HOPE AND SOLUTION (TB FOLLOW UP #2 Patricia King and Stephen Powell)

well good morning and welcome to the live stream we are excited about shifts that are taking place in the spirit even as we are sitting here as you are wherever you are there are shifts taking place in the spirit globally today it's a very important day many of you know and maybe have watched that the President of the United States just gave a update on what's happening in the Iran Iraq situation and I just contacted a friend of ours in in DC and asked how it went because I wasn't able to watch the whole thing and he said all is well no lives lost and I think that that is so powerful and just for the moment that I did get a chance to listen to just a couple minutes I heard the president say that actually the breaking officially breaking strong alliances or breaking alliances with nations that are not walking uprightly and I think that that's a prophetic picture is that God is saying to us break break alliances with any thought patterns with any emotions with anything that is contrary to his word and and his will because we are going to be protected in that when you walk according to the Word of God when you walk according to his ways there will be safety it's when you come away from that it's when you violate the word that things things start going downhill righteousness exalts a nation but you know Senate sin will destroy and it's the same with lives you know righteousness exalts a life but sin destroys it destroys individuals and it can destroy the body and this morning just as we were praying to come in Robert Hodgkin had read a scripture that is sort of the Living Translation and this is Ezekiel 22 and verse 30 and it says I looked for someone to rebuild the wall of righteousness that guards the land and I thought that was so powerful I looked for someone to rebuild the wall of righteousness that guards the land and I just want to say this morning that as the church goes so goes the nation and so if there's corruption in the church there will be corruption in the nation if the church is perverted the nation will be perverted and that's why God's saying I'm looking for someone someone to stand for righteousness to to build the land up to rescue the land to redeem the land I am looking for someone to rebuild the wall of righteousness that guards the land and I believe prophetically and I say this with tremendous prophetic confidence that we have launched into it's already broken open I had an encounter yesterday where an apostolic portal opened up I can tell what God is doing in this hour that we are in a shift moving into Reformation moving into Reformation so that once things get into a place of exposure it's like going to a doctor if you were to go to a doctor and he diagnosed you with cancer that's one thing the cancers been exposed right so you've got this exposed cancer but you can't just leave it there because if you leave it in the body and you don't fix the body and you don't rebuild the immune system of the body then the body is going to die it has to be taken care of exposure is not enough so you go to the doctor he exposes the cancer he removes the tumor you get all kinds of vitamins and all kinds of things that will build up your system again and then you can go on and have a fruitful and abundant life and that is what is happening that's what happens with Reformation in the first Great Awakening we see that God used reformers in that to speak powerful words of truth and it actually put a foundation it was actually the foundation of moral conscience for the United States came through that Great Awakening the Second Great Awakening there was things challenged there that brought about social reform and brought things into alignment to God's purposes that's what he wants to do now and we are getting a clean up we are we are cleaning up the swamp any area in our own life I'm talking about each of us is in vigils that needs to be cleaned up anything in the body that has caused infection or that is running rampant and and and spreading evil that has to be stopped right now and that's why there's exposure I was reading a comment from someone from last night this morning it was precious actually and she was asking like you know what's this this all on too you know it just sounds like you know there's so much conflict and everything and it's and it's one group against another it doesn't you know where's the lovin at all and I mean these are really good questions and what I felt the Holy Spirit said to give her as food for thought was that Jesus even said he said I came to bring not to bring peace but a sword and there are times when Jesus has to bring a sword first in order for there to be true peace he also said that I came to divide households and that you will see one member of a household turning against another because one will stand for righteousness and another will not and so Jesus himself said that but it was unto a really good end it was unto righteousness no we know that Jesus never said anything or did anything that was outside of love because he is love so he can't violate himself right so everything he said and I've been going through the Gospels recently just going through every single verse asking God to reveal his love to me and it's easy to see it when you see healing and deliverance and forgiveness and all of that I write love love love love love but it's also love when he overturned the money changers tables it was also love when he rebuked Peter it was also love when he had had words for woe to you scribes Pharisees hypocrites that was love also it was all love everything he said all the hard words that he said were love words and in the Old Testament you also see that that God actually initiated war against the enemies of his people he initiated war now in those wars there was some people that died on both sides obviously and that's a painful thing no one wants war but there's times in order to secure righteousness you have to have war and so he initiated it and and then it came in to peace and the kingdom was advanced and so I know it's confusing for many of you and my heart as just you know just someone who just cares about the body and I'm called to the body and my love for the body has been tested over many years believe me I know that sheep have teeth and and my and my love has been proven over a year after year after year and I love the body and because I love the body I want to see you safe I want to see you secure I want to see righteousness prevail I want to see truth exalted I want to see the the love and mercy of God operating and properly applied not unsanctified mercy not unsanctified grace it just allows anything to happen but we want to see you totally free to be a reformer in these hours so the wall it's been broken down we've seen morals just decayed within the church and everything's excused these days it doesn't matter you're not even allowed to talk about it in fact if you do it's almost like a habit Elijah we're a hub called Elijah of the troubler of Israel and yet a hub was the one that opened up the nation to evil and that's why Elijah is wrong about me you are the trouble are of Israel because because there needs to be a raising up of the bar in this hour so that we can rebuild the wall that's what Elijah did he rebuilt the altar there's things that need to be rebuilt and so without apology I'm going to call the people of God to believe the Word of God the whole Council of the Word of God the truth about the Word of God there is very clear in the scripture I mean in the New Testament Scriptures it's very clear about our conduct for example in Paul's letters the apostle of grace he speaks about conduct he even goes so far as to say adulterers fornicators drunkards you know sorcerer's they're not going to inherit the kingdom you know is it's very clear it is very clearly addressed so we shouldn't be confused about these things and not just say well love will cover love will confront at times love will give strong confrontation and so we want to have a really beautiful balance here and we want you to feel loved we want you to feel at peace and we want you to know that God is on the move right now and to give you hope I want to say this yesterday I had a visitation from the Lord an apostolic portal opened up where he showed me what we could start to build now he said it's been exposed now you can start to build and I started to see like even Ron counter had addressed a number of days ago he had sent our team a tack saying you know the charismatic church really needs teaching on leadership and then Michael Brown and Joseph matera went live not knowing that Ron had spoken unto us and they talked about the same thing and how they're developing things so I did talk with Ron counter this morning I won't go into details but I just want to say we're on it we're on a building I God's already putting things in people's heart to rebuild the wall and it's really exciting so that leadership can be groomed strong leadership with godly foundations I was talking to Brent for Rick last night and he said well when he was in seminary they talked about the responsibility of a leader and how holy it is and and the mandate and how carefully you have to walk and that call but we don't hear much about that now and so that needs to be rebuilt the Foundation's so that leaders can be groomed properly and so we're very excited about that and I'm very excited about the whole thing of victims because in this and Robert dosti will talk more about this later but in this the victims have been I mean they've needed a voice and they haven't had one and victims usually don't they're told to be quiet not to tell you know just erase all that don't tell anybody about it and so they're always told that they can have no voice and then when they do have a voice oftentimes they're discredited or demonized or villainized or or whatever which is disgusting really but we are going to reach out to the victims because people have said what about the victims and I'm not talking about just as todd Bentley situation there's lots of victims involved there but beyond that in the body of Christ in general there is so much spiritual abuse happening there's been sexual abuse I shared last night about a situation where a man is sentenced for 18 accounts of abuse of children under his care whenever you have spiritual authority and you use that for your own purposes and you to manipulate people so that you can extract things that will give you sinful pleasure in your life that is that is dangerous and it sets people up as a victim even if they responded to that even if they gave you the pictures that they that they were asked for they you know it's not wise to give the pictures but under a person's authority when they are asked for that is a spiritual abusive situation and so we need to have a voice for the victims they need to have a place where there gonna be a hotline where they can come forward and know that they're safe to be able to share their story there needs to be a facebook support group where they can receive ministry and prayer and where they can have access to resources that help we're going to build a resource pool of counselors of therapists on that that can help deliverance ministers inner healing ministries and we'll build networks all around the nation's that we can work together build a great big net because this is going to be for the harvest as well so that any victim can get the help that they need we're gonna try to get legal teams together to give legal counsel and things like that and what to do if things need to be taken to the legal process we're going to see what we can do about putting that together even a raising of finances to help putting