KDE Dev Reacts To Linus' New Linux Video! And tries some of the challenges!

this time i've been told there's actually something interesting to talk about in the latest linux video which is titled trying to do simple tasks on linux and it does really seem interesting so let's give it a go anything is easy if you know exactly what you're doing again i have never watched it this is the first time but by the same token anything can be difficult or even impossible if you lack the requisite skills resources or knowledge or if you're not used to it so let's see what the tasks are while the main idea behind the linux daily driver challenge is to evaluate the linux experience from a gamer's perspective even the most architects usually want to do other things on their pc like print i never game so i don't know anything about that document or watch a video and those things need to not only be possible so with that in mind we've set a time limit for each of our tasks of 15 minutes oh i love this like this kind of challenges to do very normal things i love them it's very cool in preparation for this part of the challenge i practiced using play on linux by installing notepad plus plus and i hope that if i really need some other windows application that's going to come in handy what for me if it doesn't i also have a working windows 10 virtual machine that i set up using kvm which will it trend on what in a browser and often for free in preparation for this part of the challenge i practiced using play play on linux on linux by installing notepad plus plus and i hope that if i really need some other communication i actually never had heard of that if it doesn't i also here are the challenges you must surmount in whatever order you please cut and paste a file from one drive oh man i was expecting them to come up with some stuff that's really challenging so just like in windows control x and i will paste it to my kingston that's it it is done 3.9 gigs wait how the hell is this 1 minute and 50 seconds already what happened what did you cut here playing it back yes i do appreciate the irony of trying to play success.mkv and having it just be a black screen okay so i guess what happened is that the file didn't actually transfer already is that what happens also admire how luke did this in 15 seconds linus is already at two minutes nice oh no and i'm following linus because he's using kd plasma so okay step one complete i mean i really didn't consider that this might take me longer than like a couple of seconds me neither just like it doesn't take longer than a couple of seconds to go to lttstore.com check out this is really annoying mac os does this too there's no refresh button in dolphin is there none we can't force this running on let me check let's go check if there is a refresh button of any sort so now of course you can just press f5 that that kind of like goes behind a point you need to have a button that a user would actually know about i've seen comments saying oh but it's like browsers you should know but i thought no it's it's a file manager you wouldn't expect out of the box f5 to be the shortcut to refresh and it's a very nice feature but you can't just say he should have done that and it shouldn't so is there um for 13 more actions what is it view refresh well okay that was okay that was not not easy to find i'll admit that however that wasn't like too hard either i gotta say because it was okay it was very hidden that's very that's where it was underneath view or it had to show the menu bar otherwise there wouldn't be like a context menu okay fair enough i mean it's three context menus inside of it but okay i'll take the criticism i understand linus here what's next i know what the philosophy is the philosophy is you're not supposed to need to refresh no i mean yeah i guess but you can refresh if you want and you can even add the button let me show you again i don't expect lynus to know this but it's not too hard either look at here it's done that's it it took less it took me less to add the refresh button than linux to actually move that file sometimes i do sorry so you need to have the button sorry yeah look at here it's done that that was it you cannot do it it's just i'm still angry about this from like seven or eight years ago or when the file is here okay for some reason vlc launches now did it just take that long to cancel the move operation it did i am grabbing a smaller file trying to install teamviewer.txt i'm cutting sorry what is this oh there's a list of tasks there cut paste file okay digitally signed pdf okay this is going to take longer than 15 minutes like for sure for sure success only nine minutes challenge two digitally signed this okay so it's 15 minutes not specifically installed any kind of pdf reader so this is the default yeah oh this is looking promising oh draw a rectangle to indicate hey let's let me try ocular how do i actually sign a pdf um why do i always mess up with my apps let's take bella and then oh it's digitally sign sorry oh that's very nice okay that was annotation but if i click on digital assign nothing happens this is like draw a rectangle to insert a signature field okay like this there are no availables in singing certificates okay so if i click here what pops up the help center what is this from 2000 like 19 something well at least there's a guy to do it so it can't be that difficult and i hope that linus didn't have many issues with it the signature field okay dude the signatures this size is too small to read no i'm just gonna sign it there are no available signings okay same as me man i thought i was gonna be done this in like one minute and he got the guide sign i'm assuming i'm not going to be able to sign it because i'm assuming this is just a a reader uh is there something on here yeah i know what i know this is signing certificate okay you can get free trusted certificates from the let's encrypt it or we can use the mk cert okay i've never digitally signed a document but you should like that's very easier and intuitive tool come on yes i know andy it's clear that this is a thing that you can do and it's something that i could figure out if i had another half