LS | I Was Asked To Evaluate Another Public Coach... | Reacting to Zen Coaching ft. Nemesis

um so as a preface to this video zen coaching asked for this video to be reviewed uh by me and nemesis and then as another preface we are probably going to say things uh that might be you know seemingly negative or something um about the things that are being said or other things that were possible or whatnot last time i tried doing an edu react content video with nemesis the video went up on youtube the comment section was a amy's baking company version of kitchen nightmares where it was just really really really toxic the dislike to like ratio on the video was just a complete cesspool and yeah anyways we're just gonna get into this one and hope that people are more civilized and listen to the intro anyways all right let's go my only say that i probably recognize yeah yeah i mean we just we can just run it let's see what happens yeah coaching coaching is just coaching with uh professional ex-professional players or pro players or stuff like this it's mostly discussion right okay um then it is actually me just berating you with information because you know most of the stuff right um disagree most pro players don't know a lot i don't know your thoughts here but i agree with you first yeah it's just a discussion about the game more than it is anything uh so i mean this is all let's just go past all this stuff there's no way this is gonna he's not wrong though that it generally is a discussion because it's about defining guidelines and then paths uh determining like how they're gonna practice and stuff generally it is a discussion because there's a limited range of things that you can do in one game unless the player is like really messing up uh work right oh my god okay all right oh that happened okay now yeah that's really bad for us um okay so we dropped the word okay yeah so i mean you should just start q level one please tell me they stopped fighting right yeah zoning him off the wave is really good this is really good nice this is all fine you can out of the way okay hold on okay okay do you see the stuff i just want to point out something by the way it really annoys me uh it really annoys me that he's not using a first person view when mouse and camera control is one of the most important things for challenger players that most of them are really bad at they're really bad um so not having a first person view is really bad uh what did you want to say i mean first of all i mean i don't know who got the first plot right but like that can be a point of discussion and second of all why did he ward over the wall what does that word achieve yeah the word doesn't the word doesn't do anything which is kind of weird yes because his bot lane already sees it you don't need a ward to make you feel good that doesn't make any [ __ ] sense that word's actually terrible yes because you have vision of their red side jungle so why do you why do you need this word kha'zix will never gank yeah of course of course of course right right of course all right ready yeah yeah okay okay oh oh this is gonna be better this could be a lot better fraggy please update the title oh my god see some of those you see some of the micro errors uh small small misplacing clicks small misplays and clicks this is fine to do you can't see his clicks what well i mean he can see that he can see the click movements but like uh do you see some of this you see some of the micro errors uh small small misplacing clicks small misplays and clicks this is fine to do this is absolutely fine okay he's on cooldown i think you saw him on cooldown right you can see when he uses a cooldown you can walk here and you can auto auto auto auto like this because you have vision on the ball right um you can give one more auto and you can immediately back off and you go like this and then what ends up happening is once you're here your q is going to be back up and then what you do is you just position yourself in this state here and then you just tell him no he can't touch the wave right um and then you have push priority on wave one so auto this this is good but this doesn't it's not as optimal because it's i want you to practice something by the way because i know that you're not doing it yet but you have to start doing it um i'm already doing it you have to repeat in your head what he so okay the reason i'm telling you this is because you probably think this guy's full of [ __ ] right that's probably just your immediate impression and i know that's your immediate impression you need to repeat what he says in your own head and believe it for a second in order to actually properly analyze it okay because i i mean you you it's it's just like it it's it's a thing like uh people are very dismissive of someone if they don't like the person or if they think that the person's lying or that they're full of [ __ ] they're generally very dismissive and regardless of the accuracy with what the person's saying they might just outright dismiss it so one of the things that you have to get into the habit of is even when you dislike the person repeat their words in your head and then try to believe it as if it was true and then analyze it um yeah i i mean you might not yeah it's it's it's a learned thing it's a learn yeah it's very hard yeah yeah yeah all cause there's no reason to actually click here just keep autoing if you just keep autoing this is really good for you um as long as you can take out one blue minion then there is a plus one red side advantage and that's really good for you then you can just consistently work on trying to attack belt causes resources does that make sense yeah okay do you disagree with any of that because here just just auto like this click doesn't achieve anything this minion isn't going to die immediately to any of the minions you could easily auto this one times two times and velka's just used q once you've auto this minion what ends up happening is you actually already press forward to auto and then you're already inside of this angle once you're in this angle then all you do is you move up like this and then you just tell him [ __ ] you no you can't do anything then you walk here and you threaten q he's now forced on the top side of the map which is really good for you and then let's say for example that he opts to try to uh auto you forg for whatever reason even if you auto him back you trade uh let's say 10 hp for 10 hp it still benefits you even if it's 15 hp on your run because you have the three casters hitting you because what you do then is you just pull the wave up and then these three casters move up like this and then you can play the lane inside of this really defensive pocket down to the south side any disagreements no uh but i have uh one concern like me if playing on the side wouldn't that expose me more to like velcro spoke no all causes on cool now i mean if i'm bell cause and this is my sequence ori move in me move up i'll use different color find belcause and ori moves in i move up and then i have buffer because i have minions i mean i think she's an idiot if she tries to trade with me i have a hard time following what he's saying because for me it's just tons of information but it doesn't do anything i don't know well i mean i i think it's wrong i think what he's saying here about worry is wrong i'm happy with that sequence playing out as velka's just because i move up i mean i'm not unhappy like what i have buffer and you don't what like he's he's saying that the way she's clicking is wrong but i feel like he consistently miss the marks where she clicks because she draws the line like not where she clicks yeah you have to draw the line on her face because her face tells you where she clicked yeah yeah i agree right okay so you're like okay when he's on cool though okay when he's on cooldown yes we don't want to just pull like now as we're talking he's on cooldown there's no there's no spell up right but once he's off of cooldown on the way when the wave is pulled up that's when you take defensive pockets against him that's fine for you to do because then the thing is it's a lot easier to take defensive pockets around them if these minions are pulled up okay you see what i'm saying yeah okay do do is any disagreements about any of that uh no uh i i just thought that since i was playing against focus i mainly like i had to position myself before behind the minions that way he wouldn't hit me with the cue you can you do you do but i'm telling you to do it afterwards right okay yeah afterwards so how does he want to pull the minions up is there like some magic trick that i don't understand i mean the other thing for me is getting getting getting a lane position against bell cause is less important than getting these three minions out of the way because he's already