The Shroud and the jew: Barrie Schwortz at TEDx ViadellaConciliazione

thank you well as you've heard I was the official documenting photographer the Shroud of Turin research project Shroud of Turin research project was the first and only scientific team ever to be given permission to do an in-depth examination of the Shroud of Turin now I have to tell you that I just finished a six-week lecture tour three states twelve cities twenty-two lectures all of them two hours or more and all of them extemporaneous I often do eight hour seminars on the Shroud of Turin again no notes no lecture notes of any kind but 15 minutes is hard and so you'll have to forgive me but there was no way that I could do this you know it's not hard to get me to start talking but it's hard to get me to stop so you'll forgive me that I brought some notes with me and I'm going to have to refer to them just so that I stay on time and make sure that I do it correctly so there it is that's that piece of cloth that got into my life 35 years ago well as a professional photographer I specialized in scientific medical and technical kinds of issues so I had the skills in the qualifications that were necessary to be a part of the team that examined the Shroud but when they excuse me when they first asked me to do this first thing I said was no no way and why did I refuse well answer simple I was very uncomfortable with the subject matter because I was born and raised in an Orthodox Jewish home now I want to be clear about that I am NOT a practicing Jew at this point in my life but I was for that first 13 years both my parents immigrated to America from Poland and when they were little kids just before World War two and so my question and the question that went through my mind at the time was why would a Jewish man want to get involved with is what is probably arguably the most important relic of Christianity that moment in my life I couldn't see any benefit to being involved well not only that I was a total skeptic and figured that the Shroud was probably some form of a painting which was the conventional wisdom in 1978 I fully expected to get to Turin take a quick look see the paint and the brushstrokes and go home I even stupidly said that publicly somewhere and of course for the last 35 years I've been living to regret those words anyway in the end I viewed this whole thing and this is terrible to admit this close to the Vatican this was going to be a free trip to Italy that's what I thought but you know my attitude was immature because I was only 32 years old at the time my son just turned 33 so that and I'm still waiting for him to grow up so so I can imagine where my I can't even imagine where my head was in those days in the end of course I did join the team because the image on the shroud has some fascinating properties that piqued my scientific curiosity but I still tried to quit twice again and in fact as our team grew a few men from the Jet Propulsion labs became members of our team one of them was a man named Don Lin may rest in peace Don was an imaging expert from NASA so he was my hero immediately and he was the head of imaging on Voyager and Viking and Mariner and Galileo you might have heard of some of them so I am pretty sure that any professional photographer given that opportunity would have been honored to be a member of that team but I remember asking dawn at one point during our planning we planned for nineteen months before we came to Turin to examine the shroud I remember asked him that's it done that's a nice Jewish boy like me doing on this team and Don who was a good Catholic looked me right in the eye and he said have you forgotten that the man in question was a Jew and I said no done that's probably the only thing I knew about Jesus that he was a Jew and then he said and of course this is where Don I think God was speaking to me through his lips he looked at me and he said oh so you don't think God would want one of his chosen people on our team and I laughed I said no Don I never thought that and so then Don gave me what perhaps may be the best advice I've ever been given he said very go to Turin do the best job you can do God doesn't tell us in advance what the plan is but one day you'll know you know and on those words I stayed on that team because truer and more profound words have never been spoken Don was right and I've never regretted taking advice and staying on that team now the tests we performed went on over the years that we did it and then evaluated it went on to ultimately prove that the Shroud was not a painting not a scorch or not a photograph these were the kind of conventional wisdom things that people had and so all the tests that we planned basically were to test for those kinds of things at the end of our team we published at the end of our three years we published our work in peer-reviewed scientific journals credible ones I might add now with the internet we have journals that are the only thing they review is your check to make sure it clears and they're not exactly a high standard as the ones that we had to deal with but ideally we went there to answer the question how is the image form that was our primary purpose and in the end however we could not determine an image formation mechanism that could make an image with the properties on the Shroud of Turin our collective work still forms the primary database of literature that exists in the peer-reviewed science that points to the authenticity of the Shroud of Turin however even with all that it still took another eighteen years before I was convinced I'm not a fast sell but in 1995 after years of actually resistance on my part world renowned blood expert dr. Alan Adler who was truly maybe the foremost blood expert in the world and also Jewish I my dad was on the phone with me and he answered the final question that had kept me from accepting the Shroud of the authentic I was on the phone with him I wasn't convinced the shroud was real because the blood on the shroud is still red and old blood is supposed to turn black or brown sometimes just within a matter of hours and that really stopped me al then looked at me over the phone he didn't look at me but he spoke to me he said Barry he had found he said I found this large amount of bilirubin in the blood now somebody who's been tortured like Jesus was beaten the night before in the Garden of Gethsemane then the next day