What is Nothing? | Episode 1212 | Closer To Truth

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I'M ASKED FROM WHERE DOES CLOSER TO TRUTH COME? FROM "NOTHING", I SAY. LET ME EXPLAIN. I WAS A CHILD, NOT YET 13 - LYING IN BED AT SUMMER CAMP WHEN AN ABRUPT AWARENESS FRIGHTENED ME. WHAT IF NOTHING EXISTED? WHAT IF NOTHING EVER EXISTED? NOT JUST NO PLANETS, NO PLANTS, NO PEOPLE. BUT, NO ANYTHING! NO MATTER. NO ENERGY. NO SPACE. NO TIME. NOTHING FOREVER! WHY DOES ANYTHING AT ALL EXIST? MY WHOLE LIFE I'VE WONDERED. I'M ROBERT LAWRENCE KUHN AND CLOSER TO TRUTH, ALL CLOSER TO TRUTH, REFLECTS THIS WONDER. I CONFRONT MY OBSESSION BY EXPLORING "NOTHING". WHY IS THERE SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING? WHAT IS NOTHING? PHILOSOPHERS AND SCIENTISTS OFFER THEIR VIEWS. I IMMERSE MYSELF IN NOTHING. RICHARD, WHEN WE THINK OF WHY THERE IS ANYTHING, THERE IS NOTHING MORE ASTONISHING, NOTHING, THAN THERE IS SOMETHING. THAT NOTHING WOULD HAVE BEEN THE MOST LOGICAL POSSIBILITY. I SHARE THAT INTUITION. IT IS EXTREMELY PUZZLING. WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE? WELL, ALL EXPLANATION CONSISTS IN TRYING TO FIND SOMETHING SIMPLE AND ULTIMATE FROM WHICH EVERYTHING, ON WHICH EVERYTHING ELSE DEPENDS. IT'S VERY STRANGE THAT WE THINK OF NOTHING AS THE SORT OF DEFAULT BECAUSE WE'RE NOT FAMILIAR WITH IT. WE'VE NEVER LIVED IN A WORLD IN WHICH THERE IS NOTHING. YOU HAVE DISCOVERED THE PRESUPPOSITION THAT MAKES THE QUESTION OF WHY IS THERE ANYTHING AT ALL, SO VEXING, BECAUSE NOTHING DOES SEEM SIMPLER THAN ANYTHING ELSE. WHAT WOULD COUNT AS AN ANSWER TO THE QUESTION? OF COURSE WE CAN'T DESCRIBE IN A WAY THAT NON-EXISTENT THINGS INTERACT WITH EACH OTHER TO PRODUCE EXISTENT THINGS; IT WOULD HAVE TO HAVE SOME SORT OF ANSWER IF IT HAD AN ANSWER AT ALL. THAT IS JUST THE KIND OF QUESTION THAT WE WILL BE STUCK WITH WHEN WE HAVE A FINAL THEORY. NO MATTER HOW MATHEMATICALLY CONSISTENT AND LOGICALLY CONSISTENT THE THEORY IS, THERE WILL ALWAYS BE THE ALTERNATIVE THAT WELL PERHAPS THERE'S NOTHING AT ALL; NOT EVEN EMPTY SPACE BUT JUST ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. CLOSER TO TRUTH, AT ITS CORE, IS MY QUEST TO UNDERSTAND THIS ULTIMATE QUESTION - WHY IS THERE SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING? I SOUGHT THE PHILOSOPHER JOHN LESLIE, WHO FOR DECADES HAD BEEN ASKING - "WHY IS THERE A UNIVERSE, NOT A BLANK?" I'VE DEVOTED ALL MY CAREER TO TRYING TO LOOK INTO THIS QUESTION. I THINK THERE'S TWO GENERAL SORTS OF QUESTIONS WHICH SCIENCE CAN NEVER ANSWER. AND ONE OF THEM IS WHY ARE THERE ANY LAWS AT ALL IN THE WORLD? AND THE OTHER IS WHY THERE'S ANY WORLD OTHER