behind on vilca's it doesn't make sense what are you saying hp doesn't do much in this lane uh yeah yes yes yeah so he's trying to talk about wave state and he's trying to talk about positioning against fel cause but he's never once mentioned getting these minions dead immediately yes i don't know because right now you can do whatever you want you have absolutely free reign to just tell him you know there's nothing you can do to me in the the right near this line this click doesn't achieve anything this click doesn't achieve anything twitch shot saying he did he said it's the first thing or he said it's the first thing in the lane is like layering the minions right he said to auto the melee more but then he said to move into velcas and then play pockets and all this other stuff but it should be the utmost priority to not mention any of that and just prioritize the minions i agree no you you don't do both simultaneously because as orianna you you you don't ever move into him you just move back and only prioritize the minions there's no reason to move in because you have no buffer anyways just auto just auto cue he should be he should be hit this is so weird you should just auto queue if you just hit him with q you end up thinning this minion out you end up autoing this you end up hitting him as well or you can auto him i mean whatever right you can even auto him absolutely fine to do that you can play resource management against him right so you can give up your hp for all his mana it's not like he can do anything but it doesn't make sense as to why we're so um we are we're literally we're behind in tempo inside of mid lane while we had first response in first action inside of mid lane while simultaneously retaining an hp advantage against him now what i'm assuming is are you nervous against rogen uh no no i think i wasn't nervous okay no right but but you see that these micro movements are gonna hold you back right yeah yeah i think i was playing way too passive it's way too bad stuff it's way too passive you should just be destroying this guy right it's way too passive early on um and so you know this isn't this isn't good right um this cue is uh have you seen dopa what what um this q is uh what's wrong with the queue he has to do it wait wait the the q makes the lane winning because froggins messed up what you know this is what this isn't good right um this queue is uh uh have you seen dopa uh yeah you've seen that you've seen dopa dopa doesn't do that okay so he just doesn't do that dopa doesn't dopa doesn't ridiculate the wave like this okay i mean that's okay that's not good that that's not good uh this is really bad this should this okay so if you are going to click back either you should have done that or you should have spaced these minions hp to do he should have uh well i mean i'm pretty sure here you can just cue the back lane he didn't even mention it um so when he comes back like you've put yourself on cooldown your cooldown is now six seconds this wave pulls up and now froggen has tempo to attack this wave meaning that if you do something like this and you end up blowing all your spells on the second wave frogging gets level two if frogging gets level two then what ends up happening is depending on the uh type of the jungler you know your versus or how the jungler ends up routing against you he can get certain bounce backs that don't actually that shouldn't benefit you that shouldn't actually happen um relative to first response and first action lane okay we're losing temp we're losing the push out on a player who shouldn't be getting the push out on us it's like this especially when he has q start right if he ha if you have the w start sure maybe we don't respond because w is obnoxious right but with q we can respond uh but this should be an auto you should have already should have auto this once actually out of this twice and then immediately queued right through here um yeah yeah the downside is positioning to queue the whole minion is is kind of awkward now because i don't think that orianna's range is there's no way that orange range is that long um but regardless it can be set a lot cleaner had you done the uh the the previous maneuver okay you have any questions oh sorry that the the my cut off yeah okay oh yeah any any questions uh how do i make it so it's only you how can i why is it why do i see kha'zix oh it's because he's gonna work okay yeah okay okay there you go oh i mean q q is back up what are we doing yeah what the [ __ ] is this what are you doing is he doing something wrong i don't get it i don't get it either why are you not telling him he should he should just auto this minion and then wait for these projectiles and then q because the second wave's already here these three advance forward they're buffer i mean he can't belcoz can't queue here i mean he's playing right what velka's can't kill he can't do this he can't do this he can't do this supposed to stay here wait for projectiles hit this minion he's supposed to auto this minion and then cue it second wave's right here bounce collides here buffer here take the two crash two pull three because control mirror and bell cause fell behind early what why are you not telling him this is not your lane yeah i feel like i should have more laying dominance but you should he's on cooldown you have queue up you have two minions that you can take you you're actually winning the lane right now because of the hp of these three casters you can just stand here and tell him hey you can't play this lane and force him down here make him make him play back doesn't just stand doesn't do anything doesn't achieve anything velcoz moves back none of these minions die you're achieving nothing it's a non-sequence tell him to auto this minion what are you doing tell him to auto this minion stop moving in for no [ __ ] reason what just the lane is uh it's the korean uh word i love to say i'll just swap so there there's nothing orianna can do because the it uh it's a surety what's gonna happen with the minions so she should just play to the minions she should play to the thing bell cause can't control she tries to move in at him on either angle doesn't it's a non-factor because there's no minions that are low enough if this minion was really low on hp something like this matters if orianna had way more hp or way more mana or like way more ability to threaten damage or something like that and belkoz can blunder a spacing or something sure but all that's gonna happen is orianna's just gonna take a cue to the face and none of the other sequences are going to change you got anything to add all right just go i mean yeah i just right here you know control four okay or whatever your emotes at you know it's different for every player but yeah anyways uh i mean this is just strange the two again these clicks don't make any sense you could have bottled this twice and then you could have cued the whole thing and now we set it right now my wave will be all the way all the way down there yeah yeah the downside is that the next wave is uh is going to come and you're not going to have 2w but you will because it's only six seconds right so that's don't go w level um auto yeah this is this is fine to do uh here you should just you should just chase him you should just move in you should just go you don't care about hp you don't care about your damage just go and cue auto auto auto auto and then force froggen back here this guy should be like this much hp he's on cooldown he shouldn't be allowed to play the lane ever he should never be allowed to play the lane he should miss xp on this minion most likely and this minion he shouldn't be able to get either if you just walk down like this that's so wrong by the way you lose straight if you do that dragon legit wins that auto yeah it makes no sense yeah and you're wasting time you're not you're never gonna achieve number two because the feeling you lose the chase you should just move if he autos then it stops them yeah yeah of course you should just go make sure you don't care about hp you don't care about your damage right and these are just frost auto auto auto auto and then force froggen back here this guy should be like this much hp he's on cooldown he shouldn't be allowed to play the lane ever he should never be allowed to play the lane he should miss xp on this minion most likely and this minion he shouldn't be able to get either if you just walk down like this q auto auto auto auto force him back here tell him no and then just get level two once you're level two stan correct play is moving here try to get auto try to q and then pull right stay in the middle yep that way you don't draw minion aggro if you do you just pull the minions further into yours you're still inside of your minions and now he's between a rock and a hard place he loses