Lesley Stahl Discusses Her Interview with Marjorie Taylor Greene | In the News with Jeff Greenfield

foreign Happy Passover happy Easter happy Ramadan uh I think I haven't left anything out so if you look at the world of politics journalism Entertainment Sports whatever there are one-hit wonders and there are flashes in the pan and then there are long distance runners I think there's no doubt which of these categories Leslie stahlfits she has been at CBS for half a century she has covered stories from Watergate to Iraq to Trump and Beyond she was the first woman White House correspondent I mean fully accredited White House correspondent for the last three decades she's been a Mainstay of the most successful most watched and I think most profitable news show in the history of Journalism she's in a perfect position to talk about the vast changes in the news business and the political world the challenges posed by the rise of social media maybe even artificial intelligence she's also found herself in the last week in the in the crosshairs of media attention after her interview with Marjorie Taylor green which we will be talking about but not to the exclusion of the other issues just to be clear um because that incident and Beyond also raises questions about what approach journalism can take when examining public figures whose comments cross the line between truth and falsity and outright conspiracy theories taken as a whole these questions suggests that journalism is facing some of the biggest Challenges ever and I can't think of anyone I'd rather hear talking about them than our guest tonight Leslie Stahl I want to just stipulate right off the top that I don't like to be interviewed I want to interview you I know you do I know you do it comfortable position and good luck with that tonight in fact we owe Leslie stall a debt of gratitude because indeed she's not the only journalist who don't like to be interviewed and this situation is such that she could just as easily say you know I can't talk about this and so book somebody else well wait you asked me yeah and I wouldn't stiff you you could have faked this you could have had an injury I mean I hadn't thought about that it's what the NBA players do in the season when they want a tank to get anyway you're here next time you're here and so you know right off the bat thank everyone sister and Passover and Ramadan okay so let's let's deal with the elephant in the room so we can move on and the first question that I think a lot of people have raised and I think this is actually the in my view of the easier one is why Booker at all why do this profile of somebody with these strange views what I had to interview and that speaker McCarthy is speaker I think that she has them in a place where he has to listen to her um she really represents the Maga constituency in the House of Representatives so we saw someone who Rose to extraordinary National Power in less than two years and we found that uh powerful people get to be cross-examined on 60 Minutes it's also reasonable to say that there are all kinds of people that you have that the show has dealt with in the past where people raise the same question right oh indeed like uh well my first interview this season was the president of Iran raisi and uh we had Saddam Hussein Noriega Putin during going way back so this is really the DNA of 60 Minutes going back Mike Wallace did how many controversial people including the Ayatollah Khomeini which was a very famous interview but haldem and erlichman during during Watergate so it's who we are it's what we do and this is in the tradition um and it's it's distressing that people don't want to hear what polit what a powerful politician has to say okay so that that takes that us past that first question oh that was the first question that was three but you also know probably better than almost anybody that there are landmines about an interview like this if you're too tough then her friends will say well that's just liberal media we didn't expect anything else or just a bunch of lefties if you're too easy it's off you gave her a pass uh you're rolled over and so take us behind the scenes if you will as you're putting together this profile and it's a profile um how are you how are you adjusting the focus do you want to show us martial agreeing the person do you want to spend a lot of time on some of her more controversial views how do you when you sit down and say what are we going to do about this how much are we going to devote to which part of her well these kinds of form of profiles your right to call it that that we do our almost formulaic in that we almost always go home with whoever it is we show the audience how they grew up um and ask them questions about their childhood we almost all do do it whoever we're we've got in this position if they'll let us come go home with them and uh we always do almost always uh two interviews one about their personal life and then a second one about the issues so it followed sort of the script in that in that sense and and the the pushback on this and it's not just about this interview although is well what you're doing the argument goes is you're normalizing it here is somebody uh who has uh offered a whole variety of views some of which or many of which you you touched on some of which I assume for time you couldn't you know you say okay so this is somebody who says that Hillary Clinton uh killed John Kennedy Jr that Nancy Pelosi should be executed for treason how do you say all right that's part of her but so is the part that goes to the gym that has a huge following where do you how do you make that calculation well as with any piece that we do on 60 Minutes we do very extensive interviews usually run between two and three minutes three