Ren | New Album Sick Boi, Chronic Illness, Hi Ren, Lyme Disease

[Music] hello beautiful human I am Zach that is Dan and uh we welcome to the studio Ren is here hey hello hello hello thank you for being here it's nice to be here next to this absolutely horrifying Cat Pillow we say that about the cat but the truth is that's like one of the most famous things about our show maybe one of the most famous pillows of all time actually okay yeah many many uh many people like hold it like they can I cradle it you do yes whatever you need to feel safe yeah this this is my emotional support pillow now that is thank you it's pure purpose yeah thank you by the way your speaking voice is incredible thank thank you you have a great tone and it comes through in the music you make because a lot of it is done in this in the style of poetry is that kind of correct or am I totally off base yeah I I think I I weave a lot of poetry into what I'm doing for sure um a lot of spoken word a lot of hip-hop I mean some of the best hip-hop it has its Origins and that really rap Ryman poetry what rap stands for your story is so music means something really different to you um and I I think it all stems from like I don't even know where to begin dude like I've been listening to your music and then I really we have just your story is like just in our brief it's 10 pages because you've been through an exceptional amount that's true in a way that like like people go through things all the time and health is something that is completely and totally out of our control but in moments where you've tried to manage and go after figuring out what was holding you back healthwise you've just been steered in the wrong directions which would ultimately lead to you I mean do you look at that today and go I wish the doctor would have told me exactly what I needed to know at the very beginning or are you sowhat grateful for the journey that it's put you on it's a it's a difficult question man it's a very difficult question cuz it's and I I guess it comes back to whether you see things as a GI gift or a curse which is the choice and you know if there was a parallel universe with a ren that hadn't gone through those things would I be the artist that I am would I be writing I wouldn't be talking about the topics that I am but how would the course of my life transpired and I think it always just comes down to a choice so you might as well choose the thing that makes you feel better about it which is that it's a gift right because if I look it like a gift and I look at it like a press perspective then it justifies all of that stuff happening and it's it's it's unusual to think about a parallel universe where none of those things happened because I think with that comes a little bit of negativity towards my situation now so um I think the decision to be grateful is it really serves me the music you're making today I mean the album that is one of the big topics of discussion sick boy it is crafted while you're up in Canada figuring out your health correct for like a fourth time at this point or something yeah well some of it was crafted before I left knowing that I was going to Canada some of the tracks put together then and then there was a few tracks that I actually produced and recorded whilst yeah whilst in treatment there yeah so my understanding of the story m is you sign a great deal and you get adct well let's start with the beginning you get addicted to bus yeah which I I didn't understand could be a real thing but is because it is like this instant reaction that can release something in you correct yeah I I love I love it um and it was the first thing I mean I only had ever had one job in my life when I was 16 working at a co-op and um I got I got fired for throwing Sprouts at my coworker so uh from that moment forth I decided that all cuz I mean I was obsessed with music ever since I was 10 years old and I was producing beats and selling my mixtapes at festivals as a 13-year-old with this little tiny handheld boom box and I'd just go and sit by a bunch of people and play the songs and just you know and and I was obsessed school time at dinner time I'd lock myself in the music room and just play P piano the whole time or play guitar and um it was just a real hyper fixation for me and then um so buskin was my way of like as a 17-year-old is when I first started doing it it was just my way of I could go out on the streets and I could do what I love and then you know I wasn't making a huge amount when I first started because I I didn't quite mastered the art of performance or anything yet but I made enough to be like oh cool I can I can have a little bit of spending money from doing what I love and and that's when I just I started pouring myself into it and the Art of performance and yeah became addicted to just being out on the streets playing and that was a something that I just did throughout whenever I could before my health uh declined it was just something that I would do probably five six days a week I'd be out of there for sometimes like six seven hours at a time do you think your success in during that phase in which ultimately leads to today was kind of fueled by this ability to have hyper fixation on things 100% yeah I even you buy ADHD yeah 100% yeah yeah yeah cuz CU in those it's just like my brain which is a very common thing so ADHD that there's a lot of new research that says it's essentially like a dopamine dependency so constantly seeking these little spikes and if you're doing something that's not giving you that Spike of dopamine you become disinterested and um you find it very difficult to do and um but with music I could sit there it was the only thing that felt meditative for me I could meditative I could sit there for hours on end producing playing singing rehearsing the same lines over and over again so um I think it 100% And even to this day it's the same thing um it just it's the one thing I can sit there happily forgetting to eat all day um just because it's I just become so immersed in it what do you learn about people from busking so much man it's very it's very my I become fascinated with the psychology of performance that was one of the most interesting things I learned is um that there are these things called mirror neurons right where you if You observe a behavior you become inclined to repeat it because we're like creatures of community and we and we it's why in those talent shows when you watch somebody like gasping or crying at a moment where someone's singing You Feel That Emotion just by seeing that person in the crowd and it's like cuz your brain gets act activated to mirror those things so with buskin what I found was really interesting is if you can hold just one or two people watching you it instantly creates a space that's safe enough for everybody else to come and watch you so as long as you like kind of focus on Focus your energy on not like oh no why am I not getting a crowd CU that energy almost gets projected out if you can capture one or two people's attention all of a sudden that two people turn into 10 can turn into 50 turn into 100 uh just because they're enabled by other people doing it so I found out where yeah I probably makes me sound a little bit mental but I I love to people watch while I'm playing because I think it feeds into my performance while I'm doing it I understand that yeah well because you had the ability to react in real time and you're not necessarily focused on what you need to do next you're focused on what they want yeah exactly yeah yeah and and it's really and it's a positive feedback loop right because if if you are if you're holding because the good thing about busin as well is people are are there by choice they're not they haven't bought a ticket and if they're not enjoying it they're just like they're chatting away the people who stop to watch you do it completely out of their own free will so it's a really affirming thing and then you get this positive feedback loop which helps me almost forget myself which is almost my constant goal as a performer is get rid of the thinking mind get rid of the self-aware mind and just be doing and just be and and my favorite moments in Life or when I forget almost forget my physical form and just become whatever it is and it kind of comes through me some of my favorite artists I think had the ability to kind of tap into that flow State like Jimmy Hendrick like Jeff Buckley that the freedom of performance uh is that something you're only tapping into when you're on stage or is that something you're tapping into when you're recording in the studio it's a bit it's I I did I literally did a whole online course from it called Flow State I've done it with my with Connor who's here actually um and I try and apply it whenever I can because I think those moments where you become thoughtless even social interaction going out dancing going out partying enjoying like running whatever when you become less self-aware things just flow much nicer and I think life becomes more enjoyable so it's