Understanding The Psychology of Food | Dr. Doug Lisle of Pleasure Trap Book

hello everyone and welcome back today we're here with a brilliant dr. Doug Lyall thank you so much for being here my pleasure please tell us a little bit about yourself your book the pleasure trap and your journey into studying the psychological side of health and addictions yes I actually was just a trained as a general clinical psychologist and then I became an academic for a while and after that I actually work in criminal justice so all this is in the background while my good friend dr. Alan Goldhamer is trying to actually get sick people well and so I then joined him in the late 90s he invited me up to join him at true north health center and he said listen you're the psychologist you're supposed to figure this out they the the guard the the the folks that really know things had figured this out starting with John McDougall and obviously building on the back of Pritikin and and others and then we had Esselstyn and Ornish and Campbell and and Barnard we got a bunch of great people and these folks knew what to do and we're obviously helping people have a lot of success and dr. Goldhamer was frustrated that he couldn't have more success than he was having he was running into the obstacles that people do when they run into this problem so he said look you're the psychologist she figured it out so we did the best we could and this is a very challenging problem and it was actually Alan who named it the pleasure trap he our our publisher said you guys have to have a name for this and our name was previously survival or beyond survival of the fittest they said oh that sounds like a scientific thing nobody'll ever want to read this so Alan one day said you know what it's a trap and my people are in a trap and we don't know how to get him out of it and it's the pleasure trap just came out of his mouth and you know it's stuck it's stuck I like it and that's what we're that's what we've been working on now for the last 20 years nice so so Alan said to you listen you're you're the psychologist you get into this how did you really dive into how did you meet the connection and when where did you start didn't anybody teach you or did you do this yourself did you you just figured it out yourself little bitty pieces yeah I was reading a book called The Selfish Gene which is a major work in evolutionary biology and in that book Richard Dawkins the author talks about energy conservation he just mentioned it briefly in a passage and it almost matter-of-factly and and I thought my god that's an unbelievably important concept and along with people had talked forever about pleasure-seeking and penguins and so we certainly knew that hyper palatable foods processed foods are supernormal stimuli they they have a drug like reaction on the system they're hyper stimulating the dopamine pathway this was known and then we knew that that's how drugs worked I don't know how long we've known this but at least since probably the 1980s the but putting this together with pleasure-seeking and pain avoidance the I was thinking what kind of pain are people avoiding but not avoiding physical pain by eating junk food but they're avoiding psychological pain of essentially not going along with other people so if we if we start doing things in a healthy way we wind up at odds with our friends and family co-workers acquaintances we wind up in a battle and it turns out that battle is very often just too much for people in this are well-prepared and so the pleasure trap is born of actually three parts what we call the motivational triad and there's yeah understanding the pleasure-seeking mechanism and how we get it right there the pain avoidance mechanism being social pain and how to maneuver around the social problems and then finally energy conservation which is the fact that we live in a world where it's extremely easy to eat a healthy food and very more problematic and takes more energy to do it right so those three things constitute a is sort of a three prong trap and that's what we wrote about and that's what we try to help people get out of what is the ego trap a number of years after we were fortunate enough John McDougall liked our book and he he actually said you know what you guys did a good enough job I'll write the foreword if you'd like ok we couldn't have asked for force we were extremely pleased and on that he did this the and then he came to us a year or two later and said you know what there's more to it than this you know he he had thought about it and he just sensed that there was some kind of a psychological obstacle that his people were running into and the more I thought about it I actually thought about a problem of perfectionism which is a major plague that inhuman motivation that's talked about a lot in cognitive therapy so there's a beautiful chapter in the classic work in cognitive therapy which is called feeling good by David Burns and a chapter is called dare to be average and so I I knew that in my clinical work for many things I had been encouraging people to don't set the bar so high let's just see if you can do okay let's let's start there and that winds up being a useful tool to try to essentially keep people in what I'm going to call an attack mode where they're willing to try the the ego trap is where we feel like we've got too many chips on the line where the expectations are too high and it's so easy to once you learn about healthy living it seems like a reasonable step that all you need to know is to learn about what the pleasure trap is and then you should start to just execute it and lose 50 pounds and then everything should be great and it turns out that's not the way it works the pleasure trap is actually far more difficult than we predict and so if we have perfection as our goal it turns out that very many people will fail and if