Worlds Deadliest Sniper: Anthony ‘Staz’ Stazicker

stairs welcome to the show mate dodge thanks for having me yeah mate looking forward to this one um let's get cracking let's roll all the way back where did you grow up and how did you get into the military um so i guess okay i'll take you uh yeah right from the from the start we'll work our way down like most northerners we find our way down on the [ __ ] south coast we never go back up the way do we um so yeah i was born born in wigan lancashire i've still got a lot of family put up that way as well um parents together um i had a fairly decent upbringing lower to middle class you know um both parents worked i had an older brother an older sibling um and i just remember being out all the time having a good time always out in the [ __ ] fields playing football scrappy and all that kind of stuff and that took me to about you know school age about nine that's when my parents split up and we myself my brother and my mum relocated then to nottingham or mansfield in particular and it was around about that stage obviously new environment we had an [ __ ] of a of a stepdad he was just a [ __ ] bit of a bully uh we didn't like him didn't get on with him too well and obviously probably on reflection now since i'm a bit older we'd probably give him a hard time as well probably didn't make life easy for him so it's probably probably a two-way street did you did you move in as a family yeah yeah well i i don't know i don't know if it was brought together or however that was sort of financed but we relocated there we moved into a new house together as a new family unit and with that comes the struggles and the pains of a kid and you're still trying to find your feet you're trying to [ __ ] fit in new school into sort of middle school then into secondary school and and everything else so that was about nine and then that went on for a couple of years sort of adjusting to the new environment new schools plenty of scrapping trying to find your pecking order within the school as most [ __ ] kids do you know you don't want to get bullied all that sort of stuff so picked up sport quite late on football so i started getting into football it's all rugby rugby yeah up north so it's all rugby league uh that got been sort of turned up and not going like where the [ __ ] saw the rugby post there was none it was all football so kind of forced down into that route so i started quite late with the football about 10 years old 11 joined a local team and played for school and kind of started putting all my energy and effort into that stuff and that was going all right um and then [ __ ] around about the age of 11 so a couple years in sort of just settling in that's probably when the biggest sort of slap in the face happened and my real kind of um my darkest times really as a kid and still now to some extent but that's when my my mum passed away so and it was sudden as well at the time we were up north with like visiting my dad so it was with him for the weekend and we got the phone call sunday night my mum had a brain hemorrhage so it was [ __ ] it was instant how old was she 36. [ __ ] my age you know she's younger so had a really bright career she repositioned herself in a bank was working i didn't know at the time but was [ __ ] since found out she was also doing a law degree at the time so she was grafting like [ __ ] probably you know might have been a contributing factor who knows um so our world [ __ ] was turned upside down you know within the matter of you know in the evening so we drove back down to nightingale she's in hospital she's you know in icu um in a coma and used coma you know on a ventilator and it was you know we had a few days of this sort of in the hospital back and forth and and the decision was made to turn you know turn the ventilator off and and essentially end our life and mainly because the damage i think was was was that extreme and to that much extent with her brain even if she did make it out the other side it wouldn't have been you know anything of a quality of life you know arguably so [ __ ] our will changed you know and it was [ __ ] now we're here we're in nottingham we're with a you know the stepfather that we don't [ __ ] like um and again on reflection now looking back it must have been a [ __ ] time for him as well you know he's just lost you know our mum as well so he's going through all this stuff he's got two [ __ ] kids that are just [ __ ] turned upside down inside out and yeah i guess it was a difficult [ __ ] time because we were then trying to go back into school at that age you don't want the [ __ ] drama yeah you know you just don't want the spotlight on you yeah so my way of dealing with it was just i don't want to talk about it and and i want to ignore the situation and anybody that was sort of trying to speak i'm not [ __ ] i don't want to talk about it just leave me alone i want to get back into school back into football so i kind of put all my energy and effort into into football uh and concentrating on sport really so yeah that was a hard time from there moving through sort of secondary school and i think i used i was angry about it as well i was [ __ ] i was pissed off i was i didn't understand why you know you get through those emotions of [ __ ] why me why is this [ __ ] happen to me and and what have we done and you know but i sort of channeled that energy and that anger really had a [ __ ] fire in my belly from there from then on in and you know um just moved and channeled that all into sport and football and then i started getting pretty good at football yeah so i started kind of and actually it's fair to say at this point my grandparents so my mother's parents um moved down to nottingham they bought i sold up all that place up there bought a small bungalow uh in the local village and me and my brother moved in with those with them at what age 12 11 12. so you go yeah it wasn't super abusive but it was it was physical some stuff you know grabbing us and just making it uncomfortable yeah and you know it wasn't a good environment to be in as a kid i remember being really unhappy um sort of living in that environment did you have an older how old was your brother yeah he's two and a half years older and he had to [ __ ] step up to the plate you know and i can i remember him rolling around on the floor with him scrapping he's 13. you know and protecting me essentially so moved in with the grandparents and and that's weird you know to be a kid to move in with your grandparents that's a again it's a completely different um environment so it takes adjustment it gets you you know but my [ __ ] grandparents you know you know bless them that they're amazing people and looking back now as well what a selfless act that was as well to give up everything their life their their friendship groups up in wigan you know the property everything like that they moved down lock stock everything to to raise me and my brother and give you a lot of love i'd imagine [ __ ] yeah yeah um the love was weird it was different it was old school kind of grandparents yeah you never have a hug they never tell you they love you but but you know it's there but it was that stability that we wanted probably and needed at that age so moving on from that my grandad you know kind of took me under his wing old school gentleman values which which have probably rubbed off as well you know being respectful to people uh and understanding that you've got a [ __ ] graft work hard i kind of got a lot of that from him sort of um probably the hard way at the time as a kid now i want to do this and you know you're getting pulled in all different directions you just want to go out sit on the park drink [ __ ] hooch or [ __ ] white lightning but for me the football was the main focus and he really channeled me and helped me and you know he took me to every game every training session at the time i was playing with a uh associate to a professional club in manchester town so it was training two three times a week you know uh playing you know once a week as well it's a big commitment time-wise but and the school stuff as well playing school football and then playing for the county nottinghamshire and then later on you know sort of representing england school boys and a few other teams as well um sixteen six sixteen seventeen went around um it depends who i was playing for yeah if it was well oddly enough i'm only [ __ ] two foot nine on a good day but i played center back but more of like a sweeping okay um i was like like a salmon mate yeah but um but yes it was fast you know we picked up the stuff and yeah and then from there depending on where i was if i was playing for the county team maybe central midfield you know just getting the engine room running around if i can putting all the tackles in couldn't do anything decent with the ball but i could [ __ ] tackle harder you know and get stuck yeah um and then for english school boys it was more of like a right wing back role yeah um so yeah that was all going well and for me as well i'd put all my energy effort [ __ ] eggs in that football basket and it was at the time when the football clubs were going through especially the lower divisions at the time it was division one division two members yeah one two three and then conference and i think mansfield at the time were let's say division three yeah something along those lines but um i was doing really well i was captaining i was capturing nottinghamshire team of that team and it was all yeah you're laid on it you're doing really well keep doing what you're doing you're gonna get in there at the time uh caller a yts your apprenticeship yeah uh for argument's sake um they all went into liquidation all those [ __ ] league teams we can offer you a contract but we can't pay you as a yts scheme but at that stage i was getting interest from other clubs you know uh leicester fulham i went and ended up going for fulham for quite a while um at the time were prem you know you know yeah top lane yeah yeah premier league so and training really well so i kind of went to london for maybe six six to eight weeks and i was training really [ __ ] hard and the best i'd ever trained as well and i slotted straight into this little team because you know what it's like you turn up in a dress and you play [ __ ] professional sport and was that where did you play yeah yeah yeah yeah and that was [ __ ] right back it was like oh sorry we've not got a right happy day i was kind of welcomed yeah which was good yeah um and welcome