MSI PLAYER TIERLIST ALL ROLES FROM MAJOR REGIONS - CAEDREL

welcome to my MSI 2024 player tier list I was going to do this pre-recorded but I chose to do it live instead so there's a lot of thinking out loud and backtracking here and there and going back and forth on ideas I encourage comments and discussion but please don't be toxic towards each other and Flame each other because this player is here and that player is there uh but nevertheless I'm going to be co- streaming MSI uh starting 10: a.m. 1st of May don't forget to be there at twitch and if you enjoy the video don't forget to subscribe thank you guys for watching and enjoy before I jump into this video I just want to let you guys know about an awesome give away that might interest all of the League of Legends fans out there signal RGB a leading brand in RGB software is giving away an epic gaming PC that looks just like the Nexus alongside the recognizable Nexus exterior the top can be lifted to reveal the parts inside a 3070 TI graphics card 11 900k processor 32 GB of RAM and 1 tbte SSD all of the RGB is fully customizable with the signal RGB application which controls and syncs RGB devices from any brand and there's even a game integration so you can have your RGB reacting to abilities while you're casting to enter the giveaway make sure you click the link down below uh enjoy the video now I feel like it's very hard to rate a few of these roles and Top Lane is one of them because in my eyes right and I think in everyone's eyes the Eastern top laners are obviously above the Western top laners right there's a gap and then I think a lot of it can come down to new on right I think there's a lot of arguments for some uh different players you know for example B in 369 if you only watch their finals they actually went two to two two in those four games I think if anything I think 369 played better in those games because 369 Won Lane and is also a better map player so bin actually got gapped and the when bin was the one winning the lane in two out of four of those games it was when team came and helped right uh but if you watch there like game one for example you can see renon versus atrox I think 369 is just straight up winning that lane in isolation and um like he had Perma push Top early game he he was gapping him in just direct Lane phase for the majority of the game and even on S Side Lane after they got Baron top Esports was winning the game and Bin I feel like bin just made like this silly mistake I can see why he goes for it but he goes for like this all in and like dice 1 V1 369 when they're playing 1 14 which you can't really afford to do that you just need to drop the tier two sometimes uh cuz that can murder your tempo for your team so you know and then you look at game two when I think this is the game that been quote unquote gapped 369 but he's playing Rex sign to rington and 369 was under a lot of threat and when the when the lane broke it wasn't from Lane phase was from Jungle support coming right and that was a story of Bin's Lane phase it was never one in isolation fully whereas 369 kind of was looking at finals Lane phase in more recent times I think 369 out performed bin so in my opinion 369 is is is the better of the two I'm not going to be a one series Andy but if you look at 369 he's kind of evolved as a player 369 everyone talked about him in jdg as an or Cante rennington weak side main right now he's kind of a carry player a bit he's playing way more atro way more rennington more Rumble you know the tanks are dropping a little bit more so he still plays things like or when when he needs to but he's also playing carries I feel like 369 has become a more complete player and he's always been a complete player but he's showing it now I think it was really nice for him to beat jdg as well especially an ending up against flandre and uh I think 369 did much better than fler in that series I like the I like his Urgot pick I like this Urgot pick into rexi I feel like he's one of the players in the world who can really uh counter it now rexi is nerfed for MSI right so all the rexi merchants are going to get a bit r there's a few Champions that I think some people are maning that are going to struggle when they're removed for example Rex siiz nerfed for example re is nerfed which a lot of junglers relied on re azir got nerfed a little bit right but and Zack but I don't know if those two Nerfs were enough to kill the champ uh in terms of raw form I would favor 369 over bin now just touching on the lck a little bit uh I mean zus got outperformed in that finals really hard zus was invisible in the finals if you only watch the finals you would say that zus is a b tier top laner struggled with rexi I think rexi was something that he never really picked up properly and other people did and when other people were playing things like rexi and Rumble and Cante Zeus's idea of the meta shifted to rang tops I don't know why but he was playing things like TF and vain basically I don't know who was adamant in TF being the strong champ because all throughout the regular season this [ __ ] would just blind H rocks every game look at that and then you get the playoffs and for some reason and he's maining TF and he's playing Zack in here and there his Zack was not bad I'll give him that but if you look at his finals performance you'll think that this guy is I mean zus was disgusting in finals like he he is in his the shy AR I mean just count the score line it's basically the shy World Finals all over again getting Perma caught on S side Lanes zus I think out of these three top these four top laners I would say zus has the better Lane phase of all of them when he is playing at his Peak and zus has very high highs like he is he's just inconsistent I think personally his Lane face is the best of the four when he's when he's in his when his when he's in his mode you know the problem is he's not in his mode and he choked a little bit in that finals getting solo killed by Cante twice was really uncommon for him it's funny because all throughout the regular season you'd look at it and you'd be like wow zus is just gapping everyone you know I'm not going to just be a stats Andy but he was gapping every top laner JY Perma died then you get to the playoffs and like to be down two Cs on 15 on average when you're playing range top lers a lot is disgusting and I know that I think one or two games he got Lane swapped on but being down to your opponent in CS when you're being range top Lane main is is like you can contextualize stats in that sense where you're like how is that possible so zus I think has slipped a little bit for me I'm going to put him in a tier I think zus is a really good player I think he is um if he gets his [ __ ] together for MSI and rexi being nerfed will help him I think he can he's easily an stier top laner he's one of the best top laners in the world and I think the biggest thing for zus is Rex side Nerfs are huge I wouldn't be surprised to see zus be the best top player in the tournament I wouldn't I think the meta is good for him it's not bad bad I think the The Meta is pretty good for him so I wouldn't be surprised see zos be the best top ler in in in um in the tournament I feel like I've got a bit more info on Keen because I sat down with ir relevant and watched about four or five of keen's or two or three of keen's games from his POV and the only problem I have with Keen right now in my opinion is everyone's hyping him up I do think he's a kante merchant I do I I am sold that he's a Cante Merchant rexi Nerfs coming in won't hurt Keen too much he didn't become a Rex ey Merchant but he is a Cante Main and that scares me a little bit because um I mean his Rumble was good his Rumble was good but with reide being out and Cante being his blind pick when atrox is picked a lot and uh Camille is back in the meta I feel like other players will will kind of gloss over him a bit is he a camil player no not really because I personally think the way the meta has been shifting camil is going to be a really strong top Gallo might be quite strong atro will be strong rennington will be strong um so obviously he can cover off a few of those the only problem I him with have with him is his champo I think his laning phase is incredible I think he is his map play is good his team fighting is insane so for me as an S tier player I worry about this shampoo a little bit man where should I put zus I feel like with recent performance he's 8 tier with regular split performance he's s tier I would say he's A+ the problem I have with this is I think personally at at MSI I think the best performing top laner at MSI will probably be zus if I had to gamble I think think he is least affected by Top Lane changes and most benefited by Top Lane changes IMO or is he he's not he does have few cam games right he just hasn't been playing for long I think is a problem but I'mma put him in a tier we'll see what happens we'll see what happens bin bin is the tricky one for me I think Bin's in a tier with zus I don't know what to think about bin like I said in those finals I think um 369 was the better player but B is an insanely good top laner I think Jax is Perma band versus him of course and he is a bit of a Jax Merchant all these top laners play the same thing they just play HX s bin is really good he can play everything um obviously he doesn't play tanks as much which is the the the notion around bin but I think he can play tanks as well what is my problem with bin his rumble's trash I'll give him that his Rumble is dog [ __ ] he is a Medi mediocre Rex ey Merchant is he inconsistent what were those semis like like I said by the way I'm doing this live I was going to pre-record this but uh I'm doing this live so that's why I'm probably going back and and forth is bin too aggressive no I think Bin's solid I think Bin's solid I don't know what I'm thinking about eight TI Ben a solid what were these semi-finals I don't remember what he played rexi rexi rington rexi TF the TF game was good he was smurfing on TF this game he was a really big pain point for uh Tess uh having to catch sides before objectives they were always pushed in like mid waves side waves everything was just he just covered it off well was one of his best games but I don't like the idea of having been in I don't know does this look weird 369 keen and Bin are world class and I would put z i I honestly think all the the top laners coming from the Eastern region are all insanely good there's not a top laner where I'm like hm yeah they're kind of mid you know if if jdg was here and flandre was here I could see it you know if H life was here with Doran I could also see him being a tear down but I actually think all of these top laners that are at the tournament are all insanely good um the only reason is the only reason for me putting zus in a TI is I I can find flaws easily in J in Zeus's recent performance but I can't find flaws in uh other top laners recent performance ke. s bro Keane is easily s here keen's Lane phase was on par with zus throughout the regular season he's his Lane phase was on par with Zeus's he didn't play as much hro blind he was obviously playing his kante blind and in playoffs he outperformed him so I think overall that is a very sa safe assumption say keen's in there I think 369 is the best top laner of the tournament so I could make a t s plus and put put 369 in it but I feel like that's doing Z dirty because this is the problem I have with tier lists right I think moving forwards I had an idea for this this tournament to do like four categories and rate out of 10 on those categories and that would be a much better measure of the player rather than they are this letter because of this I'm going to put zos an a TI if you hate it I'm sorry all right Oscar I think is the worst top laner of the tournament I I personally think Oscar in is the worst top ler of the tournament he's had a really rough year I hope he can bounce back I don't want him to see this and think like wow I'm being sh on I I I think he can just move into the tournament with no pressure it's his first International he doesn't have to sweat it did he play at Worlds last year second International go in with no fear just play your hot out um and do your best he's like the least experienced and yeah he had a rough year so I mean there's nothing to defend Oscar inan was the weakest player on ftic yeah last