a little bit of resource right over here and stand here is because kha'zix can't be here on the right side because kha'zix started on the right hand side meaning kha'zix's left side worst case scenario you know you have a ward so you obviously just see him so there's no way that you should ever get ganked so then you just stand here and you're just you're just happy and then frogging can't touch the waves you know what you know what i also was i remember now like why i was playing so conservative because i had no tp and usually when i have tp i just like to pretty much straight right right right yes you do wow i just i just realized that froggen doesn't have tp oh my god it could have just skull crushed him oh he's not even playing to do that though oh yes and that's absolutely fine but that's that's a feeling that's not fact right you you feel safer you feel like you can expand resources because you have this get out of jail free card but when you verse have you played have you played against faker or for uh doing b or anybody on stage ever i don't know how they land no no okay who's the best player you've played against in lane who's the best player i play against in lane have you played against any like top ex like have you talked have you played against any like uh chinese or korean midlands you're going to you're going to get absolutely demolished against really really really good mid-laners that's not true confidence that's that's not true that are like like i'm talking like top korean pro players that's not true mo a lot of a lot of top korean pro players aren't very good at laning they just they play really really safe and they handshake a lot they're not necessarily good at laning it's like it's really weird that that statement would ever be made because laning is actually where they're pretty weak at and where they're really abusable which is why there's not a lot of standouts in the lck if you guys ever notice middle of the pack to bottom of the pack in lck is almost always the same and the players who are always on top are usually exceptional at getting micro edges chobi showmaker khan back in the day right players that are actually like they seem like they're playing lane but the majority of them don't really play lane they play handshake it's it's a really big point of weakness that i know that i when i was casting lck for two years used to always talk about and it's been one of my main gripes but also the notion that high mmr korean solo queue players play lane well is also not true generally what they'll do is they'll play very abusively relative to solo queue it's really weird i don't know i mean he's right like faker would beat him but it's just such a weird comment to make it's just so it's i don't know anyway you have anything dad yeah the comment is forced and weird okay yeah right you will get demolished because it's these micro aspects in their game play that def decipher them from average pro player to like a superstar pro player right i'm just letting you know that if you can refine these things that you will get a lot better as a player right and so because you haven't played against anyone who is super super insane at these micro movements that you're going to continue to struggle um it's like uh it's it's what's a good example um it's like it's like chess you play chess no okay oh but it doesn't matter you have to play chess for this analogy it's like when you play chess with like your or it's like it's like uh what sport do you play do you play any sports or have you played any sports in the past i i played so i played soccer before okay perfect let's say you're playing football soccer okay um so you're necessarily playing football and um you're playing with your like you know your there's a difference with you competing against your average sunday league versus when you end up going into a semi-professional or a professional pitch there's a big difference right yeah and so for the player who there could be two different players one player could be consistently competing against professionals and the other person could be competing against amateurs in a sunday league neither both of them could be the same skill level but the one that's competing at the higher better players is getting punished more there for learning more and the second person who's competing in their sunday league is going to consistently have issues growing as a player you see what i'm saying it's going to pause by the way because twitch chat i just want to point out by the way twitch chat this guy has more experience coaching high mmr players and actually coaching laning phase and the game than almost anyone you see in teams so let me get an image that might help you understand what i'm referencing you know you know uh you know this you know this yeah yeah we're here okay now i've always said that i think he's very useful for lower mmr and uh mmr players because at least he gets you thinking about these types of things regardless of the accuracy of them right he opens you up to concepts about like you know playing with lots of variables and other stuff i mean we're gonna we're gonna get through more of the video right but all that i'm trying to talk about right now is that people don't realize that no one has public content okay and this has been a major uh like what is it called uh what is it when you're on a boat flare right uh it's a major like i i've been trying to like flare signal that this is a thing there's no content for most people that you can't go and see you know and i think that's interesting because of the amount of credit or lack of credit it goes both ways that some people in the scene can end up getting so all i'm trying to say is that this person has been around for years this person has tons of content with players of all different mmr ranges that is a lot more than almost 99.9999999 of people can say for coaching if i got v2 does have public content a year and a half ago when me and max opened up the public discord and we wanted to have endorsed coaches we went through over 100 plus people the only person and this is when vigor v2 was still unknown the only person that we actually selected that could actually be an endorsed coach was actually viagra v2 this was prior to him becoming known i don't think that's a coincidence uh he then went on to join fnatic removed from fnatic went on to join tsm left tsm went on to join cloud9 the only other person is max max lived with me for two and a half years max was a challenger na player that came to korea and was stuck in d3d4 and then max eventually started coaching and coaching lots of higher mmr players and doing duo coaching stuff with me and lots of other stuff and then he grinded coaching and lots of other stuff and then max partook and coaching with korean players and laning against korean players and multi-accounting uh not multi-accounting uh like he would play every lane and all this other stuff that i think is really important anyways are you ready to resume uh uh your mind cut off at the end oh sorry yeah what i'm saying is a sunday league player is going to have issues growing because he's still versus sunday league players is what i'm trying to say right um so refinement of these things is really really important anyways um so go we went off on a bit of a tangent so my bad there but you just walk up and you auto him and then you just chase him down okay okay any any questions like this could have been auto i don't know if you have many block there so maybe no so yeah so okay so yeah i have a question you might say it's like i have to have a plan for every movement that i'm making like every little decision that i'm doing because it matters it matters yeah i know it matters a lot especially if like i know when i play against ariana that i have to play on her cooldowns like let's say you use a ball that's my window to actually do stuff to her okay so i'll i'll give you an example i'll actually give an example froggins on cooldown right now all right walk here and if you give him a q and give him an auto down what ends up happening is now you have influence on the way you can now stack this wave in coming with the next third wave if you stack wave two and three you can crash two and three and then you can just recall off that if you end up recalling off that four and five will turn into you over here in this state of the lane and then you have like you can go you can go amped home right you can go antone you can go dark seal you can go uh [ __ ] cull you know if you're really feeling it um you know what i mean you can do a lot of things at that point right um if you just have such a good length state and then froggen can't actually do anything right and then once wave four and five is here then you just level the wave against him right you just play mono for mono