you know it was good it was good for me so but i was away at that time that was the first time i'd really been away from home and had that feeling of okay why are you talking about my granddad's um 16 17. okay so had you had you dealt with any of the pain from losing your mum by the age of 16. had you dealt with anything or are we also are you just suppressing it the way you put the energy into my football that's the way that i dealt with okay that is 100 percent the way i dealt with it and i didn't even really talk to it talk about it to my brother or my grandparents or how are you feeling and it was maybe i don't know yeah things have changed now aren't they there's more sort of access to information and more absolutely there's google google [Laughter] so and i didn't want to i didn't want to talk about it okay i just wanted to [ __ ] you know just suppress it and um so yeah no i didn't no to answer your question so at that stage being away it was the first time i'd been away from my granddad being there as that rock support unit and sort of always actually love after the game post game [ __ ] yeah yeah yeah there's no way really than you're [ __ ] grabbing telling you how it is how did i do it yeah yeah you know you did this but no it was all good yeah um it didn't work out at fulham you know at the time um the best i've ever trained everything was lining up the stars were aligned and i was like i'm [ __ ] in here and all the reporting back that i was getting from the coaches was [ __ ] really impressed keep going and i went away um we broke for a a few weeks for um out of season it was like go home don't do anything stupid don't [ __ ] play football i mean just look after yourself look after your body train but be careful and [ __ ] mentalist here i used to love motocross as well so i'm like i loved football but what i really loved and was passionate about was motorbikes for some reason it gave me that sense of scrambling yeah yeah like scrambling there was a real good place in there it was called the desert or you could literally used to get on the little one two five i can roll out the garage and i'd kick it up and down the local streets and then down the little alleyways and then onto the dual carriageway for 30 seconds flat out no one's looking at it and then just hop off and then you'd be straight into sherwood forest so you get into some real good riding with your mates and at this place in the desert an old dishes quarry there was like a track there and there the van it was proper setup um so i used to do i used to love that and i don't know why i just i just loved it the sense of freedom the exhilaration that adrenaline [ __ ] buzz i loved it um and i went to uh and did a track day with with some of the some of my friends and something as stupid as i went around the corner put my leg out and just a simple rub and i i dislocated my knee at the time he's got my foot caught and i was [ __ ] yeah the [ __ ] is that yeah trying to stand back on the peg i was like oh [ __ ] i've done something here i've done myself a mischief so i rode back into the paddock and i remember sort of put the bike in and um my leg was just kind of locked in a weird position i remember squatting down and rolling my knee and sort of you know crying with you know just the frustration of what the [ __ ] have i done and i knew i'd [ __ ] up and i knew it was serious and it wasn't so much the pain it was the the contract yeah and how am i going to tell me granddad whose famous last words were be [ __ ] careful yeah so i i masked it i hid it yeah um it sort of went back in after i'd sort of rolled it around and really swollen and got back in van back back home to the bungalow pushing the bike back in all sheepish and got in and he's kind of looking at me all good yeah i'm alright i'm sort of limping a bit that's all right it's all good um fast forward three weeks back to fulham and then we're back into training um and i just said to him look i've had a bit of an issue with my knee i was you know playing football and you know i had a bit of a ticking off yeah i went in to see the physio they were looking at stuff and um i kind of had some physio back and and i was feeling okay and we played a sort of pre-season game and literally the first tackle i went into it [ __ ] went again my knee went again and dislocated and and i [ __ ] knew and i was looking at them they're looking at each other and [ __ ] wheel me off get me in they look they did really well looked after me got me into a private sort of stuff had the um operation it was only like medial meniscus stuff and shaving and all that bits and pieces um then looked after me again rehabbed all this kind of good stuff um first came back it [ __ ] went again and i knew i was i remember just [ __ ] punching the floor at the time in frustration yeah and just what the [ __ ] have i done um that's not to say i'm not sitting here and saying i should have been in the last world cup yeah for england i'm not saying that's your story right but um i do feel i could have had a you know some some level running here i could run it yeah and i never had to see yeah i never had that um but this happens how many people does this happen to you it's [ __ ] you're that close you're on the line aren't you and you [ __ ] raise his edge mate and you go yeah one way or the other and [ __ ] you need a bit of lady luck not just in what you're doing with with sport but in life in general and and i didn't have the rub of the green you know on that response i do believe everything happens for a reason yeah i'm a big believer in that yeah yeah absolutely i think it yeah i learned a lot from that as well uh moving forward um i i was then released from there i went back and and was next thing was [ __ ] what am i going to do now yeah i've received an education here yeah so i left school and then was kind of right i need to get into college i could do something so in the hope that you're going to get a contract somewhere yeah but your backup was if i don't i've got college yes okay yeah so i went to college uh turned up at one of those open days at college [ __ ] looking around i loved engineering well i love bikes and cars and tinkering with stuff like that and and playing around so i went to do like an engineering um course whatever that was turned up got the [ __ ] result gcse results out they were like [ __ ] [Laughter] enrolled into a b-tech national diploma for sports science which was two two years three years whatever it was yeah um got into that and then again uh by this stage the knee was feeling better i was rehabbed you know fast forward six months whatever it is feeling better and i'm starting to play football again uh a local level sort of paid small contract stuff but playing with grown-ups with gizes with blokes but for a semi-pro team so i'm getting back into it and then i start playing for the college team and then i get selected for the england colleges as well so i'll get represented for that go all around the country playing great stuff and then i got offered a scholarship to play at university of south carolina so at these college games or england versus whatever yeah all the [ __ ] um a lot of guys or scouts from america or universities would would head over and be like start talent's going yeah so i got picked uh for a full scholarship three four years in paper university south carolina and i was [ __ ] yes the dreams are live dreams yeah yeah here we go back on the bus yeah and at the time you know um i started going through the process figuring out all the paperwork speaking to the um um the the coach that was over there my main point of contact and it was a time when they're sort of on their sort of break period as in going on holidays like i've got two weeks of the whole year where i get to go away with my family yeah so but if you've got any issues any of the forms you need information on just [ __ ] call me it's not an issue yeah brilliant i've got this yeah filling out all this there's [ __ ] tons of paperwork flying through affidavits all this kind of stuff and i filled out of amateur eligibility form for the collet to play in the college league i thought nothing of it have you ever been paid to play yeah have you ever had a contract yeah have you ever received royalties which could include free boots bags clothes yeah yeah yeah they'll have some of that yes we have yeah yeah we know where this is going anyway fast forward a week all the [ __ ] [ __ ] forms off and but i selected where i was going to be living my accommodation my flight was booked i was two weeks out you're probably in you know i was in my flight everything bags were getting packed and uh at the [ __ ] the phone call of doom from the what the [ __ ] the coach is like what have you done you fill like this form right you and there's a quite clear distinction in america between being a professional or you know being an amateur and never the two can kind of cross over that's right and they deemed me to be a professional um and i couldn't play in the college league so he was like no worries i know the guys at the board i'll smooth this right out don't worry about it roll in the church group together yeah i'll have a word left it for a few days came back i can't do anything um what we can do is put the application on hold for 12 months probably shouldn't be saying that and then we'll redo the forms yeah and when we do them yeah obviously don't don't fully please yeah yeah get someone else to fill it in for you remember my [ __ ] red crayon and at the time i was sort of 70 18 sort of finishing college and i was like [ __ ] that [ __ ] that's dream stuff thinking i could go in america for three years well it is yeah um and but a year is a long time yeah it's not but at that age yeah so um i left college and i i got a job i need to get a job um so i started working um a local leisure center in a gym i did a personal training course i started working in this local gym and i started doing that for you know a year or two and i'd kind of left left the um application for that stuff i was like it's fine i can still play football here and i'm playing at a good level and getting paid quite well i can probably still make it through this channel yeah so you still had hope i still had the hope and it's all clinging on to that that dream and then i think about two years into working at the gym i was just kind of like the [ __ ] am i doing um do i want to be let's start looking and start planning ahead and there's arguments for both sides of the spectrum