'The Most Widespread Miscarriage Of Justice' Mr Bates vs The Post Office | Good Morning Britain

maybe you watched episode one last night in which case your jaw is probably still on the floor IV's new drama Mr Bates versus the post office tells the Shocking True Story of hundreds of innocent post office operators wrongly accused and some sent to prison for theft and fraud between 1999 and 2015 well sub postmaster Alan Bates the M debates of the ITV drama was accused of fraud but made it his mission to get Justice in a legal B that took 10 years we're going to talk to Alan in just a moment well the real M debates joins us now from North Wales very good morning to you Alan it is great to speak to you on the show this morning you were never actually accused of any criminal offense but you were really one of the very first people to notice that there was something terrible going wrong because your figures didn't add up and you wouldn't accept that it was your responsibility would you just talk us through what you spotted which then caused the downfall unfairly of so many of your colleagues in the post office uh good morning um morning I think realistically it all started for me um a couple of weeks after the system went live and I suddenly found I had a 6,000 shortage showing on the system and I couldn't understand it I couldn't get any help with it at all but after after doing hundreds and hundreds of PR or it felt like hundreds of printouts uh and spending hours and hours um going through them I suddenly found that were whole batches of duplicated transactions which had sort of made up the bulk of that money which once I'd found it I reversed them out but I put all my concerns in writing to post office but they never ever responded on those points I suppose it's understandable that to begin with um a big organization like the post office would be defensive of its shiny new system what seems to most people watching the documentary last night and who know this story anyway is that they were persistently in denial that when it became crystal clear to anybody with a logical train of thought that it was the system that was wrong and suddenly hundreds and hundreds of post Mistresses and postmasters couldn't possibly have suddenly become corrupted overnight um they couldn't accept that the problem was with the system what was motivating them in that denial do you think I've always said it's arrogance and ignorance really I don't think they had the technical expertise to bring in such a big program like that and it was a big program and it should have been really good and should have moved the post office forward but I think it was brought in at probably the cheapest price they could get and they really you know they they should have listened to sub postmasters who were using the system on a daily basis but their arrogance that um the system was right was the main fault Alan what did you think as thousands of people said that they had the same problem and hundreds of them 700 were prosecuted between 1999 and 2015 for something that you knew was not their fault it's all well and good knowing it's not somebody's fault to proving it's not somebody's fault and I mean post office you know they rebuffed our our our accusations year after year not just from ourselves but also from the the MPS who were supporting us throughout this time and it wasn't until we got them in front of the Judiciary where they had no control that you know things really started to change and we managed to expose the truth all be it at huge cost to ourselves but it wasn't just that they didn't understand their own system as you quite succinctly said there they move forward from there to lying to you uh they they established this hotline for people who are having problems they could could ring up for so-called advice and hundreds of you were told that you were the only person that had a problem you were lied to oh very true and it wasn't until we started to get together that you'd have probably seen in the drama last night that we realized that there were so many others involved well the suffering that that imposed on hundreds and hundreds of people like you let alone the fear of it happening to people who weren't in the end prosecuted it seems extraordinary to many people I think that we have not seen any prosecutions of anybody in the post office for what went on because you talk about incompetence but I think most people would say that in the end it was wickedness oh yes I wouldn't disagree with you on that I mean there's certainly it came a point in all that when it was a feel felt vindictiveness on there they were out to prove a point they had the money they had the muscle they had the power and we the little sub post Masters couldn't do anything I mean we we have been looking at of recent um um private prosecutions and I think many of the group would want to see a number of the the real guilty in all of this brought to account um but you of recent I've started to to notice the statutory inquiry have um are now looking at prosecutions themselves so I I think we'll wait and see what they do in the first instance but be be rest assured we will be going after them if if the authorities don't it is called the largest U miscarriage of Justice in this country the drama is compelling you portrayed by the actor Toby Jones brilliantly I I mean it's you know I can't tell the difference between you I'm sure you can but I just I wonder whether having it so high-profile and the public reaction to it galvanizes the campaign and might leads to further action possibly as you suggest prosecutions or finally the payout of compensation you have to come back tomorrow now the the compensation or the So-Cal compensation it's what government call it is a compensation it's actually the financial redress these people are due it's money they're actually owed compensations if you stub your toe against a sticking up pavement or something but I mean