and you and you try to make you try to get lane states where you can continue to play inside of this sweet spot that allows lilia to consistently try to pressure um you know why did frogging go cleanse by the way oh it's causality um against you yeah okay does that make sense got it yeah yeah it makes a lot of sense yeah um so you do have to have a plan for every little thing and this is what i think this is not possible what he's saying right because he's going to resist cheater yeah w crushes the wave last hits all the waves without us and only q then the next wave comes double double use it and here's minion demo you can't pull four or five it's wrong i wasn't even gonna suggest cheater because of the dynamic of the matchup but also he doesn't i mean he doesn't have ads so this this whole situation transpires with you just actually walking properly there there's a few champions in the game you guys can't cheater yasuo is one of them always one of them uh yonei is one of them is one of them zedd's no you can you can do it to that i've done it to zed i don't know never works for me um actually to be fair to be fair the only time i do it to that is as alway and you know how broken her wave clear is yeah um so maybe irelia yeah you can't you can't you can't do it to aurelia um nasus can resist it we tested that on stream um tristana can't be cheated against garen can't be cheated against um no renekton can be cheated against uh talon can if he messes up uh no set can set ken he's too slow there there's a couple of champs yeah so anyways tldr there's some champions that you can't reliably cheater against unless they really play wrong yeah malzahar you can't cheat her against yeah malzahar you can't um all right let's all right let's go inside of the lane right um anyway so yeah this this is all really great and now now it's a little bit a little bit odd i don't entirely know what your plan is for the lane um i i think you should just be autoing this one yeah and then this q is actually not very good i think this q is pretty bad uh and the reason this q is bad is because froggen has no minions to actually last hit so meaning froggen's attention is all right what in this this q um i i think you should just be autoing this one yeah and then this q is absolutely not very good i think this q is pretty bad wait isn't this q about to just collide into velkas i think not i mean just play the clip and see i mean he paused it it's [ __ ] weird so meaning froggen's attention is obviously going to be clicking back as he sees the as he sees the projectile coming out but if you just wait for this minion to get low it will eventually he can't dodge it and then you throw out the queue it's absolutely fine i think you can instead because now this will miss if you miss then it's not effective no you tell the ball to go here no no the way he casted it he did it way too early i think he can dodge it really the problem yeah i think the problem with what he's saying is that froggen uh that he shouldn't keep because froggen has uh no minions the last hits that's technically not true he shouldn't queue because he should hold it so when froggen gets in range so he gets wq off okay right which is what he's talking about which is what he's talking about yeah but then why is it about minion not being lost i think that has nothing to do with it this is one of those weird things i really don't think the cue can be dodged i think it does get watched am i thinking velka's is a little bit thicker than he is am i no i think i think he already like cast like i don't know where right now it will hit only if he's locked in he's locked in motion yeah he has to yes he can cancel it i think no i think by the time this it's closed it's close like i don't know i think w will hit i'm not sure if he will hit i think if you if you dance it um or you wiggle it to when he clicks in and then you immediately queue it hits as long as the ball isn't uh awaiting your command do you know what i mean yeah but i don't know it's all right yeah anyways it's it's super absolutely not very good i think this queue is pretty bad yeah fudge said it hits two one get [ __ ] loser uh and the reason this queue is bad is because froggen has no minions to actually last hit so meaning froggen's attention is obviously going to be clicking back as he sees the as he sees the projectile coming out but if you just wait for this minion to get low which it will eventually then and then you throw out the queue it's absolutely fine to do that you should be doing that instead because now this will miss if you miss then it's not effective does that make sense okay try to find yopo and look it up look at a look at a uh a trade that dopa does where he does something like this that's really bad that is portion spot that's really bad to say it's really really really bad yeah suggesting what one other player does in in a scenario that's completely different than this one yes yes yes yes rather than teaching how to think to juggle all the variables happening in real time and then come up with answers in real time that is a awful awful suggestion yes because the person won't learn why you won't find one that easily if you do it's a misplay and if you do it against a really good mid laner he'll most likely just dodge it right but if this minion goes low froggen has to attack you just go and then you know everyone's happy you don't even have to really shove this wave i think you can just keep the wave in the center right um because if you do want to look to recall on wave three if you have a tempo advantage then you want to keep the wave in the center so the wave doesn't end up crashing on this tower i think that was my my goal for that for that laney phase show us the queue find that that lenny phase will most likely go even but each but it shouldn't be that way no it shouldn't be that way it shouldn't be this way yeah you should win and you see it now right you see as you play it you see how you analyze it that you should actually just win the game against him he's a pro player right you're playing against the pro player he's not he's not some random person i mean you know so you can you can do these things if you just you know consistently are 10 gifted subs but i mean he didn't turn fast enough but the ball didn't go to where i told him to send it and it still hit all right okay that's fine i'm just meaning all right let's go or by the way yeah why is he saying that why is he saying that vegas is a losing matchup versus horry maybe because he saw you played at worlds there it is i think it's easier for rihanna to play i don't think it's a winning matchup i just squeeze that one in the other thing that's really weird is he's belittling the uh idea of a pro player right because right now he's saying that he's a pro player so you can do these things right as if to suggest he can get away with honest gameplay because the person's a pro at least that's my interpretation of it right but it's also kind of weird because just a few minutes ago he's saying that pro players are like glorified so i think that's really you're sending different messages did he just say the opposite wait let me listen again wait no right you see as you play you see how you analyze it that you should actually just win the game against him he's a pro player right you're playing against the pro player he's not he's not some random person i mean you know so you can you can do these things if you just you know consistently are he sends two messages with the same sentence one is that you're playing against a pro player not a random person but then on the same in the same hand he's saying that you can get away with these things what what is going on yep that's such a weird sentence yeah but yeah he's encouraging him but just i don't know man i don't know i don't interpret it as encouragement very nitty like nitty-gritty what's your with your mechanics um anyways yeah so he's on cool he's off a cool down he just queued yep great now you can walk back in you don't have to queue like this you can just auto you can just stand here you can stand here and auto auto walk up uh and then uh you can lock the you can lock the third wave with the second wave somewhere around here and then what you do is you want to now decide then you have a very important decision so obviously let's just recap this real quick all right auto we could have gotten this minion from an auto you auto this you have q available frog is on cooldown you walk up the frog and froggen backs up you then auto this minion slowly this wave ends up locking here and then you have a very important decision what do i do inside of the jungle what is kha'zix's routes what is happening on top lane what is going on inside of the game all right if we look at top lane we see that gragas is in a state where