people on the ground to help these people and help them you know with different expenses that might come up this is our dream we're dreaming now we don't have infrastructure we've had people ask us where can we go to find out more information there's no more information right now I'm just telling you the dream but we are going to move on this right away we are going to put infrastructure in place we're going to pray into this we are going to build a network on this and we're very very excited about about what's going to come out of this I also foresee prophetically that apostolic councils and panels are going to come together where we're real seasoned mature apostles and prophets will come together and say what are we going to do about the problem in the body of Christ where the walls of righteousness are broken down because if they're broken down in the body they will never be built back up in the nation they have to be built back up in the body and so there'll be different voices giving input from different points of view and coming up with solution this is a season of solution and so I want to just encourage with that and give you lots of hope joyful expectation of a great outcome I believe that our God is a God of hope and that we are going to follow him into into Reformation and as you're watching this and you're under this word I wanted to create over you prophetically that you are being invited by the Spirit of God to carry a reformer spirit now some will say yes to that and some will not pastor Francisco from Shiloh was talking to me last week and he said I love reading about God's generals you know all the generals and you can read the history of them all on the revivalist that they they had great anointing in that but every single one of them had faults and things that brought them down but he says it's interesting when you read the book about the Reformers they didn't fall they were strong they had a standard that was a banner that was raised and when you look at the holiness revivals of like the Welsh revival the first and second great awakening some many other others there was a standard that was raised that actually influenced nations and and and brought reform into place and the difference was the message of alignment to the holy mandate of God and many of you are getting so excited right as I'm saying that because you're saying yes this is what the Lord's been speaking to me about this is what I've been called for this is what I'm made for now I know personally of people that started out that way and then they they bent and fell into the temptations of the enemy the enemy took them out and as soon as you do that without properly repenting the enemy has access to you and he'll take you down a dark path but there's always an opportunity to return to repent and come back and be the reformer that you were created to be that you were called to be in the very beginning and there has to be full repentance repentance isn't just saying I'm sorry no no it is a matter of making all the wrongs right and cleaning up the messes downy silk says in his book unpunished well he says it's like if you spill a can of paint you have to go and clean up all the mess if it's on the wall on the furniture on the floor whatever you have to clean it all up and so we have cleanup to do right now and that's what this is about this morning is that we want to clean up some things now I understand that many of you are saying oh my goodness I just don't want to hear another thing about this todd Bentley situation I am done with it and why are you opening up your mouth about it I know that many of you are feeling that and I feel that way too to be honest with you I'm feeling the exact same thing I want to be done right from the very beginning I've been I've been struggling through it I've been like in in pain over it for months and months because I've been involved in different aspects of this since July of last year and I I am I am in pain over it as you are but over the last few months I mean once the tribunal process got or the panel process whatever it's called got put into place to evaluate and to come through a proper process and it was a very good process it was not a corrupt process and if you want to know more about that process we talked about it last night but there was a proper having things brought to the person who was in in violation and then tried to go to the overseers and then it was taken to the body and then it was taken to to an investigative process and make sure it was fair to listen to the sides that were were available to speak into it and then to evaluate it and to bring bring a not only a a statement but some action points on that so it was a very very good and clean process very well done and so now that that's done we're saying well it would be nice if it was finished but there's just a couple things that during that process well well I mean I know I was quiet Stephen was quite a Brent Robert doe see Ron candor we all went quiet because we honored the process we never said anything we never opened our mouth but during that time Todd and his team did and it was lately daily and sometimes multiple times a day that there's a lot of slanderous things being said a lot of things that are not true and that's what we want to address right now and we're not trying to put anyone under the bus on that for sure we just want to address the content of what was said that needs to be straightened out so that people aren't going around in there my believing lies because if you believe a lie how can you be healed how can you be healed if you're just wounded by a lie and so we want to be able to address on that saying so I'm so sorry about having to even come to this place and many of you might say you know I really don't want to listen to anymore and so you're really welcome to don't listen to any further if you want and I really mean that I don't want you hurt any more I don't want to be labor this thing we just want to clear up a few things so that you you are clear and I also want to just say is that I know that there's been some things that have been reported that have been reported very objectively and I appreciate that and I appreciate things that have been reported with concern and some of that has been reported I really appreciate that and and you know I appreciate some of the input even though some of it I don't believe is accurate but I have appreciated that everyone has a voice and that needs to be there but some of it has been through bitterness through a fence and slander and it's just been been so hurtful and I just want to say just as a piece of advice for you all it is good to hear different sides of a situation and the counsel of many you'll find wisdom but if you detect bitterness and anger and rage and defensiveness and you know just backbiting and all of that going on vicious things I'd say stay away from it stay away from it don't sign up for that Facebook post don't sign up to be on that list because in Hebrews it says if you have a root of bitterness it will defile many and so jesus said in mark 4 that that to the measure that you hear it will be measured back to you and so if you're listening to bitterness being spewed out and slander being spewed out and cynicism and and mockery and all that that's going into you so it's going to defile you number one but it is going to also be measured back to you in other words you'll start to spew it out - it's going to go in and it's going to it's going to defile you so you know if you had something that was really clean to be again with maybe your own own discernment of God's indignation about something which God does have an indignation and it might be pure but if if then you have your own human anger and your own bitterness and you try to speak a word of God's indignation if it comes through the pipe just like water coming from a reservoir going through rusty pipes when it comes out into the glass that rust will defile and contaminate all the water because there's no separation the contaminant defiles the whole thing and I don't want that for you I don't want you to be defiled I don't want you to spew out what is not good and so we all have to take our own responsibility for that personally and and do our very best to speak out of love to speak out of truth and and and to cover and believe me we have covered much in this season much more than you could ever realize and we will continue to cover there are things that we could say right now in self-defense that we will not say we could give reports that have been brought to us with with with validation against people who are speaking slanders things that we refuse to speak because love will cover and because we we we are totally wanting to do that so I just want to say that up front so we are gonna speak with Stephen Paulo right now we're going to go through some things Stephen Powell has been a target of a lot of verbal back lashing and and and scorning and exposure and things like that and we're going to talk about some of those things because I know that you're confused about it you some of you that are watching right now it might have really evil perceptions of Stephen Powell because of what you've heard so we just want to clear up some of that stuff but also to have Stephen take responsibility for some of the things that he has done that we're immature that were wrong that I need adjustment and he will apologize for that and he will define it because you can't just lump everything into one thing and say oh a man is disqualified because of what one thing when it is made to look so much bigger okay so we want to talk about that and I want to say Steven that I have only known you since July so you know there's a lot I mean it takes years to get to really know a person and go through many tests see how they respond to tests and things like that before you can totally endorse a person but I want to say that from what I've seen and the dialogue that we've had that I've appreciated your honesty I know that you are a man of passion I've always often described you I was like James and John when they were following Jesus they were at one point called the sons of thunder because I mean they were so passionate for justice they wanted to call down fire from heaven and consume those that were in opposition to Jesus and he said you know what you don't know what spirit he actually rebuked them he said you don't know what the spirit europe i've come to to not judge but to save but then john but then John became known as the apostle of love and so that's what I see God grooming in you is this beautiful mixture of justice of fire and and of love and of learning what love looks like and how you're maturing in that love and also the other example I've seen is of Paul before he was Paul he was saw the zealot he was so zealous for God he knew the law he knew the word he was you know a person who was so respectful of the word he obeyed it more than anyone else and and he thought he was doing God justice by killing Christians but he was doing it with with a passionate heart but he became known as the apostle of grace and that's how I see you moving towards from from zeal to an apostle of grace and in His grace he became even more zealous for truth but it was through through the right filter so I've appreciated watching you in that journey and the growth that's already happened and in the more growth that I know is coming and then I'm believing is is going to happen but you you are going to share some things today so people get to know you more because all they've heard many of them all they've heard is you're getting blasted so they don't know you they've never met they've never heard from you because we haven't said anything until now and