Why I Joined the Mormon Church | Debbie - NE | Atheist Experience 24.20

now I'd really like to move on to Debbie and New England and it says it's loading it says that you actually did are you the wonderful person who called and said that your son was in Australia that definitely awesome so if I remember correctly you your son is in Australia he was on a retreat for to be a Mormon he was on he was on a Mormon mission yes a mission okay and he's back now and you told him that you called and he's willing to talk sit with us yes he is he's here now and I'm really excited he was gracious enough to come on and and have a conversation and absolutely I guess a four-way call or we put him on and then get off the line or house with me to Anthony I did want to say I've watched some of your Street epistemology videos and I do want to thank you so much for your lovely approach because it really helps somebody like me tends to be kind of fiery and not very patient maybe learned how to approach something in a little in a more respectful manner so I thank you very much for that you were very little anyway my son my son Eric is here and he's ready to talk yeah hello Eric tell us tell us about your tell us about your missionary trip where you did a get cut short because of the virus or what yes unfortunately it was I was originally supposed to continue to be in Australia for I guess at this point five months when I came home it was six I was supposed to come back in in October but then the virus of course you know swept the nations and we were under the impression that missionaries in Australia I'm not sure how many are in Australia exactly there were about a hundred and eighty where I was living I was living in Victoria and Tasmania that's where a lot of the missionaries that I was working with were we're staying we were under the impression that Australia was mostly safe we didn't really get hit that hard missionaries were going to be staying that's the word that we were getting from church leaders and then next minute the stray lien government basically comes out saying that they're going to be restricting flights and a lot of neighboring countries like New Zealand and Tonga and Samoa and many other Pacific Islands where a lot of the missionaries I was working with came from we're closing their borders even to their own citizens and so they had to evacuate us even the Americans and I ended my missionary service and now I'm back in the US and back with your family yeah this is interesting were you not originally Mormon you found your way to the church that's correct yes I joined the church when I was 19 I was raised not a member of any Church really under any belief system yeah exactly not under any belief system at all neither of my parents really believed in God my dad sort of but neither of my parents went to church certainly neither than did anything like pray or you know read the Bible or anything like that and as I'm sure mine my mom has shared on on the show just a few months ago I eventually made my way out to Utah to attend University and of course that's where I was really exposed to the church and I ended up joining about a year later hmm what was it about the church that made you decide to join it um well that's that's the question not easily answered with just one thing there were a lot of things that can you try to keep it short with I yes I'll try to I'll get the short version absolutely so I guess a couple of the things that drew me was one thing that it was it was a church where the teachings and the doctrines make sense I thought they were sound it was a great community of church members to be a part of I it seemed like a decision that was right to do at the time okay what was it about the teachings that made you think that it made sense well there were there are a few things that that made sense to me that I saw I guess we're a lot more fair than a lot of the things that are taught by other churches around the world and I guess I'll preface anything by saying that I'm not saying that the teachings of other churches are bad goodness snow and that members of other churches are not okay certainly not there are many millions of amazing people that believe in great things so I'll practice anything just with that first of all I want to eliminate any I'm glad that I'm glad that you did because lots of people will say that their doctor makes sense to them I've literally had videos and people from a variety of different faith traditions saying that it just makes sense to me and that's the reason why they adhere to it do you think that's a really good reason for thinking that something is true is it good enough for you um all by itself no but it definitely piques my interest but it was enough to get you interested in the church okay so that makes sense so yeah it made sense to you it appeal to you possibly you started studying it more did you find something that confirmed to you that it is factually true well there so I'm not really sure how much this whole me the the name of the show is called the the atheist experience and this is my first time on here so I'm not we're doing really good because we're not we're not religious anymore and so that what we're doing is we want people to call and tell us what they believe and why because it's confusing to us now we're looking back and we're wondering why anybody believes any of this yeah I should have I should not have assumed that you knew the premise of the show we would like to ask you a question to challenge why you think that that's true I hope that that's evident but if not we're gonna have some pretty good questions we want to we want to figure out how you got to this point where you decided to go to Australia to share this news with other people so you must think that it's true I think tell us how you concluded that it's factually true to the point that when you would get on an airplane and fly to Australia and leave your friends and family to spread the word about the Mormon Church tell us yeah how did you get there I know that it appealed to you and it made sense to you did you confirm that it's factually true let's start there did I confirm that it's actually true well I guess I should say right from the get-go that and I'm not saying you specifically I'm saying anyone listening that is interested in me providing empirical evidence these are longitudinal case studies and so on and so forth that conclusively proved DNA why I'm not I'm not looking for that I don't know about Jenner I'm not looking I'm not looking for that at all okay I'm interested in what can what convinced you don't look at this as what you need to do to convince us or anyone listening or your mom or anything how did you become convinced that this is factually true yeah I I just wanted to get that premise out of the way that there there's no way for me to just actually prove the existence of God for example I