Matt Taibbi On Malcolm Gladwell: "He Insinuated I was Racist"

well and speaking of that you were just in Toronto not so long ago at the increasingly famous monk debates they apparently seem to be doing something right and you and Douglas Murray faced off against Michelle Goldberg and um Malcolm Gladwell Malcolm Malcolm Gladwell Malcolm Gladwell and I believe that you and Douglas won the debate by the biggest margin that had ever occurred at the monk debates and actually speaking to an audience that in principle shouldn't have been particularly favorable to your claims right because the monk debate audiences Toronto Ottawa Montreal glitterati such as you know such as we produce in Canada um are equivalent of people who think they're celebrities let's say that might be a good way of thinking about it and the probability that they would be both beholden to and fundamental supporters of the Legacy Media was extremely high and yet by all accounts you moop the floor with um both Michelle and um Malcolm so do you want walk through that a little bit tell everybody what the debate was about first and and tell me your impressions of the whole of the whole Enterprise first of all I had an amazing time it was um it's a great event um I I think anybody who has the opportunity to attend the monk debates should definitely do it uh the the resolution was be it resolved do not trust the mainstream media and so uh Michelle and Malcolm were arguing the Nay portion and uh Douglas and I were arguing the EA portion and you said that we moop the floor with them really Douglas mopped the floor with them and I was kind of there um but the you know he he's he's very impressive uh as an orator and as a stage performer and he was very Qui as a fighter he actually enjoys it and so yeah you you you mess with Douglas at your peril exactly exactly uh but another thing I think that that that really turned the tide with that debate was um kind of the superior attitude I I would say of a couple of the participants Malcolm in particular I I don't have anything in particular against him but I I made the observation at one point that Walter kronite had twice been voted the most trusted person in America in the 70s and 80s and uh Malcolm wouldn't let that go he kept implying that um by saying that I was longing for the days of Jim Crow uh in America and that I had forgotten that when those votes were taken by the way he was wrong about this when those votes were taken that you know lots of people didn't have it so great in America um you know implying that this was the 50s or the 40s when you know women gays and African-Americans had a tough time in the states again people were doing a hell of a lot better on the marital front back then than they are now by a large margin and there were a lot fewer children who were fatherless so you know some things have improved but there's lots of things that haven't improved so we might not want to be too smug and Superior about how well we're doing on the moral front compared to 40 years ago I mean lots of things have changed for the better but it's by no means a universal Panacea let's say and and that's especially true for poor people who are nonetheless on average richer but I would put that at the feet of capital ISM you know rather than of any you know well-meaning government programs or ideology so anyways he he you said he adopted a Meen of superiority on what basis well he he essentially he was calling me a racist for making that OBS observation so um and he went back to it five times and by the fifth time there were actually sort of audible gasps in the in the audience so I think that had something to do with what happened with with the debate well that sort of thing actually doesn't play very well in Canada you know um yeah that the the people who I debated at the monk debates they played that same mistake too they played the racial racial card and racist card yeah and Canadian audiences they don't like that much because that hasn't really been part of our parlament the part of the tenor of our our public discussions not nearly as much as in the US I mean we're trying hard to get there and we might be successful in this country but generally it's not a good strategy so yeah yeah so did you learn did did you think that Goldberg and and uh Gladwell made any points in relationship to why the Legacy Media might still be worthy of support and Trust well the their basic argument was that the procedures of the Legacy Media uh are still good procedures you know factchecking that sort of thing and and we countered with yes those are good things unfortunately they're mostly gone from Legacy Media organizations and that's one of the reasons that you have problems like the Russia gate case where you know one story after the other goes sideways and you you guys don't catch it um and that's I think there's still a failure of vision I still know a lot of people who work in in Legacy Media and there's a a slowness to recognize that audiences no longer I think um really believe what they're reading uh in a lot of these organizations in the New York Times Washington Post they see it as politicized uh not terribly reliable factually and I think that's a shame even as an independent I I think the mainstream media needs to be good right like I I think it's everybody uh everybody benefits when it is um but but they haven't figured out that in order in order to have that respect that they think they deserve that they just can't get this many things wrong and um that's been the that's been the fact the they don't get to be the Legacy Media without maintaining a genuine respectability right exactly [Music] exactly

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Id: BX2PfMxow34

Length: 6min 29sec (389 seconds)

Published: Mon Oct 30 2023