that's it you say I've heard so much but you've only heard one side okay you've only heard one side so we just need to clear up a few things not in self-defense not to protect yourself or defend yourself validate yourself that's not where we're going here but to help the people understand so describe your relationship quickly with Todd and fresh fire and your moved to fort Mills to move with him yeah well I I grew up in a very conservative Church and I was awakened to the power of God when I was about 16 17 years old and somehow supernaturally I believe I came across Todd's testimony about how he encountered the Lord they're spending hour upon hour you know with the Lord taking special time so the Lord took that testimony put it in my heart to make it my own and right when I graduated I asked my parents if they would give me grace instead of having to go get a job right away just to seek the Lord for months and I did that and that marked me from nineteen eight years my life has never been the same since then so I just want to honor Todd I want honors ministry you know there's been all this tragedy that's happened too but there's been good things as well I was a young man that was turned to seek the Lord with all my heart and in part that was because the testimony that the Lord used with Todd in my life so sorry I'm emotional but um many years later I went through a wilderness season in Alaska where the Lord called me to fast and pray pretty much all my 20s I just serve in the local church serve my family be a godly husband and father but there came a time where I had a supernatural meeting with Todd talk to you through my church in Alaska in 2012 when I was working as a janitor of the church he saw the gift of my life that's one I believe the Apostolic Graces that todd has is to recognize gifting and he gave me an invitation to travel with him and it was it meant so much to me because all those years I knew I had a call to ministry but I felt hidden I felt like the Lord wouldn't reveal that anybody and and use eleven years in intercession and seeking the face of God even as you're a janitor you would just see your role as an intercessor crying out for the purposes of God to be revealed yes absolutely and and I think God for those years because I had all those years just to focus with my wife my children my relationship of the Lord and serving in the local church which is a you know a big thing to me before I got into full-time ministry and I believe it's it's meant that you know all the difference I've always had a great relationship you've served your pastor and served the church well yes yes I love pastors mm-hmm I would not be where I'm at right now without my pastors you know that watched over me and loved me even though they saw you know some some of the things that needed sharpening but anyways I started traveling with Todd and right when I turned 30 years old Todd ordained me into ministry that was after three years of traveling with him and just serving him around the world and we mean my wife felt the call to move to Fort Mill so for South Carolina so we moved there and helped him establish a new base there in Fort Mill and that was in 2015 so all right now when you were with him you observed good things did you observe any concerns yes there were several occasions where I witnessed things that um were unbecoming of a minister at first I was confused because I had never been around a ministry like Todd's in person such extraordinary signs wonders such extraordinary revival I was a part of several revivals with him around the world you know Korea South Africa where you know I saw incredible things and at first I was confused I'm sure a lot of people have been confused about this question how can there be such immorality with such grace glory as such gifting you know so at first I had to go through that you know even theological II and just working out in prayer myself eventually I mustered up the courage to talk with Todd about some of it and there was one occasion where I actually went to leadership about it and it got back to I was told that it got back to Rick Joyner and that Rick Joyner dealt with you know so yes I did see things but I tell you I never dreamed there was the depth of the stuff that we've discovered this last year I just I just couldn't fathom that those deeper darker issues were there you know my rationalization was well you know we're dealing with stuff right now in the body of Christ with the exaggerated Grace and not as much of an emphasis on sanctification and stuff and you know I want to pray for the whole body including Todd that we can you know balance these things out that that's what was going through my heart at the time right no you you were removed from fresh fire yes oh you were part of their network their apostolic Network and then one day you got notice that they had removed you do you know why you were removed uh well I I can't speak for them but from my perspective um I had a visitation from the Lord in 2017 and there was an incredible zeal released a fresh seal release for holiness for the endtime message calling the bride to purity and also I was awakened to some of the truths in the Word of God even the New Testament that although our God is a God of grace of love he's a God of correction he's a God of judgment even all in love of course so of course like a lot of people that have incredible encounters of Lord I overreacted that that's where I would say I err I tend to err is in zealousness but I just thank God for people around me that can handle me and help me but uh during that time I said some things I shouldn't have in my zeal I probably exposed some things you know I shouldn't have so there became began to be tension between me and Todd right away and we thought you were exposing things that you had seen in areas of sin and the that was different situation sir up until that time most of my prophetic gift you know in my relationship with God the revelations I would receive were focused on intimacy revival and harvest that was it that was my foundation that's why me and Todd blended well at the beginning but I had a major shift in my prophetic mantle and I started seeing all the ugly I saw many of these things actually that we're dealing with now in the spirit there on the Lord began to entrust me with revelations of people that would fall actually are not would fall but people that were in sin and the first thing I did with that is I prayed for them and it broke my heart when I saw some of them eventually fall so I went through all that that shift in that mantle and I think it's discernment you know and I was trying to balance all that out and and yeah I made some mistakes and trying to handle that and trying to work that out at the beginning but but at that time in 2017 I can remember it clearly it was on the 500th anniversary of Martin Luther's Reformation that I met with Todd in California and we just agreed to be friends and to still be in fellowship but just to kind of distance a little bit right but eventually there came a controversy in late 2018 there was a private message concerning some revelation I was processing in private about about some things I believe that I'm just because I mean it's it's out there is a you were processing something that you thought the Lord might have been speaking to you about reading and some other things and it was private you wanted some input you wanted to process it through you wanted to understand exactly what was you know going on and your communication it was private God sent out yes and so people assumed yes that that was your word yes it was never public I never made a public post it was just what I would call private processing and when I private process a lot of times I'm wrong you know that's why I don't make it public processing or I try not to you know um but that left a bit of a stigma you know a lot of people were very upset with me I did issue me immediately a public apology for that you know why anybody you know is suffering you know homes are being destroyed I never wanted that to be out I only wanted my message to be let's pray and asked for God's will to be but that eventually led to Todd felt he needed to cut me from his network and that happened in in in December of 2018 the day after Christmas no it is said that because of that you have anger and rage in you that was the motivation and and jealousy which is the motivation for you going after Todd Bentley yeah well that so hurts my heart whatever I hear that because that's just absolutely not true that's a misrepresentation I think in all of our hearts we deal with a whole host of emotions battle through a whole bunch of things and to say that I was just you know happy and everything was just fine when that happened no I went through all the emotions of heard and confusion and even anger at times because um when when Todd decided to cut me from his network he didn't even call me himself he had somebody Lewis de Sena actually that I didn't even know called me the day after Christmas and do it and that really hurt me because I felt I had a relationship with Todd at least enough for it he would call me himself um so over the next few months early 2019 yeah I was dealing in my heart with that but honestly God is my witness when we came to May and June when this other stuff started coming even coming to me about Todd I felt that I had done a really good job with managing my heart I still continued to sew to Todd even up to that time that's financially so yes it's a big principle of mine core principle mine is that you know Jesus said where your treasure is your heart is also so even when I'm having a difficult issue I want to sew because I because I want my heart you know do everything I can to make sure my heart is right and I really felt that I had managed those things and it brought the things before the Lord and that it was being dealt with so that beautiful so how did you come to know about the allegations then because allegations you know came to the table how did all that happen yeah and like I stated there was stuff that would come up down to the years you know that I did the best I could but I never dreamed that there was this next level this this depth that is happening but when I really started to become a prize of this next level of stuff that was happening it was in as much as I recall it was in early June I got a call from my friend Derrick gates we spoke at that time about conversations that Derrick had been having with some some friends out there as well as David hunter about serious serious and going on behind the scenes with Todd with interns with personal assistants thiefs types of things the first testimony I heard was 2017 that during that atmosphere when the lyndale revival was going on so that's when I first heard it but even then I did nothing with it at first but just pray and and I was shocked you know and when you hear things like that you hope it's not true yeah exactly I was going through that whole stage of in my in denial here did it do it do I believe this it was a big shock it was and then within I would say about two weeks of that that was into May early June within about two weeks of that I was actually preaching at Moravian Falls a Morningstar the church there and I had a very powerful visitation I won't get into the details of that visitation but there was there was a courtroom in heaven that was in session there was there was a case that was being tried and I had no idea about the details I just knew that something serious was happening and the justice of God and I was shaking in that encounter and I felt like I received somewhat of a commissioning word in the Justice of God I felt like it wasn't just for me though I felt like it was