the first one most of you don't even need to look up in your bible because it is probably the first verse if you were raised in a christian family as i was that you ever memorized unless you're in the durban household that's james 2 20. you don't want to go there because they're always dealing with the mormons but john chapter 3 verse 16. yes john 3 16. who could ever argue with john 3 16. i mean isn't it clear and here's something to remember my friends some of the worst interpretation you will find you will find on the basis of verses that everybody thinks they already know what it means so in other words the more popular the verse and you've heard it preached on over and over and over again you'll find some of the worst theology because people are afraid to even think about well could my old pastor be wrong about that traditions die hard so most of us have john 3 16 memorized right do we know what the context is uh yeah that nicodemus guy that's right he was a short guy in the tree no that's zacchaeus different guy different guy nicodemus jesus conversation leader of the jewish people what does it mean to be born again what does that mean now if you have a printed edition well it's the same thing on your your phone too we're not sure exactly where the conversation between jesus and nicodemus ends and john's commentary or explanation begins and hopefully you realize that whether you've got black letters or red letters is an editorial decision the original manuscripts did not have black and red letters in fact those were introduced sometime about ancient times like about the 1800s somewhere around and there so not that long ago we're not sure exactly where that breaks off and john's commentary begins but you remember that jesus did raise up the issue of moses raising the serpent in the wilderness remember and anyone who looked at that serpent would be saved and so we go just a few verses back to verse 14. and just as moses raised up the serpent in the wilderness in the same way it is necessary for the son of man to be lifted up and we think of lifting up as in well in worship we lift up jesus no that's not what it's about lift it up as on the cross lifted up in sacrifice it is necessary the son of man to be lifted up in order that everyone believing in him might have eternal life now immediately we need to do a little original language here don't tune out it's important hear me there are different ways of translating the greek language into the english language the greek language in many ways is more expressive or specific than the english language but we have more words in the english language because we've stolen them from everybody else basically and so there some translations will say in order that whoever believes in him or whosoever believes in him might have eternal life and then verse 16 has the same phraseology for in this way god loved the world in that he gave his unique son in order that and here's the exact same phrase everyone believing in him might not perish but have eternal life now key issue is you've all heard the sermons i've heard them too oh some of the big southern baptist preachers focus on the translation so that who so ever believes in him will not perish but have eternal life i remember one of the big names in the southern baps convention his big anti-calvinism sermon was whoso ever and man could he belt that out and just impress upon you whosoever and the idea that is communicated is no election no choice on god's part everybody can do this without any type of supernatural intervention or action on god's part now we've spent weeks going through ephesians 1 and romans 9 and john 6 and we've we've gone through all this and you can go to john chapter 6 in john chapter 8 in john chapter 10 in john chapter 17 and there's all this stuff about election and choice and all the rest of these things so is the bible contradicting itself no but it is contradicting the tradition being read into the english word whosoever and there's the issue because the literal rendering of the greek pas ha pisteuon every believing so the point is the reason it's translated whosoever is that whoever believes there's no word here that is talking about everybody whosoever has a certain capacity that's not there the literal rendering is every believing one but the point is there is no such thing as a true believer who will not find jesus to be a perfect savior it's not addressing who can believe it's not addressing who has true faith john does address that jesus does in the things he's teaching things he'll get into in john chapter 6 but here the simple point in verse 15 is why will the son of man be lifted up in order that everyone believing in him remember the one believing the serpent being raised up was healed so the son of man must be lifted up in order that everyone believing in him would have eternal life now if your translation says might sometimes people go well see that's a that's a doubtful thing it it it might it might not no in the greek language you have something called the indicative and then you have the subjunctive this is a subjunctive but that's how the greek expresses purpose or result the reason that god has set it up this way is so that the person who believes in the son will have eternal life and then 16 is really just an expansion of verse 15. for this is how god loved ah but here's the question the world the world the world has to be every single individual right that's what world means and you calvinist you keep changing the bible you just don't like what it says world always means every human being which is why this same