hours two and three hours and uh and I did too with her this is normal we shoot a lot of footage and we bring it back and we make our editorial decisions in the basically in the office in the edit room before computer we have transcripts made of every single thing I say and they say and then we make our editorial decisions the the interview is designed to be comprehensive where we would touch on as many controversial issues as we could get in within the two to three hour time span so you at some point went down the list of all the things you said and said this is what we're going to ask her about we don't have room for this or we we're gonna yeah for the most triage for the most part so here's the almost last question about this and it comes from somebody who made one of the more telling observations about how journalism works and the name of that person is Leslie Stahl and it's a story you have told many times including here it's what happened in 2004 when you did a piece soon for the evening news contrasting the Airy optimistic Reagan commercials with what you regarded as facts that were left out and you discovered that the Reagan people in 1985 four oh four yeah one in America 84. 84 sorry yeah 1980. no four wouldn't have been very inappropriate it was right before his re-election okay and you and what did they tell you they told you they told me well can I go back yeah uh I did a Evening News piece on the Reagan re-election campaign that was pretty tough and uh I was covering the White House at the time quite sure they'd never answer any phone call of mine ever again peace was hard-hitting and they loved it and I couldn't understand how could they love it they thanked me it was on the eve of the election and they said well you and television haven't figured it out when the picture is powerful enough that people are get an emotional reaction to it they don't even hear what you're saying you are drowned out by what's coming in through the optic nerve and go somewhere behind there down into the gut where people make judgments and decisions about people and we proved that that was true we brought the piece to a focus group but most of them didn't hear what I said at all and the rest of them thought it was a positive news story so why doesn't that apply to the Mary Marjorie Taylor green story well one person you know I'm not quoting these critics because you know them that's fine but one person who loved this piece was Steve Bannon sure why not well but that you know I can't help who loves our peace we were what I was going to say about the picture and it had very little to do with the actual piece itself was how it was advertised and promoted because unlike most of our stories for some reason they didn't put out ahead of time back and forth they put out pictures of her and me walking around a lot of the criticism came before the piece ever aired she's collecting questions so you're so wait so so the so before we ever got on the air and a person a friend of mine brought this up to me my daughter that before anything people saw pictures of her and me walking we do the famous 60 minutes walk and we walked in front of her house and we walked in the Capitol and we were conversing and there was no q a going on in the in the teaser that ran Thursday night Friday night and so forth on television and people got an impression because they were pictures that this was friendly because we were talking and it set it set the whole stage for this we do so many interviews with people that a majority of Americans would not want us to put on our air we do we do them once a month let's say we never got a reaction like this why did this happen and it started before a single question was shown to the public and so I point to that story that you're telling and say yeah people saw the picture they made their initial judgment it was powerful and it colored the way people saw the interview okay um that's my answer I am reminded of because people in your business and what still semi is my business face this all the time how do you approach um when I went to South Africa I was assigned by nightland to tell the story of the afrikaners the white supremacists uh and you know that wasn't exactly my view of things but that was the job so I'm remembering one guy who I thought figured this out when Tim Russert the late Tim Russert David ducon former Nazi former klansman he had he was in the runoff for governor of Louisiana the very first question that Tim asked him was what was it about growing up in America in the 1960s that made you become a Nazi now that's set a tone in a sense that you know it did but it this whole issue uh raises I think a broader question which he wasn't powerful let's point that out say again David Duke was not a member of Congress no but he was the Republican candidate for governor of Louisiana he just won a primary yeah that's when his opponent Edwin Edwards ran the slogan vote for the crook it's important so he was in a position to have a fair amount of power but my question is and I do think this is the age of trump we all grew up in a particular way of how you approach interviews pieces you know when I went out and covered Jesse Helms it was not my job to say this is the last racist in the United States Senate you know you want maybe the effects but when you have a candidate or a figure like Donald Trump the Press was caught in a bit of a vise at first and by the end even of the 16 campaign the New York Times was was calling him in Headlands a liar yeah so how does that you know how does that world and the Maga World which I'm perfectly prepared to say it you know but it's suggesting we don't put anybody on from that like the contrary the question is the context and look one of the people who proved that it