the whole body Christ and Lord was like you've said many times raising the bar in this season and in the day that I had that visitation there's a supernatural sword actually that appeared in the sky so I took that as a sign as well and even the scripture you just mentioned at times Jesus says I've come to bring the sword and not peace so we have to understand that that side of God's heart and it's always redemptive it's always for the purposes of love but from that encounter that I had on June 9th within days I had reports come to me unsolicited for instance I'm sitting down with a pastor in Pennsylvania we're having lunch talking about other stuff not even related and he brings it up he says is God gonna deal with todd Bentley and I was shocked honestly I was shocked I'm like where is this going and it turns out he had a young lady in his church that was one of these one of these young ladies like many stories we've already heard that came forward told me her testimony she wept and is a serious thing so those events those sequences of events Derick coming to me unsolicited reports beginning to come and also I felt I was hearing prophetically from the Lord I decided that this was the Lord and I did felt feel a burden to start reaching out to some more people and asking more questions and that's what I did right and and so Derrick who's just probably such a good friend to so many you know he's a he's a filmmaker Derrick Derrick gates a wonderful man so Derrick gates and David hunter and you were conducted during that time you had sheriff back and forth different things do you want to share about that relationship and how it worked yeah a lot of people don't understand how David hunter came into this and why I was talking to him and why he had so many details and the reason why is because it was me Derek and David at the very beginning and and one of my prophetic experiences the Lord specifically highlighted Derek to me so I felt like he was supposed to be a true partner with me on this but David was more always in the background because he explicitly stated I do not want my name mentioned not once and I do not want to be involved publicly at all but I felt that honestly that when he started saying things when he started telling some of these stories some of the things he's seen with Todd I honestly felt that the Lord had finally got in the hold of his heart that the Lord convicted him and that that was my honest feeling from the beginning but we were all three of us talking discussing the details of this you know in June and then into July all the way up to the exposure and and yeah we it proceeded from there we gathered David David Hunter worked you know or maybe not worked as far as an employee but he was involved inside a fresh fire on an air of different levels and a close friend of Todd's I understand as well yeah so that's why a lot of what he was sharing was believable yeah and in much of the the Intel if you want to call it call it that that he gave to us it checked out so that's another reason why I kept talking to him and and and I had a reason to but to believe him because some of the stories proved to be true now after the fact that everything that's happened I go back and look at some of the things that he told me and told us and I realized wow that was twisted then and I even bought into some of those twisted stories at times but you know he was the one that led us to directly to the information that we received from the young man that I recorded that he's made such a big deal about that he has not been honest about he's actually the one that led us to that young man and here's the one that mentioned his name you never mentioned his name yeah he didn't tell me directly but he told Derek and then Derek eventually told me we all knew where that came from and once again I thought the Lord was dealing with his heart I mean I I had an indication of some of the things we were gonna hear from this young man but I had no idea the full depth of what would happen it was so heartbreaking not only had this man this young man been abused by Todd been taken advantage of but when I spoke with him on the phone he was not serving Christ he hated the church he told me told me that he hated leadership and that really broke my heart mm-hmm because there's been so many of the people that I've interviewed this last year that I taught myself in Todd school you know and it just broke my heart that they come to our school to receive Jesus many of them very broken many of them came out of lifestyle of drugs and brokenness themselves and some of them left and more brokenness so so David Hunter had given you the story and I remember Derek calling me in an airport one time I was just between flights and he he didn't mention actually the name of David hunter to me at that time but he said the this guy has so much that he knows that was because I kept my word all that time I never once mentioned David on her even to you never once mentioned his name so it's been recently when he himself went public and I want to say I never threatened him never threatened his family never threatened his children there was a story that came up where there was possible inappropriate tivity I wouldn't say activity I would say speech okay in language between Todd and one of his daughters and I did pressure him or not pressure him but I did try to encourage him as strongly as I could David you need to submit your testimony to the the investigator because that's the right thing to do and it was totally I said totally do it in private I said David I don't even have to give your name to him you could just call him up and give an anonymous he's opened up to receive anonymous testimonies and he still wouldn't do it right and of course over the last couple of months he's been the most vocal voice for bashing the process of the panel and the investigation very much bashing your name my name dr. Brown's name robert dosis name I mean he's got I mean it's been absolutely vicious I just want to say I'm not sure if David would even watch this broadcast but if you are we just want to say we we do forgive you but there are some things that have to be settled for the body sake because you haven't been honest and I remember getting a call from Derek gates this was just a month or two ago and he said Patricia David hunter who is a guy that you know gave a lot of the Intel in the very beginning and in in other words I would call that a whistleblower right you know the original whistleblower that's what I would term it he has never wanted to give us testimony but he's ready but he wants to give it to you and he said would you be open to hearing him I thought oh man you know I've listened to a few testimonies and it's not something that you love to do but I said if they'll serve yes I can do it so he gave me David's number and I contacted him and we had I thought it was it was a beautiful a beautiful talk even told me after that that he just had the utmost respect for you said it was just such a wonderful conversation he told me how much he just appreciates your love your humility honors you I mean that's honestly what he said to me after that yeah and I felt that we had you know a really good talk and I listened to his heart he had had I could tell he was in pain over some things with with dr. Michael Brown and he had got heated in the discussion about some things that he believed about Michael Brown and I said I checked those things out with Michael Brown himself and he has a different story and I think that you need to go to him directly if you have this issue you need to go to him directly because David hunter had fed you and I and and and and our team the stories I mean I got it through you and Derek but you know he had said some negative things about dr. Brown's that made us afraid thinking oh my gosh you know that's why I went directly to Michael Brown you went directly to Michael Brown and checked it out so I said you know it would really help you and I was just trying to help him it would help you if you go directly to Michael Brown yes then he told me he had things about you and he started look boy I thought boy you've got a lot of pain concerning Steven Powell because there was a lot of bitter judgments and never Sharon scene well it was very evident in that call and he he had you marked as pretty demonic in your behavior in that and I said you know I I won't disagree on some of the points I knew you and I have been so open about this I've been so open with you painfully open it's painfully open with you how can I I've been confrontational about because you're very black-and-white and you're you know you you're very justice oriented so I've been trying to help you in balancing that out and so I said I can't disagree with you on some of these things on the way that things were handled or the way things came across but I've found Steven to be very teachable and I said I would highly recommend you going directly to him and sitting down and sharing because you could help him if you give light on these things and how it affected you and how you feel it's affected others it'll help Steven grow we need to help each other grow so that was a con of that conversation and then I mentioned to him even I said even with the report that Stephen was passionate about when I submitted edits to him he was open to that okay so that was part of the conversation to try to show him it was taken so much out of contacts but that's the August 22 yeah because yeah the the August 22 one because I had nothing to do with the only report yeah people need to know that there were actually two reports there was a 30 page one that was just given a few leaders behind the scenes and then and then the one that went on Facebook so I'm talking about the one that went on Facebook and and I had nothing to do with the formation of that report you were the one that put that report - it was your investigation it was your words but I did some tweaking and some submission of thoughts that you could know an earlier version tone both you and Brandt gave me input and feed and I was really happy for that because because of the way I am I just a lot of times my words are very sharp and I don't realize it especially when I'm in that anointing that zeal anointing so you just really helped soften some stuff and communicate and that was always your concern always even behind the scenes this what is this gonna do to the body so I just really appreciate you know your heart and that's how these things should be Hanna I didn't want it all to ever just be on me I wanted a team of people you know and leaders wise leaders elders in the body of Christ it was hard to find people that wanted to get involved yes and I get it I totally get it and I didn't want to be involved either but so so in that same conversation that I was on the phone with with David was a long conversation and I actually really enjoyed the conversation I really did because I find him really warm and easy to talk to and you know I totally see why people can be themselves around him and why you actually always made as well he always made us I he is so funny and if you're watching David you are so funny even the thing that you called me and and Steven and dr. Brown had a lot of last minute told us he called us the three turds floating around in a Punchbowl and I thought oh my gosh but as as gross as that is I couldn't help but love I thought this just crazy you know but anyways um he is a guy that makes you feel that can can make you feel relaxed when when you're talking to him and he said to me I just really have a lot that I can report but I'm not sure no we had already like as far as I knew everyone had already taken all their stuff to to the investigator that process