Tech Talk Tuesday: What is the BEST TURBO Money can Buy!?!?

[Music] with inspect funds and this is Tech Talk Tuesday today's topic is going to be turbo chargers specifically precision turbo chargers why we use them why we sell them why we recommend them one of the big comments I get with precision turbo chargers from people is question and reliability you know they have they've experienced the precision turbo failing in the past they know somebody that's had a turbocharger fail always been precision is why people tend to steer away from them what I've learned in my experience of installing them is it's it's your installation method one of them being the oil feed oil feed is very important ball bearing turbochargers don't like to see really high center cartridge oil pressure so you need to run a restrictor with them for our application here in its dana depends on the oil pressure of your engine we always run the thirty thousands restrictor pill you need to make sure that you have a good gravity feedback to the pan so that no oil gets backed up in the center cartridge another tip for installing a ball bearing turbo in general specifically precision sighs your blow-off valve properly the spring for your blow-off valve you don't want to hear compressor surge when the throttle body closes and then hear your bluff out and if you've ever ever heard it it's very distinct sound if you're hearing that immediately go to a slightly lighter blow-off valve spring when when we do a build will typically use an a su third a six or an eight pound spring in the blow-off valve and when the car is idling the blow-off valve should actually be open a little bit they you won this the fastest response from the valve as you can get so when the throttle body closes you get a little - no back pressure in the boost pipe bla valve opens vents boost pressure off so why precision over everybody else in our experience in the industry that we're in the top three turbochargers that we see the most of them before woman garret and then precision four corners are great turbos they're extremely tough you know a lot of their development has been in the diesel industry so their turbochargers seem to be built to run you know a million miles with with no problems they are tried-and-true tough turbo what I see on the dyno and tune them is they're they're lazy God don't tell me this man just called me lazy y'all got a lot of trouble I'm lazy I got up at 4 a.m. in the morning made lunches for everybody in the house pull in the hail you know wake up at 4 a.m. to make lunches you know who do that Mays people do it that largely comes from the weight of the turbine shaft they just have a physically heavier physically heavier guts to the turbo that makes it a little bit harder to get lit I'm not fat I'm Big Bend but they are tough that is that is definitely a perk to run in bora-bora turbo Garrett particularly the GTX lines what I found through the years and this is this is my own personal my own personal findings my own personal dyno comparisons and you know what I what I like and what I don't like Garrett turbo seemed to be very efficient within the range that they were built for it you get too far outside of that range and your power band just just just falls off I believe I'm not an engineer so I don't have all of their fancy drawings and math to go with it but one of the biggest things that I see is just frame size for frame size comparisons is going to be the turbine design these are comparable frame turbos both of them 100 housing both of them basically rated for the same power the turbine wheel design and size drastically different between the GTX and the precision Chintu turbocharger you know the GTX turbos use an 11 blade inducer where the precision the gentoos use a 6 blade again more blades are going to get more air sooner but you would also with more blades when those when the shafts becomes up you run the risk of a cavitation because you have so many blades paddling at the air at one time the citizens Gen 1 turbos were very good I really believe that the gen 2 turbochargers changed even though we were seeing massive mile-per-hour increases in drag racing once Gen 2 turbos came out Dino - Dino comparisons I mean same boost levels same frame turbos just going from a Gen 1 to a gen 2 we saw a hundred to a hundred and twenty horsepower increase just just swapping Gen 1 for Gen 2 on all of our big builds we always log back pressure we monitor back pressure in the turbine housing so that we know exactly when we're out of turbos no guessing it's important feature to measure when you're trying to get every bit of power every bit of horsepower that you can out of a build what I see with Garrett is we hit a very high pressure ratio will change turbine housings to go to a larger turbine housing in the same frame size and that pressure ratio does not drop what that tells me is again turbine wheel we just can't get the exhaust out of the precision I feel does a does a better job of that I think the blade profile just districts this the sheer size of the turbine wheel and I focus a lot on the turbine wheel but that's honestly where I where'd a lot of the the power is made and particularly your power being people you know peak horsepower is mean very little to the performance of a car and you get a lot of people that get hung up on on peak horsepower numbers what what we shoot for what I personally shoot for is a Power Beam you know a car that makes 500 horsepower as early as possible all the way out to redline is going to be a much faster fun or car to drive than a car that makes 700 horsepower at 4000 rpms and falls to 350 horsepower by redline which does happen so I guess back to why do we choose precision Jenn two turbochargers dyno chart doesn't lie performance doesn't lie we've had multiple cars where we've gone or Horner carrot precision on the dyno in the same day retune just to get the data and frame size for frame size currently they are making more power and with a better power and reliability as with all turbochargers again back to install any turbo needs a proper install precision maybe a little pickier I don't know if pickies the right word but reliability properly installed we've got gen 2 turbos that have been on cars for years now daily driven driven very hard you know we have street and track use we have dedicated track use and literally I've had zero failures proper install proper tuning Garrett I feel that I feel the same same applies you know Garrett actually has a little bit more information on the website as to oil pressure I believe they're number four the center cartridge is 18 to 18 to 36 psi oil pressure as think they recommend moving for their center cartridge precision doesn't have that information but I've just kind of applied Garrett's chart to precision have no problems with that journal bearing turbos are a different story they can take a higher