Joe and Matt Walsh Disagree Over Gay Marriage

The Joe Rogan Experience I think of marriage is is a certain thing which is the um the context for uh for procreation for the for the the building of the the nuclear family what about people that get married that don't have kids are you opposed to that what if they get married they decide you know we don't need kids I'm going to get fixed you get your tubes tied let's travel the world well what do you mean am I opposed to it I mean I I think that uh that every married couple should be open to life but what if they don't want to do are you opposed to them being married if marriage is only for procreation and to bond a family together what about people that are deeply in love that never want to have children I don't think it's it's not only procreation but that is one of the fundamental definitional uh uh aspects of it of course there's more to marriage just than that and what about people that are infertile they've fallen in love and they realize that they can have babies they don't really necessarily want to adopt is that okay for them to be married because then you're by definition marriage falls into a completely different thing because then it's a bond of love it's a union of love sure I mean that doesn't change the nature of of marriage though it's a little bit like um I say that uh what's the definition of a woman well a woman is someone who by her nature can conceive children in her womb and their children and then the response is always what about women who are infertile does that does that destroy your definition of woman and it it doesn't because you know it's still it's still a woman's nature to Bear children not every woman will and there will be disease and infertility and and old age and all these things that will preclude that but it's still it's still of her nature to do so um and I would say the same thing for marriage I mean it's it is natural in a marriage for for procreation to occur it's not always going to happen in reality though but that's still that's still one of the natural functions of marriage and and uh married couples who can't conceive children there are other ways to um be parents like adoption for example if they want to right but if people want to be married and don't want to ever have children are you opposed to them being married well I'm not I'm not I would Advocate a law that would prevent it but would it change the definition of what their marriage is to you because they don't want to have a family they just want to have a loving Bond I think this will be a couple that is rejecting one of the fundamental aspects of marriage and they they should be they they should be open to to life I would hope that in the future they would be but but isn't that just a personal choice I mean you can have a very fulfilling life if you just follow your Pursuits and your dreams and your your interests and you find someone that shares those interests with you and you share time together it's very fulfilling it's a loving yeah it's a it's a person it's a personal choice and that I'm not advocating for like a law that says you if you're a marriage you have to have you have to have X number of kids um but then why are you opposed to two gay people doing that well because because again it's it's it's not about Choice it's about what this institution marriage is an institution and what is it and what purpose does it serve and I I I do not agree with um tearing down or or changing this definition especially because the people who have changed the definition haven't come up with a new one so they say well that's not what marriage is so for thousands of years we said marriage is the procreative Union and then we had the other side came along and said well it's not that okay well then like what is it exactly and I know you said well it's people who love each other two people love each other well but then why two people why do they have to love each other um you know all these kinds of questions you get into what if they're they're in the same family what if brothers and sisters want to marry and I know every time that comes up you know the advocates for gay marriage will say well that's a slippery slope argument that's fallacious but it's actually not it's like we're trying to get to what do you even think this institution is now since you've rejected out what we were saying it was and um and I've never found a a compelling definition and any definition offered it's like it's like well what do you what's even the point then why do we even need this now I just don't see how a gay marriage in any way damages a straight marriage I don't I don't see it at all it doesn't make any sense to me it just seems to me that if people want to be look if you if you wanted to look at logic especially in our modern society which is pretty [ __ ] when it comes to relationships it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 50 of all marriage is in a divorce anyway they don't make it you know if I don't know if anything would damage marriage and damage the institution of marriage it's the option of divorce I don't think gay people and gay people getting married in any way shape or form changes a bond that you have with your wife it's just called marriage it's a human invented thing if we decide that gay people can get married too I just don't see how it damages anything I don't think it tears down the definition of marriage in any way it just opens up the possibility that people who are gay won't be discriminated against yeah I don't think that a a gay couple existing uh directly impacts you know there's a gay couple and you know wherever and and I'm with my wife and in our house like obviously there's not um but I'm talking about I'm talking about on the individual level I'll talk about on this on the societal level right I would agree that um divorce especially uh you know uh there's no fault divorce rampant divorce I don't think it's as high as 50 I know that that's the that's often quoted I'm not sure where that comes from but um it is high it's like it's too high and Chris Rock has a great joke about that and so those are just the people with the courage to get out it's like how many cowards stay but it's also it's also true that the advocates for what we call now traditional marriage which I just call marriage but the advocates for traditional marriage put themselves at a disadvantage by allow especially in the churches like allowing this rampant divorce to occur um and then you've already sort of given up on some marriage is supposed to be monogamous and uh and permanent as well as procreative well you've given up monogamy and permanence and so now it's not that's that's two of the three legs gone and so now this assault was waged on the procreative part of it and it was just it was it was difficult to withstand it because the institution had already been weakened so I agree with you there um but my answer to that is to try to reinforce what marriage is not to just give up on it entirely and I I still think you're left with this question of like if marriage is not what I'm saying it is then what why do we even need it what's the point I mean you're saying it's a it's a man-made Institution yeah but you but you're also like the way that you're presenting it it's it's also it's a totally meaningless institution no they don't need it at all no it's not meaningless because it means something to the people that get married so it's just it's just a subjective symbolic thing I mean what yeah so it's kind of what it is look there's a massive responsibility when you're married and when you have children to