Guestsplaining 004: Michael Gormley of Catching Foxes - Forming Intentional Dudes

[Music] welcome to godsplaining contemplative preachers contemporary age each week join the dominican friars as they consider all things catholic hello and welcome back to god splitting i should say welcome to guest planning because here we are with an extra special guest this is the one the only mike gormley also known as gomer it is a pleasure to have you on our show gomer please say a word of welcome oh it is good to be here thank you all for inviting me on here father gregory i do want to remind you that i invited you to do a parish mission at my church and you stood me up no hard feelings but i selflessly come on your show it's fine don't worry about it it's fine it's fine that's right they say friendships that they are non-reciprocal and benevolence has only to be one-sided so i am happy to have this friendship with you who says that says that no one does i just made that up that was for convenience sake uh we're not alone here on this call those who watch on youtube can verify that that is the case those who listen will not have known until this moment we're also here with father jacob burch and father jacob birch howard thanks i'm i'm doing great i was worried that you were going to forget to introduce me again but but you did it so we're making steps strides we're we're learning from our mistakes it's great so i can i can rest assured yeah no it's great so yeah good to be here thanks for being with us gomer yeah thanks for having me so um usually we talk about mindless nonsense for the first five minutes of the episode because such is the manner of conversation but we are here about the serious business of not wasting someone else's time uh so we we value your time and uh we thank you for sharing it with us so to set up the topic for today's conversation uh we want to talk a little bit about masculinity and maybe people have all kinds of associations with it so certainly people talk about masculinity they might think it to be toxic in some settings they might think it to be um i don't know febrile is the word that i came up with but i don't know that anyone else says that word except for me uh maybe wimpy in other settings yeah it's just it's just me okay so so we have a sense that that men should be men but that they shouldn't be brutes uh nor should they be not men um so we have we have a sense of what we want but then the question is how do you how do you make good men so from your advantage you know you preach parish missions you're a lay evangelist you have a media apostolate with catching foxes and with every knee shall bow so you're thinking about forming disciples and you're also a father so you're forming little men well boys to be men um so maybe just to kind of get things going what are your thoughts about uh kind of like men masculinity in general do you have a working model in your mind what are some things you're looking to form what are some things you're looking to tease out yeah i think for our culture right now we're in kind of a weird moment where um you know pope john paul uh john paul ii and chris david is late she brought out this notion of participation and how we're seeing for the first time in world history groups that were excluded now participating in the public life of their countries their people their nations whatever and of course he was speaking also in terms of the communist um you know totalitarian regimes that were occupying but he brings up this whole point about female participation in society you know to unheard of levels after during and after world war ii and it's amazing because as women especially through birth control have been able to modify their lives in such a dramatic way um it's modified society in a dramatic way in ways that we never knew or could think about or anticipate um you know from things like uh if a man was that person in which who leaves the home in order to make a living for the home and a woman was that person who raises the kids what happens when those when both of them are out working what happens when you know the woman makes more than the man and so the man stays home you end up um the the mutability or the um yeah the mutable nature of these rolls gets so dynamically switched when you throw birth control into it like our society's been doing since the 60s it it really does i don't think we fully appreciated the radical way it altered the human landscape and social landscape so for men men have always been in a weird place i know that might sound weird but um you know right now men are targeted with patriarchy and all this stuff uh with the domination over women you know obviously physical strength and violence has been a part of our of our society since since the fall but um men have never been tied to their roles as women have been because of mother nature we call it mother nature because women are initiated into womanhood naturally men have always had every culture except ours has always had initiation rights and rituals and procedures to say now you're a man and we haven't had that for the last 100 150 years for most western modern societies you know cardinal sarawak was talking about you know in his tribe in africa they march you into the men kidnap the boys take them into the middle of the forest and circumcise them and if they scream or cry they're out of the tribe right so could you imagine being a 12 or 13 year old boy and all of a sudden like and then when you return you're a man you don't hang out with the women anymore you hang out with the men until you're ready to you know make babies and such and so forth but um so for me as a man to navigate all these different waters right like you realize that the increase in female participation in the culture is a net benefit great thing but it destabilizes these roles that we've had for literally thousands of years and i don't mean the woman's just barefoot and pregnant at home what i mean is there was an an understanding of the dichotomy of what it takes to build a household and that that understanding is completely gone so you have the rise of toxic masculinity which is not masculinity as such um you know the idea of um reducing my role as a man to just uh you know and i see this all the time