European leaders in China | How should India view Macron's visit? | The Hindu

[Music] thank you as European leaders make a beeline for Beijing to seek support for Ukraine amongst other things is French president Emmanuel macron simply out of line with the West with his words on Taiwan and what do all the latest developments mean for India hello and welcome to world view at the Hindu with me sahasini Heather if the backdrop looks unfamiliar that's because I'm coming to you from Paris this week as I've been in meetings with officials and experts talking about the latest developments particularly for Europe and China so let's just get you up to speed with what's happened so far to begin with you may have noticed a sudden uptick in visitors to Beijing over this week and the past few weeks after German Chancellor Schultz French president macron European commission president Ursula Van Der Lyon as well as then German foreign minister annalena berbach all visited China in this space for a few weeks now each of them had had a similar agenda one was to seek China's support president Xi Jinping support in particular for a resolution to the Ukraine conflict stressing that China must not support Russia militarily in fact in a joint statement issued a 51 Point join statement issued between she and macron they criticized the bombing of civilians and according to French accounts Xi Jinping actually distanced himself from Russia's War saying this is not my War now this is very important coming as it does ahead of a an expected spring offensive by the Ukrainian side against Russia which has been in control of as much as 17 to 20 percent of Ukrainian territory since it began that Invasion a year ago now the leaders also sought to share a Shore up trade ties with China which has opened up post covid and was very clearly a trade push an economic interest pushed to the visits May making the point that they don't want to decouple from China but only de-risk their supply chains and they also asked president Xi Jinping to be more proactive in helping debt-ridden countries in Africa and Sri Lanka amongst others to manage their debt and for more Chinese commitments on climate change so those were some of the other issues but where they really appeared to have deferred views and what caused the controversy was the words on Taiwan while Wonderland and bareback were very clear they warned that any Chinese action against Taiwan would be disastrous for the world macron appeared to be stepping out of line he said Europe should stay out of the fight between what he even called U.S agenda and Chinese overreaction and stressed on the need for strategic autonomy and independent foreign policy for France as well as for Europe uh listening to what he said I want La France the situation is constitutional now there's much more of those comments in an interview that he gave to French journalists who traveled with him uh to China and back and you can see that on the link given below now macron's words appeared to divide Europe in fact a divide NATO as well as he received criticism in the United States um as well as from some of the East European countries like Poland and Lithuania who counted his argument that France and Europe cannot be vassal states of the United States and said actually they want closer ties with the U.S and aren't seeking help or don't need help from China now one of the journalists who was on the plane was Pierre husky he's a columnist he's a veteran China expert as well as the president of reporters Without Borders uh also called rsf and while in Paris I spoke to him about what to make of macron's visit and his words on Taiwan that he had watched up close we've been looking at some of the statements of the French President what do you think according to you what really was the reason for his very strong statement uh on Taiwan in particular while he was in China where he said France is not a vassal state of the U.S almost suggesting uh that France would not perhaps uh look at Taiwan in the same way as the United States was what do you think was behind that well first of all you have to understand that Frost always had an independent view of the U.S you know in in 2003 for example Frost did not take part in the U.S invasion of Iraq and there is a kind of girlish tradition of maintaining Independence I think in this particular context president macron's visit to China was dictated by his view that the war in Ukraine the longer the war in Ukraine lasts the more Europe will become dependent on the US and and and this is bad for what he calls a strategic autonomy of Europe and therefore his trip to China was really designed to not to get China going against Russia because he knows this is impossible but at least get China on board to think about a way out of the Ukraine war and Russia still think that it can hold on what it controls and maybe expand a little bit so this is not the right time for negotiations but what the french were trying to do is is get China on board for the day when those negotiations are possible do you think because there is a cynicism that this is more about Europe wanting to shore up its trade with China postcovid do you think there was an element of just basically making sure that business ties are not hurt by the tensions of a Ukrainian obviously business with China is an important component of the relations with China for every single country in the world nowadays and and I think France doesn't make is not an exception and uh and probably less than for Chancellor Schultz because Germany is far more dependent on its economic presence in China than France is uh but uh I I think you know there is a balance to be found and and that's what uh Europe is trying to find between uh doing business as usual with with China and um thinking of the overall strategic balance of the world in which China is the rising superpower and the challenge to to the Western uh International order and I think that's really that balance which is very difficult to find Europe is not yet talking in in one voice on that issue when Mr macron says it and often in in one speech he mentions Independence and strategic autonomy several times is he speaking out of step with the rest of Europe uh or is this essentially uh his vision for Europe uh that is shared by others and at the moment yes he is out of step with the rest of Europe because the rest of Europe wants to keep the Americans on board and France is probably due to its own history and the fact that it has its own uh uh you know nuclear weapon that it has a seat on the U.N security Council it has a specific uh Speech now let's move forward 18 months if if Donald Trump is elected in the U.S or if Rondo santis another Republican