was just about done I think that was November when you talked to him yeah and it was just about done early November and so I you know he said I've got some some things and I said well we don't actually like from what I understand because I don't have a clue as to how many reports went through just what I initially knew about but I said I believe that there is enough evidence that they don't need any more but I mean it's always good if you're trying to make sure something's fair and make sure it's confirmed to have as solid as you can so I asked him I said do you have anything that isn't already said and he said oh yeah and these are this this is with God as my witness he said I've damning evidence against hogg Bentley yeah and he went on to say that if he brought forward to the public what he had Todd would never rise again and then he went on to explain to me that he was afraid though he was afraid to bring it out because of his he said I fear for my life I was confused about that because I've known Todd has some definitely he's had weakness he's got addiction he's got problems with lying but I've never known taught to be violent or anything like that and so I said well why would you be of afraid of todd Bentley I said he's not got like a big ministry right now and he's like you know a lot of the the more influential leaders don't even connect with him so I was wondering like why why would you be afraid and he said you have no idea he said you have no idea and then later just this last week we found out some more I'm not going to share that though I'm going to refrain from that but a close friend of his found out why and I I'm I'm gonna cover that one in love but I just want to say that it's it's strange because the very next within less than 48 hours maybe it was 24 hours even 48 of the latest he was on Facebook coming against us and coming against the process and I wrote myself I'm confused he's I don't know why and then he just continued from that point ranting and a lot of it was twisted like he wasn't posted a text that I responded him to about the Edit on the thing and it was taken out of context like no one knew the context behind that you know he did that with you also he's saying he has four hours of conversations and that and it's like those were all recorded without permission by the way so one of his biggest things is that you recorded a conversation without permission which by the way I'll let you share your reasons for that but I don't think on any situation like that and Brent Borthwick and I are in complete agreement on this we don't believe that's Ithaca at any time any time that's our conviction you might have a different conviction I know that you have a different conviction obviously David has a different conviction because he just does it all the time to say that he has four hours of recorded conversation and I do know that some of that was very much taken out of context with you and it was it was all premeditated with gotcha questions um there are times that I can remember talking to him on those calls I mean I'm pumping gas I'm dealing with kids in the car I'm not exactly you know faking a lot of times just off the cuff you know just just responding you know you know from my heart but there were times where even on the conversations I would think this is weird I'm like why is he asking me these questions there are all these pretend scenarios you know that he would present well well well what if dr. Brown throws you to the wolves when this is all done you know or stuff like that and I was like confused I'm like why would that happen and I would give him answers like well if that happened David you know the Lord will be my defender you know we will deal with it when it happens or whatever and every now and then I make a brave comment or something along lines I will fight on you know one of them was about me and so will that happen I just say I was pressured and I just want to in a way that was true because we in fact I can't even remember the scenario right now but it wasn't like we pressured you to do anything no but but but there was like we wanted things done right yeah and so when it came to the panel you were afraid to give up yeah some of your some of your information because of David yes yep and and because of what you heard yes from from David about Michael Brown but Brent and I strongly encouraged I wouldn't say we pressured but we strongly encouraged you to go with with the process yeah I felt pressure but I believe it was from the Lord I believe this was the Lord nudging me but when dr. Brown first got involved after the exposure David came forward with this story about him about how he said that dr. Brown was the one who led Todd's 2013 incident restoration that dr. Brown's the one who called all the shots that's absolutely alive that's not true just like dr. Brown said in his video the other day he received evidence from a friend the friend didn't know how to get in contact with Joyner he put him in contact with brick and passed it on never thought about it again you know and I went to dr. Brown with David's story David had convinced me that dr. Brown and Rick Joyner had worked together behind the scenes and that the reason why Rick called dr. Brown in was so dr. Brown could cover both of their corrupt activity I mean it's great it sounds crazy but when you're under that spirit I mean when you're when you're being influenced by that spirit that he's operating crazy sounds logical at times you know that's why I just thank God that those weren't the only voices speaking to my life because eventually I broke through those lies I can remember I had such a hard time even going and meeting with dr. Brown because of the fear that David told yes and you guys encouraged me I finally made myself do it totally did not feel like it at all I'm like I'm gonna do it I don't care once I did blown away by dr. Brown I mean the depth of humility oh my god he's led so well in this you can feel that that this guy has been through so much and he's so seasoned he's so wise mature I just thank God for him you know he was completely open completely transparent didn't try to hide a thing and at the end of it all he said here's my phone number he says give it to this guy I didn't even tell him his name because still at that time I was keeping my word to David hunter I will not expose your name I will not use your name ever I called him the ghost source at that time yeah he eventually used that as his code name you know so I've been like yeah I gave you that code name hey but I gave the hunt the number I offer the number the David hunter I said he can clear up anything I said David you're under you know misconception about dr. Brown that's not how it happened I don't care it what Todd told you in 2013 he refused to call dr. Brown okay now when that happened when he refused to call dr. Brown that's when more of my blinders started to come off and I said well if he cares so much about the truth why isn't he calling him like what why and then eventually in a very short period of time I was disagreeing with David I was saying David I just don't believe you anymore basically you got your information from Todd later we found out it was an office rumor that he said to you that's what David told me I said okay tell me how Michael Brown influenced because he said David said Todd didn't write the letter in 2013 to the partners David wrote it and he said but but he was told that he had to make dr. Brown happy and that dr. Brown was actually doing writing the narrative and I said how was that happening was he standing behind your shoulder telling you what to say and he said no I said well did he phone you no I said did he text or email you no I said well how was he directing the writing of this letter and he said what was through office rumor and David hunter that's what David hunter told me and I remember confronting David on the phone with that saying so you have built this case around dr. Brown with an office rumor yeah and so you know there's there's so much and of course now we know what he's distorted about us like much to the public and we don't have to go into all those details but when me and David finally kind of kind of split or it was over that issue I said David you're asking me to believe an office rumor or this man that's got an incredible reputation it was very honest with me when I went and met with him they even offer you his number you're asking me that and I said I just don't believe that anymore and and when it came to the point where I feel that that David felt he couldn't control me anymore to try to get me to do what he wanted me to do with the evidence and he wanted me reject the tribunal he even tried to form something himself on the side this is crazy when it came to that point that's when I think he really turned on me and really decided to go another way so that's just some background for people that are that are neat wanting more understanding right I want to go back to because one of the things that has been brought up over and over again that has been replayed and replayed and replayed is a clip that an audio clip that he took of you where it sounds like you were mocking and you're proud about well you know Rick Joyner's made me a hero or whatever I can't remember the exact words you can probably quote it better but what what he was saying was like one day you are emotional about sharing the original report because you did it in written form and you did it also in a video format and that you were weeping you were emotional because I watched it and it was very tender and it was beautifully done by the way I want to thank you for the the respect you had for the body and the delivery of that and the care that you had for the body of that and I know that that emotion was true because even prior to that weeks prior to that you've been weeping before God for hours sometimes wailing before God in addition I'm number weeping with you on the phone yeah praying for talk yeah I remember all throughout this wheelchairs yeah and so then he said and the very next day here's this recording of any places thing about how you're happy now you had gone through a number of weeks of being bashed hit hard I mean it was it was a really hard thing people were coming against you Todd Campbell's coming against you the public was coming against you I was already being threatened with law suits at that time and Rick was ranting in that and so tell about the context of that like you were overjoyed in that clip and yeah well this give me a minute to lay this out because this is important when I first got a hold of you one of the main reasons was because I had not been able to get in touch with Rick Joyner yet and I felt like that was crucial I felt like I needed to protect the information I had up until that point we had already had stories of Todd reaching out trying to quote lock people down manipulate threaten we even ran across one person that allegedly had a paid-off gag order so I just want to say that gates in The Fairly beginning part of the process actually did a recording you and him he submitted a recorded testimony you were interviewing him and he alluded to that also very strongly that be yes these threats had taken place and that yes and this is the first time I've ever dealing dealing with this type of situation so we absolutely made mistakes along the way but honestly we did the best that we could and one of the things that became very aware or very apparent early on was that we have to protect these victims I wasn't calling them victims at that time but you know they were victims these witnesses because we saw the type of tactics that Todd was willing to use behind the scenes and we were not gonna let him get to