9 Steps To Becoming A Creative Director w/ Adam Morgan

[Music] what's up people hello Donuts donation features feature potty feature Pham futurist happy Friday to you guys today's episode is gonna be jam-packed because we're welcoming out of Morgan to the show if you don't know who he is here's a quick bio for you guys he's the executive creative director he just recently got a promotion at Adobe he's also written a book Congrats on that as well sorry Spock emotions drive business I'm a Spock person myself so I want to know more about this he's spoken at many events including Adobe MAX at America the AAF Sioux Falls at conference and so many more he's also been Harold not Harold given the title of advertising professionals a year for Utah in 2014 by the AAF also named top 40 under 40 by Utah business magazine which is where he's at right now in Utah he's also worked in marketing strategy and a self-described pitchman we're gonna be talking about how to become a creative director welcome to the show oh my god we are color synched today yes we are feeling the vibes right yeah the frequency is good okay so without further ado I know that a lot of people in our community always ask how do I become an art director and more importantly how do I become a creative director it's such a beautiful glorious glamorous title and I believe you have a deck that you're gonna share with us today right I do alright so while Adams preparing his deck I just want to remind everybody's watching this live on YouTube as you listen in Greg and the team will be monitoring your comments so go ahead and start commenting and we'll be reading them and asking the questions when appropriate okay Adam take it away all right no come so there's an interesting topic not sure if you can see the screen but when I start out with a story so this was the early 2000s I was working at an ad agency at the time before I joined Adobe I did 20 years of that agency life and at the time you know there was there was kind of this core of four guys you know art directors and Arai that whenever there's a big pitch that came in we were always the crew that was working on and I was working hard at the time you know doing my best in my craft and then one day in December we had a huge All Hands meeting with the whole creative Department and our UCD at the time came up and said oh we got some promotions and I'm sorry I have to interrupt yeah we're perfect before we started but now you're moving a lot and I'm hearing the scratchy beer sound okay don't take that down or what do we do I like that you're animated there we go holding still okay it's fine otherwise we might switch back to the other mic okay keep going then start out there I'll try and please continue with your story so anyhow the short of it is that during that meeting all the other three people of us four they were all promoted to CD and I was the only one that wasn't and at the time in my career it was really heart Randy I was like what's going on you know I was one of the the glourious for right we were the the pitch band the people who are coming up with all the great ideas but I was passed over and so it was a really really hard day for me to figure out you know why why I did all my cohorts become creative doctors and I didn't you know I thought I was doing all the right steps and first I want to talk about like what the internet teaches you about becoming a crepe vector if you look out there there's all these articles you know five steps fourteen steps twelve steps but the truth is what they focus on is something like oh you need to be really really good at your craft like whether you're an art director or a writer you just need to be awesome just become a rock star and that you just keep getting better and better at it and then all of a sudden one day you'll become a CD and it's really really light on the guidance of how to do that step mm-hmm later as I've gone through it you know I've been a critic of director for a long time now and it's it's eye-opening to really describe to people what it takes because it really is you know our perspective of it is oh as a creative director you just have to be really good at your craft and then you get to finally be the one that kind of leans over the shoulder and tells everyone else what to do right campaign Adobe about this you know that over the shoulder our director campaign and it's really not about that it's a totally different perspective and and it's really hard for people to grasp I didn't grasp it back there on my dark day in December but the truth is you know there are some truths and what I'm going to go through are like nine steps that throughout my career cuz I've had this conversation with a lot of people a lot of people saying hey I want to be kind of CD or or why am I not a CD and they're just kind of doing their thing and they just expect it to come and there's a lot that you have to understand and first of all number one truth is what makes you amazing creative does not make you a great CD I mean let's be realistic how many of us are out there reading books on leadership or taking skills or you know listening to podcasts on leadership not as I am there's so much content out there on becoming a great designer for becoming a great writer but there's not so much out there on becoming a great creative leader and so that's the real question you to ask yourself is is this the right thing for me I'll give you example I was at a conference for developers six months ago and you know in our world every wants to be the creative director you want to be the person in charge the one to be able to call the shots to pitch to all the ideas right and at this conference for developers they were doing a session on how to become a manager and in this huge room of all these developers they asked who wants to be a manager and nobody raised your hand but like one in their world it was like forget that who wants to be that do that job right but with us it's like everyone wants to be the shiny object so you really have to think through and I'm gonna give you a lot of pointers on these nine steps of the real insight behind the job of a creative director and what it really takes to cross that gap so we'll get into that so here we go nine things to consider I'm gonna go in order of top to bottom of what I think are really important things of becoming a creative director so this first one is the idea of relationships this is a really hard one you know I've had many as senior creative come to my office and say hey I want to be a CD and the first thing we talk about is like okay but you're always off on your own like as creative people we like to be introverts and go and crawl into our cave and just Zone in get flow state right and start creating stuff but if you really want to be a CD you've got to get out of that habit you can't just be the quiet lone wolf that just goes off and does your stuff you have to be there and you have to build awesome relationships with stakeholders clients you know others we're gonna be a strategic partner with it's really and it's not just knowing the name or doing a drive-by every once in a while it's it's becoming so expert in their space and understanding their world that they come to see you as the expert and on creativity and they really feel like you're the go-to person so lationship is our critical critical critical you have to be a little bit nice it's not you have to be an extrovert but you have to be outgoing you have to push it number two you have to be able to talk kaki and this is a big insight there's actually a great book out there on you know learning to talk business for creatives by Douglas Davis you just got it out a little while ago mm-hmm yeah so it's this idea that you can't just you learn to speak creative stuff you have to learn business I had an old one of my old bosses owned one of the agencies they worked for I said you have to know how does your client or how do you make money and if you have it once you understand that then you have to make sure that all of your work aligns with that you can't just create beautiful stuff and it's not making you know the business grow so learning to direct executive so we keep thinking oh it's creative director is all about directing other creative people right I can speak their language but it's not it's it's we call it talking kaki to doing because it's all about you know articles and thought leadership on how do you speak business you know casual and really understand what they're all about so that you're on the same playing field because think about it all the people you're dealing with when you're wanting to move up your creative director the people making that decision whether they're you know ECD or it's you know the executive the CEO of your company they have grown up with their MBAs learning all about finance and numbers and that's what they understand and we speak a totally different