it's not so bad for him right because again where are the minions there are one two three four five six seven seven blues around versus uh how many one two three four five six seven rights but the proximity is in a state where i think that the wave should just come into gragas because of the hp of the blue minions versus the red minions and so if you know that the wave state up in top lane is relatively fine um then we can assume that kha'zix will just end up doing a full clear and then most likely won't invade because if he did he would have done it by now on to lilia's left side jungle unless he tries to invade this but that's really stupid considering your priority um and then you can just you know you can ask yourself what to do right if loli is invading then you can crash the wave obviously and if uh if if froggen is not this low then i think you can even okay so i find this part really weird because chat's reacting really negatively but technically what he just said is all correct and he defined the reasonings for it he pointed out the minion discrepancy and why it would be illogical for kha'zix to go toplane and then he broke down the nitty-gritty of why it's illogical and why kha'zix should probably pull clear relative to mid lane state and how it's illogical for kha'zix to try to go for an invade especially when gragas can move first so but it's weird because chat was flaming him this is what i'm talking about with discernibility so this is the thing that i said to nemesis early on even if you're dismissive of the guy or you don't like him you have to repeat what he's actually saying and believe it for a second and then analyze it to determine whether or not it might actually be true this is a really really really hard thing to do i've had to do it a lot the last few years when i engage with certain individuals because you have to think like them to try to see what they're seeing regardless of its accuracy um and then you know uh anyways do you want to just move on sorry yeah okay in a state where i think that the wave should just come into gragas because of the hp of the blue minions versus the red minions and so if you know that the wave stayed up in top lane is relatively fine um then we can assume that kha'zix will just end up doing a full clear and then most likely won't invade because if he did he would have done it by now on to lilia's left side jungle unless he tries to invade this but that's really stupid considering your priority um and then you can just you know you can ask yourself what to do right if lily is invading then you can crash the wave obviously and if uh if if froggen is not this low then i think you could even look for a uh crash on this wave and probably even just reset maybe but anyways does that make sense yeah yeah yeah so we're just we're just evaluating so what i'm telling you to do is i'm about i'm telling you to evaluate the state up in top lane kha'zix's route and what lilia wants to do inside of the game that's all fine so and if there is like nothing to do on my sidelines and like pretty much like if there is nothing to do in the jungle would it be better for me to just like look to cross the next wave and then look for a ricoh and get that little advantage or no uh well yeah yeah yeah you can crash this in recall you can just use all your that question suggests that he doesn't get it which if you're a challenger player this question's scary uh or if you're coaching the challenger that's a scary question to engage with because the person's asking for a black and white answer when you're trying to teach them gray because gray is the most skilled aspect of the game because gray is ultimately the interpretation of various lane states variables you know position in lane hp mana et cetera right and it spits out a black and white answer but the problem is is that he's ignoring all of the gray and just asking for a black and white answer based on very surface level variables uh do you have any thoughts on this i agree with you okay i'm not paypal on my new phone yet your monitor crash system recall if you're running dmac it's even better right if you're running materializer you can crash this wave and then you can just reset after this um and then the the thing that i don't like about this the one thing that i dislike about this is because is that you don't have any reasoning to ever be topside to defend or to fake rome to a counter um because one thing you can do that's very subtle that a lot of players don't do is you can fake rome up here and then if you fake rome and kha'zix and froggen pings up um and this lane is in a weird spot this actually incentivizes kha'zix to be a bit more cautious because it is it is going to be a numbers advantage for you at that point because he knows that lily is also the left side of the map okay so because we because enemy enemy kha'zix knows that it's 2v2 top lane tell him the correct play because you haven't said it what and we know that um mid has priority and lily is obviously top lane as well he knows it's 2v2 but you fake roaming actually helps uh gragas possibly crash the wave or gives time for lily holy [ __ ] holy [ __ ] holy [ __ ] we know kha'zix is over here we know kha'zix is on wolves or he's on blue right now what the [ __ ] is that click absolutely not we're going straight down to pound town is he gonna cue us when we're full [ __ ] hp with all of our [ __ ] nourishments no he's an idiot if he does he has to just focus on the minions so he's just gonna back up as we move down but because we move down we can start going to pound town on the minions real nice and easy right here with a lot of buffer for our minions because we're playing right pocket kha'zix can't [ __ ] go out of his mind and be crazy and come on us from any of these angles because he's not doing it anyway because of all the aforementioned reasons based on lane states that we just mentioned nor is he looking for any sort of an invade on lilia so we're just gonna click down but he doesn't point any of this out instead we're going into a tirade about doing some fake [ __ ] rome why are we going on a fake roam against the teleportless mid laner who is bleeding out there behind on hp and mana when we are riding them what just go down to the right not just that but i don't know what the point of fake roaming discussion is right now it's just it only works against bad players yes and he's overlaid overloading him with information that's not you know it's not relevant it's not relevant yes yes yes okay i'm getting mad all right uh well yeah yeah yeah you can crash this and recall you can just use all your mana to crash this and recall if you're running d-max no way better now nope all right if you're running materializer you can crash this wave and then you can just reset atlas um and then the the thing that i don't like about this the one thing that i dislike about this is because is that you don't have any reasoning to ever he can attempt to crash it and re but he can't recall he can attempt to crash it and that'll cause velcaus to panic and because of the threat of a recall depending on speed and depending on what bill cause does but the reality is is that the only reason that you crash it is because velcoz is already so far behind you've achieved what a cheater attempts to achieve which is ultimately an economic advantage velkas is really behind on hp he's very behind on mana so if you crash and then pull for pull five which normally you do post cheater you've already achieved the result that you're looking for the desired result because the enemy is so far behind on economy that you win out on four five six anyway so ultimately this kinda looks like a push three do nothing but it's not a push three do nothing because he's already too far behind due to wave one and two you have any thoughts i agree ever be top side to defend it this is why he's teamless by the way he's agreeing with me right now fudge you're next oh it's fake rome to a counter um because one thing you can do that's very subtle that a lot of players don't do is you can fake rome up here and then if you fake rome and kha'zix and froggen pings up um and this lane is in a weird spot this actually incentivizes kha'zix to be a bit more cautious because it is it is going to be a numbers advantage for you at that point because he knows that lily is also left side of the map okay so because we because enemy enemy kha'zix knows that it's 2v2 top lane and we know that um mid has priority and lily is obviously toppling as well he knows it's 2v2 but you fake roaming actually helps uh gragas possibly crash the wave he just said kha'zix wouldn't go top because the lane state and obviously kha'zix doesn't go top because of the lane state so now why are we saying there's a 2v2 and then a fake room would influence it yep and why is he