year Oscar last year was pretty good Oscar last year was really good but this this year I I feel like Oscar's um yeah his Lane phase has been weak he's been randomly getting solo killed caught out his finals was okay the last game but yeah some of these games he was um the obviously another another problem I think he has is the lane swaps I think he has not got much of a clue what he's doing in some of these Lane Swap and his Zach was a very big Band-Aid to some his games you could see in a lot of these games he was just completely out of it he's still he's still a good player though I think he has a good a high ceiling I just think he's lost his momentum and his confidence um impact Broken Blade and bipo I think are all really good I I want to put impact above Broken Blade personally I know people think bipo is the best top laner uh of the West and people argue between Broken Blade and bio being the best top laner in the west if I had to the way I'm rating this is if I had to have a top laner on my team to play the game at an international and I had to choose between the three I would choose impact I'll give my reason of course uh I think impact is such a reliable Rock and I think if you look at the styles of teams how can I show you all the teams I'm going to put all the teams here right how many of these teams are top sided teams right how many of these teams are top sided teams I would argue these are the two top sided teams in the tournament would you agree and the rest of the teams are midb sided I would not argue T1 is a top sided team I don't think zus gets like resources you know your blg is not a a topsid of team at all I don't think it's a bad way to play but I think for example a nice example would be like if gen G went against fly Quest I think both them have kind of similar Styles you know um like their their bot lanes are a bit weak and this is all on paper from games you see on stage obviously their bot Lane looks like the the weaker version of of the team and their their top side is just insane their mid jungle is insane and I think fly Quest is kind of similar I think bipo is the best player on their team I actually do H and I think bio bipo inspired is is an insane top jungle I just feel like if you go against team like gen you'll lose if you don't get a big enough top playing a lead tops side lead against teams like um you know T1 or or top eorts you'll lose and I feel like their style won't really match well into the into the better top laners like for example against impact it didn't work very well impact's just a this [ __ ] rock I've been seeing a lot of stats of Ki and apparently he's ins say any good Broken Blade to me the reason broken Blade's here and people might disagree with this is he hasn't shown me enough personally I feel like I get this notion from when I see Broken Blade is he is smurfing domestically he gets to Internationals and he is invisible he is he is just invisible and I think he becomes a liability sometimes in Internationals and I don't care if he solo kill top every game of the entire split I would never put him up here because when he gets the international and he does well is when I'll start to reconsider it and I'm sorry if that's not a good enough analysis but I think he in isolation if it was domestic tournament I think Broken Blade is the better top laner but impact is better in Internationals and more reliable H and whippo style is so incredibly aggressive that I feel like it becomes something you have to play for and I think as an isolated top laner he's insanely good but I just I'm not a fan of the way the game's played not not not say it's a bad thing you know I I don't think bipo is bad at all I think bipo is is like I said the best player in tournament and he leads the [ __ ] charge actually maybe B bipo is really good I don't know rating these three is hard do you want do you want the reliability do you want the carry top or do you want the top laner who's really good domestically who's never really shown International which one do you want I personally think this is um this is stylistic choice and that's why I said I think it's hard to rate it's hard to rate these top laners you know because again you could argue zus has the higher ceiling of the four and better Lane phase You could argue tan has the higher reliability You could argue Keane is choking in Internationals and playing bad you could argue bin in his last International best of five in the semis he underperformed and got outperformed really hard by the shy that cost him an entire semi-final you know I think there's arguments in every direction and that's why I think a lot of these tier lists are subjective uh I will argue that personally I would favor impact on my team in international broken blades show a lot and is's a really strong top laner and flexible and whippo is an incredibly Good carry top laner I think all of them I don't like this this notion of B but I think they're all about the same and you can choose which one you think is best all right I think that Top Lane list is fine I think I'm happy with that I don't think there's anything too egregiously crazy in there let's do jungle see jungle is where a lot of funny stuff is going to happen I'm going to go ahead and say it because everyone's thinking it kenyon's the best Junger in the worldo he's instantly s here and I don't think you can ever use the argument that Canyon will underperform an international because every single International Canyon's been at he is uh stepping up is sometimes the sole reason that he he drags his team across finish line sometime and is the only reason that they're incom competitive I think he's the most creative jungler in the world as well in the sense that he will play picks the second he picked at Kix in that game in the finals and he he won on it and he played well on the Kix I knew this guy is uncontestable because he is willing especially considering their on Match Point now it might not it's only one pick right and it's hard to read into but I think he has the confidence and the champion pool to pick picks that are sometimes unconventional in necessary situations and in sense that is like a clutch Factor you know and I feel like that's another reason why I think he's the best jungler in the world he's he's just the go jungler I think there's this guy is so insanely good it's crazy why not R listen I I haven't watched the minor regions I I I don't want to get into any like minor region stuff I don't I don't I don't know them well enough I I if I if I had watched the region for the whole split I I would do it but I'm not going to do it anyway Canon best strong in the world uh hands down and my other strong opinion my other strong opinion that maybe some people will disagree with I think Tian is minimum maximum bti I actually might put him like lowest of B tier listen I am a Tian hater I am I personally am I've watched Tian for years and I have seen him at every International he always has a problem domestically he's good like he's a good player and he is a strong jungler and when tian's on this when tian's on the ball and he's feeling it he is like a proper good jungler you know but the amount of games like t i feel like can sometimes just lose the game too quickly too suddenly and too easily for your team and he he is just a a liability you know and I know he's a world champion and you can say Kel he's a world champion how is he under performing and I know Dom is a huge fan of Tien and he loves TI he calls him the goat listen D just like you're the shy hater I'm a tan hater I'm putting him in [ __ ] B tier I don't give a [ __ ] like I don't think Tan's that good I think he's he's a strong jungler he's average and uh well not average he he's got high Highs but his low lows are the lowest lows every jungle in this tournament and he's disgusting and some he's he not only like there are junglers who can run the game down and like path badly and get caught on crab and die and then there are junglers who suck their team in to say if I don't get this buff I'm out of the game and when they do that and his whole team dies for it that [ __ ] gets banned and I feel like tenen does that that's tenen so those was my two strong opinions as much as the first one might be normal I feel like this one maybe people will hate me for that one actually also by the way Tian quick thing before I move to to owner Tian you're a [ __ ] vgo Merchant I'm just going to say it you were a vgo merchant all of last year was it last year this mother suaka was a vgo merchant was it season 12 season this [ __ ] absolute Merchant in season 12 and he's bringing it back I can see him slowly bringing this this foga game was like one of his best games I've Seen Crazy almost carried the game by himself all right let's go owner um owner I'm going to put him solid like super good a tier I've had problems with owner over the last few years I think this split he's been decent the problem with owner is the rail Nerfs are going to hurt they're going to hurt and people will watch owner the split and be like wow his Le not that good his Le insanely good his Le is most played all time and um I think some of these games I'm not going to give the context I come all up top of my head but I I don't think you can look at this stat and say owner is a bad Leon I don't think owner has champion pool issues I think I'm biased towards a dam one player because Kenyon is also a rail Merchant what you mean I'm biased towards a dam one player he's on gen what cuz he was on Dam one before I think the re OB Canyon probably has most played as well sure I won't disagree that most played well I mean his finals well was also insanely good even though they lost I remember was it real he played well in one of the games maybe it was this one the D one series I'm thinking of something's in my head and he was completely cracking heads on it oh it was the Damon series when I was screaming B re right and they like one first picked it he's a real too but I don't think he'll be as affected as Canyon would be think about last MSI you know when owner was trying to play things like kazak and Kindred himself he just looked like he was struggling like a shitan and um I feel like T's meta read was slightly off I feel like T1 is a team if the meta is can you play every champ yeah what did I say uh if you look at T1 as a team last year at MSI they got the meta wasn't great for them they got sucked into meta reads like the northless and the Kindred and the kazak play style it didn't work for them but then you get to Worlds you you look at their The Meta for worlds and I think it was basically perfect for them I also think worlds 2022 meta was perfect for them because I feel like ker is quite a um a a reliant player when it comes to meta so that's just T1 as a team personally I think Canyon is best strong in the world I put owner in a tier I think that wait isn't the real Nurf just hurting every jungler like like you can argue that like Yik real Merchant umti doesn't play it I don't think razar plays it much either I've seen him play a couple times yeah's on a real Merchant some junglers had a Voli bear fetish this split and razork was one of them and umti was one of them razar and umti with the volley bear Merchants but yeah I think owner's a solid jungler I had problems with him when he when it came to play around playing around bside but yeah Kenyon gapped him pretty hard in that finals owner got caught here and there completely randomly and owner is just like really good you know I don't know I feel like some T1 players turn it on when it comes to Internationals and the two players on one who turn it on in Internationals are Faker and owner listen I'm going to give you a quick rundown of my opinion of the T1 players okay and you can agree or disagree okay zus zus is in his the shyar faker and owner step it up like [ __ ] at Internationals Kia is a montage maker against lower teams which makes people think that he's better than he is sometimes because he picks random picks against bottom tier teams that are really in unconventional but never plays him against a top tier team so he gets over inflated as to how good he is but if the meta fits him perfectly well when it comes to range sport meta he is a really strong player and he's probably one of the best range sports in the world but ker has this thing where he plays like Caitlyn support and VAR