AMD Ryzen 9 7950X3D Review

Good Friday welcome to the Friday Tom's Hardware show we are here finally to talk about the ryzen 97950x3d with Paul he's done some additional benchmarking over the last few days uh nothing super critical but he's been a busy man that's right yes always around these ndas and hopefully he won't have to run off and deal with a school lockdown this show yes all right so uh what do we want to say let's let's get right into it we've got the 7950x3d beauteous uh in the new am5 socket differences between this and the regular 7950x Paul Walk us through it so the big thing here is is AMD is using their 3db cash technology which is where they stack a additional chiplet of L3 cash on top of the processor the uh 7950x 3D comes with two ccds and one of those has some cash stop stacked on top of that now AMD has used this technology to great effect with its 5800 X 3D its previous gym or first gen rather uh x3d processor and as we know it boosts games tremendously in games that benefit from having a you know a lot more cash and there are some trade-offs especially in application performance but with amds this time around with the 7950x 3D there's a little bit of complexity because instead of having just one chiplet they have two and only one has the cash so they need to make sure that the games land on that cash triplet and I mean so far it looks like it's actually a really good implementation of it that it does it though there are some lingering questions about the impacts of of how they're doing this and how this impacts multi you know performance and multitasking but by and large for the most part in our observations especially if you're just gaming and you're focused on gaming this is absolutely the fastest chip that money can buy of course that will vary with title but we'll get into that a little bit so there's a white list of games that are supposed to run on the Stacked cash chiplet right correct so do we have a do we have like a list of what's in the white list so how this works is is AMD is using the white list from Xbox the Xbox game bar that is a component of Windows it detects games and it's designed to detect games and then it toggles on and off what is called game mode or it I mean it works with game mode excuse me once you have game mode on then what happens is is the Xbox game bar detects the games automatically when you're using them Intel AMD has a new driver a new chipset driver and a bunch of different Services they're like three of them that will run on your computer in the background they're all very super duper lightweight and what they do is they hook into the game bars list is there's a kgl it's called a known good list of games and then whenever that the Xbox bar detects that it turns on game mode when game mode comes on bam amd's chipset driver uses that information to do any number of different things what it's going to do is it's going to say okay this this uh you know this game is going to run on this chiplet okay and then depending upon the power mode you're in if you're using amd's balanced mode not only is the game is it going to try to constrict that game to that chiplet it will also Park the cores on the other chiplet and this by thereby by doing that by parking the course they're essentially shutting off half the processor and as we've seen with a bunch of amd's previous gen multi uh you know multi-dye chips like threadripper they've had real problems when there's a whole bunch of games uh or all of the chiplets are enabled so by turning it off it boosts performance even further and that is how they do it now they say that some games will be locked to the the other chiplet base of like if it prefers frequency but as far as I can tell right now all of the games are at least the ones that I have tested are being locked to the cache chipboard and overall I think that the overwhelming majority of games that will benefit from this technology are going to be of course better all three cast chipboard so yeah the the times where the non-cast chiplet is your better choice is probably pretty restricted and limited correct yes some games will price frequency more than L3 cash capacity and uh AMD has said that in those cases it will Target that but this is kind of a a work in progress so we'll see how that goes as they move forward but it absolutely does Target workloads at one the CCD or you know their compute chiplet the one with the cash and it works very well and the reason why they do that is because they say that if they have both you know the courtship their cash triplet on both sides they get a very limited benefit by doing it that way but they get a huge cost increase so you gotta you have to kind of balance it because these are expensive processors the ryzen 9 7950s 3D comes with the same amount it's basically a 7950x with a souped-up chiplet but it costs 6.99 now you can get its counterpart for 5.99 I believe that was actually the uh recommended selling price of the 7950x that's the vanilla version without the x3d uh wasn't it 649 at one point it's running at about 5.99 at retail so yeah you pay 100 bucks more yep all right well should we dive into our benchmarks and see see how we perform yeah all right let's see uh here we go so this is the meat of it I mean we could run through the different benchmarks but at the end of the day this is what it what it boils down to now there is going to be some variance in which titles can be will be accelerated by this technology we'll we'll give