writer in 1st john chapter 2 says love not the world right nor the things in the world the world's passing away if you love the things the world the love of the father is not in you oh well no that's a different verse right it is a different verse but the same author uses this word cosmos you've heard it cosmos but in greek cosmos john minimally uses it in 10 different ways maybe as many as 14 different ways in his gospel and you have to look at each one to understand where in that range of meaning the author intends us to settle for now god demonstrates his love for the world in that he sent his unique son in order that everyone believing in him might not perish but have eternal life now folks there is specificity in the text who receives eternal life every single person in the world no thank you i think someone said probably saying no to mommy who was taking something away but i appreciate the the joining in there no there is specificity the one who receives eternal life is the one who believes in the son that's the one who does not perish so how can you interpret the first part of the verse god shows his love for every single human being in the world by saving a particular group of them it's not talking about every single person in the world it is talking about all the world of jews and gentiles because anyone who believes in him will have eternal life not just a jewish messiah not just a gentile messiah anyone who believes has eternal life 4 verse 17 god did not send the son into the world to judge the world but in order that the world might be saved through him so is everyone going to be saved if not then this world is talking about kinds of people not every single individual the one believing in him will not be judged the one not being not believing in him has been judged already because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten or the unique son of god so here's the point world in this context is not to be taken as individuals and whosoever is an english translation of the phrase everyone believing and we believe that everyone believing will find jesus to be a powerful savior the question is who's going to believe the question is who can believe who can believe in the son the one drawn by the father who will hear the words of the son the one who belongs to god for whom does jesus intercede in john chapter 17 the ones that god has given him what out of the world consistency in interpretation absolutely vitally important here's the problem your friend who throws john 3 16 back at you is probably not going to listen past about the first three sentences of what you just said unless you challenge them to think it through once if someone's belief in john 3 16 is primarily based upon tradition they don't want to be challenged as to the consistency of their interpretation of their tradition they can become very emotional and so very often you need to find a way of dialing that down before you can get anywhere and being able to explain to someone what's actually going on in this particular text okay john chapter three i've got four of them i've got to get to i'd love to spend more time in each one but turn with me back to the gospel of matthew yes we have seen the gospel of matthew before here at apologia and i'm wondering personally since we're done with philippians now we're done with the doctrines of grace i'm not sure where jeff is but is we're not done with matthew 24 yet there are still some verses left so i'm sort of wondering you know will jeff will jeff's bible just automatically open to matthew chapter 24 is really what i'm sort of wondering we're not going to matthew chapter 24. we're going to matthew 23. yeah we spent a lot of time there didn't we we did matthew chapter 23 verse 37 jerusalem jerusalem the one killing the prophets and stoning those sent to her how often i desired to gather together your children as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings but you were not willing you see god wanted to but it's up to man's will god wants to but man's will is in final control there it is you have to believe it matthew 23 37. now when we hear this now it's fascinating to me i can't tell you how many times i have heard people misquote this verse and it wasn't just arminians god bless him we love him but i even heard rc once misquote this verse it's because he was always debating them arminians i guess but even he did you know what they miss out here's how it'll get quoted jerusalem jerusalem you who killed the prophets in stone those were sent to you how often i would have gathered you under my wings but you were not willing it's not what it says is it it's not what it says here's the key what is matthew chapter 23 matthew chapter 23 is one of the most scathing judgment texts in all of the new testament read it the meek and mild jesus the sort of 1960s hippie version carrying the lamb guy you can't recognize him in matthew chapter 23. scribes pharisees hypocrites whitewashed tombs and then right after 2337 behold your house is left to you desolate judgment is coming judgment is coming that's what matthew chapter 23 is about matthew 23 37 is part of the judgment message that jesus gives to the jewish people he says jerusalem what is jerusalem jerusalem is the capital jerusalem is the seat of the leaders of the jewish people and so here you have a representation of the leadership of the jewish people the ones who killed the prophets just before this notice something up in verse 35. in verse 35 you have this weird discussion this weird mention jesus says you need to realize the blood of righteous abel to the