world of emotions and ideas and so you have to be able to speak all that and speaks you know smartly about it otherwise you're toast like they're not gonna see you as a creative leader they're gonna see is a great creative person and they want to keep you as a as a senior great alright next vision and leadership that's the next step it's not just a matter of you know unfortunately in in many instances most creative directors you know they become a creative director just because of attrition or they stuck it around long enough or it's a it's a strategy for the company to keep them from leaving right oh we don't want to lose that person will make them a leader and it's a terrible terrible system and and really if you want to become a leader and a creative director you need to understand vision and leadership you need to step up and have a plan a point of view what are your thoughts on content development what are your thoughts on on whatever your product is and details about it what do you thoughts on product design like you really need to know and understand and with a lot of people go back and say find a passion or figure out what you care about and really get in deep on it and understand it there's a term I say it's like you've got to read to leave you can't just you know sit back and watch your your cool Netflix shows and and look at your you know design websites you have to be out there reading reading books articles things like really figuring out the world around you so you have a point of view and then you can give give that vision and leadership that's critical next presenting and selling so this is just any any good creative as you grow up in the field you need to be a master of meetings and I know that sounds lame but man like if I showed you my calendar they're just meetings up their meetings up your meetings and and I've seen creatives get into meetings and just kind of curl back up into their ball and just kind of let things roll right and and they're not leading they're not guiding the work they're not defending the work you have to be a pitch person you have to be able to get out there present guide own the room read the room understand it and it just speak the language of meetings we're so used to when we quote/unquote get work done is because we go back to our cave and work but as a leader work gets done for most other people in those meetings so you have you have to be able to represent and you have to be you know on stage and have a presence and be able to drive and guide that so you are a meeting person whether you like it or not next is managing the credit machine this is a part that you also don't think about its structure and process I can't tell you throughout my career how many times it's been decks about how the organs organize or how we're gonna do the process of organizing files how we're gonna keep it on the servers how which technology were using how are we going to connect with all of our other partners and people and and how the flow of content go throughout this this whole machine and beyond that how do I manage all these different creative teams how do I keep the workflow balanced you know I have this there's a whole article on this idea of the whelmed scale that I came up with where it's like you want to be underwhelmed or overwhelm something how do you find that you're perfectly well and and balanced and its really tricky to keep all these different creative personality is in line right so managing the creative machine is a huge huge deal and and creative paths just what we're talking about right now is a part of this how do you know where everyone is at on their path and what's the right path for them maybe management tonight at the right path for some people in here dobe we have levels for a management track and levels for individuals that go far you know up into the same level and above of what as a creative director would be so it's not always you grow the old process of start out as a production designer and move up to an art director and then the creative director and beyond there are different paths so organizing all that understanding structure and process is a big part of it so if you don't like that you gotta you know prepare yourself for it next is resourcing so what you most people don't think is a big part of my job or a job as a creative director is getting all the work done and who's doing what and how are we doing it and how do I manage team and resources and the flow of work and so whether it's working with outside help and agencies or other you know freelancers or just balancing the workload within that's a big big process that kind of goes into that that step above that resourcing huge huge deal you know here's an example of that whelmed skill just real quick if something I used at one agency of just to find that sweet spot of how are you totally overworked versus under worked and and there's different types of personalities you know I've got creatives who either you know one they'll do it if you ask them but they're never gonna come ask you for more and there's some that it will never ask you and they'll do it but they'll complain and then the last one they'll come and be very proactive and want more work and they're usually the ones that take on more work and more willing so how do i balance those personalities and make sure it's the right number of projects and presentations and all that good stuff all right number seven the hustle and this one's a really hard one to to get across because I'll have people who are saying I'm already doing the job of a creative director right I've got relationships I'm in meetings I know how to talk about stuff I can pitch and present and doing all that stuff but they're not present and and so there's really this element of you have to be aggressive you have to be a go-getter you have to go out and find where the work is going and why and what how the business works and makes money so that you can integrate that design process into it and really hustle like that's really the idea of being present pushing yourself and others you if you you know our work adverse then it's you're not gonna be a great credit director you've got to get out there and push it and be a champion of creativity and then we finally get to number eight managing other creatives I mean that's really what it's about and some people early I did - you know before that day in December it was oh you just get up and I finally get to have the say and I'll tell everyone else my vision and or how I like ideas or ads or content whatever it may be but there's so much more to managing people really understanding their hopes and dreams and needs and you know all their fights like I tell you at least weekly there's going to be some employee problem you're gonna have to deal with so how do you deal with personalities egos and all that other stuff and make sure everyone's happy and growing in their careers so there's a lot more to than just telling creatives what to do it's all about really you know being a good leader and understanding their path and then finally is you know a working City anymore today it's not like you know the glory days where you became a CD and then you stopped working and you just you know run around directing people I think most cities that I know are still working CDs which is what you started in this business in the first place for right it's the craft so being a working CD you still have to keep up with it you still have to understand it you still to be good at it so you can't let that slide and that's that's really important but it's funny in my interpretation early on in my career I thought number 9 was the most important thing of all so this is the list but I'm going to talk to you about this important point which is most people or at least early in our career is we think that the way to get to a creative director is all about steps 8 & 9 it's all about the craft and managing other creatives like that's that's what we think it's about and we don't see all these other levels of vision and under in talking business and relationships and presenting in structure and all the stuff that you know becoming a project manager it doesn't seem like what we got into business for but as a CD you're a project manager you're a process manager you're you know a business manager you're all those things and you have to balance it all so here's a good rule of thumb to see if you're ready to become a creative director the next so not too long ago we were interviewing for a creative director spot here at Adobe and I you know went through there was like 700 people applied and I had you know hundreds of interviews and whatnot and it was so interesting as people got and said their room I could tell instantly if they really were ready to be a CD or a CD based on what they're talking about if they come in and you're and you're saying to your boss and your next interview saying oh