THAN A BLANK? I THINK OUR BELIEF THAT LIFE IS WORTH LIVING COULD BE INFLUENCED BY THE ANSWERS WHICH WE BRING TO THESE QUESTIONS. JOHN AND I MET IN 2006, AND OUR CONVERSATIONS ARE FEATURED IN MANY CLOSER TO TRUTH EPISODES. SOON THEREAFTER, WE DECIDED TO CO-EDIT A BOOK ON THE ULTIMATE QUESTION. IT'S CALLED, "THE MYSTERY OF EXISTENCE: WHY IS THERE ANYTHING AT ALL." A PRIME ISSUE IS WHETHER THE CONCEPT OF "NOTHING" EVEN MAKES SENSE. MANY PEOPLE NOW WOULD SAY THAT THE QUESTION, "WHY ISN'T THERE NOTHING?" IS A MEANINGLESS QUESTION. ONE THING THEY MIGHT BE SAYING IS THAT THERE'S SOME SORT OF CONTRADICTION IN THE IDEA OF THERE BEING NOTHING. IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE POSSIBLE ABSENCE OF EVERYTHING, YOU HAVE NO TRUTH-MAKER TO MAKE IT TRUE THAT IT'S POSSIBLE THAT EVERYTHING BE ABSENT, BUT THEY HAD THIS SLOGAN, THIS IS VERY POPULAR AMONG PHILOSOPHERS THESE DAYS THAT TRUTHS ALWAYS REQUIRE TRUTH-MAKERS, AND TRUTH-MAKERS MUST BE IN THE END EXISTING THINGS. SO THAT IF YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE TRUTH OF THE LAW OF PHYSICS, FOR EXAMPLE, YOU HAD TO HAVE ACTUAL PARTICLES GOING AROUND AND OBEYING THE LAW OF PHYSICS, OTHERWISE YOU'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT ANYTHING. MAYBE THERE'S A LANGUAGE CONFUSION THAT'S BUILT INTO THE QUESTION SO WHEN I'M WORRYING ABOUT WHY NOT NOTHING, I AM WORRYING ABOUT A MEANINGLESS QUESTION. SURELY THERE'S NO CONTRADICTION IN A BLANK BECAUSE IN A BLANK THERE'S NOTHING TO CONTRADICT ITSELF. AND THE OTHER PERSON SAYS, "WELL YES, THERE'S A CONTRADICTION HERE BECAUSE YOU'RE SUPPOSING THAT IT COULD BE REALLY THE CASE THAT THERE WAS A BLANK BUT REALITY ALWAYS INVOLVES THINGS." OR THE PERSON WOULD SAY, "THERE'S A CONTRADICTION HERE BECAUSE GOD HAS TO EXIST AND YOU'RE SUPPOSING THE CONTRADICTORY SITUATION OF GOD BEING POSSIBLE BUT GOD NOT EXISTING." WHEN YOU HIT THESE COUNTER ARGUMENTS, YOU ASK FOR MORE DETAILS. YOU SAY, "WELL WHERE IS THE CONTRADICTION IN GOD NOT EXISTING?" AND SUPPOSE THAT THE ANSWER COMES TO YOU, "WELL WE DON'T KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT THAT, WE'RE TOO HUMBLE TO KNOW THIS, IT'S TOO MUCH OF A MYSTERY, BUT IT'S ESSENTIAL TO OUR FAITH," AND SO ON. AND THAT ENDS THE CONVERSATION. IT TENDS TO. PHILOSOPHY IS A VERY DIFFICULT AND FRUSTRATING FIELD AND I WISH I'D BEEN A NOVELIST INSTEAD. NOTHING IS NOT MEANINGLESS. THERE COULD HAVE BEEN NOTHING. I FEEL THIS DEEPLY. BUT FEELINGS BETRAY. SO WHY NOT NOTHING? I NEED A CLEARER UNDERSTANDING OF "NOTHING". I ASK PHILOSOPHER PETER VAN INWAGEN. PETER, IF THERE WERE "NOTHING," WHAT WOULD THERE BE? TO SAY THAT THERE IS NOTHING IS TO SAY