you kind of a we'll show you a chart that AMD has that has a bunch of different games on there because it kind of does a good job of a summation of what what types of titles see boost but here when you look at this the you know the 7950x 3D is when you look at the the core I9 or 13900 KS that's also a 699 dollar processor if it's sold at retail which it rarely does and that is from Intel it was intended to keep the gaming Crown but here the 7950x is 12 faster um even when we look at the overclocks here in a second uh you know it's still nine percent faster after you overclock boat ships so they pretty much dispatched with the 13900k with you know I mean it's pretty easy and when we're looking at stock settings you have to realize that this 7950x 3D is consuming a lot less power I mean the the the power between these two isn't really comparable I mean Intel's is is running as hot and hard as it can in this 7950x 3D is just running on one chiplet during most of these games almost all of them are running on one Shipley and the other one is effectively shut down I mean the cords are part so you have power data for the CPU from from like when you're gaming like not during gaming no but it largely follows power testing if we're not doing something that's going to give you fully bandwidth you know like fully uh bandwidth limited or fully utilizing the course so when you do something like handbrake is is probably a decent enough proxy where you're gonna you're gonna Peak with the 7950x 3D somewhere around 100 watts and with the 3900k or 900 KS you're gonna be running over 200. I mean it would depend on exactly what kind of a game you're running but the general take is is you're looking at a significant reduction in power it is significantly more power efficient now one area that you do there there is a bit of a trade-off though is the 7950x 3D I idles a lot higher uh but this has kind of been just a trend and I actually didn't have the idle numbers in here but I opened my chart anyway it does idle a little bit higher than Intel that's going to really depend upon it's going to depend upon the power mode that you're running in uh Mike fire off in chat what gray overlay I'm not I'm not seeing it on my YouTube stream so I'm not sure what you're referring to all right so let's go on uh this is so your Geo mean of stock running at 1080p let's here's your overclocked version so you've got multiple different variants of overclocking so there are a few different ways that you can overclock the one that is marked Expo up top is just simply engaging the overclocked memory profile uh for AMD which is Expo the kits are a little bit more expensive not a whole lot because AMD runs a ddr56000 is a sweet spot anything over that really isn't even worth bothering for the Intel chips they're using ddr5 6800 but as you can see I mean you're gaining like what a percent there from memory overclocking or something like that you're gaining two two frames over all of these titles it's really not worth bothering with you could just run this this the stock I mean you're not going to be able to perceive that yeah that's even just one or two titles right so yeah and like the big cash basically makes your memory Speed and Performance less critical in games exactly that's the entire purpose of this is to make the processor less Reliant upon of keeping the game data close so that's less Reliant and doing fewer trips out to main memory which is a higher latency the games love low latency so the the whole point of this is to reduce the impact of the memory and it does a really good job um when you look at the PBO now PBO there's there's a lot to this what happens is or prior with the previous agenda the first gen x3d chip using this technology in AMD did not allow overclocking they didn't allow you to manipulate power uh or the the ratios this time they've done limited overclocking now you can't change voltages and there are reasons for that it's because the cash chiplet has a lower voltage limit which if you read the review and you go to like page three or four I think it's three I did a bunch of boost testing there and there we showed the difference between the two chips like one the cash chiplet at most will pull 88 Watts but the other one will pull like 140. if you're just disabling one and running your test so there's a big difference between these chiplets so there's limited overclock ability and what they're allowing is precision boost overdrive that's their their uh automated overclock you hear that buzzing no okay good there's an automated overclock feature there if anyone else Hears A buzzing it might be from me so let me know okay so there there is an automated uh overclocking feature called Precision boost overdrive you have less control you can Define certain parameters that boost the power limits of the chip as we can see that paired with Expo so whenever you see PBO when I'm testing we're also doing overclocked memory that will get you up to 232 frames per second so you're getting a little bit more of a boost I think this is more applicable because we're just using a 280 millimeter cooler it's a one-click operation if you're going to take the time to click once for Expo you're definitely going to take the time to click once for PBO and it sorts it all out and it does what it needs to do and it's going to give you the most boost that it can from that cooler that you have attached to it whatever thermal Headroom is left over is going to extract that it's going to