keep your family together and you raise and keep everybody happy and healthy and this great reward to that yeah but it doesn't always work out it's not it's not a it's people change people are [ __ ] up that doesn't it doesn't always work and so I don't think it should be outlawed because 50 of the people fall apart just like I don't think it has any effect whatsoever on a straight couple if a gay couple decides that they want to make it official and that's what it is to them it gives them a feeling that that they're accepted and appreciated and that they're not discriminated against because they happen to be homosexual so but what you're articulating to me is the damage that's done buy gay marriage to the institution of marriage but how is it done how is that in any way damage straight people because we are making the institution meaningless but it's not meaningless it's very meaningful to the people that have it subjective symbolic and it's about your own personal feelings isn't it though well no I I would say that it's not it's well if it's not subjective and it's not symbolic codifies and protects and uh gives a name to a thing that actually exists which is which are you know man woman couples creating people creating creating babies um but not always right but again that's that's still the that's still the nature of the Union so but what are the percentage of people today that are married that don't have children I bet it's pretty high amongst heterosexuals probably is there something wrong with that I think there is something wrong with that I think it there is something wrong with you know getting married and saying or just we don't We're not gonna have any kids at all but why is there something wrong with that if someone's personal choice why would that why is it wrong that two people are like you know I am deeply committed to work and I don't want to sacrifice any of my career and I don't want to ruin a kid because I'm constantly at the office but that's where I get deep satisfaction and and that's that's what I'm focused on and the woman says that's great because I don't want children either I really am attached to my interest in my career and what I like to do that's not damaging your relationship with your wife and your family it's I don't certainly I certainly don't think of it as a threat to my marriage or my family yeah it's uh it is a personal choice right but shouldn't people be allowed to make those personal choices like isn't that a fundamental aspect of what it means to be American to have that freedom well right yeah but right now we're not talking about what people are allowed to do I'm not saying well we're talking about marriage gay marriage okay we we were just discussing straight couples who treat a couple of students that's also a personal freedom issue isn't it yeah but and I'm not saying that that straight couple should be legally required to have kids but I you know if you're asking me do I think it's the right choice to just get married and choose not to have kids ever I I do not think that that's the right choice am I it's their it's their choice but people can make choices that are wrong is it wrong if they have a fulfilling and wonderful life together with that choice if their their thing is that they just want to have a bond between the two of them to just like take it to the next level let everybody know like we are married if I die my money's going to go to Helen and if Helen dies you know I you know I'm gonna mourn her because she was my wife and I'll be a widower like to some people that distinction gives them peace and security and makes them feel better about the relationship that they're both so committed that they've legally signed documents that say that they're Bound by law and under the eyes of God or whatever you believe in yeah they're they're able to make that choice but I think you're rich they're still rejecting one of the purposes of marriage and in the scenario that you just outlined you're also deciding to live a really self-centered life you're saying what if you're not what if your work is very charitable what if it benefits Humanity in a deep way well if you spend a lot of time doing you know Health Care work and you know and social work and you're you're deeply committed to your community it's not selfish at all you're just dedicating your time to something other than raising new human beings yeah that's dedicating your life to enhancing other human beings that are around you that's a hypothetic he's a hypothetical so is yours right yeah but I think most of the people that choose like we're not gonna have kids and and the the rate of those rates are declining um and the age when people first have kids is also going up and all that yeah most of the people that are making these choices I don't I don't think it's because they're involved in charity work I do think that it is more the the scenario you outline in the the first time around which is just like well this is what I'm doing you know I have my job I don't want to give it up yeah um but don't you think that people should have the freedom to live their life in that way I think human beings vary widely in a huge way and I think there's some human beings that find a very fulfilling life just reading books and traveling and experiencing different things and seeing art and doing whatever the [ __ ] they want to do and they don't necessarily have to have kids to live a fulfilling life that way and if they choose to do that with someone who they have a loving bond with and who they get married to I don't think it's a bad thing that they don't want to have kids well I think I guess we have to maybe we're running into a question of of you know now you get to the real fundamental question if it's a fundamental Freedom thing yeah we're not disagreeing I guess on the Freedom aspect of it because again I'm not saying that you should be required to have kids so you're imposing your sensibilities and what you think is important in life to other people but everybody has a different idea of what's important without hurting anyone the thing is like what I'm saying is these people that are that are married that don't have children they're not harming anyone they're not harming these unborn children that they never have they're not harming anyone and it doesn't affect your relationship with your family and your marriage at all yeah but I'm also not I'm not imposing myself on them or harming them by answering a question about about how I feel about their choices right but nor are gay people doing that to you I think the harm comes from on a societal level when we start breaking down these basic uh Central institutions like the institution of the family in a marriage that's where the harm comes from and the more that people believe the more that we build a society where it's believed that marriage is objectively meaningless right it's it's entirely subjective it's just about it's just not making you feel better um the more that we build a society like that I think the that's where the harm comes in the worse it is and people are going to reject marriage um and uh and that means more you know fewer kids are being born also more kids are being born in a context where they don't have that stable family structure so the harm definitely comes it may not be this immediate you know connect the dots thing but uh yeah and when we can already see that

Channel: PowerfulJRE

Views: 5,226,443

Keywords: Joe Rogan Experience, JRE, Joe, Rogan, podcast, MMA, comedy, stand, up, funny, Freak, Party

Id: I957o08voU0

Length: 14min 49sec (889 seconds)

Published: Tue Nov 08 2022