seems to me was you when you were interviewing Donald Trump the last time you you know you pushed him to the point where he I think pretty much walked out of the interview right pretty much yeah I pushed her too and she got angry as you saw well I do want to move on from good you know um people will make their own judgment about how that piece worked but there's a bigger issue here I pushed her pretty hard and she when we had it we don't show the whole interview we don't show the six times I would go back she got angry not because of what you saw me ask her the two two or three questions before but because we've been going at it for an hour and that that isn't the way we do our profiles we don't just show you one aspect of it but you're the whole person take his purpose wrote a question when you were dealing with a political figure who uh who flatly says one and one is five yeah and not only that but the people who say one and one or two are Traders um they're Communists uh they're pedophiles which you raise their satanic child killers and they and you know and they should be executed for treason all of which she has at one point or another son said yeah and she's hardly the only one how did I've seen a whole lot in the last few years of journalists and journalism critics trying to wrestle with how you do this you can't just say Marjorie Taylor green says a uh but the facts show b or there are two sides and sorry because sometimes there aren't two sides to it exactly how do you deal with that well one we will not put on the air anything that's a lie that either we do not challenge within the interview or we challenge after they say it so 60 Minutes is not going to put something on that's not true and we will point out that it isn't true one way or another sometimes you prepare yourself for these kinds of interviews and you think you know everything and you don't and you don't catch all the lies but we as we said I said in the interview we fact check and nothing gets into our pieces that isn't true now she did say that President Biden was a pedophile and she said it and I remember saying to her well you know that isn't true and she said I said you know that isn't true and then I said why would you say that and then I just rolled my eyes because what are you going to say what am I going to come on and say for a third time he's not a pedophile please you know if if she had said to you for instance in an interview Donald Trump is just like Nelson Mandela and Jesus Christ which she said not to me but she did say that so what is your follow-up are you going to say no he's not you're just going to look into the camera and say oh my God there's you know what are you going to say what's the follow-up to that there's no fun no fault trust me there's no appropriate follow-up okay and as someone said and I love this was my favorite of all the banging on my head that I took a couple of people were kind and said just putting her on the air was the gotcha that and then see that [Applause] that leads to the broader question that we actually were talking about a while ago um by the way if if I had had the honor of being in an interview and she said that I would say you know I don't know my Temptation would have been to say you know that's sort of the same level of your argument that the California wildfires were started by a space laser run by the Ross Shields which unfortunately I was kind of waiting for that to show up in the piece there just been that's kind of the same but that's me because I have I have no tact and I don't have that platform um but well we thought that by having me come back on the pedophile thing twice and then just roll my eyes that was well we when I say we it's the committee not just me and so I'm I'm not unhappy with the interview for the record okay so let's go let's go to this issue of how you of how as a general proposition um journalism has been struggling with this at least since the days of Joe McCarthy when they learned that it was not enough to say McCarthy says there are 200 Communists in the state department Dean Atchison says there aren't that ain't going to do it at some point you have to weigh in and say and the facts are you know there are no or there are two Alger hits and one other that's it and and Biden's not a pedophile yeah and so at what point in doing that do journalists also have to be careful that there's a limit to that I mean you know because at some point that becomes almost like a campaign ad against the person you're interviewing even if what you're doing is telling the truth right yeah well these are all questions that you struggle with when you bring all your material home and put it together and knowing that the 60 Minutes audience is a pretty sophisticated group of people uh I don't think to be to be frank now we I don't know myself how many people Watch 60 Minutes online or on in Snippets uh and and where they're seeing it or because they all the Nielsen is only what we show at seven o'clock at night um but our audience didn't balloon because she was on No in fact it was a bit down well because we didn't have a sports lead-in it was what we normally would get without a sports leader so we didn't have basketball or football it was kind of pretty much normal for this time of year so she didn't you know the the audience didn't explode with people dying to see what she had to say I suspect we had our usual audience not just in numbers but who generally watches I I I was wondering why she did it I've explained why we wanted her on she's powerful why did she want to come on 60 Minutes what was she hoping to do and I was confused I thought what I think a lot of my critics thought that she wanted to come on and normalize herself and appeal to a wider audience of people um