support and ezal support and everyone's like wow his Champion pool's so good and then he gets the international and obviously he's not going to play them he was just playing them against a bottom tier team so everyone gets a bit too overhyped gumay Yushi is like the he tanks everything when the team's [ __ ] running it gumay Yushi tanks it all gumay Yushi is like the last line of defense and he is also a um a clutch player so Gushi to me is like the most solid player on that roster Gushi is really good like I said if if if the if the meta suits carrier well he he is he is insane yeah I feel like sometimes he gets a little bit I don't want to say overrated but people lose their minds a bit too much including myself when he plays random [ __ ] and then he never plays against top teams and if he's against a bottom tier team he'll pick some random [ __ ] and make fun of them all right razor I think razar's winter was really good I think his spring was all right I think fantic as a team kind of struggled a little bit fantic as a team was kind of all over the heav I think razar's still really good I I'm I'm a big fan of rzor I I do think his win was better but I'm a huge fan of rzor I think he's really good I'm going to put him in a tier Maybe even above TN honestly maybe I'm [ __ ] on TN too much and people don't the last thing I want is people to say that I'm rating these fantic players because I'm on fantic I'm not I put Oscar is the worst top player in the tournament from major regions he's got nothing to do with being part of fantic or anything like that I think razor was the first All Pro was he first All Pro for winter I think he definitely deserved it razor insanely good jungler the problem is it's hard how do I describe this you can look good as a jungler when your team is struggling but it's hard to look like the best jgler when your team is struggling right and I think that applies to many roles for for example Top Lane I guess you can argue it a little bit differently when Top's always gapping every game and your team's still losing but fnatic as a team struggled a lot Razer seemed like a pretty decent player through most of their series a couple of the series he he did run it down a bit and that's why I don't want to put him in a tier I feel like if you cut out some of those those best of Threes like their BDS one where he was playing maokai or not best of three best of five yeah those first two games against BDS how is fnatic even here is there sometimes a question I ask myself like they even reverse swept their way to get here that's why I think rating some of these ftic players is weird cuz they shouldn't even be here BDS should be here it's crazy that they're here but I'm putting razar over TN I think razar over TN might be the new meme of um of the year you know last year it was K Over Mick Micky X over K I'm going to go ahead and put razar over Tian I'm going with some crazy takes every now and then uh you can call me high as [ __ ] and I know maybe Dom's going to see this and he's going to call me up on Discord and he's going to probably ask me to sit for an hour with him and tell me why TN is is this low listen I think Tian is too inconsistent there's inconsistent and there's Tian and he's disgusting sometimes uh or I'm going to say someone's going to look at this and say I'm on hard drugs you know what pass me the Zaza listen I'm not about that life I've seen too many [ __ ] [ __ ] ass tier lists where it's like T1 is B tier because they came second geni is s tier because they came first T is a tier because they came second blg is EST I'm not about that life I'm not putting TN in [ __ ] a tier with owner and [ __ ] shooting it I'm not doing that dog [ __ ] he's trash and he's going to expose it MSI um and Internationals and Razor's better well what do you want from me man I can give you a tier list and say winners are winning and in second place places are second place and third place or thir place but that's personally what I think I I actually think that and it's not just for Content I actually think he's he's not that good maybe I'm a tan hater I don't know why uh Yik Yik is a controversial jungler sometimes because people are like yike this Yik that Yik this Yik that he's on a he's on a he's on a winning team it's hard to rate him he's on a he's on a losing team to rate I don't know I feel like Yik is the guy that gets the least credit on G2 because everyone always argues when he plays well that Yik has good teammates so it doesn't count and that [ __ ] I hate I think y's best stronger in in EU I think he's he's he's gotten so good now you can't call him a rook anymore he's got I feel like Yik has had players and coaching staff around him where he can sponge up as much information as possible you know for example the lane swaps you know Yik probably had no idea what he was doing the lane swaps he even tweeted he had no idea but he still run with it you know Yik is the perfect player for G2 because he will run with it you know when [ __ ] hits the fan things go derailing and you know [ __ ] random picks are coming out he'll run with it and I feel like Yik has got the mechanics to run with it and play with it so I'm a big fan of Yik I do think that okay my only argument with Yik my counter argument for yike is I think if Yik wasn't on G2 now this is going to sound very weird right if Yik wasn't on G2 and he was on a mid to bottom tier team Yik would not look good and I'll describe why yike I think there's two types of junglers right and you can complete them both to be a good jungler yike is a very good mechanical jungler and he's very creative but that needs guidance and Direction and there are junglers who are not so creative but they can give guidance and direction and those junglers are strong on bottom tier teams because they have a set play style and sometimes it works okay whereas I think if you put y on a bottom tier team in the LC he would struggle if you put razar on a bottom tier team in the NC I think he'd be fine but Yik needs people around him with experience and like Direction and Leadership and then he needs the space to be able to pop the [ __ ] off you know and I think Yik is an insanely good jungler he just lacks that quality so you can easily argue that yike on a bottom two team would would kind of suck but um I think on G2 he fits so perfectly that he's a really strong dler we've seen brazar on a bottom tier team he's not good that take is trash he was on Misfits and almost went to Worlds with them with like four rookies that's a dog [ __ ] take and I think you're wrong he was on Misfits he was contesting the top of the table in regular seasons and in season 10 or season 11 they almost went to Worlds if they won that last game best of five look at his roster he it just came over from Korea VTO was a rookie and kobby Vander was about to retire and so was kobby they were two veterans right this was classed as a bottom tier team and they almost they almost won the split so well not the split they almost went to world sorry not four rookies my bad I was thinking of a different Misfits lineup so yeah I think that that's my take on on Yik uhti umti I think's a really good jungler umti is a really good jungler I think he's super solid I feel like TL the thing is umti won't sit there and outpath you um is not the kind of guy to pick a carry jungler and go I feel like this is the different style between umti and inspired you know um is not that kind of guy to go [ __ ] you know vegan jungle mode and just power Farm you know he is the kind of guy to just Spam gank and you could see it on bro last year when he was on bro with the gang [ __ ] Morgan and henah and [ __ ] and and effort umti was the leader and umti was just that guy who just dropped every camp and ganked everyone and he would never pick any farming junglers he would just pick Shani maai zinzow and just Spam gank and he's a he's a jungler who I'm talking about with he's a leader you know he is I will do this and I will stabilize lanes and I won't play for myself whereas inspired is the opposite you know inspired plays for himself a bit more humty plays for L and it can look really bad you know there was games in the lck where umti played one on the Bro roster where he would attempt plays and as a jungler right how do I describe this you're both both jungers are even at the start because if you just keep full clearing you'll both be even right and what happens with umti right is he will drop camps and he'll slowly bleed but he'll keep the game stable but it's only until he makes a play that then makes it so he dies and enemy jungle can take his camps that he just falls off a cliff right so umti is the epitome of take my camps I'm just going in as a tank and I think again subjective I love that play style I think that's great play style uh obviously doesn't have flexibility but I feel like it's reliable and I feel like that's what the Team Liquid roster is it's just the Baseline reliability so I would slot him in to be tier somewhere I think he's decent he's good I like him where would I put him I would put him on the same level as Raz I think around about I know a lot of bro fans want him here but I think he he's really good he um it's funny to me it's weird to me that he comes from lck where he finishes 10th place for like two three years in a row joins the LCS and wins the split I think that's just that's not no Flame by the way I think that's um that's poetry you know B for bro 10th Place comes in and wins the split yeah but umti over TN does sound kind of [ __ ] up actually I'll put him below TN okay I am a TN hater but that is [ __ ] up I can't put Tian I can't put umti below above Tian I can't do that solid good jungler we'll play to keep Lane stable we'll go in we'll tank you know that's his role he's he's a stabilizer pretty good I I feel like it's too egregious for me to to put Tien below umti as a second place LPL jungler versus like this is why I hate tier lists because it's like wow look at that gap between these players that must mean they're much worse right it's like no they're they're all pretty good you know I don't like this idea of order I just think they're all solid and the only reason I say Tiana is solid is because everyone thinks he's really good and I'm a hater um all right inspired I don't know how to rate inspired man he's going to slot in beat here as well I think they I feel like it's going to look something like this you know but I'm not a fan of his play style no I can't put him here chat I can't put it I can't do that so I feel like okay so the thing with inspired is I feel like uh inspired play style aside you know he's got his play style he's got his thing the way analysts you inspired is they're very uh what's the word when you're like opposite ends of something you know you're you're you're you have like extreme takes for both sides of inspired you know some analysts Love Inspired because they're like wow polarize that's it they're like wow he Farms a lot like he he's he's like such a good carry jungler you know his mechanics are really good I I know and his pathing is really good and you can see it like when he was on Rogue for example you know they would be losing but inspired would never really be the problem cuz he'd always be pretty strong you know like um in like season 12 or something not season 12 when was it he was on Rogue season 11 season 10 and then when he was on EG you know he's he's farming he's strong and he never looks like the problem but I guess that play style does have a little bit of like selfishness to it you know and inspired is quite um I don't think it's a secret that inspires quite a toxic person you know no like I've never worked with him this is just from heay you know I don't want to put words in people's mouths but he's quite um a bit of a tilter you know he gets a bit triggered at his teammates or something what you mean drama people people have said this people have said this you can't doubt that when he was in Europe he was one of the best jungers in Europe 100% I think no I guess a better way to word it is to most people he's toxic because I feel like there's players in EU who just speak their mind you know and sometimes they speak their mind in a way that comes across as aggressive you know he'll come after a scrim and his mid laner will will int it and he like you [ __ ] ran it down and the mid laner can like oh [ __ ] that's toxic and to the community that's toxic but to be honest what he's trying to do is just basically say what he's thinking and I've been there I've played with players before who are like you're [ __ ] ining stop [ __ ] inting don't do that again don't pick this champ again and it's like whoa but if you kind of just read into what they're saying they're just speaking their mind without without a filter instead of saying something like you know I didn't really like your performance on that game you know I don't really like the way you play that champ you know can we look for something else he's a bit different but again I think he's got a very polarizing style to what he has I think he's a really solid jungler analysts could you know suck him off a bit and say he's a tier he's so [ __ ] good I love his ping I love he's really good I think he's between the EU boys I think he's really good he's a good jungler I think he's really good he's a good jungler he he's got a good carry style he he plays for team pretty well uh when he needs to he can play tanks I feel like there's a notion that like only a carry player but bro I feel like I [ __ ] this tier list a bit Tian man I'm sorry am I really [ __ ] Tian this hard am I really putting Tian below inspired and resor yo Tian listen again below yike I I see it no I [ __ ] this I [ __ ] this tier liab bit CH like I said I'm doing this live I was going to do this off stream I was going to do this off stream and I think I [ __ ] Tian a bit here in this tier list listen I'm a Tian hater okay I'll be I'll be I'll be a bit more a bit more respectful okay because I I don't hate Tian as a as a like it looks like I have some Vendetta against him to put him as the second worst jungler in the tournament doesn't it from major regions I'll put I'll put R I'll put TM between between Yik and razor that looks a little bit better and you can say k you're backtracking I'm not this is done live I was going to do this [ __ ] pre-recorded I don't know where to put inspired I don't I don't think he's better than resor but I also don't think he's I think um's being done dirty I'm not putting him in seat here Chad [ __ ] it I'm going put him here I think when Inspire is locked in he's he's a good carry player I don't think any jungler is a seat like it's similar to Top Lane I don't think there's any bad top laners when it comes to you know for example the top four lplk all the top lers are sending are basically all s here you know but umti is being done dirty here somehow n I think someone listen someone has to be done dirty if Razor's last that's [ __ ] criminal if tian's last that's criminal inspired is in isolation a strong jungler he's got really good carry performance on carry Champs and real out of the meta I guess I don't know if that helps him I I don't think he plays well at all I think I think MSI meta is going to be like probably sinza lein uh poppy Vigo Sani and Vai and I mean shun will play Kindred shun loves his Kindred maybe a bit of jarvin as well depending on bot meta I feel like I'm this tier list is hard isn't it this this bottom half of the Jungle is really difficult the problem is no one else has done tier lists so I guess I'm the first one taking the bullet of of the of the screenshot and uh being on drugs I don't know someone's being done dirty here and um I don't know who it is chat I don't I don't know who it is we'll talk about sh in a sec but listen I'm just going to leave it like that I'm going to leave it like that I'm going to leave it like that I feel like this is fair enough this is fair as I get it I don't think inspired is the worst Jungle of the tournament I think um is a really solid Baseline jungler very kind of one-dimensional volley bear SL tank I'll make sure lanes are stable and the problem is it makes it look like that's a bad style and is a bad player but yeah I think ump 's good 's good I feel like there's no Junger on this list that's bad I don't think any Junger is bad at all obviously it's top two from each region that's why teer the problem is this is why tier lists are hard for tournaments like MSI because you have eight players instead of what is it with worlds you have I don't know like 20 or something per role so when you do a tier list what are you going to say the first and second seed from major Reg there's a bad player on it because they're in a lower tier you know that's why it's horrible to do this you know if there was a third seed and a fourth seed it's much easier to put people down here that's why I think tier lists are quite difficult for MSI and I feel like um it's difficult to isolate people out anyway I think I'm happy with that I'll touch on shun real quick I don't think it's any surprise shun that uh to people that shun's in s tier I mean shun is like one the second most complete jungler in the league uh I think he does have a little bit of that creativity um to it him where he has Champs that he for example like the Kindred champ that he plays I mean what was in the finals he had like six Stacks in [ __ ] 10 minutes or something um but one thing that I broke down with Shun and did a lot of analysis on him uh last year was him and on I think are if you included supports and you did Jungle support tier list I think the best jungle support in the in the world right now is shun and on I think they are the the the timers they have to team up on invade to play for Shun uh is insane I wish I could give you examples but you know for example Canyon lens I don't think is a strong because Canyon to me is much more of a mid playthrough player and a topside play through but sh and on uh I mean there's examples probably you can find throughout the whole year where they'll Bas same time and they'll always he for example enemy Raptor respawn on blue side I can remember a game where he's playing zenza and on playing rakan I think or something they'll always team up perfectly to get shun resources without dropping the map and uh I don't know if it's shun calling that or not but that's one of the attributes that I really like about shun one of the attributes I really like about shun and that's I think he's really good at also I think shun on and Elk are the best Three core in the world their their bot play is incredible aun's timers for bot Dives are second to none his min max of camps before bot Dives begin are crazy and I think you'll hear a lot of people say that all right I think jungle's pretty safe pretty fair I think this I I'm interested to see what other people's tier lists are around these three I feel like a very Baseline standard tier list what people could have is just this right they might do something like that or they might do something like like that or they might do something like that I feel like all of this is very easy for people to do I guess the only hot take I have is is is Tian I'm a Tian hater nothing personal kid all right mid lane let's start off by saying chovi is the best player in the world uh he is the epitome of everything that is correct and right and the best about mid lane whether it's any attribute you want to you want to break down about chovi the problem with chovy that he had before was he was a bit too selfish didn't roam as much wasn't a very big map player now he's much more of a map player his team fights are impeccable his mechanics are the best in the world some of the best in the world his farming is some of the best in the world will he choke is the question will he have another International where he doesn't show up because every year we say this chovi is one of the best players in the world chovi is one of the best players in the world and domestically he runs the lck he is on another level and there's like a chovy tier in my head will he run it down well not run it down I guess it's more like he doesn't actually run it down and choke he kind of becomes invisible you know and that's why these tier lists are difficult because for example this is what I'm probably going to do on paper right and say these two are the best mids in the world and faker's just behind them but the counter argument is Faker shows up in Internationals and these two don't and that counter argument is so strong that it makes it so hard to defend the idea that these are better players you know and that's why this tier list is such a weird one because there's one player on this list that has intangibles and uh that can't sometimes be measured you know when Faker will just do something random at an international or he'll show up uh but faker cuz last MSI wasn't that great anyway let's let's carry on with chovy anyway we all know chovy's best player in the world I will make you a deal chat here's the deal here's the deal here's the deal because I said chovi was also insanely good last year if chovi doesn't at least come second at this MSI I am done with geni forever I will never ever ever rate them domestically ever again this is the last time I'll ever rate them domestically ever gen don't come top two at this tournament and they lose to T1 or they lose to top e sports or G or whatever it is when it comes to Worlds I don't care if they're 18 and0 regular season undefeated playoffs they're not going in s year it's not happening you said that last year no I said that last year for Doran I said if Doran doesn't show up at this worlds CU this is one of his best domestic years ever then I'm done and Doran [ __ ] ran it so I'm that is done I even signed a waiver with Yamato that said I will never doubt Doran again I'm [ __ ] done because he did really well in their domestic finals and I was already hating on him all right chovi and Knight two best mids I think easy if you look at Knight's finals you can argue Knight was not that good in the finals but I've said this before he played air like two games because they would there what happened in the finals was top eorts bandari from Knight so he couldn't get it because it's one of his one tricks Kem had a small champion pool so what Knight did was he took azir one two every game so he could deny Kem champoo because he's an he's an azir AR Main and then Kem had to play um H and tiia and it's not really his comfort the games that he did get arri and the games that he did get air he was strong anything other than that he was pretty useless so you can't look at knights's final and say he was bad uh he was playing for the team and basically trying to shut down what cream could provide to his team Knights easily the best man in the LPL and yeah him and chovy are top of the tier but what I'm going to do is I change my mind I'm going to put Faker Nest here as well because I think Faker if you contextualize his whole year so far faker's Lane phase was the best Lane phase I've seen from him all year long uh for many years I don't care about what those stats say plus six I don't give a [ __ ] Oriana was permanently banned against Aker every single game I I'm going to look at T1 and I'm look at most B against T1 and I bet you yeah Oriana 69% of the game time they per banded ker obviously Perman B Ash orena was Perman band against him and you can always use the argument that Faker is going to show up in Internationals did he have um did he have a bad uh finals he choked game five he did there was an instance in game five where Faker actually lost the game for his team which is very unconventional and Faker he ran that game five down quite hard with the Herald and uh cost this team a lot of tempo on the map it's it's one death and it's one mistake but it's a costly mistake it was a big mistake by Faker the fact that he did this I was Mega surprised but uh yeah sometimes you just kind of sleep a little bit don't you and uh like right now you're down 2K you're heralding mid for Drake it's there the problem is this is such an important death right because it's it's Drake spawn it's third Drake spawning and T1 have control of the river it's only a 2K disadvantage it's fine they have midwave Herold crashes and they have a they have a team fight right there right they have a team fight for Drake and that's their time to come back but obviously what Faker does is he he haralds in gets poppy wed into their Tower and dies and then they have no chance of a fight and then they're against um an infernal infernal Soul point geni and the game's just become incredibly hard he misplayed that really hard um very unconventional of him I think he's had a really solid year