some people say don't put so much pressure on yourself or kids and i get that but i needed purpose and i needed something to [ __ ] really dial into and and focus on and football was always that yeah but that was slipping away yeah and almost slipped away um and for me the next thing was well what do i want to do um and i'd always been interested in the military so at that stage i started looking into the military and thinking well maybe this is the way that i can get away and still have the adventure and still i don't know scratch an itch that i wanted to scratch and and still play football within the military as well um so i went down to local careers office in nottingham and she walked through the door bro i bushed it i didn't have a [ __ ] clue really i'd been looking at certain stuff and i knew that i wanted if i was going to do it i wanted to do the hardest thing yeah just [ __ ] what's the hardest thing well that's the mentality yeah and the bloke in there was a marine and he was like that come over here what you want to do is this marine and arguably again you you know um it's probably the marines or the paris which is the hardest basic infantry um course that you can do within the military it's certainly the longest you know with the marines and the paris as well that's that are the two most hardcore soldiering courses that you can do and so i signed myself up for marines and then i was like refocused then i was like brilliant now i've got something that i can really start thinking about and i can start planning towards and i can start training for so you know i got the course got the course of course they um i did a potential royal marines course went down it's just like a little look they can look at you for a week you get to look you know inside the camp and get shown around and it's basically a [ __ ] beast in for a week you go down and get thrashed around and and i think because of my base fitness from football playing at high level i kind of um i turned my hand to it quite quickly in terms of the fitness side of things um so past the potential royal marines course was offered a date to start and it was that was 2005 and i was 21 years old yeah so off i went [ __ ] you know packed the bags said my goodbyes and and oddly enough no one in our family had had done this before so it's not like i was kind of um following footsteps following a grand dead or following your dad so it was nothing like that no there wasn't me so i don't know why it was a bit weird probably a bit strange um did you not thought about the military whatsoever as a kid or growing up i was literally like 21 going right i fancy the military no i did yeah i did mate when i was kind of in school at 16 i was i was um one of my friend's dads was in the marines actually and i watched a few things an old [ __ ] video tape a few bits and pieces and had the um like the pamphlets and the leaflets i was looking through it it was kind of there but like i said everything was [ __ ] yeah so it's kind of just gathering dust on the shelf and it wasn't until later on i thought well [ __ ] what can i do and what do i want to make of myself and um probably i didn't think about it that deeply as being that old at 21. i think oh it could be you don't really know what the [ __ ] going on and i was getting not getting into a lot of trouble but i was i was going out every weekend i was living for that thursday friday saturday [ __ ] drinking getting [ __ ] drunk fighting yeah just being a [ __ ] no-bed yeah you know what i mean and everyone goes through that process and again you need a bit of luck because it's so close to the edge isn't it between you're being arrested being nicked or going [ __ ] yeah and going down one way yeah um but i think probably having that grounding that focus and having something to aim for that that helped me a lot so that's why i enrolled and i started i started the royal marines um uh basic commando basically the commando um center royal marines in limston okay yeah down on this on the coast there along the coast um and i was there for 32 weeks and [ __ ] oh you very quickly develop and learn and and they they mold you they sort of break you down and get everyone onto a skill and then they build you up fitness-wise but also mentally all the things that you're going through they start toughing you up and i know that after that 32 weeks i again i turned my hand to it quite well i enjoyed it enjoyed the challenge i enjoyed the physical challenge i still had that fire in my belly probably had something to prove to myself and to other people that although i'd failed at the you know the football side of things and i could still do something that was was worthy for me and that having that green beret and you know the bell it melt it meant something to me he had a sense of worth for me and how long did you how long did you have you said you had to train for 32 weeks is that for them to say at the end of it yes you are official marine yeah so they build you up to essentially they teach you everything from basic weapon handling you know shooting drill everything and then um at the end of the 32 weeks so week 31 to 32 you do what's what is your commando tests and these are tests that you cannot fail that you have to pass you know and it culminates with a 30 miler with x amount of kit within let's say eight hours across dartmoor uh and then there's a commando there's a tarzan assault course there's a nine mile speed march there's certain things that you have to do within time okay uh and you've got to hit those [ __ ] markets you know and you kind of move through that process at the end of that if you pass them all then you you've essentially passed and you have a pass out parade and you get you bury your family come down you do a bit of marching around terrible at yeah [Laughter] so passed out of there um and i passed all the way through as well most a lot of people sort of get back trooped or they get injured you get moved back into another troop and so i was a what was called as an original so i passed i started on day one and i'd finished on week 32. how many people how many people can you remember joined that from day one and how many people you were left at the end i don't know let's say there's 45 people joined our ark and a troop and we must have had maybe half of those that were kind of back trooped or injured and and then other people that are at the same stage as you move along the ladder to week say you're in week 28 somebody who's waiting who's been injured we'll jump into your stream and then carry on with you okay um so yeah and i passed that i did i did really well i got the like the king's badge awards or the best recruit yeah i got the pt medal as well the fittest guy in the troop i've got all the best times and so i was kind of like [ __ ] hell i'm good at this it's kind of been all right it's just yeah for once in my life yeah and i then you then go on a real high as a [ __ ] yeah you know the cream of the crop within the training camp and then you're [ __ ] over 2-4 i went over to 40 commando commando unit 40 come on 40 commando wasn't based in taunton okay and within there you've got different companies you know i went into bravo company and i was in the same company as aunt middleton okay uh louis my business partner and a few other guys that have since been badged so um i don't know if there's something about that era but me and um sort of training together we was he was uh one troop behind but and it obviously had previous experience with you know the powers and bits and pieces as well so but we've always seen each other and um you know he was that guy who turned up with wings on as a recruit like he's like the [ __ ] is this guy like he had more medals on the training team yeah you know because he was he you know he had his issues and dramas and moved through and wanted to rejoin and and do marines train as well so we joined the same company and i deployed went out to afghanistan for my first tour which bit of an eye-opener what year was that when you went to afghan 2006. so straight away after you've gone straight into afghanistan yeah well i did some mountain training first and a few bits and pieces i went into some machine gun training bits and pieces and went into a different troop and then i deployed i only deployed for about two months it was quite a short and sharp tour for me i got attached to another company okay um in kabul um what's that feeling like going from england to afghanistan were you excited now knowing what i know now and what i've done yeah since that with the sbs and everything else [ __ ] you know i was a i didn't know anything yeah i didn't have a [ __ ] clue yeah you know you think you do you've got all the belt the mirror you've got the equipment but i didn't have the experience but how did you get the experience you've got to [ __ ] go out and get in it and get involved and immerse yourself in that world and [ __ ] it was an eye opener from you know all sorts of weird [ __ ] and ieds going off and rockets and machine gun fire and just what the [ __ ] going on this world is weird this is different yeah you know and i've never experienced that before i've been on holiday and bits and bits in the [ __ ] kabul afghanistan the [ __ ] is this place yeah you know it was where's the beach culture shocked me you know but you but you've got a job to do so you still have to keep that level did you know how long you were going forward when they say right we're going to put you out into kabul do you know how long you're going for it yeah you do yeah yeah generally speaking you'll know how long you're deploying for those moments that has been instances before where you go out on a on a job like hostage rescue yeah and you don't know how long you're going to be you know you could be out there [ __ ] two weeks quick in and out we know where they are let's go and do it or it could be two months could be [ __ ] six months and i've done that before where you know you get left in place and and you're working the target bits and pieces but generally in the green green army or the wider army you know how you know where you're going and you know how long you're going for so you were a commander going out there yeah yeah what was the next steps for you what were the next steps to get into the sps was that is there a process you go you know what i'm nailing everything i want to get into the top yeah creme de la creme yeah so i went through the marines and then um i've kind of been i'd been in maybe let's say 15 months i'd