How to Destroy a Perfectly Fine Ford 5.4L 3v Triton Engine with a Timing Job!

hey guys what's up welcome back to the Forte Makey loo channel uh real quick today I want to show you this 2014 Ford Expedition that's here in the shop this truck has been through the mill uh so a little backstory in the vehicle um has about 112,000 mies on it it's young my my eyes uh barely broken in and it had a tapping know he ticking tapping noise and another shop uh he had a do worked on um said it was the roller followers and lash Jers completely agree um because they're they're common failure Point especially 09 and newer so he said okay well uh you guys got to do that you got to pull all stuff apart it's a lot of Labor just to get in there and change those how about you guys just do a full timing set and uh change the last gers and followers while you're in there we do it that way you know okay yeah so the guy said I'm going to provide my own part he went ahead and gave him a meling water pump and then a meling high volume oil pump great uh and then he gave them a meling timing kit which I don't really agree with I don't like the quality of the parts um but the only thing to know about that meling timing kit is that the one he bought he upgraded and bought on purpose because it had cast iron tensioners to it and you'll see over here that's not what they put in um so then he brought it to he couldn't didn't never ran right after that basically so before his only concern was the ticking and tapping noise from the valve train which is why he brought it them in the first place that's the only concern when he got it back within a few weeks I was having issues where it could not keep oil pressure especially hot and it would cause you know erratic VCT operation phaser oscillation all that stuff so he said I'm done with that shop and he brought it here to get a diagnos to see what is going on uh so long story short man they did one heck of a job on this vehicle and actually ruined his engine so uh hopefully you can get some kind of money back from them or help with a new engine or whatever I said I could put in a Ford remand engine but it's expensive it's over 10 grand nowadays with parts and labor and all the hoses and manifolds and all stuff I change on there so that's the way I do it I do it right and one time only uh so he's going to take it and have some more shop put in a junkyard engineer junk vehicle whatever I don't know before he does that though and before I put it back together I want to show you exactly what I found it's pretty crazy okay before we get into the engine side I want to go over here to the parts cards and show you a few things I found and then do some comparison between the the Ford stuff and the F Market stuff on there very first thing I want to show you though is the oil pan on here so you look at an oil pan here and I'll zoom in so you get some better detail you can see there's some sizable chunks of metal in when I pull some out in my finger it almost looked like sand which is kind of crazy um fine metal in here like this to fine aluminum like that I see that enough in the 543 valves um but when I do see that they've been neglected tension is blown chains flopping around broke the guide and it's starting to work on the cover as you can see here this is the exact path it takes it sags here sags change sags and then it it pulls tight and flops around and rubs right here so you can see right here very small little Mark maybe something down here maybe right there there when these are going for a long time and they're flapping and they're they're they're blown they'll wear into the front cover and there'll be major grooves and sometimes they'll Groove way into right here these reinforcements right here me way into I'm talking 38 of an inch into it um and that's where you the metal would fall and go right into the pan so if I see something like that and I see the the metal in the pan I know it fell directly in the pan generally everything's okay believe it or not as you can see that process barely started here so where's all this metal coming from honestly yeah that's a little worrisome the other indicator of that is on the trigger wheel so the trigger wheel is just like this right it goes here and it bolts on to the the the nose of the crankshaft and the dampener and and everything kind of just squeeze it together so that chains riding riding riding so on the back side here it'll start wearing into it kind of like you see right there but it be way worse be all chewed up in the back side of this trigger wheel when the chain is failing and starting to wear in the components on here didn't see any of that stuff so that's worrisome why is there so much metal well we're going to find out here in a second so going over here again we don't see any real reason why there is that much metal I don't like the quality of the work they did you can see the gasket surfaces were not clean very well uh all this stuff would be cleaned off of there and beautiful uh 2,000 miles later like after I do a tumming job for instance um tension or gasket ceiling surfaces they be clean not well stained like that uh just just stuff like that so that that right there already tells you a a little bit about uh the work they did now as far as oil changes the guy obviously took care of oil changes this looks beautiful inside here so it's a real shame uh that all this happened to this engine but if you start looking at different areas like right here you guys see that right there the gasket surface there's certain areas they a wizard wheel to and they start grinding into it right there there so all that metal if they weren't careful will go right into the engine that grit and everything else here's the other thing I found um the dampener so dampener has this big bolt on it and it's it's it's torque to yield and all that good stuff but the the thing I'm trying to say is that this bolt has a real high torque rating okay so when this bolt went in there and was torqued down properly it'd be really hard to get it off of there you have a big old half inch Drive Impact and it would finally come off this one zing came right off which means they didn't even tighten let alone torque this down when that happened this uh damper was not pressing against the actual sprocket down here which again look at this aftermarket one right here look at the quality of that compared