can certainly provide my personal experience I can certainly rely a lot of evidences that and that sort of thing but I'll move on to the question sorry I'm probably taking a lot of time but the thing that convinced me I guess was twofold one of which was I like I said like I said at the beginning it was it was a church and its teachings that made a lot of sense to me for example and I'm not necessarily naming anyone in particular but generally many churches out there believe for example that there's only one heaven and one hell and that's a black and white end of story if you die without baptism you're going to hell if you died without hearing about God or Jesus Christ no baptism you're going immediately to hell that never sat right with me that never seemed right morally intuitively or even biblically and when I was learning more about the church in the plan of salvation providing answers to what happens to these people that didn't have the chance to say embrace God or learn about Jesus Christ or even have the opportunity to to be baptized what happens to them there there's merciful answers that that happen to these people and so it's stuff like that that's just one example that that's good that's good lent money in it let me interject and repeat it back just real quick I don't want to cut off but I also want to get through this real quick so it seems to me like you were saying the message that the LDS Church gives the story you found appealing and I asked you how did you conclude that that's true and that's what you that's one of the things that you told us there might be more do you think that that's a good reason that that a story being appealing to you maybe it's not so much fire and brimstone and there's not going to be an end times and well maybe you'll get your own planet or maybe you'll just cease to exist when you die rather than burn it does does the appeal a does the what's the word I'm looking for does the does the appeal of a message have anything to do with the truth of the claim perhaps not immediately I guess the main reason the main convincing saying that I guess I guess I would it later how about prior to deciding you said you said not immediately yeah you you you you you brought in a time element to it and so I let me just repeat the question was the question was how did you conclude that this is true you you told us it makes sense to you but then it was more than that the message was appealing I'm talking about how how you concluded that it's factually true to the point where you decide to join the church and leave so why are you introducing a time element to it I would think that the appeal the appeal of a message what exactly are you saying why are you bringing time into this well I'm sorry my answer not immediately it wasn't my intention to bring in is bring in a time element I must have misinterpreted the question that's when they did it was probably an error on my end but I guess the the main thing that convinced me to join was you know I'm so sorry love you asked him a question right and it was was is is the appeal is something being appealing does that have anything to do with the truth of the claim and that should really be time and to be like you know would something be more true later just as we waited a year I should not an introduced a time element that was that was that was my fault please disregard calm yeah we won't we won't get on faith yeah so on on face value I suppose not you would not use this I guess in a lot of other fields such as the scientific world just because something feels right or it appears to be true doesn't always necessarily make it true we thought for a long time that the world wasn't composed of atoms for example but then we found out that that time and space expanded infinitely but of course we learned that there's atoms exist and that there is a non divisible element that we get to at some point so not everything just because it seems true necessarily is so you're you're right there but there did that sort of answer your question that or not answer the question but I'm sorry clear up my ambiguity that I'm sorry I didn't mean to create a yes you told us that you do not believe that it's a good idea to to assume that something is true because it's because it feels right or it's appealing that's what you said right yeah so so that's no longer a reason to believe in a God correct well it could be a reason it did a good reason right a good logical reason efficient yeah do you think that that's a sign I were to go to someone and tell them what I just told you that there is no immediate heaven in hell on that sort of thing we didn't say that like sound of that I would not say that as an immediate decision to join the church all by itself I'm not saying that alone would be a good decision just because something sounds appealing I would say to what would what could be added to it that could that could make that legitimate reason all by itself I don't think is just because something sounds good I don't think will be a good reason but I do think that it should inspire you to look into it further essentially is that's a community that you feel that you could embrace then what's the harm in looking into it further well that's a different thing asking what's the harm in looking in something into something is completely different from going with the assumption that it's true so so is there a way that this that the appeal of something can be necessarily true if you add if you add what to it what would make a good reason did you repeat the question so we we agreed all three of us that appeal something I claim to be appealing does not have anything to do with with the legitimacy whether or not it's true right so you said that not sorry you said not alone and so I'm curious what could you add to it that would make that a good reason to believe if it if it doesn't do on its own what what what can you do that you know I got shot so I guess it could be a number of things for one thing I guess you could there there are there's there's lots of I guess you could say there's a lot of research being done out there to validate biblical claims for example a lot of people that may not necessarily believe in Jesus Christ just as one example lots of people out there may believe he's a fictional person he simply never existed I'm right so that's personally it kind of extreme wrong direction I'm so sorry you're talking about appealing to Jesus Christ we're talking about adding to an appealing claim were so now right now we're not talking about Jesus right now in this in this second we're talking about what can you add to appeal to make something true look up evidence if your evidence and appeal so isn't appeal evidence well I don't exactly have a checklist that you know this has to be checked off in order for something to be confirmed but okay I'm sorry I'm sorry if it sounds like I'm berating you I'm