blood of zechariah the son of verikaya who was slain between the the altar and the place of incense literally will be held against this people now we know about abel we're not so familiar with zechariah son of barikaya that story is actually found in second chronicles which is why we're not quite as familiar with it as we are genesis because when we do our yearly reading program we make it through genesis repeatedly second chronicles not so much normally leviticus wipes us out long before we get to second chronicles but here's the point here's something you need to remember the jewish canon was not in the same order as we have in our english bibles it wasn't in the same order for example the 12 minor prophets are all one book for them the last book of the jewish canon his second chronicles that's the last book so what was jesus saying all the blood of the prophets the way we would say it would be from genesis to revelation will be held against you and every jewish person hearing that knew exactly what he was saying knew exactly what he was saying all of scripture now we know that for the jews that means they're not holding what we call the deuterocanonical or apocryphal books because they they came after second chronicles they were never part of the jewish the jewish candidate just something to keep in mind something that is important to remember so the jewish leaders are being addressed here and jesus says they are the ones who killed the prophets stoned those that were sent to her that is to jerusalem how often would i have gathered tateknasu your children together who's that well what he's talking about here is you're the jewish leaders you're the ones that they're looking to you're the the priests and the high priests and the scribes and and the people that are opening the law in the synagogue how often would i have gathered your children those who follow you together but you would not not they would not and see the whole use of matthew 23 37 by norman geisler and by everyone else who cites it is that the people that god wanted to gather were the people who said no they would not the word thelo is used at the end of the verse and you would not you will not so see there's man's free will right there but if you look carefully you would not is the jewish leaders not the ones jesus is trying to gather the point here is this is a sentence of judgment upon the jewish leaders who literally stood in the way of the ministry of the word of god to the jewish people themselves by the way that they interpreted it by the way that they hid it by the way that they lived in such a way as to empty it of its power they stood in the way of the very ministry of god and that leads to behold your house you leaders you think you're over the household your house is left to you desolate judgment will come upon you that's what matthew 23 37 is about it's not talking about man's free will and god trying to do something and man man's able to this is a judgment passage and these jewish leaders will be held accountable for the fact that they stood in the way of that accomplishment okay john 3 16 matthew 23 37 we're doing good we're doing good turn with me to second peter ii peter now as you know there have been some um shall we say controversies down through the history of the church concerning certain issues regarding canonization and just so you're aware of the fact if you go to a christian bookstore and buy a commentary it is very very common for people to say that it is impossible that peter wrote both first and second peter and they will say the reason for this is anyone who can read the greek language the two are written in completely different styles and on that point they are exactly right they are there is no one who can who would confuse first ii peter as being written by the same person if if it was peter who sat down and wrote in coin koine greek but he did he dictated these letters probably dictated them in aramaic and the greek speaking scribes that he used had different styles in how they then rendered that into greek now do what you wish with what that means remember when scripture says it is inspired it is the scripture that is the anustas not the writer who is they honest us and so you can have differing styles and still have exactly what god wants you to have but the point is you'll hear it very often well you know ii peter couldn't have been written by peter and blah blah blah blah blah there are also a lot of parallels between second peter and jude that are very very interesting to look into we don't have time for that what we do have to look at is the fact that this is the section not about salvation have you noticed that you know john 3 is about salvation matthew 23 is about judgment this is about the second coming of christ this is a section about the promise of his coming and the fact there will be mockers who are going to come where is the promise of his coming why has it taken so long and of course this is where you have the second peter 3 8 which has provided every person who has ever tried to come up with a date for the second coming of christ with exactly what they needed a days of the thousand years a thousand years is a day and therefore i can make the word day and year in old testament prophecy and new testament prophecy mean whatever i want it to mean and make lots of money in the process and people have done that down through the years the believe me church history is filled with failed prophecies of people who simply refuse to hear jesus when he said of that day and the hour no one knows for some reason that's their most unpopular verse