FASD, ADHD or both with Dr. Gabor Maté

what we're looking at is not just FASD onhd we're actually looking at a general problem in north america a problem ain't like it's too warm over there a problem in parenting child rearing in education very much and certainly a problem in medical practice because what we see these days we have a lot of kids where are you diagnosed left right and center with our coding disorder and a lot of parents are getting wrong or perturbed about how to handle the children's behavior the north american response is one of two possible not really possible one of two main approaches the first is behavior and a behavioral approach we take the behavior and we don't like it so we try to change it how you change the behavior while you punish the kid for it the idea is punch them enough they won't behave that way anymore or we reward them with a good behavior the idea being if you reward them for the behavior then they're more likely to engage in that Oh notice that in either of these cases are we concerned with what's causing the behavior we're just looking at the behavior we'd like you that we don't like it so we say more of this less of that here's the punishment here's the reward that's the behavior approach which gets us to our Toronto in June of last year where a nine year old kid was handcuffed in school and what happened was that this kid had Asperger's and he had as a part of Asperger's as the part of all of these childhood problems because poor impulse control and lack of ability to read social cues so this kid it isn't ability read hi there didn't mean to school you so so this kid because this different is about Asperger's he's bully that's what happens to these kids they get bullied and ADHD kids hit volume more often asterisk is good oh you boy you know a lot of subject so he got really upset in the classroom and he started yelling or screaming us the teachers thought that the best way to do it is would either lock him in a room by himself which they did at which point he totally lost had proceeded to break up the furniture at which point the call the cops and the the cadets of in hangers and I know in a school in this can in its country the debate afterwards was in the police do the right thing and intervene charlie which is of course a completely pointless debate and a wrong question the right question is because once you call the police take another one police do which is to restrain me that's what they learn how to do the right question is what was the school so devoid of understanding of what his child behavior was all about they could only respond by trying to suppress the behavior whether as the school wasn't asking themselves they had no understanding of what actually is going on in the brain of this child poor impulse control or what's upsetting him and what a big deal with it and I've said child it's all about behavior so that's one approach so you know and it shows up very early in the parenting literature if three-year-old doesn't behave or three or what do you do you banish timeout it's a pure behavior T you don't care what the kid is experiencing feeling you just want to control the behavior I'll come back to PI months later on but the essential the essence of it is separation you've got a lot of kids separation as a way of controlling me now the other approach when the behavioral techniques failed is to medicalize chop conditions so we have this whole panoply of childhood diagnosis force FASD ADHD Asperger's Tourette's conduct disorders oppositional defiant disorder Akana was it pervasive development disorder and so on and being that we see them as medical problems we also have a medical response to them which is too many idiots so thank you so right now in North America we have a situation where there are three millions appears receiving stimulant medications in the United States tens of thousands in Canada as I mentioned last night the number of prescriptions for us stimulant medications have gone up 43% in this country last five years five times in the previous 15 years one in 10 of American children is not said to meet the diagnostic criteria for attention deficit hyperactive disorder and we have half a million kids in the United States many tens of thousands of Canada including hundreds or thousands perhaps in this province or receiving heavy-duty antipsychotic medications such as you give to adults kids of finance these kids are not getting it because they're psychotic they're getting it this means of behavior control the side effects can be horrendous weight gain risk of diabetes heart disease acne kind of stuff personality changes to the point where BC Children's Hospital has had to establish a clinic to deal with the side effects of the medication the reality is that these antipsychotics have never been studied in children we haven't got a clue what the long-term consequences will be on their brain development if they're given antipsychotics I'm not done with the staleness for ADHD I'm talking about the and psychotics for behaviors we don't have a clue what the long-term consequences will be what we do know about the ADHD medications is that they don't seem to have negative question hunter but they also don't leave good alejandro they help in short-term in behavior control and in focus suppressing hyperactivity but they don't let me put a child in the long term but if it's a medical problem we deal with it by means of the medical solution the assumption of course is that we don't know what causes these behaviors or is it's a medical problem it's probably genetic and most clinicians that be with agency it is they are still assuming that it's a genetic condition that you inherit so for example I've been diagnosed with ADHD in which I have a couple of my kids there's the proof it's gotta be genetic pastor Don genetic now of course both of these approaches look only at surface manifestations the behaviors are not diseases they're manifestations of an underlying problem when you diagnose the kidman ADHD or Asperger's and threats you haven't explained anything you just describe something you described a set of behaviors or personality patterns that can you can fit into a category but it's not an explanation them said a thing as to why he's got the condition you just described it now that may be helpful so they do have a general approach to the child you know you can describe a child understand the pattern of his behaviors as you know belonging together into a spectrum or through some kind of a syndrome but you have not explained and therefore to try and change behaviors or to simply hand up medications is to fill with offense but not to in any way have an impact on causes so my intention here is to give you a perspective that encouraged us and even allows us to be over the causes not just the original cause of the child's condition but the causes right now is over present situation and as I those are the trending speak this morning or last night that perspective is called the biopsychosocial perspective which says that the biology of the child's brain and body is reflective of and is shaped by the emotional and psychological environment so I'm not saying that there isn't the Bosco problem here sure there is if