push the heat up so if you have a 360 millimeter cooler you could get a little maybe a little bit higher you know as always with overclocking your mileage will bearing with x3d AMD also allows under bolting which when it comes to this type of a chip could arguably be better now when it comes to Applications it's absolutely better but when it comes to overclocking we basically get the same results if we add uh undervolting to this we get the same results it just kind of changes the rankings in some games a little bit depending on how much they like Peak frequencies because undervolting will allow you to hit higher frequencies but it reduces the impact of all core boosts they won't go as high but you get higher single core booster two quarters so there's a little bit of a trade-off here and there the end of the day it's basically a wash I mean they literally they will have the exact same 232 average okay all right uh 99th percentiles not a whole lot different to say right same exactly exactly I don't really see that there's not a whole lot to pick through here I mean if we go back real fast one thing I will point out is if you look at the the 13700k for Intel is very similar to the 13900k and the 13900 KS is like the worst value in chips so when you're looking at the 13900k comparison you're saying man you know I could save a little bit of money compared to the 5800 or the 7900x 3D like if you're looking for bang for buck really the set 13 700k is your conversation there and then you're looking at the 5800x 3D in the same conversation but there's so many trade-offs with that chip I still think the 13700k is the better chip for most people over the 5800 X 3D even though it is they're cheap uh right now anyway the 5800x 3D is the first instantiation of this technology from AMD and the 7950x3d just blows it out 1440p gaming this is our stock chart should we just go to the overclock chart and get it yeah I would just go right to the overdock clock chart again you're seeing much the same Trend I mean there isn't really anything here that's going to change your perception of things folks do like to see these because uh they you know on high-end systems like this you're almost certainly definitely going to be gaming at 25.60 so that should be you should take that into consideration if you're building a high-end system because how much extra do you get of course later in the future you will get um you know larger performance boots if you get a faster GPU it depends upon how long you're you're keeping your system so I mean I guess you could make the argument either way but people who build super high-end systems are probably updating more frequently on their system but yeah so just just well I guess these are different games I was going to say you know if you look at our 1080p oh that's 99 that's there um you know the drop in performance going to 1440p is not that significant overall which means we're mostly still CPU Limited at 1440p because of the 4090 but you know two years from now we get a 50 90 or an 8900 XTX or whatever the next gen cards are called right and so then our 1080p results might become more applicable to higher resolutions all right uh yeah again not much to say about the 99th percentiles you can see these all in the full review and the 10 FPS difference like they are a slightly different selection of games so that might skew the 1080p yeah because yes we use we don't use the entire test suite for 1440p because the other games three of them of the seven tested titles it's just there there's basically no difference that there's nothing to learn right it doesn't really show you anything and it's really time consuming to do a whole bunch of 2560 but you know to do a bunch of tell me about asking for yes uh for CPUs it's definitely not as important I mean 19 you know 1080p is really the thing that you're you're viewing QHD isn't as important this is just more of a demonstration of the differences all right uh multi-threaded performance all right here we see I'm just going to skip to the overclock again yeah yep here we see the yes we put the simplified charts in the review with without the overclock things to make a little bit easier for people who maybe aren't as tech savvy or just want a quick view this overclock is a little bit more complicated so we put this in there for the big brains now when you have the 7950x 3D the big thing that you're going to notice right away is that it is not as fast as the 7950x the 7950x in multi-threader performance um for some reason I did not color it in this Char and now that I see that what a mistake that is it says 673 is a geometric mean of um one two three four six different workloads here and actually for that blender there's four different kinds of renders because the different renders worth the CPU differently so uh you actually have 10 different workloads this is a geometric mean of those it is really a good indicator of multi-threader performance so the 7950x3d loses quite a bit of steam compared to the 7950s and this is the drawback one of the chiplets runs about 500 megahertz slower than the other because it has x3d Tech on it and the x3d tech does little to absolutely nothing to boost applications um I've heard some people say that compiles some types of compiles can benefit like five percent um but I've tested numerous you know types of compiles like Godot llbm and chromium i7zip yeah yeah seven zip is the one thing that actually can benefit from the big cash I think it doesn't okay