The 10 Stupidest Mistakes Men Make When Facing Divorce: And How to Avoid Them

well good afternoon and welcome to the Cordell and Cordell webinar on divorce and specifically the ten stupidest mistakes men make when facing divorce and some tips on how to avoid them and hopefully prepare for them so we're gonna be moving very quickly today so get some pen and paper out and you can take some notes but really the majority if not everything contained in today's seminars we rapidly move through it it's really contained in this book here which is the ten suppes mistakes and it's on sale at amazon a lot of detail in here that we're not going to cover because we just don't have the time to do it so we're gonna run through very very quickly through those mistakes and we'll address some of them and some of the you know the more important key points in each mistake so let me tell you a little bit about Kordell and Kordell quickly we are domestic relations firm if you haven't heard of us or know anything about us we're across the country specifically we have offices throughout Tennessee and in Chattanooga we do domestic relations only and we do everything before during and after divorce which is you know premarital premarital agreements prenuptial agreements divorce modifications paternity anything related to family law we handle and as I said we have offices around the country including the UK with about two hundred and eighty lawyers across the country so that's really all I want to tell you quickly you can find us at cordell cordell comm or even more information at dads divorce calm or men's divorce calm we have a live seminar coming up in Chattanooga on October the 23rd at the Chattanooga Marriott downtown and we'd encourage you to go online and register at men's divorce cool calm there you're going to get some of this information as well but you get more detailed information about the divorce process some strategy tips but best of all something you won't get today and that is an opportunity to speak with the Kordell and Cordell divorce attorneys ask them questions you'll get the answers today it's just about learning getting some information quickly giving you the tools and things to go find out some more information online and you can always do that at dads divorce calm so let's get started we'll go right through it and get to some of the mistakes that guys make facing divorce and really does happen to be some of the more the most important question that guys ask when they're facing divorce and when they come in for a consult is really do I move out and it tends to be the very first question that guys ask and do I move out should I move out I have moved out what do I do now all of those things have ramifications so one of the things I tell clients continuously throughout in consults and when I do represent them is that every decision that you make in divorce has a consequence good bad and neutral and so let's talk about moving out and there are times when you should but generally my answer is no and let me back up quickly before we get through a lot of these mistakes making sure that you understand that I don't want to give you legal advice I'm not going to do that today I am licensed in Missouri Illinois and Georgia and so I want to make sure that what you get from today are strategies without legal advice because I can't do that I don't know enough about your case what I want this intended to be is educational and I also want this to be to serve as an opportunity for you to spur a conversation with your attorney and if you don't have one we'll talk a little bit about how to find one so let's get back to moving out so whether you have kids or not what's really important is to make that right decision and if you've made the decision already to move out or stay it can change but what it does require is that you have a conversation with your attorney to make sure that it is a good one so let's talk about where whether you have kids let's say you have no kids and you come to me and say should I move out generally I'm going to say no but guys often do I mean they may be in the midst of domestic violence they may have issues where they just can't stay they can't emotionally or physically stay in the home so I say look you have to understand when you do move out and you have no kids you're gonna be facing double household expenses it's one of the biggest mistakes guys make because they don't anticipate that your wife's attorneys gonna tell her look don't pay the bills don't pay the mortgage don't pay the utilities don't pay anything not automobile no nothing telephone nothing take all the money out of that can account make him pay it so now you've moved out of your home you didn't bring anything with you you move into a one-bedroom apartment that has no furniture and you can't even sleep but you'll be sleeping on the floor but now she's paying nothing and you're paying the mortgage because ultimately it's your largest asset and we'll be telling you it's a decision you're gonna have to make do you save your largest asset which is your home oftentimes has the largest amount of equity and oftentimes bigger than what you have in retirement and the answer is yes you should save it but until you can get to court to try to apportion the responsibility for those debts those recurring monthly expenses most guys will be faced with double household expenses through the duration of the case until they can get a judge to apportion them and that's huge because most guys can't afford one house living together with their wife much less for to a small bedroom apartment while she lives in your home with her boyfriend and you're paying for it doesn't sit well also loss of household goods when you move out whether you have kids or not you're not always able to bring everything that you own with you particularly the things that you brought into the marriage that's separate property that you so desperately want and it somehow disappears you move out you come back for it and should tell you oh you took it and you know you didn't or you'll find it on eBay or you'll be set on fire and left outside in the rain I've seen it happen and she gets into the courtroom and she'll tell the judge well I he took it with him and she'll cry and she'll prevail so if you move out take everything you want with you and lastly when it comes to personal goods is video or photograph everything in the house and that is take a personal inventory give it to your attorney because if you left it behind plan on never getting it but if you did leave it behind let's plan on making sure your attorney knows to ask for it quickly and put it on our personal inventory list I mean there's just so many ramifications when you do move out many guys think that they have to move out and they just don't they can stay in the house through the duration I mean I've had couples one lived on the top floor one lived in the basement they put tape on the floor and they didn't cross they put alarm systems we twing floor so that they wouldn't go in it with motion detectors while it sounds ridiculous it worked because they couldn't afford two homes and they stayed and it did and actually they stayed living together for about 90 days after the divorce while they were trying to put the home up for sale so now it changes a little bit when you have kids and most guys save a look at my abandoning my kids am i leaving them behind well there's a there's some legal significance when you use the word abandoned a mess is not one of those it's not the legal definition of abandonment when you don't support or no contact but this really is it's a loss of access a loss of control easiest said by saying you're no longer driving the bus you're just a passenger and it's out of control excuse me and so imagine this you move out you want to see your kids as frequently as you can you get into an argument and your wife is gonna show no sensitivity no empathy she's gonna say you know I know is your weekend but we're busy slams the door in your face and you can't do anything about it because if you do you try to get in she'll call the police now you have an order of protection you've got problems so what happens is guys think that everything's gonna stay the same that actually it calms it it does calm the situation but it creates a status quo where you're seeing them one night a week maybe every other weekend and those every other week ends aren't overnights so you're not getting the schedule that you want and so