Mormon Church Shaming and Virtue Signaling

well sister as your bishop it's my grave duty to because of your sexual indiscretion we're going to have to excommunicate you what does that mean I can't go to church anymore Oh sister heavens no we were reasonable people sis in fact you should come to church all it means is that while you're at church you can't say any prayers you can't hold any callings you can't really talk at all in class we're gonna have to let all the teachers and most of the people know that you've been excommunicated so that they don't call on you while you're at church you can't protect the sacraments so you know everyone's gonna see that you're not taking the sacrament but we're trying to get it to where you can just hate yourself back into God's loving arms oh thanks bishop of course sister anyway you work on that Reed I'm miracle of forgiveness they'll teach you the right way to hate yourself and then we'll just see you next week thank you come in hey bishop Oh will hey there sister Jensen does just come by to confess time so I got all hopped up on the prescription oxys that I'm addicted to and I told all my kids that I don't love them I never want to see him again they're worthless pieces of crap that's wondering if you could you know get God to forgive me for that or something Oh mr. Jensen we've been over this that's not something you need to come to the bishop for Oh silly me buh-bye now [Music] hey what's up guys ex Morgan here with my spiritual life I've got Jared my husband helping me out and today we're gonna talk about some interesting stuff we are talking about public shaming within the church community in addition to virtue signaling that goes on you know what we're talking about those members that are like look how awesome I am look how many times I go to the temple each week anyway you get the idea so talking about the public shaming that happens within the church your sins are just often on display for everyone even though that's not really technically what happens it's what happens I mean it's pretty much technically what happens they you're not allowed to take the sacrament or so that's a small example even people notice when you're not taking the sacrament and when they see a 15 year old boy not taking the sacrament everyone I wonder what his doing no he jerked off okay so to recap for people who may not have ever been Mormon understand that there are certain sins within the church that the the your leader your bishop will tell you you need to repent of an in order to repent of those sins you will be punished in a way that's unfortunately kind of visible for everyone else to see so for example we have the the twelve and between twelve and eighteen year olds are the ones that pass around the sacrament in the wards the men the young men and for example if one kid does something wrong then he is forbidden from passing the sacrament well everyone in the ward knows if someone who's normally passing the sacrament stops passing the sacrament and then everyone just knows oh he did something he did some kind of sin which of course when it's a fourteen-year-old boy we all know what that is there there are a lot of sins that they'll tell you to stop taking the sacrament for like most bishops even if you drink alcohol that's not even something you're supposed to really come to the bishop about you can just take care of it on your own but it's also important to know that the alternative - that sort of silent public shaming is - just lie yeah which messes you up inside it's right leavin the church then lying is gonna make you feel very guilty and especially if you're passing the sacrament you're like mice like this this bread is not blessed correctly like all these people I'm screwing it up for everyone well not only that I was told that if you pass the sacrament unworthily then all the sins of the congregation are heaped onto you what oh my gosh I don't know if that has any if that's ever been mentioned by an actual authority I'm sure it hasn't but those kind of rumors go around when you're in the the church that you believe is true and everything else is bad and oh my gosh that is so horribly damaging I just want to give a little jeredy - I just lied and I never I never told a bishop about anything which I think was the right move but I don't know I guess lesser of two evils oh man I remember my friend who was having bishop issues to make it less awkward he would just not wear a white shirt because a lot of bishops I don't think it's doctrine but a lot of bishops will say like you hope to wear white shirt in order to be worthy to pass the sacrament so he'd wear a different colored shirt which is you know kind of taboo and Mormonism sometimes but he would wear a different coloured shirt and be like oh well I wore my purple shirt today so I can't pass a sacrament which I don't blame him like it just is a sucky situation it's a nice that's a nice life hack for teenaged Mormon boy's life act don't wear a white shirt unless you got one of those really progressive bishops that's like all that purple shirt you can still pass the sacrament you're screwed oh man I think it just really bothers me in Christianity in general this isn't the only church that offers this kind of recompense for like doing something wrong this kind of recompense that's just so obvious to everyone else like if someone's sitting outside the Bishop's office they're either getting a temple recommend or getting some money or they CIND and it's like you can usually tell which one of the three it is well especially if they sit outside of the Bishop's office consistently yes if they're sitting out there every week then you know oh they're working on a sin or if it's like your brother