they've conceptualized so in this way and so when they fail what happens is they'll kick over the table and just quit and this is a devastating trap this trap has also been explored in a different way by the Stanford psychologist Carol Dweck and what she calls mindset so her notion is is that we want to have a growth mindset in other words we're improving rather than a fixed mindset which means we've already supposed to have arrived it's really exactly the same notion I just used slightly different language to try to describe this because I think it's useful to not did it to conceptualize it as a trap rather than a mindset a mindset is it's as if we could just switch our mind about it in an easy way it turns out it's it's I think it's more useful to realize wait a second this is a trap and if I don't recognize it as a trap and I get this bar set too high and I have expectations for myself that are too high then what's going to happen is that when I fail which I inevitably probably will then I may just kick over the table and quit and it's super useful to know that that's an additional landmine that sits in the way of the pursuit of any goal but including healthy living what is the law of satiation what the law of satiation is is the notion that we are designed by an evolutionary process that is extraordinarily accurate so none of us are short of breath here and there was we we we've gotten after all these years of breathing we're not like ten breaths short and we're designed by nature to sleep satiation although we can we cannot do that we can be sure to sleep but then we will have a device that'll help us actually catch up which is sleepiness so these are so whether it's sleepiness or whether or not it's thirst or whether it's hunger or whether it's heat and cold regulation mechanisms in other words we're designed by nature with exquisite machinery that actually tells us what to do these are signals from our ancestors they are shadows of forgotten ancestors that made all the right moves and so the law of satiation is simply that all animals by nature will if they're in their natural habitat eating their natural food they'll eat the right amount of food over time they're not going to read there's no such thing as eating exactly the right amount of food for today you're gonna overshoot it a little bit you're gonna under it a little bit but what happens is you have exquisite machinery that is monitoring this process and will balance this out perfectly over time just as you're breathing this and so the only reason why people struggle with their weight is because they are actually eating foods that are not natural to their environment and as a result when we shift people the natural foods the problem of excess weight goes away and so will does willpower have anything to do with that willpower is we don't want to be using willpower to try to eat less than our satiation mechanisms are telling us in other words so when people typically go on a diet what happens is is that they think that what they need to do is eat less than they want so that's a cruel mistake I've lived in that world yes it's awful this is this is the world of beautiful actresses and models and they're trying to essentially override their biology as well as the the common woman and man who is so frustrated with their bodies that they that they're essentially they know in principle that if they just eat less that they'll lose weight but this is actually not the solution the solution is to obey the law of satiety which is that if a creature eats the food of its nature it can eat it to society and it will be of ideal weight and that that is what will happen it's so we just need to move people to healthier food and then the problem will fade away what are the myths of moderation everyone's favourite term when it comes to eating bad foods and any bad habit for that matter yes this is the myths of moderation are that that a little bit isn't necessarily a problem now the thing is is that that isn't necessarily true so when we look at the pleasure trap more broadly we're just not looking about food we're looking about everything we're looking at all supernormal stimuli so we know the depending upon who you are sometimes a little bit of a supernormal stimuli it can be the difference between life and death so a person who has a heroin addiction or a methamphetamine addiction this a little bit can be can be the essentially a cascading avalanche of incentive that will take them down to a very dark place so and the same thing is true in alcohol so we will not tell people that only about 5% of people have the genetics to be addicted alcohol 95% of people it's never a problem but the 95 percent of people don't actually have the insight or intuition as to what it's like to be one of the 5% and if you're one of the 5% it's very difficult it's not impossible but it's very difficult to achieve any kind of drinking in moderation and so the myth and moderation is applied to food is that for some people that isn't a good solution now you can see what I just talked about the ego trapped before but what we actually have is we have two opponent processes here that are actually very difficult to negotiate so and they're actually counter processes and it is it just so happens that in nature the way this is unfolded it's completely unnatural and the reason why is that the pleasure trap is an unnatural phenomenon it was never supposed to be here we were never supposed to have to choose between the richest tastiest food and our survival or our well-being it was always the case that the richest tastiest more exciting food was the best for our survival that is no longer true the ego trap is the problem is setting the bar too high so if we set the bar too high at perfection then what happens is if you do this if you are all the way perfect with respect to the pleasure trap then you