overall though uh he's had games where he's he's hicup here and there like obviously that game his Lane face that game also was not that good I think if you actually I can put the camera wait hold up for you can if you look at that lane phase and isolation you can say that you know Faker is like an 8 tier mid but I'm not going to look at that lane phas and isolation I think there's a point where the camera sits mid for at least a solid minute and you watch Faker laning versus chovi and this Manaka is not Landing a single spell uh and he lost Lane versus versus corki which was um obviously not ideal yeah it's here look at this Lane phas like I remember watching this and thinking to myself like what is Faker doing so they' both just TP back I'm just going to use this example and KY the amount of cues that Faker throws out at him and the amount that don't land the way this match up works is Oriana outranges corki and then Oriana pushes in cor and pokes him on the tower but he like chovi somehow had Wave Control and this wave slow pushing into Faker and he can't poke him from stopping to crash the wave because he's just missing everything and uh obviously this is the kind of Lane phase where you sit there and you're like Faker what are you doing so if people want a counter argument you know faker's Lane phasee was weak la la la la la sure counter argumented I don't care I think he's had some of the best LAN in of his life all year long but he just kept missing everything like it's just a montage of of of Faker missing qes right so he could never really punish the corki and chunk him out corki was dodging everything and then uh and so you know corki eventually got first Blood got red buff and now he's got health regen and now it's kind of hard for Oriana to push him out of this Lane there's the first one that landed so if you want to be a finals Andy you can say faker's eight TI but yeah I think I think uh Faker will show up at this tournament he always does and yeah don't be don't get caught out by one game because I feel like a lot of a lot of fans have Goldfish Memory in a sense sometimes not all of them right but some people like they'll say this player sucks he'll play one game of a finals that is insanely good and they like he's the goat or vice versa you know they'll play good all regular season they'll have a Finals game where they play bad here or there and they're like nice dog [ __ ] and it's like well recency bias is quite powerful all right cream cream cream cream a lot of people for some reason don't rate cream so highly I think cream's a really good player I think he was good in OMG he's had his moments everyone has their moments you know Kem last year OMG lost the game on kaisa everyone remembers that he has a small champion pool he will probably get exposed an international for that champion pool but he's a really good player his aali win rate is pretty trash last year but he's probably one of the best tales in the world he's probably one of the better melee champ players in the world next to Zea uh his air solid uh blg's whole plan in the finals was just to shut down shut down cream Ari Ben denial pick of air after game one and it seemed to work pretty strongly against him and yeah he he looked a little bit dizzy off his Champs but he's got a certain few Champs he's good at you know akali Ari um azir Tristana is not bad like he he's he's got a solid pool not the best though for um an international so I think if anyone's going to expose him it's through his champ pool but I feel like he's got Champs to rely on like yon and [ __ ] when he comes back to it but I think a lot of people will be surprised his Lane phase is pretty strong his team fight's good he's quite reliable um is it his first International chat 20 years old yeah First International yeah maybe shits the bed I doubt it though he's got [ __ ] 369 on his team and and moo so I mean just listen to them and shut the [ __ ] up yeah Kem I think will be the most underrated player at the tournament because no one's ever heard of him uh humanoid humanoid honestly humanoid has the most degenerate play sometimes he has the most degenerate plays like he will like that already on Soul series against nuke just getting solo killed by Oriana or air sorry level level three um some of the team fights were disgusting but humanoid somehow is always really strong and he always pushes Sid Lanes his air is good but he just has these really stupid moments you know he has games where he'll single-handedly carry the game but he'll have stupid moments that will cost you a lot and those stupid moments come from the lane phase he'll do really really silly things in the lane like getting solo killed on air I think it was a few times against I don't know if it was this game or this game where he just gets solo killed by Caps or or nuke listen I think he's got a lot of good qualities but my only argument for humanoid and putting him in B tier uh is I think humanoids biggest flaw is most exposable in an international now what I mean by that getting solo killed by nuke level 304 an orena Soul as an example doesn't matter much because I don't think much is going to happen getting solo killed by chov or Knight level 304 is going to be a whole different game and that game is going to be disgustingly unplayable um because the way teams the best teams in the world punish you for mistakes is absurdly strong and I'm scared for humanoid but humanoid has had high where at Internationals he plays really really well he is like the best player on his team most times at Internationals so I'm giving him a little bit of leeway I would put him here but I'm giving him a little bit of room to be like you know what his last Internationals were insanely good he's been the best mid at some Internationals even better than caps and this year he's been overall pretty good he just has those slip ups and those slip-ups can cost him the whole game his whole game I guess more relative no yeah World 22 humanoid was better than caps deal with it so yeah humanoid International seems always pretty reliable and quite strong um I kind he's like leaning between these two me but I'm going to put him in B caps obviously the Best Western mid uh I would put caps above cream personally I think caps has it's he's got more experience he's got more champion pool he's got a few qualities that comes with playing the game for more time I think caps is the best player that Europe is sending to this International I think caps is the best player that the West is sending to this International and is the player that stands the most chance against the Eastern players right and he is the Bastion and Beacon of Hope basically for for for Europe in the West in terms of international success sometimes you can look at caps and say he's craps and has a bad split I think caps a split this this split has been really good I don't have anything egregiously wrong with the way caps plays the game the problem is if you look at caps versus chovy Lane face when he was playing when the [ __ ] was it was it the Leandra game I don't know when it was and [ __ ] like that where he's just getting solo killed and you know was it at MSI I think it was right like this series gen G2 was painful this was painful the last time caps played against trovy or I don't know if that was the last time uh it was painful to watch it was really painful like just what are you doing caps what are you doing like what are we doing honestly it was something to forget but that was a year ago caps I think now is is is pretty strong player this year yeah uh I I I think caps is is is definitely the crem of the crop of what what Europe is sending so um yeah I also Lov CS caps' creativity I feel like he does have that creativity to him you know intangible sometimes yeah caps runs the region I also think like the last thing I'll say about cap gam playwise aside if you look at his history you know I feel like it's hard to argue and doubt him I mean look at this from ever since he joined first first first first first first first I mean fourth once he is like the epitome of like European International success right so he is the core of it all all right the na mids listen I think Jensen's Lane phas is atrocious I'm just going to say it his Lane face to me every time I watch I haven't obviously I'm not a huge LCS expert don't get me wrong I I'm not I'm going to prefac this by saying I haven't watched every LCS game however to me as an analyst I think Lane face is really important the the series that I saw from Jen's Lane face I was not a fan and that for me already stings a lot and when I say his Lane face is bad right I mean relative to the domestic players right when I come up against people like this uh it gets even worse I think his his his Snappy decision- making as well I think him and inspired are a little bit inspired sees plays goes for them yeah desync maybe inspires these plays goes to him and Jensen doubts sometimes or like maybe it's a little bit late and then the play is dead and inspired looks like a [ __ ] Griefer for example I I don't know I know JoJo didn't get a single kill uh in their Series against fly Quest but I also don't think Jensen's Lane phase was like egregiously good in the matchups that he had you know I hate this Karma pick I'm not going to be a huge hater like don't get me wrong Jensen to be honest in my eyes is probably next to maybe you could argue like CJ the most successful player from na you know you can't say bjen you can't say double LIF I think Jensen is that guy like Jensen is Captain America just [ __ ] deal with it he is I'm sure at an international he'll be fine like I don't I don't think he'll have okay from the LCS like Jensen is that guy he [ __ ] you know like you doubt Jensen he [ __ ] pulls it off somehow you can say he's not from na la la la whatever but Jensen is is the most successful player LCS has ever had um internationally I think that wealth of experience you know and like just being a bit reliable will will help the team a lot I just don't think his individual caliber hits any of these players in my eyes I just don't think it does impact yeah but impact impact internal came success came from the lck you can't just be like well core JJ like he won worlds well he didn't win worlds for na did he sneaky I mean yeah sneaky is classic but he's not the he also sneaky has been out for a long time Jensen always makes the Internationals I don't know I don't have many other real points about Jensen um I've just not been impressed with the his recent best of fives and maybe I have Recon to bias in my mind and maybe someone's tier list he's going to be like in B tier you know it's his regular season was really good from Lane phase and stuff but I will tell you my judgment based on what I've seen and I think he's a CER m Jensen has zero International trophies bken has one my my guy I am [ __ ] Cavit 2015 doesn't count they played against we all right appaa yappa listen APPA before I rate you listen I don't know if you're watching this but I hope you listen to this name change don't call yourself APA apaa is much cooler listen apaa you got so many memes from that apaa yappa apaa yip yip bro don't call yourself APA apaa is clean as hell rename that [ __ ] ASAP the thing with apaa is you know apaa you know who apaa reminds me of he reminds me of Malang you know and I've said this on stream before you know how Malang came to Europe and every jungler in Europe was like yeah his Styles is kind of coin flip uh he's going to be easily abusable when teams learn his style of just Spam ganking and they stop dying to all these ganks malang's going to be a bad jungler seven months later he wins Summers split and goes to Worlds with the first seed and appa's the same everyone's like yeah appa's champion pool is so small he only plays zigs and a on soul and tell you if you just figure out a way to to abuse his champion pool he's going to be useless but no one has and no one figured out Malang either everyone always says these things and they were never they they they talk to talk but it never happens and I get it his champion pool is small you know he plays his Champs Captain America bro he locks him in he looks like a bit of an intro and everything else but you know he [ __ ] finds the magic and he makes it work and you know the second that game ends and the Nexus exploding he leaves the stage and runs to the