but from the beginning of the second interview where she started pounding away saying things that were outrageous I thought nope that's not where she's going and I well she may have that old there's no such thing as bad publicity although that well my daughter who's very smart said she thought and of course this is pure speculation but she thought that in Marjorie Taylor Green's mind there was an audience of one and that was Donald Trump and this was her audition to run for vice president ha everybody agrees with you there's there's something inside at work here uh I don't know that you and I disagree about the degree to which politics has become polarized that people live in silos and that they are no no that's not what I disagree let me just let me I don't disagree with you okay okay I disagree about how movable it is yeah well that's what we're going to go to okay next but the point about about the polarization is I believe that one of the great beliefs about journalism in itself is under real Challenge and the great belief is if we go out and tell the people what is they will rally it's it's you know all the newspaper movies where the heroic reporter breaks the milk trust or the bank trust or Edward Arnold and cigar smoking Nazis and the People Say Yes by God we understand Watergate right okay and in fact in Watergate it happened exactly and produced a generation of Journalism students who might have been better off doing something else but that's another story but now that's not what we're seeing what we're seeing now is you you know you can come out after January 6 in particular and say for heaven's sakes the outgoing president United States I will say this you don't have to attempt it to overthrow the government attempted to Stage a coup and was perfectly prepared to have the military seize the ballot boxes that's pretty out there and his people or the people did not say we got this guy wrong oh for heaven I thought he was a hero no you know this is unacceptable and so the question is whether or not to a significant extent that notion why do we do this you know you're you're pushing the same buttons I don't mean you personally you know and and it's not happening that way well you forget uh and I don't because I covered Watergate that the American people were with Nixon almost up to the end they stuck with him and stuck with him no matter what was coming out in the Washington Post or in those Senate hearings for those of you I can tell by the color of your hair that you watch uh we're watching in the afternoons the American people stuck with him stuck with them stuck with them all through my years and then it began to deteriorate and it be it was a long time coming and I saw a poll today and this is why I was disagreeing with you we had dinner together um there's a poll ABC did yesterday I guess and what's happened is his support Trump support among Independents has completely collapsed he is now down to approval rating of 25 percent that's as low as he's ever gotten I'm not saying that this man isn't going to pull another Houdini act on us because how many times have we said he cannot survive attacking John McCain he cannot you know all the things we thought this is the end but there are people who can be there whose Minds have been changed by the indictment just the indictment so you know I'm saying the the let's say call it the jury is out well as um as no journalist ever said only time will tell right right but I'm my skepticism um may be confined to the to the base but well the bass ain't moving now okay so because one of the things that you need asked congresswoman green is uh you um you're for a federal ban on abortion eighty percent of the Republican caucuses are federal abandoned abortion even after the election results seem to be telling the Republicans this isn't helping you uh she thinks the election was stolen two-thirds of the Republicans in the house and at least that percentage of people who are believed the election was stolen so what I think I think you're illustrating is that at least among the people who are going to decide let's say the nomination oh absolutely you know there is none of this stuff seems to happen that's now down to 25 okay it used to be 40. not that long ago well I'm I'm curious to see you may well be right about that I I just don't know but I do know that that the one of the things that happened slowly over time and particularly after the tapes with Watergate um you might remember the number on the house Judiciary Committee at least six Republicans voted to impeachment yes right um and you now have but all the rest didn't and there were like 17 who voted not to indict with all the evidence that had come out and it's yeah I think I'm trying to remember the numbers but it was a that's for this week many more voters to support him than went the other way um that that in this case after January 6th is a high water mark of discontent among establishment Republicans who are the eight senators who voted to convict on the second impeachment and how many of them are left I I would guess none no I think I think Cassidy oh two yeah some retired in some yeah and of the of the House Republicans have voted for impeachment I think there may be one left which means that within that party they're doubling down within within the Republican party I what the collapse came among Independents yes okay I want to I keep wondering how much the Republican party that is people who I identify themselves tell pollsters I'm a republican how much those numbers have come down I keep asking our pollster and I know the change in 40 identification yeah no that numbers yeah I and that would be significant I don't know but okay let's change this yeah I wanna I I want to talk for a second about the