it's constantly like a thing that I'm trying to fall into yo beautiful human real quick I I want to tell you uh my secret to the perfect date night for me and my boyfriend you can steal it I will let you steal it Dan I'll also let you steal it so you can do it with your girlfriend oh thank you I'm looking forward to it you guys shouldn't make a hellofresh dinner together yum serious I'm not kidding it it brings you together plus at the end of it you get a great meal and it's so easy to incorporate hellofresh into your life so once you do it at for a date night you realize how quick and efficient it is so then you just want to do it over and over again that's what happened with me and my guy it worked we love it there's over 40 recipes to chees from they swap them out all the time they're designed by the best of the best chefs plus it's so easy to do it's like all set out for you everything's portioned you don't really even need to cut thing which is good because I don't you know I don't I don't like doing that and then on top of that they give you step-by-step instructions with pictures it's easy like again like I can do it that means I can do it too and you can too try hellofresh right now and if you want free shipping and if you want 50% off your first order we'll hook you up just go to hellofresh.com Zack Sang that is hellofresh.com 50z sang or use our code 50 Zack Sang when you're checking out so just to like recap and if you don't know we get to a place here today and an album that is an incredibly intense Journey yeah like you know one of the things you've talked about a bunch is like it's two things right like physical health is incredibly important equal to the importance of physical health is mental health yeah and the two very much it's like they they they're so deeply deeply connected in so many different you end up losing a record deal early on for things that are completely and totally out of your control yeah you you get sick does it come out of nowhere it it it's funny I mean I in terms of the physical symptoms yes in terms of I think mental health and feeling like a little bit of an outlier and an outsider I think that was just a constant theme in my life and maybe it maybe it set the stage for a chronic illness getting uh a hold of my body because some people don't develop autoimmunity some people don't fall into a state of chronic sickness they get something like Lyme disease and their body deals with it and they're okay but then you have a percentage of people who don't and there are theories as to why that H happen so I'm not I'm not sure if the disease in my body the disease the disease came from disase and and umum and came from a a place of discontentment cuz I kind of always felt that can't even really tell you a time not to get too heavy but I can't really tell you a time where I don't think I did feel like that apart from in the recent years um when I've been picking everything and apart and then putting it back together again and I've finally come to a place in my life where I'm feeling a much greater sense of peace and tranquility and by the way it's a journey of Health that is it's being supported by those who appreciate and feel understood by your music and you're giving and you have given them your music in return right like for GoFundMe donations to for treatment you would give them the album in return 100% yeah and yeah it's it's so important to me and now luckily I've gotten to a state a place where I'm financially independent and it feels really nice to um be a voice for those people be a voice for the voiceless be somebody who can tell their story because my story is so many people's story and when I started doing the health blogging before when I was too sick to make music I realized that there are so there's such a underground community of people who aren't seen who are just suffering under the surface because they're they're not dealt with properly by the medical industry but they're too sick to really speak up about it so it feels really nice and empowering to be in a position where I can tell their story too and in a n nutshell you were wrongly diagnosed like they thought you had something called me yeah yeah well I was first initially diagnosed with bipolar um which was a misdiagnosis because my symptoms would come Cy cyclically and In Waves when I wasn't looking after myself or when I was eating the wrong thing but I didn't know that at the time but that's also connected to Lyme disease yeah exactly but I didn't know that so they were like oh well some days you feel a bit better some days you feel like really con like mentally foggy brain confused and they like well it sounds like hyper cycling bipolar so I was put on Sat talopram I was put on um some different ssris which made me a lot worse cuz I had underlying mcast which is this allergic condition but I didn't know that at the time either so I just fought through it because I was like well the doctors tell me if I it will even out eventually and I'll be fine eventually and so I just went through the mill with all these things um Valium was the worst one because of the withdrawals but I I just went I went I I was bouncing from Doctor to doctor and then eventually as I was deteriorating they said well you're tired loads of the time you're in pain maybe it's like Emy fibromyalgia and then I I'm on a waiting list for a year and I finally get to see that doctor and then the the the treatment is resting more and it's like I've been in bed for it's honestly it's it's really it's the the level of care is so bad for people who go through those things so you know I was really hopeful for this appointment for a whole year went to the appointment and it was just really disappointing and and and that was a cycle that went on for years of just like getting my hopes up for something and then getting my hopes obliterated and and my physicality being worse off and it was something that I had to constantly pick myself up from the ground until the point of breaking point in 2015 where it kind of culminated in going into fully blown psychosis cuz I just I think my brain had just had enough well and you literally try to do everything at one point I mean you explore feal transplants yep yeah yeah that was the uh that was the highlight of my life that was having somebody else's uh excrement put in my my backside was um yes what a what a journey that and that was that was it was another thing because there's a lot of science behind it right so you're you're implementing your someone else's microbiome into your own so at the time I was like cuz I had so many digestive problems I was like maybe it's gut-based and maybe it's just like this disbiosis that's throwing my whole body off so and one of the most researched things and it was it was healing things like Crohn's disease it was healing a lot of autoimmune condition even Ms was being slowed down by having these feal transplants so you know my music wasn't known at the time I spent six months raising £6,000 which was the the price of it you know don't come from come from a poor family so they couldn't help me so I had to do it myself really I I started doing these Health blogs and reaching out to the chronically ill community and eventually I the money and there was so much hope this is this just before the psychosis there was so much hope for that 6 months at the time I was so ill and so underweight I couldn't get out of bed so that whole 6 months I was in bed maybe I'd get up and have a shower every few days but even that was pretty excruciating and then this is before you know you have lime right this is before I know I have Lyme disease yeah so so I I raise the money I go to stay in this clinic and we do 10 days of uh the feal transplant thing and then my body had an autoimmune reaction to it and it made my symptoms like about five times worse and that for I think for the level of hope that I had um it it was like one of the most crushing things ever and and then it was it was a few weeks after that that um it was the start of the seven sin song I was literally lying on the kitchen floor like with my hands um sort of like with my nails digging into the floor because it was in so much pain and so much uh I don't know just just uh I was just so bitter about about the fact that you you have your sight set on this thing you do this thing and then it it not only does it not work but it makes you worse and um yeah I just remember this thing and then my mom came down she she came down the stairs and saw me in this state and then I just felt myself it's really strange I kind of felt myself fall through this tunnel it was almost like quite a spiritual experience and um all of a sudden it just like all that pain and everything it just there was it's so so bizarre I don't I still can't really understand what happened because like all my pain stopped all my all the weird feelings and I just felt this weird sense of euphoria when I came to I remember looking around and I developed this this tick which was like a click in my hands and um