THAT THERE ISN'T ANYTHING. AND THAT'S ALL THERE IS TO IT. MAYBE YOU COULD ALLOW THE EXISTENCE OF ABSTRACT THINGS IF YOU BELIEVE IN THEM LIKE NUMBERS OR MATHEMATICAL OBJECTS LIKE THAT, MAYBE THE QUESTION WHY IS THERE SOMETHING RATHER NOTHING IS THE QUESTION WHY ARE THERE CONCRETE THINGS OR MAYBE NOT. A VAST EMPTINESS IS A VAST EMPTINESS. FOR THERE TO BE NOTHING, IF THERE WERE REALLY NOTHING, THERE WOULDN'T BE POINTS IN SPACE THAT WERE A CERTAIN DISTANCE APART, EVEN A VACUUM, IF THERE IS REALLY NOTHING THERE ISN'T EVEN A BIG VACUUM. JUST THERE ISN'T ANYTHING. FOR ANYTHING THAT YOU MIGHT MENTION THERE ISN'T THAT. IF YOU ASK WHY IS THERE ANYTHING, WELL YOU CAN'T APPEAL ANYTHING IN ADDITION TO ANYTHING. BECAUSE THERE ISN'T ANYTHING IN ADDITION TO ANYTHING. THAT'S WHAT MAKES IT SUCH A DIFFICULT QUESTION. THAT'S WHAT MAKES IT A NON-ORDINARY QUESTION. SO IS ABSOLUTE NOTHING, LITERALLY NOTHING, EVEN POSSIBLE? I ASK PHILOSOPHER TIMOTHY O'CONNOR. SUPPOSE IT IS POSSIBLE THAT THERE IS NOTHING, AND IMAGINE THAT THAT POSSIBILITY WERE SO. OF COURSE, WE WOULDN'T INHABIT THAT POSSIBILITY; NOTHING WOULD. SO, HAD THERE BEEN NOTHING, THEN IT WOULD HAVE BEEN POSSIBLE, SINCE NOTHINGNESS IS NOT NECESSARY, WHICH WE KNOW, BECAUSE THERE IS SOMETHING, SO THAT THEN WE HAVE AN EXISTENCE PROOF THAT SHOWS US THAT NOTHINGNESS IS NOT NECESSARY. SO, IF THERE HAD BEEN NOTHING, BUT STILL IT WERE POSSIBLE THAT THERE BE SOMETHING, THERE WOULD BE NO GROUND FOR THAT ALLEGED POSSIBILITY OF SOMETHING. EVEN IF THERE WERE ABSOLUTE NOTHING, THERE WOULD AT LEAST HAVE TO STILL BE POSSIBILITY. YOU CAN'T GET AROUND THAT NO MATTER WHAT. YOU CAN'T GET AROUND THAT, RIGHT. SO, THERE'S AT LEAST THIS POSSIBLE TRUTH. SOME PROPOSITION, SOME FACT, SOME FEATURE OF REALITY. BUT THAT'S NOT ABSOLUTE NOTHINGNESS. IT'S A VERY EMPTY REALITY, JUST THESE PURE POSSIBILITIES OF SOMETHING. I FIND THE IDEA OF ABSOLUTE NOTHINGNESS A PROBLEMATIC IDEA. WHEN DEALING WITH "NOTHING," CAN ANY EXPLANATION MAKE SENSE? I ASK OXFORD PHILOSOPHER OF RELIGION, RICHARD SWINBURNE. I THINK WE CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION WHY IS THERE A PHYSICAL UNIVERSE, AND I THINK THE ANSWER IS IN TERMS OF GOD HAVING MADE IT AND SUSTAINED IT. BUT AT THE QUESTION WHY IS THERE ANYTHING WOULD INCLUDE THE QUESTION WHY IS THERE A GOD, AND I DON'T THINK WE CAN ANSWER THAT. INDEED, I DON'T THINK IT HAS AN ANSWER, BECAUSE INEVITABLY, YOU CAN EXPLAIN X BY Y, AND Y BY ZED, AND ZED BY A AND SO ON, BUT THIS IS GOING TO COME TO A STOP SOMEWHERE. THE ONLY QUESTIONS WE CAN ANSWER IS WHY THERE IS A PHYSICAL UNIVERSE AND WE OUGHT TO POSTULATE THE SIMPLEST EXPLANATION, WHICH LEADS US EXPECT