when you stroll into court imagine the testimony where the judge hears well how are the kids doing oh they're doing great and their grades they're getting A's any behavioral issues none the teachers come in and say the same thing but you're you're getting one night a week every other weekend no overnights what judge is going to change the status quo when your kids are doing better than they were when you were living together better than when you had more time not one judge they're not risk-takers and so that's the problem of moving out oftentimes you want to stay in and the worst thing you'll find is parental alienation I ask guys across the country when I'm in these seminars live and we'll do that again in a couple weeks here in Chattanooga and a show of hands who's heard of parental alienation I'd google it now while you're listening and watching because it happens in every case and most guys I would tell you that maybe one max two hands go up in any seminar when there's a hundred guys in the room and they don't know it so it's best described as this as by example you move out and mom immediately goes to your child and says look I know your dad doesn't love us anymore and that's why he's moved out he's got a new life he's gonna start a new family with a new girlfriend and a new mom and he'll have new kids and they're replacing us but I will always be there for you and it's a birthday the child now I know you know I love you and I get you a birthday present but your dad doesn't send us any money because he has a new family to support but again I'm gonna work two or three jobs to take care of us and I'll always protect you imagine what that does to a child it destroys a relationship between dad and the child and that is parental alienation and there are experts throughout the country who are testifying to that using that information to gain custody a way or getting more custody plenty of courts are starting to recognize parental alienation I would encourage you to look it up so in the end and it very quick move out most of time do not move out so let's go on to the next one which is choosing the wrong lawyer and that really is probably one of the more important decisions you should make obviously before you choose to move out in fact it's interesting I'm actually going through the process of choosing a doctor I'm trying to find a general practitioner or an internist right now and so I always relate the choice of a lawyer similar to choosing a doctor it's an intimate personal relationship that you have to have a couple things and that is trust experience superior knowledge and doing the thing that you're looking for most and that is family law I always stress that if you have cancer you're not going to go to a cardiologist you're not going to go to a general practitioner you're going to an oncologist because you want to go to the one person who's done the most research has the most experience to try to tackle the prob that you're facing and that's why I always encourage clients that come in the door in fact yesterday I was meeting with a gentleman and I said I want you to go in interview two or three more lawyers when I'm confident you'll come back to me but I also want you to get an understanding of what it is that relationship because we're gonna talk a little bit about that relationship between lawyers and their clients as it relates to the differences between doctors and their patients and there is a distinct difference but choosing your lawyer is such a critical point because there's some things you also want to ask that lawyer you want to know their litigation experience you want to know their feelings towards trial there are a lot of lawyers who like to mediate and that's all they want to do and they want to settle your case now I'm not opposed to settlement and we are at court Allen Cordell we do it all the time but we truly believe that the way to set up and to settle your case is to be prepared for trial first and foremost because the other side has nothing to lose they don't fear anything if you just come in and start talking settlement it's like any negotiation in business they're not gonna accept a contract they're not gonna accept an offer unless they think that you know they're gonna lose the deal and so that is preparing for trial knowing what you can do and finding a lawyer who's willing to do it finding lawyers who have received prestigious awards super lawyers or the like you want to ask those questions you want to ask them if they have processes in place that's one of the things at cordell cordell we find that is is critical is that his processes to keep the clients informed not only on a daily weekly basis or monthly basis but 24/7 we have a client portal that you can log on and see the what's going on in your file 24/7 on your time not our time but when you don't log in we're giving you updates you want your lawyer to return your phone calls the same business day and I say that and I laugh every time I talk about it in these seminars because it is ridiculous our own corporate lawyers who handle our business dealings won't even return our calls the same day it's frustrating and and so you should demand it will you return my call the same business day will you return my email the same business day and if they hesitate then that is not the lawyer for you because the one thing that is clear is that your case doesn't end at 5:00 p.m. you live it 24/7 you may not be engaged with your spouse arguing but the stress of a divorce the stress of uncertainty lives 24/7 you want your attorney to give a cell number you want your attorney to have access to be accessible not only during the day at night on the weekends it's our job it doesn't end it at 5 o'clock for us we're returning calls on the weekends we're handling calls on holidays because that's when family law really matters most is those times when the client needs you so those things are really important but lastly I think is preparation you want an attorney whose focus in your case is preparation I can tell you far too many times and far too many lawyers across the country and family law and I think they're plagued with this and that is they don't they wing it they don't prepare we're going to talk a little bit later about financial statements and preparing and going through preparing for testimony preparing for war because reality that's what it is imagine going into war and winging it going into a battle and not being prepared not knowing what the other side's gonna do no one would ever do that with an expectation of prevailing but choosing your lawyer has to be those things and it has to be someone first and foremost that does family law only I'm a big believer in that that's why we began our practice in the 90s and started focusing entirely on representing men facing divorce and and really having our attorneys across the country and the United Kingdom to really do their education in just family law so that's about choosing the right or the wrong lawyer usually this mistake I tried to say from the end but I thought it was important that we talk about it now and that is waiting for your wife to file or filing first I had met with a guy yesterday when that question was the very question he had and that is when is the right time do I do it now are there advantages legally strategically what do I do and particularly and in family law there are opportunities and I spent about 20 minutes yesterday talking to the client and said look you're not gonna hear this from a divorce lawyer but I'm gonna ask you is your marriage over do you think it can be saved is it irretrievably broken is there any chance at reconciliation and I know he was looking at me oddly because you normally don't hear that from a divorce lawyer you're just you know thrust a fee agreement and let's go but I always said a bad marriage is better than a terrible divorce and so we want to ensure that before you consider filing first that you consider whether your marriage can be saved because that's as equally important to us and that's always been our position at court Allen Cordell but when you've reached that point where many guys like yesterday this gentleman he was convinced that it wasn't gonna happen they work on a reconcile they just grown apart there were no bad acts nothing to consider but I said what are you waiting for and he thought well maybe she should file sometimes it's a feeling of guilt sometimes they want the other party to make that decision but there are