gets elected words might sound a little bit prophetic because Europe will wake up again as during the first Mandate of Donald Trump um as wanting to protect itself from any potential damage coming from Washington remember that Donald Trump wanted to pull the U.S out of NATO and he was prevented from doing so by his Entourage by the the the defense establishment in the U.S and therefore uh you know what might sound like uh out of Step today might be tomorrow's mainstream thinking given Isha and on Ukraine at present uh where do you see India France types I think everybody in the west and not only in France was taken by surprise by the attitude of India but also other um uh non-aligned the the new non-aligned uh version uh of 2022 last year uh and therefore at the beginning I think there was a a bit of a of a shock I think today a lot of people understand why certain powers in in the global South as as we say um have taken that attitude and don't want to be automatically aligned on on the US or on anybody else for that matter and I think you know we we're ready to live with it and I think this is the the new reality of the world um and other cases in the world and particularly now that president Lula has taken over in Brazil and has gone to to China with a very different attitude from his predecessor I think we can see that this is a global Trend so I think France and India still have a lot of work to do together I think this is really the opinion of the French leadership that India is a key player in uh in in today's world and should not um we should not stop at at just this india-russia relationship in relation with Ukraine but see it in a more Global world where India is is really one of the defining powers of a multipolar world there was a very unique unique perspective of where the French president was coming from now as we had reported at the Hindu recently prime minister Lorenz Modi is expected to visit France this summer president macron will be in Delhi later in September for the G20 Summit uh so India is really expected to walk its tightrope much more this summer between its friendships with Russia Europe and the US so what should India make off macron statements of the divisions in Europe on the engagement with China that we're seeing play out now and remember this is still a work in progress because we still have to see just where Europe goes as a whole to begin with the China visits make it clear that Europe is willing to engage with China and India on the issue as long as Asian countries stay out of the Ukraine war now this is a huge shift from last year's position where they wanted Asian countries to join uh um in support of Ukraine they wanted them to join the consensus of the UN as well as to reduce their ties with Russia so that seems to be a big shift and it's worth watching here in India the second is the kind of pressure that possibly India is going to face uh as G20 chair to invite Ukrainian president zielinski to speak at the G20 Summit virtually if needed remember this was also a demand from Mr macron to Mr XI asking him to pick up the phone and call President zielinski thus far New Delhi has resisted this kind of pressure when Ukrainian Deputy foreign minister I mean came to Delhi last week and actually publicly called for an invitation for Ukraine to the G20 the mes spokesperson said India has already announced its guest special guest list of invitees to the G20 and it is a list that doesn't actually include Ukraine at present however macrons are words are there on his visit to China and indicate that there will be less pressure on China and India to reduce their ties with Russia as well during Russian Deputy Prime Minister manturo's visit to Delhi this week in fact India and Russia vowed to increase their trade that is already nearly tripled since last year and to seek new ways to pay in National currencies and obviously the oil intake that has grown exponentially more than 30 to 40 percent uh times is actually also likely to continue finally macron signals a less confrontational approach to China in the indo-pacific at least with these words that's what it sounds like so India should prepare one for a very close strategic partner to be not as tough on China as perhaps one had expected but also for a different kind of indo-pacific Engagement with France and even the EU then at present India has with countries like U.S Japan and Australia that have decided to be much more confrontational so what World Views take on the entire development regardless of the context and the concerns over China France's push for strategic autonomy is one that should strike a court in India for years this is a policy that has kept Indian interests and Independence at a premium and has also meant that in times of adversity like of course decades ago when the West sanctioned India over nuclear testing France actually maintained its strategic partnership with India so the Strategic autonomy is a policy that cannot just be bushed away let's get you some reading recommendations and I'm afraid I have very few this week particularly because we have very little time but one is certainly engaging the world Indian foreign policy since 1947 this is edited by Sumit Ganguly but it has a very interesting chapter in it by Jean-Luc Racine on the india-france relationship and you will find that interesting there's also macron's own if you want to get into the mind of macron if you like a macron's own words these are basically speeches put together and it's a presidential Memoir more than anything else but it gives you insight into where macron wants to go with his strategic autonomy plan for Europe and there is the last president of Europe uh Emmanuel macron's race to revive France and Save the World by William drozdiak of course the last president of Europe giving macron that kind of position that perhaps only Angela Merkel had in the past then there is another collection of essays India's foreign policy in the post-covet world I've spoken about this one before it's edited by former Ambassador Surendra Kumar it has a chapter in it by former ambassador to the EU manjiv Singh Puri on the India EU relationship which is well worth reading there's also former Ambassador bhaswati mukherjee's book India and the EU and Insider's view so we hope you do have some things to read on the issues today but we do thank you thank you for joining us here on world view we'd also like to make a special request that you subscribe to the Hindus YouTube channel so you can keep up with all that we do here from the team here thanks for watching foreign [Music] [Music]

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Length: 16min 48sec (1008 seconds)

Published: Fri Apr 21 2023