and half yeah i agree with them here unless he screwed up something that i don't know about digitally signings should be easier and honestly open it up and let's see what it actually says here you can add digital signature blah blah blah you need to have proper p p k c as signing certificates the system why what is this like come on a random user won't be able to understand the current user home slash dot pki dot nssdb like come on this won't help us i agree with i think that delp center in general is not very helpful to the average user no sorry about the help center is this even like updated recently or something uh i don't think so honestly i've never seen any merch requests related to the help center but i could have missed them our background is not the color of the cells the black background is just an image oh yes yes yes here we go here we go here we go okay you just have to find exactly the right spot export as image hey what is he using you just have to find exactly what's just what is it okay why did it default yeah it looks like yeah yes okay i needed a w here and i well at least it did this one it's okay so this is adding a new font and hopefully this should be easy but i'm just going to copy it to my s now you click on it what just happened did that just copy to the why would it do that i dragged this onto a folder but because arc is some completely separate application that doesn't integrate properly with dolphin it just goes it just dumps it into the folder instead of specifically on the folder i'm dragging it to yeah that sounds like an issue yeah so i have to open this folder then copy it okay i can open okay zone that works at least sorry what is this k font view oh yeah install install do you want to install the font person systemwide come on yes did you do it i'm gonna change my user interface to it all right i mean i've seen that in part two he already had a weird font so i was pretty sure is was going to do this unless somebody else set up the font for him in the previous video so yeah print that document okay hold on what was that printer printers what is this i even have an hp printer it's a samsung that's going to be whoa whoa whoa whoa oh are you kidding me does it there it is samsung clp 310 series okay add new printer in the printer it's actually from kelly plasma or i mean kd as a whole or is this like a major edition edition do we have actually the printer and sorry printers and at printer oh no not so bad okay and then [Music] manual uri okay well it's not so bad this printer is actually a pain in the ass to get working on windows because i think the last time it got a driver was either vista or windows linux i actually have it saved to a folder on my server because there's no other place that i can find it or i can but it's a real chore you have to like extract it from some other like it's um this just worked as far as i can tell but until i actually see the page i'm not ready to believe it it's right to it for the actual page let's go andy the lights flashing it's flashing come on clp did it work yeah that's very nice to hear usually setting up printers is such a mess for me so that's very nice to hear i'm happy compress and send okay all the files right click compress okay compress compress compress here that's it why is it dot zip dot u q j okay well that brings up wait seriously nothing why would it put that there oh my oh that's not that's not a good idea is it that's uh very bad is there any very large file inside of it chart.png looks like there's no pdf maybe a video is very large but i don't think so is that that's probably uh like a temporary file is it it's open archive not a zip archive it's a youtube oh come on it was supposed to be super simple this one nope it just is broken perfect i'm going to compress to a zip holy crap andy you know what i think i just fell for the same thing that i said i wouldn't fall for again press here as dot zip it was doing it down here and i didn't oh come on okay i mean luckily people don't usually have screens that large and as far as usability goes i now understand all of the messages that were sent like in the past few days in the visual design kde chat but like i thought i mean come on how can you not see a notification on the bottom right now i understand but that's such a weird monitor so i'm going to bleep you're holding it wrong linus you're holding it wrong now how could you how could we improve that now there are there were a couple of ideas from dvd chat i didn't quite follow the discussion but uh like one of the latest that i've seen is to actually display if that's possible like progress bar on the file itself which be which would be of course the best but actually hard part is implementing it i don't think you can that easily know which is the temporary file to display the loading into it but if it if that's possible yeah that's something that could be improved but to my personal opinion it's not like super important because again like for real usually people don't have that big of a screen and you can see the notification another thing was trying to make notification a bit more visible flashing i don't know but probably he wouldn't have seen that either so yeah notice so i guess the the six characters or whatever here [Music] is just but i mean it was right while it's attacking the fact that size was increasing i could have guessed i like it let's do it with that i guess tscu comic there we go are these files gonna compress at some point oh that's why that's why he had comic sans in the previous video see dolphin you're embarrassing yourself okay let's try and do it in i forget what this one is called it doesn't matter archive now toulouse is that nautilus might be at least it prompts me for what i want to call it i don't see any kind of progress where is dolphin dolphin we don't what's the name if we don't prompt for anything where is it take me a couple of files like this too if we compress a zip what's the resulting file name the name of the folder i mean okay what happened is really the name of the folder i mean not very pretty i gotta agree with him here as an indicator are you kidding me am i going to fail