you do a study for example that in Alberta they looked at the electroencephalogram EEG which is a printout of the electrical activity of the child's brain of adolescent males with ADHD and they found that at rest in a normal state you compare the neji's to kids without ADHD there's no difference but then when you give these kids a math problem in the non ADHD group the frontal lobe of the brain in the front part here shows increased fast wave activity in other words the brain starting do more work to solve the math problem in the brain of the ADHD child you have diminished activity so instead of speeding up or being at you slow down that's a biological attack for the question is what's causing it jessica is biological doesn't make genetic sonar an issue isn't logical or not issue is what creates and influences the biology and what I'm saying to you is that what creates influence of the biology is actually the environment now an equal that my own personal history bit so I was diagnosed with ADHD when I was 52 years old and I was the medical coordinator the palliative carried in the background that was a busy and accomplished family physician and I was writing his weekly medical column with a boat man and the social worker on the head Patsy Joe Spicer said I'm coffee with you sir okay so he had coffee and three minutes of the conversation a God why was it me that she went to have coffee it was because she recognized me as part of her tribe in other words everything she said about herself I recognizing myself so recently what that for my book on ADHD is catalysed to dip my toe in was to know that unawares I had been immersed in it all my life up to my neck this realization may be called the stage of a to the Epiphany the Annunciation characterized by inside elation enthusiasm and hope it seemed to me that I have found the passage to those dark recesses of my mind from which chaos tissues without issues without warning burning thoughts plans emotions and intentions in all directions I felt that discovered what it was that it always kept me from attaining psychological integrity wholeness reconciliation and joining together of the dis harmonious fragments of my mind he seemed to explain any of my behavior patterns thought processes childish emotional reactions my workaholism and other addictive tendencies the sudden eruptions of bad temper and complete irrationality you wanted who you the conflicts in my marriage and my jekyll-and-hyde ways of relating to my children so when I might play heroes but in this impulse control now one of the traits that ADHD is about three major trades by the way which are also salient traits of a PhD is your motives for impulse control B 1 + + control means just what it sounds like impulses are not thoughts that be consciously necessarily in an aware are released sometimes not too late impulses are urges to behave to do something that arise from the lower brain centers for example why my dear is let's say you're seeing their Martin with 3 good-looking cookies and I might have the impulse to grab and then shove in my mouth that's fine nothing wrong with that impulse but something up here in the gray matter of my brain the cortex is meant to say ah not yours is your lecture right now you're supposed to be speaking about eating cookies and if you do that you might never get invited back to Smithers that's basically imposed regulation though those are not conscious sighs there's just asserted with all that information as his arm nine kids with ADHD FST Tourette's Asperger's autism conduct disorder etc etc his poor impulse control and by the way and what adults they also have poor impulse control salient Lee I mean many adverts you do but but what that is what our what adults position specifically for addicts of course you know so that they'll do the thing that they know it's not good for them because there's no impose regulation if you do brain scans on drug addicts the comments finding is at the part of the brain a balance and to regulate impulses use doesn't function which is why these childhood conditions of poor self-regulation and impulse control are such risk factors for addiction later on ADHD is a significant risk factor for addiction in an adult for that reason and for other reasons as well so that VSD of course now poor impulse control that's one of the traits of ADHD so let me try override it and I have to preface this by telling you that as a physician I was never want to be too coid with the prescription I was always much - today you know thinking or talking a problem through and dealing with it a lot of quickly reaching for the pharmacological response except when I came to myself with an impatience and lack of judgment characters - the baby I had already began to self-medicate even before the formal diagnosis a sense of urgency dignified attention that is a disorder a desperation to have immediately whatever it is that when we desire at the moment be an object an activity or a relationship and there was something else here too well expressed by a woman some months later came for help would be nice to get a break for myself at least for a little while she said and sentiment I fully understood one longs to escape the fatiguing ever spinning ever churning mine I did will in and a higher than recommended initial dose unafraid from the great day I first heard about attention disorder the doctor you can do this you go I went not to my friend bad but got it to get bad think I've got anything use of riddling on sir how much do you want professional secret within minutes I thought you four can present experience myself as flawed insight and love my wife thought I was acting weird you look storm or sir immediate constant now within a few days so I'm demonstrating here to lack of impulse control within a few days I mean of straight forwards I became very depressed on a river that's one of the side effects not for everybody but for me that's what one side of it so I got off that when she psychiatrist was diagnosed and I was given another stimulant which helped me in some reason and in other ways it creates some problems now the other two traits of a DD are besides poor impulse control or hyperactivity so that's we got the agent and hyperactivity you know so that that's why I like to have a lapel mic and walk around rather than stationary and so dueling and fidgeting and restlessness you know difficulty sitting still that's all trade of ADHD and then the third characteristic is poor attention skills difficulty focusing staying on task when you're not interested in something so give it a THD consider for both five hours eight hours in front of a video game doesn't mean they got no ADHD just means that they're tuned up and the TV set so if you're not interested you can't pay attention so easily absent-minded you're talking to somebody you notice that they're just somewhere else in a lecture you might might wander a lot this is the piece of music my my mind my not you'll stay and you say you start to do something your attention wanders you don't complete the first activity you go on to the next this or these kids are likely they start a normal appearance there than the other attention off somewhere else so these are the traits but the