it's all about me and you know all the work in this agency or in this company you know all the best stuff usually comes from me I'm the one that drives it all it's my craft and I'm doing an awesome job and I'm really really talented therefore I should be a CD or I'm ready to start managing the pupil I'm ready to start thinking about you know how I can guide them and help them along the path well you're just thinking about steps 8 & 9 that's like the base if you're coming from the top if someone comes in my office or starts talking about alright it's you know I've been talking with so-and-so over in this department or this client I've got this big idea of this vision oh here's where we're gonna take things and I know you know we've got you know some process things to work out but I really have this big vision and this is where it's gonna go and I know all the players and I know how to talk to him get them online and you're coming from number one down to nine I totally get that you understand the job of a CD and you're ready for it versus just thinking that I have to be awesome at the craft and that makes me automatically a creative director so it's just an interesting process where are you at and sometimes when I'll talk to people I'll say tell me where you are on this scale and if you are missing some skills or if you're missing the hustle and you're not present like let's figure it out and start working on those skills so that's the big answer is if you think about making making that next step keep going to the creative director put yourself in the perspective of whoever whatever leadership is in your company and how they perceive you are they just seeing you as eight nine they're not gonna promote you they're gonna keep you as a senior creative because you're doing an awesome job but when they see you as a player and understanding all the relationships you speak business you understand the vision and how the business works of course you know if you're doing that already then the idea of making a crepe director is easy it's it's already there so before you make the lip leap answer these questions first is it the right path for you do you have the right makeup do you have the right skills are you ready for that if you don't go to step two learn all those skills figure out and then do it effectively until you forget that you're even doing that and it's just a flow of what you are then the promotion will come too often I find people still step one and two kind of figuring out and just assuming I'm a rock star I should be a CD and then we got to stop that and start learning about the real craft of leadership and the real craft of reviewing your credit Victor and then go for it because then after that you know I promise you you take on the mantle the company and not talk about your portfolio that's when you have finally crossed that gasps and you look back and you won't even know that you've made the jump so marmot truth it only you know it all hinges on you if someone is saying they're complaining about how this company doesn't appreciate me they don't see me as a CD maybe I'll move on you know stop thinking about in that perspective and start thinking about what is the perspective from leadership to me and the truth is this the only person holding you back is you it's up to you to decide am I ready do I have all the skills am i doing at all am i involved am i making all those things happen then it's gonna happen no matter what so that's that's my advice on becoming a creative director that was excellent I think for a lot of people are tuning in they are probably working their way up from the bottom of the list towards the top thinking exactly what you said that's probably the wrong focus thinking about the craft thinking if I get better at the crap I should become a creative director if I hustle more and if I art direct or I'm the over-the-shoulder creative director that should warrant me getting the title in the position so I imagine there's a lot of people will give them a second to kind of process the information but they're they're shocked right now thinking wait a minute everything I thought in the order in which we should approach it is all wrong so we're probably gonna get challenged a little bit here and I just want you to take a minute to kind of reflect Adam on when you were passed up for the opportunity of becoming a creative director looking back on that now were you also thinking about it the wrong way oh absolutely I totally see it now and that's why I said I've had that conversation with so many and it's hard to get that that that see change like that perception change because I always thinking like I'm the rock star of this agency I do awesome work it's always the work that goes to the clients always the work that gets sold you know I I'm just the more and more I focus on becoming awesome in the craft and understanding you know the world of creatives and in the prop and how to help and guide them that's what I thought the next step was oh now I just need to manage people because I figured out so I can help them be awesome right now and it was just so shallow and when I look back later the other three guys that got promoted of course I look back and it's like some of them were actually better creative directors than they were art directors or writers like and that's the truth like they are really good at all these other things and and and we just have this perception that it's just the the most rockstar artists are the ones who inadvertently become the leader and that's not true like there are different skill sets mm-hmm that's kind of the point I want to do yeah I want to do a deeper dive on some of the points that you brought up and how you could potentially give some advice or coaching to the community that's watching this video but I still feel like we're a little scratchy in the audio I know it's impossible to stand absolutely still let's try to figure out some other audio option here I'm so sorry there yeah that's very clear but now you guys you have to hold that yeah it's like you got a beard it's it's the problem and it's so close that I'm like okay so that's great so I'm gonna ask you this question you said at the very top you need to learn how to build relationships not just internally but externally as well and a lot of people got into design or the creative arts because we don't want to talk to people so for the introverts is there any hope obi-wan yes is there any hope yes master talk about career paths like that's what you have to that first thing I said is ask yourself the hard question is this really the right path for me mm-hmm I know a lot of super talented people maybe they are really really good at the particulars of production or maybe they're really really good at illustration you can make an amazing career and be a senior creative and going to have an awesome career path and you don't have to become a craft director that is an old model the old model of the only way I show success in my career is by going from a junior creative to a senior creative to a creative director and beyond that's not true in the least I know so many people who have you know are paid more than maybe like an a CD or CD they're paid well they have awesome job and it's just a matter of figuring out what their what their true calling is and you don't have to feel like you have to become a manager it's not that that's not the key but I would also say don't think that you can hide in your hole and be a lone wolf that's not going to work as a CD like you're gonna be a mediocre CD you've got to be a leader and not everyone may want to do that and come out of other cave if they want to be an introvert and do an awesome job at their craft they can still find a great career and get paid well but that's not the same thing as a CD so back before you're a creative director would you describe yourself as that shy lone wolf-- introvert or no there are times that I thought I was more of an intruder I don't know I've taken the the tests and my family's agree yeah maybe I'm but I'll say this like my boss he's like he's an introvert mm-hmm but he knows when to turn it on he knows when in meetings he's got to own it right so I know people who are introverts and extroverts I'm certainly more of an extrovert so it makes it easier sure but it's just a matter of knowing when and if you can be a quiet leader there are plenty of books out there for you to read and I understand that you you know you can you can do it through action and through you know a few words you can make a big wave rather than being a big loudmouth like someone like me so their leadership styles yes great but that doesn't mean you can't not be a leader you can't just assume that you're you have a diverse style because you're a lone wolf and therefore that's the right style for a creative director I don't know you know we've tried it sometimes but it's just it's just