come back and um i was kind of looking around thinking what's next yeah like a person what the [ __ ] what's the next challenge what can i do next but while i was out in afghanistan in kabul i remember i was working the gate i was on on the gate and security and a soft skin vehicle a normal vehicle come through and there's four guys in there long hair beards wearing civilian clothing jeans flannel shirts little chest rigs [ __ ] cool weapons yes shades on caps who the [ __ ] are those rock stars yeah it was it was some of that and the one that was the [ __ ] sbs i'd heard of them i knew who they were but i'd never really seen them physically in person and that left a mark on me i think it impressed me and i was kind of like i want to [ __ ] beat that how do i [ __ ] do that as quick as possible yeah so that was the first instance of seeing it and seeing them in and around kabul and not really knowing what they were doing but it just looked cool as [ __ ] um so i started looking into it a bit more and at this stage i was now at a different unit i was up in scotland at a different unit and so when you so when you come back you're deployed to different units whether it's scotland exmoor whatever generally you'll do about 18 months to two years within a unit and then you'll move somewhere else or why um i guess i guess you move where you're needed depending upon rank if you moved up rank and also a lot of the times you'll have to you'll have to develop a skill as well and everybody tries to hide and most people just want to be a door kicker they just want to be a [ __ ] knuckle dragger they just want to be a commando yeah however the the bigger brigade the unit they need skilled people they're self-sufficient the marines are one of the only units that are self-sufficient i.e um marines become chefs they become drivers they become vehicle mechanics you know they become clark like clarks and stuff so and they're the [ __ ] ones that you don't want to get pinged for so yeah generally speaking you're putting in an interest i want to be a whatever a signaler or i want to be a chef but there are people that want to do that yeah thankfully um so i guess it depends on who you are where you are where you are in your career and where they need people so i moved up to fleet protection group raw marines up in up in glasgow sort of area protecting the nuclear submarine sort of deterrent for the uk um but while i was there i got in my head i was like i want to try and start training for selection for the sbs so i started training running around the hills there big [ __ ] heavy bags on no wonder my back's [ __ ] now um but before that i was like i want us i want to upskill myself so what's the hardest course i can do in the marines or or certainly what's the most what's this what's the course that's going to give me the most benefit and set me up for success for going on to selection and that for me was the the romney and sniper course okay which is highly regarded as one of is the hardest course you can do within within the marines in terms of a soldiering skill set you know that's it it's [ __ ] hardcore it's 10 12 weeks away and every day you're [ __ ] you're crawling around stalking map reading stalking so stalking um is uh the easiest way to describe it is there's an enemy here yeah you start out here yeah go and get into a position that they can't see they can't see you you snuggling through bushes cutting your way in prickly set up your weapon system as a sniper and generally speaking everyone thinks sniper cool [ __ ] shooting the majority of 90 of your work is actually observing and reporting back information but you're normally out on a limb you're normally out with as a pair yeah ahead of the main force um but you are there if needed to have that critical sort of um action if required you know you have a pinpoint accuracy in terms of shooting that's why you spend [ __ ] the first six weeks or on the ranges to shoot in okay it's long distance [ __ ] wherever windy rain just [ __ ] you know trying to back in are you are you learning with all different types of weapons no so you i learned with an l96 an old sniper rifle which is now discontinued but yeah you what you'll have is um your main sniper rifle that they employ or use within the marines yeah so you'll learn on that weapon really yeah but the first six weeks are let's see if you can [ __ ] shoot because there's no point doing all the other yeah of course [ __ ] yeah you can't [ __ ] shoot which makes sense so the first six weeks are here's the standards of shooting yeah this is what you've got to meet if you don't meet it you [ __ ] bend yeah and that course is hard because you have to be a corporal or below you can't be a higher rank and go on the course because the failure rate is so high and you can't go back you kind of lose face especially on that military imagine being a sergeant in charge of guys in a troop you've got any slide of course you [ __ ] fail you you know you kind of lose a bit of face yeah and a bit of credibility yeah so i think they cap it at corporal or lance corporal but you generally get about 14 guys on a course okay two of those guys will be from other units across the world whether it's danish or whatever american um yeah and i said it's about 12 weeks course um and it's [ __ ] it's hard but it was brilliant i [ __ ] loved it mate so the shooting stuff what it is what it is you know you shoot you hit the standards and that's [ __ ] hard it's really a high level of shooting but then you get into the stalking stuff and i [ __ ] loved it you're on woodbury carmen it's training but you know you've got all the kit on the ghillie suits all the cool kit and i love the snipers because whenever you saw them on cam they're always the different they're always dressed differently yeah okay always looking cool scruffy yeah you know his hair and and kind of had the different weapon systems so already they were they were different yeah you know which yeah you know what it's like yeah you [ __ ] shiny thing over there yeah i want a piece of that yeah but um so i kind of went through that and and i passed that um and again i kind of um did you know you were a good shot before you said right i want to get into this well before you go on to the sniper course you've got to do a pre-sniper course within see if you're half decent so what they do is each unit can only send two guys so you'll get maybe 20 guys from each unit doing the pre-course and they'll only pick the top two guys to go onto the cyber cards and a part of that is doing lots of shooting with your normal rifle yeah and again there's you've got to hit certain levels so you've got to be a um i don't know what the word is but a marksman yeah with on your rifle first and foremost so you've got to you know be a good standard of shooting and then they'll do some of the basic stuff the map readings got to be really good all your personal soldiering abilities and skills have to be [ __ ] top-notch yeah or you just get [ __ ] binge yeah and if you get seen stalking you can only have so many strikes there's like a big um board of doom at the in the sniper training wing at limston it's got your name on it and everything that you've done it is assessed okay and it's either green or there's a score out of a hundred or red okay so everyone can see it all adds up okay yeah yeah you've got to meet the the required standard if you don't you get [ __ ] um so i did that and that that for me i was like [ __ ] gave me the confidence probably to go right soldier wise i'm good yeah now it's just fitness and mentally can i [ __ ] put myself in the locker and go through selection so actually um there was another guy that put me onto selection with him one of my friends he uh enrolled us both on a briefing course so again like most of these courses there's a theme here yeah you have to do a pre-course before because of course you have the pre-course before the course before that and it was a week down here in paul yeah um we love it down here [ __ ] love it i didn't love it at the time we were on the jurassic coast you're doing a lot of stuff just running around big heavy bergens on and again this criteria you have to meet it's a 26k march with 70 pound and you've got to do it within three hours 20 or whatever you've got 30 kg on your back yeah yeah yeah for how many miles 26k yeah we did the whole roll it's called the rollercoaster the whole route from doodle door car yes up and down smuggler's arms turn around i can go back yeah [ __ ] you know cheeky pint on the cheeks yeah um so there's all this stuff you've got to go through at the end of the week you know this map reading the skills the shooting there's bits and pieces brake contact drills all this kind of stuff that you do that they're always assessing you're always watching and at the end they'll say yes you can get you can get loaded onto selection yeah well thank you very much and then you do a pre-selection course around the hills and the mountains in wales yeah and then you start selection um and what is and just going back a moment there why did you choose the sbs over the sas yeah this is interesting for most people that don't know um the the the selection was amalgamated all the units were amalgamated and made one as one uk special forces umbrella the sas and the sbs yeah and that meant the selection process was the same because historically we run our own selection processes um but i i don't quote me on this i think around 2006 or five they amalgamated it makes sense so it was all an all under one kind of training center uk it's a training center and then you'd have a mixture of directing staff from the sas and the sbs and before you start you just you made your preference you you know you kind of put your marker your flag in the sand and say i want to i want to join the sps yeah and generally speaking most people from the marines would join the sbs and most people from the army or paris right we'll join the sas okay um that's not to say there isn't crossover there is and probably more so now than ever yeah um but at the time the operational tempo and areas were all out in the desert so a lot of people forget it's just boats isn't it yeah we'll know where we've been operating since 2001 it's all been in the far east um so yeah it's just your personal personal preference and a lot of time because a lot of the marines or people that you know have gone to the sbs you kind of stick some people do make that choice through family or through you know um geographically it just