uh the defamation suit against Fox oh okay yeah easy easier well uh let's see but but here but here's here's the core of it for me because I don't think this particular aspect is confined to Fox what we have learned in all the the discovery is that within the fox world they felt that if they told what they understood to be the truth about the election they would lose viewers but that seemed to be the case yeah I mean that was that's literally from Rupert Murdoch on down to Tucker Carlson where where but it was true okay no I'm asking it was true yeah that as they right so Arizona they lost enough so there seems to be a choice that they made either we keep telling them what we think we know to be true and we we hurt ourselves at the bottom line or we to use the phrase of one of the fox Executives respect the audience yeah just I mean that's euphemism with the capital e but here's my question is it confined is it only Fox that is telling its viewers readers what they want to hear or is it fair to say that on the other side of the of the spectrum you're not getting a lot of of on MSM really good question it's an excellent question it's not true of 60 minutes I mean that but an executive at CBS you'll recall when I don't know if he was asked or he volunteered about how much we were putting Trump on the air on the air said he's not good for the country but he's really good for Ratings so we're going to keep putting him on the edge that was your former CEO yes it was my Pharmacy no longer the scene no longer but so to answer your I think your question is an excellent question nothing to the extent that fox went where they they were riding the Trump horse so enthusiastically and they hated him I mean that that's quite extraordinary and they call themselves a news division I'm talking about something else whether or not MSNBC feels comfortable going uh critical on Biden or whether they're gonna I mean I think I told you when CNN had a group of lawyers on who said you know some most of them said this indictment out of New York is looking a little a little shaky to me I'm not sure this is really good and the response a lot of their views was ah you're going after the fox audience you're becoming conservative not well that's your judgment about the case that I think people and and they lost audience you think no I just think that I just think that there is a you're saying there's you're saying that there are some news shows that pander and it may be justified that if you tell your audience what it doesn't want to hear they're gonna they're going to not accept it and say well maybe I was wrong about this they're going to say you know they're going to challenge your motives uh they're going to say you're swinging to the right you're pandering to the this is this is so sadly symptomatic of where we are right now where people only want to hear what they want to hear they want to turn on television or open a newspaper if you still do that or whatever and have your own thoughts propelled back to you and if they don't get it they will go somewhere else and you're asking me if that means that the reporters and the anchor people feel compelled to soften their own trees yeah um I don't know but it's a scary question to ask and a legitimate question to ask and when we should all be worried about and it comes to mind to me when the idea that 60 Minutes might put on something that our audience won't want to see is is attacked yeah but you're you're in a you're an incredibly great situation which is that for more than 50 years you've built an audience that is so devoted to the show that it will follow you I was laughing about this you guys can do a show about a monastery in in the Carpathian Mountains where they grow lima beans and don't talk and we'll watch it because we've come you know first of all it's probably good journals that was a great piece there was a piece pretty closely very close classical musicians you'll do you know you'll do all these things that aren't supposed to work on TV because you you have had you know that shows had 50 plus years to build that audience uh at the at one point protected by a time slot we're still protected but nobody can compete with you which is cool um but that's unique I think it is and on top of all this we're talking about all those rotten questions written on down on that piece of paper is that a bed is that a button question no really the business because I'm getting to I'm getting I'm teeing up something that you have actually prepared because one of the other things that we're all dealing with is with the growth of artificial intelligence with the technology to be able to do deep fakes it used to be a how to spend have a lot of money to do that now you can do it in your in your parents basement with you know five bucks on a box top and you can make uh Joe Biden come out for um I don't know ritual Slaughter and it'll look pedophilia but you but you in fact have brought something I did illustrate this this well this does not know this this was not this was um no I haven't shown him this yet this this was to show you how scary AI is now I know you all know how scary AI is because we all read that incredible New York Times story but um I went and did an interview with Microsoft because they introduced AI into their search engine Bing and I got to ask their AI to write me a poem that would be advice to their CEO about how to handle the 60 Minutes interview be honest clear this is from AI to the CEO be honest clear and concise don't evade and don't tell them lies lies show them you have nothing to hide and back your claims with fact and pride and that's just what he did he followed this thing remember they are not your foes they're just doing what they chose to inform the public of the