many considerations when it comes to family law some of them are strategic sometimes our clients view you have some things that went on during the marriage that you're not proud of not only you're not proud you're embarrassed but the point is those are the opportunities when you want to present your evidence first keep in mind when you file first if you don't settle your case you get to present your evidence first that is the longest time you'll ever spend listening and cringing and wishing you had filed first if you didn't when you're at trial and your wife's on the stand beating you up saying things you know not to be true acts that never happened word you never said things you never did but now we have a judge whose attention span is somewhere between 40 minutes and sixty minutes writing everything down feverishly about you- your chance to sell the judge which is really your jury that's why injuries you do opening statements you want to sell the jury right off the bat about your strategy what your case is gonna be about why the jury should like you the judge is your jury I mean there are two states in which you can do jury trials Texas and Georgia but typically not so you have an opportunity to impress your judge immediately and representing guys is about appearance and presentation and you pretty much get one chance and if that one chance hasn't happened right away could be devastating for your case I can tell you that I was second my client was in system not filing and twenty years ago as I remember this very vividly they're beating him up with her their evidence in their testimony and I could see the judge focused on his computer and he was typing like crazy smoke was coming from his fingers so I got up and just was walking around acting like I was just trying to stretch during the petitioners testimony and I looked over and there's the judge writing the judgement already we're probably an hour in my client looks like he's a terrible person which he's not everything on the stand could be controverted with cross-examination and testimony from my client but the judge had already made his decision totally wrong but that's life in the family court system so sometimes consideration is what bad acts do we have what did you do and I always ask the client what is the worst thing your wife is gonna say about you the one worst thing and I and we'll talk about that a little bit but the point is don't be afraid to share that I've heard it all there is anything I'll be shocked about which sounds ludicrous but doing this twenty five years you've heard it all income considerations is your income high is it low are you making over time are you getting stock options bonuses I've met with gentlemen especially in 2008-2009 and prior to that where their income was at its lowest and I did an interview and one time I was asked well can your guys afford to file and I said well they can't afford not to file and that's an interesting statement but the point is is that your lowest point you want to get a judgment set especially an income in courts at that time and I think nowadays are a little bit more open to understanding the big swings of income and understanding that guy's normal guys middle-income guys hard-working guys blue-collar guys their income goes up and down and that's who court Allen Cordell represents and the point is that needs to be a consideration whether you should file now illnesses uh I met with a guy whose wife had a serious illness that was debilitating that were actually shortened her life span the question becomes why not do it now why wait till she gets worse we need to get to a judgment get to an order we knew we were gonna be paying spousal support or alimony or called maintenance and so those occasions we know that the factual situation requires us to get moving there's nothing to be gained in fact one of the issues you want to consider his retirement meaning what are you putting away in your 401k how much is going in your pension plan you're you're contributing to your pension fifty cents of every dollar is going to her the longer you wait why would you just continue to fund her retirement or her property settlement you didn't think about some of those things we always advise clients to consider stopping their contributions if they're gonna wait there's no point in setting her up for the future use that money to pay down debt or pay down something that you have and so income and expenses are a big factor if she's spending a lot on credit cards if she's going crazy it sometimes can be a band-aid you can stop the bleeding by filing and seeking a temporary order many courts many counties and states have local rules that go into effect temporary orders upon filing that prevent excessive spending so you want to talk about that and then lastly custody if you're not getting the custody that you want perhaps in a mistake number one you moved out let's file the longer the status quo goes the worse it becomes for you now if you're getting the best custody you're getting week on week off then let's wait it out let's get a good period so long as she continues to provide you with the custody that you want then we can show an established status quo and when you do file and she had cut you off which she will cut you off now we can show his retaliatory now we can poison that well and turn the judge against her so you do meet with your attorney talk about filing first many states I'm sure do not have strategic advantages in Gush in the early 90s there was an advantage in Missouri where whoever filed first and had physical custody of the child was the custodial parent pending the case it was crazy we would be racing to court I just don't hear that anymore and so it becomes a strategic one about your particular facts concealing information from your lawyer and so many times when I do this seminar across the country I will give them themes and so write this down we'll have a couple of these today doctor versus lawyer it's easy to remember this one because it's an unusual title unusual mistake and what I mean is imagine this there as I said earlier there is a relationship difference between doctors and patients and lawyers and clients and there should not be I have two friends who are doctors and we had this conversation and this is how we came up here I came up with this mistake and I asked him I said look that your clients ever tell you a lie intentionally or negligently did they leave out facts and he laughed and he said never in fact he gets more information about their patients that are completely irrelevant than he wants and he gets more information about their personal lives then he wants both of them were unanimous in saying that and I said look that's just kind of the opposite of what we do in family law or even as a lawyer you typically get clients and and you can blame a number of things it can be because it's embarrassing it can be because they think the little things don't matter but they don't give all the information and so I best describe it like this so if you're injured and your left leg hurts you pick up the phone you call your doctor and you need to make an appointment typically the triage nurse is saying well what brings you in my left leg hurts okay we'll see you tomorrow you go into the nurse are you going to the doctor's office you see the nurse there again asks you why are you here and you say well I know when I called I said it's my left leg but it's really not my left it's my right but you're lying to them not a single individual would say that ever because they don't want the doctor to look at the right leg because it doesn't hurt and the reason they don't give false information is because they want to be healed so the point being is why wouldn't clients also want to be we'll call it healed or they want to win or they want to be accomplished in the tasks and the goals or get them closer to what they they are setting out for themselves again it's it's the nature of family law now while doctors don't or can't use all the small information lawyers will I tell my clients keep a diary write everything down tell me everything the littlest of things can matter and I can use the small facts perhaps in your case and that is so critically important and in the way that I look at this is an example so I call it the one chip theory if you're old enough to remember the Lay's potato chip commercials in the 70s you can't just have one potato chip because they were so good that's the way lies work or