question is and I'm already seen the nods of self recognition in the room now the question is what does this all about well what I didn't buy into right from the beginning even though I didn't really know the answer as to what this is all about one thing I didn't buy into right from the beginning is that this is some kind of genetic Authority and the reason I didn't buy into the genetics order hypothesis despite the fact that I had it and I so recognize that through my kids did is something that was just written out if I can find it there it is in this month's edition of Pediatrics which is the Official Journal of American PDF mystic and Academy and they it's all about it's called an integrated sided framer for child survival during struggle development it everything I've been saying last twelve years is ruins or not that I had made it a lot I'm just saying that I've been saying these things because as I see it but the research has been there but not it's not even controversial or not controversial but that doesn't mean that most doctors nobody they don't the perspective I'm giving you now is completely formed the medical fashion mostly so we ever go to Children's Hospital and then keyword you'll never guess and that's a lot of questions to why not but here's what the article says growing scientific evidence demonstrates that the social and physical environments that threaten human development can lead to this listen can lead to short and physiologic and psychological adjustments that are necessary for immediate survival and adaptation but which may come in a significant cost long-term outcomes in learning behavior health and longevity they're saying our friend very adaptive survival techniques or survival modalities that help the child navigate difficulties at a certain point if they become embedded in a child ingredient child they lead to difficulties later that's what twenty novels now let me give you an example it's the 20 odd is nothing genetic knowledge genetic disease it's just a survival thing let's say that let's say that you were sitting here with a bad bellyache and all kinds of anxiety about your mortgage okay those are two stressful things but let's say you've got a text message saying that some of you love and care about is an emergency or that's a very injury what would happen to you concern about organs or your belly you totally tuned them up in order to adapt to the city to live to the needs of the situation is that a good thing or a bad thing it's a good thing in the short term but what happens if you do not in the long term but it won't be attention to what matters you know and you get and you get disconnected for your body so a good thing or a bad thing so the question is how does a temporary state that is serves a survival function becomes a long-term trait okay so tuning out is actually just a stop defense under certain situations question is why you get programmed into the brain under what conditions well again I'm not saying that things not biological obviously the kid is hyperactive and can't focus or an adult for that matter and they take a bit length outlet or efficiency or insert our adderall or whatever they take and now they can focus and you calm down that means that something Balaji has happened in the brain remember Balaji effect the real question is what creates the biology again the conventional explanation is simply passed on genetically but you see that's a problem it's an intellectual problems because if its genetic if all these conditions are significant genetic and why they increase it geez don't change in a population over ten years fifty five hundred years a thousand so for something is genetic you get a much longer time for it to show up when things are increasing to such a degree we know we're not talking about heritable problems we've got to be talking about something in the environment so that of that alone should tell us oh what I didn't know but I truly didn't know because nobody medical school has talked about those things when I went to school 32 years ago or 35 years ago and nobody talks about them now is that the human brain develops actually an interaction with the environment that's not controversial that is state-of-the-art brain science the human brain actually develops an interaction in the environment so which circuits develop wish to nod has to do with the input from the environment so for example you have a child with perfectly good eyes and good genes at Birth you put them in the dark room for five years so he never sees light they'd be blind thereafter for the rest of his life because for the development of the 30 or so servants that make up the visual apparatus you need the input of light waves if there's no light there even a few circuits that are present birth will atrophy and die and new ones will not develop a night job is blind this is a critical period for the development of the visual circuits which required input like now it's not any different for the service of impulse regulation emotional self-regulation emotional segregation simply means that it's like the thermostat in this room it is too cold the to warn the air conditioner come on to keep it even temperatures human beings the only function with a certain range of comfortable temperature for any creature Khan Academy but emotionally is the same thing we can't function at the extremes of upset and rage or elation and somebody is at those extremes we call them bipolar you can't function at those extremes correlation or depression so there has to be some internal thermostat that brings us back to emotional balance and that's the function of certain circuits in the brain but also and those these kids lack it so one of the other things that these kids lack at 50 kids ADHD kids while these other kids they lack the capacity to regulate themselves emotional a lot of us as adults it was well now the regulation of Hawaii so that none I practice as though that's a developmental thing because their algorithm you know the ability that they attention in infants have no capacity to focus it has to develop emphasize our so they're capacitor focuses the developmental task development achievement now as I said just as the stimulation of light waves is required for the development of the visual circuits in the same way and the stimulation from their alignment is required for the development of all these other circuits that are impaired in all these conditions that recover my PhD to ADHD through everything else that I've mentioned and that's because most of human brain development occurs after birth so he compares to a horse the horse can run on the first day of life human beings can muster that much coordination balance visual acuity until a year and a half two years that means that the worse the moment of birth is 18 to 24 months ahead of us in terms of brain development know why is that by the way but why are we so behind the horse it has to do with evolutionary logic because of course what gave impetus to the development of the brain was the use of the four paws of hands and the digits as fingers so as you start to do this and hold objects and use tools our being is larger and larger to plan and control all that stuff so our brains are getting larger