news and give them different points of views but I saw this and I I thought he followed it I thought he said I can't lie I have to come off as being open and not insulted by the questions and just sit there as though I'm just very proud of what we've done out of AI okay okay but I think that I mean that's a that's a scary that's that's less scary than well yeah and a lot of other things yes never mind the generation of law school applications I wanted to do I wanted to start an organization I can't because I'm in the media but I wanted to start an organization called organization of grandmothers against social media because I am so worried about social media in general now we have to add AI on top of it and I was really thinking I would love to do that until I realized that organization of grandmothers against social media spells orgasm and your problem is no but I hate the whole thing yes social media understood and it you know a hundred years ago I don't know who said it maybe you remember that um truth a lie goes halfway around the world before truth gets its boots on and that was before social media so I I sometimes I picture traditional news media as I was in a rowboat with tin cans you know while while this flood of stuff comes pouring in quite literally by the second and so what happens is you you know between that and deep fakes you get a huge number of people who believe um to quote to congresswoman that Hillary Clinton and some other Democrat ritually slaughter babies uh I think she but you're you're a larger point it makes me despair well I don't know how we thread I don't just mean media I mean the whole country from where we are I I don't know how we thread our way out of this I I I can't see it I can't see it you know in the past when countries got in this kind of trouble they went to war and that would end it all or we'd get a new system of government I don't know the optimist about people changing their minds and stuff what this is this is not what I was expecting I'm talking media here well well I'm talking the country you're right I'm talking the country being being fed information that isn't true being asked to believe what isn't true I was talking about Trump I think Trump is no but before I mean at dinner before I was talking about you think people changed you can get people to change their minds on Trump okay but I wonder how we thread out of the distrust we have for each other how the polarization comes to an end how people you and I were talking at dinner about how you can't in your own family can't talk to someone if they're on the other side I mean the only way to keep the family together is not talk about issues and how do we get ourselves out of this and how does the media survive this not to be even more pessimistic but this is dark but I mean this is the season for Christians of renewal and hope but this is the ymha so I'll be pessimistic [Laughter] very good they didn't get it you know we as you know there are all of these organizations trying to figure out pessimistic you know all right we need a common set of facts we need everybody should be able to agree on this and the people who are pushing this idea pointer Institute the Aspen Institute I don't know in my view these are the people who least need to be doing this because they know that and the people you most want in on this are not participating in this because among other things it turns out you can build a certain degree of political strength and certainly you can make a lot of money uh peddling yeah extreme lies lies um and you know that's a pretty uh a pretty powerful incentive not to change I mean if you are I mean I I you know if you are Tucker Carlson on one hand you say I I hate Trump you know he's terrible and then have him on and prop him up well yeah that would be the polite way of saying it but yeah problem up because that's what your audience is wanting and you're you know that's you're making a a ton of money with that um so we're we're talking about two different things but they're both leading to a dark place well it's you know well I hope that's right we have if you've got questions um yeah oh good Leslie you don't know what the question is I'm guessing okay right don't be optimistic did you say Okay then that was nice and sweet see this is the the very first question I asked is this is this question you know why put her on but you've answered that question um you said today tonight that the public stayed in support of Nixon nearly until the end of his presidency what was the Tipping Point sorry Smoking Gun I thought it was the firing Archer Wilcox oh no it was way after that oh yeah way after that this was you know the the real tip came after the impeachment hearings and really was associated with The Smoking Gun which was real fast you mean when the tapes finally came out yeah that was three days before it was you think it was that late that the public switch pretty much okay we can do you think it's possible today for public opinion what if it's possible to tip today what would it be I think this may be a term related question because it's a little hard to imagine what could come out about him that would change his supporters so you wrote a column recently in the Washington post about how people who are indicted or go to jail get reelected yeah frequently if not always whatever yeah and uh I saw this ABC poll about how his numbers have collapsed because he was indicted and I wonder how how all of that job's in your mind because I think okay yeah you're interviewing me now but that's okay it's in your blood Leslie first I think that um for reasons that I'm going to be writing about I think I think the odds the the chances of trump getting the nomination remain very high you know he doesn't need 50 