with the young adults especially college students where they have no appreciation for relationships just racking up sexual encounters and um you see this young adult i would actually say that's more like post college um because you have these people that just settle into grooves i don't know if what it's like in the ops but when i hang out with my fellow uh uh bros right we're a bunch of morons and that's kind of what i need to be because i have to be a fancy sophisticated man at work and all these things but the problem is when that's your only culture right when uh these men are not choosing to grow up beyond that um it can have a very toxic effect and so what i find is you have these guys who consume porn at an unheard of level um you have other men who are doing that and then um pursuing relationships with women in an unhealthy manner and it just kind of compounds the efforts of trying to form an authentic christian masculinity and so again i look at jp2 i mean he was he was a um an adventurer right he was an outdoorsman he um was also an actor and an uh towering intellect a deep man of spiritual life and prayer um and so i look to him more often than not and and what it means to be a man and what it means to reflect that and reverberate that right out to the world so it's super confusing and you can't sugarcoat it like everyone wants the typical answer like oh be a man you gotta be strong you gotta you gotta punch a tree in half right and i am i am very little of those things i used to always joke every time franciscan university made me uh give a men's session at the youth conference i'm like crap can't we get one of the guys from the band like i don't know what it means and we always joke that the men's sessions have evolved when i when i went to the youth conferences in the 90s uh it was uh like the ura braveheart you know raw remain yeah and then in the early 2000s it was the it's okay to hug a brother like sensitive guy talk i don't know if father gregory have you experienced that and then it was uh for the love of god stop looking at porn and that's pretty much all it is now uh for the men's sessions and so um and i find it i mean like the guys who don't look at porn are such an anomaly right now so um the pornification of masculinity leads to uh hypersexuality and an inability to relate to women in a real level so that's what i that's where i come in with my uh bed head right here yeah i didn't yeah yeah that's awesome yeah check it out on youtube there you go yeah look at that so through through what you just described there are a number of i mean pornography of course relationship kind of things if you were to sort of um you know before kind of diving into thinking about solutions identifying the problem is always a good thing otherwise you're proposing solutions for things that nobody cares about but if you're you know looking at looking at the horizon and per maybe in a broad social context or even more specifically the within a christian catholic context if you had to sort of identify um some problem areas where where because of either the social changes or like the influence of pornography where men where men suffer um in these kind of ways where they're kind of anemic in their sort of the masculine virtues i guess what would you kind of uh describe there um yeah i think with the widespread confusion over masculine roles and the lack of initiation into adulthood you have 40 year old preteens basically right and you're dealing with these with these men in adult bodies with adult careers who when it comes to relationships in a very real way are childish uh maybe not 40s maybe maybe 20s and 30s but um the the onslaught of uh social media and i know that it gets such like bugaboo you know lip service everyone always criticizes that stuff but when you put an always-on distraction machine that's high definition and broadband in everyone's pocket and then you tell them be mature but you're giving it to a sixth grader or in my daughter's case uh in her preschool a six-year-old you're giving a six-year-old a brand new iphone um like how do you handle that when you're a little kid i'll tell you how they handle it they put their face to their phone all the time parents ask me all the time what's one thing i can do for my high school students and now i'm doing youth ministry on top of a dolphin formation and i tell them all the time do not buy them a phone until they're 16 years old and if they need a phone for text messages or uh you know whatever then get them a dumb phone do not give them access to this stuff it's it's impairing their ability to relate to humanity and right in front of them right and uh so then you look at pornography what does pornography do the way i describe it is it lets you feel like a man without demanding anything of you right so if i had to pick one or the other i would probably get rid of pornography if i could you know snap my fingers and make it disappear because it's always a mortal sin right or it's always gravely sinful and disordered but and i think you would have a night and day turnaround with pornography um but as it turns for men to be for boys to become just adults and girls to become adult women i think social media is impairing that so much i think it's crippling our moral sense and so when i work with people that's the first thing i say is i do a lot of discipleship right so working one-on-one working in small groups of people and first and foremost is if we don't have an aim in society for men then and we don't posit anything for them then there's nothing for them to strive for right and life becomes just one dang thing after another right and it ceases to be purposeful meaningful and because it's aimless and so what i try to do is give them an aim and this is where um you know the catechism and the and conception of the virtues is so absolutely paramount and they are not getting this right have you ever read the section on chastity in the catechism um i mean you probably haven't because you don't need to but people i'm just kidding but right but that is one of my favorite places to teach people about the moral life in general because it talks about like the laws of progress and um the you know the the reality of failure and i think so often we picture