deceit or leaving facts out and you can tend to continue to do more and more so I had a client come in to the office and he was just doing a consult and asked about separate property it inherited an apartment complex a large one from his father and wanted to ensure that he would get that property as his sole and separate property he'd done everything right he had kept it in his name he was in a trust all the income was staying in a trust he didn't use it I had its own tax ID number on and on and on I mean everything was perfect and I said look that shouldn't be a problem he didn't believe me and didn't retain at that time so he left he did it over bend me back up he asked how he could hide his assets and I said look I there's no way to do it and in fact I don't know why you would consider doing it because I can get you that property so that's an important fact every guy tends to ask can find out from other friends how they can hide things hide money hide property but it never works and so he came back months later and retained and I didn't connect the dots I didn't written that down we're in the middle of his case we're at a deposition and then at the deposition at the conclusion we start talking settlement and we settled a case on very favorable terms and as I were walking out the opposing counsel looks at me and says oh by the way would you mind giving me an accounting of his checking account for the last six months money and money out I didn't hesitate I said absolutely and the reason I didn't hesitate is because he made mistake number one and that is he moved out and he had double household expenses and he'd been paying so much in and out we were paying temporary alimony on top of that maintenance and so I figured no problem he was the breadwinner it shouldn't be an issue there were no allegations of impropriety financially or otherwise and so we're walking out I tell the client and I said look all I need is an accounting and I'm walking and I do this in the actual live seminar no I'll talk about this more in detail but he falls behind as I'm talking and I didn't realize he was already stopped in his tracks I turn around he's gone he's there I realized there's a problem I said what's going on and he looks like he's about ready to get sick because he's so shocked and I connect the dots this is the guy this is the one that said any one of the hide assets this is the one and wanted to get this property and I asked him what's going on so basically he was taking $25,000 a month of revenue from this very big apartment complex taking it from the trust into the mayor of checking account taking it out of the marital checking account writing a check to his brother who would then kept the money for the last six eight months and until the case was over so that he could cash out and get a quarter-million dollars so the the other lawyer knew it the other lawyer set us up because good lawyers find bad people it's not that difficult all she did was subpoena the bank statements and knew that there was money unaccounted for where it was coming she pretty much knew she didn't have an absolute idea but she knew that he was hiding money because it was the same amount every month and hid a check to the same individual which was his brother so what happened here is that good lawyers find bad people and judges are derailed by emotion he lost his chance that lie that he thought he knew better because his friends told him he can do it it would make sense if I'd said to him I could have easily gotten you that property a separate easily so we go to trial and he lost his chance to settle he lost his chance to be victorious because we lost in every aspect and I go on in in the live seminar on October 23rd you'll hear more about the testimony but it was terrible I call it the dreaded yes mode and I won't go any further because I'd like to see you on October 23rd and tell you a little bit more about that but to end this mistake and the way to avoid it is don't conceal information because typically speaking and the facts that I get with guys we always find a way to position them to give them a great chance to succeed and accomplish the goal doesn't mean we do it every time but absent outright child abuse there hasn't been facts in which we couldn't formulate a good strategy and your lawyer probably could too to give you a good chance at success and there are moments in which we say look this one has been commingled there's no chance at it but we can do X Y & Z on something else he didn't trust his lawyer he didn't treat his lawyer like a doctor you wouldn't hide something so you could get healed and so when you're choosing your lawyer we talked about that in a mistake make sure it's someone you can trust with all the information because if he had just taken my advice the result would have been drastically different mistake number 5 neglecting the children and you know it's a hard word to say neglect as you you know automatically gives you undertones of abuse failure to provide support what I'm talking about here is not being involved dad and especially when it comes to dads in custody neglecting their needs neglecting time failing to look at the important things during your divorce or prior to because ultimately and perfectly we'd like you to start doing this be for you file and so let's talk about it basically what this is I want you if you're seeking maximum time there's a couple things you want to do and they're really quick easy bullet points and that is stay involved don't fail to stay involved go to parent-teacher conferences everytime email the teachers call the teachers be involved in school activities go to the small things making sure that you email the teacher and say look keep me up to date on progress if there are concerns let me know and even if it's a small one get involved doctor's dentist did you know that doctors write down who presents the child in their notes their permanent notes in the file when you walk in it'll say father presents with child mother presents with child father not here it's interesting most doctors will do that dentists will do the same go to every appointment even it's just a standard checkup or if it's an urgent care you got to do it I know that you're busy but if you want maximum time you want to take one thing away from mom which is probably her best evidence and that is your uninvolved uncaring unknowing do all those things clothes shopping buy them buy a second set know their sizes medium/large whatever it is kid size adult small know their shoe size I know that sounds simple excuse me I know it sounds odd but if you get on the stand and the first question is what size shirt does your son wear and you hesitate forget it or if you give a wrong size forget it that goes along with attend playdates sounds odd as a guy but go to neighborhood playdates with other parents and other kids know the parents names around know the kids names that your kids are friends with also schedule things with them stay home on sick days I know that's hard taking time off but when your child is sick and it's your custody don't call mom and say hey can you take care of him that evidence 100% is coming in at trial and it hurts it hurts terribly homework do the homework with your child set that time aside even it's just to review saying hey let's talk about what's your favorite class let's go through what's going on do you have a test do you have a quiz stay involved go online see the report see their grades talk to your child because you want that to be that what's going on the status quo moving forward and then most of all when you talk about neglecting or failing stay involved do the fun stuff it shouldn't always be the you know the medical the social times that your kids have and just sitting in the car do the fun stuff schedule fun stuff on your weeks your weekends your time it shouldn't be you in front of the TV watching Monday Night Football or Saturday college football or the World Series while your child is somewhere else because that testimonies coming in they're gonna ask the child so what does your dad do when you're there oh he's always in front of the TV watching football that hurts yeah it's it's a good word for you to focus on neglect it's a harsh word but it tells you the seriousness of becoming and staying involved because what you want is this new to be the status quo and that's the evidence you want to see at trial to avoid making that mistake all right during doing a sloppy job on financial