I I kept doing it but I was speaking really eloquently to my mom and and almost like really wit witty and funny and she was kind of like nervously laughing at all the things I was saying can't quite remember what I was saying but I was in this kind of like manic euphoric State um and then like loads of strange I started having loads of Strange Behaviors like I went down into the living room and I couldn't stand the fact that everything wasn't parallel so I'd move everything parallel and then um and then it kind of culminated in me well that was the first there was a few days of euphoria and then it turned into just like this intense feeling of dread that I couldn't explain and I'd wake up at like 3:00 a.m. sometimes like screaming as loud as I could like literally scream my mom would run in it be like these night taror things and then my my communication went the opposite way and I I couldn't really communicate what was happening and I developed a vocal stutter where I'd get stuck on words for maybe 2 minutes it be like just again and again and again and then um I I I started becoming quite delusional and thinking that the only explanation for my health struggles could be demonic or some sort of experiment it was the only thing that my mind at the time a rational mind made sense and um uh there was a time where I I decided that the only way to Short Circuit my reality was to do the thing that was least expected of me and this one time I while I was in the car with my mom I jumped out the car on a road I ran into the road and I took off all my clothes and I just layer in the middle of the road and caused a traffic jam while I was like laughing hysterically at the sky because I thought this is the last thing they expect and if I do this then all this is going to stop and then the police came up and luckily my mom taught me out of getting sectioned and um yeah that that that was about 3 months where I was just in this really intense psychosis that was real really fueled by this one treatment that like really I mean because it's such intense pain yeah that you're you don't even know how to compute it yeah like you're still alive but you're feeling like it's like your body's breaking down but like I you you you mentioned that you there's a song about that moment when you're on the kitchen floor yeah what role does that song play in this whole process does it come to allow you to find peace does it rationalize and help you understand like what what does that song mean I think I think when because right at the start it has this like Welsh choir which almost like a US eulogy to myself and I was setting the scene with that it's just cuz that moment was such a prominent moment that always sticks in my mind that it it it wasn't I don't even know if it was castas it was just to tell the story in in its rawest form without sugar coating it just making it as much as a window and as much as a transparent window as it could be what is it like to go back to that not that comfortable always always no you know but it's something I've spoken about and it's something I've spoken in therapy about and you know it's still important for me I think there's an an element of PTSD through throughout the years because it literally does feel like you're being tortured like when you're um sorry when you're when you're lying in bed for that long it it does feel like you're being tortured and and your your your cap is um you don't you don't know when it's going to stop if ever and and then then life seems a bit a bit pointless because you see you know all the people I grew up with doing their thing getting married uh getting jobs doing the thing and I don't really have a 20 so it was um yeah it's it's quite difficult but um but it feels despite despite the element of PTSD that I think there's it it it's really important for me because I I'm probably a lucky very small percentage of people who have managed to climb out of that place and and some people don't ever climb out of that place so it's really important to for me to tell their story in hopes the more awareness comes and in hopes they don't feel alone uh I appreciate that uh I lost my friend this year she had a terminal illness and I think people don't realize how much time lose yeah and this concept that you're you're a prisoner to your own body yeah and even though your brain can tell you one thing your body can do something they don't they don't correspond that's it that's it and and especially when you have like a part in yourself and I'm really sorry about your friend by the way really sorry um but when you have a part part inside of yourself that's um just craves life so much like and just wants that because you know what I mean cuz we we all want and we all deserve we all deserve it and and and it it can feel very confusing and very I touched on a lot of spiritual things on this album and it can be very spiritually confusing um being like what is the purpose of this it's coming back coming full circle to the first question and then attributing a purpose to it and then I think about that and and I'm like okay I have a tri so so it's giv it meaning but where's the meaning for the people who don't you know what I mean like what sorry but where where is the meaning for the people who just suffer and die with this like where where's like where's the rationale in a spiritual sense like what what justification is there for that or is it just meaningless and is it just it just what it is and it's a very sort of like an ny view of everything that is just these things just happen it's just part of the the whole cycle of life and yeah it's it's it's it's something that makes me have a bit of a tug of war with with my my own spirituality of what I believe and what I think and um something that I quite still haven't landed where or what or why probably eternally but um yeah it's I I hope to in whatever way in the path of my career carve out a space that hopefully eases some of that suffering for people just cuz I know how Insidious it can be and it's coming through in these records um but one of the one of the songs of yours that it's not on this body work but i r and yeah it it is so brutally honest and it's a conversation amongst yourself and I mean are you crafting that record thinking back to where you were mentally at that time or are you crafting that record from a space like what you hear is what where you were do you get what I'm saying yeah I I think with that with that song it cuz I mean it's impossible for my house stuff not to leak into stuff just it's been so so much a big part of my periphery but it that that song was really I mean the core of it was really just the human plight not the plight of the chronically ill person but just the human plight of these two Duality the ego and the self-doubt and the the overconfidence and the overd doubt it was just really like the doubt of me as a Creator and it was quite fun actually at times for me to just poke fun at that poke fun of myself and not take it too seriously you know and um yeah I and I think that's why it did so well because it was on a human level just relatable to a lot of people because you don't have to have gone through a big life full of trauma to be able to to have a voice inside that's like you can't do that especially in today's age man like with like the barrage of like we we're put under a microscope and we've all social media has made us all performers like all of us are now entertainers because we're all just showing little Snippets of Our Lives um which I think is a new thing for the human brain to process and get to terms with like being so observed makes you very self-aware and within that realm of self-awareness becomes a lot of self-criticism right so um and I think that's why and also as well I mean it's a 9 minute song which is bit of a bit of an antithesis it's bit bit of a juer position to what is successful these days which is short fast food content you know yeah well because you're telling a real story and honestly it's so the details are so vivid and the way you you produce it I just I can see you talking to yourself in a mirror I can see the The Duality like the two sides of you yeah yeah super wild yeah I thank you man thank you Exquisite song yeah really Exquisite appreciate that when is that a stream of Consciousness or how does that work it it I had the concept for years actually I just hadn't I hadn't done anything with it I knew I wanted to do it and I had I actually had a whole 4 minute long song which I scrapped all of the lyrics for which was a similar sort of concept but then I came back to it years later cuz um you know I'd gotten better at Guitar I'd gotten better at libric writing and and I was like oh I want to bring bring this concept to life I think it would' be a really cool video I didn't I never really expect it to go the way it did and in the end as well the end was a lot Bleaker at the start it ended up with me offing myself after after the negative voice gets too much and I remember showing my friend and they were