the moral life as like you're on a mountaintop now don't fall off when in fact it's like no you're at the bottom of the mountain you have ordered and disorder desires feelings urges inclinations whatever the phrase you want and you need to harness them through training and um i think if there's one word i could use to summarize what could help masculinity the most it would be train right that notion of training i saw a woman with a t-shirt in a gym parking lot i wasn't going to the gym i was going to the donut shop next door but she can't she came out and she said and her shirt said don't exercise and then in big letters it said train and i thought like oh that is actually really profound that is really profound because it's like you have a stated purpose i want to go to couch to 5k or i run want to run a marathon or i want to deadlift x amount of weight you have to adopt a rule right and the more i'm doing exodus 90 right now and the more i live as a layman under a rule the more i realize the um the disciplines that come the disciplines the word discipline right means to teach it doesn't mean to punish yourself because pleasure is evil right that means to teach and you're teaching your passions your desires your emotions your inclinations you're teaching them and you're learning more about yourself and where you fail so doing exodus 90 i realized you know one of the things is i might give up tv but i fall into other indulgences because i don't want to be a dad because being a dad is exhausting and so along that don't just exercise train my advice to people is don't just say i need to spend more time with my kids do a project right it has that same motif um of like you got to focus on a thing with a clear goal so that they see with you how they are making progress with you and i think that's so huge i really do yeah god bless you for exodus 90. i i did exodus 90 the last year i can't remember two years of those cold showers holy cow mm-hmm not gonna can i tell you the cold showers are my favorite part you're sick man i am they have it has and we just got this crazy two winter storms here in houston and the guys were all texting were like should we roll back the cold showers and i'm like no i stand in the shower i don't do the arm stand in crank it onto cold full power you see the face of god my friend see them all yeah you're singing i'm not because the cold showers they they got the best of me i tell you what i was showering like once every two weeks because of that that's not true but kind of too close to the truth yeah yeah let's uh let's stick with this idea of training so it reminds me um uh i can't remember who it was or in what context but someone asked my mom if my dad you know pre-deceased her if she would consider remarrying and she said no because it's taken too long to train him um so there's this sense that in relationships be they you know married relationships or friendships that you're kind of training the other person and you're not like making them a project you're not saying like i know what's good for you and i will bring it about as a result of very intentional and deliberate steps which are kind of creepy and manipulative um but in like a friendship you're trying to coax the good out of the other person not because you know again you don't like them until such time as they're better but because you love them as a result of which you know this relationship barracks good fruit in their life so i suspect you know people listening some may be married and some may have kids but i think a lot are probably just involved in ordinary work a day friendships with men who probably disappoint them uh disappoint them because they are afraid to be committed disappoint them because they ghost them when it is convenient you know uh when they find communication too demanding or burdensome disappointing because they are reticent to actually share on a deep level and choose instead to hold them off at arm's length you know disappointing in all the ways in which modern modern man is typically disappointing so how do you encourage these people who want to coax the good out of the other but want to do so in an organic way that will actually produce good fruit because it's you know like animated by love what do you say to these people the best thing you can do is to so everyone wants to do in in the christian churches that i see catholic and protestant whatever is they want to create small groups right and i'm a big fan of small group ministry i created one i see there's a lot of power in it but i constantly see that men don't take to small groups very well one guy said i feel like i'm sitting in a knitting circle and the reality is men don't use words as often as someone like me right because i talk all the time non-stop i'm like a shark if i stop speaking i just die right and if the shark stops swimming it just dies so the idea is for most men articulating their feelings and sharing their heart and all this stuff that just sounds like dear lord no thank you um but so much about the faith is built around that at the parish level like hey we're going to come and we're going to have a men's meeting we're going to do this we're going to share there's teaching there's discussion and then there's like that personal sharing that sometimes i feel like it's emphasized too much and so my remedy is to do things right so along the training stuff is to do things together to not make it about because i don't know about you but for a lot of guys their high school life consisted of sitting in a room chugging beer or trying not to be awkward right and you know sitting in a dorm room or going to a party but what are you doing you're talking with people but you're drinking as that social lubricant and you're trying not to replicate that in the churches but that's often what people do it's like go sit in a small group drink your punch nothing in it you know and so i find that men and women both need to to do something rather than just talk about it and when you're talking about uh training someone i think that is hilarious what your mom said because it is so true and what i think of it is the the subtle negotiation of other persons habits and hates right like my wife hates dishes in the sink uh so it has to become my habit