makes more sense for them and they do that uh and also people have jumped ship when they've been badged so they've been in the sbs for a few years yeah which again normally comes down to um location or family yeah more than you lot of knobbers i'm i'm off over here yeah you know there's been a lot how many sbs are there well [ __ ] those maybe roughly 300. is that 350 maybe yeah and they're all based down here in points yeah yeah yeah within the different squadrons so going back to going back to your training to get into the sbs how tough was that for you perhaps [Music] i think like with most things um most difficult things you the brain's got a wonderful way of [ __ ] suppressing it yeah stick it in the [ __ ] yeah in the locker okay no one will deal with that later on you know and such pain and stuff but it's i can't explain or describe you know how difficult something is other than it was the hardest thing i've ever done physically and more importantly mentally i'd say ever you know i'd never been pushed to that limit before um but it was good to see what the body and the mind could do once you were placed into that situation and most people generally speaking don't ever put themselves in into that position and there's a lot of sayings out there isn't there there's a lot of people that say you know you're only ever operating about 40 anyway your body and then but the mind controls the body you know a lot of times you're tired and you've probably didn't play you know professional sport and rugby you know there's moments of i've got dictate and i've got to dig deep and professional there's a lot of similarity and crossover between the military and the like special forces and i think professional sports people but you know you know quite a few of the guys and there's loads of similarities between personality type and you know what they can endure and put themselves through physically and mentally i think it's the mental the massive wine strength because day one you turn up there's 250 people on selection from all different walks of life and different different experiences and you know you get new guys you get old guys you get [ __ ] wiry guys you get big [ __ ] guys you know and you sort of stood on the line and it's human nature you look around you look left and right yeah [ __ ] you're getting poster syndrome yeah straight away [ __ ] am i doing here have i [ __ ] underestimated this and have i trained hard enough like the [ __ ] size of this keys yeah it's a mad mountain yeah yeah you know and but when the [ __ ] chips are down that's that's not what matters how big they are or how [ __ ] fit they look or how strong they are if they've got a six-pack or how big their [ __ ] biceps are because ultimately it's a leveler you run around you know the breaking beacons for the first four weeks and that's like your your basic fitness and map reading stage yeah the first four weeks are there is there is a set thomas and you are going to be doing this selection for 16 weeks you're gonna be doing it so you know at the start yeah okay well yeah you know if you're successful it's going to take you six months yeah and then you go into the unit and then you start the other training and everything else but yeah you know how long the hills phase is you know how long the jungle is you know how long the you know the skills phase is for the weapons and tactics stuff um so yeah it was just a [ __ ] slot and each stage is different and tests you in different ways and pushes you in different ways so the hills phase is physical it's [ __ ] big heavy burgeoning [ __ ] weather running around wales yeah you know we had a lot you know it is and it's we had a lad die on our on our course on the hills as well you know from um the heat of all things we did a summer selection there's two selections around the year one in summer one in winter and each have benefits and negatives everyone thinks obviously i want to do summer i don't want to be running around in the [ __ ] snow in the freezing cold however for me i'd prefer that i'd prefer being colder you can always warm up yeah you're going to get [ __ ] warm running up and down a hill with a big burger on and you need less water whereas the heat that we had was [ __ ] savage it was super hot in breaking bacon it was [ __ ] savage mate um what year was this 2008 it was really [ __ ] hot a lot of people were struggling with the heat heat exhaustion people passing out you know getting medivacked guys i remember running past somebody and you know you have two generally speaking a minimum of two liters of water on you yeah but you'll carry stereotabs as well so if you run out you can very quickly [ __ ] stream put a stereotab in there okay and you're back in the game yeah yeah yeah um people [ __ ] just laughing at streams literally like dogs just [ __ ] overheating jumping in streams and they're off again because you've got time to meet and you've got to be get from point a to point b to point c the point d all the way [ __ ] around you're running around in a loop and it's it's [ __ ] chaos it's comical at times of lads just running around you see the fear in people like back in what route are you on and this is what number you're going the wrong way no you're [ __ ] you're going away you have that moment i'm happy yeah you're going the wrong [ __ ] way and you're not supposed to talk to each other but it's you know there's a moment and you can't eat enough you can't consume enough calories and you're just eating on the moon and maps out and you know all this kind of shenanigans at the end of that four weeks you do the um the hills test phase which um again there's certain marches that you have to do within the time frame um and if you get any sort of reds or fail then you're off course right you know so you've got to pass all these and then it ends with endurance at the end this is the endurance march and that is i don't know if i can remember now it's basically 23 i had about 23 hours on the you know running around all these [ __ ] points through the bracket beacons and it was it's a mad it's like 80 kilometers or 60 something 23 hours yeah it's a madness yeah but you've got 24 hours to do it so and again you're on your own just [ __ ] you know meeting around the route that you've been told to go yeah uh and you just end in a big snotty mess at the end yeah after that that's kind of then you tick it to the jungle so you then go to hereford you do some pre-jungle training for a week weapons and tactics and bits and pieces and then you fly out to what was bruneifers at the time yeah um [Music] and you're straight into the [ __ ] so how many people you said there's what how many people was at the start of this course to say before before 250 and how many went to the jungle roughly probably maybe 50 for each oh really 50 for each 100 so yeah that hills face just [ __ ] chops the [ __ ] week it's um they're out of there and yeah surprisingly a lot of the big guys a lot of the [ __ ] yeah yeah but yeah yeah just [ __ ] commenting in mate um running past them like a lot of people say it's like the the quickening it's like the old highlander i mean you feel like you're drawing the power from them yes yes we're going i'm still all right um but again you need a better look you know there's injuries everybody there's not one person that goes through that phase without getting some form of injuries yeah it's [ __ ] and then you go to the jungle do the jungle for four weeks um and that has its own and you're still being tested in the jungle now yeah they've given you the sbs yeah you're in a four-man patrol and you've got one ds attached to you and he's just watching everything watching everything how you operate within the jungle how you operate as a team and it's it's [ __ ] stinking that environment is horrible if you can soldier and survive it's like survival yeah you know for four weeks you get dropped off under the canopy and you're there for four weeks that's it whether you're [ __ ] no one around no no again this is a course you're a volunteer at any stage you can go [ __ ] this yeah see you later celebrity get me out of here yeah you can you can pull that card yeah um a lot of the time it's injury or it's heat exhaustion or the safety issues that people come across to in terms of shooting everything's [ __ ] really tight and you know you've got to be proficient in the drills that they're showing you and safe as well because it's all live and you're shooting it's all live [ __ ] bullets whistling past your [ __ ] head so the last thing you need is some [ __ ] [ __ ] at the side of you you get a few yeah yeah yeah yeah what the [ __ ] are you doing yeah you get a few of them but they get pinned so at the end of that you come out [ __ ] um it's great diet plan to probably lost the bar i didn't have [ __ ] any weight to lose but everybody just comes out come back yeah yeah hang in and then you go back in then you do the weapons and tactics phase all the cool gas masks black rig [ __ ] absolutely and [ __ ] all the shooting stuff and shotguns all these explosions breaches go go go all that sort of stuff for about six weeks again there's you've got to meet all this required standards of shooting all the drills everything else and then after that uh you got probably the biggest kick in the tits for me was the um escaping evasion um because it's not really talked about escaping their faces or the resistance to interrogation phase you know you've probably seen it on the program yeah you know uh the old white noise or screaming baby is that part of it yeah so you go on the run for five days in wales or scotland um in in just what you stood into your belt kit your combat fatigues and your weapon and a four man patrol and you've got to meet our agent rvs so you're generally moving through the night what's your thing uh rendezvous meet somebody behind you you've got a big corridor to move through so you can't go any further left or right than this map east things are north and then you're off and you're going to meet this dude he gives you the good news yeah keep going so every rendezvous you've got to get there are people chasing you yes you've got behind you've got on the force they know that you can't go any further left or right you know than let's say you know a certain area you've got like let's say a five mile oh i said you can't just boot out yeah okay yeah and they want nothing more these are usually marines or parrots yeah yeah [ __ ] yeah it's like christmas for them they catch one of us so you're running you're