records and that is a very direct way to say don't mess up your financial statements will again I told you let's get a piece of pen or a piece of paper and a pen out write down the tax return interestingly on this slide you'll see something really important and that is a calculator we'll talk a little bit about that a great tool to use that most guys tend to ignore so in our live seminars to emphasize why we call this the tax return I asked guys to raise their hand about how many do their own taxes and it is usually the supermajority I would say seventy to eighty percent of guys either prepare their own taxes act from beginning to end or they do a substantial amount of work getting ready for their accountant to do their taxes and so if you think about that tax time we spend an inordinate amount of time preparing our taxes we go through invoices and receipts we go through bank statements credit card statements we look at every piece of paper that comes in the door we fill out paperwork in advance of preparing our tax return I mean many guys spend hours in advance you know if they file anything but the 1040ez they're easily spending a couple hours just getting ready to file gathering the supporting documentation I mean even the 1040ez I think the least estimate on the IRS says 45 minutes just going through it getting to the website calculating it even if you use TurboTax there's enough questions and TurboTax that heats up 45 minutes then a double checks then it looks for potential deductions that you've missed so I emphasize this because the reason we say doing a sloppy job on financial records and we compare this to the tax return it is that guy spend more time on their tax return than they do on their that probably the single most important document that they'll ever prepare that they'll ever file in any family law-related action particularly divorce and that is what's typically called the income and expense statement and that is what do you earn what do you spend and at the end of day what do you have leftover because that is what the judge is used to determine spousal support child support attorneys fees they look at that as the gospel because whatever you put down there will come back to haunt you if it's done incorrectly yet guys spend less time on the single most important document in family law than they do on their tax return they'll spend 30 minutes 20 minutes where sometimes the second lawyer in and we get the financial statements and they're done in pencil and those were actually filed with the court in their own handwriting which tells me no one reviewed them no one double-checked them no one looked them looked at them for accuracy and so you got to ask yourself why okay why is it important why should I spend more time than my tax return why do we call it the tax return and that is think about it if we spend two plus hours on our taxes and we all do it for one reason and that is we fear Big Brother we fear the government no one wants a phone call no one wants a certified registered return receipt mail that says mr. Johnson you're being audited for the last three years please set up an appointment because that strikes the fear of God and every human being when the IRS gets involved yet the chances of being audited are probably less than four percent I ask how many people have been audited in a room typically it's zero yet they still spend more time on something that they perceive to be more important than what I can tell you absolutely is the most important document in your family law case and so again I'll use it as an example I was trying a case in Georgia and opened up our Georgia office at the end of a four-day trial I had filed or my client filed first and I presented first we were in day three and I cross-examined the wife for two days on her financial statement we had a semi-retired judge on the bench I rested my case judge immediately kicks his feet up his boots up on the bench picks up a newspaper and starts reading the newspaper and all you can't even see him you can't see his head just a giant newspaper opposing counsel is nervous and he should be because at that point I knew I had it won because the judge had made up his mind and opposing counsel kind of starts talking louder it still doesn't get anything from the judge and says your honor just want to make sure you can hear me and judge peered over that newspaper and said Alan I've already heard enough and that is she had spent such little time on her financial statement because the Edition didn't add up he was obvious she didn't use a calculator because she totaled up like $5,000 more than what they added up to it was obvious her attorney didn't go through it so obvious her attorney didn't prepare her for it and it's obvious that she was guessing at most of the expenses and she was asking for alimony or maintenance and so as a result we won and the court didn't have any oven within which to reach a conclusion to establish how much money she should get because you didn't have any proof of evidence or proof or evidence of the expenses and so on the flipside if you list more income than expenses at the end of the day and says oh yes I have a thousand dollars left over after I pay every single possible expense I can think of which is a mistake guys make what do you think the judge is gonna do with that it's not gonna give it back to you and say you work so hard you can have it he's gonna give it to the other side but most guys I talk to most guys I see are living paycheck to paycheck and they have more expenses than they have income and so what I talk about sloppy let's reflect what life is and that is guys live paycheck to paycheck and they have debt then they have credit card debt so it's also not listing every expense because in most counties and most states they have these pre-printed forms that are most guys think are just everything that you should list it's not we add an appendix to the items and expenses that perhaps aren't listed lawn care subscriptions internet whatever maybe go through your bank statement go through your credit card statement let's find out a life in the day and what do you spend dining eating out gas gym membership I mean I can go on and on typically they just live list rent mortgage utilities food clothing entertainment so you need to list everything you spend and especially if you have kids and then most importantly here's a unique one if you've moved out these forms only list one set of expenses they just go straight down well you're paying double household expenses right so once you list two so we add a column we go down and add a column straight down next to it so you know you have double household expenses because that's life that's real and that's not fake money it's not monopoly money you're spending it so let's list it and so that's what we do and then lastly when you look for a lawyer we talked about someone who will prepare you someone who's prepared and organized someone who'll spend the time with you one of the things we do at court Ellen Carell and that is we spend an inordinate amount of time reviewing your financials you'll prepare a draft it'll go to Ally a paralegal who will then sit down with you to make sure that you've covered everything then you'll sit down with your attorney to make sure one where you think it has everything you need but - and most importantly you know it that you didn't guess now you understand where everything came from it's kind of the first step we're gonna talk about it preparing you for testimonial hearings and then finally use a calculator many guys are math geniuses but double triple quadruple check your math because you get one chance at it when you make a mistake it'll be cross-examined and you'll look like a liar judges look at guys they have one chance one lie you're a liar your wife five six seven times so it's important use a calculator take your time now I'm not saying spend less time on your taxes and saying spend more time on your financial statement talking too much especially to your wife so a little caution with this one because it's taking it as gospel it's something you should avoid meaning that I don't want you to just stop talking to your wife and that is I want you to talk talk to her try to reconcile especially if you have kids you want to talk about the legal stuff and that is major decisions regarding health education and welfare right you've got to do that but again I've got a theme here so write this one down we talked about the tax return