hard because there's so much more to the job than just doing the craft that's really with them okay I think there's a video it's either called it's a TED talk called the genius of introverts or the power of introverts maybe you guys don't want to dig into this a little bit more I am an introvert and I've learned how to to work with people and to be comfortable in my own skin and to develop the language and the communication skills and the interpersonal skills to be I think comfortable building relationships with people both internally and externally okay so you're an extrovert so it's a lot easier for you and so you solve a path and like okay even though I love designing the craftsmanship I need to get out there because that's gonna limit my career path but just to put a point on it you've said very clearly that the end of your journey in terms of the highest possible position for you doesn't have to terminate as a creative director that there are many viable options that will pay you well that'll give you the respect and the responsibilities that you're looking for that doesn't end with you being creative director okay let's move on to the next one speaking the language of business now you're talking about language you're talking my language right now right because we we talk about we teach creatives the the the business of design and the book that you were talking about by Douglas Davis is called creative strategy and the business of design and just based purely on that title I bought that book read it and then I got to meet Douglas Davis and he said that we need to to think how they think yep that he learned from his grandfather think how they think because the business people usually the big drivers of decisions in companies they're thinking about something very different than aesthetics and design so we have to build that bridge between the creative side and the business side and some of us are able to do that really well so what kind of tips do you have besides hey go read the book what else can can you tell us oh you know here's something that I've seen it's really really important there if you look at business strategy and there are books on this there's like three basic types of business strategy either one you're all about operational efficiency think like a Walmart like it's all about moving something through really efficiently and getting the best prices yes or there's businesses that are all about relationships so it's like the the local bike shop that you go there and buy it even if it's more expensive because of the experience that you get from them yes and then the last one is product innovation which is kind of like what adobe is you're you're just out there creating new cool products and getting them out in the world and I've seen that as this this may be controversial but my point is that there are some business models that do not fit with great creative or pushing the boundaries of creativity so if you're in a relationship type of a company or a product innovation company then I often can see how a you know designer can be on the board of directors how they can help design and guide the vision for that company but operational efficiency companies there are a lot of them out there and I see over and over creatives in house or agencies trying to drive that operational efficiency business into a creative you know showcase and it's not gonna happen sure you can have a beautiful design within it you know Walmart can have great design I'm not saying that but it's not gonna be designed led it's operationally led so don't beat your head against the wall if you're in the wrong type of business there are so many people that are trying and trying and trying and just hitting the wall and you just got to realize look at the board look at the leadership what's the background what's the vision of that company and just see either if there's a chance that you can make you know design or creativity a part of that or if you need to find something else because you're just gonna kill yourself trying yeah I want to say hello to everybody is tuning in to watch this live with us on YouTube a lot of people like to work and listen to what's going on there's like good lives being thrown there i want to let everybody know in case you guys are a little uneasy about this the way that we're doing our live streams now is you have to join us live to participate in what we're doing and after a couple days we will take the live streams off air and that's your opportunity we don't want to have we're trying to do very different pieces of content so you guys make sure you tell a friend right now tune in and I see the audience is growing quite a bit here since when since we started we grew from 60 to 200 four of you guys watching us live and Greg I just want to prime you or prep you are you ready with the questions or do you need a minute to kind of think about the questions that the audience is asking us let's take a minute okay I think I'm sort of cooling through them so okay you keep doing that that's fine because I can continue to talk to Adam about the different points that you brought up let's just keep moving down the chain here vision and leadership when you say Reed to lead I like that first of all read the lead what how can i what kind of books or what kind of things can I do besides the things that you've said in terms of watch videos attend workshops seminars etc how do I look was there something in your life that you you read or saw that you thought wow now I'm starting to understand what leadership means I'll tell you the first time I saw it is I had a creative director you know I think was like a mccann-erickson back in an agency years ago and he would walk into a room as a creative and yet he had been staying up on whatever your favorite is you know Harvard Business Review or some cool articles and different thought leadership on on leadership or business or or a specific industry like let's say if you're in travel and hospitality like what are the trends what's really going on and he would keep up with that and it was a voracious reader and when he'd come into meetings it was really clear that he knew what he was talking about and he could hold his own just as much as everyone else and all the strategists and leaders in there and then therefore they saw him as a as a viable force of understanding the business just like you know speaking business so I realized that wow that was really really important and it made him not just be like oh he's just the the creative he's gonna make it look nice to the end let's not talk to him that person and get their opinion but it was it was really critical so for me I just you know it's like if you're an author you have to read and read and read so you know it's out there some thing you're gonna be a leader you've got to read and read and whether it's you know finding different podcasts finding different topics like this like this videocast like that's that's just helping inform you about the space right mm-hmm whether it's books there's taught there are tons and tons of great books out there great articles great medium articles whatever it may be but you've got to just soak up something like I have on my staff we have like a monthly you know staff meeting and I'll randomly pick two or three different people to just stand up and report back what they're reading lately and what they've learned whether it's at a conference or a book or whatever so that everyone is a little bit on edge knowing I've got to be ready to present and talk about something so I can't just not do it right I've got to keep going and keep learning or else I'm gonna regress so it's really anything are their favorites of yours in terms of podcasts or resources ha I love looks okay yeah I have tons and tons of books a huge library at my house which is advertising marketing vision whatever it may be leadership there's there's a lot of great stuff out there and when you were first dipping your toes into the Leadership world and immersing yourself in those books did you find them to be boring or interesting or oh absolutely are you kidding me and just look at the book that I just wrote it's all about proving the value of creativity to stakeholders because I had so many problems with you know some CFO comes in and says Oh creativity just fluffy stuffs like we don't need that that's stupid right and so in that journey for five years I read Sony neuroscience science studies that were so dry and so terrible but they're nugget like you get nuggets in there yeah that's the other thing for me that it's taught me is like of reading all that stuff I can see what's good content and what's engaging and good storytelling so as we create stuff here at Adobe I don't want something dry and boring that sounds like a white paper from some professor at university no chances like I want to make sure that it's got a good flow a good story and it's