scourge dand ultimately capped with a crack capper crown of thorns ultimately crucified and speared people who have been tortured that way usually going to show the liver floods the bloodstream with bilirubin and al told me that blood of that nature stays red forever suddenly and unexpectedly I realized that the last bit of evidence had come in and I had no choice but to accept that the shroud was authentic IRA mmediately kind of remember I was a big Arthur Conan Doyle fan when I was young and I remember Conan Doyle once said through the lips of Sherlock Holmes if you eliminate all the possibilities whatever remains no matter how improbable is most likely the truth then I remembered Occam's razor Occam's razor is is that the simplest answer is most likely the correct one so I was left with only one conclusion that this cloth could only be the authentic burial shroud of the historic Jesus it was even a surprise to me I I was shot cuz after all those years of resistance you know you think well I'm finished with this that wasn't to be the case now over the years I had noticed over all those years I'd noticed that the media reports on the Shroud were often misleading or even completely false and I'd been privileged to study it firsthand and I had access to what I ultimately realized was inside information so I knew the truth about the Shroud and because of my media experience I knew better than to believe the nonsense I was reading in the paper now there were probably a billion people on this planet who had more right to be in that room than I did and yet there I was in 1978 God dragging me kicking and screaming keeping me on that team and at that moment in time I realized that it brought with it a great responsibility this privilege I had been given and it was something of an epiphany because I finally came to realize that I wasn't in that room for me I was in that room for you now I knew the truth about the shroud and was frustrated because my Christian brothers and sisters were not getting that truth and to me all of our team members had always been doing this simply about the truth now in 1996 I got a phone call and I apologized to the interpreter this isn't in the script I got a phone call from a friend and my friend said you know that shroud thing that you're involved with and I said yeah I know that shroud thing that I'm involved with and he said well you know it turns out that's a photograph made by Leonardo da Vinci we'll be in our dough dimension and I'm not an expert in history we had some real historians that we worked with and I always left it to them but I remember saying to him first I thought he was joking but then I realized he was serious so I said excuse me but where did you get that information and he said well my wife and I were checking out at the grocery store and there on one of the counters was a tabloid The Enquirer and I had this epiphany as I mentioned and I realized that the public just doesn't have access so at that moment in time I've built shroud comm which has since become the oldest largest and most extensive resource on the internet we just celebrated our 17th anniversary and although that says 3.8 million we're well over 4 million since I wrote this put that slide in this lecture and so we had our 17th anniversary this year and I also got about dough I'm thinking thousand emails a day now some days a little less I was on CNN a few weeks ago a couple thousand emails came in so it's turned into a full-time job anyway and as a matter of fact people often say hey you know you're number one on Google and my answer is always the same you know we're five years older than Google because we are most importantly I guess now I realize that this work is the fulfillment of that obligation that I felt that came with the great privilege that I was given in 1978 and in the end it's also become my legacy I've had a long career and done a lot of stuff but it's coming it's gone it really means nothing and now I'm doing something that in the end will live beyond me that means my grandchildren maybe can show their grandchildren something their great-grandpa did back in the old days anyway in 2009 I formed the Shroud of Turin Education and Research Association or Stara Inc that's a nonprofit organization for 14 years I supported the website myself and it mentally got to be a point where I needed to go nonprofit I think a lot of people and I'm going to be candid a lot of people may have been a little suspicious of my motives you know a Jewish guy and I'm actually permitted to sell things a photographs of the shroud and no offense I'm not offended by that I understand and so I formed Stara Inc to help preserve this information to support the website so that in the future future researchers will have the opportunity to have access to the materials that we collected and I've collected since so that future research on the Shroud doesn't have to start from scratch again and that ensures that we remain free to everyone still no advertising on trial calm now there's our page I'm sorry I'm a little behind now case you missed it that's the topic I'm supposed to be talking about I know it hasn't seemed like that at all yet now the problem I have is that I'm not really a scientist myself I'm a technical photographer so I cannot speak for the world of science in general and addressing this issue although I personally believe and this is my personal point of view that science is simply man's attempt to understand God's creation that's the way I see it so in this particular lecture I can only share my personal point of view with you about this specific project and that's how I used to look notice that there was a lot more hair well I still have a lot it's just slid down the back a bit and it has changed color a tad so I can start by telling you that first of all the church was very gracious from the first day and in no way interfered with our scientific work they even allowed us to own and keep the data we collected which is why I'm permitted to make copies and make photographs of the Shroud available but the strip team member who really put it into the right words was dr. John Heller also gone now he put it far more eloquently in his 1983 book about our team and I'm just going to quote him he said though it was believed that there would be a confrontation between science and religion none occurred rather the relationship was harmonious and