we talked about doctor versus lawyer this one is called Texas Hold'em everybody knows poker everybody probably has seen on TV at least once the poker you know World Poker Championship or something or guys playing poker at a table so here's why I call this Texas Hold'em and particularly silence is golden what matters most don't share and that is when you're you're spending a lot of money with a lawyer and you're preparing your case and you're preparing to win and you want to accomplish a lot of things guys talk too much they share too much information they think they share it because they want to win an argument right with their spouse so you're arguing about your your case you're arguing about your marriage you're arguing about settlement do you really think you're gonna win an argument because you haven't won one for the last 20 years your marriage you're not gonna win this one so as a lawyer I used to do employment discrimination defense for big corporations and jury trials that compared to family law you can share information with opposing counsel that'll help you get to a settlement in that kind of case not in family law I'm a big advocate of holding back not sharing the evidence that you have not showing your cards because imagine so you're sitting at the poker table the first two cards are down you look you're pulling you've got aces right no bets are in other than the big and the small blind who at that table when you got two aces would flop those cards over and say I've got aces who's in no one unless you want everyone to fold and you only get the small and the big blind they hide it they Bluff not to denigrate or relegate your marriage into a poker game but it is a business transaction it is a game of bluffing because at times you don't want them to know what you will take and what you won't you don't want them to know what your settlement parameters are and particularly you don't want them to know what your evidence is that's equally important so let me give you an example quickly 25 years ago I had a case custody case we hired an expert at the very end for custody and they did not and we knew they had not we were sitting very pretty in terms of custody we had week on week off even though mom was going to ask a trial the client dad have only one night a week every the weekend the very odd requests considering we had gone a year week on week off so we did an expert just to protect that expert was going to testify that she had observed dad observe the kids interact that based upon the kid's testimony based upon their interactions and their desires that anything less than what they were experiencing over the last 12 months would be damaging psychologically so dad goes back to the house of one point just a week or two before trial they get into an argument about the settlement or trying to discuss settlement they get an argument about the trial she starts hammering in which every I can tell you every guys can experience this be prepared for it you're a loser you're going to lose I'm going to take your money I'm going to take your property I'm gonna take your retirement that you've worked hard for I'm gonna get it all and when I get that all I'm gonna take you back to court in a couple years and get more child support and I'm gonna get all my attorneys fees because you're Louie's a loser and you're gonna pay and you're gonna live in a one-bedroom apartment with nothing while I live in your home that you built that you're paying for and I'm gonna have boyfriends and you're gonna watch every bit of it I'm gonna go on vacation while you get stuck in your little town she did it Shep going after him so he said well yeah wait till you hear from my expert she stopped she got what she wanted she was trying to get information from him and he showed his cards instead of keeping them close to the best instead of not talking he talked too much she calls a lawyer they get an expert dueling experts cancel each other we lose a trial we were in the driver's seat it was the evidence in which mattered most he was really his aces in the hole he could have easily bluffed just rode along that everybody continued to ride and increase the bat being very confident but he let her go he let her do it and he played her game and he shared too much information all that money we'd spent strategizing all that money he had spent getting ready for his trial was now gone because he decided to talk too much so yes it is a game of poker it is a game of positioning and bluffing and making the other side believe that you have something that maybe you don't or that you don't that you do going back to my original statement about being prepared to file and to settle essentially means being prepared to try the case he spent money preparing and it was blown by one moment so what guys the mistakes they need to do is walk away you're not gonna win and I always say let's look it this way when you got married you were sitting next to each other at the table looking out to all your friends and family it was a great time now that you're getting divorced she's not next to you on the same side of the table she's across the table on the other side it's a very different dynamic now you're not together on the same side you're on opposite sides of a transaction and you need to understand that and that's why you hire a lawyer to take care of it that's mistaken 7 all right we're gonna pick up speed so we can make it through revealing too much on the internet so this is a huge one especially now in the onset of social media I was on dr. Phil I talked a lot about social media and its effects on divorce and how to use it how not to use it and the they remain true then and they still remain true now and that is I can tell you with certainty which is something rare in family law they have anything certain and that is social media should not be used while you're going through a divorce while you're going through modifications in any way there's nothing positive from a social media presence only negative and that is because we asked on our intake sheet are you on Facebook do you have an Instagram account do you have a Twitter account and ask your spouses or girlfriends information because I want to look at it in fact I look at it before I come talk to you I want to see what's on there because nothing good can happen you don't want to be on there in fact deactivated don't delete it because you don't want to spoil evidence and get accused of destroying evidence just deactivate your account because you don't want your friends posting in your account as well you may have gone out had a great time somebody snapped a photo you put it up on they tagged you and now it's on your Facebook page and I can take that photo and I can turn it as a negative to you and that's what I did on dr. Phil he showed me some photos and one was a mom having a drink and in the background was her child and I don't know if it was water I don't know if his bod qey her child was in the background she had a couple friends over so I turned it into she's having a booze party while her child's in the midst of it an irresponsible mom over drinking overindulging and that was probably couldn't maybe it wasn't the truth that maybe it was I didn't know and that's what you want to avoid the point is you don't need to give the other side any ammunition and lastly stop making comments about your case again Texas Hold'em poker why share evidence about hey I can't wait till my best bud testifies for me at court next week and then even well more importantly don't make comments about the judge we had a client who made a negative comment about the judge posing counsel printed it out imagine the judges reaction not too positive whether it was into evidence or not whether or find a tional issues objections or not it's already an judge knew about it it becomes a huge huge problem I can tell you certainty there is nothing positive about social media just he activated no more photos no more comments no more likes I don't care if you like a post from Twitter maybe you can somehow someone hacks your account and you start liking something that's inappropriate whether you know you don't agree with it a fringe group I'm telling you nothing positive you're not gonna use any evidence of it you can use photos from something else not your social media so just deactivate your account when it's all said and done go back onto social media all you want but it is you're revealing too much spending too much to be risking