to an old Ford one wow much better quality that's the first thing I say but that dampener comes down gets bolted and torqued down and presses hard against this uh against the nose of the cran shaft and this this little timing gear down here well they didn't tighten it so guess what check this out right here hopefully you can see this let me get you in here you see this right here so here is the nose of the crankshaft here's where that timing gear sits and here's where the uh dampener is pressed on probably up to this point right here okay because this point on it's it's like a conical shaped dampener so the very end of it actually pressed on there that's why you see the marks but right here more importantly is where that that gear sits and it's it sits in a keyway right here um but the only way it stays from vibrating around on there it's not a press fitter and it just slides on the only way it keeps from vibrating around and ruining the crankshaft is by the dampener coming on pressing on and squeezing in between the dampener and right here you can tell right here look at that the whole thing is hammered like crazy right here especially right here you can see the hammering effect because it was loose on there look at that so there's a lot of different things they did to this engine um that that that worries me so let's go over to the parts here so again he used a meling timing chain kit I don't like their parts I think they're very cheap uh that the the the guides the tensioner arms everything but the biggest thing I don't like about them is the chains they use okay so the chains they use this is the kind of chain they use uh clo is the same way now look at this chain look at it from the top side here let me to get you in and get you some detail look at the top edge of it here now you put your finger over it's very Lumpy it's very lumpy as it goes around this is a four chain pretty darn smooth not perfect cuz it's going around a circle here very smooth just side profile there it's very hard to to show but you see how lumpy it looks on here it's say it feels as lumpy as it as it looks and this looks this feels as smooth as it looks so that's the difference there I don't like it because it seems to wear into to the plastic guides more it's not as smooth when it's going down them as tension so this has 2,000 miles on it and you can start to see the wear in there already and maybe this one will show it better some of it right here here we go you see that grooving in there that's from the rough back that's pretty crazy for 2,000 miles yeah I that's why I don't like these F Market kits so the other thing I'll talk about the F Market kit is that again he bought cast iron tensioners which look actually I have a pair over here well these I use the Ford one I use the melon ones this is the Ford one I got these sitting here for a video so this is how it looks so it's a cast iron iron tensioner with ratcheting teeth a lock out right here and you can use these on the three valves and Ford and even like meling and apmarket offer them so he wanted them he thought they were more reliable okay well he bought them and this is what he ends up with on there the old plastic ones the old style plastic ones they have been replaced you can tell by the gasket here so they did replace them but the other thing is this right here so this is this is the other side of the engine here so this is the side that actually sags on the right hand side so this is the a bank one okay so you look at this if I can squeeze it check this out so this is the old one gaskets fine all that good stuff has a really strong spring in there keep tension when the engine's off Right Moves just fine everything's gravy look at this one right here cannot get this one to move mve just a little bit it does not go in all the way so in other words if I were to use this clip right here this clip goes into it goes right here and then locks in here this clip right here here that's how they come once it's timed pop the clip tension's fully out I cannot get this one back even with all my weight to do that where is this one I can do it no problem look at this one little finger on there you see that difference now the other thing I want to talk about because I'm trying to give a lot of information you guys is these aftermarket timing chain these the these timing chain with this weirdo profile see that that is so weird to me I hate seeing those that's Ford that's a market These Chains I don't know who makes them for clo and meling but recently at least the last two years these have been known to break a lot that's bad it's the interference engine I wonder if these cheap inferior tensioners are using they're including in their kits that are coming fully out putting extra stress on those chains and never actually relieving them which was kind of a failure kind of a a design flaw of the ratcheting ones I wonder if they're coming out they're locking solid when this first came out I couldn't even move this at all it was Rock Solid I lean on it Rock Solid now it's star to move this a little bit um I wonder if them fully tensioning out and locking getting hard wedged whatever is actually what's causing These Chains to break you got to think about all this stuff when you go to buy a timing kit and go in there and do this not only is it a lot of work um but it if it breaks it's interference engine means the the valves will kiss the Pistons and you will ruin the engine another thing I noticed that this this this gasket on here is way too flattened for 2,000 Mi they never changed it uh the O-ring for the pump when they changed it which is messed up because when you replace the pump it comes with it from meling another thing I want to talk about so these cam caps are are are are set in order okay so here's a Thrust cap with a thrust washer right here and that keeps it from four and a half uh movement right kind of locates it that one's hard to mess up it's one there's no other one like it but the rest of these cam caps they all look the same see this look it they all look exactly the same what's worse is on the newer vehicle that would say 09 and newer there's no stamping in them indicating which number they are in order see it's totally gone there's no stamping telling you which order these going so uh the way it looks on this guy's vehicle also is that they pull them all off threw them in a pile