in the front part behind here at the same time make full use of the our capacity use the hand we begin walk on two legs and welcome to legs the palace has to get narrower because you can't walk on two legs of the palace of ours so we get a narrower pelvis a larger head what's the punch line the punch line is if you given birth is in fact you got to get been born at nine months because you waited till eleven months you wouldn't be was the head me to be already at nine months the human head is the life spurt of the body and it's the one most likely get stuck in the birth canal barely makes it up you know it was much larger we wouldn't be born so we have to be born prematurely that means urban development has took her on the outside women no longer necessarily have their relative safety of the room I say relative safety because already what happens in uterus to pregnant women as an impact on the developing child so that stress of mothers during pregnancy will lead to a behavioral problems in the child at age three or four has been shown in recent studies women who are abused in pregnancy in a British study they have higher levels of the stress hormone cortisol in their placenta at birth and their children what I do the HDH Center there's the stress on the pregnant woman already and there's a cordial lots of studies it's always use science of artists on and societies and publications are dedicated to nothing but study the impact of pregnancy and stress and pregnancy on the developing j and i'm talking about still in the relative safety of the uterus what happens on the outside what happens on the outside is is that the brain is shaped by the interactions with the pen caregivers and I read your quote for though the Daniel Seagle is one of the leading researchers in this field psychiatrist at UCLA he says for infant and young child attachment relationships for the major alignment the factors that shape the development of the brain during its period of maximal rope attachment establishes an interpersonal relationship that helps the immature brain use the mature functions of the parents brain to organizes one process so the child to develop soft regulation they have to connect with the parent who's also self-regulate but what happens when a parent is depressed or stressed or alcoholic or otherwise not functioning in a sub regulated fashion the child's brain doesn't get the input source of regulation because the necessary condition for the development of his key brain circuits just as or vision unity presence of light waves for these crucial circuits you need the presence of non-stressed non-depressed emotionally available consistently available up to the parenting caregivers non-stress non-depressed emotionally available consistently available for - and training caregivers absent that the child's brain circuits don't develop the way they should at the University of Washington Seattle they've done EEG electroencephalography on the infant's of mothers with postpartum depression now EGS already logical printout of the activity of the brain as I just told you and they compare the ages of the six-month-old and the mothers were depressed with infants whose mothers were not depressed you know what you could tell from the EZ of the child whose mother was depressing what universe the logic electrical activity of the child's brain reflected the moods of the pan if either the moons of the parent know about to pause here for a moment and ask are we blaming mothers or we're not does anyone get depressed on purpose cause any woman choose to do crafts to screw up a child no depression is what happens to people under certain conditions my wife had a post on the fashion with our daughter who's not 23 and she's like 8hd the post of depression and the mother is a major risk factor for ADHD in a child if you do if a mom is depressed to the child's first year by that child were abnormal stress hormone levels in the third year of life in other words the mother depression first year affects the brain functioning much later on when my wife had a post one depression is very simple because she was married to an ADHD workaholic physician for self-regulation very stressed and no emotional support I was too busy out there being that important doctor in the world to be present for my own battle so she gets depressed and then our daughter doesn't get the right foot that she needs and now she's got ADHD so I passed it on all right but I didn't pass it on genetical I passed around because the conditions in our home were such that healthy development could not take place and when we give riddlin to kids or adults we're elevating the level of a chemical in the brain called dopamine dopamine is the essential chemical for incentive and motivation you don't have it you have no motivation you can measure the pain dopamine levels of different monkeys and they're normal and then you separate it from others and within four or five days there's opium levels are diminished so the presence of the mother is required to maintain the chemistry of the child's brain now the mother or the mother figure whether it's a grandfather or we're staying here the job can be absent in two ways you can be absent physically or you can be absent emotional and the psychologist Allan schore calls that proximal separation proximal separation is when a prison this parent is physically there but emotionally absent so I could give myself it's an example of that I was quite capable or being my children a story and had my mind somewhere else at the same time I'll be reading the story if they ask me a question I couldn't answer it because I mind wasn't on a story what he supposed the child makes of that how did the child interpret them but then they don't want to be there I'm not available to them they are not worth quiet it's the only way the drugging intuitive that's what's called proximal separation and proximal separation given the stresses on past these days it's a major problem parenting and because the recent study showed when parents are stressed they can't be attuned connected with their kids emotion and the chair the child experienced the disaster it's very confusing for the kids by the way we trying to ask them my friends are always there but nobody remembers their parents emotional absence which you remember you can't remember what didn't happen two things again is the beige psychiatrist DW Winnicott said there's two things that go wrong in childhood two things that keyboard is one if things happen that shouldn't happen and that's the abuse and neglect sexual exploitation or whatever that's what shouldn't that's what happened that shouldn't happen or the other thing that can go wrong is when things don't happen that should happen it's easy to study the factors that should have happened for there so you can ask people was their addiction and family before your grandchild your father beat your mother or were you abused those are yeah those ignition of evidence it's harder to study or just important when things didn't happen not sure and I've talked to so many people oh yeah I know my parents were loving wonderful people and they were but they asked the question when you're upset as a child where did you talk nobody well that's