to make sure that doesn't stay that way for a long time right and there are things that you both that if you care about the other you're attentive as much as possible to their their mode of being in the world right and and their likes and dislikes and so part of it is grafting yourself to them and they to you and i think that's important that that is how we function in society i have to be able to know your behaviors as somewhat predictable in order to be in the same room with you right i loved how who was it some presenter was on stage and he said just imagine he's like all of you were just sitting down staring at me imagine if one of you turned in your seat and just started staring at the person behind you how would you feel and people he's like you don't even notice like these social conventions that we adopt immediately but um yeah training one another in friendship i think is absolutely important was that line from c.s lewis when one of their friends in the inklings died and he said i'm not just going to miss so and so i'm going to miss that aspect of jarrah tolkien that only so-and-so could bring out you know and i think that's really i think that's really important um connecting over things with groups and not just individuals i think is is a key into reaching the masculine heart boom all right in the middle or somewhere around the middle of each episode we artificially take a break uh like we're a television show so we're gonna do that right now you are listening to god's planning visit us at godsplaining.org to listen to our episodes shop our store and donate to our podcast all gifts go to improving the podcast and bringing the gospel to more listeners thanks for your support thanks everyone for sticking with us on this here episode of god splitting more specifically gas planing we're joined here by gomer mike gormley who is known for his exploits with lay evangelist every niche albow catching foxes one of the first podcasts i guess maybe to kind of speak to that all right so you got involved in podcasting like back in you know the days when dinosaurs roamed the internet earth you know it's like you and catholic stuff you should know and then a barren wasteland of non-media based catholic ministry um in your experience of that you've met a lot of people and you've formed a lot of relationships what would you say like what is the place so we're talking about forming man what are the place of podcasts internet apostles things of that sort um in forming these types of virtues or forming these types of relationships that we've described um you know i'm a professional speaker that's one of the things i do on top of working at a parish and i tell people all the time when i'm at a conference or an event or a parish mission i say talking with me or coming to a talk is not your it's not going to bring transformation in your life i'm just hopefully at best i'm a catalyst i can't walk with you so the idea of the new media and the role of the new media and things especially like podcasts and audio books and whatnot the reason why they're so powerful today is because and and i got to be honest with you all our the complete failure of communicating the catholic faith at the parish level i mean i tell people all the time i i'm no longer shocked at how little people know about being catholic i mean look like it's it's shocking like uh 80 of a group of high school students had never heard of cain and abel had never heard of the ten commandments had never heard of moses right and so i come from this place where i did the bible timeline with jeff cavins when i was 14 years old with my dad and i'm dealing with stuff like you know people who have never heard of cain and abel and they sound like silly children stories when you read them for the first time so podcasts fill in the gap in a very real way to the complete deformity of the catholic heart in the culture i mean and and thank god for them but they're not enough and they can feel like enough but they're not enough interpersonal relationships are what we ultimately need but they they are ex it's like a visiting preacher right like hey i'm gonna go down father so he's doing a three week mission i'm gonna go and listen every night to to the talk well that's good but yeah he might hear your confession too but at the end of the day he's not going to be there in six months when your marriage is upside down and you've gone back to drinking right like you need someone who journeys with you accompaniment uh you need someone there with you and if you don't have them with you you're not capable of living the christian life in a in a very real way it becomes almost impossible um to even keep the commandments right when you don't have someone with you in you know in the journey right so i guess my when you say well i agree with all all of what you said um and i think that's important you know dominican life has some community life to it we i think we gripe about it more than we do anything else but it's still part of our life so i i'm with you so what would you say you know somebody who tunes into the podcast ours yours or here's a paris mission goes to like a big conference something like that you know guys who are looking for what you're describing um but but what would you what advice would you offer as far as beginning to build that because i think sometimes with this the hardest thing is not it's not keeping things going but you know finding that community or being the one to build that community or that friendship or something i think and because of what you said because of the whole social media thing we lack those skills i think that were more natural in in decades and generations past so what what do you kind of you know for those listening what would you say here are a couple things that might be useful helpful to try to kick off what you're describing yeah i i heard of this men's group it was it wasn't religious but the first thing you couldn't join the men's group until you've gotten the phone number or until you've approached 50 separate women and asked for their phone number right so the idea was to be exposed to the horrible difficulty of being rejected because you're probably going to be rejected by 48 of them right and especially if you look like me like