they just skipped that one they probably wish that it was a textual variant but it's not so it is in that context then that we have peter saying the lord is not slow concerning the promise as some people count slowness but is patient long-suffering toward you toward you not wishing that any perish but all come to repentance and so obviously the idea is well see right there god doesn't want anyone to perish he wants everybody to to come to repentance and so all this election stuff is false and and there's there's no concept to it now of course that raises all sorts of issues in regards to the nature of the love of god and the intentionality of god and all these things but my question is what does ii peter 3 9 actually state what is the argument that is being made here because he's not talking about salvation this is all about the promise of the coming uh people mocking it uh but instead i mean the very the very next words is that the day the lord comes as a thief in the night which then obviously um you know well it's literally as a thief i think some manuscripts go with the knight but which then causes those of you as old as me to immediately shift into oh no not that movie again and only five of you laughed because the rest of you have never been forced to watch a thief in the night i saw one person that was that voluntary the arm going up there or was that a twitch uh prior twitch yeah because because if you were forced to watch did you know how many of you don't have never heard of a thief in the night oh my goodness okay luke dude we need to we need to have a a a thief in the night lock-in you all know what a walk-in is right where you stay overnight and you're you know and crazy zany things happen and things like that but we need to have a thief in the night marathon lock-in i'm thinking that would be really cool what do you what do you think luke you good on that i've got okay the bear says good so we're on um the single most rented christian videotape in history in history called the thief in the night you eventually watched it didn't you summer no no eric you've seen it no vhs wow amazing you've got to go watch it because it the one the thing that gets everybody was this guy's mowing his lawn and then the rapture happens and the and the the camera pans back to the lawnmower just sitting there and man people freak out and teenagers man they're repenting right and left because they just figured that i don't want to be the guy behind you know that's left behind you've heard the left behind series right oh now yeah okay all right all right so this is where it came from i mean this is the terminology right here so that's what the topic is it's not talking about free will or anything like that at all that's not what's talking about but what does it mean that god is patient toward you not wishing or willing that any should perish but all come to repentance well we need a context who is being addressed well what's the first verse of chapter 3. it's addressed to the beloved he's addressing the beloved and if you follow it all the way back to the beginning of the epistle who is it written to those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours this is being written to christians that's the audience because you see what happens is when people just simply quote ii peter 3 9 without a context here's what happens you read an external idea into it that then determines its meaning so when it says he is patient toward you nobody stops to go who's the you the assumption is it's anybody reading this text it's for everybody even though ii peter is written to believers and there's nothing in chapter 3 that changes this you follow the pronouns from the beginning of the chapter to the end it's consistent it's consistent so when it says patient toward you not wishing for any to perish but for all all is a part of whom the you what's the assumption whenever ii peter 3 9 is quoted by people that the all everybody all humanity that's not what the context is so what's he saying well think about it folks this was written over 1900 years ago and here we sit speaking a different language on a different continent gathered together in the name of christ worshiping his name we're going to have the lord's supper here in a while the church continues on christ is building his people what if god had determined to end it all 1900 years ago what about you what about me he didn't because what's the promise abraham going to bless the nations and your inheritance will be like what sand the sea think of how many of the elect have been drawn into relationship with jesus christ over the past 1900 years there is the patience he's patient toward you not willing that any should perish that's the same word jesus used in john chapter 10 when he said none of my sheep that are in my hand will ever what perish will ever perish why are you in christ today because god has patiently been working his plan for all this time and he continues to draw his elect people unto himself he is not willing that any of them perish but they all come to repentance repentance is a gift of god repentance involves the work of the spirit of god changing the heart of man the text is perfectly consistent as long as you don't read into it the presuppositions that come with how it is normally quoted outside of its context let it say what it says let it say what it says okay so we've done john 3 16 and we've done two of the big three so what is the last of the big three is what you're all wondering and it is found in first timothy chapter two first timothy chapter 2. first timothy chapter 2 verse 4. well