have reduced the pole of the pleasure trap but you've made the likelihood of failure extremely high if you lower the bar so low that all you say is what I'm going to do is I'm just going to eat a banana for breakfast better than I am now and I'm gonna leave all the bacon and eggs and all the rich food so I lower the bar so low that I can achieve it so I'm not in the ego trap but now I'm still in the pleasure trap so now my taste buds in my palate will not encourage me consistently to healthy food so these two things actually wind up being opponent processes if you lower the bar too low you're too far on the pleasure trap if you put the bar up too high you start to push into the ego trap for every individual there's a sweet spot and the sweet spot to me is you need to be able to feel good and you need to continue to enjoy natural food that you that's where you need to be in a place where you feel like that you can do this in a place that you can sustain please help explain what dopamine serotonin and endorphins are their functions and how they relate to the pleasure trip well that's a huge question and I would say that about 8,000 neuroscientists with that would love to be able to explain this the truth is is that the mind is exceedingly complicated and we've we've actually identified maybe 16 neurotransmitters and we suspect that there's over 300 so the functioning of the mind is sufficiently complex that I am NOT gonna sit here and tell you that I know what serotonin does because nobody knows yes my father and he's a biologist yes he went into like the way that everything's made up and I'm like dad I just want to know what it I'm sure what it looks like sure we'll draw a couple lines - the truth is is that the one were most interested in and won't the one we're most worried about is dopamine dopamine is clearly the the engine and the main chemical signaling mechanism for pleasure it's the also endorphins also are there but dopamine causes what we're gonna call an excited euphoria it actually encourages the organism to pursue something and to continue so when you sit down to eat you're designed by nature if you like the smell of food that's activating the dopamine pathway and what it's doing is the the anticipation of the pleasure is essentially attempting to close the distance between the stimuli of you that's what it's trying to do so when you when you will you're with some handsome actor it's doing the same thing okay same thing it's trying to get you to close the distance between you and the stimuli when things are dangerous there's different neural chemistry causing a different reaction so if you open a jar in the refrigerator and it's something spoiled it actually makes you avoid it or increase the distance between you and the stimuli or if you jump in the water and you see a shark you want to get out of the water - we do say essentially the way biology works it works on approach versus avoidance mechanisms so you have psychological experiences that are caused by a neurotransmitter Cascades that are that cause you to feel things and so what dopamine does is it says close the distance close the distance close the distance that's what it's trying to do okay it's like clues in a treasure hunt and so for food what it's doing is it's saying keep eating okay this is really good now later on after you've eaten you'll have another experience of a relaxed euphoria called that's endorphins that's it's actually analogous to during sexual activity that's still be mean it's like saying keep going keep going keep going the moment of orgasm is endorphin rush it's an endorphin storm so these two things work together and so dopamine is the main one that we're actually worried about because it's it's the anticipatory mechanism and during the process the pleasure pathway also known as the dopamine pathway in your mind is saying keep going keep going that's how we're designed the problem is is that the modern food supply has made those signals acute it's intensified them so you can see how this would be a problem if you make it more intensive than its supposed to be then you're going to get a more intensive reaction out of the animal it's going to eat past normal satiety mechanisms because it's going to blow right past them because the system is bit essentially being lit on fire and that's the problem with a pleasure trap and that's why we try to get people to go back to nature let's talk about the psychological effects of eating animals does what and who we eat make a difference and how we feel emotionally in your opinion how much does it contribute to mood disorders like anger anxiety depression and aggression I think what is what happens is is that these things can can cause emotional issues if you know if you're in the know and you actually have understood and come into contact and have you had your consciousness raised that you understand that that a living being has experienced pain and death as a result of what it is that you're eating then I think all of these things are true in other words you're you're could very well have turbulence in your mind and cognitive dissonance about what it is that you're doing and eventually the atherosclerosis will cause damage in their mind so if you were to take a cat scan people that are 50 years old in the United States you will find thousands of little tiny black dots on that scan and what those what those are is they're little tiny miniature strokes and so they're slowly losing their IQ and those are like tiny little earthquakes that are that are essentially signalling of a possible major earthquake to come the discomfort and the self-esteem issues that come with not not being fit as well as the the poor circulation generally that results in not sharp mid states not sharp thinking fatigue also the diversified pain also the disease processes that have just major constant chronic