THE PHENOMENA, AND I THINK THAT THE EXISTENCE OF GOD IS THAT. THE "GOD ANSWER" IS A POPULAR ONE. NOT THAT POPULARITY MEANS TRUTH, OF COURSE. HOW MIGHT THE EXISTENCE OF GOD DEAL WITH THE POSSIBILITY OF NOTHINGNESS? I ASK FATHER ROBERT SPITZER, A JESUIT PRIEST AND PHILOSOPHER. NOTHING DOES SEEM SIMPLER THAN ANYTHING ELSE. EXCEPT FOR, PERHAPS, ABSOLUTE SIMPLICITY. BUT THAT'S NOTHING. WELL, NO, I WOULD MAINTAIN ABSOLUTE SIMPLICITY IS THE POWER WITHOUT INTRINSIC OR EXTRINSIC RESTRICTIONS. THAT SOUNDED LIKE A LOT OF SOMETHINGS. WELL, ACTUALLY NOT A LOT - IT'S SOMETHINGS. I WOULD JUST SAY SIMPLY THIS, I WOULD SAY, WHY ASSUME THAT NOTHING IS THE CONDITION THAT DEMARCATES AS IT WERE, THE ETERNAL EXISTENCE OF EVERYTHING, ALL RIGHT? LET'S SUPPOSE FOR JUST A MOMENT, THAT THERE WAS SOMETHING LIKE ABSOLUTE SIMPLICITY. WHAT GIVES US THE PROBLEM IS REALLY FINITE REALITIES BECAUSE FINITE REALITIES THEN IMPLY SOMETHING BEYOND THAT FINITUDE IF YOU REALLY HAVE AN UNRESTRICTED REALITY, WHICH IS NOT A LOT OF SOMETHINGS, IT'S A PERFECT UNITY. THEN PERHAPS PERFECT UNITIVE REALITY, SOMETHING WHICH EXISTS THROUGH ITSELF, IS THE PRIMORDIAL AND THAT NOTHING, NOTHING IS ONLY THE RESULT OF OUR REFLECTING ON WHAT'S OUTSIDE OF THE BOUNDARIES OF FINITE REALITY. IT WOULD SEEM TO ME IF I WERE GIVEN A CHOICE BETWEEN NOTHING BEING THE MOST SIMPLE AND AN UNRESTRICTED, UNBOUNDED SIMPLISTIC REALITY BEING THE PRIMORDIAL EXISTENT, I WOULD PICK NOTHING. YEAH, I CAN SEE WHY YOU'D DO IT; BECAUSE OF COURSE YOU'D THINK, WELL, THERE'S NO PRESUPPOSITIONS IN NOTHING. BUT WHAT I WOULD WANT TO SUGGEST IS THERE ARE NO PRESUPPOSITIONS IN PERFECT SIMPLICITY, A PERFECT UNITIVE, UNRESTRICTIVE POWER EITHER. IF YOU REALLY DID HAVE SOMETHING THAT WAS TRULY ABSOLUTELY SIMPLE, HAD NO INTRINSIC OR EXTRINSIC BOUNDARIES WHATSOEVER, WHICH WAS A COMPLETELY UNCONDITIONED REALTY, THERE WOULDN'T BE A SINGLE PRESUPPOSITION THAT ATTACHED ITSELF TO THAT REALITY. WOULDN'T I ASK WHY DOES THAT EXIST? ACTUALLY YOU WOULDN'T HAVE TO BECAUSE IT WOULD EXIST THROUGH ITSELF. THAT'S AN ANSWER TO THE QUESTION. BUT I STILL HAVE TO ASK THE QUESTION. YEAH, YOU - IF IT'S NOTHING, I DON'T HAVE TO ASK A QUESTION. - IF YOU UNDERSTOOD IT IN ITSELF, YOU WOULD UNDERSTAND THAT IT WAS PRESUPPOSITION-LESS, AND THEREFORE, THAT YOU WOULDN'T HAVE TO ASK THE QUESTION, THE PROBLEM IS A LIMITATION TO OUR UNDERSTANDING. SOME PHYSICISTS CLAIM TO HAVE ANSWERED THE QUESTION NATURALLY, WITHOUT GOD OR ANYTHING SUPERNATURAL. QUANTUM PHYSICS, THEY SAY, CAN EXPLAIN "WHY IS THERE SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING?" THAT THE DEBATE BECOMES IMPASSIONED HIGHLIGHTS THE PROBING AUTHORITY OF THE