to zip a file this is not uploading i was kind of hoping that i was going to be able to do every single task in underfoot this one is clearly stalled hold on maybe p-zip's got me still hold on so this is this is all the stuff okay copy then i can go into downloads zip folder 15 minutes yes this is the workaround oh my god 10 minutes remaining to copy these files this is another thing that i definitely can do it just i mean come on come on that's a bit unfair is this actually significantly faster to zip files in windows because that was like the only issue i've seen and if it's slow on linux if it's low on windows as well i mean okay the usability of the pop-up seeing that the progress is in progress okay but even if you do see the pop-up and it's too slow to actually finish in 15 minutes you can't blame linux i guess he said that the task was stalled which could be but again very large files i guess wait wait no i'm good i'm good the the first one i did in dolphin it's done i think nice wait no i didn't get the point i'm supposed to send them yeah maybe i can weasel my way out of this a little yellow what do you mean by compress and send does that email it or something well i mean there's a three gigabyte file in it so emailing it's not really practical see that's your issue i mean of course it's going to take a while is it actually faster on windows emailing it's not really practical oh well i mean i already zipped the whole thing including the video because like okay i'm giving myself the points i could i could have emailed this to someone yeah i mean come on okay all right okay well i can i can really cool if i search for a snipping tool it actually is like haha we don't have that but we do have spectacle wait wait wait screenshot spectacle screenshot capture capture utility why would you call it snip i mean if you i mean why wouldn't you search for screenshot like what did you search for again this is really cool if i search for a snipping tool why would you search for a snipping tool come on at least stop a snip when actually expect spectacle pops up i guess i guess you wouldn't see it but i mean screenshot and you do get spectacle it actually is like haha we don't have that but we do have spectacle which is a pretty cool little screenshotting tool and then you can do drag a little thing press enter and that's it i did it one minute now i have to make a shortcut okay just drag it anywhere you want it and make a shortcut so no i will find another way to do that link to file or directory wait is trying to do a shortcut on the desktop can i try to do that one sec why do i have 15 applications or open go away okay so if i drag this here are you kidding me you just literally have to drop take it and drag it to the desktop hey hello take it and drag it to the desktop and then click on link and that's it how did he not see that okay he did create sim link no okay i did right click and then create new link to file okay name for the link is pretty pretty easy to say and then you can click on this button and actually select the i mean it can't fit this it can't it's too easy to do this yes this is a much better way of doing this haha i mean you could just drag and drop it for new length okay can i copy the location yes i can ha-ha did you work okay done i had an earth attack to that copy-paste the what how did he even got the path to the file from what is it copy copy location ctrl alt c okay okay that's fine it works uh connect to a network sure again dolphin we do have network um and then there's these things servorino does it actually work for me i don't think so might be the old one but i mean share folder pretty easy is actually crazy easy because while i am using samba on my linux thank you ah nas it's a linux nas so network yeah so network shared folders ladder server oh does it want me to like map a network share i mean that's not really necessary i can just add a shortcut to this right here see did you i'm gonna call that good enough so now every time i open up dolphin i just click linus and it will go to my share that's it like that okay is it a samba file because for those there were actually many improvements in the last year i think i've seen many patches from nate and it's very nice that it actually worked out of the box there's at least one thing we can safely cross out as everything went super well also i think links went super well here but your mileage might vary compressing in files failed copying failed yeah thanks a lot dolphin you suck ah that was not fair come on is this uh no i mean there's not really any reason to say that dolphin did not perform badly in any way except for actually not making notifications more visible but that's not dolphin that's plasma so that dolphin did everything good okay there's not a refresh button in very like in plain sight but honestly the refresh button use case is such a niche one that it's fine to leave it to a more slightly hidden contacts menu or customization so i don't think this is fair to say dolphin doesn't sucks i think it's a good fight manager i'm biased not that i ever worked on anything about dolphin i never touched dolphins co to be clear but i did i do use it every day for years and i do work on plasma so yeah set up discord app these curtains start open on start that's in settings isn't it let's check and you can simply search for start third startup [Music] you do get autostart and you can add at application and then now what was it discord i don't have discord but it oh i do sorry and you just click it and that's it come on you can do this i believe in you i think it might just do that by default the first thing i'm going to do then is just test that i'm feeling good andy i got this hey okay it was even simpler than that it was just on by default but if it wasn't or if it was on a third-party application it would have been super easy to actually add it to the startup application so very good okay apparently i had already configured this so another point for linus yep watch 4k content okay video dot mp4 where'd it go hello wait it goes black in full screen what up is that well vlc why okay i grabbed mpv media player official repository