on the [ __ ] run and slowly but surely your body's [ __ ] as well you're knacking now you've been you've been having a tip full of it for a few months now and you run down but you've got to stay on the game and you've i've made literally i was running around just pulling out [ __ ] turnips out of the ground and just eating it yeah eating anything in [ __ ] bins and just ah so you just how many days you on the run for five five days five nights and at all costs you cannot get caught by these lads generally speaking if you get caught they'll ping you back to base interrogate you a bit slap you around wet you put you in [ __ ] bright orange fatigues send you back out on your way again [ __ ] great [ __ ] human highlighter [ __ ] sake so off you run um so at the end of that five days you're pretty [ __ ] yeah you're ready in the end you're like just [ __ ] catch me yeah yeah i'm ready yeah and then you know then that you're going into 36 hours of interrogation so you move into the interrogation phase you know you're straight you've dogs you do all the stuff you strip you do all your bits and pieces uh and then you you've got to then go through all the stuff that you've been taught in terms of releasing of information and how you release information and what are you talking about bits and pieces are you taught just keep stunned or do you have to cooperate with the old school thing yeah you might have heard of his name ranked number yeah and religion that was it yeah very quickly they learned from people that were held captive yeah that doesn't wash and very quickly you just end up pissing off your interrogators can't say that can't answer that question no comment no comment i kind of yeah yeah i came out this is [ __ ] so they've devised a new way of releasing information slow releasing information or giving green information away information that's readily available now on the internet there's no point now saying anything other than if they can get information and you know they can get information from google from facebook from other means social media or bits and pieces then release that information but slowly yeah and the main thing is building rapport with your characters yeah it's it's humanizing yourself yeah it's making yourself not robotic and it's it's you know just exactly that creating a rapport being you know subdue submissive in your body language bits and pieces and then slowly but surely you know and everybody's doing the same you're a little four-man group and it's then this goes on for hours you get interrogated for you know 20 minutes right [ __ ] off and then you're back into a stressed position give an example of a stress position um so sat with your legs crossed yeah on the floor yeah um um fingers in interlocked and then hands on your head and straight back sort of with you sort of straight back elbows up and then eventually you just [ __ ] yeah and they'll come along and put the boot in the other one is just leaning against the wall leaning against the wall which sounds easy yeah you're leaning against the wall with your hands up just just hold that position yeah it sounds simple yeah trying to do that for a [ __ ] few hours yeah um you know you're falling asleep everything's [ __ ] aching and um yeah you're just getting beasted and and then what about the noise what about the the the what the when they're putting noises yeah yeah yeah screaming babies or we had a call to prayer thing that was on loop i couldn't i think i counted it was like a two loop yeah so like you know um the uh call to prayer was going and you you start hallucinating you start [ __ ] hearing all sorts of yeah as well and um anyway you know through that process you get different styles of interrogators you get the nice ones you get the mean ones you get people playing off each other and all this sort of stuff and but it's about knowing when the right time is to to give the game up and say yeah this is actually what i'm doing here for these reasons and um but it's knowing when to do that not too early not too late yeah you know when there's actual threat to life and all that sort of stuff so we go through that stage and then um at the end you know you get badged you have that moment of [ __ ] i've passed what the [ __ ] just that went yeah yeah you know you get the very an amazing day a really you know one of the best days of your life you know because you can't go into this sort of thing half fast you can't it's like you know sports and other stuff you turn up you you're all chips in yeah emotionally physically everything else is taking a back burner you know i was you know married at the time everything just gets [ __ ] pushed aside because you're so focused on on the outcome and you have to be you can't you're not [ __ ] playing at it you know and you can't and then you badge and you get your belt and bury and it's [ __ ] snakes and ladders isn't it life again yeah yeah back down to join the squadron yeah oh [ __ ] yeah you know new bloke right now you're doing the dive course now you're doing your boat course now you've got to do all these courses before you could even what does that feel like what was that feeling like did you get paraded around or was it a bit of a oh is that it no right or were you paraded was it seen as a big thing or you don't have a parade parade you have a badging ceremony which is in the office mess but it's really low-key you know and it's just you come up and generally whoever's on camp will come to it and sort of clap you welcome you into the service and the commanding officer will probably just give you your belt and barrier shake your hand have a photo uh and then yeah after your squadron right and i joined them squadron and went straight out on my first tour with those guys uh and what you hit what you was this uh 2009. um afghanistan and it was really kinetic at that time it was [ __ ] it was everything i joined for it was it was call of duty [ __ ] when i was [ __ ] my first job i did is actually a painting on on one of the uh soldier's mess all the best jobs get [ __ ] paintings made of them and get stuck in the sergeants or offices mess yeah and one of my first jobs was a [ __ ] painting job and i was i don't know again not knowing much but i was in as a war sniper we sort of landed off target walked in 10 kilometers through the green zone in the [ __ ] north yeah and now we've got all the cool kittens yeah and all that blacked out uh no you're in the fatigues but you know you've got your night vision on it what the [ __ ] is uh you know snuggled in the position and just had a massive kinetic [ __ ] scrap and yeah [ __ ] like the wild west yeah yeah yeah you know it was kind of everything i i'd hoped for and was thought it would be uh and more and i remember getting off that job and [ __ ] you always have a hot debrief when you get back you flew back to base and all the [ __ ] lads are there and it was and where was base um in kandahar okay air base uh so we flew so you drop so you you're out in afghan and then you're dropped off into a place wherever we're going probably land off you know however many kilometers and we'd walk into the target sneak into the into the [ __ ] zone uh and then we'd [ __ ] do what we needed to do then we'd walk out and get a pick up and then back to base and oddly kandahar's massive the airport it was it was like a city by the time we left after however many years 20 15 years of of kind of occupation in kandahar this place was [ __ ] bigger than bournemouth it's massive massive and a lot of different partner forces americans and dane all these people in there and out of all the guys on that camp however many [ __ ] let's say a hundred thousand people i think only two percent of people actually went outside the wire outside everything else was supporting the main machine the effort whether that's intelligence or signals or vehicles or mechanics you know all this kind of stuff so um so what were you told to do then they're like stairs and the boys you need to go in do a job and get out yeah literally how it was for you guys yeah in its simplest form yeah but we'd be working targets you know back at our base in our headquarters we'd have drones we'd be looking and and operating and working high value targets we'd be like what's who's the [ __ ] what's the network who's the big dogs right [ __ ] those little guy right we're going for this guy yeah right let's let's work him and let's you know use the technology that we have yeah to find out how this guy is then we would then watch the guy soak a target with drones have a look at it get pattern of life and understand the target and everything and once we were happy on our terms okay and the moon state was right and it was dark enough and you know one of the guys it'd be his job when the team leaders are coming all right [ __ ] orders tonight we're gonna [ __ ] talk through how we're gonna how we're gonna cut the cake and then we would we'd do that fly out do the job come back debrief team stickies i remember after that first job coming back in new guy yeah [ __ ] you know it was [ __ ] amazing one of the guys was like they're not all like that no no i remember that first time i got really lucky yeah lucky or however you want it's not you know and i'm not glorifying war yeah at all it's [ __ ] it's not glorious and and and it and it's a [ __ ] it's a hard thing to do you know mentally it takes a lot from you emotionally and everything and physically but those that first tour that i did for that six months we were out most nights and it was one of the most kinetic tours that the service had had in terms of a squadron you know and foxy talks about it in his book actually because their squadron took out over us but after six months of it by the end it's [ __ ] it's hard you know and we had a [ __ ] last week our [ __ ] typical last [ __ ] job a massive daisy chain ied went off it killed one of the guys it um you know one of the guys who i did selection with he lost his lower leg um and a lot of guys were injured quite substantially injured it took out 20 guys out of a 35 guy squadron you know one ied yeah it was a daisy chain ied so yeah in a compound someone must have stepped on a pressure plate it went up um so at that stage it was [ __ ] what a [ __ ] way to end yeah what was a really good talk you know um so by that stage you're ready to [ __ ] off and get out of there and foxy remember those guys come in they're ready to scrap they come in all right and toby gutter is a local guy now if you've heard about him he's you know um