what should have happened is there is officially somebody there to me to really see the child in the right night shots the stress that's often lacking because the parents don't love each other over their best because they're distracted to stress or they're dealing with their went on or not dealing with I tell where I talk about a 200 now to meant is important okay so let me go back to bathe about if I get back so brain development so much of that happens in the first few years of life you know 80 or 90 percent of the development the brain happens after birth by the third year of life the end of that the human brain is 80% adults eyes 90% outside the human body is only 17 or 18 percent at all times there's a rapid period of development for a period of rapid development so that times in the first year of life from literally every second so consider this space of time in that space of time in a billion connections or in degree so it's a highly sensitive period and the environment decides or influences which service will survive and research get pruned up her babies get many more service than any many more connections that he needs to go jungle if you looked at in eg of an infant and you didn't old resentful and if I was an adult you would be looking at a dying person in the brain gets a totally disorganized that's what the baby's brain is like except during the influence of the environment all that disorganization turns into organization and the circuits that are not needed get pruned out that's called synaptic pruning and the ones that need to be there get wired in and strengthened and reconnected and developed the system circuits and so on for all that demands and depends upon the right environment now think about Tony up so let me answer this question if I were to stress one of you right now be inappropriate physically or emotionally intrusive or aggressive will be your options why officers would be any one of three healthy options you can simply stand up and say don't do that you can just stand up and fight back and assert yourself right we got yes just walk out to the door say this I didn't come here to be abused like with this workshop just walked out your third option would be you couldn't do the first two is that given that it's 50 or so people here in the room with you you could ask for help for what now if you could escape fight back or ask for help then how would you paint handle it four one-ways your brain with a little bit tune it up so that to protect yourself from the pain of it so the tuning or the gain is a survival technique but what happens if you're in infant and your parents are stressed which means that your spirit because you're picking up on your parents tresses so that your friends are stressed and you're stressed can you fight back escape ask for help you can what you do you - now you tune up when your brain is developing you tune up and every second billion connections are being made and then the wiring is wired into your brain it becomes the default setting of your brain seven years later you're diagnosed with ADHD genetic disease Hecate furthermore your dopamine circuits those motivational circus didn't develop either so now I need a dopamine medication like Ritalin or destiny copy focus and to get things done simply because the early environment was so strong now when it comes to FASD in HD first of all you can notice that all the behavioral traits of EHD are also true of the behavioral traits of FAS for impulse control lack of emotional separation hyperactivity low the luminosity now alcohol of course that is an expansion of Western last night was a toxin it affects the brain as you've been hearing all the answer and when it's present in large quantities it will have drastic effects on the physiology of the child hard havenõt these facial abnormalities brain abnormalities that you can see on brain scans and so on but a lot of kids affected by the spectrum you don't see the states at all you just see the behaviors and the emotional dysfunction I think it's a mistake to assume that it's all because of the alcohol because everything I've said about the parents of the child and ADHD is also too for the parents of the child that I faced it anyone with any woman who drinks is by definition a stressed woman that's why she drains the alcohol is an attempt is her attempt to soothe your emotional pain that usually goes back their own trauma as a child which is been carrying on her life because she was come and that's not my opinion large-scale studies again show the more adversity there is in childhood Edwards physical sexual emotional abuse and all these other factors like parental absence or violence in the family and so on the greater risk of Ecology the way of the risk of obesity the greater risk of addiction and so on and so forth so the akamalik simply somebody who was traumatizing a child and using alcohol to soothe their emotional pain and to get their mind into a more acceptable state likely of course if they had those experiences in childhood they have not created for themselves a stress-free environment as adults either more than likely having a relationship with a male alcoholic for us or in an abusive relationship and in many ways leaving out leading a life that's low stress now is it just the alcohol that's affecting that infant in the years heck no it's also all the stress on a woman for the same reasons I've already explained and that child is not born into a happy environment that the parents are drinkers that child is born to high stress and unstable environment so all those years of brain development are occurring under conditions of high stress having that impact on child brain circuits so what I'm saying is the privilege phase in ADHD is very simple both come from the same source stress in the parenting environment in with the addition that India fetal alcohol syndrome situation you also the edge effect about the less or greater degrees but the significant difference is between perspectives is that if we recognize that a lot of it has dual strengths and its biological effects then we also know that the brain can undergo new development even life that it was that is what it's called neuroplasticity neuroplasticity the capacity of the brain to the robhughes circuits later on in life given the right conditions so I mentioned last night the studies but in Berkeley with rats but it took rats with different ages young adult newborns and they even took some old ones they even took some rats at birth and deliberately brain-damaged them and then expose these animals to different levels of her mom and stimulation and two months later at any age at any stage and even the delivered in brain-damaged rats if they're exposed to more nourishing environment stimulation social stimulation they were better able to find your way out of a maze they're smarter and when you autopsy been in the front part of the brain they're larger nerve cells with more connections and richer blood supply in other words the environment stimulation led to positive changes in a very physiology and structure of the brain this is through the old rats this is true a bit literally brain-damaged rats which is to say that the key working with these kids is the