saying kha'zix has to be cautious when in reality kha'zix is no danger of dying to anuriana and lilia even if he does face check he's just fool clearing that's all he's doing yeah of course i mean yeah wave or gives time for lilia to end up arriving for the counter attack right um this is just something very subtle you can do uh but here i think that froggen is so low that i don't think you have to recall i think you can just continue to put them really really behind side of the game got it okay i think you can just continue to funnel pressure down into frog and i don't think that deliver a world where you need to recall i mean this is just strange to me this this this doesn't make any sense he's going to go for this yeah just auto and then just hit him with q again program can't touch the swipe he can't do anything yes right now yeah even if he has abilities he has wf but it's not like his w is going to sustain anything um so your plan don't you don't have a concise plan you don't have a direct plan you're not playing the lane you're not playing the game as though you want to look for a recall on wave 3 you're not playing the game as you though you want to consistently kind of funnel down pressure into froggen you know there's like a lot of things you can be doing in this game um if you're going to stay then i'm assuming that we're just going to play for kha'zix's rafters if you're going to continue to push them this is my assumption if i see a mid laner doing this i just assumed that maybe lilia would just look for raptors um this is really bad um and the reason this is not very good is because it doesn't i mean what what are you trying to do in the lane uh i mean that's a really awkward situation i was trying to crush it to be honest right yeah so if i mean if you want to crash the wave then trading into frogging is a waste of time if froggins and if froggen is in columns or if he's do it with his jungler his jungle is a pro player and this is in the lane state ends up blocking here kha'zix can come down after his routes on the left-hand side kha'zix can just come down and chunk you out um the only downside is that kha'zix will end up losing efficiency inside of his jungle because he'll be on the right-hand side of the map with a very weird reset timer by the time that lily is back onto the right hand side of the map um which then opens opportunities for like uh you know whatever um but in this case it it's it's a little it's a little strange to me because you're influencing the wave but the wave has no you know uh you're also trading with him for no reason right so then what ends up happening is you don't hit him you waste mana and then you have the next wave the fourth wave again locked and this is where it's danger zone right you have an entire dark left side you don't actually you can't really play like this sure you can play on this word but like why even do this why not just crash the wave right um and this is weird again as well i don't know why you just queue when froggen can get a permafreeze against you relative to this account on these minions this queue doesn't make any sense you should just give up all your hp and all of your monitor crashes the wave or alternatively you just stand inside of your wave in the middle and you let frog and hit you and then you end up giving your hp for wave state okay okay does that make sense yeah it makes a lot of sense here okay any questions uh not so far no okay that makes no sense yeah because i mean i was all right what do you want to say on it that makes no sense first of all i don't know what the [ __ ] is the discussion about kha'zix going to meet and chunking him blah blah blah blah blah it's irrelevant he will never die to a gang he will never burn a summoner and he has two potions so who the [ __ ] cares second of all uh vehicles can never permafreeze midland it's actually not possible okay yeah anything else before we hit play again no that's it okay i was playing i was trying to do two different things at once like poking and then play for wave when i should be doing like i should be focused on doing only one thing and then he pretty much just i show the lane and get the free bag i believe yeah because he's very boss yeah and next wave is absolutely fine he's on timer next wave is actually uh this is the this is the the fifth wave the sixth wave is a reset timer for vlog cause you've missed your opportunity to kill him right you've you've essentially missed your opportunity to solo kill froggen which you could have done possibly because he's running cleanse um and so now now i mean now this is also really strange oh actually never mind yeah sorry he has to stay i'm an idiot this is the fifth wave it's not the sixth wave froggen's just gonna crash this next incoming wave and you should just do the same this is like when two boxers are finished the fight and they go to the next round and they back off right you should just crush the wave as well you should just crash the wave you should do exactly what froggen is doing or you just hunt him down or what you do is you know that froggen needs to reset you know that the wave is in a really nice spot for you and you can actually let froggin influence the wave and immediately jump him right after because if you jump him right after he's forced to run away because you're going to solo kill him and then on top of that he can't influence the wave any further meaning that if it ends up killing his minions any further then a freeze can be further retained here and if you're running teleport the game is just over the game is just over if you're running teleport then even if this guy opts to try to find a back there's no way that ball costs can return before you get to recall off and try to actually crash the incoming wave because then you just you just you just play mind games with teleport but here because you should know that i mean what he's saying what he's saying isn't true either right now because he doesn't have teleport i mean whether he had teleport or not it still doesn't change that the sequence that we're trying to achieve is making velcros lose all of his economy and then pulling the wave but as played out we're not ever actually looking to freeze we're looking to make bell cause um what's the word uh release maybe i we're making to look velcos like have to look at a wave and then just recall you know what i'm talking about like when the lane's gonna reset almost and you're like doomed without your jungler and you can't walk up you know what i'm talking about like that's what we're looking to achieve not a freeze because then if he recalls you can get a crash and then you get a recall which should be what you're trying to do with or without teleport you're just looking for a plus six with a pulled wave you're always just looking for a plus six with a pulled wave and if you can't get a plus six with a pulled wave from the lane state that we just had in front of his turret you're really messing up does that make sense yep oh actually never mind yeah sorry he has to stay an idiot this is the fifth wave it's not the sixth wave froggen's just gonna crash this next incoming wave and you should just do the same this is like when two boxers are finished the fight and they go to the next round they back off right you should just crush the wave as well you should just crash the wave you should do exactly what froggen is doing or you just hunt him down or what you do is you know that frogger needs to reset you know that the wave is in a really nice spot for you and you can actually let froggen influence the wave and immediately jump him right after because if you jump him right after he's forced to run away because you're gonna solo kill him and then on top of that he can't influence the wave any further meaning that if he ends up killing his minions any further then a freeze can be further retained here and if you're running teleport the game is just over the game is just over if you're running teleport then even if this guy opts to try to find a back there's no way that ball costs can return before you get to recall off and try to actually froggen has x mission you not standing there obviously only doubt um because it's 3 30 you probably just finished rift herald and kha'zix is most likely hovering um for a uh for velcast to crash the wave and that's why you see lilia moving in as well and actually what you need to be doing is you need to be paying thresh to come in as well josh comes in this is obviously a two versus two it's very obvious this is a 2v2 froggen if froggen autos is froggen rolls his spells on the wave and he doesn't immediately move back you know that kha'zix is obviously here meaning you have no incentive to actually move up and that's why lilia hovers but because you know that's the case you should also just call it