okay and then they just bolted them back on later on wherever they wanted okay and they didn't know where they went now the problem with that is is that these cam caps are full height full size inside right uh they're they're they're they're bigger than they should be let's just say I don't know how to say it they're bigger than they should be from the factory when they make these heads so when they make the heads they take all these caps that are rough cut let's just say they're rough cut and they bolt them on to the Head without the cam shaft okay so they'll go over when they're building this head they'll take these rough casting caps okay you see that they'll bolt them on there they'll torque them down okay and then they'll take a machine and they'll take a machine and they'll align boore through all of them all at once in their respective positions they'll align bore them to spec whatever that inside diameter should be based on the oil clearance based on the standard spec of the cam shaft journal on there okay so you cannot mix these up because they were aign board as part of the head that's why you cannot buy cam caps because they are part A machined part of the head you cannot mix them up on the same head you canot swap them from head to head they are machined as they are bolted in place okay and there's there's no bearings on these so that is the bearing that's a finished clearance on there is when it align BS it so what I think they did is they pulled them all off and they just put them back down there wherever cuz all of these are the same and that cut into the cam shaft and more importantly it cut into the actual cap if you look at it on here and I've seen a lot of these it's really worn inside of here uh let's see if I can get a better view it's really worn on the inside here and not only that I saw some evidence of burning inside of there so these all look like they've been recently machined because they were put on in the wrong place and they were cut into by the harder cam shaft so the cam shaft's harder than the aluminum here so it actually wore into it I think that's where a lot of is wheel pressure loss is coming from I did a lot of bad stuff so with all this stuff floating around from them wizard Wheeling the covers and the the heads and putting these on the wrong spots and not being clean about it in general they put a lot of stuff down into the pan that gets moved around in there and this is what happened to the brand new oil pump so for comparison here here's an old 543 valve oil pump probably 150,000 miles on it okay now look at it inside side of here notice the wear right here barely any right here looks beautiful right machine surface the wear right here in the face not so bad okay back plate pretty standard for 150,000 mil still smooth and then the gears themselves pretty standard no real flaws here definitely not out of spec by comparison look at this melant oil pump that has 2,000 miles on it look at the grooving in there look at the big chunk taking out right there it's decent grooves right here nothing to cry about and then over here too see it look at all that grooving in there already good amount of wash on this backing plate if you look at it nothing too bad yet but for 2,000 Mi seems excessive same thing the amount of wear on these gears looks excessive for 2,000 miles so that's from all the the actual metal coming through so all that fine metal comes up and through here it goes through a strainer only on the end here let me see if I can get it out of here without causing a catastrophe goes through a large hold strainer it's not going to catch much right because after the pump it's going into the filter well so the pump here is going to take the brunt of it of all that debris coming through so they ruined his new pump too which was an upgraded hard anodized pump which is even more expensive than the other ones so yeah I mean I don't know else is say about this besides it's it's sad to see this kind of work being done out there hopefully they give him a great deal on it because now he's in a real real pickle and uh they're going to have to replace this engine like I said it has oil pressure issues Hots when everything can bleed past all these clearances on here much faster and the old trick is to use if you don't know know it already if you have uh gone through and you've done a proper timing job everything's clean pans clean pickups clean um replace the to the latest roller followers that are have a smaller hole in them if you look at them on here I get one out of here they have a smaller oiling hole on them I know I'm focusing here so you look at there's a small oiling hole on there it's about this you can't see it yeah kind of see it right there see it it's about the size of a pin prick tip there a little pin okay and um this thing will not focus sorry guys there we go so with those all being smaller uh the amount of oil that's flowing out the follower and spraying on to that cam lobe um is is less because a hole is smaller and it's a higher pressure um but it increases the back pressure pressure and the oil log built into the head which adds to the reserve for proper VCT function so we've done a proper timing job including sealing up your tensioners which are probably blown out new followers with that increased the back pressure in whale log high volume oil pump down there clean pickup clean pan you're running 5W30 and you still have phaser oscillation afterwards hot only where once the diet stop signs and all that stuff the old trick is to use heavier oil in this case I recommend Rotella T6 5w 40 full synthetic so in this case before I even pulled it apart to see this catastrophe I went ahead and I put this oil in there because it's a good test to do doesn't take very long and then I'll tell you if it if it's going to fix the clearance issues which on this one they're unfortunately way too far gone that's it for now I just wanted to bring you guys Along on this that some of the stuff I see in the shop here just blows your mind this engine should not be like this at 112,000 Mi 543 V or not and I want to show you how bad it can get real quick if you choose the wrong shop enough yaking for now see you guys next time

Channel: FordTechMakuloco

Views: 51,625

Keywords: FordTechMakuloco, ford, fix, problem, repair

Id: auig_Y_5qjs

Length: 22min 51sec (1371 seconds)

Published: Mon Jun 03 2024