influence on the person's well-being these things are all absolutely directly related to poor diet of which the main component of that poor diet is going to be animal food let's talk about unhealthy addictions this is kind of a long question so come with me for the right answer and how to break free specifically some addictions like the standard American diet filled with junk food and processed meats mood altering drugs and porn in most cases we need more and more of the addiction substance more often and more hardcore intense versions just to feel normal then in comparison people activities and food that are good for us seamless interesting can brain pathways move in healthier directions away from cycles of addiction and if so how yes they can and they will and it's inevitable that they will so the the issue is is that the way nerves work is that they they become they are set sort of at a normal level of sensitivity for a normal level of stimulation that comes into the organism but if we if the intensity of the signal from the outside in this case for example when we massively increase the concentration of sugar fat and salt in the diet or we use some chemical altering substances some drug if we do those things then what's going to happen is the senses are effectively going to become dulled there's a reason for that they're essentially defending themselves against hypersthene so they will become dulled they will become desensitized as what's going to happen and therefore the experience of a normal substance in comparison will feel flat so this is well let's just say if you go into somebody's house at Christmas time and you smell the Christmas tree that smells fantastic the but then after you've been there for a while you can smell it that says that's a case of your senses becoming essentially dulled to that stimulus that is that it's at a higher than normal level of concentration and you would even find in the forest so that that's how it's going to work now that doesn't hasn't done any damage it will go back you'll see so the same thing is true of evading a very rich diet if you eat a very rich diet you've had done so your whole life if you try to make the change to a healthy diet it's going to be feel like a sacrifice yeah well for how the chemical census studies will tell us that you can get essentially a totally natural palate in about four months now the truth is that's not linear so you're going to do a tremendous amount you'll probably go halfway in two weeks so you'll be in quite good shape in two weeks and then you'll continue to gain sensitivity I wish I could tell you more about what these curves really look like but I can just tell you well we are doing the original research on that currently a True North health centers so we are yeah we will now we're gonna learn here in the next year or two what these recovery curves actually look like you didn't have to come back yes me about this but I would I would point out following some things that we see even with major brand changes that have taken place between major drugs which is they're way heavier on the brain way more impactful than the taste centers were the respect to fit it and that would be alcohol notice that there's a reason why a 30-day chip in it is a very big deal and that's because after 30 days if you've made it through 30 days you've gone through a substantial portion of recovery now we know it's really tentative and you are still in trouble and you're still going to have major cravings but this is also why a one-year chip is huge because if you can get through that year you have done a substantial amount of recovery to the sensitivity of the mind of the brain for normal dopamine level stimulation life is starting to feel normal now it's not as good as it's going to get okay it still then RB recovering more for the next couple of years and it will probably take about three years for things to be all firing on all cylinders again with alcohol with alcohol but after a year were in pretty good shape okay and the same thing is true after two or three weeks of healthy food you're in pretty good shape you're you actually like the healthy food you're feeling better things are moving the right direction all is getting better now are you shaky yeah you're just shaky like someone who's been in a for you but you are on your way so the the sacrifice and the the determination and self-discipline is not at the level of major addiction it's one whole notch down it's there it's not easy and it's enough to trap us but people should know that it is not the harrowing ride that some of these other challenges are but it's what you know but it has similar magnitude in terms of your health and happiness how can one make eating a whole food plant-based diet and healthy living pleasurable so it's sustainable and exciting well I would say this as I was just saying it's it's probably a two or three-week process just sensitize your taste enough that you that you're going to enjoy it quite well and what will happen is that will continue so one thing that that I actually want people to pay attention to is something that they wouldn't be looking for and that is that and this is the key to actually sustaining this kind of a process and that is to be looking for something that happens inside of us emotionally by the time you've gone say two weeks and you've done a very good job and this is going to be what I call the self esteem mechanism you have inside of you an internal audience that watches you so before you step in front of a camera you step in front of the mirror and see what you look like and when you're gonna have people over you look at your house and you fix it up and you put flowers around and you you look at the house through the of your guests and then you think about what they are gonna think of you and what they're gonna say to you as a result of this a