interesting and and still gets you that great data and that great that great concept mm-hmm well I think this is a good point to just let everybody know because people ask me all this asked me this question all the time what design books are you reading it's like I don't read design books first of all most design books are pretty terrible it's mostly a portfolio showcase so you're not gonna gain a lot of insight if you really want to advance in your career in your understanding of things but forget about even a Spirent you creative Victor just to be a better creative person David trot writes about this in his book one plus one equals three and I'll just take a moment to talk about it in that creative people are really good at connecting dots finding relationships between things that most people can't see and that's the beauty of being a creative person so it's not that that's the issue the issue is you do not have enough dots that connect that all your dots seem to line up in one very narrow column that we need to expand the dots that we can connect so if you learn about philosophy psychology about business about marketing about positioning all the negotiations and pricing all those things make you a much richer person and then you could dialogue with more people so when you study only designed only graphics typography though that's the greatest newest trend in design you are most likely only going to be speaking to other creatives and designers and that's the problem it's like even if you're the most gregarious person and you're speaking to designers well that's it and you could be the Pied Piper designers at which some people are out there but if you want to build different relationships if you if you want to be more interesting you got to be able to connect more dots so it's about going out there and broadening the things that turn you on so I'm glad to hear that you're reading these books and that you say they're totally dry and just lifeless but you slog through it and you mined for gold and here's a couple things that can use and that was a waste of two days of reading but otherwise I was able to use that right Oh totally you gotta put in the work a good example of that I went to a writing conference this last weekend with my 18 year old son it was a science fiction and fantasy con and I don't ride in that genre yeah I went to a class on romance writing and horror writing and it was just so interesting you connect those dots you get more and more dots and so super fastening push yourself to try different things not everything but maybe well you're also I think I read on your site that you're also working on a piece of fiction right oh yeah yeah like all of us I mean who isn't like any creative I've seen someone's got a book or a movie or something you're working on there's always these pastors I've got one that I wrote that is a humor book a fiction book about all of my white trash and a week of craziness that basically happened at this trailer park with I took a lot of these real stories and then just put it in a narrative arc and mm-hmm something fun but yeah matter adult some other stuff right well is that fiction or nonfiction your white-trash family that one is well it's fiction because I took all the stories and then changed like sequence and when it happened and who's doing what so that it had a normal novel yellow even though they're all based on unreal crazy stories but I see I think the book is called like my family tree has termites or something yeah yeah and the best part is I had to go out because I went to talk to a lawyer about even talking about my crazy family first of all he was like even if you change the names they can still come after you and I know and I really probably so I went to a family Union ahead I'm all signed an on suing Uncle Joe Billy Bob I just need you to sign this document here yeah and you know the answer was what's that the best was my uncle Paul who's like you know in and out of prison all the time it's like you can tell whatever story you want as long as it doesn't put me back in prison totally fine with it oh my gosh that's a colorful family history you got there oh my goodness I'd read that book yeah and it's available is it available on Amazon sorry we're totally going off okay here's my idea under I don't want to sell it if you're heard like you like speakeasies where it's like you only know about the restaurant if you've been hurt you hear about it through worth your mouth yes I want to make a secret website and it's only available if you happen to get an invite for someone and then you can go and buy it so it's all just behind the scenes mm-hmm like a book easy you just get a bookies you got to wait for an invite and then get into it so I'll have a seat what on the seed list I'll let you know but that's the plan with that one okay we are going all over the place I do want to say something I was in Barcelona barthelona and I went to speakeasies I'm like hey why are the only three people sitting up front like I couldn't even I was like oh my god it really is a speakeasy and you open up the refrigerator and you walk through this corridor so I love the book easy concept what will the facade B Oh some some terrible website that's built from 1994 you know technology and then there's happen to be some Easter egg that gets you into that nice I'm looking forward to that Greg do are we ready or do I just keep going oh yeah we already we already so now the questions are coming yeah all right so Greg mister creative director as I'm evaluating you now based on this new I know a nine-point list where is he falling short all right let's let's take it from the top here okay and I apologize in advance if I butcher any of your names its you mean when you butcher their name yeah thanks yeah so Shafi asks what is a good career path for someone who likes the process of designing in itself with the goal of becoming a creative director what and from what I get from that question it sounds like are they watching a live stream yes didn't Adam already answer this question welcome to my list of questions okay alright Adam go ahead drop the hammer on him oh that's easy like there's a lot of different paths and maybe what they're asking is not what are the things I do and the skills I need but where do I go get jobs and that's you know an endless list you can start out an agency world you could start out at a company you could start out in whatever industry you want there are some different ways to learn and grow and you just have to look for places where you know design is valued design is or you know writing is valued and then find ways to learn and grow and start with note you've got to do now first you've got a new nine first so how are you gonna get the craft figured out you know we don't just walk out of college you know having perfected the craft it takes a lot of hustle and figuring it out so wherever you find that you can have the best opportunity to stretch your creative wings whether it's even on your own I know a lot of people who just go out and build their own you know portfolio in their own site and then get a job at a certain place so there are many ways to the to the end goal all right next question okay let's see I was a little late on that guy's I was fumbling around with my sound I have more sound effects and I will use them so the job asks is it more important to have technical art skills or people skills as a creative director that's an excellent question so let's go back to career paths in my last job I set up these different career paths because it was based on on your skill set you know again going back to the old model of you start out as a production assistant then you move to a designer and then you move to an art director and then a creative director so eliminating that kind of a career path there are multiple paths to the top you could start as a writer or you could be you know it may be a more of an long-form writer you could be a technical designer you could be more of an art director or like a classical designer or even like a motion graphics person and each of those different paths you could be as junior a senior a mid-level whatever it may be so I've seen people make it all the way up and then jump over the the career or sorry the management track from being a grant made art director or being a great writer or even a great production person you know someone who's really good at the technical aspect but not necessarily the concepts and ideas so it's all based on where are you working where do you want to be a CD what kind of role at that company is important is if it's an agency you're probably in better luck if you're like a copywriter and art director because it's all about concepts and ideas and selling them to clients right but if you're in house or at a different company where it's a very technical you know there's a lot of technical design then absolutely