thresh for 3v2 and if you guys end up doing a 3v2 here you just win the game you just end up winning yeah you just win the game there's no there's no question about that froggins lane is [ __ ] thresh is having a great time josh doesn't have to do anything else has it freeze no one gives a [ __ ] thresh is great i feel like this is happy everyone is just happy you know just happy he pretty much just show um and so now i mean now this is also really strange oh actually never mind yeah sorry he has to stay i'm an idiot this is the fifth wave it's not the sixth wave dragon's just gonna crash this next incoming wave and you should just do the same this is like when two boxers are finished the fight and they go to the next round they back off right you should just crash the wave as well oh no she is she's [ __ ] you should do exactly right i'm running around shoes okay i mean it's incorrect for her to hover though uh i don't know it's incorrect for trash to go me too in my opinion [Music] i mean affiliates does have a freeze but i mean level two fresh that's slow yeah it's level two threshold right if he goes meet and doesn't achieve anything then if if velcoz and kha'zix play it right or he doesn't achieve anything yeah they'll cause and kha'zix have autonomy that's why they're supposed to be all right it's 500 600 because they uh professor scream definitely scream even in the on season i think there should be i know that lily is going lily are going to scuttle and then i don't know it's weird i mean lily is pathing in general is a little weird are you praying to god you're versus someone who can actually punish you right or like a bunch of autofill people yeah yeah so so like you should be a learning environment soloq should actually be a sandbox for pro players um but it's not a sandbox when every other player isn't actually excelling right um so in my opinion i think that there should be a consistent in-house server um or you do the korea method where you end up scrimming and then at a certain time everyone gets on and play solo queue yeah but i don't know that's like that's i'll you know i'm not gonna get into that but you know what i mean like it's what i'm trying to say is that it's hard to improve in n a it's just it's fundamentally more difficult for you to from n a than it is for you to improve in other regions like korea or like uh china or something um the ways that this guy has to improve has nothing to do with region though so i don't get the point of bringing this up okay yeah you just stay silent it's fine i mean this is just [ __ ] this is a slow push into frogging now holy you know yeah if you were early to the you can go flash for oh i just missed it i don't know what you're planning constantly playing against no no uh i would consider i don't know what your plans are after college but you know relative to how things work out i think you should probably look to go to korea for a little bit as well see what you can do no no no no no no korea is i just i just had this conversation with another like amateur player you do not come to korea to boot camp if you're not intending to stay for at least a year you don't come to create a boot camp if you're not going to stay for at least a year you will not utilize huh what i'm leaving korea just because the server is better doesn't mean that it helps you get better because what ends up happening is you just adapt to the way that the koreans play but you're not actually learning what is going on you might be learning in the moment you'll go back and you'll be like sort of jacked up on steroids because you just came from playing against like way better players but you will not have brought with you the the knowledge of like what goes into the actions that you ended up making or like doing right so champions change meta changes you adapt to your own regions like play style and solo queue its own tendency and stuff and it's not helping you if the ping difference is there then like that's another issue that you could have most people and it's why i really heavily advise against korean boot camps very very very poorly utilize it um teams that come for korean boot camps it's generally a joke i think generally i used to not hold this opinion but i think now i now i do it's generally a waste of time you don't the the only positive of the boot camp is that you're all picked up and dropped into an alien country where you're forced to sort of like bond with each other like that's probably the most positive effect of like a korean bootcamp for a team um but the idea that just coming and playing on a server for one month or two months is going to help you no it's not it's not going to help you not in any long-term way i agree yeah dude there i punish him but i think it was way too late you can go flash for flash here but not here but like in general you know yeah if you were early to the trade you go flash for flash because flash for flash benefits you holy [ __ ] thresh i mean this lane is [ __ ] how does flash for flash benefit orianna when velka's has more range i'm asking you by the way i i don't know maybe you can play devil's advocate here but if i'm moriana i i want flash not the other way around you know it's hard it's hard i don't know i think i think especially factoring the jungle matchups it slightly favors uh blue team all right yeah i can agree oh no yeah this is uh this is this is bad now anyways whether that's scenario of you know having to be really like really threw me off but a lot of it is mental you feel like you're more inclined to you know be careful right yeah play safe yeah yeah you don't need to when you have you know an optimal situation inside of the lane anyways i actually just want to talk about this i think that going forward doesn't matter because everything going forward into this lane is a byproduct of you making micro misplaced from levels one to four if you can fix that yeah your situation would never happen you would just kill him by now okay yeah i get it okay oh you've jin duck on your team all right on the enemy team cool yeah anyways uh do you have any okay any any any more questions what for today i know really what happens if the opposite scenario like let's say i'm frogging and i'm playing against orianna like how how should i be playing the the laning phase to record well i can't i can't exactly show you because i don't have to replay yeah but but but but i can give you i can give you a general concept mid lane when you're on the losing receiving of mid lane it becomes a recovery so let's let's talk about this right if you win on when if you win on wave a if enemy wins on wave a they win on wave c do you understand that what this is not true some champions win level one and then lose level two and because they lose level two they lose level three yep yeah okay if they went on a they went on c meaning now they can end up getting a bounce back on d and e no some champions can't be cheated on but also the first point's not true and then this becomes a freeze okay no it doesn't especially in midland by the way it's the hardest thing it's really hard it's yeah but not only that trying to teach black and white things rather than black and white black and white is better utilized on a surface level for low mmr players because it helps them just nudge them in the right direction for players of this mmr you can't leave out the little details but then one of the things i like to start incorporating is lying to these players which i didn't do until towards the end of my public coaching uh public coaching career whatever you want to call it because i don't coach anymore but one of the things i started devising was actively lying to the client to see if they could tell that i was lying to them because if they can tell that i'm lying then it means that they're actually juggling with the gray yeah they can't then it doesn't matter what i'm saying anyway yeah uh yeah um i mean this is just this is really this is really bad this is i mean i i think yeah i mean none of this is useful to this uh orianna player because if you ask the orianna to recite anything he can't you can just tell by how they're conversing yeah yeah this isn't the way to help this orianna player so now the way you win that is you now have to do now what actually ends up happening is now this is a this is this is a reward this is the reward for wave a because orianna played x on wave a wave c he won and wave d he ended up reaping the rewards on there meaning now what you have to do is you have to find something known as the recovery this this is [ __ ] i'm making up by the way this is not a real term but because but because the coaches and na and just the professional coaches i don't think that they're very good i don't think that these terms have even been discussed or talked about but we can i'm