young guys shooting baskets in his driveway young kid you know is calling up the game as if he's in the NBA Finals and when he makes his shot he acts like the crowd is roaring this is the internal audience this is a extraordinary psychological device that is part of natural human evolution and what this device is there to do is since there to give us feedback on our rehearsals or our actions when no one else is looking so that's why if you go into a store and try on new clothes if it looks good you feel good even though nobody has seen you in the clothes this is your internal audience the internal audience is actually key to whether or not people stick on a healthy pathway and they make any healthy changes or with respect to any goals that they do people are naturally designed to be looking for the endpoint or the outcome of their goals so with someone that wants to lose a hundred pounds is thinking that the key to them feeling better about themselves in their life is the moment when they're 100 pounds lighter and they can wear different clothes and what other people will be saying and feeling men so that is what drives them what they're looking for is the actual esteem from real live other people later that is the goal that motivates them that is not the goal that I want them to pay attention to there is a shadow goal that is actually the key to this whole problem and that is that that you don't have to wait for a year and a hundred pounds to feel better it turns out that you will feel much better about yourself in two weeks this is an extraordinary and important secret in psychology and this is what I call esteem dynamics that we tend to think of self-esteem as a static issue that came about from how we were treated by our children or whether that the cute girls like this in junior high school that's what we tend to be thinking but it turns out that self-esteem is actually not this the what self-esteem is is it's the internal audience giving us feedback and judging us on what have our actions been like in the last couple of weeks so it turns out that that what they are is they're very much like they're like the manager of a carwash that if you're the owner operator of a carwash and let's suppose you had a young kid named Jimmy and he was a very good detailer but he's a flake so sometimes he showed up and sometimes he didn't show up sometimes he showed up late sometimes he showed up on time and you would be very frustrated with him and if you were the owner and you would say listen you know I might just quit on you I might just fire you and just forget it and this is exactly what the internal audience will sometimes tell the person like you know what you're not gonna do it you're a failure just forget the whole thing no it's very sad okay and so what we have to watch here is that if the following takes place let's suppose Jimmy picks up on this and and the owner says listen if you would do a good job I'd make you head of the detail of division okay well let's suppose that Monday morning Jimmy shows up on time the owner-operators first reaction is whatever rabbitov he's not impressed at all yeah so the kid has done something good but there's no positive feedback there's no there's no big cascade of positives at all there's no encouragement there's actually a low-grade disgust that I don't trust you this is exactly what happens when people start to make make a healthy move in life is that their internal audience doesn't trust them because it's known that they have fumbled the ball 40 times previously so if Jimmy shows up the second day on time still not impressed third day still not impressed show us at Thursday and Friday there starts to be a little internal pause that the owner/operator thinks yeah first time I've ever seen you know first time I've seen this in a long time well but I'm not impressed okay and he tells his wife you know what that kid isn't gonna show up on Monday morning I know he's not but next Monday he does Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday two weeks what's gonna happen is the owner is gonna go home and he's gonna say to his wife something has changed okay I don't trust him I think he may not show up on Monday you know I mean and I'm upset about it now it's like it's she's starting to break my heart because I feel like he won't do it but he might do it when Jimmy shows up at nine o'clock on Monday morning the reaction is gonna be hi Jimmy it's gonna be excited that's what's gonna happen to people as they do a good job that what's gonna happen is the internal audience is going to start to believe in them okay long before anybody else has seen 100 pounds lost long before there's any new clothes and any new fans anything the internal audience will have observed this process and will start to change the neurochemical cascade of self-esteem that is what they need to look for okay if they look for that and understand that this is an inevitable byproduct of excellence for even a short period of time then this is the cascade that will chain the process together that will make their success much more possible you don't have to have won the game already to feel good you have to just know that you are winning and that you can do it that's how that works what makes people's reactions and coping mechanisms differ so drastically to the same situation so say if two twins went through a horrible I don't know the situation when they were young name it you name it I don't know something horrible no one would would survive and thrive off of that and one would be a victim for life now why what in your opinion what is it that causes somebody to take something whether being overweight or whether struggling with food or whatever struggles that they're going through and turn that around and it's easier for some people to thrive and harder for some people yes to so yes there's more more than