no people deserve this and they some people have been waiting over 20 years to try and get this back uh and the big problem at the moment seems to be the bureaucracy involved in in the um in the scheme team that's running and we've got to get that moving we really do I mean people have been suffering for far too long now why is the system so complicated Horizon um so sorry I'm at the system for compensation it seems to be operating on three different levels why is it so complex well there are three different schemes actually and and they came along as they were needed rather than were designed to have three different schemes from the outset um the scheme that I'm involved with is really for for the original 500 and so who who who brought the court case against post office there's another scheme which is for um if you like historic shortfalls other sub postmasters have had and there's a third scheme which are for those who had convictions and who have had them overturned and looking for their financial redress but as as far as our scheme goes the the original what they call Glo group the group litigation scheme uh I mean it's been 20 months since that started and I don't think I don't think there's one oh No Lie there's a handful of what they call the loow hanging fruit that have um received their money but the bulk are certainly nowhere near that they haven't even received offers yet so I just it's it's Madness but I think it's held up in the system and I know that government seem to say it's the lawyers that are holding up but it's not the claimants lawyers it's government's lawyers that are holding this up um and this is you know this is for things which started in 1999 so in the prosecution started your campaign started in 2009 now I know a lot of people watching The Drama watching you the real mbat this morning we'll think why hasn't this man been knighted for his services to Justice you actually were offered an honor weren't you in the list before last or the year before last why did you turn it down yeah you're right I was I was offered an obbe uh I mean but I've always said it's not just about me it's about the whole group but as far as myself goes I couldn't accept it I I mean it would have been a slap in the face to to the rest of the group because Paula anels the the CEO for many years years at post office she'd received a CBE for her services to post office well what service has she actually done she's caused Devastation to a major British institution that was at the heart of communities she's ruined thousands of lives over the years what on Earth has she done to deserve it it should be taken away and taken away now you are an extraordinary individual and what you've achieved is absolutely remarkable I just want to ask you this having watched the first episode of the the drama last night when you got galvanized um and embarked on this campaign against this extremely recaldent giant the post office were you always confident you and your wife that in the end you would Prevail that you'd win no well I mean we didn't start off with a major campaign we started off as a small group of us seeing us what we could do and it just sort of grew over the years and we just took it to the next level day after day and it's been I it's been the worst unpaid job I've had for 20 years but I it's it's just you just got to carry on with it and you see the suffering that happened to so many people and it's not something you could give up no I know that there were four suicides associated with the Scandal and 60 people have died waiting for either Justice or compensation I mean it's had a devastating toll Alan Bates it's privileged to meet you thank you very much indeed and um are you enjoying the TV drama yeah I think I mean the actors done a wonderful job in it and they've really portrayed a lot of the suffering that people have gone through so well yeah well listen we're going to be talking to the Home Secretary in about an hour's time uh if you were talking to him what would your first question be get moving with the compensation don't extend the deadline for payments because you can't extend people's lives get moving with it Mr Bates thank you for your time uh now a post office spokesperson has told us we fully share the aims of the current public inquiry set up to independently establish what went wrong in the past and accountability we're acutely aware of the human costs of the Scandal and we are doing all we can to write the wrongs of the past as far as that is possible I'm continuing with the quote here both both post office and government are committed to providing full fair and final compensation for victims and the former Chief Executive Officer of post office limited Paula vels previously said she's truly Sor sorry for the suffering caused to the 39 sub postmasters as a result of their convictions which were overturned recently she intends to focus fully on working with the ongoing government inquiry to ensure the affected sub postmasters and wider public get the answers they deserve now we asked the post office Minister for an interview he wasn't available this morning but we will keep asking until he comes on because I think the drama which is all episodes on ivx and I think the second episode is on tonight 9:00 p.m. yeah and there's a documentary on Friday about the whole thing that's right it's really putting more energy back into that campaign

Channel: Good Morning Britain

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Keywords: good morning britain, breakfast show, news, morning news, gmb, good morning britain interview, itv, susanna reid, Talk Shows - Topic, post office, post office scandal, uk news, mr bates vs the post office trailer, mr bates vs the post office itv, toby jones, the horizon scandal, horizon post office scandal documentary, horizon post office, horizon post office inquiry

Id: 7aw_x1lscRk

Length: 12min 57sec (777 seconds)

Published: Tue Jan 02 2024