backstage he [ __ ] runs I mean obviously everyone will credit his small champion pool and to me it works like I said Team Liquid to me is like this big rock team the problem I have with APPA is I think again Jensen and APPA I think their Lane phases are going to be really really rough against some of these players the good news though for APPA is I think a lot of his his Champs are cheating Champs now what I mean by that is they either cheat the wave or they cheat the move so what I mean by that is like zigs can clear wave very easy without being punished heavily Talia can cheat mid move and drop pryo because she has a global already on soul can cheat midwave with you know pulling the away with E and like farming for free so I feel like he gets away with a lot that it's hard to punish you know for example Ori Oriana versus corki a good example Oriana needs to get mid push into corki it's a good match up Oriana should be first on the Move corki can't cheat the pryo a lot of appas Champs can kind of cheat a lot of things that you need to force you know in a in a winning Lane and that's kind of funny to me and I feel like that's why he gets away with the champion pool a lot you know he can skip waves skip Lanes clear waves and get away with things that sometimes you just can't you know you can't punish so yeah I'm going to put him I'll put him I'll put him in C tier next to Jensen uh I think he's he's all right he he's overall like average to me and everything and uh I do think he's going to get blasted in Lane phase by a lot of these players his champion pool is quite small do I think it's abusable no the thing is domestically it's like how do we deal with APPA champion pool internationally they're like wait why the [ __ ] does this guy Play Oran soul and zigs or some [ __ ] you know obviously or soul is met now you know I feel like if you play zigs versus any of the players above him he's probably just going to sit under his Tower clearing waves yeah I wish I could give you more info but yeah I think he is overall just kind of average everywhere across the board I think that's a pretty solid mid TI list I think cre slept on humanoids all right he's better than these two I think maybe I'm EU biased you know maybe one of the na uh people like you know for example Dom might be like humanoids a [ __ ] inter and I you know what I can see it I can see it humanoid has shown that he can go toe-to-toe with other Internationals with these players above I just don't think these two can Jensen more so in times very past but yeah yeah maybe my I feel like I don't have as much to say about the LCS players as I do others cuz LCS I think I watch about 60% of the league the problem was the games went on so late that when I was watching the games bro my brain was off that the the the most surprising thing about paay was when he joined the league was he was breaking records as a rookie you know like most kills all these Penta kills Jinx and zeri he was insane in his debut year and especially considering he was replacing ruler now things have kind of faded down a bit you know and the dust is settled and he looks all right regular season was good don't get me wrong but to me pays I'm going to put him in a tier I think he has shown all of last year that he is an S8 carrier on the world but uh yeah Pace this year he's shown countless times in Lane face where he's just kind of dropped the ball uh overstepped got punished quite easily his team fighting however I still think his team fighting is pretty good he is a bit of a hyper carry Merchant in that sense you know ailos and zeri and I feel like what they what they tended to do was the way he works I think sometimes pays is if he loses a game or when a series drags on he'll always default zerion ailos which is quite reliable for some you don't count last year for some you do I think I count last year if the sample size is big enough and I don't count last year if the sample size was quite small for example caps ran MSI down last year will I count it no he had a [ __ ] [ __ ] meta read he was trying to play northless mid which also baited Faker and he misplayed a game or two here in Lane phase against geni however if you look at peses last year he will play Zer neilios every game when he needs to play hyper carries and he'll ask his support to lock in Lulu and there's a there's a handful of that [ __ ] you know what I'm saying thing so I feel like I discredit things that happened rarely and I credit things that happen a lot anyway paays yeah overall weaker point of geni I think lens is actually pretty good I've seen the only other tier list I've seen was was monoculus and lens was in B I think lens is a solid player the only thing that sucks sometimes with tier lists is you can't contextualize like for example how vocal a player is or how much they provide or how much they're sacrificing so others can succeed in draft sometimes you can see it from the outside but you can't see it sometimes uh the whole story yeah it's I think it's criminal to put Pace in B tier or any lower I think pace is called insane mechanics good team fighting and he'll play a hyper carry you know I don't think there's anything wrong with that and he'll play some of the best mechanics in the world but you know he he's just had a rough year rough relative to how good he was last year I think that's fine elk and gumay Yushi I think these are the two best ads I'll do them together uh two best ads I I put elk as the best ad in the world I put Gushi right behind him I don't think a lot of people uh rate Gushi high enough which might sound weird I think Gushi is the best player on T1 personally I think when T1 is winning it's Pro it's because of gumay Yushi I also think that the way T1 has been playing recently I'll try and describe this as most possible the way T1 has been playing recently with zus playing these carry top style range tops has hurt gumay Yushi more to make him look worse than he currently is and he's still performing very well zus is playing you know TF top and and V top and all this stuff and he needs more I guess the best way to describe it simply is these pcks need more resources whereas people like Keen will play Cante and they'll play bside zus did play Zack a couple times in those game fives but instantly when you look at for example let's look at uh his his a couple of his games right some of these games he's playing with TF top vain top he's playing with all the [ __ ] that his role in the game is to end the game as least possible I suppose or play the weak side as best possible and I feel like that is a is a is a paino sometimes for measuring how good a player is you know um I mean I don't I don't disagree with the way T1 plays because I get it that you have one of the best carry tops in the world z is definitely underperformed but even if you look at that game five it's funny to say this but gum Yushi is is probably the most reliable player as well on that on that on that T1 roster right now because if you look at that game five from a game POV this is the most pressured T's been under all year who's the one who's performing the best it's it's it's Gushi why because if you if you contextualize what everyone's doing around him Z's got solo killed twice owner has found nothing ker is obviously sitting with him and Faker made the biggest mistake in mid ever to give them Soul point and everything's on Gushi so you can look at the score and be like wow Gushi this game he was one and two wow shs like he did nothing but if you contextualize the game State the only reason that midf fight was even remotely close and T1 having a chance was because Gushi is so strong the only point there at this the only reason there at this point is because Gushi has held the game together in a [ __ ] horrible game State and and found a way to maybe like give them a small chance to win a finals in which his team made so many mistakes so yeah I mean he has to play the fight perfectly to even have a chance right yeah I think gumi's best player on T1 and he's second best ID in the world and I hope people don't underrate him by just contextualizing the numbers of what happened in the finals rather than actually what happened cuz he died here the game's over but yeah the only game reason the game was over was because he he's smurfing yes I'm not going to put actually you know what all right I accidentally put my stream schedule there with Pedro Pedro Pedro but as well put Viper up here as well we'll put him with the we I'm just going to leave him there okay I'm just gonna leave him there on the right okay I'm not saying he's better than Gushi or anything like that or or or Gushi is worse I'm not going to rate him I'm just going to put him in in s tier and just leave him there you know just as like a little spectator I just want him to be there you know it's like inviting him to be like a sub for for for all these teams just let him sit there and just [ __ ] watch Jackie love does Jackie love go in s or a because some people are [ __ ] on Jackie love but I think Jackie love is so [ __ ] good I think that guyy is so good the problem is Jackie love just has his degenerate moments and the problem is he still has them and I love his style I think his style can be subject Sometimes some people like this guy plays too aggressive I don't like the way he plays and I'm sitting there like Jackie I [ __ ] love it and it's not purely on entertainment basis I love the way he like his play style can sometimes get in your head you know at the disrespect and level of confidence he plays with and you can see it sometimes in the in some of our Series where they'll leave open kalista let them first be kalista just play [ __ ] Draven into it you know Jackie doesn't give a [ __ ] I do think Jackie yeah Jack's mechanics are insanely good he just has a unique style to him you know where you know elk will play a aggressive gumu play aggressive gum has like a really strong Lane face reliable you know pace is like this hyper carry like you know Jackie love is going to make sure that something's happening in a lane he will and the problem he has sometimes is when he makes things happen in that lane he can sometimes lose the game for his team right or or not lose game for his team but he can lose the lane I thought that finals was quite interesting the way they picked Draven right you know it was like what did they first pick they first picked Ash wanted to go kalista Ash you can see the confidence from it right I think you can see the confidence from the draft of like we first pick Ash because kalista and varis are open will pick the other AD then blg catch some off guard with slamming kalista varis which actually for some people you know maybe catch some off guard Draven is locked in [ __ ] instantly bro no hesitation just slam it happy to go that matchup and obviously that matchup can be quite annoying but the thing is he will make [ __ ] happen and he will he will he will he will play the lane as needs to be and sometimes too aggressively like this for example like Jackie L slams his Draven it looks great he's playing really aggressive they go for something kind of greedy and then um you know Jackie gets his kill and he'll die and then you know elk pushes out and then he kind of lost a little bit of lead and then he'll keep doing the same thing where he'll just keep going in and you know for example the early stages he'll just keep making it happen keep fighting and it looks good you know but sometimes it can it can really look disgusting and they'll misplay it and then Jackie dies on Draven and the game's lost you know but my main point is he will do what is necessary and sometimes he will he will do what is necessary more than what is necessary if that makes sense I love Jackie I think he's above Pace yeah t sold him that game yeah TI uh Jackie has games where TM kind of sells him I'm sorry if I'm overrating him but I think the two best players makeo aside on three on on top Esports are 369 and Jackie you he's got it all he's got International experience world champion he he has insane mechanics he's got incred aggressive picks he can match lanes that uh people try and draft around to get the push into him in uh his team fighting is overaggressive and that's one of his pain points and it has been for a long time but um to me I like ad carries that'll go in and make it happen and they will go for angles that people