that's the right role hole for you to move up that company and get that job as a creative director because you understand that part of the craft so I don't think it's a one-to-one let's stop looking at career paths as a singular path but looking at its like dozens of different paths that we can move up and still be happy and grow and then maybe you know one of those paths is is creative director okay I got a question here Adam because we're about online education so if you had to create a school curriculum for creative directors what kind of classes or resources or how would you design this school so that people who are interested in creative but also want to be good leaders what kind of classes do you think we would need to have in a school let me ask first are the is this more of like a graduate level class where people already have the craft figured out you're the ruler of the world you get to design what this goes like but I would say yeah it's more of a if you want to figure out the craft there's different classes that if you're talking about just leadership then I would say boy there there would certainly be things on leadership styles you know I'd go through the basics of figuring out what your leadership style is and what and what that entails there are a ton of great books there are a ton of great TED talks and and other content out there I'm figuring that out I would also there would have to be some class on figuring finding your voice meaning you know maybe someone just really understands content or someone really understands you know events like you you need to dig in deep and and find that voice and find a thing that you care about so you can lead from it right you can't just you have to have a point of view on some things so that would be really important I think they're happy several classes on just process and resourcing and you know if you want to get any good NBA or whatever degree you'd have to figure out like how do I understand people skills how do I understand you know organization of teams and how do i balance all those things balance the load all all of that stuff I think there should be a class on you know we could bring Douglas Davis in and talking khaki and learning to speak business I think that would be critical those are some of the things like I mean I know it looks like I'm just reading off the list here but you know just dig deeper into those and then imagine you know how do I get those skills and what are the ways to get there and that's probably what I would explore as a created leadership super Greg do you have another one otherwise I have my list of questions too and it might take us a little bit off topic but I know that these are things that your passion about Adam so Greg yeah I got a big old list okay let's fight for the list you go play tennis it's your turn okay I wishing to do some tennis lingo that would make sense here okay you can follow you back to me Natalia asks what are some good ways to establish connections with others how do I approach someone it's a great question so if I were in in her shoes the number one thing if I were to you know whether you're at a current job or starting a new job is to first understand the goals and hopes of above your partner's your strategic partners so if you're a CD go talk to your main strategy person go talk to your main you know process or your finance person whoever it is in the business that you're going to be partnering with you're gonna be a strategic partner with go and sit down and and here's the important part a lot of times you'll get into discussions with people when there's heat on the line there's a big project something's do a big event is coming up and you're working with this person but there are problems and you're working through it and it's if there's just too much fire so don't don't do it then I would do it when things are calm go set up a meeting with them and just talk through and say you know what's your vision what's your your goal and how do you see creative playing a role with with your with your goals and then let's work out a way that we can meet my goals as well and we can start to formulate a plan so being a strategic partner is critical I find that over and over and over with those relationships you have to make people see you as that creative strategic partner not a set of hands so if you just go off and create something in the toss or the fence you're always gonna be a set of hands you need to be that's where you go back you present you own it you talk through it you figure out you know what they're going after teaching them how to give you good feedback telling the types of feedback telling them how you would you know you know what's important to them or with you know what's important to us so I think that those conversations are the first step that I would take I'd go establish that relationship mmm so Greg what's a question about how do you establish relationships with other people yes okay I'll give you my take on it I'll make a lot shorter which is empathy empathy if you want to relate to somebody try to look at the world through their eyes and walk in their shoes so many of us are very egocentric we just think about our life and what we're trying to do that we forget this is another human being in the room and just take yourself out of the equation kill the ego be there a be of service to somebody and empathize with what they're going through and asking just a few smart questions is all that is needed to open up the dialogue all right here we go there's a question here from the JA coop and I think it's relevant whoever this is is asking you can you tell us about your academic background did you study certain thing like did you have an art background or how did you develop into this creative director that's fair I actually started out in college wanting to become an engineer I wanted to create something invent Kevlar you know something like that and then I found that you know I had both creative and kind of a data background but being in a lab would have been the most boring thing on the planet I wanted to come up with stuff more often so I switched over to advertising and marketing and I got a degree in in advertising as well as a business and then just just the way I function you know I I'm kind of a central brainer so I really like both halves it's really been a lot of like looking at the creative field but through that logical lens of like how do I break apart headlines how do I create better headlines what's the structure and then also you know I'm less zen of a creative and more of that like that middle ground finding great ideas loving all the emotion but still also finding the logic behind it so that's where my background is I have a master's degree instead of getting it and creative I started one in creative writing and they just got really frustrated with with that program and ended up switching over to a master's in strategic insight and integrated marketing just because I thought you know being well-rounded is really important I've always been like the creative guy in my whole career for 23 years so adding that to it it would seem to balance it out did you do that back to back get your undergrad and then grad or did you work for no didn't think okay no so okay let's rewind the tape here mid 90s early 90s was on and then what school did you go to Brigham Young it was a local school and they had you know they've got a pre decent advertising program mm-hmm and then northwestern is the one that was grad school that's and how far apart were those two so northwestern is like the last few years like oh really very recently then just doing it at night for fun just because it on you know up with the latest stuff I don't think that's gonna change my career necessarily because you know it's pretty well-established but why not you know go back and get a degree just to for me it helps like when I'm writing articles and thought leadership it's like oh that's an interesting topic I hadn't thought of yeah hey Jonah I just want you to notice too how I'm standing straight by look like I'm leaning can you see that Jonah let me see that slightly yes that should be like this yeah yeah see I told you it's not straight okay all right oh here's here's an interesting question from IPRO tanner he's asking common creative director interview questions and how do you answer them I think they're approaching this the wrong way but I'm gonna ask for them just in case like what's the secret question to get me past all yeah pretty much like what kind of questions can I anticipate being asked and then maybe if you have a couple of juicy executive creative director level answers okay well first of all I'm usually when I'm in an interview it's mostly feeling out the person I've already looked at their you know their resume look at their portfolio I get an idea I wanted to know how they work and function and just their personality