like Ren why are your songs always so bloody depressing and I was like that's a good point maybe and so I went away and thought about it and sat with it for a while and then I wrote that last verse which ended up being my favorite verse on the song which is a lot more hopeful and bringed a lot more which was actually more true to my story at the time as well so it was um yeah I I'm really glad that they pulled me up on it in that way actually because I think it's my favorite thing is the the kind of acceptance of the dark and the light rather than one winning over the other because it's not even really the light winning over the dark of of the hope it's just more that those two things exist in parallel Duality and they could exist and they should exist and they always do that's the thing I think this we we we're obsessed with The Narrative of good versus evil in in Hollywood in in stories and everything and it's always like the the Battle of good versus evil and whether in a horror film or in a superhero film one always wins but I don't really think that's the truth I I think that I think that it's more akin to the yin-yang symbol where where both exist inside each other and there'll always be a place for both and a need for both what a beautiful thing to accept yeah and I think that acceptance makes cuz I think we're such harsh critics of ourselves you know what I mean we're so and we're so hard we're so quick to point fingers at people without accepting our own hypocrisy within that um but I do think life becomes less of a struggle when when you you don't see as things as this is good this is bad this is black this is white because I think when things are like that it becomes a little bit more jarring to navigate life what does it feel like when you find out that you didn't have this me but you ended up having Lyme disease it's it was a really weird one because when I first because I so so so what happened so I was in The psychosis right and um I there's part of me that's still lucid and I'm researching online all cuz I'm was always researching online I took before that I was taking countless different supplements and trying different things that weren't working but I was like I I I found this condition the subsect of kids with autism had this condition called pandas p n d which is caused by the strapped to cockus bacteria but gets inside your brain and causes all these psychotic like symptoms and I was like oh I wonder if that's with me so I convinced my mom to take me to a gastroenterologist and I faked the stomach bug CU I knew that I'd get penicillin because I was active against strapped cockus I fake the stomach bug I go to the doctor and um gives me a course and I tell him oh I've taken penicillin before cleared it right up gives me a course of penicillin I get home never taken it before take it for two weeks and then my my psychosis goes away and my symptoms like diminish by about 50% and I'm like what the hell and then they creep back up after it and I'm like like and I've taken so many pills at this point that I know it's not Placebo so um because I'm I'm no stranger to the placebo effect and so I go this this is infectious this isn't this isn't my brain this isn't like a Mis this like there's an infectious element with this cuz I took an antibiotic and my symptoms got better so I I saved up and I go and see a infectious disease specialist in Brussels um about 6 months later and I tell him on my symptoms before he even does any blood tests he was like we're going to do some blood tests but I'm telling you right now you've Lyme disease it was like it was like wait until it comes back but I'm I'm almost certain um tests come back positive for Lyme disease um and all the all the biomarkers of it as well there's certain things in your blood like the cd57 and different inflammation blood counts and it was it was this it was this strange thing because I was so relieved that all the years that I went and sat in a doctor's office and say no there is something wrong with me and they're like Ren we've done so many blood tests and there's nothing wrong with you psychosomatic it's all in your head and it was like such an affirming like thing but it also made me feel really angry as well because I was like why didn't somebody take the time to do what this guy did right at the start why why did I have to do all this so I felt lot of anger for the medical industry but I also felt so much relief because I finally had an answer and then I had to find out that it's not as clear-cut as you've got L he take these antibiotics and your better because it would been in my body for eight years so I treated the LM disease I take the antibiotics and I'm just left with like all this autoimmunity and all this like stuff residual stuff from having an untreated condition for so many years so like it was a real mix bag because I had a path to Wellness now that was the great thing and it gave me a lot more determination um but I also it there was a lot of like resentment there for the years of like medical neglect and and the times that people with 100% confidence looked me and were like Ren there's nothing wrong with you so one doctor even said if you tried getting a hobby while I was like while I was in the thick of bit and I yeah that's terrible yeah yeah W wild to R like like tried to even just wrap your mind around yeah it it was surreal but the good thing was and then I started blogging about it I I kind of got a second wind after that diagnosis cuz I was like I am going to get better there's nothing is going to stop me nothing's going to get in my way I start blogging and um a stem cell doctor finds the blog this is something very outside of my financial capacity at the time he he felt a sense of empathy I guess cuz his his son was a musician funnily enough it was hit right here in La he goes if you can get to yourself to La I'll give you Stam cell transplant for free and I guarantee you it's going to make your life a lot better I beg my mom for money for flights she gives me flights I stay with a family who were going through the same treatment funny enough a set designer for the fresh prins of Bair somehow he just a guy I found on a Facebook group but they're lovely lovely couple by the way like Lyme disease there's a big community of people who go through it and I I I have friends it's a very it's a somewhat common thing here in America I know in the UK yeah well and by the way like if you look back at the traces I'm pretty sure like it's a profit over people situation where they did pesticides and things that they shouldn't have used and like there was an uptick in ticks and all these different things that would make its way to people and I mean terrible stuff but if you caught it quick enough with the right dose of antibiotics you'd actually be able to mitigate symptoms because the longer it's inside of you the to be C that's exactly it if you take a course of three weeks of doxy cycline within the first I think you've got about a month window um most people make a full recovery yeah and again like other famous cases of this is like AAL LaVine yeah yeah yeah AAL LaVine I think I think I heard something about Justin Bieber um you've got um uh what's her name um oh it's not coming to me now but yeah there have been a few cases where celebrities have have come out and spoke out about and it's still there's still so much misunderstanding about it whether it's like because because there's in the medical industry there's still an argument whether is this just post lime disease and an autoimmune thing or is this a chronic inection whether it's persisting but evading tests the um uh antibody tests because of the way that it operates in your body is it's almost like a stealth bacteria so and there's still a big debate about that which leaves the patient in the middle and and I don't even know which side of the fence I sit but it leaves the patient in the middle without answers and that's the most that's the that's the most difficult thing is the scientific community that you know there's couple of schools of thought and then and then then you have the patient and the patient is left with no clear answers which is why I think there's a desperate desperate need for more resources to be put into what's actually going on because yeah it's it's tough the other thing too is like stem cells a big discussion about stem cells and the ability to use them yeah those are I mean rumor has it in LA they use them for almost everything and uh like my chiropractor is like yo your shoulder hurts like let me put like I'll inject you with stem cells but it it is gamechanging because of the way what it is I mean you're essentially injecting new cells to replace the unhealthy cells right and and yeah and you know I was advised against with normal doctors they were like nah just don't go there you know it's not it's not researched enough we're not and um I took a gamble on it cuz I had nothing to lose really at the time you know I didn't think I was going to live to see 30 so I was like