are afraid to go with he won't even [ __ ] Flinch and I I I think that's a quality that I I respect a lot about him all right Hans Mama the funny thing to me about about G2 is I love it how they came into the start of the split Hans Sama was playing what was it he was playing like a felios and uh then they dropped it instantly and the reason they did that I think was because you know they were like let's try and expand Champion pools early season ah [ __ ] I don't like ailos I'm not that good at it let's go back to kalista Draven and [ __ ] and whatever we can do to win Lane which is quite funny Hans Sama is a good player Hans Sama is a really good player I think the problem with with G2 sometimes is Yik and Hans are the two people who get axed a lot or not axed ignored you know I get it he's playing Jinx I get it all he has to do is play Team fights well I get it you know he's [ __ ] babysat kind of carried through a little bit and I get he does very silly things like there was team fights at MSI where he should have he should have flashed and you know he could have ended the game or something and instead of Chase it or whatever it was I think he's overall pretty good and he's solid I think he's a strong in carry he his Champion pool's decent he he doesn't really seem to struggle in any real metric other than team fighting sometimes and that's a really detrimental metric to be a bit weaken sometimes especially when how do I describe it a lot of the game state is carried through for him obviously Draven will be banned against him all the time he's got he's a good Draven they have Cog more Brown as well which they might pull out they played a lot of Lane swaps G2 which Jinx and [ __ ] and they even Lane swapped I think they laned the fos as well in there or something he's not a bad player name BR I think he's like really really high beat Tier solid player overall really good I don't want to blow too much smoke up his ass because like G2 I think a lot of their success comes from Mickey and caps personally I think Mickey and caps are the cor of G2 for me yike is like this mechanical Maniac that follows through and and Hans Sama he does his job really well I think he's a very good Baseline of of AD carries at the International Event and this is the thing that I want to say I just want to reiterate this again because like I said with these tier lists the annoying thing is I have to put people you know in B tier and in C tier and it looks bad relative but there's only eight players I have you know at Worlds there's 16 and so B tier and CER from third and fourth seeds becomes a lot easier I feel like it it it hurts me a bit to put them like this but it is what it is they're they're strong players hands some are strong player I'm also my follow-up take here is I think Noah is in the same tier as Hans the reason I say that is because sometimes to me Hans Sama rarely has games in my opinion where the game is decided by him you know whereas I feel like Noah is always in that situation where the game is lost or won by Noah and when fnatic wins games it's because of Noah and Jun and when fnatic loses it's because Noah and Jun didn't carry and the pressure that Noah has is a lot higher so it's much more noticeable when Noah underperforms because they lose and it looks like he's the reason they lose but he's the only reason they win as well whereas Hans Sama if he's behind you know it's people look at caps and look at Yik and look at Mickey and I feel like that means that Noah gets a lot more Flack than he deserves so I personally want to put Noah in B tier I think they're on similar kind of levels and Noah's mechanics are insanely good Noah has really good you know in that game five versus BDS he pulled out asreal which I thought was really weird especially asreal North Lane uh it proved me wrong and the only reason the Fanatics here is because of their bot Lane so yeah I I I actually maybe some people would put Noah in C tier I think Noah's B tier to me I think Hans Sama is still the better player but I think they're quite close in skill level that I don't think there's a tier deide them the both of them but yeah I'm a big fan of Noah I think he's good all right masu and yon I think masu is the worst 8 of the tournament and like I said a lot of time when it comes to LCS players I didn't watch the whole league I guess the best way to do this is this right I didn't watch the whole league so maybe I'm missing context the regular season stuff I think I watched most of the playoffs almost all of them uh to me masu Lane face with busio is um it's kind of bad his Lane face is just really bad they can't play kalista Lanes they can't play Lucian they're he basically just picks varis kind of just sits there I don't want to I don't want to Flame him I'm not here to Flame I'm just saying you know he's a rookie he's brand new you know give him time let him cook but uh yeah I don't think there's much to say I I think this team is a heavy topside play if they win it's through tops side if they lose it's because topside lost I don't know I personally was a a bit of a yon hater last year I thought yon and and and APPA on that TL roster were like the sole reason they were losing you know I thought if they had better carries this team would be a lot stronger and then when it coming coming into this year people ask me you know they're getting and and impact are they going to be stronger La I thought they were going to be trash and I openly said I said I think apaa and yon are just bad carries and every time I watch these people on midwave they just die and it's like some basic fundamental mistakes are missing uh some fundamentals missing and they just look like unreliable unreliable liabilities so I thought they'll be worse and they proved me wrong they won the split and yon actually looked pretty damn good his Lane phase was strong he wasn't getting C out too much was he like this incredibly shining star no but I don't think he was ever too much of a liability as he was last year yeah him and core seem to be working well together so I'm I don't think I have any big problems with yon I kind of want to do this but I'm going to keep it like that I do think Noah and Hans are better even though I'm saying that he's gotten better yon to me last year yon almost like this but uh I'm going to keep it like that I'm I feel like I'm quite EU biased aren't I maybe I'm quite EU biased I think there's a lot of arguments for yon's improvement but NRG are eu's fathers suck my [ __ ] uh we we'll leave it at that you put impact over BB you're not EU biased yeah true actually bro I think impact so good impact is so good I think oh God here we go again micke X over carer let's start off with strong takes I think Jun is [ __ ] insane I think he's the best player on fanatic I'm going to put him in a tier I'm not going to put him in s but I think Jun is one of the best supports of the tournament I feel like the reason I'm putting doing Jun first is I think people might put Jun here or here because hean fanatic and ftic are the sh and cheet from Europe and they came sh and play and actually you know I'll put El in LPL first SE first and L no I think Jun is insanely good I actually saw Jun after they lost the finals I saw him after they lost the finals uh sitting outside looking at a fan sign and uh I was like are you okay he's like yeah I lost and I disappointed myself and everyone and he kind just kind of sat there like sad for for a long time he was really hot on himself even though they lost that finals he's very self-critical player yeah I think again if there's if I had choose between Noah and Jun Jun is for sure the better part of that bot Lane and the best player on the team I think the the funny thing to me that the only inside drama we get sometimes or inside Insight we get is uh scrims right and you know obviously we can't watch scrims but I remember when irrelevant was here he was like Jun like that guy is Korean Korean you know he's not fake Korean I was like what the [ __ ] do you mean by that he's like that guy's a real Korean let's hope I hope he shows up on the international stage I hope shows up because his uh his his chample mechanics are are really top tier all right lens lens lens lens lens lens it's funny cuz I remember the last thing I watched was that voice com video where lens in game five said I'll go any and then chovy was like please don't go any and the coach was like No And Lenz was like yeah I'll go any yeah I mean gen's weakness is their Bots side right but lens do you count short calling as tier list you know I think you don't most cases and if it's just the reason no it's why because it's it's kind of unquantifiable as as an analyst or reviewer right it's not a it's not something that's a known quantity so as a player he's quite difficult actually shot call tier list it's an overall package obviously I'm thinking between s and a if I remember a lot of things about Leen it's he's a northless main he will play range supports he when he plays range supports for Pace he does look kind of invisible but his range support play is good he just doesn't have as much impact on the map as when he plays like northless but then I compare it to someone like Delight you know and when Delight plays northless in some of their Hammer life series The Stark difference for example of northless in this series versus like lens's northless sometimes is quite crazy he him and the light are the two things that that shines me when it comes to Nautilus what else do I think about lens I think he's a downgrade from light personally because I feel like gen's team fights they looked a lot more Snappy and and decisive when um when it had the light now it looks a little bit not all over the place you know but Kumi Kuma he's solid he won't counter pick you in win Lane super hard he won't have insane Rams or you know but I think he's super veteran super big voice and he's kind of like the moo of the lck you know to me he's a bit of a moo in a sense just overall really solid so I think he's like high AER he's kind of invisible sometimes not in the sense that he does nothing but in the sense that I mean this roster has chovi Canyon right this is Keen this to this game is this team is run through topside this this team is run through topside Jun same TI lensia I don't care I don't care what you want to say you can say proo I don't care about any of these arguments about 10th Place lck Jun quangong freaks I honestly I don't care obviously if you did this tier list last year spring in the lck people be like what the [ __ ] you're crazy but yeah I I think Jones has had one of the most insane years ever for like um LC supports Kean was 10th once true Keane was 10th quite recently wasn't he he was 10th on afria 2020 or some [ __ ] wasn't he afria 21 all right on uh to me best sport in the world most complete support insane engaged player sometimes he gets C warding which is like sometime like the most degenerate thing I could I could say about him uh he gets caught a lot sometimes but most Complete Care probably the best engaged support right now at the tournament his play through blg and the play the way he plays with Shun is is is perfect his timers are perfect similar to shun his knowledge of just playing through bot for bot with bot for bot Dives to get bot ahead and play like the map is is incredible he can play range supports he can play Nico support he can play kalista support orange support I mean look at his champion pool in the finals right it's not like he's an engage support Andy he's he's come a long way you know uh I feel like obviously it was him and missing last year jdg blg missing like overshine them they were both like these rakan Mains I I feel like the quality that separates players at the top from players who are the best is you can have players who win regions and like are top four in the world but then you can have players who will just pick anything that is necessary to win the game right Canyon's a good example he'll pick khazix in that game he'll pick Kane in that game for example this one where you know I know they lost the game but the idea of playing kalista there and denying varus kalista love it into into them to stop getting in the pushing Lane they obviously play Draven and one anyway you know Barrel's another good example of someone who just pick whatever the [ __ ] they need to like he'll just play Zyra one