maybe a little bit but I I I should probably do a chiplet versus non-chipley overall basically nobody buys this for application performance the number of workloads that would benefit from it from the cash triplet are um so small compared to the vast number where you're going to lose that I mean unless you're doing one certain seven zipping all day long it definitely is not worth it I mean even AMD does not position this at all this chip is positioned for gamers and gaming specifically the idea though is to give you this big boost in performance in gaming while retaining The Lion's Share of the performance in multi-threaded work and here it is still a pretty strong processor I mean if you're doing if you're just doing one quick overclocking which with PBO you get up to 650. but one thing you really notice here is that we also have the for the application testing we also added PBO UV under bolting this is PBO with undervolting applied you can't over volt but you can under vote under vote Yes this actually gives you quite a bit more uh give gives you a little bit more here and you're getting up near a pretty close probably enough for most people uh two to thirteen nine hundred K of 5.6 that's pretty impressive considering that this chip is very power efficient and you know I mean you are paying more you on the other hand you also get the the benefit of the Gang so there are ways that you can do to bring this up of course the 13900 KS up at the top is 6.0 on two cores and then the remainder of them on 5.7 and then the e-course at 4.4 I mean that thing is is sucking power like the Sun but you can get um you know more multi-threaded performance so there is a trade-off there with the 7950x3d if you're running at a bare stock settings and if you're not like big on the multi-threaded application performance and you just want the gaming performance we have the 7800x 3D coming next month which is why it was probably held back because it's going to be all the performance in games it will lose the multi-threaded performance because it's dropping eight cores but less complexity and cheaper so I asked the AMD reps at CES when they announce these chips of course anybody with you know who knows much about chips and how this works knows that the 7800 X 3D will be the chip to beat here it will be the the chip that Gamers should go for um I don't recommend shows this expensive just for gaming there's a whole bunch of people with a whole lot of money are going to tell me to shut up and they're going to do it anyway but most people should most folks should go for the 449.7800 X 3D it's one CCD and even AMD agrees that that will give you the overwhelming majority of the game you performance I would say at least 95 that would be my guess that would actually make it even better I'm not sure if they're going to do it but um yeah are you going to tell us the trick no sure oh so AMD when they designed the Epic processors okay um the or or this CCD the compute dye of um ryzen is the same that they use for the Epic data center chips this is important to remember they use the same guy and anybody who says what's the difference everywhere but shut up it's the same die okay I know this for a fact AMD is confirmed so on this die there are these things called GMI links Global memory interconnect link and it connects the chiplet to the i o die Bam Bam now there are two physical GMI connections the GMI connection is only so wide you know think in terms of a pcie connection this is pretty much what it is it only has so much width they only use one for the client products there are two connections per die so when you look at the data center products the Epic chips the data center chips they use two gmis for anything that uses fewer then six is a six six CDs so four and Below there are certain skus that use both gmis so it has access to twice the memory throughput per Chipley now AMD has chose not to do two GMI connections for uh the client processors I don't know why my guess they've never confirmed that's the chipset support it not chips at the uh yeah I believe that it does but I I could be wrong again and how hard would it be to use a different um you know slightly revised version or just the i o die from the Epic ship well but I would die from epics big isn't it yeah that's pretty big and it doesn't have graphics yeah yeah but the point is is there is a means for them to do that and double it and I think that that would be a lot yeah double the memory bandwidth double the i o potential oil getting off in the weeds all right all right we don't know what they're gonna do uh let's see single threaded performance here's your non-overclocked easy chart and then we'll skip over to the big brain overclocking chart that that's what Paul calls it now that's right so you look here if you look at 7950x 3D PBO only you are taking a huge hit in single threaded performance here it drops quite a bit if you go from just the vanilla 7950x 3D here and you compare it to the 7950xp or just the 7950x the standard version of the chip is faster in single thread work if you do just PBO you lose a ton of performance why why would you lose performance with PBO on single thread this has been a long-standing problem with PBO uh PBO will you will lose single threaded performance because it increases it basically focuses on multi-core boost it it's increasing the power limits and for whatever reason the implementation that AMD has done PBO is notorious for this it will lose performance and Singletary