synergistic so there was never a conflict between our team and the authorities in Turin or faith in general now I'm sure that's an important part of why our team in the end was so successful now in the end of however I consider myself kind of a living example of religious freedom and scientific research in my 35 year involvement with the shroud I've always been treated with great respect by not only Christians but Muslims and Jews alike all shown an understanding and a consideration of my position somewhat unique I might add and even the atheists and skeptics I that I often will debate on TV shows and radio shows show a grudging respect for me I guess they have come to understand that I'm only telling the truth ironically I now teach a course at the Atheneum imagine that a Jewish man teaching future priests of the Shroud of Turin thanks father Gera I know you're out there somewhere the man who organized this event although he did come to my house and spend three days there checking me out I'm sure he did and he can ask him later anyway but the story doesn't really end there shortly after building the website and stating publicly that I believed the shroud was authentic based on the scientific evidence people started asking me a new question and you know what that question was what do you believe they were asking about my faith well at age 50 I was forced for the first time as an adult to confront my own beliefs about God I'd walked away from Judaism when I was 13 that's me that's my bar mitzvah picture you know the one that mothers hang on their walls to this day fifty-five years later it's still hanging on my mother's wall but at age thirteen I walked away from Judaism and never looked back God was not a part of my life I never even thought about religion now at age 50 I was being forced to confront that which I had avoided most of my adult life I was raised in a very traditional Orthodox Jewish home both my parents born in Poland grandparents lived with us two sets of dishes two sets of silverware Orthodox Jewish home and so had to look in my own heart for the first time and I had rejected all that before but I did look into my heart and to my shock I found that God had been there all alone just waiting for me to look and acknowledge him so with that knowledge I'd rediscovered my own faith I only took what 50 years better late than never I guess and it's still hard for me to believe that 35 years have passed and I'm called an expert on the Shroud of Turin how did that happen this was not my idea I didn't decide to do this like I said earlier I was dragged along kicking and screaming I didn't want to do this and yet Here I am I'm standing in the Vatican addressing this audience unbelievable of course over the years the shroud has brought me to places I never thought I would be last year I lectured on the Shroud of Turin in the little village in Poland where my mother was born now ironically that little village in Poland has this little Catholic Church and my mother left at age seven and when I asked her before I went to that village to kind of find my roots I said what do you remember of that village and that little girl that little Jewish girl her fondest recollection of the little village of eëtion it - in Poland was the Catholic Church that was down by the river so last year I lectured in that church and called her and I said where do you think I am she said we are in Poland I said no but where specifically well I don't know I'm in that little church that you remembered a what an awesome opportunity and yet none of that could have happened if it weren't for the Shroud of Turin later this year I'm going to make my first trip to Jerusalem now for years my friends and colleagues have all said to me Barry when are you going to go to Israel and my answer has always been the same if God wants me to go he'll arrange it well ironically I'm going to jump ahead ironically guess who's the one who arranged it and isn't it ironic for a Jew to go to the Holy Land for the first time in his life and it's arranged by a Catholic priest well I'm not just any Catholic priest that one so I'm really honored to be a part of that and father Gera is my friend and my brother and is responsible for bringing me here now I truly believe that only God would think to choose a Jewish man who had no emotional attachment to Jesus who was a total skeptic and with a pretty negative attitude I might add and put him on that team now ironically I've learned it as a child that the Jews were chosen people on her death since I was a little kid I never felt very chosen but now I do because of the shroud for the first time in my life I get it and yet all God asked me to do and it was very simple to tell the truth Barry now if God had said to me Barry go out and make up stories to convince people that the shroud is authentic I would have failed in Vancouver British Columbia two years ago the gentleman came up after one of my lectures one of my extemporaneous to our lectures I might add and he looked me right in the eye and he says mr. Schwartz that was a great lecture you know but you'll never convince me and I looked him right in the eye and I said what makes you think I even care what you believe that's between you and God take it up with him and so that's when I realized that the idea of trying to convince people is not a good idea now I'm sure in the early days I probably tried but now I just put the facts out there and let people decide for themselves now I usually end my lectures by answering the question that I posed kind of at the beginning what's a Jewish man like me doing involved with the most important relics of Christianity why well it took me a long time to figure out the answer but now it's obvious God wanted me to do it isn't it funny how God always seems to pick a Jew to be the messenger I'm the messenger so with that thought all I can say how many Jews can claim that it was the Shroud of Turin that brought them back to their faith in God I can so with that all I can say is if I'm not an example of religious freedom scientific research I don't know what is thank you thank you very you

Channel: TEDx Talks

Views: 391,639

Keywords: ted talk, religion, english, tedx, study, italy, history, ted talks, ted, ted x, research, Jesus (Deity), truth, shroud, christ, tedx talk, tedx talks

Id: 4G4sj8hUVaY

Length: 24min 10sec (1450 seconds)

Published: Wed May 01 2013