well you know there's this real big opportunity it felt right there one of those things if felt right and yeah I went and did the stem cell transplant and um 6 months later um I just got a lot better I was I was able to go out singing playing on the streets go to the gym hang out with friends and it was incredible but is that scary to do that all again it was it was very bizarre I I just want to do a disclaimer as well and say that some people that did the transplant got worse because you know I always feel when people are like do you recommend doing this I'm always a little bit hesitant because I took a Gamble and some people took that Gamble and didn't work out for them so um I I think it's important for me to say that but for me luckily it worked out and um it was I don't know it was there was a I remember there was a little bit of um performance anxiety the first few times I went out again because I was like w I'm learning how to learning how to swim again um yeah it was it was bizarre but I think I was just so relieved that I just took to it very quickly and it was very quickly I think it was only 6 months after my stem cell transplant that the first video um that we filmed busking after years and years of not been able to make music videos and stuff um this this song blind died I did with my friend Sam we went out on the street we did this video while we were filming another one and um just started videos everywhere from these buskin vid sessions just started going viral all over the internet and it was like oh damn like cuz at the time I would I kind of like surrendered the fact was like oh I'm 26 now and you know I had this opportunity when I was 19 you know I just want to do music for me really and I didn't really know if there was another chance and and all these videos start popping off and um yeah it was really incredible actually for me yeah at 27 you think you're going to die but the reality is at 27 you get a whole restart to your career in life yeah that's right yeah and which is it's kind of ironic in it cuz 27 Club it's like the the the age where most of these uh these uh amazing musicians died uh some some of the most iconic musicians died at 27 and 27 felt almost like a rebirth for me so that was a nice flip on that really special yeah is s boy your story it's not my entire story it's it's it's a it's definitely a photograph of moments yeah moments that range from when to when yeah uh from uh just from from that whole period I think you know that the because you've got the sick boy the actual song itself um that that's to do with my frustration with uh with certain interactions with different doctors and stuff uh masochist masochist is about rebirth for me it's about samsara it's that uh it's that Buddhist cycle of of destroying and that that everything does eventually disappear and everything gets born it's it's this constant cycle of Destruction and rebirth some people took it very literally and were like this isn't masochistic this is sadistic you're just talking about killing every thing you know cuz there's a lot of bold lines in there um but that you know they're they're all metaphors for for cutting off various ties and it wasn't about being shocking to be shocking for me that song symbolized um symbolized rebirth but in a way that is quite self-destructive by shutting yourself off from everything was just tendency that I had to do with my illness because I think the thought of attachment becomes very scary when you're ill and you realize you can just lose everything when I was attached to the idea that I would be a star at 19 and you know that all that all blew up in my face and so it's just about severing tires from anything that could cause pain um and that's any hope and dream because it's the the obstacles are too great to overcome which is why it can become quite uh masochistic because but in in that and gaining gaining almost like a satisfaction from being the person in control of severing all those ties I I think that's one of the things yeah because it's you before it's your illness you know what I mean yeah and that became a bit of an unhealthy theme in my life was like leaning on destructive things because I had the power to choose them rather than my body choosing them because my body was being so destructive in my experience of life so if I go out one night and smoke a 100 cigarettes in in an evening I've chosen to destr I I'm the person in control of that destruction but the other destruction is not your choice exactly and there was something quite empowering about being the person that chooses when I destruct so so I I did I had quite a few unhealth some some that I still still carry unhealthy cop and mechanism just because of that power this feeling of empowerment that I am in control of this destruction I'm going to be honest like having this conversation allows me to see my relationship with my best friend who I lived with for many many years navigate her terminal illness right it was terminal but it was also chronic right yeah and um think actions she would do that were the worst possible decisions get new meaning even from this right like yeah and and and it is hard when you are someone who wants to do before your illness does it for you yeah and it's not just hard for you but it's also hard on those who care about you because 100% because because in the old in the long run ultimately it feeds into a into the illness being even worse in some ways if oh you become your illness too yeah yeah so it's it's it's definitely one that I'm trying to find a lot more Zen and a lot more balance with I haven't quite mastered the art of that yet but I'm aware of it and I think that's the first step totally yeah um a song like the hunger you wrote that in 2015 but why did it fit now um I think at the time I'd wrote it in my bedroom when I was just kind of like too too ill to get out and about and it was just a bit like a fun hip-hop track for me but how many songs were you able to write from bed I there's probably about a thousand songs on my hard drives various different in various different stages complet cuz that's all I could really there was I think there was a there was a period of time where I was unable to do anything at all really but most of the time I was too tired to really leave my room but what I would do is just sit there with my laptop on there's a video of P called patience on YouTube where it kind of it's got a shot where my friend Aisha came over to my house but that was a period where I barely leaveing my house but um my I think the thing when I when I could when I was functional enough to be able to which um you know the the hours that I was able to I just that's all I did I just just right just produce beats and just write so there's a huge uh catacomb full of music music on my hard drives um uh which maybe I'll revisit one day maybe not it's but um have you even attempted to revisit it from a healthy yeah yeah so so I I released demos one and two which was a bit of an accumulation of a lot of those songs I just kind of went through a lot of them and go oh I like that one I'll bring that one to life oh I like that one I'll bring that one to life I'm sure I'll probably do that at some point with more demos projects the the difficulty is when you're an artist releasing things that you've done a while ago is you feel that you've improved and and a different perspective so you might not completely relate to them so even though someone else might really like them it's it's quite a difficult process to put them out if it's not on in a place that you are I understand that yeah so like even with sck boy are there any songs that you made for this album that at the time of making it meant one thing but today mean something else to you oh that's an interesting question um H well I think suicide was an obviously obvious example because that it was never meant to have the end on it so it it and after I added the end on which I did when I was in Calgary cuz before i' I'd wrote in it about three years before when I was in lockdown and um and that's a tribute yeah and it wasn't a tribute initially but the end gives the the start a whole new meaning I think because it then you have it from two different perspectives you have it from the persective the sufferer and the perspective of the person who's actually gone along with it and carried it out so um that one definitely transformed yeah minut is is that a strategy for you creatively that you write songs from two different perspectives that you cap capture in one story I wouldn't say strategy is the right word no it just it just what happened I think it just it just happened to be for for me like songwriting is quite a spiritual thing and and it it it um it almost kind of feels like channeling at some point it's just something that's already there which which is why I think I sometimes find it quite difficult to take compliments for for it cuz it doesn't really feel like mine once it's done um so it was um yeah I don't think I ever go into songs strategically so