environment and what is the key my mental factor it's what was missing in the first place unconditional non-stress or to an interaction with caregiving Adams let me tell you about it to me because the two-month is what was missing for these kids and it was missing to get the transfer to distract with our strength our treatment is being on the same wavelength being in tune with emotion so on to Monday's brain when you're in a certain emotional space and suddenly is attuned to you will get it and share it and reflect that back to you so this is something that the baby needs we do instinctively there's no big deal so it's not a big technique it's simply something you do respectively as your knees as long as we're present so the baby who's upset the three month old was crying we will attune we will not do what we'll do with each other or with an older child you will not say something stupid like get over it it can't be that bad we will not say a three month so we'll think of the starting millions in the third world what are you whining about your diaper is wet so what do that we're going to pick them up and we're gonna go and what our facial and tone facial expression and tone of voice and body language is conveying is hey kid you're sad I get that you're sad and I'm sad that yourself then a kid can hey that's how the functions of the adult brain regulates the brain of the charm so these kids need a lot of attune now imagine what it's like for you you're sitting there upset somebody slaps your shoulders is cherubic can together I'm even as adults we get in few years what kids need attunement much more because they're much more dependent on their relationship and particularly these kids do because they've never had it so there was a study done with mothers and children small children put into separate rooms but broadcast to one another by means of closed-circuit television to the mother which she would see the child on the screen and a child and see the mother in this room and the child would wave and would way back tribe would wrinkle up her nose make a funny face of the mother with coffee her and everybody is very happy until this turn up a live feed and they're being played for the child a video of the mother that was just made she's still smiling loving gestures friendly intimate expressions we played one funny for the Chagas upset very quickly and why do you suppose the mother is no longer responsive it doesn't matter that the mother is loving and friendly what matters is that the child is not responding to the parent mother's not responding the child so these can either lie between the emotional go back to that situation in Toronto the human brain of the human nervous system is three responses to challenge one of them is who won that is the primitive reptilian response which is invaded in the lower part of the brain which is to freeze that's what the immobilization it is involves physical stillness so that you won't be noticed and dissociation so therein lies I'm caught by a lot of spent caught by a the cat will actually dissociate and sharing over the doors within friendly relations so my mom's been caught by a cat largely associated and then it's not so bad to be that's called immobilization that's the primitive reptilian response but it's in our brains the second level of response is globalization we a lot of adrenaline and the heart rate goes up in a fight or state that's a sympathetic nervous system and million flight or fight response those are defensive states there's no learning that happens in those states all these kids because they're traumatized early or they were just stressed early from years onwards are in constant defensive mode they're constantly in defensive mode near during a mobilization mode or they're in hyper most efficient when they can't learn so they don't learn for anything that happens take you through the same thing over and over and over again they can op it because there's no learning in those defensive states learning only happens in the state called social engagement social engagement involves different nerves different facial muscles different neck muscles as you look at somebody you look them in the eye and you listen to their voice they interact in that social engagement mode learning can take place but these kids have to get big out to that stain so for that they need a lot of safety here in the temporal lobe on each side of the brain we have sensors just like the thermostat basically these sensors mean the safety of the situation we're constantly assessing safety we're all doing this all the timers as in safely we're not safe we respond in different ways the problem of course is that when the early environment was difficult stressful or traumatic our proper ability to assess safety may not develop well so sometimes we'll press up in the situation are not safe and think that they are that's why women traumatized often going to very unsafe relationships and sometimes we don't see safety when it's there so we're not able to relax even when we're safe so a lot of extra input has to happen to make these kids feel safe and that's why they're tooling is on board without that women their brain never relaxes it's always a defensive mode when it's in defensive mode it can't learn so though adaptation happens no development happens and that's why the essential condition for development is unconditional loving acceptance or toulon support and the presence of the adults not all the techniques that nothing wrong with the techniques but as the spiritual teacher Krishnamurti road and was code I used in the beginning of to my book since that action is meaning only in relationship and without understanding relationship action on any level all in brief concept the understanding of relationship is infinitely more important than a search for any plan of action the understanding relationship is infinitely more important than the search link plan of action so let me give you an example these kids are often the opposition of they resist right even diagnosed as oppositional defiant disorder here's the thing our opposition allottee you might bring end up for many things so what are you doing when I push end and the harder I push yeah harder I push the harder you mister that's a natural human resistance to abortion there's a natural human resistance to portion physical or emotional my friend more than you thought cause that Conor will okay nothing wrong with it now when we say that a kid is oppositional were you saying something what then but in this interaction between the knees and I she was delorean I was there too I was pushing on her that's why she pushed bad why would I diagnose her being oppositional instead of looking at their relationship members oppositional is not a trade of the child it's a function of the relationship now what mitigates our positionality is relationship right if you and I were in a different relationship you might want me a lot you know there's some people that do anything you have in your life you know and many others that you don't so what mitigates opposition Ally is relationship if I had mistake your opposition allottee for some in a tweet trait of yours and I try to change it behaviorally by pushing harder on you