and I'm just gonna have them talk about tell me about your work or what you've done and it's an easy open question and it could quickly get into my portfolio am i this I did that versus here's what's really important you know I love you know figuring out all this other stuff and really understanding you know how I'm gonna add vision or maybe talk about your vision or your passions I'll always want to talk about passions and you know what got you into this business what keeps you excited what wakes you up every day you know and and really know deep down what their what their emotional connection is to the work and and then to me because I think that's that speaks so much more but it's it's for me it's not amount of like a secret question I know all over the internet it's like here are the cool you know secret questions that you can learn to answer it's not that at all it's like you can authenticate can real and I can tell from your responses just what your level of experience is and what your level of leadership is and that's gonna stay so much more than a secret answer to question so you're basically saying you're screwed he's gonna give you an open-ended situation and just see how you respond so this is not one of those things that you can memorize like a robot nope you you can't hide the fact that you either know it or you do not and the way that you approach a problem or maybe even the way that you ask questions will reveal everything so there's nowhere to hide all right next question Greg yeah just gonna say that sounds less like a quantifiable and more kind of like a personality check test maybe how you process and think about things totally yeah okay what's up Shiva I see you in there welcome to the live chat miss Chima what's the next question okay so what Chuck asks what are some ways I can prove my value as a leader to my employee hmm employer - employer or employee those are two different questions the second both they're both good okay okay all right it's going I think this goes back to what we just said it all the while back empathy like if you're going to your employer talk to them about what what they're concerned about like figure out what their goals are figure out what they care about and then see how you can use creativity to reach their goals that's that's easy solve their problems with the creative solution as far as your employees help guide them help them feel like they're getting new skillsets like if if any of you have read the book was a crate plate and Christensen how to measure my life where it's all about we do all these great things for businesses and we find these strategies for business but we don't find them for our own careers so as a leader go out go back and help them see what are the things I need to learn where do I need to go what do I need to do because it's not a straight line all the time in an integrate creative career and go back and figure that out and help guide them but but you can't like drag them along life all I've also learned like as a leader it's not like 80% me pushing people along and 20% them it's more of them and I'm there to guide and help them so you've got to see people who are aggressive and willing and have some hustle and then you can help point them in the right directions mm-hmm if you guys want to should definitely check out dr. clayton christians Christensen's videos he has a couple on the internet and he's pretty fantastic I believe he was the one who originally coined the term disruption hmm so he gives some really powerful talks on business and understanding what disruption is in its true sense now we're using I like left and right using yeah in the wrong context too but whatever so Clayton Christensen Greg next question I have a good one mmm I like this one I like to set up okay so this is I Pro Tanner asking it again and they ask how do you create growth for team members as a creative director great question the trick is first I need to assess where they are along in their path and let's say they're on that level we're talking about making that jump to create a picture so they're senior creative and they're just ready to start making the jump the things that I would start to help them with is number one what are they going to own they've got to own something figure out a big project an event something a cat of business and let them go like one that's not like the big main one that if they wreck it it just takes the business but let them own something and then be there as like their their guide to help see how they're doing it and making sure they're you know they're doing all these things they're they're understanding the flow the process the relationships the managing the creative selling at all you know just give them an opportunity to own that and then and then move up from there like that that's where I would start I can't like do it for them I can't like you don't want to micromanage them so it's just give them ownership of something given them a category to own and then they can they can run with it hmm I think it'd be extremely helpful especially if it's something that works within your organization to say why don't you shadow me for a week they'll last any questions just shadow me and see what we do so when you're in those big meetings and you're giving the pitch they can just make observations like I don't know how to do that and so then you can say at the end of the week or whatever I want you to write down the top ten things that you think you need to learn okay go ahead I was gonna say that that happened recently it was funny like one of the guys on my team watched and did a shadow for a day just did some meeting and it was really eye-opening to him he still had good self-awareness that he's like holy crap like there are certain things that I just don't even know how I'd respond in those situations and it helped him see where the gaps were that he needed to learn so right I'm a big believer in teaching people how to learn learning how to learn so that you're not waiting around for people to tell you the answers because the answers are there if you're just willing to ask the questions right so if you see that there's a goal that's out of reach try to identify what that goal is and then try to dissect it down into little bite-sized pieces and Matthew talked about this is a project management course is you want to break it down into chunks so imagine that if you're eating a candy bar and you've ripped it open let's say it's a kind bar well before you eat it you'd look at it's like there's almonds there's caramel nougats raisins or whatever it's in there just make an observation like what is this and then take one bite and try to break it down in your mouth like what are the flavors I'm feeling and do this for everything in your life if you want to learn more about business just begin there and just go down that rabbit hole and be a life learner and just be eternally curious and that's gonna take you very very all right what else we got okay so I'm gonna combine two questions because they're related here so this is a combo question from both Luca and bamboozled yes see so what are the hardest decisions and the most common decisions you have to make as a creative director what are the most hardest and most common okay that's interesting i I think I mean one of the hardest and this is true to any creative is what's the next big idea like you can't just go look it up and grab it you've got to find it so as a CD you have to look for those big ideas the odd diamonds in the rough and so one of the hardest thing is is finding those making sure that when you find that idea it's one that works for the business it's one that works creatively it's one that works for the team like there's so many different levels to that a lot of times when you look up at a CD and they choose something that you don't like you're always like you just chooses the lame ideas right but no there's really a lot going on behind it of finding what are the right ideas that are hit the strategy and that are on target and and work and are creatively brilliant that's hard so finding those are really challenging and then what was the other thing the easiest questions are just common and hardest coming in hard yeah oh I mean common stuff is just the lame ankle-biters that'll eat you alive all day that's just like meetings meetings meetings there's just you know follow up on this and that there's just it's almost like process stuff process stuff just eats you alive just information to people emails following up on whatever so that that's the stuff that eats me up mmm do you find that it's hard to be a creative director and still get that time on the machine and get your hands dirty oh of course of course balancing all of it is is really really hard and if you look at that list of 9 things like how much time do I spend a number 9 how much you know whatever else it is that's extremely