how do you know you've entered a state where you can receive and by the way like that is a common thing right like Chris Martin believes that all of his best songs were given to him by the universe and you know he told the story here twice like that is super common like you enter this thing that you don't even you can't even fully explain yeah it's kind of some because sometimes it's like all the words and the Rhymes and everything are there it's strange it it feels like with with lots of things in life there's a conscious I'll do this to get this result but sometimes with music it's like and which is why it sometimes doesn't feel like mine it's like I'm not actually doing I'm just taking um you're you're taking from you though or taking from something bigger or com each of the two I don't know may maybe like you could argue for the both it could just be like a subconscious sub perceptual thing where you've written so many lyrics that it just your brain is working behind the surface or or or maybe it could be some some more esoteric type thing um I yeah I'm not really sure I'm not really sure do you care to even know or do you just let it whatever happen I don't really care enough to know I I think I don't I don't really need to understand it just kind of like I don't really need to understand why I'm here I think I think um my favorite my favorite thing that I've keep referring to recently is that the end of one of those Bill Hicks shows before he died I love Bill Hicks man where he was just like it's just a ride just a r man just you know it's things terrible things may happen but the the purpose and the point I think is to be to enjoy the ride and and and try and make it as an enjoyable ride for everybody else who's sitting next to you as well why was Loco produced the way it was uh just again just for fun man I I like the challenge of just doing something completely Acappella and I I grew up uh it's something I like to revisit something but I used to be obsessed with beatboxing when I was a teenager and I used to um I used to to just love it I think it helped with my flows as well because you've got like when you have those rhythmical flows it's almost like a like [Music] a you've got that kind of like you you've got [Music] this so you can hear counter Melodies because you've got you've got the high hats the snares the symbols in the words so when I'm writing having that kind of cuz rap rap is a bit like a drum kit I I always see like singing is a singing is like a cello I think the cello is the closest thing to the human voice theing is an instrument and rapping for me is a drum kit and you can accent certain so if I'm like [Music] a and I'm like and put words to that and it's like when I am rolling this I'm the rolling with and then you kind of put in more and then consolidate into words and I think that really helped with my flow because you can do some really interesting things with triplets counter rhythms and or more straight fall to the floor patterns and um yeah so so with Loc I just wanted to build a track that was totally from The Voice how do you determine which story deserves which type of Sonics and vocal performance I I think that just comes back to the other thing as well I usually start with a with a either a drum Loop or a um melodic Loop or a guitar pattern right and um that really kind of infers the feeling I I'll find something that I really like I'm just playing around on a on a keyboard or my guitar or whatever I find something that I really like and that almost like puts me into this feeling of what the song should be about and then sometimes I'll just write stream of Consciousness I'll just write until I find the theme and I stumble across accidentally then I'll get rid of all of the things that I've written and then write again that fits inside that theme because for me it's like finding the seed the concept makes the lyric writing process so much more fluid I get that yeah what are you thinking Dan well I was going to ask how you rap so fast on songs like Wicked Ways but I think you just answered that question yeah well it's part that and it's and it's a lot of coming back to the hyper fixation it's a lot of um just repetition I I'll start with the metronome on like 100 BPM and then I'll pump it to 110 then I'll pump it to 120 and I'll just keep on for some reason I never get bored of doing things I could stay there for an hour saying the same line over and over and over again and um I just don't I don't seem to get I find it quite meditative I don't really get bored or even if I'm walk into the shops I'll do it or if I'm on the bus I'll do it just anytime that's like free realistic state to practice I'll practice just cuz it's I might as well otherwise I'm just there thinking about I don't know anything anything so it's just it's really good opportunity to be able to just kind of improve that on that so and I that's what I like about the I what I love is if I've got an idea in my head and I try and do it and I can't do it because I'm like oh I'll be able to do that soon and then that will push my ability level to this new foundational place and then when it comes to the next thing I can try and up it yet again so um yeah yeah I really like doing that why do you why is giving the lyrics super fast vital to the way that that song needs to come off it's I don't think it's vital and actually with with time I've actually I think I was a lot more excit I mean I grew up listening to people like skidy who is like a UK drum and bass MC and um some of the old I mean obviously like the Buster Rhymes and and and um and people like that but I really I just liked how it made me feel but I don't believe in doing it for the sake of doing it such of like a flex sort of way because I think there are so many amazing artists that do that you mean you got like the tech 's um yeah yeah and and and twister hell yeah um and and and it's for me it's not about being the fastest really it's it's just about sprinkling it in places that makes it sonically interesting because I is the same with my production there's there's a danger at one point where you can become a bit too overindulgent in that and and you drown it in too much of that stuff but for me now with time it's being like okay okay this little moment would just raise an intensity if I bring this in here so um yeah but I do enjoy it I do enjoy it illis of our time a double on Tandra yeah pretty good great record thank you mate thank you I mean is there a part of you that is I mean Embrace is one I mean I don't it's not making light of it but it's embracing it right yeah it's understanding what you got well that's the thing and it's the same same with sick boy it's a double the whole album is a double on Tandra cuz you know in the hip-hop illst sick is sick Bro is like you know it's uh it means good and and but sick sick is an illst as well it's my story man so um yeah and I suppose it's the first time I thought about that but there's there's a little bit of uh there's a bit of duality in that as well in terms of you can take good out of the sick you know it's true yeah what's the story behind a song like down on the beat is that just you just want to have fun yeah that's me want to make a dance Banger bro I yeah it worked yeah yeah I I just um you know I mean I I've funnily enough probably the music I listen to most is like EDM which doesn't really come across my music cuz I'm either singing Soul on the streets or making hip-hop but I I love I love dance music man and I I love when I first started producing I I just wanted to be a drum and bass producer that was like I was like that's all I want to do cuz all I'd listen to was drum and bass and like really techy like dark drum and bass which probably wasn't good for my mental state at the time but um I just like yeah I think that was just I wanted to make a dance Banger and there wasn't there wasn't too I mean you've listened to the record there's not too much depth in that or anything but it's just fun and um it was my my mate mate Vic as well we were both like freestyl into a dance beat one night one time and um and we were like we should make a track and we're like yeah yeah let's make a track so we that's what we did we just we just like got this EDM beaten and put down on the beat together yeah does your hyper fixation apply to Animal Farm um or socialism it it's communism I I was always the deal I would I wouldn't I wouldn't say say no I I wouldn't say I wouldn't say it applies to Socialism or communism I think I think with my view on those uh I I think there are good elements I mean it plays into the NHS it plays into the health thing I well it plays into every system and every system to a degree will lean more into a particular thing but even even America there are there are elements of socialist socialism in America I think we it's one of those black and white things again where if you slightly hint at it people be like but communism doesn't work socialism doesn't work because this example a BCD and and I think I think there is