or something like oh he didn't come home from church with us he's me with the bishop well you know he's sinned and it it's just it's one of those things that if I were to believe in like your sins have to be worked on or whatever I would at least say that this should be a really personal thing but it's not really personal it's just very evident to everyone and it just it just becomes this gossipy mess of like oh did you see who wasn't taking the second man who was leaving like and it's just wrong and I just feel like your spirituality should be very private I don't feel like it should be on display for everyone but it's on display in this church on the positive and the negative right because everyone can see if you're going to the temple a lot or whatever it like those you know anyone will get more into the the other end of it but Mormonism has a weird obsession of sexual sin I like the way that Catholics do confession I think it's something that can be very therapeutic it's kind of implied that just everyone needs to go to confession from what from what I've heard it's just you know had nobody's perfect you got a and and and I think it can be very cathartic for people to talk about ways they think they could improve sure the problem is in Mormonism it's it's almost more bureaucratic it's like a technicality that you have to go through and it's like paperwork for God basically but since they only do that with sexual sins basically for the most part you always know what that person did right it's and it's kind of creepy right like like if a lot of Bishops don't care whether you drink alcohol or not if that's something you can deal with on your own then like it's almost creepy like we only want to hear about the sex stuff that's weird I don't know some people would argue like well like those are the sins that are the worst so that's why you need a bishop to take care of it and I'm like that's just creepy I don't get it well they're very vague they don't have degrees of sexual sin really they're all just second to murder yeah a little can you avoid jerking off guy raping a bunch of folks both second to murder well in that and that's not even an exaggeration this is taught within the Mormon Church that sexual sin is second to murder that is actually taught that's yeah that's extremely damaging and I I think if you asked any reasonable bishop they'd say well no obviously raping a bunch of people is worse than a thirteen-year-old Jack it off but to what extent there's no there's no way to measure you don't I don't know I grown up I was always under the impression that I was just as bad as a rapist and then you had that whole like I'm sinning against the greater light so I'm even worse yeah yeah sinning it gives the greater light meaning that you know when you're a Mormon and you said it's an even bigger deal because you know better someone who doesn't know better maybe they can get away with masturbating specifically when it comes to excommunication this blows my mind right because you have sinned right and in order to fix that sin God is saying that you are being kicked out of the church because that's what excommunicated means your your name is officially removed off the records and to me that is just ridiculous like you're having a hard time a lot of people who get excommunicated yeah they leave whatever but there's a lot of people to get excommunicated and they are very sour and they want to be a part of the church and they feel really bad I feel bad for those people because their way of this is how you have to work through your sin is that you're excommunicated so you can't you can't do anything you can go to church you could sit there and you can listen and that's it you're not allowed to have a calling which first of all that's funny right no no you sinned now you're not allowed to do service for the Lord like oh darn I don't have to plan lessons that's funny but second of all you're not allowed to speak during ass or pray like your sin was so bad that God no longer wants to hear from you that is ridiculous to me and that is just so so so shaming to people that it just it just it makes me really frustrated off anybody with a calling like with teaching or anything like that you have to let them know when somebody's been excommunicated so they could know not to call on them or ask them so pretty everyone has to basically know that you've been excommunicated yeah cuz they're like oh you know this is between you and the bishop and the Lord but it's not because if someone calls on you to pray you have to say don't call on me pretty you have to tell them ahead of time so you don't make a fool yourself in front of everyone but then pretty much everyone needs to know so they don't ask you it's a mess I am NOT a fan of that at all I just I feel like if you believe this is the true church and everything like I understand the concept of like when you sin you have to try to make up for it somehow I don't agree with it but I understand if if that's your line of thinking but how is your way of making up for it not praying so they're allowed to pray outside of church but still it's just it blows my mind like I just do not get it like it makes no sense the other issue we wanted to talk about when it comes to this kind of public shaming is that punishments vary so much from Bishop to Bishop and Ward to ward state to state even I've heard and that is just unfair to kids do the exact same thing and their two bishops punish them differently how is that fair like it just doesn't make sense and it's like oh well the bishops being told by the Spirit of the Lord which kid needs more punishment than the other that's just crazy to me that's a lot of faith to put in your bishop that maybe he's not