work when you engage it it's really focused on multi-thread work the the main problem typically the almost always the the drop is a little bit it's like four or five percent with the x3d chip though man and you can see it's a big drop so a Curious Thing but if you use under bolting here um you actually gain a little bit so this is here is a demonstration of where undervolting is actually very useful I mean like your PBO numbers on the 7900x the the 7950x those are both at least fractionally higher than the stock clocks yeah it kind of feels like is is there potentially some glitchiness bugginess with how it's targeting threads or something when you look at it with a with the am5 platform we started to see small gains but everything on am4 you would not you would see a regression in PBO almost always I mean it depends but you know even any gains would be small single percentage but you would see regressions a lot in single threaded work and this is by no means anything new but with am5 it is better because they improved their power delivery and it could be something with thread targeting I'm not sure yeah it's just a long-standing thing with the 7950x3 3D you can see it's a big dot it's a big drop yep yeah like that's um about 10 something like that all right uh that takes it us through the benchmarks we've got a few other things to discuss with the platform and how they do this thread targeting um we can quickly run through these um here I mean you know AMD is just saying hey we're supporting our chips chipset until at least 20 25. the big thing is is AMD is committing to supporting this chipset until we get a new revision of uh memory this is kind of what they say off the record-ish I mean they haven't written it down but they say basically the constraining factor is here is when do we move to ddr6 so they're saying at least 2025 if we don't see ddr6 until Beyond in like you know ddr4 was around a long time so that's why you saw am4 around for a long time so ddr5 they're planning to basically run this platform through through ddr5 we know ddr6 will not be here until 2025 at the earliest so they're saying hey that's where we will we'll support it through DDR you know DDR or 2025 that is an advantage now Intel's current platform we'll have one more generation of chips so uh you know we could see this go further um there's more performance Headroom for these boards uh you know a big problem with when they went from things like the 3950x to the the 5950x with the high court count chips at the end of the am4 platform they didn't have a lot of overhead with power they pretty much were Tapped Out so you didn't get real big gains uh that will change with this platform the the reason why the boards are so expensive is because the power is built like a tank um there's a ton of power really unneeded right now um in some respects yeah it'll be interesting to see what happens with like Zen five four five right that it will this is I have to keep my numbers straight yeah we're on Zen four so you know Zen five maybe next year or something um you know what's that going to bring to the table how will it improve things we saw with the 5800 X 3D that like you could run that thing on an original x370 board and not really lose much in performance compared to the x570 just because of that big old cash uh we'll see we'll have to see what Zen five maybe even Zen six bring to the table in terms of changes I don't know Zen six DDR dddr6 that sounds like a good transition point yes yes that will be nice so there you go that's an advantage of the AMD platform if you look at the folks who bought a 5800x back in the day or excuse me an 1800x ryzen was just six years old uh what last week so or the week before it very recently six years old the the folks who bought that first gen platform uh God bless their soul because that was rough uh they could theoretically drop a 5800x 3D in there now how well it'll work I don't know that that assumes your motherboard stayed functional I had at least three of my x370 boards die yeah but you know you look at it the x370 is like any platform the first revisions of the boards are going to be really rough but the ones that they sold the last revisions the newest ones of those should be pretty decent anyway point B oh it's a heck of an upgrade Runway to six years later drop a a huge upgrade and performance in there so that's it yeah we're looking at at least three at least three or four years of am5 okay this here just shows curve Optimizer here when they're saying PBO plus curve Optimizer that's PBO and under bolting I call it a UV because I think that UV is a more common term than curve Optimizer curve Optimizer is UV all right we already saw those numbers earlier okay uh here we go we can go past this somehow like I talked about overclocked already so yeah we talked about should we talk about the architecture and this stuff before or after the benchmarks but yeah okay here's the important part and this is the part that is still generating some controversy from folks and probably Bears some further testing from us so keep your eyes peeled this is something I'm working on as time permits over the weekend the AMD is targeting they they have a system whereby they're targeting games at that specific cache but they're also disabling a bunch of cores effectively by parking them now how does it determine how to do that now how does and how does this impact performance in applications they're using Xbox game bar Xbox game bar