he's got that base um there are other reasons that I don't want to take up the audience but I think that is a possibility once you are the nominee of a major party who last time if you don't count the if you count the real vote not the popular vote 44 000 votes in three states would have would have made it a tie and the way it works 26 house delegations would have voted for Trump he'd still be president 44 000 votes out of a hundred and sixty million so all you have to imagine is any one of a dozen events is Biden still going to be running if not do we think the Democrats can avoid a Civil War who the nominee is will the economy collapse um there's a certain degree to which the public or part of the public as they say on Wall Street has priced Trump's it's priced it into the stock they know they know what they know and nothing seems to bother so that's why I think you know these numbers May hold up you may well be right that you know there are Democrats right now who say well we can't wait for Trump to be the nominee you know and my feeling is uh you can you think all the way back to 2016 um I remember in 1980 I don't know if you remember this but we had a bet on that election I don't remember I'm sure I lost I always it was a very nice dinner [Laughter] it was I understand why people back then would say Ray we got to have Reagan as the nominee Democrats and he's an actor he's nobody will buy into that the only one he only won 44 States so that's one it's not that I don't do predictions because uh you know I wrote a book saying that John Lindsay could be the next president I learned early don't do that but that's why it's just it's not a this is going to happen I hate I don't hate I am not impressed by people who write here's why X will happen yeah we have learned all of us in life that's ridiculous um this is a good question uh online are you able to choose or refuse your assignments and if so any regrets ah uh the answer is yes and our it's part of our job to come up with our own stories um I remember when he would hired me and he told me that I thought I won't be able to come up with stories where am I going to find stories I'd always been assigned before that he said you're going to find that you never run out of ideas and I thought oh boy what's he telling I don't believe that for one minute but it's true you just we have so many stories we want to do that we haven't gotten to yet I can't think right now on my feet of a story that I was assigned and I said no to I wish I hadn't or the other way around there are stories I'm sure if I went back through the catalog that I proposed and they said no for whatever reason and I'm still angry about I'm sure this is a an Allied question and and they're the I like these questions because they they're folks who like the news and want to know what's going on what was the most difficult interview or Simon you've done or if you can't give one no no I know you know I for eight years in the 80s I did Face the Nation which is live and when the clock is ticking and you've got about 28 minutes and the person is filibustering and you want to strangle them but you know you can't be furious at someone or hit someone on the air um the pressure that builds up in you to make sure you get all your questions asked at least so this was an interview I did with Margaret Thatcher live television and it was during Iran Contra and she as we know was friend among all the leaders in the world and she came over to the United States to support him during Iran Contra and I said well why are you supporting him he lied to you you said my dear my dear ah the relationship between the United States and Great Britain I asked the same question again but he lied to you I mean you know you say it on follow-up I followed up he lied to you my dear my relationship with with as any in the whole wide world my dear I asked it a third time she snapped totally snapped on live television he said why is it my dear that I seem to love your country more than you do that was the moment of my life where I thought oh please please I'm scared I'm scared open yeah oh my God but the clock ticked and they show ended and I ran home and cried and whatever you do I I was on Bill Buckley's Firing Line as a then young Inquisitor when she was young and she was the guest and I said to her to what EXT you just become leader of the conservative party not the previous to what extent was the fact that you were a woman you know how did that oh and she said I'm not quoting the success do you mind if I tell you that's an exceedingly stupid question and I lacked the wit at that age to say do you mind if I tell you that that's an exceedingly ridiculous answer to a perfectly valid one I thought about that six months later she used to say she used to say because she always got that question and she hated it she used to say well how would I know I've never been a man if you say you asked her what's the difference how would I know she was pretty good at that um you may or may not want to answer this question and it's not what you think it is what if I who are your who are your top three most respected journalists that you've worked with or even just just watched as well Mike Wallace for sure um boy I'm going to stop at Mike and tell you an amazing story about Mike so here's the reason that I went to 60 minutes he brought me there so of course I adored him so one day he calls me into his office and he said Leslie you're never gonna make it until you learn to ask an embarrassing question without being embarrassed hmm I know and I thought well I'm never going to get there if it's embarrassing it's going to show because I'm embarrassed and he said you have to work on it he said I can do it and he said Barbara can do it and you've got to get