them and and and you know abuse them further whatever you know so there's screenshots that were submitted to you that kind of gave confirmation about the threats even like so-and-so would never come against me I've got too much dirt on him or I've got a biker gang or whatever that yes Todd Todd told Derek gates and some text messages he alluded to going up to Canada and get his biker gangs coming after me you know sorry he alluded to yes his tactics of I've got dirt on so-and-so they'll never talk so he was black million people he was using information against them to keep him silent it was very messy so it became apparent pretty quickly within a matter of weeks that I could not go through Todd's office I couldn't go through luis de Sena because he was taught Slyke right-hand man I mean why would you go to an investigator that's Todd's friend that made no sense to me I said I need to get to erect Joyner and all my efforts had failed I went to Michael thickest at that time because Michael focus was on my board and I considered him a friend Michael told me that uh he wouldn't even look at the evidence that I tried to give him he said he'd heard clearly from God that this was a distraction for me and that I was to leave it alone and God will just take care of it and I had major convictions about that type of an attitude because I felt like many people that had come across this over the years of the decades have that same type attitude and although God does work sovereignly at times he works through us he works as our hands extended and that's what we have to and what we have to decide is is God calling me to get involved or is he's not and I had already decided that point and got confirmation from you and others that yes God was calling me to get involved so I respectfully disagree with Michael and then I asked Michael at that time this was even before I met you before I started talking with you I said Michael can you help me get to Rick Joyner can you help me get a meeting he refused to help and it was very painful later on when I heard on one of his broadcasts that later on after I did my exposure he felt the call the Lord to get involved and that hurt me when I heard that because I said why didn't you feel the call to Lord when I came to you as a leader to help me ask for help so it was very difficult in the beginning many people just didn't want to touch it because it had big-name ministries attached to it you know but me the way God's created me I don't care about any of that I'm gonna do what God's told me to do even if I lose a ministry of it ministry is not my idol and God did that in my heart all those years in Alaska where I didn't have a ministry praise God but anyways leading up to the exposure I want to get this out I did everything in my power to keep it a private matter you and Brandt were ultimately against me going public although when you saw that I was convinced that I needed to you provide a support while still giving caution right Lord's really telling you to do you absolutely are convinced you have to obey the Lord yeah and here's what happened the week before I went public todd Bentley went public so he went public first not me and talked about the issue and everything that had been happened in that summer he mentioned in his public address at revival harvest America that Rick Joyner had instructed him to do that instructed him to get ahead and try to control the narrative okay at that time I had a friend of a friend who had practiced law for 50 years he was not my paid for a lawyer I didn't have a you know contract with him or anything but he did provide me some counsel from a legal mind which was very helpful he said he predicted just out of his 50 years of experience in law in legal matters he predicted he said what is going to happen next as he says Rick Joyner's gonna make a statement next he says you need to get ahead of that you need to get your story out there so I immediately hit my knees began to pray that made me very nervous it had all come down to this I was not looking forward to that at all within days of that we received confirmation from someone that had been talking to Rick then indeed that was his plan to release a statement I was told in defense of Todd and also to discredit me I don't know if Rick was planning on doing that with me but that's what I was told so I thought to myself wow this this lawyer friend of mine is is prophetic it seems like so I prayed some more I still didn't do anything I prayed some more I even consulted I hope this is okay to say I even consulted with Jeremiah Johnson at that time because Jeremiah had been talking to Rick Jeremiah asked me what my intention was I told him that time what my intention was he said give me a certain amount of time give me some days to talk more with Rick and he did and I didn't go public until I coordinated that with him too and I believe he was trying to give Rick every opportunity to still deal with it in private before this happened but during that time as well I received several prophetic confirmations as well I believe not just from my own prophetic gift but from others so I became fully convinced that I needed to go public leading up to the exposure the Lord absolutely broke my heart I feel that same breaking to be honest with you this morning in having a hard time holding back tears and stuff several days in a row up until the exposure I was broken I was weeping and I was praying for Todd I was praying for the body of Christ and when it came to the morning or the afternoon or whatever August 22nd when I released the exposure it was the same thing I woke up with a broken heart I had a prayer session several hours with my good friend and intercessor Eric Arnold who was accompanying me on that trip and we wept both of us we cried we prayed for Todd once again we prayed over and over again have mercy on Todd have mercy have mercy on his wife and children and also for the body of Christ and when I released my address I couldn't keep back my tears that was not a show that was not I'm not that good of an actor I released him brokenness and my plan actually was to release all the details in my video as well that I'd release in the written portion but whenever I started the video started rolling I just couldn't do it I could not do it so but I'm glad I released a video because that allowed people to see more of my heart not just the black and white stuff in ink and also one of the words that the Lord had given me and that it back in July he gave me this word out of Luke 12 I don't have the passion or translation with me this morning but he specifically gave it to me out of the passion translation and it says that there's nothing hidden that won't be revealed that it's a time for everything to be exposed and in the passion translation it says they'll be exposed and all the facades are coming down and then it actually says it will be broadcast yes it will be broadcast so when you were saying sure that I thought well maybe that's maybe this is the Lord then if it can't be done one on one with Todd if we can't get them free there if we can't get them free by going to the leaders if we can't get this there then maybe this is the only way that it is going to be done and that's what I told with told David also I said you know because he kind of twisted this again is that I said you know at this opportunity if this doesn't do it I don't know if there's anything that can with this much exposure if that doesn't set Todd free if that doesn't bring change then I don't know what will yeah but going back to the original question about the recording that was released by by David in my state people have to understand this has been the hardest trial of my life I've been an absolute mess at times they got for my wife even right now I just feel so so much brokenness I mean I need some so so how does he after all this but at that time that week leading up to the exposure and then after when Rick started doing rants I was an absolute mess I only four weeks I only slept for about three hours a night I was having such bad anxiety attacks all the warfare I felt like witchcraft was being coming and coming against me because of what leaders were saying out of their mouths about me there were times where I could not I felt like I couldn't breathe unless I went to the gym and ran straight for 30 minutes on the treadmill just to dump some of that that anxiety that that that you know just pressure that pressure so there was so much warfare I mean I have all these supernatural crazy stories the week of the exposure like I kid you not preaching in a church and a bat literally swooped down and I ducked my head I mean crazy stuff like that so when I came up to the exposure I literally thought this could be the end of my ministry I mean because I felt not just to include Todd's name I felt to name Rick as well not because I wanted to dishonor him but because I felt I had to give an explanation of why I was doing this and let the people know that I had done everything I could to get a meeting with him in private to work this out privately and they went public first not me they initiated that so I honestly put my ministry on the altar I thought I could lose my ministry I mean I may have to go back to doing what I was doing before so when the exposure happened and it seemed like God gave us favor in it it seemed like oh it's like a relief valve it was so much relief and I had all the emotions of of happiness and joy and not only had I you know my facebook crash my facebook grew of course that was never the motive no never I've never felt that about you ever and I've never felt in you I'm gonna say this publicly I've never because I'm sensitive to this I've never felt in you personal ambition to have a big ministry or whatever I've always felt from you that you just want to obey God whatever that is yeah and I've never sensed that you were after money after fame after attention I have not ever since and we've spent hours gonna say we I remember having one conversation particular where we talked almost for two hours on that one subject and that was a major point of concern all throughout this is crucifying everything letting everything die a personal ambition what can I get out of this I mean of course at anything that we're doing we want to prosper and have success I want my wife and children to be provided for all that but we had to completely just put all that aside die to all of that and saying we're gonna do what the Lord says and that's it not for personal gain and you have very humbly you know very humbly and and you've been responsible with your anointing but also unpractical areas too so I just want to say that for the record yeah but uh about the recording though when David caught me on the recording or he didn't catch me he recorded me he totally took it out of context it was a small little clip if he played all the hours of audio you would see that that was not the state I was always in there are times where we pray for talk together where we express both of our hearts about how you know broken or about how sad this was about how horrible this was I mean I talked with David and Derek both many times like and we never dreamed that our tribe you know of revival and and in the glory and harvest would ever come to this place it's so sad it's still to this day is so sad because something has been lost there and we're all dealing with that sense of loss right now but yes I was elated I was relieved and I was very happy especially when Rick started doing his rants that I was not taken out but I said God seemed to give me favor I mean who wouldn't be happy in that you know because you were expecting because of Rick's ransom too lose all of your followings but you gained it