triggers game mode now Windows game mode has a very tortured history and I mean I had uh disabled this for many years especially when it was new when we tested you had to explicitly enable it for this right yes yes as a matter of fact I did yes because game mode can get a little bit wonky the idea really is is if you have a high-end system or even a medium it shouldn't do a whole lot um yeah I'm gonna unplug my mic and plug it back in that sometimes helps so bear with me all right so with the you know game mode has been known game mode has been known to cause problems because what it does is it de-prioritizes background tasks when the game is running and really the only place where you're going to get a ton of benefit from this would be core I3 or below like or ryzen 3 and Below very low end systems on higher end systems because it deprioritizes those tasks that these big processors like a core I9 can do just fine in the background or ryzen 9 like they're laughing at your multitasking unfortunately it deprioritizes those applications and it creates lower performance so this can be bad on higher end systems now they've ironed out most of the Kinks but it's been a long time since I've messed with game mode because you know we're an Enthusiast site and our focus is typically above uh Core i5 so you know how much of a performance impact this has and the fact that they're shutting down one CD CCD um there's just a lot of chances here for this to cause some weird situations so what we're going to do is simulate some of these weird situations but you'll have to stay tuned for that testing these things take time for now this is how they do it you install a new chipset driver and it installs a provisioning driver a PPM provisioning file driver and this you know slide describes it pretty well when they do this it targets the threads at a certain chiplet to improve the performance because you want that game running on the cache chiplet now this under normal circumstances is all let's just say for instance that all both ccds are turned on fully it's still going to limit the game to the cast chipboard that is the idea so even if you begin running something else it's you know then it's going to expose the whole processor and those things can spill over onto that other CCD like OBS or something like that this ring in the background or twitch like if you're watching a YouTube stream while you're while you're gaming you've got twitch ons watching someone else game which my son does all the time strange thing but whatever um this ensures that there's it's still running but the game's still on that CCD how well that works in application we're gonna you know I'm experimenting with so then that's part of it and if you go over to the other one next slide next slide yes sorry uh then you have this which also dynamically changes the rankings of the the course during normal times how this works is AMD on all of its processors right now it's current gym processors it ranks the course based upon frequency because not all cores can hit the peak frequency some cores are faster than others and they spec their chips that way which is something that Intel for years and years and years nobody did AMD well yeah unless it was like turbo boost through points so this is effectively like turning that into the base spec so they target the cores based upon frequency first once they see that a game is running now the chipset driver flips it and says no we're gonna because the chips the chiplet with cash is slower they're gonna say nope we're just gonna go buy which ones have cash those are now the prioritized threads so that's the ins and outs of how it works there are a bunch of different services that run in the background but for most people they're they're not going to really worry about it they're going to install the chipset driver ensure that they're on the balanced power mode and then game the Xbox game bar does not detect all games um there are a few that it's not familiar with or for whatever reason aren't on the kgl list and when they're new they won't be however you can go into the Xbox game bar and tell it that whatever is running that's in the foreground is a game it will list it you can even do it with applications you can do simbit charge 23 you'll see it right there if you have some bench open and it's the application in focus when you open it it will show it and it will have a when you open the game bar you hit Windows G and it opens the game bar and you go into the little settings icon and you'll see It'll say app currently running and then it has a checkbox to recognize this as a game and you do that and Bam it's good Photoshop to be in a game yeah you can do this during registry highs with registry Heist and all these complicated things but I see no reason why you would do that unless you just really don't want to use Game Bar and they're in is something there's another way of doing this without using game bar or game mode but that's complicated I mean that's what Linux would have to do when it like right exactly right now Linux is not benefiting from x3d exactly that 0.1 of gamers they're not getting the benefit of it I bought it at 7950x3d so I could run games on Linux said no one all right this is your asymmetric chiplet design we've already talked a lot about this okay confused Council has a question that is because the 5800x 3D does not support curb optimizer uh maybe they added it after support but undervolting support is new with 7950x 3D I believe