community version because that seemed like do i have any player foreign boom full screen solved okay like gorgeous guy i gotta say i think mpv is one of the best video players out there i just i also use it as you can see here it just works like it just okay it doesn't have everything that vlc has but it just works challenge number 12 watch hdr content as far as i can tell this is basically just james rubbing in that i have not been able to consume any hdr content this month here's everyone's gonna fail so i feel pretty good other than digitally signing my i felt pretty good too i would feel even better if you didn't see that dolphin sucks but okay pdf i managed to complete all of my possible challenges but that doesn't mean that the road to get here was as painless as what you just saw i've had a very frustrating issue where any amount of windows movement especially meanwhile on manjaro kde i've had a relatively smooth experience i do have little complaints like that the show desktop button doesn't actually minimize anything okay we keep hearing this i think that there's some even developers that want this but okay you can't like you can easily very easily change to that one personally i prefer the show desktop but i can understand that it's very very subjective and i don't know if it will ever change by default so easily but we do get that complaint a lot that's true and as soon as you grab a focus application everything comes ripping back onto the screen or yet the application i mean that's the intended use case from what i can understand is quickly grabbing something from the desktop be it a file or a widget if you need to interact one second from a widget in the desktop or take a fighter and drag and drop it somewhere i guess that's what it's supposed to do but if you prefer minimize all i guess patient labels are underneath the window previews when you cycle through with alt tap we do want to change the task manager to be this one i mean okay we is a very general generic word there is some interest from developers from some developers to change it to this and from what i've seen i think that this will event eventually succeed maybe it did already and i didn't see they didn't follow this very much i actually don't remember changing it to thumbnails so okay but yeah this complaint will hopefully fall as soon as we go for a thumbnail as we sure if we do and i think at this point we will that's what i had seen from the latest like discussions i might be wrong making them harder to read but overall if all i needed to do was run a web browser do some basic word processing i wouldn't have anything to complain about installing and managing applications on the other hand has made me wish that my papa yeah that i mean that's purpose i won't say anything experience hadn't been so discouraging manjaro has a graphical package manager called pamac if you had been using i don't know discover you'd be happier but okay i don't know i don't i don't know how good pamaque is but i love this cover i i think it has so many nice features and there's a lot of hate for discover but i think that lately it has improved a lot that allows applications to be installed in a couple of clicks but by default it contains only some of the things i need it can be unlocked to search for flat pack snap and aur packages no by default it contains only some of the things i need it can be on uh okay okay i unders no i don't no i i don't fully agree here because i still think that proposing to a user four different places to install apps from is so confusing like you can say okay i want to install this okay we're from like the official arch little repositories or from the hour or from snap or from flatback and the user is going to go like what and i i don't think that having all of them enabled by default is a good idea it should be easy to enable them but look at here how to enable blah blah blah for beginners through per mac ui so it should be like pressing some button i guess package system blah blah blah to allow developers okay there's not the actions are out of the screen but it shouldn't be too hard to do this and i don't think that it should be on by default honestly for flat pack maybe you could say that i don't want to say snap and flatbacks are bad at all but you could you could say like we should use flashbacks by default and show users flatbacks just but if you do have the arch linux linux repository by default then you shouldn't in my opinion also have snap and flashbacks snap and aur packages which dramatically yeah it was just like a butterfly increases its usefulness but if this manjaro developer is to be believed these non-official sources can result in downtime and if they do everything is working as intended and you're installing third party untrusted that's why it's disabled by default you know fortunately i haven't really encountered that yet though i have never seen anything bad on the horror either but you never know i have only been at it for a few weeks but yours it's this kind of hit or miss functionality that is turned using my computer from something that i do for fun into something that feels more like work okay here's one miraculously the browser source plugin that i needed for obs was available in pamac through the arch user repository okay but the thing is i ended up only stumbling upon that by finding a post referring to it as i was fighting my way through attempting to manually copy the plugin files into the appropriate system folders which in fairness to me was based on a guide i found and actually got me really close i was able to launch obs but as soon as i tried to actually use that source it would crash now i understand that this is totally a power user thing to do but it's also absolutely something that a gamer particularly a game streamer yeah again we're getting the gamer stuff which i don't know anything about so is there anything else some of my dumbest problems have been caused by my default file manager dolphin among other things it does not allow the user to copy anything into a folder that requires administrative privileges that's for security reasons and i think it's actively actively been