challenging and there are a lot of tricks like sometimes I've started just block out chunks of my calendar mm-hmm I know like I've got to focus on just writing something really cool or designing something really cool in that time and it I don't know the more you move up in in see deal and the more people want your time and I just find like sometimes I could to my kid my joke to my children when they say what you know what is your dad do it's like I'm just really good at meetings that's what I that's my cigar that is not something sexy though it does not it's not but that's what I do I mean a ton of my life is just giving vision guidance helping listening you know it's just meetings meetings meeting so mm-hmm well talking about meetings our meeting is almost over here I just like oh my gosh the hours almost up Greg I'm gonna give you the ability to ask the last question otherwise I'm gonna take it oh man okay let me get a good one yeah okay okay here we go we'll change it a little bit so Tony asks what do you still want to learn good question Tony all right what do you still want to learn Adam right now I'm super fascinated in just book writing and novel writing and ideas and character development and storytelling I'm just there's so much to learn with all of that like I don't think anyone's like the master storyteller so I think how do you figure out what content is awesome and how do you build that content that's that's intense good answer man yeah good answer I can see where you're going with this you want to be a writer and write all kinds of things and share your thoughts and speaking of writing I was on your website and your blog and will tell people how to find that in one second but this question really intrigued me now I'm gonna ask it and you're like Chris that's gonna take too long for me to answer then we'll end it on the cliffhanger but I'm hoping you could at least stir it up a little bit I want to end on a little controversy all right so here we go why are time sheets an enemy of creativity I want to hear this this is a good one you're right you've you've already that that's something that I'm gonna go off on for 20 minutes give us a trailer yeah I wrote a huge article on this you did it on medium or LinkedIn and you know it's gotten a lot of views thousands and thousands of views but the truth is I you know for 20 years in that agency life I was living under a timesheet world where you had to keep track of your time constantly and and even being not just me doing it but being on the management side at several agencies of seeing how my creative teams handle time how they dealt with it the truth is this we think from a business perspective that the best way to define the value from a creative act is by putting it into a time increment mm-hmm and that's totally flawed it should be on the value of the object that comes out of it because you all know creativity strikes in different ways you know there's different times and you know when you put pressure on it like and you're using too much your prefrontal cortex and your logically like you're gonna lose all your creative so it's it's a real tough balance and I just feel like it's a flawed system and when you really dig into it it's all fake data and there's nothing real coming out of it I mean I know I did and everyone just use out their timesheets and makes them whatever they need to be to fit the needs of whoever is hounding them for it mm-hmm so go read the article and then let's have a conversation and email me and look I'm happy to chat about it but okay that's okay I mean I want to just expand on that just a half second here I think corporations and sometimes artists and designers measure success in inputs like how much input do I put into it like how many hours what kind of resources do I use but in truth most people measure success by output so we live in this conflicted system where maybe as a byproduct of the Industrial Revolution how we quantify people's value by having them clock in and clock out and it's a meaningless measure right because as I was reading a different article not yours they said that if you ever just want to raise all you have to do is be slower create less and use this use more time basically and so the whole system is upside down if you don't understand like say if you had to do two logos under the system of measuring time if you want to raise just do two logos in four months and that's a really messed-up way to measure success or productivity or efficiency okay it's time now for the summary of the show before I say goodbye to Adam I want to summarize a few things here and there's lots for me to kind of break down but here's a few things I've floated to the top that we have to understand that this is a myth being a better creative will not get you to being a creative director so don't just keep doubling down on the creative skills as you can see they were at the bottom of adam's chart learn to be a better leader that's you want to begin and because a lot of people don't always speak English sometimes they have a hard time figuring stuff out it's Clayton Christensen how will you measure your life I think that's the book you mentioned right okay good okay now if Adam were to create a school to make creative directors and this is not a prompt for us creating a course you guys relax he said these are things that we need to talk about defining your leadership style finding your voice I added thick your voices your Y your purpose understanding process designing process learning how to resource and balance teams and just to get a general knowledge of business so I just wrote in there business 101 so here's the summary of Adams and nine points in my words and his that you need to learn to build relationships that the idea of the lone wolf the lone creative is going to hurt your ability to become a creative director so you need to learn how to build rapport to be empathetic and to learn how to serve others on your team as well as your clients or your boss you need to learn to speak the language of business which is all about think how they think we need to learn that and if you if you want to excel you have to start thinking of yourself as a leader and to have vision and Adams perfect phrases Reid to lead if you want to be leader you need to read I was going to say you need to be a reader I guess that works too and what a lot of people don't understand and this is going to be the bear to entry for a lot of people is you have to learn how to present you have to learn how to pitch and sell concepts and ideas you have to learn how to master the meeting and there's lots of books and videos to help you do this that means you have to learn how to communicate articulate your ideas to have to command a certain amount of to be present and to have presence you need to learn how to manage the machine which I just wrote down is systems design understanding how everything works and making it really efficient resourcing you talked about balancing the workload you have to hustle you can't be complacent you can't just show up so we're really gonna push the limits you have to manage and this is what most people understand how to manage other creatives to empower them and also to help resolve conflicting personalities and issues and last on the list surprisingly for some of you guys is you have to work on the craft that you have to be a working creative director you can't just be somebody who phones it in a telephone designer as Paul Rand would call it and the path to being a creative director begins at the top of this list to go down the stack Adam W Morgan that's his name he's the executive creative director over at Adobe and you can check him out on his website Adam W Morgan calm and there's a book even though he may or may not want us to help him push it or promote it it's called sorry Spock emotions drive business you could buy it on Amazon I just wanna let you guys know because people keep asking about this in the in the spirit of PBS or Sesame Street this episode was brought to you by the typeface to knock out people keep asking about that and don't forget you guys if you liked this episode leave us a like comment and subscribe I love you guys the sustaining members and the donation Adam Morgan thank you very much for being on our show guys give them a round of applause thank you

Channel: The Futur

Views: 91,338

Keywords: Creative director, Skills, How to become a creative director, creative, art, art director, how to become, how to, creative director, creative director (job title), advertising, design, marketing, what does a creative director do, become a creative director, branding, director, design careers, creative career advice, interview, career, jobs, agency, marketing and advertising (organization sector), design agency, design career questions, the futur, chris do

Id: aHPsfiGsxF4

Length: 63min 5sec (3785 seconds)

Published: Fri Feb 22 2019