2015 Kia Soul 27 kWh 65k km degradation test

this video was brought to you by stoneburg about the replanner mr green ken power and marcus bill yo what's up we have yet another kia soul this is 27 kilowatt hour from 2015 so it's seven year old and we're going to do a degradation test again but this one has not done that many kilometers but this is the same guy who has that otherwise his mother uh has that that soul that has so much degradation and he just told me that actually his mother at one time but it was just parts of a year she was dc fast charging a lot because she didn't have home charging but still that's that is a small portion over the big lifetime of that car yeah that was the one with the red roof but anyway this one is a different one different car still a soul anyway i just plugged it in and topped it up again to 100 because it was a 99.5 but you can see here that here now we have 100 and then state of the charity bms is 95 hmm it would be interesting to see maybe when the car was branch banking new maybe 100 back then was uh different here and that's the way they can hide some degradation but at one point they can't do that anymore but you see that the the the cells they charge to 4.1 volt so i guess this is also a way to avoid too much degradation because if you i think of a charter test not 100 or a leaf it would be 4.2 volts and that's bad for the battery to charge that much every day but okay anyway you see that this oh this one was being discharged now had to be careful but you can see it here you can see it here 12.2 volt okay you want to don't don't only camp like this for too long but we have 65k on the onometer only after seven years so i'm going to do the regular stuff reset everything and then off we go and i can show you by the way yeah i i start seeing now that these soles they tend to be like this uh gray interior is very common okay anyway let's unplug and then go yeah it uses type one and charter more and this is the chart port all right we're on the moon now so uh not much going on we have some traffic out of oslo as usual so you see we start here with 90 kilowatt discharge power well at least that's what is reported from the car okay it's going kind of slow up the hill i don't want to drive too fast yeah i'm doing around 75 kilometers per hour now so i would try to not have too hard acceleration and also yeah try to cruise at around 90 kilometers per hour to avoid too high discharge rate because especially with these old batteries [Music] you will have more and more internal resistance which means that when you discharge you will have more heat loss and also that is important for me to test the actual driving because ebms might claim something but i don't know if the bms counts internal resistance in the estimation or not and by the end of the day what matters is what what why is that mother trucker hammering that is barely legal but by the end of the day you're not supposed to use the car in the lab you're supposed to drive around with it and what you get out of the battery actual energy out of the battery after losses is what counts so uh this method is very time consuming but i believe it's the correct way so we're going to charge it up uh at least to 90 i think after the test now just to verify that the numbers that the car reports are correct we are passing by garden one right now uh the battery is down to 73 percent can you see it uh there yeah and the consumption actually despite going uphill is 153 watt a kilometer but we have tailwind and then on the way back we have a headwind so i have to keep that in mind and also have to keep in mind that uh the stator charge scale here is not linear which means that i probably want to turn around at um well okay at 60 which is probably 55 ish percent so as usual i will just look at gum okay how much we have like 80 kilometers is what the car estimates and then i look at the distance back to uh oslo you know 38 kilometers so um then we just keep driving usually i have to drive to uh dal or nepene sometimes minisun we'll see today okay this is it nibinus see here we have 59 left let's hope that's enough uh yeah yeah let's turn around here [Music] and then you see here by the way the temperature in the battery pack has gone up this is the way lithium batteries work that when you discharge it you get a little bit of heat coming out just imagine when you're doing some work a workout or something you're lifting something right then you are also eventually sweating but you your body gets hot because your body is not that efficient but actually i think the body is highly inefficient compared to uh electric motors but okay but this one here uh so why why does it heat up well again i can't explain why but at least i can tell you that in order for the battery to heat up it needs to take the energy from somewhere and it takes it from the battery itself so that's that heat loss i've been talking about and you can't avoid it i mean depends on which chemistry this year you can have lower internal resistance but yeah so then my point is that with higher internal resistance then you have more loss so as the battery ages you will have more of this so um and also as far as i know the cars instruments they cannot measure the heat loss they only measure what goes out from the battery or into the battery but not the heat loss so in a way the trip meter or whatever you see there it's not always correct so but yeah i have to say by the way the car feels fairly quiet we are on semi rough asphalt not too bad noise i think this car has summer tires on i suspect maybe some kind of michelin with a acoustic foam i'm gonna check it out i guess if i remember once we stopped all right the test is done we are now safely at the fast charger so if you look at the stats um we have five percent left on display six percent in the bms uh cell voltage 3.2 hmm wait can you see that yeah there you can see it yeah 26 degrees so no cold get there and then if you look at your trip meter now uh 156 watts a kilometer okay uh slightly thirsty on the other runs maybe because of summer tires and then 123.4 kilometers all right let's plug in and then start crunching some numbers here huh interesting the charger reports that we started with four percent and then how does the charger know this well the car reports to the charger so somehow the car says it's four percent but then it was five percent display here and then i'm not sure what's up with this one but um uh in the previous sessions with other cars we managed to get 125 amp this one is only 120 so that's why well should we get higher speed i think it was supposed to be higher right but it's still good okay i think on this charger 90 try to make that as standard on these tests oh yeah before i forget it the tires i was so wrong we have nixon but not the inferior nixon and blue hd the high definition okay 205 60 r16 all right okay so at least my impression is that they are quiet wait how old are they let me check here looking for the the date stamp made in korea all right korean quality hmm let me see it's supposed to be a 25-15 whoa what the heck yeah it's a bit upside down now but uh 25 15. so this is also ancient tires seven years old tires oh wow all right let's summarize everything now so um actually i will take four percent as the remaining battery not five percent so i'm not sure if this decision is correct but remember that the car is reporting to the charger how many percent it has the charger doesn't know really um but i've seen some uh inconsistency uh in in car scanner this app