we can go ahead in verse three this is good and acceptable in the sight or before god our savior who wishes all men to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth well there it is god wishes for all men to be saved to come to a knowledge with you there's no election there's no choice he's trying to save everyone equally if you don't believe that then you don't believe what the bible is saying right well once again the question is what would timothy have understood these words to me because he was the one that paul wrote to right so what would timothy have understood these words to mean now again this could be done over the course of an entire sermon but i will be brief and if you want more in-depth discussion as i said there's an entire chapter in the potter's potter's freedom that goes into a number of other texts from paul that address the same issue but i want to do this in such a way that you're sitting in a in a plane and you're talking to somebody uh which can't do right now because everyone's got a mask on and no one can understand what anybody's saying through a mask anyways but back in the olden days when you could actually see people talk to people communicate that kind of neat fun stuff which we can hope and pray will someday happen again in the future but you're in a conversation and you want the to be able to open the bible with them and show them so they can take something with them and and see this at another point go back to the beginning of the chapter therefore first of all i exhort that prayers prayers and intercessions or entreaties be made with thanksgiving who pair pontone on throwpone in behalf of all men now we are western thinkers we think in concrete little packets the new testament was not written by western thinkers and you'll notice that when the apostle says in behalf of all men our temptation is to go that means and this used to be a good illustration it's not anymore because none of us have these anymore you know you're getting old when your illustrations were based upon physical items that no longer exist in the universe but the illustration i used to use is something called a phone book phone book now phone books were things that the power team used to rip in half to show how strong they were anyone remember the power team okay i got got a few 30 40 year olds in there hey power team yeah i knew one of the guys on the power team great guy eddie dalcore good guy um he was called the gripper but i won't go into any of that right now anyway a phone book obviously you had the white pages and yellow pages remember the white pages on yellow pages i remember them very very well this was google before there was a computer all right this was how you found people and things and services and everything else is you looked it up in the yellow pages for businesses and in the white pages that's where everybody's phone number was yes you once actually wanted everyone to have your phone number the frightening thing to realize how very very trusting we were in those days but the cool thing was your phone couldn't go more than 12 feet away from the wall anyways so you could like leave and it would be okay and if you had to make a phone call you found something called a phone booth you young people are going how did you people survive bags at it well we did and we flourished we really did anyway so the illustration i would use is is paul really saying to timothy timothy you need to take the phone book for ephesus now by the way i do happen to know that they would not have had a phone book in ephesus in the first century i do get that it's just an illustration all right but was he saying timothy take the phone book for ephesus and start with the alphas and start praying all the way through the omegas is that what he was saying no because the very next phrase defines for us what he means by in behalf of all men in behalf of kings and all those having authority now he uses the exact same greek forms here so he's telling us i'm defining these things for you what is in behalf of kings and all of those those are kinds of men those are kinds of people and when he says pray for all men what he's saying is there's a temptation on the part of christians to not pray for the people that are picking on us that are persecuting us and the church was already receiving persecution then by people with power people in the government and it was going to get a whole lot worse as time went on under the romans and so this is a generic use timothy pray for all men including kings and those having authority why so that we can live a life of godliness and peace so pray for the leaders you're not necessarily praying that they'll get more power and more money you may well be praying protect us from them but don't forget about them pray that they'll be converted pray they will submit and bow the knee to jesus that's the greatest thing that can happen right but pray for all kinds of men kings and those having authority we want to live godly lives that's what we need to do this is good and acceptable in the sight of god our savior who now let's be consistent desires to save all kinds of men and that all kinds of men come to knowledge of the truth he wants to save kings really he wants to he wants to save he wants to save democratic senators really can he do that is he that powerful i know he created the universe but saving chuck schumer yes he can and the very fact that we laugh about shows we need this exhortation doesn't it oh yeah very much so but someone might say oh i think you're stretching it let's continue on verses five and six you may notice