everything on social media alright failing to fully engage in your case and this is a this is one we're guys I think put too much emphasis too much trust in their attorney and assume that the attorneys can do everything for them but the relationship whether it be a doctor or with a lawyer is similar it works two ways it works it's a two-way street it isn't all give from one direction and there's a number of reasons for it and I and what I mean be engaged it really is be involved and be involved in your case be involved in what's going on do homework do research on your cases on the statutes on the relevant cases that have come out gather discovery when I always tell clients look go home start gathering everything and and at the end what you're doing is you're saving attorneys fees huge if you can write a book about how to save attorneys fees this would be one step on how to do it and that is be proactive in your case that doesn't mean you're being a lawyer it just means you're being proactive I've had clients come in with binders organized we had a contempt case where client was being accused of not paying his fair share of substantial extracurricular activities and we're talking $50,000 over the course of 10 years a very active children in a lot of sports and lotta extracurricular activities so he came in with three binders every single receipt was tabbed marked what it was for with an email behind it saying that they had had agree to it or had not agreed to it I didn't have to do any of that I probably would have spent five to seven thousand dollars in fees preparing those exhibits had he not done that yes it was his time but he saved an enormous amount of money not only that he knew every expense inside and out by being actively engaged by being involved by doing his own math a research an investigation his homework his testimony became that much more credible and when I asked him about an exhibit or an expense he was yes it's on exhibit 32 a and that was for gymnastics and that was when we both had an agreement and there's an email backing it up that I sent she responded to and I paid and here's my canceled check testimony was fantastic we can gather tax returns gather bank statements I even tell clients to call their plan administrator at their company to get their pension information so then when it comes time to dividing their 401k or their pension we get a sample what's called Quadro QDR a qualified domestic relations order I'm going to spend 150 bucks just making a phone call trying to get a sample so that I can divide their Quadro this is money saved it's easy phone calls so we talked about being engaged but work with your attorney work with your counsel to prepare your case and that helps you knowing your facts when we talk about sloppy financials you want to know the facts so when you're actively and fully engaged you're more informed you're more credible and ultimately your case is gonna be presented in a much better fashion because when representing guys I've said it before it's about appearance and preparation alright lastly we're talking about being ill-prepared for testimony and interviews so really the title should be prepare prepare and prepare because that really sums it up I was watching the American League Division Series her last night or the day before interesting every major league team goes through a pregame warmup every major league team every NBA team every NHL team they do something in the major leagues they do a hit the batting cage these guys are at the top of their game they're the best of the best right they probably don't need it but they prepare they they see ten pitches they want to get sharp and they still do it it's like pilots on an airplane they know how to fly it they've been doing it for thirty years but they go through that checklist they prepare so when you're facing the most important day and for the most important moment of your life that has evolved everything you've worked for your property your retirement and then importantly your kids prepare meet with your attorney and that's why I said when you're picking out an attorney talk to someone who has a weigh in a process of preparation one of the things we do at Cordell is we have litigation roadmaps and we outline here's where we are here's where you want to be and how are we gonna get there and what preparation is needed along the way before any significant testimonial event you've got to come into our office 48 to 72 hours in advance if it's a trial it's a week prepare know your case to many people I've seen just walk in the door and they tell their client oh we'll get ready before the trial that's a huge mistake you're spending too much and too much is on the line you might as well sit down feel comfortable with what's going on feel comfortable with the strategy and feel comfortable knowing that you can testify to it because again guys can't make a mistake they may be one and I can try to reconcile the mistake is something that was just a simple one but when you're not prepared and you start fumbling through the evidence through your testimony you start fumbling through what we had planned and that is preparing for direct and cross-examination it disastrous and so some of the things we want to do is actually if you're gonna testify let's go through a dry run here the questions some of the questions I'm gonna ask you here's some of the topics we're going to go through and actually ask you the questions and see what your answers are we want to talk about how you want to answer it where do you want to look how do you want to look what are you gonna wear it matters I had a guy walk in one time I told him wear suit he came in in clothes that looked like he was mowing his lawn he thought he knew better he thought the judge would think too much of him if he wore suit well the opposite happened the point is it's preparation no one an understanding and then more importantly and probably the most important preparation you'll do is preparing for cross-examination knowing and preparing for the unexpected because oftentimes I can try to tell you what I think they're gonna do the questions that they're gonna ask the facts and the evidence that they are going to cross-examine you with and try to catch you try to make you embarrass you or look like you're lying I'm gonna ask you those I'm gonna ask you tough questions but your lawyer needs to do that and you need to be prepared to do it it takes hours you'll be in and preparing for a full day just getting ready but if you watch some of the Supreme Court nomination hearings in front of the Senate Judiciary Committee you know that they prepared you know that those were questions that were probably already asked the answers were canned and they were ready and it was an effective it was good but the point is is no one goes in unprepared especially when all is on the line and that is if you're ill-prepared for even the simplest of motions the simplest of temporary hearings it don't expect a good result because if you or neither you or your attorney are willing to invest that time then the result is going to be a wasted amount of money so lastly know your financial statements we talked about that prepare go through how you came up with every number how you came up with every expense how you ended the result of what you have and what you don't have the values of your property marital and separate it's a lot goes into it especially if you have a multi-day trial so you may have preparation after beginning at the beginning of the first day you may have prep after the first day demanded do not wait for it from your attorney to ask about it so being ill-prepared is a huge mistake all right 60 minutes in a whirlwind so wanted to let you know that if you want more information about the ten stupidest mistakes but more importantly the process along the way we have something coming up its the Cordell and Cordell men's divorce school again it's free but it's live and in person on Tuesday October the 23rd at 6 p.m. at the Chattanooga Marriott downtown hotel and we say go to men's divorce cool calm to get more information or register and if you're a guy facing divorce and we always save one that you probably don't want or and maybe you don't want one at all you want to go to one of these seminars because you want to talk to a lawyer live have a chance to ask some questions hopefully get some answers so thanks for joining hope you got a lot of information and hope she helps you along the way