just really anti-porn you know I had a friend that told me when he was 16 years old his bishop put him through disciplinary council now that is like so serious and they basically held excommunication over this kid's head he's 16 you're not supposed to be able to be excommunicated until you even go through the temple it's ridiculous and they basically told him like that if he didn't start really making some drastic changes that they were gonna excommunicate him and it was just absurd to me because a 16 year old going through something like that it's not even a church standard so for him to go through that it was very traumatic like he felt terrible and oh man it was just a message just was not right at all man any guys cheat on their wives and don't even get a disciplinary council I've heard of that happening before doing it kind of it just varies a little too much I don't yeah I don't usually like for a religion to be centralized all that much but I think maybe one area where it can be centralized is punishment I guess if there has to be punishment I yeah it's hard because then what do you have to map out every sexual sin there could possibly be and figure out where they fall in the spectrum I don't know although just don't make kids come in and tell random strangers what they've done sexually I guess that would fix that would fix the problem that would be much better it's just creepy and gross the more I think about it and I'm just really glad that I actually had sincere leaders that weren't creeps I mean from what I know I guess I don't know maybe they were in closing about the public shaming for now I just feel like your spirituality it should just be between you and God honestly like I don't know I just I don't see the need for a third party I don't see how it helps I just I don't get it because all the all the [Music] like I mean is there ever a good reason to have a third party I'd not when you don't think the church is true so it just doesn't make sense they take a good approach to other sins I can explain they take a good approach to other types of sins like I mean they tell you it's between you and right and I'm not sure it must have been the Puritan movement back in the day that got them so stuck on masturbation if you think that's a sin then pray I guess I don't know and I don't know how to fix that I just don't think it's healthy I don't think it's right to make things so apparent for everyone I obviously I don't think the church is true so it's like you know I'm not gonna propose any solutions yeah we're just gonna move on so now we want to talk about kind of the other end of the spectrum and that's kind of this virtue signaling or this this like just making your holiness like just so obvious and apparent to everyone I mean going to church first of all right I think there's a lot of religions you know it varies so much in the world but I would say that the Mormon religious specifically it's like you were completely judged upon how often you go to church or not it's even a temple recommend question so like you can't go to the temple if you're not you know according to that regularly attending your church meetings right I just think that there's a lot of people that go to church to show everyone else that they're going to church and maybe they're not going for the right reasons now not everyone right like but I'm just saying that I think we get so caught up in what other people are thinking about us and what the judgment that would happen if we didn't show up to church that we almost are going to get less out of it because we're just so busy trying to prove to everyone else how awesome we are you follow me yeah I don't know I don't I don't really have any beef with the church telling you to go to church more often but where they really start sort of trying to signal how virtuous they are is with with tithing is a big one and though they'll give talks about they thought I couldn't afford to pay tithing turn I couldn't afford to not pay time I couldn't afford to not let my kids starve I've seen stories where they'll say it came down to paying rent or paying tithing and they chose to the pay tithing and first off I'm so good I paid my tithing instead of right no that's stupid and then they didn't know what was gonna happen whoa whoa how am I gonna make ends meet and all of a sudden my tax returns come in and it's the exact amount penny my rent and if I hadn't have paid my tithing if you had to pay your tithing one your tax returns would've come in I was gonna happen anyway maybe somebody just stole their tax returns if they didn't pay their tithe if you hadn't paid your tithing you would have your tax returns and your tithing money two months rent oh honey I don't have issue with people wanting to pay tithing but I have issue with people acting like they're gonna pay tithing before they feed their kids or pay their rent that is not smart and guess what God gave you a brain for a reason some of you just don't use it this is usually the part where I say well in the church's defense but there's no defense here really hey Church has so much money no no I'm not even talking about that I'm talking about this is this isn't something that's just like oh it's the members not the church that the church propagates that as recently as two years ago I think they had that talk where they guy glorified paying tithing before feeding your kids oh gosh that makes me sick because guess what that's not how God works I always say warm as the Ariat for saying how God works but that's not how God works the thing that really bothers me - tithing in particular is that the church doesn't need your money God doesn't need your money this church is freaking so rich and you are willing to