in your bible depending on your translation is might be set apart as poetry some bibles will some bibles won't anybody have it set apart as poetry in your translation okay there's at least one couple all right it is in the greek text this is probably either an early creedal statement or a fragment from an early hymn of the church i love when we run across stuff like this i really do four there is one god and one mediator between god and men same word that's used up above about men between god and men the man christ jesus who gave himself a ransom an anti-lutron a ransom who pair pontone in behalf of all a testimony literally in its own time or at the proper time and then paul says he has been made an apostle and a a preacher of this gospel he speaks the truth he does not lie a teacher of the ethnone the gentiles in faith and truth now here is the question that i always ask my friends who are using this text as a means of trying to overthrow the biblical testimony to election and predestination in scripture all right you want us you want to ignore the generic use of kinds of men that the text itself contains and you want to say that verse 4 is actually saying who desires to save every single individual human being and for every single individual human being to come to a knowledge of the truth all right then you need to be consistent for there is one god and one mediator between the one god and what every single human individual the man christ jesus who gave himself a ransom in behalf of every single human being the testimony given at the proper time that's how you have to be consistent you have to be consistent and here's the problem that raises and this is a problem that i'm just going to be honest with you folks 99 percent of evangelicals in the united states have never been challenged to think about this because the vast majority of evangelicals united states are canonically challenged canonically challenged you've heard me say it before most of our fellow believers have never read leviticus 16 or if they did they've already forgotten it they don't do that old testament stuff real well and so when they read something about a mediator they're really not thinking about high priests and offerings and all the rest that stuff which is what paul has in mind paul understands intercession romans chapter 8 hebrews and so they've never been challenged to think through the question for whom does christ intercede for whom is he the mediator but think about that for a second for whom is christ interceding well you and i already know if he's following that pattern of the great high priest then the offering the sacrifice the blood is taken into the holy place and sprinkled on the altar so the intercession the mediation is for the same people for whom the sacrifice was made so you're stuck with one of two possibilities the way they want to go is jesus is in jesus dies for every single individual and jesus intercedes for every single individual and what then would be the logical outcome of that every single individual will be saved but to avoid that because they know the bible doesn't teach that this same apostle talks about the destruction of the godless and it doesn't teach universalism so they've got to break the chain someplace so what you do is you break the chain by saying that jesus can die in behalf of someone and then he can intercede in behalf of someone and the father can try to save and the son can try to save and the spirit can try to save but it's all up to man and so all these passages about willing desiring yeah god really wants to do it but man he's bummed all the time he's bummed all the time i mean think about it just just think about after the death burial resurrection of jesus how many people died in far-flung lands before any missionary ever got there and god wanted to save him right and i guess god wanted to save the the the canaanite high priests that he never sent a prophet to right and i guess he's just going to be eternally bummed by how he set all this up really that's that's how you read the new testament no no this same apostle is the one who just in passing said he endures all things for what for the sake of god's elect that's what kept him going he knew there was an elect people he didn't know who they were but he put up with the beatings and the imprisonments the rejections i endure all things the sake of god's elect because he has his elect the father has ordained their salvation the son has died to perfect their salvation the spirit applies at the time god ordains that work of christ and christ will never lose one of those sheep so here's the question one god one mediator between god and man the man christ jesus for whom is christ interceding he is interceding for the elect of god we saw it in romans 8 just a few weeks ago we walked through the text same author you think he hadn't communicated that truth timothy of course he had same author so for whom does christ intercede who is he mediating for and to say he's mediating for all those who are already experiencing the wrath of god is to introduce fundamental disconnections and disharmony in the godhead itself now have most of our friends ever thought that through no of course not when you present it might they become somewhat emotionally challenged by your presenting it to them yes and therefore our attitude is everything our attitude is everything what do i mean well you can be the type of calvinist who gets out your first timothy chapter two sword and you have been honing it all week you've got it sharp and ready to go just like pastor jeff has all those swords hanging