he's you're going to push harder back if I want you to not be a bloom oppositional I have to build a relationship that's the key with these kids let me just try and focus on the behaviors we do harm that's what Krishnamurti says without understanding relationship any plan of action will only be accomplished I think of the timeout situation the separation when you say to a three-year-old forget timeout what it is saying we're saying to the child you know kid I know what your biggest need is your biggest need is the attachment relationship you can feel safe and nurturing with me and hence I also happen to know what your biggest fear is which is the loss of that relationship and you know what I'm going to use that against you every time I don't like what you do or we increase the chart sense of safety or we be sick decreasing we're getting the behavior that we want because it is only alcalde good the 300 can't stand the separation from a parent as they're already detached so the issue in ADHD FASD any of these related a childhood condition is not short term behavior voles but long term developmental goals if we understand that we're not talking about a disease here where we're talking about a problem development and the question would be asking at every turn is not what would promote good behavior in a second or what will promote healthy development in the long term the things that we do to get the healthy because of the desired behavior in a short term very often completely undermined the long term a developmental goal and unfortunately medical schools don't teach this the faculties of Education I'm sure don't teach you they sure didn't when I went to educational school and I was a teacher for you and I don't think they do now and they don't teach you two schools of psychology either which means it will constantly miss feeding kids we're not seeing what matters we're not looking at the emotional experience and you stop your following first off document steadily what that is a situation your birthday okay let's type in a question on it any comments or questions right so yeah he bins for the numerous times we have a medical community education from here no matter some pieces of parenting and I guess our political system associative these things are being poorer now they have talked about research can replace it is established in these cases and this something says by this by this been well I think about that that part of you make that yeah well the good news is that this information is getting out more more now at least now we have this article and an injured in this moisture Pediatrics Journal now let me tell you it's not get ignored by a lot of people I was speaking in Calgary if you re in Children's Hospital I think probably two weeks ago today and this article just come on let's talk to doctors they're now saying all that stuff and say look here it is right here is you have strep that I was very pleased because you know it's right there in their journal you know this response I got I said pretty much right okay so blind it was fine we didn't know what to do with it part of the problem is that I could I could put the problem into the lap of the medical profession and that we just not training people to make sure of course the influence of the pharmaceutical companies a lot to do it but the research is mostly funded by pharmaceuticals this research was not but most research is there's no profits to be made in nurturing relationships lots of us to make some drugs so what is printed in the medical journals is stuff that's funded by people who are profit or that's an obvious fact the fact that a lot of people are going to medical school are people are very stressed and regardless and all that they have done with their own stuff that also commutes to it but it goes beyond that we live in a culture that separates the mind from the light and suggests a political question I'll give you a political answer the essence of this society is the profit motive for the sake of the profit motive we have to treat people like Maimonides so people are fundamentally rough producing or wrought consuming creatures but they don't have any other function and and the schools actually the way we have the night you know where they develop them developed in Prussia in the 19th century where they were industrializing and they needed a docile and obedient by intelligent and educated working force so they love these schools for kids sit the whole day and hands behind the back and they respected teachers Authority and all that well that wasn't designed and these are the child of mine who in their right mind would design a school system where kids ever sit in a desk the whole day if you talk about children's needs in other words that the system's needs are beaten was being surgery up and even now in the school system very often it's not the fault of individual teachers I know a dedicated teacher son I know what stuff they go through to teach the material to the kids but the problem is that the schools are even not designed for the kids that we have the design for some ideal students learn at the same rate at the same time at the same age in the same way no child was ever like that and instead of saying what the school system ought to be saying is that if due to the stresses and pressures and distractions of modern society for producing a lot of these kids with these problems it better fit the schools around the needs of these kids and if we did with a very very different situation and a bathroom and any school said but no we try to fit the kid in if the kid doesn't fit in let me label them medicate and we deal with their behavior so you know I could go on much longer about your question but I is a huge systemic bias I guess this kind of understanding well then one of the reasons I asked is because we're about to go through an educational change in our province and on the books right now which is which is individualized education pretends well nobody's been able to articulate the best money and I've got many many prosecutions and but one of the things that hasn't come out of that that I've heard of observed is it it's hard we deal with the issues that are arising and the labeling of kids the target of individualization so that they kids can reach their potential well the law but again it's based on the model of the ideal student and that were busy being able to make rational decisions about what they want or need of their education and I haven't seen anybody real that articulate how it's going to help the kids but I want exactly if itís not and it designed a game as you say that ideally and you know in the state's now but also Canada space them in one more pressure for computerized Rick is actually stay at home and learn the computer that's fine for the sublimated child aborted the buggies sorry pick it up for bid your hunger for the device yeah but what about the children are not self regulated you know that's going to be and up because people need that they need your voice and yet I need your facial expression they do president is your friend it bad on their back you need that smile on your face you feel that safety where they can open up and learn I'm not going to get that from you I mean