QUESTION. I MEET PHYSICIST AND ATHEIST VICTOR STENGER. WELL, THE ANSWER IS THAT THE UNIVERSE IS NOTHING. IT'S KIND OF A CRYSTALLIZED NOTHING. WHAT WE HAVE NOW IS A PHASE TRANSITION THAT WENT FROM NOTHING TO SOMETHING. LIKE FROM WATER TO ICE, YOU GO FROM A STATE OF HIGHER SYMMETRY TO A STATE OF LOWER SYMMETRY, OF ONE WITH MORE STRUCTURE. AND IN PHYSICS, IN NATURE, THAT TENDS TO BE THE WAY THINGS GO. THE MORE SYMMETRIC STATE IS ACTUALLY THE LESS STABLE STATE AND SO THEY TEND TO GO THROUGH THIS TRANSFORMATION TO SOMETHING MORE STRUCTURED THAT HAPPENS TO BE THE LOWER ENERGY ARRANGEMENT OF THE MOLECULES, SO, LET'S JUST IMAGINE WHAT I CALL A VOID. IT'S A REGION OF SPACE WHERE YOU REMOVE ALL THE PARTICLES, ALL THE ENERGY, AND SO YOU HAVE NO PARTICLES PRESENT. YOU HAVE NO PARTICULAR DIRECTION IN SPACE SELECTED OUT, NO PARTICULAR ORIENTATION IN SPACE; IN OTHER WORDS, IT'S A VERY SYMMETRIC SITUATION, AND NOTHING IS MORE SYMMETRIC THAN NOTHING. AND SO THAT'S A SITUATION THAT'S GOING TO ACTUALLY BE UNSTABLE. SO, IF THERE EVER WERE SUCH A SITUATION, THEN THE CHANCES ARE GOOD THAT IT WILL ACTUALLY TRANSFORM BY NATURAL PROCESSES TO A LESS SYMMETRIC STATE WHERE THEN YOU HAVE STRUCTURE THAT YOU DIDN'T HAVE BEFORE. BUT, VICTOR, THE LAWS OF PHYSICS, OF QUANTUM PHYSICS, ARE NOT NOTHING! HOW TO EXPLORE FURTHER - PLUMB THE DEPTHS OF THE QUESTION - WHY IS THERE SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING? I CANNOT GET THIS QUESTION OUT OF MY HEAD. I SPEAK WITH OXFORD PHILOSOPHER JOHN HAWTHORNE. JOHN, ON OCCASION AT NIGHT I'LL WAKE UP IN A COLD SWEAT THINKING THAT THERE COULD HAVE BEEN NOTHING. WHY IS THERE SOMETHING? THERE ARE A FEW QUESTIONS BURIED IN THERE A BIT. I MEAN ONE QUESTION IS COULD THERE HAVE BEEN NOTHING? AND WE CAN ANSWER THAT, AND THERE'S A YES OR A NO. AND THEN WHICHEVER WAY WE GO WE COULD TRY THE QUESTION WELL WHY IS THERE SOMETHING, OR WHY IS THERE NOT NOTHING? SO, WE CAN SAY COHERENTLY THAT THERE COULD HAVE BEEN A TOTAL WORLD WITHOUT ANY PARTICLES, THAT'S EASY. THAT'S EASY. OKAY. COULD THERE HAVE BEEN NO FORCES, I THINK IT, I WOULD FEEL THAT YES THERE COULD HAVE BEEN NO FORCES. EXCELLENT. OKAY. THEN YOU GO UP TO COULD THERE HAVE BEEN NO SPACE AND TIME. AND IT'S A LITTLE HARDER. THAT'S HARDER. I MEAN MAYBE WE COULD ROLL IT INTO SPACE/TIME. FINE, FINE. SO COULD THERE HAVE BEEN NONE OF THAT? I MEAN IT CERTAINLY SEEMS SO. OKAY, OKAY, ALL RIGHT. I MEAN YOU FEEL THAT THE BURDEN'S ON THE PEOPLE WHO SAY THAT THERE HAS TO BE - SPACE/TIME. SPACE/TIME. THE NEXT STEP IS ABSTRACT OBJECTS, WHICH ARE NUMBERS WHICH IS THE EASIEST ONE. OR TRUTHS. TAKE THE TRUTH THAT THERE'S EITHER NOTHING OR