yourself there and the it's not a funny thing but your respect for him I understand that survived some of the things we've heard about his behavior and a metoo age would not have been he was he had redeeming qualities he would he would every one of his uh colleagues he would steal stories from us me too um there was there was never a moment ever that someone on the show was not talking to Mike Wallace but everybody forgave him he he had a I don't want to say kind side but he he was a mensch and a brilliant journalist and I personally liked him very much um loved him where as Ted kafel you say we're almost at the end of our time and we're not going to run over like he need Affiliates do on Nightline used to drive people crazy he would say I'm telling our Affiliates we're going over five minutes and they would you know we got this program to put on at 12. at CBS they just pulled a plug you'd be talking and would go to commercial um actually so there's one question more before the final question you've been saving well it has to do with it has to do with the change in the news business now look everybody of a certain age thinks things were better in the old days so the tomatoes were better it's a line from Atlantic City where hoodlum says to Bert Lancaster boy that Ocean Atlantic Ocean is great he said you should have seen it in the old days I get that but it does seem to me that that there are changes in the news business that maybe it's generational that are of concern in terms of the commitment to news in terms of the resources given into news yeah you you've been you've been at your stand for quite a while what do you see well I'm like you and not I always question whether it is because I'm older but I feel deeply that because of technology I blame technology for all of this that we've lost one the time to think because of Technology an event happens and the correspondent or reporter has to say something instantly there's no time to make a phone call there's no time to get another opinion that's just one problem the other problem is that because there are so many outlets now and so much competition for each news division that the audience for each one is getting smaller and smaller that means revenue is lost and it's an expensive business that we're in particularly television news is expensive especially if you get to travel the way we do and so when I say I despair I despair for Broadcast News in general and and not just because of the fear that the quality will be so diluted and diminished just because no no one Outlet will be able to afford US and you are so lucky and in my career I was so lucky because when I would go out for Nightline um first of all they give you time to do the peace and you know yeah so you're going to travel for a couple of days you're going to interview then you're going to come back and think about it and if you need seven or eight minutes which in television terms is pretty generous rupees not two you'll take that there's a story that Katie tur tells in her first book where she's um flying out one of the candidates maybe it's Trump and she gets a call from the desk saying um you got to go live in four minutes and Katie says to say what I mean I literally just got here well you gotta you're on the air I'm sure and wow you know obviously 60 Minutes does not have that problem at all and but that's pretty I'm sure that's not an unusual story well your look CBS people are lucky because you don't have a cable network seriously right right we don't well we're we do have streaming services yeah okay but this the idea that that you hit the ground and you're on the air with no time to research and no time to check facts and no time to think yeah so what you get is you know a kind of superficial thing so who remembers Eric Severide oh you all remember so Eric was once asked to write a second commentary for some other Outlet because he was doing the evening news with Walter Cronkite and then he was asked to write a second commentary and he said no no I only think once a day yeah yeah these poor people are out there putting things on the air constantly how many times do they have to go out and do live shots is what they're called well we haven't even talked about the the more amusing aspect of cable news which is how they cover things like the Trump indictment and now the motorcade is moving down 16th Street and Harrison Avenue that Avenue Harrison aimed of course after Benjamin Harrison the 17th president of the United States I believe that would be Alexis yes hybrid and you just want to just stand up just want to say for God's sakes do this you know so now we're at the courtroom tell us for the 15th of well he'll walk through these doors you'll notice there's Riders on the door then he'll open the door and then it'll turn to the right and what did you notice from the three seconds well he looked really worried to me you know that's the part of the business that I laugh so I do not weep you make me feel I feel so lucky I know I am so I ask all everybody at this forum the same question you have answered it Optimist or pessimist about where we're headed it sounds like you pretty dark after us the Deluge yeah look I'm worried but I think everybody in this room just to be clear about this you know given the circumstances of the last week this is something that Leslie stole did not have to do um she did it she answered these questions Taylor after this we're going out to drink and I think all of us not just for tonight but for the last several decades oh you a debt of gratitude for Leslie [Music] [Applause]

Channel: The 92nd Street Y, New York

Views: 167,180

Keywords: 92nd Street Y, 92nd Street Y New York, 92NY

Id: 5JlL7fl5q74

Length: 56min 26sec (3386 seconds)

Published: Fri Apr 28 2023