just I'm just trying to get down at the bottom of this cuz because we don't have a whole you know forever can I jump in it sounded like you were saying just very quickly there Eric that you sort of recognize that just because something makes sense to you or because it has the the message has an appeal maybe those are the best reasons and now we're asking you well what else do you have and you were starting to say something about the Bible and Jesus and the stories so did you verify did you verify that those are true and then that's the reason why you decided to go into the LDS Church and become a missionary and do all that give us something that we can talk with you about that really is the reason why you think that it's true you gave a couple of them and I think we can I we've drawn some lines through those I think because I think because I think we're starting to realize that maybe they're not good reasons what's what's your best reason for thinking that the Mormon Church the LDS Church has it figured out that that Book of Mormon is really true well first of all I guess I could say that I definitely kind of came into this unprepared I wasn't exactly aware of the the premise of the show described it was just well no no no I'm not I'm not saying that to parade on you guys certainly not you two have been wonderful wonderful and kind and everything but it was I was under the impression that this would just be a discussion of how I came to faith and and you know explaining that and maybe helped clear up misconceptions about oh I see I did not at all understand that I was on it expected to give factual proof as to why the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints is is the only true church or something like that I was not expecting that but would you be willing to look into it and then getting back to us I could I can certainly give it a shot but if this is the direction that's going I'm sorry I really just don't have a good answer that I can give you guys I can't give you empirical factual data that proves that the church is true I didn't come prepared with that and I don't think you know I I think I said this one before I'm personally not looking for that from you I'm really not there might be other people who are expecting that or I guess it would be nice to have if you if you can demonstrate if actually that's true but you you changed your behavior because I presume you think that it's true and I'm interested in how you concluded that it's true what are your biggest best reasons I'm not actually I'm not asking for for proof I'm asking for your explanation of how you concluded that it's true and there's a difference right but but if you're not comfortable we're not going to force you to talk to us absolutely yes oh yeah I don't know I do not feel uncomfortable add value to has been have been very kind and not consultation 'el in any way and I do appreciate that I don't know if you've ever tried teaching Australians about Jesus but it's certainly still a bit hostile experiences thanks for calling in and Debbie thank you for having your is your son thanks for bringing him on that was pretty cool yeah thank you so much I really hope I really hope that both of you can call back at some point yeah well I thank you guys thank you okay so this is just not letting me drop so I'm just going to talk on the next maybe you can try oh yeah let me see oh they're gone okay and I kind of wanted to get to that was interesting Wow you know a second maybe just briefly what's dinner gonna be like at that household I mean that's just so interesting that the the mother would encourage the son to call in a show it's honestly the way that he was describing it it's not different than what you do on this show so I don't feel like he was misled by he felt pressure or caught a little caught off guard I think maybe I am i I think I worded a phrase a certain way that I noticed his attitude changed after that and I think I'm maybe I'm not trying to speak for him he's not here so sorry I'll just blame it on you it's your fault it's probably my fault honestly that was a good call yes it very is very interesting and it actually sort of reveals the main reasons why a lot of people think that this is true for the verse of people they say it just makes sense to me the stories resonate with me I can sleep better at night because I think that it's true there's no question I I'm willing to go get on board with you with that it's it's how can we verify that it's the case and he's a young person hopefully he'll give it some thought and then maybe he'll come back and give us an update and maybe check out some of the videos where we've used a version of that engagement with missionaries of the LDS Church there on my youtube channel okay that'd be awesome there will probably be a link for the surface homology channel on YouTube in the link and I wonder why just on that note just to leave that I wonder why somebody would believe in something that they can't proof it makes sense to me though I mean I think we largely do it because coming to grips with be uncertainty can be a problem for a lot of people it's just it's a lot easier to just say well I like the message it makes me feel good these people are really nice my goodness I could really see a future in this new family of it right what what's the harm or it's a logical fallacy I found out but that should be introduced this time element two and maybe he did or didn't but sometimes I think people think well it will eventually come to me all these people are believing it they can't certainly all be mistaken so maybe I just need to devote myself and put more time into it and then I'll eventually come around and figure out what it really is that's backing all this stuff up when in reality it's it's the it's the very basic cursory stuff that he mentioned at the start that's actually why I believed it was cuz everybody and I knew did so they can't all be wrong that was my reasoning

Channel: The Atheist Experience

Views: 27,145

Rating: 4.8317757 out of 5

Keywords: Atheist experience, the atheist experience, theatheistexperience, atheist, atheism, atheist vs christian, atheist debate, religion debate, atheism debate, Matt Dillahunty (Broadcast Artist), belief, faith, reason, rational, proof, evidence, logic, fallacy, religion, religious, science, secular, skepticism, skeptic, questioning god, doubt, is god real, agnostic, agnosticism, evidence for god, christianity, islam, morality, evidence for Jesus, Jesus, Jesus Christ, debate, bible, bible contradictions

Id: nox5uCpsJO8

Length: 21min 55sec (1315 seconds)

Published: Wed May 20 2020

Reddit Comments

[u/RealDaddyTodd]

I heard this the other day when it streamed live. This kid doesn’t come across as particularly bright, and I’m skeptical of his claim he didn’t know what kind of show it was. I mean, “The Atheist Experience” isn’t exactly hiding its agenda.