SOMETHING. RIGHT, RIGHT. COULD THERE HAVE NOT BEEN THE TRUTH THAT THERE'S NOTHING. SO, YOU KNOW, SO IF YOU THINK THERE ARE THINGS LIKE TRUTHS OR PROPOSITIONS, THEN IT'S QUITE NATURAL TO THINK THAT THEY - HAD TO EXIST. - HAD TO EXIST. SO YOU MIGHT THINK WELL IT COULD HAVE BEEN MAYBE NOTHING CONCRETE, BUT EVEN IF THERE HAD BEEN NOTHING CONCRETE, THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN THE TRUTH THERE'S NOTHING CONCRETE, SO THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN SOMETHING. I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THAT WILL HELP YOU GO BACK TO SLEEP AT NIGHT. YOU MIGHT SAY ALL SIDES SURPRISE YOU TO KNOW THERE ARE A SMALL MINORITY OF PHILOSOPHERS WHO THINK EVERYTHING EXISTS NECESSARILY; THAT YOU, EVEN YOU AND THIS TABLE COULDN'T HAVE NOT EXISTED. EVEN GIVEN THE CONSTRAINTS OF EVOLUTION AND CONTINGENCY UPON CONTINGENCY? YES. SO YOU COULD HAVE NOT BEEN CONCRETE, YOU COULD HAVE BEEN LIKE AN ABSTRACT MARBLE AND THAT'S THEIR PICTURE. THE PICTURE IS ROUGHLY NECESSARILY EVERYTHING EXISTS NECESSARILY. AND YET SOME THINGS EXIST CONCRETELY BECAUSE THEY'RE PICKED OUT OF THAT YES, SO, IT'S NOT LIKE YOU'RE CONCRETE NECESSARILY, BUT IT'S JUST THE WAY THAT YOU ARE THAT CHANGES BUT NOT WHETHER YOU ARE. OKAY, HOW DO POSSIBILITIES WORK? THAT IS WAS ALWAYS POSSIBLE THAT THERE COULD HAVE BEEN A UNIVERSE EVEN IF THERE WERE NONE. A QUESTION ALWAYS IS WHETHER THESE ARE ARGUMENTS FOR THE EXISTENCE OF OBJECTS. I MEAN SO-CALLED NOMINALISTS IN MATHEMATICS WILL AGREE THAT ONE AND ONE IS TWO, BUT WILL SAY THAT DOESN'T REQUIRE THAT OBJECTS EXIST. SIMILARLY THERE'S A KIND OF GUY THAT SAYS, "OH NECESSARILY IT WAS POSSIBLE THAT THE SOMETHING" BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THERE'S THIS THING, A POSSIBILITY, THAT EXISTS. RIGHT, RIGHT. SO HOW ARE YOU ON EXISTENCE OF POSSIBILITIES? ARE THEY, THINGS THAT ARE REAL? I'M THE SORT OF PERSON THAT LIKES TRUTHS AND FALSEHOODS EXISTING. IT'S POSSIBLE THAT THERE ARE WINGED PIGS, AND THAT SEEMS LIKE A CLAIM, THE SORT OF THING THAT'S TRUE AND FALSE. AND THAT'S AN EXISTING THING? YEAH. THE CLAIM? YEAH. THE CLAIM IS AN EXISTING - - IT SEEMS QUITE NATURAL AND INTUITIVE TO ME TO THINK THAT INSOFAR AS YOU'RE GOING TO BELIEVE THAT THERE ARE CLAIMS, THEN YOU SHOULD THINK THAT THERE, AND EXIST NECESSARILY. I THINK THAT'S THE DEFAULT PICTURE ABOUT A LOT OF PHILOSOPHERS. GOD CAN, AS IT WERE, ERASE THE CONCRETE BUT CAN'T ERASE THE WHOLE SHEBANG. IF IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO GET RID OF POSSIBILITIES, CLAIMS, TRUTHS, THEN IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. BUT WHATEVER WOULD CONSTITUTE MAXIMUM NOTHING, BACK TO