instead that's right and also that recording was not taken the day of the exposure was not several days after there's a reference in the recording to Michael Brown Michael Brown didn't come into the picture until several days if not a week or ten days and yeah and he thought it was hours later or an hour later he gave the impression that I put on the show earlier that day and then I went and just started mocking and laughing with him and that's not true I mean the way I described it was like you the other day you've been through so much lately with all the accusations and everything it's been at times just harassment and having to rebuke the spirit of harassment and then you know you just you just were you know how to laugh the other day about David's comment and I totally can relate there's those times where you just have to find some way to laugh to laugh at off you know and of course that would be inappropriate if I laughed you know about something even related to it publicly but I was in a private conversation with someone that I thought was my friend and brother at times I vented to him at times I vented things in the flesh you know and and he made you feel safe and invited you to share your heart and to open your heart and I just want to say to all of you is that when people come and open their heart to you that's a sacred that's sacred and so be careful with that and so I mean that's a lesson for all of us to learn right we have to be careful I'll take this moment to briefly say this as well there was absolutely things that I did and said during this whole process that I was wrong for saying and doing and I repent publicly for that I asked you to forgive me there were times I handled things with immaturity and there are absolutely times where in my zeal I erred that's a lot of times where I tend to err is on the side of zeal so I just want to say that there were times I was absolutely in the flesh the things I shouldn't have said and done but honestly before God I did my best that I could and I did my best my best that you know not just according to what I felt but also submitting to leaders that God put in my life there are times I absolutely did what you said to do not because I felt like it or even agreed but I wanted to be in submission I wanted to trust God in you as someone that God had put in my life so it's so beautiful okay some practical questions did you ever at any time hacked any computers or social media in order to prepare your report or tell people to go hack them absolutely not the recording that David Hunter released that it was it was at the very beginning when we first heard the rumor about hacking and it actually came out of Todd's camp I believe it originally came from David so once again he was putting these pretend scenarios giving these pretend scenarios to me like well what if the cops get involved what if the FBI comes and my whole mindset was David even if there was hacked material I'm getting so much stuff sent to me every day how am I gonna know the difference between a hack screenshot and not hacked they look exactly the same I said my thought was I'll pass it on to the investigator has 26 years of police experience and he can deal with all that and at that time as well I was no longer leading the investigation I was no longer handling anything it was all if any kind of a witness came forward it was referred to the investigator you know so but no and we now have proof actually proof that there was nothing ever hacked okay some some stuff did come out of Todd's office but they had legal access because Todd had given to him as as admins and having of the passwords and stuff yeah did you engage in any illegal activity absolutely not it's been a Ledge that I took an illegal recording of the young man that was abused by Todd in 2013 at the time I took the recording in Pennsylvania when I was on a road trip and I thought it was the same laws of South Carolina which is actually most states one one part RCB two-party consent I found out afterwards that there is a law in Pennsylvania that says you do need to party consent so after the fact I found out there could been a conflict there I immediately went and got legal counsel and this time it wasn't just a friend telling me on the side I went and paid for a legal counseling session my lawyer told me explicitly 100 percent I did nothing illegal he said what I did in that state actually falls under federal statute because the phone call put took place in multiple states and federal federal statute states that it's one-party consent another thing that he told me was motive is very important in in in in in these cases he said because my motive was I took it in private and I took it just to make leaders like you aware of the situation how serious this was he says that's another thing that really plays into it you didn't take it to blackmail him try to extort money from the young man or slander or slander because if you record someone without them knowing like what's been done to you yeah and for the purpose of slander or defaming yeah that is illegal it is that is illegal when you do that so we just want to say that not that there's gonna be any legal action from this side or whatever but just to set it straight that you didn't you didn't engage in any ly illegal activity another thing I want to say about the recording I took of the young man when I was in Pennsylvania at the time when I got him on the phone I just took it because it was so hard to get him on the phone and in that conversation he actually agreed to give me more so I thought I was going to be able to just throw that out and actually get him to release a written statement and another audio one but I never got a chance to he pulled out immediately and even when I kept it yes I did have a battle with it about the the ethical mists of it that's not a word but you know I'm saying the ethics yes the ethics of it but my thought was well in the world even police officers and whatnot they'll record somebody at one time and it's ethical there so I had a battle internally and in my heart I protected protecting the young man you remember when when you know you started becoming a prize of this I didn't even mention his name I never knew his name until recently when it was actually I think it was through David hunter someone that mentioned his name yeah they they're the ones that put it on publicly in my original port 30 page report I never put his name I just called him the 2013 intern even the audio I put 2013 insert I wouldn't even put his name because I want to protect his identity I didn't want to hurt him anymore did he know that report was not submitted to the panel it was not a minute no that was just so that everyone knows is that that was not submitted because it was not acceptable because of the way that it had been recorded so the panel never did hear that and it was never blasted all over the world by you or by me that's a lie I never blasted the recording all over the world even the recording that David had hunter has of me talking about something related to that I was referring to just a quote that ended up in my August 22nd Facebook post but that original report that we had the purpose of it was to share in private with a few leaders and we did hear that one of the leaders that I believe Derek Gates shared it with leaked it like put it on an email blast and sent it out but that was not me at all I did not want that you know because uh Derek Gates had gone in safe I mean he was in faith because he has his own concerns he's a movie maker and there was like Todd was involved in the movie and he was was concerned so he gave it to people who were involved in the movie yeah and you know they might have I mean we don't know for sure who did it but I'll tell you for sure it wasn't me and it wasn't you and it wasn't Brant it wasn't Robert OC or Ron Cantor or anyway in fact I don't think Rob and I don't think Rob and Ron even had it but I believe that David sent it out to people as well David sent it out to his well he calls his spiritual father as well that's actually got some things rolling in June right so I just want that known for the record that because I heard even about myself that I sent even it sent it up blasted it out an email - first of all I heard three hundred and seven hundred and then over a thousand people I never sent it out to any email list never I never posted it on my facebook never so just for the record that you would have that clean in your heart about that never happened that was um not true lots of things that are not true but let me just confirm one more time I've done nothing illegal and the people that we've worked with as far as we know I've done nothing those are complete lives right and we verified I verified with a lawyer he shown me the laws and I believe that all right I'm just gonna go with one more thing before we wrap right now and that is you were accused of having an affair up in Alaska yeah that's a complete lie absolute lie me my wife when we married I was 20 she was 18 we were both virgins my wife had never even held another boy's hand never even dated I got the first everything with my wife so we have a record of a purity a testimony purity which I love we both grew up in church we both grew up in very godly homes I thank God for my history in that where the rumor comes from is when I was 16 years old there was a woman leader a pastor in the church who was 32 years old who became infatuated with me who pursued me in the church but nothing happened you know pretty soon my parents found out leadership found out cops caught involved even and they fled the state you know at the time so it was kind of a mess you know I was confused I was her 16 year old boy but there was never any affair and you know what it really hurts me when when David hunter Lewis de Sena Todd Michael thickest get on live Facebook and and push out those lies and they never even once called me or text me or anything to get my side I mean that that's what they have alleged we have done which we have not we've taken it in private we've done the best presenters we went through the paths the Bible says never bring an accusation against an elder without two or three witnesses most of the accusations they brought one witness David hunter so there was also a very vile gossip rumor about Robert dosti as well that was false completely false I mean completely fabricated out of the blue because Rob Rob and his wife have a very close relationship and and they love their family but you know there is a warning in the Bible about false witnessing you know it says thou shalt not bear false witness yes and you know you have to be careful that when you are representing and I think a lot of that has to be intentional to fabricate a story like that has to be intentional I mean I'm not saying it is in this case but when those kind of stories come up out of the blue with nothing to validate them or anything or just based on gossip a rumor it looks like there's some some intentionality about it and I'm not saying again I'm not saying in this case it is but we have to be careful about that okay I want to finish up with this you have a concern for the victims and I asked you last night I said all over this whole thing because we're moving on we are moving on it that's why we're finishing up here we just want to clean up some of these details because we want to move on as much as you do okay and so we're moving on to build now we're we're not going to discuss this stuff after we finished today that is it it is final but we will be building the body we will be building messages so that the the the bar will be raised and so that we can have solution but last night and you teared up then last night too you said