one thing so the story of the pleasure trap is actually the story of how subtle situational factors can make big difference so we now have people that are smarter and better educated than ever before but they live in a food environment that is more tricky and and trap filled so as a result they're struggling more than they've ever been they've ever struggled because the situation has changed the same thing is true when someone starts to try to make a change who else is in their life who is their social circle and how encouraging are they that's an enormous ly important factor in determining how well people are going to do also I had one man that that said I understand all this and I know what to do but the problem is I live right next door to 7-eleven and it's open all night and I can just walk over my pajamas and get an Ice Cream Sandwich I said well you're gonna have to move you have to sell your house and move because that's what's that did he move yes you want to the point is there's no way that this is gonna work you can't be an alcoholic tending bar you can't be someone who is trying to have a healthy diet and work it you know a pizza place this is not gonna fly so you what I explained to people is that we must pay more attention and work harder on our environment than we do on ourselves you are your question is a deep one for psychology and that is that how much does situation impact us and how much is just personal character your your personality is really not subject to change that is natural its natural to you it's natural to individual variation in genetics the that's just how that works so we can't make someone who's who is say open and adventurous and once you try everything in the world and isn't very conscientious and real social and real agreeable that person is gonna have a lot of problems with this somewhere in there we need some conscientiousness which we usually have anyone who's interested at all is usually pretty conscientious then people differ and how open they are and how how much they need wide stimulation people that need wide stimulation need to have a wider repertoire of healthy foods and treats for them to coming their direction these are the issues of personality so personality is that is a major issue I actually have a little slideshow and lecture I've given called the perfect personality there's a perfect personality for healthy living and nobody has it except my good friend Alan my co-author he's the only one to medium sure he's no fun let me tell you and so but he is the perfect person is looking for personality for healthy living okay he's disagreeable so if anybody ever asked them would you would you like some no oh yeah cuz I don't want to get sick and die okay so you want anything new and different no okay it sounds like a great person travel and see with all the world's food is no he doesn't want to travel I'll do any California so some people have the perfect personality some people don't and so most of us down and it opens us up for some vulnerabilities the within those vulnerabilities what we need to do rather than working on ourselves we need to work on our environments so our environments new we need a way to work on our environment is to know how we're going to manage social situations that are going to come up that is effectively not changing our personality but it's a it's helping us become more effective at managing our environment what are we gonna say when they say oh come on just one would you like just one we need to be ready we need to be ready for these sorts of problems and organize our lives in such a way but healthy living is a lot easier for us that's how we did that's how we do it well would what is one thing you say say if I said um have this I don't know pork chop oh just now maybe later you say maybe your hair maybe later just K just punt the ball down the field one round okay they'll come back around we punt it again and I need to come back a third time you get insistent then we're gonna say something like no I'm just kind of on a on a healthy kick right right at the moment so I'm gonna pass right now okay no problem we just danced around these things and move on okay yes depends on what mood them in sometimes we'll be like you're an animal there's there's these are different personalities John John McDougall would never do what I said he calls that does Wiles wimpy web that's it helps a lot of people but you know what sometimes you have to be peaceful sure and professional sure so that's a good way to do that how much sleep do we need for optimal health and why this is an open question and the first place we look is to the mechanisms of satiety so in the same way that you need to breathe a certain amount in the same way you need to drink a certain amount the same way you need to sleep a certain amount and it's gonna change from day to day dependent upon what's happening in your life what we do know is that people are chopping into that and we we know they are the electric light bulb is essentially lengthen the day artificially and it's made it so that people are sleeping less than they have before and as a result of that we know they're tired and when they're tired they use coffee and they use coffee in order to block the signal of sleepiness that's what coffee does that's what caffeine does yeah sure there's a particular neuro chemical that is the mechanism that signals sleepiness and a coffee or caffeine literally goes in and blocks the action that chemical it's as if you have a sprained ankle and we take cortisone and we we knock it up so that you can't feel it that's what that's doing so but in answer your question more broadly there's been considerable disagreement among sleep scientists about this the most recently interesting research was published by Hunter College showing that in in looking at hunter-gatherers directly out there in the