just making this up again it's not a real thing i'm going to call this the the recovery the recovery wave the recovery wave could be wave d and e and the reason the recovery wave could be way of d and e is because it's the same time when you can expel all your mana and all your resources and all of your hp to break the freeze and crash on d and e right f then returns into you now you have to try to win on f and then you know however whatever wave is after this you can reap through words so mid lane then becomes this this conversation between two players between um between uh what to do on x-wave and then what happens on the y-wave okay right so and then what ends up happening is now if you're if again if you're losing are you trying to talk or is that him what yeah yeah yeah me go so let's just get this straight okay he asked what does he need to do when he's the vehicles the coach is talking about [ __ ] [Music] something completely different why he's just loading him with information that i don't know how he's gonna use and half of it is like complete bs um these are tactics that are used in other fields uh intentionally to disorient uh the person you know what i mean but i don't think he is intentionally doing it do you know what i mean yeah yeah because i don't think we we would be at this point where like you and i are being asked to go over the vod if that were the case but i do wonder if this is a like subconscious thing that he developed without realizing it but yeah i mean i i how wait actually yeah i don't know then you have to try to recover and you have to now make it you have to have your own sequence that benefits you right and then if orion is forced to play on your sequence you're winning midway but for the entirety of the lane you had the ability to play against froggins froggen was forced to play inside of your sequence because of how level one played out but you didn't play your own sequence correctly yeah okay yeah great that's all that's literally that's literally it yeah that was i like that laney phase was actually so free for playing correctly now that i see yeah and stuff like this will will uh continue to be replicant of your other matches as well right so you this is like a it's an ongoing process okay anyways i'll let's all we want to talk about everything anything else is kind of pointless because the game is already i completely disagree i'd like to see him play out a reset laning phase where you know like now velcoz is in the driver's seat because vel causes a head from this freeze frame so i wholeheartedly disagree there is a lot to unpack in the next [ __ ] six waves that i want to see what he does because this is 15 maybe dude like just throw it into the game to say that oh man well forward holy [ __ ] there's like especially because he's so he's so far behind velka's right now he's so far behind bell cause there is so much to gain by watching the next like six waves this was i don't know i don't know what i learned from this i actually uh not trying to be like disrespectful you but yeah well i didn't learn anything i didn't learn anything of course i didn't learn anything but if i was the person being coached i also think i learned nothing because i was actually misled which is worse than learning nothing yeah i think the only thing you could have maybe learned is that using q at random times is bad you know like maybe like something basic is that that's the only thing that comes to my mind i mean he talks about some positive concepts that the person should be aware of like looking at other lanes and then entertaining like the jungle stuff like that is as as simple as it sounds players don't even do that you know like using f key to look at gragas and stuff like yeah that is good that part was good i mean technically he didn't but mention of keyboard there was there was too much there was way too much like other stuff that it felt like it was being come up with in the moment like remember the the lulia's hovering thresh thing and whatever like it just felt like things were being said to being said how come a high-low player can't tell he's being misled um because high-level players don't necessarily know a lot about the game they're really good at executing a very small amount of things over and over way better than other people and if you're just good enough at that you can climb but no zombering it has nothing to do with me not learning anything because i'm a coach because you're implying that coaches know the things that we were just talking about this guy's a coach this guy has more coaching experience under his belt than most people on professional gaming teams he has more interaction with high mmr players than most people on pro gaming teams your comment doesn't make any sense the reason i agreed to do this the reason i agreed to do this is because one he asked me two he gave me permission to be open and honest with everything that i thought but then three people don't realize what's going on with coaching this is something i'm very passionate about and i really really don't like that people can hide behind not having any content because this is someone that has way more workload and way more stuff under their belt than most people that's that's the sad reality of it and that can probably also hurt him it could hurt him yeah i agree yeah this guy is at least putting himself out there and the thing is is that i don't think that he means to do any negative i've personally recommended this person to lower memoir players because even telling low mmr players the general gist of basic things like it gets them thinking like oh yeah like oh this is a thing that in theory is possible right so even though you don't have all the nitty-gritty variables the nitty-gritty variables don't become important until you start getting to like really high mmr where micro aspects become really important so for lower mmr players a lot of the things that he'll talk about that are super surface level they are pretty fine um but when you begin to like delve into you know challenger v challenger pro vs pro you know challenge reverse pro etc you're gonna need a lot more um yeah i don't know uh i didn't learn anything from the video uh and i felt like the video had way way way way more misleading information than that had positive information i don't think this orianna could re so here's what i would do right so this orianna based on how he was talking with the coach and other stuff this orion is the type of person i would lie to um in order to actually see if he's following um and then i would ask way more questions uh like you know like the i started doing this towards the end of my coaching career too um i started drawing a lot of circles and then i would draw numbers on them right like one two three four five oh and then i would ask like what number is good and why is it good and then you know because this gets them actively thinking about defining their rules and defining their variables and why they exist the way that they do because that's what becomes more important the higher that you get up is understanding something not just knowing it um but all that this coaching is doing is trying to make the person know it not understand it so it's not good or it's not useful to challengers it's not useful to hire more yeah and laura mario can get away with general things um because the details like there's so many mistakes happening so often that finer details don't really matter as much why don't i coach publicly anymore because it's a [ __ ] ripoff you don't need to pay me 120 or 125 dollars whatever my rate is uh to get told the same stuff that's on my youtube i have dozens and dozens and dozens of videos on my youtube that are literally titled recommended and they only go over the fundamentals fundamentals don't change if you want to actually get good at laning that orianna aurelia video is one of the best videos there there's a lot of videos on my channel that you should just be able to use but also i still do content with pro players like casual coaching with lemon or like fudge or well i mean we sort of troll fudge but yeah i don't do like nitty gritty stuff anymore also this is just one game but it's a very bizarre one game was ended at level four and then said that there was nothing else to do but there was a lot of that dude the best part was coming you know the best part was actually coming which is yeah the cake the cake was actually on its way it was seeing the next six waves when orianna was behind that was the cake okay guys i will see you all later also thank you for 500 000 uh twitch followers very very very very nice thank you so much um and i will see you guys all later okay all right bye

Channel: LS

Views: 288,320

Keywords:

Id: EdykMwVxJfM

Length: 77min 17sec (4637 seconds)

Published: Tue Mar 30 2021