that your heart is for the victims and so sure about that because you've got some some really good insights that you've been learning well I've been educating myself just on this whole thing about abuse sexual abuse in the church and the church really needs to become more aware and more educated on this because this is a major issue and I've never even heard it come up as far as training or awareness or anything and any of the organizations I've been involved in and we're discovering more and more with the me2 movement and now it seems to be happening the church too we need to do a better job we need to bring some reform to what we're doing we need to raise the awareness we need to treat this seriously so yes my heart is for the victims from what I've read the healing for the victims has only just begun because this is a major part of their healing and you know and this has been confirmed by all these studies they've done all these case studies where this stuff is happening which is a major part of their healing what do you mean by this I'm gonna say it's it's justice justice institutional justice and also reform also hold the institution and the leaders accountable is a huge part of healing for the victims and that's why all of a sudden when justice gained by the panel victims started speaking up and also from what I've read the first reaction of people many times when victims speak up is to actually attack the victim and defendant some of the articles and now that you've been reeling from professionals yes from professionals and the reason why that is is because they said they call them the secondary victims there's there's primary victims but then there's secondary victims the secondary victims are all the people worldwide that have been impacted by Todd's ministry and anointing and now they're hurt they're confused they're in denial they're reacting emotionally in anger and all these things and that's why we've been trying to give people grace okay with this I've had dear friends of mine come so hard against me in this and many times I just haven't responded haven't engaged in that because I want to give them grace they're going through their own you know emotional working this out and it's believing for them the truth to prevail but you know I have a heart for those people right now that that hopefully that's a major reason why I believe we're doing these videos hopefully that they can see the truth okay they've heard both sides now and hopefully they can come to a resolution as well that just because someone they put their trust in someone they looked up to so much received from them so much has betrayed them its betrayal gets the body of Christ not just direct victims just because that happens it doesn't mean that God has betrayed you it doesn't mean that God's failed you it doesn't mean that God's still not gonna use his church and make her the glorious bride that he's promised her to be so I just have so much hope you know I so bear witness with you on the hope message there's an angel of Hope here in the studio this morning God is releasing the spirit of hope the power of hope right now the the the expectation of what is coming something good that's coming and I just want to give grace and I want I want to speak healing for everybody who's been impacted by this who everybody has had their their faith shaken by this I remember you telling me that was one of your major things that you were praying into when Lakeland happened is so many people around the world are so hurt by this and we have to raise the standard if we're gonna have to be raised it has to be we cannot claim that we're baptized in the Holy Spirit and just roll on the floor and do miracles and not exemplify the fruit of Holy Spirit we've got to be just as powerful and righteousness and justice in holiness as we are in miracles you know and you know we've talked about this several times the holiness movement came in in church history as God built line upon line precept upon precept the holiness movement came in and became the foundation of the Pentecostal movement you know one of my favorite guys to read in the early days when I was a teenager was Smith Wigglesworth and he recalls about how these holiness preacher these Wesley ins would come through his hometown and even the Salvation Army that he was associate was such a holiness ministry and that became the foundation for him being baptized to fill power always needs to be the foundation and that's what I want to see precision I believe that's what God is releasing right now as he wants to release a fresh holiness movement Romans 1:4 so that we can release the resurrection power that he's been promising us all these years the greater glory but he doesn't want us to lose it we need a new wineskin that that raises the bar so we don't lose what God's about to pour out so good I just want to cover one thing and then we're gonna pray because a number of questions I know many of you send him questions I have pages and pages of them to go through and so a lot of those questions have been answered between last night and this morning a lot of them have been answered but one of them that comes up over and over and over again I mean just is it it predominates it is about why why would in in this case Todd but not not just hard like why would a spiritual leader who is getting someone sending them you know a photo of their body parts or whatever why would they be more responsible than the person that sent them yeah the picture from the experts that I have been learning from lately people who are trained in this counseling psychology all of it they say that an abuse situation the church is very unique because spiritual leaders have a special power they don't just have a power in terms of a status and office a place of authority like in the world but they have an elevated level of authority power because they have the power of God they represent God they're God's agents so the reason why you cannot say that any of these victims consented okay that I've understood from professionals is because whenever you come into a relationship the power level has to be equal in order for an honest consent to happen so when you go out on a date well if I were to go you know when I went on a date listen for that I'm not going to again but when I went out on a date with my wife back in the day um long time ago we were coming together on the same level okay of power and authority and of course never nothing ever happened then but anything that did happen to afford consent without marriage it was consensual yes the reason why none of these victims you can't say they consented so their equal responsibility with Todd it's because it comes in like this Todd automatically the first moment he meets them has an elevated level of power and he has more of an elevated level power because he's a premier revivalist he's done things that many of us revivalists could only dream of doing moves in incredible signs and wonders incredible gifting so he has an elevated level of power which I believe gives him an elevated level of responsibility so all of these people came to Todd in that relationship and he had power over them and he used his position of power to abuse people and that has to stop yeah it has to stop it's like people have asked us another big question that comes in well why doesn't go to the criminal courts you know and some of them will I'm sure you know yeah we can't comment on that right now we're not permitted but we're sure that some will and so we'll just let that one play out on its own because it takes the person who has been a feeling that that there is a criminal case has to make the decision to take that into the light and into the courts but I think that we've already seen not speaking of this this situation but many situations recently even in the last month there there's already been men that are in jail today and and I'm not saying men only because I think women are going to start to be exposed to because it's wrong for a woman in power like the 32 year old woman in your case that went after a 16 year old you know chased after a 16 year old boy that is that needs to be addressed so we're going to be part of the solution we know that there's problems they've been exposed we're going to be part of the solution the the cross of Jesus Christ offers forgiveness offers healing offers deliverance offers restoration and we talked about last night about what restoration looks like so we've got some some differences there but I do want to say again I think that we have had in our mind that the ultimate is to restore a person into ministry where I don't think that's ultimately God's choice necessarily because he cares about his children and I use the scenario of a of a father with you know having children and getting a babysitter to look after them and for for him in care even it could be another like older son or something if that person abused the children that that father is going to care for his children and he'll still forgive he can forgive the abuser he can get counseling pay for it maybe visit the person in jail but he's not going to have his his that person babysit his children anymore look after his children and we have to be a lot more responsible and get out of this naive thinking about woo yeah the blood covers everything there there there's criteria for it and and I think that we need to examine the Scriptures a little bit more the Scriptures have just been kind of pushed off to the side but in this Reformation I believe the scriptures are going to come back and have their weight again and we're believing for that because even though the validity of Scripture is being challenged in society and in the church and so we we need to be a strong voice if you're gonna be a reformer you're gonna be strong for God not for the voice of the world out there not from the voice of air or not for the voice of immorality you're gonna be a strong voice for God and so I release you to rise up as a reformer in this hour and be a solution for God I hope that this message has given you hope and you will receive the hope the refreshing that comes from it even though painful things have been shared today difficult things have been shared today but you know a lot of times even in a divorce situation in a family no one wants to talk about it they just you know hopefully the elephant in the room is going to go away and so it never gets talked about and we we we just can't be afraid of talking about it you know people would say stop talking we don't want to hear anymore I understand that it's painful but in order to heal these things need to be brought forward so let's not just be a dysfunctional family and say let's not talk about it let's deal with it like we are right now and then move on okay and we're gonna build we're not just gonna leave this and go our merry way we are responsible and we are going to build and I hope you will too so god bless you and thank you so much for joining us we're gonna take a half-hour break right now and we're going to come back with another livestream with Rob Roy dosti and we're going to share more with an emphasis about the victims and what's going on with victims and how they need our help they need our voice they need our strength right now and how we feel like there's going to be Reformation in that area and that there's going to be community calls forth together in the church to care for the broken because we're getting ready for a great harvest so we'll see you in half an hour let's see it's a let's see it's 11:30 7:00 right now let's meet back here at 12:15 for a wrap-up

Channel: Patricia King

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Length: 97min 29sec (5849 seconds)

Published: Wed Jan 08 2020