MY ORIGINAL QUESTION; WHY IS THERE SOMETHING? I ASK PHILOSOPHER PETER FORREST. I THINK THERE'S ONLY ONE SORT OF ANSWER TO THAT AND IT'S A BIT OF A CHEAT, THAT WHY IS THERE SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING BECAUSE IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S NECESSARY AND THEN THERE IS SOME EXPLANATION AS TO HOW YOU GET THE THINGS THAT AREN'T NECESSARY FROM THE THING THAT IS NECESSARY. NECESSARY BECAUSE IN ORDER TO REALLY UNDERSTAND WHY THERE'S SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING, IT WOULD HAVE TO BE NECESSARY IN THE SENSE OF BEING INCOMPREHENSIBLE THAT IT COULD HAVE BEEN OTHERWISE. THE TWO RIVAL EXPLANATIONS IS GOING TO BE THE NATURALISTIC IDEA THAT WE JUST HAVE THESE NECESSARY LAWS THAT BRING EVERYTHING INTO EXISTENCE, ON THE ONE HAND, OR THAT WE HAVE GOD WHO AS AN AGENT BRINGS THINGS INTO EXISTENCE. BUT NEITHER OF THESE ARE NECESSARY IN THE SENSE REQUIRED TO UNDERSTAND WHY THERE IS SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING. SO IT'S A BIT OF A FUDGE WHAT WE CAN SAY IS THERE ARE CERTAIN THINGS THAT ARE NECESSARY IN SOME SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT SENSE, AND BOTH GOD OR THE LAWS OF NATURE COULD BE CANDIDATES FOR THOSE. HOW SO? WELL, I'LL TRY TO EXPLAIN IN THE CASE OF GOD, IF THERE ARE ABSTRACT OBJECTS INCLUDING POSSIBLE UNIVERSES, WAYS THE UNIVERSE MIGHT BE, THEN THESE THINGS THEMSELVES ARE NECESSARY BEINGS. SO THESE POSSIBILITIES INCLUDING AS IT WERE, BLUEPRINTS FOR ALL POSSIBLE UNIVERSES. NOW THE THING IS THIS, THESE KIND OF BLUEPRINTS ARE NECESSARY BEINGS. OUR UNIVERSE ISN'T A NECESSARY BEING, BUT THE POSSIBILITY OF A UNIVERSE LIKE OURS IS A NECESSARY BEING. BECAUSE WE CANNOT IMAGINE, IN ANY POSSIBLE WAY, THAT SUCH A POSSIBILITY DOESN'T EXIST. THE ACTUALITY DOESN'T HAVE TO EXIST, BUT THE POSSIBILITY HAS TO EXIST. THAT'S THE IDEA. OKAY. NOW, THE POSSIBILITIES BY THEMSELVES WON'T EXPLAIN WHY THERE IS ANYTHING ACTUAL, BUT WHAT A THEIST WILL DO, IS TO SAY, "WELL YOU DON'T NEED MUCH IN ADDITION TO THESE POSSIBILITIES," ALL YOU REQUIRE IS SOME ACT, A CHOICE AMONG POSSIBILITIES, AND THAT CHOICE IS CONTINGENT. SO THE ULTIMATE EXPLANATION FOR THINGS IS THE RANGE OF PREEXISTING, NECESSARY POSSIBILITIES, AND THIS ONE SIMPLE ACT, THE CHOICE. SO, ALTHOUGH WE HAVEN'T EXPLAINED WHY THERE'S SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING, WE'VE EXPLAINED WHY THERE ARE THINGS IN TERMS OF ONE ULTIMATE MYSTERY, THIS ACT, THIS CHOICE. BUT, THE DIFFERENCE IS THAT THE PHYSICAL LAWS, IF YOU TAKE THEM TO BE THE ULTIMATE THINGS, ARE ONLY GOING TO BE COMPARATIVELY SIMPLE, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE ABSOLUTELY SIMPLE. WHEREAS A SORT OF ACT, IT IS BECAUSE IT'S GOOD THAT KIND OF CHOICE HAS IN IT A KIND OF SIMPLICITY, WHICH I WOULD CLAIM, THE LAWS COULDN'T HAVE. I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE ADVANTAGEOUS OF ULTIMATE EXPLANATION IN TERMS OF AGENCY OVER ULTIMATE EXPLANATION IN TERMS OF LAWS, I DON'T THINK WE CAN EXPLAIN WHY THERE'S SOMETHING RATHER NOTHING. BUT I THINK THE BEST WE CAN DO IS TO EXPLAIN IT RELATIVE TO TAKING AS UNEXPLAINED THE MYSTERIOUS, A SIMPLE FACT OF A CHOICE GIVEN THAT THERE IS THIS PREEXISTING DOMAIN OF POSSIBILITIES. THAT'S THE THEISTIC ACCOUNT. WHY IS THERE SOMETHING RATHER THAN NOTHING? WHAT IS NOTHING? NO THING. BUT THERE ARE DIFFERENT KINDS OR LEVELS OF NOTHING. WHY "LEVELS" OF NOTHING? THAT'S WHERE THE CONFUSION LIES. I HAVE NINE LEVELS OF NOTHING. FROM SIMPLE NOTHING TO ABSOLUTE NOTHING. EACH NOTHING HAVING LESS AND LESS. BY NOTHING 5, THERE IS NO MATTER, NO ENERGY, NO SPACE, NO TIME. BUT THERE ARE THE LAWS OF PHYSICS. NOTHING 6 - NO LAWS OF PHYSICS. NOTHING 7 - NO GOD, NO CONSCIOUSNESS. NOTHING 8 - NO ABSTRACT OBJECTS - THIS MEANS NO NUMBERS, NO LOGIC, NO TRUTHS, NO PLATONIC FORMS. NOTHING 9 - NO POSSIBILITIES. NOTHINGS 1 THROUGH 7 REMOVE EXISTING THINGS, SO THAT A "NOTHING" I MIGHT CALL "REAL NOTHING" WOULD BE NOTHING 7, WHICH HAS NO CONCRETE THINGS, NOT EVEN GOD. BUT SOME ARGUE THAT GOD IS "NECESSARY" - MEANING THAT IT IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR GOD NOT TO EXIST, THUS CROWNING NOTHING 6, WHICH INCLUDES GOD, AS THE ULTIMATE LIMIT. AS FOR THE NOTHING OF PHYSICISTS, NOTHING 5, WHERE THE LAWS OF PHYSICS GENERATE NEW UNIVERSES "FROM NOTHING." WELL, THE LAWS OF PHYSICS ARE NOT ABSOLUTE NOTHING. THE NOTHING OF PHYSICISTS IS THICK WITH FIELDS AND FORCES, BARELY HALF WAY TO ABSOLUTE NOTHING. SO, NOW, HOW TO EXPLAIN - "THE MYSTERY OF EXISTENCE: WHY IS THERE ANYTHING AT ALL?" THAT'S NEXT ON CLOSER TO TRUTH.
Info
Channel: Closer To Truth
Views: 123,694
Rating: 4.8542576 out of 5
Keywords: closer to truth, robert lawrence kuhn, Richard Swinburne, Simon Blackburn, Robert Spitzer, Peter van Inwagen, Steven Weinberg, John Leslie, Timothy O'Connor, Victor Stenger, John Hawthorne, Peter Forrest, What is nothing, nothing, nothingness, universe came from nothing, why is there something instead of nothing, why is there something rather than nothing, closer to truth full episodes, closer to truth season 12, lifes big questions, robert kuhn, existence, reality, physics, CTT
Id: YkB-phz_2cA
Channel Id: undefined
Length: 26min 46sec (1606 seconds)
Published: Tue Jun 23 2020
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