he actually moved into my bed space and he was a new guy south african kid maybe 20 years old fit young reddit bit between his teeth ready to go and i sort of showed him around the camp here's your bed space nice one have a good tour lads we had one last booze up uh with everybody and we [ __ ] ripped out yeah and then i later heard you know toby was critically injured and shot well critically but he he was shot through the neck and instantly was you know quadriplegic he still lives locally and he'd be a [ __ ] good guy to speak to the way that he's turned his [ __ ] life around and because he went through everything those stages are sure the fact that [ __ ] actually as you would as you can expect um so you're always close to the edge you're sailing close to the wind all the time and that's what you love you love the [ __ ] buzz the excitement i [ __ ] loved it um and i did a few more tours after that you know which were very good for very different reasons my last tour was in you know in kabul uh what year was your last tour uh 2013 14. so i was you to pick any of the tours which is the tour that really stands out to you the first tour the first or definitely okay um just because it was new it was exciting it was kinetic it was everything i envisaged and wanted from a tour it was [ __ ] it was everything it was brilliant it was it was [ __ ] brilliant and everything else that came with it as well the freedom and the and being special forces within a camp and all the freedom and luxuries that you are afforded and you know it's big boys does everyone does everyone look up to you yeah you are the you know there is that sense of you know it's a fine balance between the ego and that line isn't there between you know um but you are being confident you've confident and you've proven yourself so you you you can have a little bit of that you know it's like walking around so pictures of playing around with [ __ ] i'm top i'm on the top of my game uh but you're still always learning you know and um yeah you i guess you looked at as the rock stars of the [ __ ] million all the military they all look the same and we're just [ __ ] dripping in all the best kids long-haired beards doing what the [ __ ] we want driving around you know all that kind of good stuff so for different reasons is there a is there a rule or anything like you're rolling around you're getting in there you're going down you know who you got to target before you shoot that person is there a rule that you're allowed to or you're not allowed to yeah so there's basic rules of engagement you know and everybody has we're all covered under you know card alpha which is um the the the basic right to self-defense and okay i can take in its simplest forms you can take a life to save a life you know and obviously i can take someone's life if i feel like they're going to take my life or if i feel like they're going to take your life what it doesn't cover is things like um property so if they're going to steal a vehicle you can't [ __ ] shoot yeah yeah shoot the keys yeah and also if they are a threat but then don't become a threat anymore i.e they're running around shooting but then they put their weapon down and put their hands on yeah okay there's that line there they're no longer a threat yeah and i don't have to engage with you um we had different rules of engagement when we were going out because of who we were and what we were doing and who we were hunting yeah um and that that was always job dependent i.e we know this place is full of badness yeah there's no women and kids on there we've been watching this target yeah when we when we go into this hornet's nest it's going to be a [ __ ] scrap so we can shoot first yeah because they're all [ __ ] bad they're all bad guys and we know they are the intelligence you know and everything else that's built around can you give me an example of what you had to do did you have to go into buildings do you have like lights on your forehead what what just so i can build up a picture um all of the above everything from rural so out in the [ __ ] desert yeah you know to compounds like compounds that are out in the open out in the sort of rural areas mountainous and um you'd land off generally because of the noise signature you'd walk in and you know you'd surround the building and there'd be maybe 10 20 you know taliban fighters in there or it was a it was an ied factory or it was a weapon stash factory and we were going in and were just you know getting amongst it really and then so you'd have that to build up urban kabul yeah you'd have high rights you'd have like in all sorts of you know different scenarios really to to deal with but yeah generally speaking we'll always fight on our terms we'll go out at night we'll use the cover of darkness we'll use the technology we'll use we'll always try and stack the odds in our favor you know night vision lasers on our weapons light systems infrared light systems and you know and all this kind of stuff as well and communications drop down tablets the technology is always [ __ ] advancing you know it's always advancing at a high level really but um yeah moving on tell me about the middle the gallantry cross medal which is the top middle to get that you received from the queen what did you get that for um so it's a weird one with medals you know within um a lot of the guys you sort of feel a bit weird i'm the medal itself is a conspicuous galaxy cross so it's one down from the victoria cross and generally speaking if you're receiving a victoria cross in our world and yes in the special forces yeah it's post homelessly you're [ __ ] dead yeah okay you know but you've done something obviously that is deserving of that medal um so i think there's only about three of us within the special forces that have the conspicuous gallantry cross so and mine was for two separate jobs and for other jobs as well um but two standout jobs that i was doing at the time i was working in kabul um with a partner force and i had a lot of autonomy but i was kind of leading the um one of their specialist sort of police units so training them i was responsible for training and taking them out and other guys i was working with another uh the srr reconnaissance regiment they'd be doing fine fix they'd be locating the bad guys then they'd beat over there off you go and then we'd set up the strike option to take down that that person of interest or building or whatever whatever it was um so yeah it was one job of running around i can give you the full story or not probably the staz shortened version basically running around yeah so we've been working a high value target for about two months and it was a bad dude he'd come into the city and his plan was to um drive a vehicle-born improvised explosive device into one of the um one of the main camps uh within kabul uh it was the biggest that i've ever come across or seen we had an informant working for us that was feeding us information that was we were giving him kitten equipment that was inert um he brought in i think it's 13 tons of uh high explosive ammonium nitrate high explosives so that to put into perspective you know it's probably twice the size of this room floor-to-ceiling [ __ ] explosives and the idea was they had two lorries they were gonna fill the lorries in and uh they had about six fighters with them as well but we knew where they were because we'd sort of orchestrated the meeting through an informant we'd given them a safe house that was our safe house that was bugged that had um audio and visual devices within that um so we kind of had control of it within the city so we were watching and we're monitoring tear out and what yeah and what you don't want to do is is go straight in and deal with the situation what you want to do is is give them enough room to play and breathe and also work out what's going on on the bigger picture you know because a lot of the times it's you know these are just they're the doers you know you need to find out who the [ __ ] prodders are you know who's who who the intelligence guy who's who's their commander what network are they a part of and what's the bigger threat yeah because it might not just be that it might be multi-stage attack they might just be one part of us larger attack so we're always listening to phones doing all these bits and pieces and working the target but at the time and i was the kind of commander for the job and i'd talk to my team how are we going to [ __ ] cut the cake how we're going to skin it how we're going to [ __ ] move through you know this particular compound of interest deal with the threat and and and prevent this large-scale attack and it went all the way up it was a pretty high level job um you know we brought guys back in from the sps as well to kind of help out and big briefings i had to brief the [ __ ] president you know at the time of cabal about the job and what we were doing all the [ __ ] eyes and ears were on us we had all the stuff above you know the drones come you know the main commanders and and the special forces within all the different nationalities we're all watching this job like [ __ ] if this goes off it's going to go off and and to be honest i probably won't know much about it be [ __ ] vaporized you know that much explosive but at the time we were we were still working it still letting it play out but then our informant came to us and was like look these extra guys have come in and they've brought their own detonators we gave them detonators you know um that were inert but they were like he's brought his own detonators this is now gone to another he stepped up that's next stage and it's essentially live like at any start stage they could turn the [ __ ] vehicle and off they go and and clack it off so the decision was made quite quickly right we're gonna we're gonna move on it tonight um make the briefings get everything in place go through the system and and we did that and i sort of ran up to the building did my bits and pieces i always would always lead the team in the front and with the afghans behind the partner force and at this stage in the campaign we weren't really supposed to step foot inside the compounds we're supposed to step back we're in the training and mentoring role yeah and rightly so you know it was time we were sort of even back then was getting ready to look we're going to give you the tools and the knowledge to do this yourself yes and that's what we should do so the idea was i'd go in i'd lay the charge on i'd breach the main door do a quick check and