that it was not enabled with the 5800 S3 so you have to go they definitely did not allow PBO that's for sure uh day unlocked new overclocking features with the new series so if there is if it is enabled by the for the 5800x3d perhaps that was added post launch yes that's what he's saying that was added at the end of last year oh okay yeah and this might be via some sort of unofficial Edition by a motherboard vendor which means it actually might not work how they did but I mean now you're going to send me off to some research on this but uh start down the rabbit hole that is why I mean there are a lot of hacks from the motherboard vendors that we typically don't test like combo strike I know the uh MSI added that functionality with the 5800x 3D where it's allowing it to exceed basically the safe thresholds uh of the cash chiplet and hey I'm all for going past those that's what overclocking is about but in some cases it's a little bit sketch sketchy when they're doing hybrid branding because the temperature limits with that can cause that to become unhybrid hybrid bonded so like it's a little bit more dangerous but hey yeah I'll look into it thanks for the heads up I do know that there are some methods but we typically don't use those because I even I deem them to be a little bit all right uh we have the thing you're going to come back and ask me hey Paul why did you tell me to fry my chip yes so then this this is the last thing to really show these were amd's own provided benchmarks we showed our overall geometric mean averages but you can see here across you know this is a fair selection of games 20 or so and there are a couple where you know the the drop in CPU frequency did impact them strange Brigade and csgo both of those at least in my experience are probably running in the like 400 plus frames per second range and are probably more CPU clock speed limited and so yeah it wouldn't be too surprising to see a very slight drop with the x3d and yes and those those game engines just for whatever reason do not benefit from having that um csgo dx9 engine from like a decade ago yeah yeah yeah there yeah I mean hey CS goes already doing a lot I mean I don't know how much it really matters you know I I see a I don't have CS go in the in the my game test Suite and I always debate this internally with myself about CS go because it is so popular but at the same time I hate to Benchmark things that are getting up over 200 300 frames per second because what am I really telling you what are we really learning oh look it runs just as stupidly ridiculously fast with this as it does with everything else um you know I I want the benchmarks to have at least some meaning but then again it's popular I acknowledge that and then there's I think this is one of two slides uh the other slide I don't know yeah one of these I believe was with oh 13 900k there we go there we go that that's against the 13900k the other one shows you basically the uplift I don't like this chart as much uh because I don't trust amd's until Sunday okay just as much as I don't trust Intel's benchmarks of the 7950x 3D I mean they'll both just have to forgive me but I don't trust it now this I trust yes most watchdog's Legion that's interesting that that's the biggest gain that one does I I've noticed with eight gigabyte cards that you can start running so issues but even then yeah in the spirit of this you know when I look at our test Suite um I look and I say hey man it seems like I have quite a few games that are falling on this big game side um you know so I did do five more games that fall a little bit more on the it doesn't get anything from it like was it cramped I thought I added them in a table beyond what we normally do down here down on the gaming page you can find those and I reference it at the top hey there's some other games in there that may not benefit much because I feel like we're waiting more towards games to benefit but when you look at our at the CPU test Suite that I run uh compared to some of the other big Outlets that test CPUs be there on YouTube or on things we are very heavily weighted towards newer games and newer engines um so those newer games and newer engines do tend to benefit more I think that's a safe statement um from the the 3db cache so I don't you know I do want to show both sides of the coin so we did some testing with some games that maybe don't benefit them as much or just hey they're different games expanding our range just show them um you know I'm always debating both with myself and asking Jared for advice on things that we should include or not include you know this is an ongoing thing I'm just looking at these games for my GPU benchmarks I'm currently running 15 games I'm like ah I only have five of these Watch Dogs Legion Warhammer 3 oh no that's dawn of War I use test or Warhammer three we have one on here yeah we had Watchdogs Legion in here for uh on my test suite for like two years but then they started doing all these weird game updates and stuff all the time that makes it really hard to keep up with it and I actually dropped it so you know what this benefits it doesn't benefit has nothing to do with our game selection I've been running the same suite for what six or eight months well before this but we like to try I like to try to keep it balanced you know we're trying to get a mix of apis like dx11 dx12 Vulcan yeah anything that runs Vulcan well we're uninvulking because there's so few but you know we want different apis and then