not feed your kids so that this billion dollar enterprise can have $60 like that's just ridiculous and I know a lot of people they have a really they're very sincere like oh I want to do this because I want to show like God how much I care and stuff it and it's like I get that but you you gotta realize that God would want you to feed your kid right I just feel like if God it's cool and I think he is he would want you to feed your family that's the cool thing to do that's what the cool kids are doing these days what are you cool cats you're up to now a feed our kids now so that changed tithing a little side note it used to be what was it 10 percent of your increase yes it was and only when you could afford it it was 10% of your surplus yeah no to backtrack when tithing was initially like started with the church the way it was implemented was it was you feed your family you take care of your bills and then you have some leftover right you have a hundred dollars left over after paying all of your bills 10% of that goes to the church and then outside of that if you want to donate more you can but now it's turned into this it's ten percent of your income with your gross income well if it's up to interpretation but a lot of people say gross income yes so they'll go and calculate what taxes would have taken out right and then pay tithing on that ah so the last issue and I swear we'll stop talking about tithing the last issue with tithing that I have is the tithing settlement so each year at the end of the year the bishop invites all the families separately like each family individually to come and to say whether or not they have paid tithing they will sit your whole family down then they will ask each member of the family are you a full tithe pay there and all of you are sitting in front of each other so it's a mom and dad there are three kids the bishop will ask every single one of them are you a full-time here and you can say yes or no and you are expected to go to that well it's not even like you can lie about it they they give you basically a receipt that shows the exact dollar amount that that you have paid so as a parent you know you got your kids in front of you and you've got to make sure that you know I don't want to disappoint my kids and as a kid if you have like a job at Burger King or whatever and your parent is gonna sit and they will generally know how much you've made and say let's see no you paid 20 bucks in tiredly right I know you've made more than $200 and it's just awkward when you're sitting in front of your kids like if you felt like you couldn't afford it or whatever like you're sitting in front of your kids you have like you're kind of guilted into saying yes otherwise what are your kids gonna think of you it's just it's just a mess plus with tithing settlement you have to sign up for it by signing up like the bishop will have this like sheet where you can sign up on on the door so you have to write your name on the door like you're your family's name so everyone in the ward sees whose names are on that tithing settlement so if your name's not on there people know that you're like trying to get out of it like that you're not doing it so again it comes back to that virtue signaling thing it's like you can all see how holy each other are and I just don't like that like I think this should be a personal thing if you want to spend money and give it to God I think that should be a personal thing and yet the bishop has to sit you down there's no other sins that the bishop sits you down and asks you outside of a temple recommend if you're following other than tithing he doesn't sit you down at the end of the year and ask if you're following the word of wisdom he doesn't see you down and ask if you're obeying the word the Sabbath keeping it holy he only sits you down and ask you if you've given him the money yeah you bring that chedda that Jesus's money go oh my gosh that concept of like it's not even your money it's God's money he let you keep 90% if I can't earn anything it's not work at all anyway there's no point if it's God's money then there's no point to work Oh another virtue signaling thing now I'll just briefly talk on it it's the come follow me program now we haven't been going to church this year so I don't know how this is landed exactly but my understanding is that the change in the format this year has been that there's certain lessons you're supposed to do ahead of time so that when you're at church they're going to ask you about what did you learn about and it's supposed to be the whole family that they're gonna ask the kids are gonna ask the adults and I imagine that can make some people feel very awkward like especially a kid like if their parents didn't go over the lesson with them that can make that kid feel bad and it's not that kids fault to a minute wait a minute babe they got rid of an hour of church but then gave you a homework yes that's exactly what they did oh that hardly seems worth it oh my gosh no and it's it's you know what the general authorities were so smart they figured this out they said the best conversion comes from inside the home right smart so they said so make them study at home more smart but the thing that bothers me about that is I think that it can make those who maybe don't have time or whatever or had you know you go you got a life you could like a billion things the church expects you to do and then you're supposed to also do your church homework and then if you don't do it I feel like that could make you feel awkward in front of everyone in the class now I haven't been there I don't know if that's the way that it's being presented but that was my understanding of it so sorry if we're getting that wrong another