then right go let's let's execute the plan that we've been training for yeah and we we did all that go and i just got the old don't fancy it so i had the whole that moment the [ __ ] looked at the interpreter what the [ __ ] going on he was like ah they don't fancy it what the locals don't fancy doing it no so i was like [ __ ] out and luckily uh i'd pulled in a couple of guys how many men were you of your men so i pulled in three extra guys from the i said look i'm gonna i'll do this job but i need these three extra guys with me one of them's gonna be a wall sniper one's a dog guy yeah and one's a shield man yeah so me and the shield man scotty [ __ ] you know i'd give them one of them we've gotta go in bro anyways all right let's go lad from soul food well he was like [ __ ] it let's go all right so he gets the shield and his job is just to hold a [ __ ] big ballistic shield in front while i can peer around it so to protect us both but also you know saves us from sort of machine gun bursts and so we run through the first door uh and also our informant have gone well there's no weapons on there they're all hidden and [ __ ] weapons everywhere they're all stacked you know the snipers in my ear now go lights are turning on there's movement [ __ ] right go we need to hurry up yeah so at that stage we moved in uh we did what we needed to do we kind of neutralized all the guys in this first room it was a big [ __ ] mad shoot out scotty had his [ __ ] pistol out it was [ __ ] wild west very quickly but then de-escalate move back down to the next room that where the commanders are and i knew there was you know a commander in there and also a woman and kid so that's that you've got to go from [ __ ] full on yeah you know it's a shoot out to de-escalate back into the switch to split go next room and then again there's opportunity there the guy stood next to kids women and it's just kind of [ __ ] desperate get them in arrested him so a real really really successful job because we'd you know kill the bad dudes yeah for one term um secured you know the woman and kid you know and got a commander you know um she'd got information and all the weapons the grenades and all that explosive was just laid out and it was a huge huge success a big job so that was the one job and then another job i got um i got attached and and because of what had happened there with my partner force i'd kind of lost the confidence in here um we had another job again out in the out just outside of kabul out in the mountains running around and um um again another stage of running up and chasing these guys through the [ __ ] mountains and you know just that's a mental drunk come on guys let's go come on so you know and then we called him a bit of a scrap and called a 500-pound bombing that landing and i had a report from the aircraft give me a readout on the yeah yeah they're all dead uh right okay i'll go and sweep up and make sure and as i'm crawling up this [ __ ] big hill towards the blast site and the [ __ ] bell bugs it's all shaley and stones and um i get the old big beam of death comes down from the drone um from the aircraft uh an infrared sort of which means circle they're sparkling something to say there's something there yeah which is 20 foot in front of me and i get the old heebie jeebies hair on the back of the neck yeah the [ __ ] in there like there's movement to your front like i thought everyone was [ __ ] dead yeah and i'm in a really vulnerable position here on a forward-facing slope climbing up a hill like i drop down like next thing bursts over my head [ __ ] we're [ __ ] straight into the [ __ ] scrappy i'm laid on my sort of side shaking yeah yeah next thing grenades coming over landing next to my head and i'm making [ __ ] these are going off so i [ __ ] throw one back except for that yeah and you know this goes on and i stopped slowly making my way and uh and in the end i don't know if i'd take the same risk now knowing what you know and everything else but just [ __ ] i got more pissed more angry and pissed off than anything and just [ __ ] stormed their position ran over flash crash and you know killed the few guys behind so uh and i had one of the kindness come up and go what the [ __ ] are you doing i was on my own to do something i couldn't [ __ ] you know i was out in there yeah so that was that and there's all the jobs and bits and pieces as well they all kind of and i got wrote up for that you know for that for those sort of couple of jobs so when so when you came back what was that feeling like when you when the you knew you were going out for this medal well i didn't know oddly enough you don't know that you know your boss is right in europe and all this stuff and i was away in texas at the time shooting on a long-range sniper course and i had a phone call from i i thought was in the [ __ ] so they i got the old call from like the silent major going mate the the boss needs to ring you on the [ __ ] boss he's like the the the proper the big buddhist yeah the commanding officer i was like okay i've never spoken to him i was like what have i done yeah everything your mind's racing isn't it uh he rings me up and he's like you know she explains everything and look you know you it's just gone through and you've been awarded you know this picture scanning across it's a huge honor and at the time i just remember thinking i don't really know what it is but it sounds good yeah jesus you know yeah wow and where did you receive that where yeah uh st james's palace yeah with the queen in 2013 14. wow yeah massive respect right yeah massively madness really mate but but to put it into what i wanted to say was it it's difficult sometimes to receive stuff when you feel like it's your job yeah i was like it's my [ __ ] job yeah what do you mean you're getting recognition a lot let's get recognition and uh you know rightly so doing heroic stuff but everybody's doing it yeah they just select certain people throughout that sort of tour or whatever not look at the draw you know and i don't want to play it down because you know i'm happy with what i did but um i want to be a bit more humble about it not to say i'm [ __ ] i'm [ __ ] yeah i'm super i don't think that at all because there's instances all the time and operations when lads are doing things above and beyond and we could all argue that well that's our [ __ ] job you know it's like giving louise hamilton a [ __ ] medal every time he wins a race you know it's your [ __ ] job that's what you do um but yeah that said it's uh you received that in 2014 yeah how long were you in the sbs before you said right it's time to call it a day um ten years so i did three years in the marines 10 years in the sbs and at that stage i was kind of half pension point you sign up for 22 years but it's an open engagement contract you just give a year's notice when you want to leave and they usually use that years period to sort of train you in in whatever you want to do you know you've got so many learning credits you can do with courses you can do all sorts of bits and pieces um i knew it was my time the [ __ ] win was out of my sales i'd moved into a sergeant's role i was moving a little bit more now slightly further away from from the pointy end and i was in a instructional role which was good that comes with its own um you know benefits and highlights you know i was instructing uh i was the main one chief sniper instructor for the service so well anything long range shooting the guys the squadrons would come through sort of um the training cycles with me and we'd go out to cool places do some like texas shooting or doing courses and and bits and pieces and short arm small arm stuff as well so all the room clearance stuff so it was good and i was getting getting to see a lot of the lads through the squadrons rotate through so and i enjoyed instructing i i quite liked it but it's um not something i wanted to do forever and also some of the older older guys were also i was kind of like is that what i want to do and have i realistically got another 10 years in me of doing this and i'd tick so many boxes i was about to say boxes you ticked in a short space of time yeah um so i kind of felt like i've had my fill and i just want to [ __ ] close that now on a high yeah i don't want to be that bloke there are people in there [ __ ] dinosaurs i just [ __ ] off with you they're [ __ ] 60 year old go in and yeah what are you doing mate there's a big wide world out there and um what year did what did the year did you stop uh 18 i think 2018. do you have any do you have any flashbacks i was in like seeing like yeah um but not yeah i do but not in a negative my sort of stuff is i i kind of um nostalgic really look back and oh an issue which has been highlighted yeah for the good now and i'm [ __ ] glad it's happened and you know it's not as taboo is it you know there's a lot of people i think just mask a lot of this stuff and i've been guilty of it as well you come back you don't really decompress one minute you're [ __ ] running around shooting guns and you know within 24 hours you can be back in the uk on rest and recuperation for two weeks yeah and that's weird yeah that's the only time i've ever felt [ __ ] is that weird because you you you're a normal civilian lifeguard i've just been having a mad timeout and yeah in afghanistan about normal people have normal life they don't know what i've been up to 24 hours it's surreal and the next thing you you know you sat in [ __ ] studying starbucks listening to [ __ ] some karen moan about the chai latte being warm and yeah you're all yeah yeah yeah so it is weird you know and the system's in place they do have things in place you know to help out and uh and everything else it's just that r r period and you have the two weeks of the family you can't fully relax because you know you're going back out you've got to get into that state of mind you can't be you've got to be all chips in again you can't be out there thinking about family or kids or the [ __ ] the bills and all that sort of stuff you're all in you've got to have a system most people deal with things differently but mine was trying to try and [ __ ] shut it all out hey oh

Channel: Dodge Woodall

Views: 584,539

Keywords: Dodge, Dodge Woodall, Staz, Anthony Stazicker, SAS, Special Forces, SAS Who Dares Wins, SAS: Who Dares Wins, Who Dares Wins, Podcast, Blog, Chat, Story, War Stories, Kabul, Full Podcast, Video Podcast, Full Video, War, thrudark

Id: ST7VsX4j2nA

Length: 77min 6sec (4626 seconds)

Published: Mon Jan 31 2022