a lot of beautiful amazing things about capitalism as well so I wouldn't say I was a socialist or a communist or a capitalist I think I think all of them have um weaknesses and strong points and some of them get abused I don't think it's the fault of the systems themselves I think it's the fault of the the people who are abusing those systems that turn them into the negative things that they are I think beautifully said I I think that I think that having a base level of housing um and health care because we have the capacity as human beings to offer that should be done um and then we can still have a system where people are proportionally rewarded for their efforts which is more of a capitalist model but I also think that since the internet has come about there's probably an even better one than all of them that we just haven't quite figured out what to what to how to do it yet cuz I I I personally think that the voting system is outdated I think that there's a much better way to make Democratic decisions with the power of collective intelligence from the internet because there's a huge there's a huge world and there's a huge number of people who are capable of making this so you don't really necessarily need an electoral body to represent a whole country that then cyclically gets put in charge I think I think it's I honestly think it's a completely outdated system that's maintained by the Power Systems and the money that that keep them alive so um but that doesn't mean to say that I'm an anarchist either because um I do believe that there are some people that are more suited to a leadership role and there are some people that don't want that role so so create total chaos I think people naturally form hierarchy but hierarchy doesn't necessarily need to be negative as long as social good is as long as social good is at the top of the hierarchy before profit before power before uh expansion and and and also homeostasis of the world that we live in because this is this is the one place that we've been given to be able to coexist and we're doing a pretty good job of like of messing it up and and a lot of data is showing that so um and then you get to a point where you have scientific arguments about the climate and no matter what side of the fence you sit if you think that it's a big hoax or if if you're agreeing um with certain scientists are saying that we're in Doomsday Prophecy situations both of which I think are maybe a little over exaggerated I think that I think that um the fact that we can't have healthy mediated conversations about these things because there are profit incentives and investments from either side and that is like here here's the deal and I can I can have the conversation about like collective intelligence helping make decisions for a governing body and allowing that to at least give you a temperature check of like where you should be going and the legislation that's right and Etc like we I I would love to talk about that yeah but I think first and foremost like the you have to inject a moral filter through every single decision and action a government body will ever make in addition to that the foundational mandate across everything needs to be people over profit 100% And the idea that people are the a nation a state a city a Town's greatest asset and without people nothing will ever work yeah and and the ironic thing is I think if if that shift which is a very very foundational and significant shift if that were to happen the people at the top and power the ironic thing I think they would be happier anyway and and I think there's this this desperate protection of trying to maintain this system because it's really working out well for the people who've got a lot of money and power so there's a desperate need to protect it but I think with that with that shift if it's done in the right way everyone even those people who have got that's it percep everything actually get happier too and and really I know it's a very simple thing but happiness is really what it's all about oh dude yeah in America for instance I believe that Talent is equally distributed in this country but opportunity isn't so much is made up by your zip code and where you happen to live and the that's around you on top of that I do also believe that selfishness can breed selflessness and selflessness can breed selfishness yeah because the ability to run for office and bring about a better day for your family should in turn bring about a better day for your neighbors when when done right yeah historically greed gets in the way and you have situations where like just like's look at a microcosm of America real quick and let's take a trip to Florida where you'll find marker Rubio who his district had the Parkland shooting uh years back on Valentine's Day you know he he decided to Ste sell the children of his district to the NRA MH while taking money from the NRA right he sold the kids and he used that money to put his kids into private school right instead of saying like let me build upon a better reality for everybody yeah um and make school safe for everybody uh he chose to take the real deeply selfish route yeah and uh you know ultimately like and die and it's I think it's so difficult to you know even even myself and and and everybody for those virtues to not be tainted and it's not necessarily our fault for being totally selfish it's just a like it's a bombardment of our entire environment inspires us to be that way because it's it's it's everywhere from the moment we enter school to Media to everything so it's really about like for me I try and try not to point too many fingers and and just try and see it in myself and and try and inspired out change in whatever way I can even in conversations like this but um yeah it's it's definitely I mean it's a foundation of everything if there is some way to put social good across profit and and that to be like the foundational I think we can still live in a world world of profit oh my God you you have no idea how I mean everybody has an idea but nobody fully understands the I mean the egregious spending that goes on the insane ridiculous redundancies the I mean there's no tracking of money right like when you pay a government pays a contractor to do anything from like do the trash to pave the roads there's no understanding of where that money goes once it hits them so there's like this I mean it's so deeply corrupt it's so deeply corrupt everybody was like you know uh crypto is going to be the feature n blockchain is the feature as a form of payment because you need to have accountability for where pennies go right so like like an understanding of where money's traveling the second like it goes from us as taxpaying Citizens into the government's hands and out there's just no understanding so the second that it goes out to a contractor it could be spend a trillion different ways and by the way it's never being used on anything that's going to do good for people like like really if you were to go in and audit everything the amount of money that is being spent on things that are probably non-existent right is could be in the billions if not trillions of dollars yeah yeah and and then profit and people just spending money for the sake of tax brackets oh there's so much money that could be used for good it's just being spent because they're like oh crap well we're going to lose lose out this money on Tax we about just buy some we don't need and that's the problem man it's like I do think that at the end of the day people can be rich and everybody can have a better day and be taken care of and there can still be a hierarchy that makes sense while making sure that nobody ever wants for anything everybody has access to mental and physical health care there's an understanding that nobody deserves to starve in this nation or live and raise a family of four on something that could barely keep the lights on like everybody deserves access to Internet everybody deserves access to reproductive Health everybody deserves access equal like genuinely like I'm the crazy that goes like take the best school system in the country and duplicate it everywhere because if you don't invest in that you're not investing in anything I I think school is one of the most important places as well because that is what shaping the minds of the people that that are taking care of it when when we're not here when we're just dust so I think school is is one of the most important places to kind of put that energy and focus but it's the world I want to live in man it's yeah you're very special like you you really uh give incredible energy but your story is really uh rather remarkable dude let me ask a question that may relate to what you guys were just talking about sure what does the pig mask represent it is it is Animal Farm yeah animal farm so yeah I mean I mean yeah I was and coming back to your question as well I was a huge dystopian literature fan growing up I don't know why ever since I was a kid I was just really attracted to that I I watched the Zeitgeist