that i use is called car scanner that even for e-golf it was not displaying the the same one there versus the charger info and also but also when i tested the kia recently the other kia when i was charging i looked at the cars display versus the charger display and it was also different which is weird because remember that the charger gets the info from the car but okay so four percent is the remaining then and then based on all that we have 20.1 kilowatt hour of energy and then i calculate that we have 23 degradation so that is on par with the other cars i've tested in similar age similar distance we're going to check the the table soon but um another check i do is that okay i charge from percent to ninety percent at least what is displayed and then we see how many kilowatt hours the charger uh delivers and then i can calculate based on that that if we would charge a hundred percent if everything is linear we would get we would need a 19.9 kilowatt hour from the charger but that doesn't make sense since we pull 20.1 kilowatt hour from it right but then remember that the stator charge scale here is amp hour based it's not linear uh it's always been like this for the korean cars so uh uh what it means is that uh it also depends on voltage when you wanna come like convert amp hour into kilowatt hour then you also have to take an account voltage and then voltage drops towards the end and then voltage so what i mean is that uh actually let's say one percent towards hundred percent is more energy dense than one percent towards zero and that means that if we actually take in account that it's not linear then it's roughly my assumption is that if we would charge it 100 if i would sit and wait long enough and actually it wouldn't work anyway because it would stop by 94 but if it would work then i will probably need more like 21 kilowatt hour from the charger based on all this stuff it's just an assumption uh and that corresponds with what i've seen before because when you fast charge you build up heat in the battery which is loss and then also the fan was running a little bit but the fan is probably not more than 50 watts maybe less so that makes sense so this is just like a sanity check to double check that okay can we trust the the instrument cluster because some people doubt that we can trust it but based on what all the numbers i have presented for you now i i can assume or i i can say that we can trust the numbers there because we double check the source there and then the source from the charger and they seem to correspond everything all right and then one other thing is um the charter screen so um it seems like this turning session it dropped slightly earlier maybe just a few percent earlier than before i'm not sure exactly how many percent it dropped that but it could be because the battery was actually overheating was a already close to around 35 degrees roughly is when it starts rotting so it doesn't want to go too far too hot but at least that goes for the e saw i'm not sure how it is here but that could explain it so actually for uh for the optimal uh charting session you don't want the battery to be too hot also and then the last thing we're gonna check now is the table so uh how is is this one i have to explain i updated some stuff in the table here um the number of cycles that you see here is just an estimation because we don't know exactly how this and car scanner doesn't report number of cycles and also how do you actually count a cycle right because a cycle is well i'm not sure per definition but if you charge the battery to 100 and then discharge it to 0 i think that's per definition one cycle but that's one deep cycle but then if you only charge uh let's say you charge to 70 percent and then you only spend ten percent of that you go from seventy percent discharge to ten percent then you only use one tenth of a cycle but then if you do it ten times then you also spend hundred percent but that is a smaller cycle and actually that's better for degradation to have smaller cycles so in a way you can say that yeah when you see those the documents and says how many cycles the battery can take then by using or by having small smaller cycles you will then get more total cycles than if you have deep cycles so anyway okay this is getting too complicated but so the way i come calculate cycle is that i look roughly at what the real world ranges on these cars but then i also look at my own range test so and you see i start reusing lots of data that i already have from other tests i do real world test and then i take uh the range in summer and range in winter and also the 90 test versus the 120 test i take some kind of average based on those four conditions and i find like the the the the all year all around uh consumption number ish and then i also know the the battery size roughly and i uh then figure out what the typical range is for a full cycle and then based on the odometer we calculate or estimate the cycles i think it's good enough right uh and what else did i add up here uh yeah i also have something called degradation cycle is this too i should say degradation per 1000 or 1k cycle so it's basically how much degradation do you have per 1000 cycles that number almost makes more sense than the pure degradation number because you see that i actually sorted the table based on the degradation per 1k cycles and then the lower the better uh on top while you have mg's at the cv but they're probably hiding something because there's got to be some degradation that's also another thing is that every battery degrades just like every wife degrades over time you might not see it but my wife also degrades i also degrade so believing that a battery doesn't degrade it's like believing that your wife doesn't degrade but okay so anyway so we had the 23 degradation and it's roughly on par with the other cars on the same one yeah so i'm not sure what else to say um it again it seems like the kiosks they degrade more than egolf uh some people actually i think there was only one guy he claims that yeah but you only tested a few you only have very low samples here so that's not statistically enough to draw any conclusions well yes i know we need to do at least 50 tests before we can count it as statistically significant but do you want me to test 50 esol's and 50 goals just to see if there is any correlation there is wise niche but anyway uh at least my claim so far is that these kiosks they degrade faster but from what i heard also uh it's just this generation even the generation after this one the 30 kilowatt hour has better chemistry better design or something where this this one is kind of like bad because supposedly some cells some modules they don't get enough cooling and they tend to over heat up more than other modules and that's probably why eventually some modules start failing and then you get a big leap in degradation yeah so i'm not sure this is just some claims i heard so i haven't been able to verify it but anyway okay very long conclusion but hopefully this conclusion gave you guys more insight about batteries and degradation and all this stuff uh so i hope this was as correct as possible so remember the abc always be correct and if i made some mistakes then please and enlighten me all right that's gonna be it for now i hope you guys enjoyed this video as always thank you for watching and talk to you later

Channel: Bjørn Nyland

Views: 12,393

Keywords: Teslabjørn, Teslabjorn, TB, Bjørn Nyland

Id: IdI3PkZ_cV8

Length: 18min 28sec (1108 seconds)

Published: Sat May 14 2022