worked upon with no obvious way to override it in the gui yeah and i've run into this twice so far adding insult to injury the community responses to this user who shared my concern that not everyone wants to copy files using the terminal and that linux should allow the user to do what they want to do with their computer were some of the most painfully condescending and stubborn things that i've had the displeasure of reading throughout this challenge now i lost my link to the tweet unfortunately but i saw an interesting criticism of this series that basically accused me and luke of intentionally smearing linux and its developers because we were going to come into this with a basic windows gamer perspective and try to do things no i don't think they're doing that i've seen also this from even like inside the kd community people saying that they're doing on purpose to like mess things up and trying to do drama i don't think they're doing that personally i don't think it's the way that they do things well news flash guys that's most people he's right i mean that's not a reason for which we should copy windows and every time the reason in vdg to do something is because windows does that we shoot that down that's not a valid argument however the idea of someone coming from windows to kd plasma that should be able to understand how things work is not that far off because it is right like most people pretty much 90 percent of everyone coming to linux from the first time are going to be from windows or like 80 and it should be understandable and i don't think that the criticism of like bashing linux because it doesn't work like windows is fur but that's not what they're doing they're coming in and trying to do things and whenever it doesn't work it's not quite because of their doing in the windows way but it's because linux doesn't work when popos died it was popo's fault when whatever problem they had like the digital signature that was linux fault and more specifically i don't know what to blame exactly but the fact that arc couldn't track things into the right directory that's linux fault it's not like oh it's because he used to use windows and he doesn't understand if linux works that that's unfair to him and if you legitimately like in your heart of hearts want linux desktop to grow you need to accommodate those people he's right which doesn't mean that we should copy windows but we should make sure that the experience of people coming from windows to linux isn't so you can sit there and go am i out of touch no it's the users who are wrong but you are you're literally a meme at that point the only question is whether you're self-aware or not well that depends something that the good eggs in the linux community need to understand though is that you guys are great and there's lots of you it's just that it only takes a couple of toxic gatekeepers to turn people off and that's also why i really don't like at all people get keeping like not even gatekeeping but fanboying kelly plasma uh like shooting on gnome i should swear less this video is going to get demonetized by the way yeah i understand you like the plasma i also do but that is not a good reason to go to gnome users and saying that gnome is bad gnome is not bad it's pretty darn good as a desktop environment and even if i don't use it because it doesn't fit my use case it doesn't mean that we should go out install them now if some user comes and say okay linux i'm trying out linux for the first time and these things didn't work for me the right approach here and hopefully i didn't fall for that in this video is not to say okay you user are stupid and you're doing things wrong because you come from windows but is to actually do some investigating like what's wrong in the approach you're taking to do to achieve something and maybe the result of that is that it is an issue but we can't quite solve it because to solve it that would mean to like uh to actually make the experience more enjoyable for windows user that would mean that it would diminish the experience for linux ones and maybe we don't accept that and that's fine but that doesn't mean that we should bash windows people that come to linux because of that we need to be friendly regardless even if they come and criticize linux that's the point that they're telling us what's wrong and sometimes if you use linux for years it's not that easy to understand it some things seem obvious to us and horrend and maybe those can get fixed like you got to remember it's not always easy for people to reach out and ask for help and if a literal developer of their distro goes out of their way to type extra unnecessary words to be condescending when they could have just pointed the user to the resources that they needed it is extremely damaging to the good work that the majority is trying to do and there has been so much of that good work on display throughout this project i mean getting my windows vm which i've only ended up needing to ingest and that was it that was actually kind of interesting there were some good points i think i don't know how much like there was a lot of discussion in kde related chats on if there's anything to improve there was lots of linuses stupid don't listen to him and lots of linux sucks and we've been doing everything wrong i'm just kidding but there's been a lot of discussion about this hopefully it brings something nice and i don't think that linux did that bad in this video at all it's sad that some basic use cases that could have just worked didn't but there's always room to improve again i think that the digital signature is the best example of that i would have very like that that yeah sorry about that anyway it's 40 minutes already so i think i can and this there the year and thank you for everything i hope that something nice came out of this anyway from tomorrow and on i'll get back to normal schedule of doing development and other things so see you there i guess stay subscribe that sort of things

Channel: Niccolò Ve

Views: 9,018

Rating: 4.8490567 out of 5

Keywords: KDE, KDE Plasma, DEVLOG, DEVBLOG

Id: ENBu9_xTrWU

Length: 41min 25sec (2485 seconds)

Published: Mon Dec 06 2021