movie when I was about 14 years old I don't if you ever watched Z guys but that that blew my mind and then I I became obsessed with reading oldest Huxley George Orwell Kurt vager people like this and um and and that really leaked into my way of how I was viewing the world and and um Animal Farm yeah it's the story of of um these these natural hierarchies that we form and and how the animals were subject to fall for fall and just how the humans were and um the pig for me the pig mask that kind of pops up in those things it's almost like an uncom comfortable companion um who represents a lot of things he represents greed he represents my Illness but he's also so familiar in all of those situations that it's like the thing that I am frustrated with and have been at war with he's been there for so long that he's also my friend in a way or you know Donnie Darko movie where you've got the rabbit there and he's like he's an ominous character but he's also a comforting character for Donnie and that and um it it's kind of like that really it's like this this this thing that is always there with me on this journey that I that is my life up but at the same time um there's a comfort in there because without him and it's for anyone to to to think about if I was just to wake up tomorrow and I was didn't have to wake up and swallow a bunch of pills and I was just 100% well it would be it' be a surreal obviously it would be great but it would be a very surreal transition to not have that familiarity of just like even now I'm sat here and my my shins are hurting my feet are hurting um it's to not have that familiarity when it's all that I've known cuz I don't even really remember what it's like to feel completely healthy so it's it's it's bizarre um because there's a weird comfort in it at the same time as being a discomfort I totally understand that yeah yeah because it's I mean for a bunch of different reasons primarily it's an Escape it's a reason it's an excuse but also it's like it's a reservoir as well it's a reservoir of of um of material I suppose I don't know that's interesting yeah yeah it fuels this yeah it fuels the album that you can listen to right now it's waiting for you on Amazon music it's called sick boy uh all of Ren's music by the way is waiting for you on Amazon music there's going to be a link in the description below what are you thinking I did want to ask with like all the treatments and medication does that affect your brain and how you like create or see different things 100% man and sometimes it can be quite debilitating Ian it's why I mean I was holding off on the heavier part of the treatment I'm doing in Canada I haven't done it yet because we had this album coming out and I was like I don't want to and it's a funny one because then you're having to like almost not sacrifice but you're having to put at certain times as the question do I not lean into this so heavily so I'm I held off in a big course of antibiotics that I'll be starting in a couple of weeks um because I know for the fact that my brain is going to go to Mush for a a few weeks and um but when you become aware of it's easier to navigate because I've you know I've had over a decade of messing around with alip pathing medicine so I come to know how I react but yeah there are some times where the first three months of this year just in a dream world after starting all the these new treatments and stuff and I wasn't able to really create during that time and this is in still on the Journey of curing or to the best of your ability managing Lyme disease yeah yeah yeah I mean Lyme disease is theoretically out of my system now um as for the test and as for the test of what Dr Hoffman the doctor I'm scen has said um the there's there's an active co-infection called bonella that's still in my body that's picking up on the antibod so we're treating that with antibiotics um which is a four because it's been in my body for so long we're doing a four month course of antibiotics um and it's about three different antibiotics at once so it's going to be heavy and it's going to be not so great on the stomach um but it you know it's a necessary evil and and hopefully after that it there'll be another level of Health that I've that I've reached and and hopefully one that I'm um uh it's really funny uh like with these chronic infections cuz your immune system is not really dealing with them you go through this thing called the herxheimer reaction which is like it's it's all these bacteria is dying off and you release inflammation in your body so um it just basically makes I don't know if you guys have ever had coid but you get super foggy in your head and it's like that constantly basically you just get super foggy and like your personality gets blunted and just become a bit of a walking dead yeah you can't you can't be on a promo run promoting an album exactly man yeah yeah and I get emotional about stupid things and yeah yeah so um I I thought you know what I'm going to enjoy this album coming out and that's what I've done man last week was mint mate we just like we went out to BM we did some partying um proud yeah I feel I feel super proud and it's it's really nice the fact that we've done this pretty much independently as well and having all the people involved in that team cuz it felt like a real shared celebration you know like we were all we were all buzzing we were all out there we went went and got the biggest steak in the world um because my diet is super limited so um that's one of the rare things I can eat in a restaurant so we got this 40 oun Tomahawk Steak which I like uh tried to finish and was in a lot of pain but the best sort of pain and then um and it was good it was good it was a yeah it was it was a good experience and then um we've come here do things like this speak to lovely people like yourself and yourself and then um and then we're heading to Vegas on Friday to experience that sick yeah enjoy it all I will I will appreciate your honesty and your Artistry and the Vlogs that you put out and your honesty here today really do I'm I appreciate and appreciate for having on and chat to me the studio is always open as you release albums please come back I will and again all of Ren's music is waiting for you link in the description below it's all on Amazon music final thoughts can you tour so at the moment uh what I'm thinking for the future I don't think I think realistically it's always going to have to be something I manage even if I get to a really good place it's going to have to be something I always look after myself so I don't imagine I'll ever go on like 60-day tours around the world but what I would like to do and I was talking to talking to Connor about this like you know maybe go and do like a really big show in the city stay in that City for a week soak up the city just like take that pace and then move on to the next one and kind of almost do it like that you can do that it's going to cost you more money but you can do it yeah yeah it's fine and and I think that there'll be a way to figure it out and and even with busking and stuff like that there are things that we can do surrounding that that make it you know financially worthwhile and um and then just interviews in those cities or whatever there's definitely ways we can make it work but I think um yeah I think that's you know unless it could happen and what I've learned in this year is Anything Could Happen man we s sitting off the back of a number one album that I never expected so so um you know maybe my health makes a 360 and I'm buzzing and I'm uh and I've got the energy of a 19y old and I want to tour the world every single day but we'll see man I you know I'm I'm just taking everything I'm taking everything as it comes but um you do it at your pace yeah exactly but I can only imagine like as a busker like who who knows that high and that feeling like to not perform in that oh no I'm definitely you won't be able to keep me off the stage I'm definitely definitely to do some shows and and and yeah and I'm really excited now it's like now that there's stuff to play with like we can be really ambitious with the shows that we put on as well so I'm really excited to put together like a sick experiential show that incorporates elements of the the more sort of like performative stuff like highren and the tales Jenny and Screech and then the more sort of hip-hop stuff I think we can have a lot of fun putting together something quite special you give Timeless man oh I appreciate you yeah you're really incredible thank you thank you thank you for being here thank you for having me you good yep Ren [Music] everybody

Channel: Zach Sang Show

Views: 186,150

Keywords: zachsang, zach, sang, interview, zach sang interview, celebrity, amazonmusic, music, ariana, grande, zach sang and the gang, dan zolot, cameronlouis, REN INTERVIEW, REN NEW MUSIC, REN NEW ALBUM, ren sick boi, ren sick boi album, ren sick boi reaction, ren sick boi lyrics

Id: AAIGsXEZ0WI

Length: 67min 51sec (4071 seconds)

Published: Tue Oct 31 2023