whoa cave troll um i did have a bit hard in lord of the rings i got shot in the mouth with an arrow but the uh but the the experience of it is um of i don't know any other way to say it than this you have to if you don't have community get all the podcasts do all the listening watch all the fun you know watch braveheart on repeat but um at the end of the day you need flesh and blood community and if you don't have it you need to start it you have to be the one who ventures into the unknown and sacrifices all the uncomfortableness to take those first steps i would recommend you go to the parish priest first right that's an excellent place to start if you're in an area where maybe i mean i get people that say like yeah but i'm in a rural place and all this stuff you're going to have your challenges but you need community you need it you need community like you need water right what does it matter what does aristotle say if you have all the riches and power of the uh you know but you don't have friends like if you don't have a single friend in which to share that with like what does it matter and so you need you need community so whether that is starting something like i have friends who moved from college into our area and they had no one right and i'm an old married man they don't want to party with me even though i'll definitely party with them i mean i i love it right i'm an extrovert where's the party but um they so they joined like rugby teams you know and they just they don't know the guys anything and i think there is a distinction between um and i heard this on a podcast called the order of man or this guy said there's a difference between being good at being a man versus being a good man and i think we want to you know it's like sometimes i think we over spiritualize certain problems and we miss the very human all too human component of like i gotta have good social skills i gotta work on that and i gotta learn how to look people in the eye communicate with them clearly invite them to events make those events fun like you you just have to do that there's no there's no thing a podcast like a pi i mean i want i love people that's why i talk all the time to them but my podcast can't hug you my podcast cannot get a beer with you so uh you you need to have that in in in whatever way you can especially post covet like we desperately need it yeah i um as i'm thinking about this when i so i listen to podcasts mostly when i go hiking i live in switzerland and i have opportunity to hike with some frequencies dude podcast on a phone and just go up for x number of hours i get to hear this amazing world-class talk recorded from the kitchen hey things are improving kind of i lost i listened to one the other day well there's a little rough but but they've they've gotten better please god yeah um or thanks be to god um so sometimes you know it's cold in the mountains blah blah blah iphone batteries are built to break and i'll like pull my phone out to check something and it'll just go dead and i'll be like that's all right i brought a backup phone because my life is fueled by anxiety and then that one goes out and it's like okay what are we gonna do here right so it's an experience of solitude right it's the kind of um i guess the negative impress or the relief of what you describe with community so podcasts can't hug you a podcast can't love you um a podcast is an opportunity to grow in some you know habit or skill to think well or perhaps love better but ultimately it's about relationships and i think that um that focuses for me my need for a relationship with the lord because if i'm uncomfortably being quiet you know if i'm uncomfortable just being with the lord that reveals a kind of baseline discomfort in my own humanity um so maybe just as a as a kind of way to wrap up or final thoughts maybe just to think a little bit about like what is man before god right so all this talk about engaging all this talk about forming community meaningful relationships growing in the requisite virtues to be of service to be generous to be good right but like what does that look like in terms of a relationship with the lord because i think a lot of the things you described which make it difficult for a man to talk about his life with other people also makes it difficult for him to have a prayer life to have a contemplative life and he might find it to be like i don't know a little bit feminine so what does that look like yeah it is so stupid when people think of the spiritual life as something feminine but i do love how you had you were compelled as a contemplative to turn the conversation to how can i be alone uh whatever um no you know how i i get alone time as a married man i go into the bathroom and i lock the door and i turn on all the air vents so my kids i i just don't even hear them when they are screaming and terror and you know they can't get to me because there's an exterior door that's also locked and then i just read my alistar mcintyre there's this little video for that i don't even i saw i think someone sent it to me it's it's a parent trying to do this you know going into the bathroom and then they have their phone and they're videotaping this and under the door come these five little fingers and they're just like you know like are you in there see that's why you got a locker the bedroom door the master bathroom door and then i have a little buffer room door yeah i got i got three layers they still find their way through they still do oh man um but no so when it comes to contemplation if you follow uh the teachings of the master right like if you're walking in the way of the lord jesus the main thing you're gonna see is every single time the crowds pressed in on him he afterwards goes off into a lonely place right he goes alone uh and that line from saint francis what a man is before god that he is and nothing else um you need solitude you absolutely need solitude uh pope john paul ii in his theology of the body right when he talks about why was adam created first and he talks about this notion of original solitude to walk with god alone every man and woman needs to walk with god alone as the foundational core of who they are from that foundation comes so i always call it the first relationship your first