Channel: Cordell & Cordell

Views: 94,071

Rating: 4.7014923 out of 5

Keywords: Divorce, Family, Legal, Attorney, Custody, Alimony, Separation, Marriage, Divorce Court, Divorce tips, Dad'sDivorce, Divorce law, Divorce Attorney, Divorce Webinar, Divorce School, Divorce Seminar, Chattanooga, Scott Trout

Id: Q7MFD3G7ems

Length: 60min 39sec (3639 seconds)

Published: Tue Oct 09 2018

Reddit Comments

[u/[deleted]]

Money hungry attorney

[u/dday_throwaway3]

The book this advice is based on is a must read. It was some of the most pragmatic advice I found while going through my divorce.

I won't link to it directly because I don't want to come across like a shill, but C&C also sponsors a divorce forum for dads -- run by a community of dads -- that's been around for almost 20 years. It's a solid resource I often direct dads to when resources in this sub have been exhausted.

[u/Stevenorris717]

If I could have hired this guy, I would have. However when I called this firm. I was referred to a local attorney operating under their umbrella that was unimpressive in my initial meeting.

All the information in this video is good. Especially the part about knowing how you want to Proceed and picking a lawyer based on your wishes.

I had initial consultations with many when I went through my divorce. I agree... there are those that want to mediate. Those that want to burn your retainer and a settle. Know what it is you want and find an attorney that will work to get you there.