in every single room in his home just ready to ninja you he really got upset with me when i i brought i brought a ninja sword remember when he and i did that little video thing and i was like be careful with that jeff it's sharp and he's like please i'm a ninja come on i can swing this i can shave with this with my eyes closed that's what you were saying to yourself was it yeah he's sitting on yep i can i can that's how you do your beard is it it's done it's perfect yeah so you can be the kind of calvinist who brings out your first timothy two sword and you find yourself an unsuspecting armenian and they go ahead and and as soon as they quote first timothy 2 4 you're like [Music] oh really and you lead them through there and with the final thrust right through the heart and then you leave it there sort of like maximus you know and go so how about that mr armenian right no one of you has ever done that have you never done that on facebook anything like that no no you see if you present it in that way and you say so tell me is jesus interceding for them huh tell me come on they'll come up with an answer and they'll probably go to their death defending it no matter how stupid it is you've done them no favors in fact you've probably hardened them to your position obviously what you need to do is to say now if you've never thought about this before just just think with me for a moment think about jesus interceding for us and in romans 8 it says because he intercedes in hebrews 7 romans 8 jesus's intercession means he can save perfectly the father and the son can you imagine the father and the son agreed on accomplishing this and anything in the universe stopping that from happening i mean isn't this glorious this is the whole foundation of our peace with god so think about it for a second is this really what is really being said in first timothy chapter 2 and leave it as something that they can think about that they can consider the spirit of god can use they can read through john 6 and go wow it sounds like the same thing and then they read through john 8 there it is again and then they read the john 10. oh goodness this is happening everywhere and everywhere they turn it's everywhere let the spirit of god do it don't get in the way don't get in the way leave that sword where it needs to be and it's not buried in the armenians chest either leave that sword where it needs to be these are all beautiful texts we're not trying to get around them never let yourself adopt the idea that because you keep running into a text that's used as a well as jeff put it a chestnut as a as an objection that you stop loving that text that's really easy to do james 2 4 2 14 through 20. anybody who goes out witnesses to the mormons oh goodness here comes james again i don't want to have to oh this is the third time tonight i've had to explain this and you can get tired of it no james 2 is still the very word of god don't let these verses become enemies they're actually friends especially if we handle them a right and can use them to then redirect them to entire sections of scripture they're specifically talking about the subject at hand if you notice it's always almost always some passing phrase that is being interpreted well it must mean this if god wants everyone to be saved it must mean this instead of going to the text that have entire chapters on the subject you go to a passing phrase that's one of the clear indications of tradition and traditionalism and that's what we're dealing with when we deal with man's absolute desire to make sure that we control salvation not god we control it that's very essence of human religion and so hopefully that's been helpful to you in dealing with these particular texts uh next week then pastor jeff will be talking about more of the philosophical especially the emotional ones i mean how if any of you have ever seen the debate that i did with george bryson at a very large vineyard church over in los angeles years ago i think it was 01 or something like that oh the emotional ones this man over here is telling you that your loved ones may not be able to be saved because they've been chosen for damnation by god that's the kind of thing that jeff will easily answer next week for you no pressure [Laughter] we want you to have good responses because we get the objections we understand we want to want to answer them accurately in light of the word of god let's pray together our heavenly father we do thank you for this time to look into your word and even though it has been brief we ask that you would make us to be good students of your word to handle your word a right in context so that we can share that with others and by your spirit you can edify the saints challenge the saints glorify yourself in the consistency and beauty of the gospel we thank you for this time be with us now especially as we go to the table that we may remember the beauty of what you have done for us in christ jesus we pray in his name amen

Channel: Apologia Studios

Views: 40,887

Rating: 4.7891374 out of 5

Keywords: jeff durbin, apologia studios, apologia church, james white debate, james white calvinism, james white george bryson, james white dave hunt, james white leighton flowers, calvinism debate, calvinist movie, calvinism refuted, soteriology 101, leighton flowers debate, r.c. sproul calvinism, five points of calvinism, doctrines of grace, what is calvinism, is calvinism true, calvinist vs arminian debate, calvinist debate

Id: kx551k78YPs

Length: 62min 56sec (3776 seconds)

Published: Mon Sep 14 2020

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