you have to take into consideration hey also how old is The Game because I don't want a whole bunch of things like CS go unfortunately but then I also look at what's hot in the steam chart the most played because you know come on how important is it if it's some game nobody plays So speaking of the singularity speaking of games that are popular I was looking at Hogwarts Legacy you know at one point it was it was a half a million people playing it I was like man that's just on Steam maybe I should add it I started trying to play that game and actually like I've had more crashes of my system with that game than that's the main thing I hear from people is how terrible that game is it's crazy like 40 90. the engine is trapped yeah and it works and then it doesn't and this is another consideration that I have to take into consideration when we're selecting CPU benchmarks is if the game is too new I am very heavily weighted towards new titles compared to all of the other day just the other day I actually compiled a list of some of the other big names uh they do this onto YouTube two biggest CPU competitors that I got and we are way way more modern in our choice to selection but at the same time I can't go too new because as a Jared can tell you when you game is new we get driver updates and Driver updates a million driver updates in their million game updates that we can't stop um you can't prevent Steam from doing it if you don't install the update you can't do it and every time there's game update we have to retest all of them and you know I'm maintaining lists on like our CPU hierarchy it's pain so it's got to be new but not too new and it definitely can't be too old like we're not just throwing darts at the wall it's my microphone buzzing again it was we're not just throwing uh we're not just throwing darts at a board there's a lot of different considerations so anyway there you go that's why we included this track and we typically I would never include a chart from it a third party all right I've unplugged and replug my microphone again I need to switch microphones clearly uh my blue yeti has apparently done it as much as it's going to do I don't know if it's the cord or the microphone itself but I think that's it for our show um do we have any other questions over here that we need to does the this is a decent question um whoa she hates monitors over 24 inches what is wrong with kids these days those crazy kids hey I've got a 32 inch monitor behind me that I really really like the extra size there's saving confused Council money that's true well I guess that this is always the question and uh you know 1920 by 1080 is always such a big measure that we use because we're trying to specifically expose uh GPU bottlenecks this would depend upon how much CPU bottlenecks CPU Excuse me yes thank you CPU bottleneck this would depend upon what kind of class and video card that you're using and how long you Inc you plan on keeping the system um it doesn't make sense there maybe not as much sense especially with 4K with today's cards but I mean now we're getting to this point to where we are CPU limited with games I mean come on Jared help me out here you still have a 40 nights it's like five different variables to change yeah like if like I guess if she's doing well you say 1080p 2K 4K at on the 24 inch oh she's limited does it make sense for 1080p gaming if you have a 40 90 I mean if you if you want to make sure you are not GPU limited um and I mean CPU limited and you have a monster GPU you know sure but like if you're running a 30 60 something relatively sane I wager the uplift from a 7950x3d or 7800x 3D is going to be relatively minimal even out in 1080P so it's like if you're if you're chasing higher frame rates and you've got a beefy graphics card then sure yeah so 24 inches on the monitor is you're leaving out the refresh rate is she limited to 60 hertz I mean if she's doing her 144 that the conversation changes and then you are also looking at 99 percentile uh you will get better 99 percentile with faster processors I mean if you've got this is mean to you uh you know you got a 480 Hertz 1080p monitor or 360 Hertz even or 240 hertz the thing is it's like there's so many games that regardless of your CPU are not going to hit 240 frames per second you know it's like if you play csgo or Dota 2 or these popular Esports games then some of those will hit those super high frame rates and those can use your refresh rate but I mean this is a 240 hertz 4k monitor behind me and there's like even with dlss3 doing frame doubling most games don't come anywhere near 240 hertz so I mean maybe she is an Esports gamer so yeah I mean if you're chasing those higher FPS why not and I'm sure that she's going to update her GPU if you're using that kind of a monitor it tells me that you're probably pretty serious about what you're doing on gaming I go for it but no no don't get the 7950x 3D people I'm sorry if I haven't been clear about this wait for the 7800 he did say the 7800x 3D earlier yes yeah 7950x3d for like 99 of the population do not buy it uh DaVinci resolves I don't think no yeah we use that it's a video on coding stuff like that yeah um all right that about does it yep all right thanks guys thanks for watching have a great weekend and we will see you next time [Music] thank you

Channel: Tom's Hardware

Views: 2,567

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Id: E8gDFZ9WXbY

Length: 51min 40sec (3100 seconds)

Published: Fri Mar 03 2023