oil pressure reason being you have your turbine room shaft that runs through the center cartridge of the turbo you can't see it but it's the chef that connects the compressor to the exhaust wheel on a journal bearing turbo that is actually suspended in a layer of oil so you have a inner shaft then you have an outer journal and there's holes drilled in specific orientation the window oil pressure comes in it actually centers that shaft in a layer of oil so you need a decent amount of oil pressure and will work in order to hold that shaft tolerance ball bearing turbocharger is just that shaft is supported by ball bearings so you're not relying on oil to hold the shaft Center as much as you need to get use the oil for cooling and lubricate the ball bearings properly which is why you don't need that very high oil pressure what I see when you have too much oil pressure and the turbocharger is you'll see the exhaust start to leak first you start to get a little bit of smoke out that out the tailpipe of the car and that's that's from the exhaust seal letting go on the turbo once that happens you're better off just rebuilding there's not you're not going to come back from that you could put a regulator and at that point there's some new products out on the market that are making some headway as far as being an adjustable similar to a fuel pressure regulator there's a oil pressure regulator for your service charge er haven't tested those yet but I'm sure we'll start seeing them in the near future I believe at the PRI show this year there's some companies that were that were releasing oil pressure regulators for turbochargers once you start to get leaking out out the exhaust side of the turbo save yourself the headache and the money pull the turbo off send it in have them have a have it rebuilt it can be a rather inexpensive repair at that point you go to the point when the turbo is bad or you actually lose a ball bearing and you're out the price of the turbo to fix it sometimes it's cheaper to buy even cheaper just to buy a new turbo at that point oil pressure touched on gravity drain make sure you have a good clear gravity drain minimum - 10 I like to say - 12 you know for a good gravity drain if you are getting anywhere near if your install puts the turbocharger near the oil level of the pan you know it in a drag racing application something that short-lived it you can get away with that if you're gonna road race if you're gonna drift if you're gonna street drive anything with a low amount of turbo I suggest running some type of a scavenge pump to actually pull the oil out of the turbo and return it to the pan that is one of the one of the biggest causes for failure is just your oil feed and your oil return them get in this information out there here's another this has nothing to do with turbocharger performance or longevity or reliability anything like that one of the things that I see a whole lot with with cars that come in for us to tune us to setup is someone will say you know I want to run 20 pounds boost out of my turbocharger okay what wastegate spring did you put in well 20 pound and we go okay that that's the minimum well no I just I want to be able to run 20 pounds boost so I put the 20 pound spring in with electronic boost controls with even manual boost controls what you set your wastegate spring pressure to is the minimum amount of boost that you can run you can put an 8 pound spring in and using a boost control we can bring that boost level up to 20 pounds but when you when you set the gate the when you put that spring in the wastegate whatever spring you put in that's the lowest you can go if it's 8 pounds 8 is 20 is 20 if it's 2 bar you know that's too far so you know we we spend a lot of time changing ways to get wastegate Springs out for people in order to get you know some some level of control when we do multiple boost positions like a five position switch or something like that when we're maxed out of 20 we have 20 pounds spring we have nowhere to go so start out lower and then we can tune the car from there I guess in a recap all the turbos have a place all of them are excellent turbos I'm not seeing anything bad none of us are getting paid here to run a specific turbo to be honest with you if it was a $200 a bay turbo that I felt me best power and best power being it was an excellent terrible that's what that's what that's what I would be pushing high i strictly come from the standpoint of performance that's all it that that that is my my opinion is based on that currently dyno charts to support it the precision gen to turbo is just the performing turbo at the moment i understand that you know Garrett has got some new turbos that are on their way out look forward to seeing those see what they can do for Warner has their efr line at turbo we've done it we've done a lot of dyno tuning with those really really cool turbocharger it's got everything internals got an internal blow-off valve it's got internal wastegate turning wheel speed sensor built in it's it's an excellent turbo it does really well and that actually that technology is not new if our turbos have been out for several years now but even against the efr turbos just don't see any turbo frame size for frame size now if you start to compare a 72 millimeter to a 55 58 of course you're gonna have a power band difference between those two turbos but frame size for frame size I just don't see anything outperforming a precision turtle particularly the generation 2 precision does have I've seen some information that they're working on a gen 3 turbo definitely excited to see what what that series of turbo does those are currently in the larger frame size right now prolong turbos that they're testing those so we need to see what see what those turbos do well that kind of wraps up our talk on the basics of turbo why we choose precision turbo or anything else again we run all of them so I'm not bad-mouthing anybody just are our personal preference hope you enjoyed the video if you have any questions post them in the comments below if you liked the video and found it informative it like any other topics or suggestions you guys might have we can cover we do everything here we do engine building with you tuning we do fabrication we do anything automobile related send us information on what you might like to see on Tech Talk Tuesday if not see you guys next Tuesday you

Channel: MspeK Performance

Views: 18,618

Rating: 4.9673023 out of 5

Keywords: best turbo, what is the best turbo money can buy, tech talk tuesday, tech talk, best bang for your buck turbo, most reliable turbo, turbo with the most hp, turbo hp, what is the best turbo for my car?, best turbo for my car, honda civic turbo, turbocharger, turbocharged, persicion, garrett, borg warner, journal bearing turbos, ball bearing turbos

Id: tuV8jZM_GFw

Length: 15min 24sec (924 seconds)

Published: Tue Jul 30 2019