relationship is with god and christ alone right that needs to be nurtured and nourished overwhelmingly and then from that spring from that um you know life-giving water then it pours over into your relationships with others especially if you have a vocation of matrimony or whatnot your children but the the art of contemplation is being devastated by easy access to perpetual distraction i mean think about it when you have netflix it automatically serves up the next show so you have to intervene to not keep watching tv right like that's the new thing and facebook automatically starts playing it that's why there's all this push for closed captioning not is one of the available important things you can do and it really is um i'm writing i'm doing a retreat for my parish staff and one of the things is you have to care about your personal your mental your emotional and your spiritual health and part of that is man being alone with nature right just being just going outside is enough nature for most people there's a reason why your stress levels decrease and why you do feel a greater connection to the universe because you're a creature right you are made in this you were made uh what was the phrase right god formed man from the dust from the wilderness and then plopped them into the garden like we need a little bit of wilderness from time to time to fuel uh and to be reminded of our creaturelyness and if you don't know how to pray using mental prayer uh you know that's the next step read that part in the catechism a read meditative prayer don't read contemplative prayers because that just confuses everyone my exodus 90 group of guys are like what is con it's like looking at stuff constantly like i don't understand and i was like oh father jean-claude bone is wonderful um but the the the part on mental prayer meditation right like helping people just read the life of christ um alexio continua over and over again of the gospels um is a master class on how to be alone how to walk with god noah right the whole world is is walking in a in a noisy crowd to destruction yet noah walked alone with god and thus he was righteous and blameless in his generation if you can't walk alone with god then um you really ought not to be walking with others right so it's it's integral to what it means to be a man i think often of um i think something that mother teresa's biological mother told her when she left to join the sisters of loretto something to the effect of like put your hand in his and follow him alone and i think that um yeah and with to end with that you know kind of as a reflection on just the discipline of masculinity it means you know to put your hand in his who lived masculinity in perfect fashion right who who filled masculinity with the grace of the most high god you know who bore up our masculinity as it were you know into uh into the heights of heaven so yeah it's that's a really beautiful meditation so thanks thanks so much yeah thanks thanks for everything that's awesome these are things that i will continue to think about meditate on i can't speak father jacob bertrand he's probably got a few episodes of the the latest netflix show to watch so i'm just watching it on my computer right now while you guys were talking um uh gomer please tell people how they can uh kind of find more things that you're involved with on the internet and elsewhere uh that's a hard one um lay evangelist.com i never update it it's a website seen by dozens uh i do a weekly podcast show called catching foxes you can find that at catching foxes.fm and any service you know spotify itunes all that stuff uh every niche shaobao is for those who want to learn it's a weekly show on how to evangelize so um if you want to do that as a roman catholic we can hook you up and uh other than that i am not on social media so don't bother don't bother burned all my accounts there it is okay burn your accounts but don't burn your bridges um yeah so from our end let's see anything else father jacob burton's like that's not a good tag line you can't end an episode with that all right so i won't um please do let's see like and share the podcast share with folks whom you think would benefit from it uh you could subtly send it to men whom you think need to grow up or whom you think are grown up you know and you could tell them that either option may apply so that way they don't know what you're doing uh please do like and share the podcast with your friends um and let's see check things out on youtube and then patreon as a way by which to support especially during the season of lent season of omsgiving um so that we can pay someone to edit uh our things and make the video quality better than it once was uh father jacob bertrand what am i forgetting check out our new merchandise that's i think the last thing uh right that's it you can get it from our from our website you can get some pretty cool stickers hopefully they've been fixed with thomas aquinas's face and one of them just kind of looked like he looked like two-faced because they cut out part of his face so we're working on that but uh check it out it's pretty cool oh that's awesome he actually looks like you hit that subscribe button and give us a like and make sure you hit that bell to be updated yeah youtube you can be a cool youtuber guys he knows what's up yeah you got to oh absolutely um for our next youtube channel nevermind i just stopped i'm gonna reign it in all right so thanks so much for listening to this episode of god's plan thanks so much gomer for joining us and we will catch you next time cheers thanks for listening to god's planning a work of the dominican friars of the province of saint joseph follow us on facebook twitter and instagram leave a review on your podcast app and visit us at godsplaining.org you

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Rating: 5 out of 5

Keywords: catholic, dominican friars, theology, philosophy, religion, faith, order of preachers, godsplaining, seekers, Truth, preaching, questions, searching, prayer, meditation, #catchingfoxes, #gormley, #guestsplaining, #frgregorypine, #gregorypine, #michaelgormley, #vocations, #catholicpriest, #masculinity, #catholicformation

Id: _FgKBZ5svqg

Length: 37min 28sec (2248 seconds)

Published: Mon Mar 01 2021