field surprisingly they only sleep the adults sleep about seven hours a night which is less than I would have thought I was actually surprised previous research has shown that hunter-gatherers might sleep as much as nine so I think that what we see is that we see an open question they must have had fires and other things for light because that's not I mean it's dark more than nine hours oh yes actually we know that it's very likely that people slept in shifts so that there's a lookout yes there's considerable genetic differences between early birds and night owls and so I'm a night owl yes so I'll stay up late and the you can imagine early bird it's going to that early and then waking up early so this is how human beings covered each other from predators by essentially having a distribution of early Birds versus night owls essentially covering us standing guard so one's not more healthy than the up nose Revere he always says if you're you want to get more done and be more productive than wake up early and early bird talk yes early bird arrogance that's what that is what are some adverse effects of coffee and caffeinated passages and why should we avoid it and what can we do so we don't need them other than you know sleeping more yeah I think one problem is night owls in this society have it a little tougher because they're gonna stay up late and yet the workday starts early and so they're more likely to wind up short asleep and they're gonna wind up them then getting dragged into caffeine so the the long-term effects are I think that we're gonna see these is pretty minor this is what I call one of the minor sins the it's not as it's not having a cup of coffee a day isn't in the same class of eating eating a third of your calories from animal food every day it's but it's it's sort of like little scratches in your car door you know if someone just every now and then opens their car door and your car door causes a little tiny scratch then after a few years we got more scratches and so the sleep science says that that we are much better off essentially sleeping to satiety consistently and making it a priority how can we successfully peacefully and powerfully convince others to make good choices like a whole food plant-based diet and taking a path supportive to true health and happiness well I think that that's such a that it's a big and beautiful question and I think that the the answer that I've seen is that this is a story that will be told by many people in many different ways and so the whether it's the the athletes that are coming coming out now more often and telling us the story that that when they eat more healthfully and they keep animal food other diet they recover more quickly this is a dutiful thing to watch it's also it's also good when we have our grand old scientists that show that the rank-and-file members of the society can reverse really debilitating disease processes and reclaim their lives and it's also when when younger people and young and and happening people can tell the story in a way that reaches the youth and also from different angles whether it's for personal health or environmental concerns or absolutely from animal rights all of these are different components of the story and as we keep telling the story in the different ways what's going to happen is that people need to often hear the message more than once sometimes from a different perspective and then accumulatively winds up impacting and causing raising your consciousness and change so I think that as I look at at the march of history and knowledge of people I see how far we've come in just the last hundred years about how we think about each other and how we treat each other as people and our differences this is sort of another major challenge for humans and I believe I won't be here to see it but I believe 100 years from now they will look back on how it is that we eat and how it is that we have treated the animals and the environment and they will bill shredder and feel like it was practically medieval and we're going to continue to share this message for as long as we can and as well as we can but we should be heartened by the fact that everything is moving in a good direction and that's that's where we take our inspiration from thank you and I want to share one more passage from your book the pleasure trap this book is so in perfect condition because I ought you listen to it and it's available inaudible and doctor not dr. Jay is the voice of the pleasure trap and she's a beautiful reading voice but I wanted to I wanted to read this passage from the book the close proximity of large numbers of domesticated animals to humans led to plagues and pestilence in fact the most potent killers of humanity since the dawn of civilization have not been warfare natural disasters or our vation they have been epidemics resulting directly from animal husbandry the desire for meat fish fowl eggs and dairy products have been one of humanity's most dangerous desires totally so thank you for being a voice for the animals being a voice for our mental health our physical health and I'm so glad that you exist in this world and thank you for being here with us I really appreciate it my great pleasure thanks so much for tuning in love gianna and dr. Lyle

Channel: Gianna Simone

Views: 30,214

Keywords: Plant based, the pleasure trap, whole food plant based, veganism, vegan doctor, esteem dynamics, eating disorder, Pleasure Trap, psychology of eating, Dr. Doug Lisle, The Pleasure Trap Book, book the pleasure trap, Doug Lisle, doug lisle weight loss, doug lisle self esteem, psychology of food, psychology of food and eating, psychology of habits, food addiction, plant based whole food diet, overcoming food addiction, psychology of eating healthy, psychology of eating less

Id: 0us8aHsRlps

Length: 42min 54sec (2574 seconds)

Published: Mon Apr 06 2020