game this isn't Champions that they play often this is just whatever is needed to be played I will do it I'm a big fan of of on I think he doesn't really have any missing piece sometimes you know uh he does get caught warding sometimes though if I can remember the top of my head from watching him this year he sometimes goes by himself and kind of autopilots moo moo moo moo my man the surprising thing to me about moo is like he's still going and like last year I actually thought towards the end of last year when they were playing like the regional Gauntlet and it was like the uzi moo EDG roster I thought Mako was trash like I thought he was dog [ __ ] you think back to EDG last year him and Uzi bro in some of those the regional playoff best of Fes moo was a liability like he was running it the split was fine yeah but the regional finals were disgusting like that was [ __ ] vile and then he comes into this year on on on uh on top and he's really good yeah you know what surprises me sometimes is I have this this notion in my head when I watch players who have been playing for so long like Mo has been playing for so long that I feel like their mechanics get worse and so they're less how do I describe this they're less willing or less not as good as playing as like range supports you know so like ash support for example is a good example where I feel like you know the young ons are crazy good at Ash support because they're like mechanically Lane gifted whereas the old on are playing engaged supports like yeah it's fine we'll lose Lane but Mako still he's got it he's got it he's still got those range supports he's been around for a hell of a long time and he's still got those range supports unlock and yeah his Ash in the final was great his Ash overall is great his Nami is really insanely good MO is a [ __ ] insane Nami um and he he fits Jackie love really well they're both they're moo I feel like Jackie love has instilled the the Jacky love mentality into moo the degeneracy you know and they play the lane well together the problem I'm having with moo is does he go here or here because honestly I think moo is is is basically almost Justice complete I'm going to put moo in s TI I think every time I watch moo and Jackie love I think their Lane face is is quite strong I think moo maybe in some people's minds I feel like when people see moo in the international stage okay so there's viewers in League that only tune in to international events and they don't watch regular season and they don't watch LPL and stuff like that and when maker rocks out to the international everyone be like oh this old washed guys here and I think he'll surprise a lot of people um it feels weird Okay so again I have issues with tier list because it feels weird to put on in the same tier list as moo but it also feels weird to put on in the same tier list as Jun but I think June is very good a part of me wants to push everyone down a little bit because I think on is a standout above moo but I want to put Jun high up so I'm going to put Jun down one and then put moo down one and keep it like this because otherwise it feels very odd to have it looking like this you know there we go that's better is that better uh I want I want I want make in a separate tier to to Jun but I don't want make in the same tier as on and that's why I hate tier list so I'm just going to do that suck my [ __ ] all right anyway yeah these are the these These are the supports so far on best sport in the world easily moo incredibly impressive he's got on attributes as well top orts are a lot less consistent in being able to execute through bot mat matchups that are winning with jungle and I think that stems from all three of them but I do think top orts bot Lane including moo gets sold out a lot because of TN I wonder what top Esports would look like if you swapped junglers from blg and top would Jackie love and Mako be able to pull off the same as what elk and onor doing in the early stages for both advantages with Jun on their team and I think they probably could so that's why I had like this argument in my head where Mako I think could be S TI next to on but I'm going to drop him a here because obviously that is um that's uh that's all the that's all Theory all right let's do uh a couple quick things buio I think we'll put him in like C tier I think buio is I may we put him in B tier I may we'll put him C tier yeah busio and masu again I don't think there's much more to touch on here in isolation not great uh their weak Lane phase sometimes reli liability you know kind of like rookies to International um International stage I also don't think their way of playing like I think a big deal for me when it comes to bot Lane and I think both are held accountable for this sometimes is playing winning bot matchups like um kalista Lanes or any kind of pushing I think I okay how do I describe this any kind of punishing Lane that needs to play for dive not so much push and get advantages because I think busio to me is a good range support player like I think he can he'll probably be able to play things like uh I don't know what range support does he play what's Ash or some [ __ ] or I don't know what what what has he played the split every time I watched him I thought he was like a Lulu a Lulu Ash player or something yeah Karma saraphi niik he Bard he'll play range supports Renata you know absolute range support but when it comes to playing B matchups that you'll see at MSI and you're against these high Tempo teams that stack waves and stuff like that and play with me supports into Dives I don't think that flly Quest bot link can keep up and I also think they'll get they'll get the resource to keep up corejj I think I'm a big fan of corejj uh again another unquantifiable when it comes to coms and stuff it's not hard actually CJ is a really good support really really good I think him and impact to me are like Staples of Team Liquid and I've said that before and I'm a big fan of cjj I would put him next to Jun uh yeah okay I'm going to put cjj next to Jun I'm going to put a gap and then put boio I think cjj is is kind of you know Jun has these flashy mechanics but cjj is super stable and riable K and Micky X listen I'm going to put ker top of a tier I think ker individually incredibly talented support I think the meta for him isn't perfect so he's not s tier and I think people want me to put K and S tier but I'm not going to do it because K is not going into s tier for a few reasons reason number one I've said it before but I think ker is really really flashy and really really impressive when it comes to playing against mid bottom tier teams because his champion pool feels like an ocean in metas that are stale when it's a stale meta ker is very talented at playing of meta Champions to punish mid B bottom tier teams however against top tier teams when the meta is stale and it's northless rakan and Ash is permanently banned against him I'll give you know ker is Ash is Perman banned against him when when he's he's playing you know ashwak Khan or Lulu or northless and this split as well he would play Tom kench and gum Yushi would play Senna and all he would be doing is Tomken just farming you know when The Meta is stale Ker's impact becomes a lot less however when the meta is a lot more free you know and he can play these punishing Bots you know like ranata and he can play Ash support in its open then he is a lot stronger that's to me Cara's biggest quality he's the best range support player in the world and when that is available he is insanely talented but when Ash is permaband and northless is first picked like that H life series I just think ker is there's not much he can do we'll pick Senna and I'll play an an engag support or something I I I just think that on is a better melee support player than ker if it was more range support heavy he would be easily s here on my on my um on my on my on my list on his better engage sport player and and that's the the Difference Maker here and that's why T1 fans I'm sorry and you're probably gonna hate me and I don't want you to hate me for this but just think that the two best players for me on T1 are Faker and Guma zus is struggling Kera The Meta isn't good for him and so I feel like that hits both of them down a little bit to a tier all right Micky X Micky X to me the funny thing about Mickey X is I think Micky X is the core next to caps of a lot of G2 success a lot of it the problem Mick X has is he has games where he [ __ ] runs it down and he looks like a disgusting inter I think I think so I I guess the best way to describe my idea of Micky X is if caps was the best player that the West was sending to compete against the East Mickey X would be second place if that makes sense and I think he's shown it before and I think he's shown it many times at Internationals before that problem with Micky X is he has games like winter finals where he will run the whole game down sometimes like that northless game and it will stick in people's minds a lot and then they'll ignore him playing really well throughout the regular season and then he'll play a northless game and he'll run it down and then everyone will Target mck again and I am not going to discredit the idea that mickeey has had games where he has misplayed a lot gotten caught and he has this he has this style where once he starts inting he does not stop and I wish I could give it to you better in analytical terms to tell you why he is continuously chain inting but maybe there's some kind of thing going on with G2 where if they fall behind and Mickey can't get Vision by himself then the game just becomes more difficult and he gets perac caught I do think Micky X is a really talented player and um meta's pretty good for him uh I think G2 on him a lot and I think he's better than Jun I'll put him at the edge of a tier I think he's next to leens but I don't obviously he's on an S tier support and I'm not doing it I'm not putting him above ker for the memes I apologize last worlds I was wrong I know last worlds I put Mickey over ker and obviously you know turned out t w won the tournament but I want to you to understand that the way these tier lists work is this is what they look like coming into the tournament but when the tournament happens and ends what they look like is a lot different sometimes right that's why I think T1 is a great example of I think Dom said it correctly T1 is great and geni are sometimes great if they don't choke at Internationals because the tournament is longer and they can figure out the patch more and they can refine the patch better over time MSI is shorter and that's why I think EU and LPL teams succeed more more so LPL teams recently because they just keep it up um and and they don't have enough time to figure it out and slow it down yeah I don't think the patch right now is very good for T1 it's not I know there's Gallo Buffs and there's camil Buffs for top uh there's I don't think the patch is good for their jungle support it's not perfect and that's why I think ker is top of a tier and uh it's similar for for for bin for example I don't think the top meta is perfect for bin and I think that isn't a good thing to take into account when doing these tier lists those are my tier lists I'm sorry if I offended any fan bases I hope no one takes a screenshot and looks it without context I hope I gave enough context this was on the Fly and uh I don't think I'm ever going to do this live again because chat was just spamming hurry up get to the point uh I wish maybe I should have spend more time on it tier list or tier lists let's see how they perform in Internationals you can only address Theory so much please do not say you're going to send me death threats for putting your favorite player lower than they should be

Channel: Caedrel

Views: 330,924

Keywords: caedrel, league of legends, lec, streamer, mid, jungle, rumours, offseason, roster, lol, lolesports, lol moments, lol clips, lol streamers, lol shorts, league shorts, twitch clips, vod review, pro play, caedrel stream, caedrel highlights, caedrel clips, caedrel twitch, caedrel reacts, lcs, lck, lpl, gaming, british, pedro, funny moments, accent, caster, lol caster, analyst, pro player, worlds, msi, eulcs, videogames, variety streamer, riot games, twitch, cancelled it, fnatic, fnc, g2, t1, damwon, geng, ig

Id: Nk2-jPiuFMs

Length: 82min 12sec (4932 seconds)

Published: Fri Apr 26 2024