we're going in just do we have we were running headlong in a wrong direction okay you know I then I should begin I mean I look it's not that I need more speaking engagements total keeping up but the stress myself up working too much but the there don't pay attention to my own teachings say knows what really I should be speaking to the schools when I do the response is always great I mean teachers have appreciated getting this stuff you know so it has full of the stars of each name it's interesting like in in Alberta's probably thousands of pictures you see baby hundreds I'm going to school on in Surrey it's Friday but on the whole Gordon and I should be in the schools much more because because the schools are such important constituencies ladies information would actually make a difference any other questions really what about what about the idea that you like I mean I understand working with people in schools and stuff I think that everybody should really have this information but I think that um I know that lots of people who work in the school system and stuff like that too a lot of it has to do with policy what's happening you know I know people who teach and have ideas and stuff like that men who find themselves in position for the catchy they want to be because they're being dictated from a whole different level it manipulates how they educate so I mean all the standardized tests yes yeah I understand you're saying look I think that the best thing I can say is it's a huge problem which you can't resolve actually but but I advise people to be subversives like it you know so for no other words you have to find ways as best you can to subvert the system nice to subvert I mean a negative way I mean to do what kids need regardlessly system as best you can you know as same as my law as a medical doctor or any physician who goes beyond the narrow confines of what was taught in medical school yet that kind of go you know stay clean and respectable and knowledgeable but do what you know as best you can and that can make a difference to the lives of all our kids okay any other questions yeah you're kind of reminds me of a lot of what you're speaking of in a lot of what everybody else is finding this kind of program if you increasing social capital for families yes and yet a lot of us are in different programs and you know these ministries will mandate parents to come to programs while their children are in school elders are at home or wherever and the generations are all just separated all day to Adobe and nobody's working out of their needs and interests they're like you said you're working based on societal demands and so schools are designed around that too to produce and so we'll be so much more in a favorable position of parents of jees children could work from their needs and interests rather than mine to five always producing Monday project and one of the things that I was thinking of was like wow you know like I'd be so much better off of my office within the outdoors only and if anybody wanted to access me that's where I'm at my kids are with me you might be people today yeah well I love the Virginia and like when I think about it like my my daughter's in school my sons and daycare I'm here my wife's somewhere else you know it's very very rare if we can all come together and be in the moment and be present not only that even then you'll be advised to play dates and stick over the accused to this activity in an activity and yeah but it's just how it is you know it's really the challenge and so though really the challenge if I deploy very bluntly is to maintain it maintain sanity in the face of an insane system and even the phrase social capital is very revealing why do we call it capitals it goes money and eating anybody three I'm not criticizing you I'm saying that even our physiology reflects the economic organization it's like all those expectations that you can file on each different generation diminishes how much time they spend with each other and if they didn't have it do all those different things the children's development and even the family's development it could be more community-based more or cultural also and we probably see a lot less of struggle absolutely so I thank you so I like leave your nun puzzle which is that at the same time as socially you might say things are getting more difficult more and more people are waking up to order more people are recognizing this information about child development and early brain development it's much more prevalently available not living with you for five years old and again it doesn't matter what trouble these kids are their potential is enormous they're given the right environment and the biggest impact that you can have as individuals with an individual child that's ended a relationship but you can provide and you can do that in space of five minutes so that difficult as it is and as challenging as it is their potential for development in our capacity to support that development is really much greater than sometimes imagined and so as the psychologist Marian diamond who did his rat experiments but these rats of different ages he said she said that based on her findings you never give up on any you hungry you just don't and I finished the course former psychiatrist dr. Stanley Greenspan who was was retired now but he was for a number of years the head of the infant development program at the US Institutes of national US National Institutes of Health and he was a US and still Odyssey so the child psychiatrist Stanley Greenspan has had a very special interest in the Dean of autism a form of neuro physiological and psychological dysfunction former disabling an attention deficit disorder dr. Greenspan mirrors that some children with Addison have been helped to become intelligent and emotionally with cold cognitive emotional and social skilled the normal or even superior range and how they did that is betrayal ation so he says if large numbers of children who showed such severe physical symptoms every diagnosis autistic or will be brought into interaction patterns that a lot of enormous growth what are lesser challenges so give them with the autistic kids not that that's fully understood yet but if you'll be done in autistic kids you can soon be done with these other kids as well and let me finally put in a plug for animals here because animals get past the autumn my stuff they were directed to the emotional centers of the brain so that if it should I can develop a relationship with an animal and so that there's actually particularly trained animals I don't you notice but the people who are called equine therapy it's called a river horses these kids are create candidates for that because human being is we're just almost just awaiting capable or being so present emotionally accepting as animals are so for these kids use whatever modalities are available play outdoors the land a lot they really need to be connected to the land animals and the gain above all your presence well thanks for the attention

Channel: SCSASmithers

Views: 198,494

Rating: 4.8988762 out of 5

Keywords: Gabor Maté, FASD, ADHD, neurobehavioural disorders

Id: vqRec-K4qY4

Length: 73min 29sec (4409 seconds)

Published: Wed Mar 06 2013