virtuous signaling thing is the ministering which originally used to be called visiting teaching and home teaching and they changed the name to ministering and what that is is basically each member of the ward the adults are assigned to go visit other adults in the ward like buddy system everyone checks in on everyone else or assigned friendships it's your it's exactly that it's your assigned friendship so now the virtuous signaling that happens with this is is that not only do you have an assigned friendship but you have someone who's assigned to ask you if you checked in with your assigned friend it's like a third grade field trip going on here I don't know it's like when they make you pair off in school and you don't have a friend in that class and you're the last one left and they just stick you with the other weird kid or with the teacher or whatever it's like that but they just stick everyone wherever they want but you know you don't get to choose and honestly that one could fit into both categories because if you're not doing your ministering then there are at least two families in your ward that know that you not fulfilling your calling and and plus the you know the best shop and and the elders quorum president whoever else is in charge of knowing mm-hmm yeah they're gonna know that you're not doing it buddy system it's important the holiest of holy ways to virtuous signaled everyone is about your temple attendance because it's not required it's just what the holiest people do it's not that you're told to go to the temple and see your voluntold to go to the temple voluntold I like that I like that makes sense he's gonna kind of fit under sort of the larger category of when you give talks right because it's when people give talks that they do most of their virtue signaling right it's it's people talking about like the blessings of the temple or how you know they were on their last dollar but they gave it to God and it worked out anyway so it's it's a way to to simultaneously fulfill the calling of giving your talk and show people how great you are that's true and and it's kind of it's also just you know people say that they'll work it a lot of those people will work it into conversations where it really doesn't make sense but true Oh bless you yeah not as much of a blessing as going to the temple twice a week like yes yes yes bless me oh it's funny you should bring a blessing so because I have a lot of them probably because I paid my tithing do you remember that guy we're hanging out with a couple weeks ago and he just kept talking about how he takes his son to the temple every single week it just feels like there's no other reason to just like randomly bring that up other than to be like look how awesome I am and it's like if you're awesome that's great but it just feels so braggy and so arrogant to be like oh you're not you're probably not going to the temple every week but I am mind if people talk about it but with him it was just it was like what have you guys been up to like oh you know just working he's like yeah I've just been going to the temple a lot with my kid bringing him mostly the temple yeah you guys been a-been at work how's work it's pretty good with temples pretty great too seriously exactly how the conversation went on there oh no I'm not even kidding he just kept bringing it back to how he goes to the temple a lot which again I'm fine if you like the temple I really liked the temple I still think it's cool like parts of it some of it whatever you know it's boring again I think in Mormonism you you fall into this getting caught up in the details where you're trying so hard to do all these little nuances that are gonna make you really holy and to hide all the bad parts of things that you're doing and you get so caught up in all those little things that you just you can't really worship God real easily or effectively or feel like you're having a good connection right you know yeah what he said whenever jared is silent - one of my responses I think he either agrees with me so much has nothing to add or he disagrees so readily that he can't even fathom what he could say to that I'll be honest I just spaced out I don't know if I fight or not moral of the story today I think that Mormons would have a much better time in their worship if they just tried a little less to worry about what everyone else thought about them and that would be easier to do if their sins weren't put on display for everyone and in addition people weren't checking up on them to make sure that they were following the God God's commandments to check in with your buddy and pay all your money well bishop i guess i won't be coming to tithing settlement next week since oh cistern evans no you still come to tithing settlement because God still gets yes thank you guys so much for watching this video today please if you'd like to support us give this video a thumbs up subscribe to our channel a comment below some of the cringy ways that you virtru signaled while you were a Mormon and we will see you guys in the next video [Music] [Music] [Music]

Channel: My Spiritual Life

Views: 13,209

Rating: 4.7813883 out of 5

Keywords: Mormon, lds, exmormon, ex mormon, ex-mormon, why i left, anti mormon, leaving the mormon church stories, religion, exmo, post mormon, postmormon, vlog, vlogging, my story, spirituality, spiritual, spiritual without religion, issues with lds church, morgan, exmorgan, ex-morgan, jared, funny, comedy, post religious content, infotainment, shame, religious shame, virtue signaling, public shame, public shaming, lds shame, lds shaming, mormon church public shaming, book of mormon, joseph smith

Id: F7m5wqLo0Z4

Length: 30min 54sec (1854 seconds)

Published: Mon Jun 17 2019