Daniel Hannan | Occupy Wall Street Debate | Oxford Union

[Music] at this stage Mr President I should just say I agree and call it a night shouldn't I there there's really no other there's no other response AP to the occasion but you know what while I'm on my feet Mr President I'm going to say one other thing the bailouts were an epical crime where low and medium income people were required to rescue some extremely wealthy bankers and bond holders from the consequences of their own errors this will one day be seen as a generational offense the government has now admitted 60 billion pounds which the taxpayers put up will never be reclaimed in fact the total cost of the bailouts was a trillion pounds we know where the money came from we don't know where it is now we don't know who's got it there's been no accounting and that happened that happened Mr President from a breakdown of the democratic system it happened in those panicky days in the immediate aftermath of the collapse of Leman politicians were running around all over the Western world not knowing what to do and in their Panic they turned to the one set of people who by definition could not give them disinterested advice namely the bankers they said what do we do well of course the bankers said subsidize the banks you know what if you'd ask The Bakers whether to subsidize the bakeries you'd have got the same answer that's why then not the people to ask that's the whole basis of our democratic system I remember those days very well I was one of the only I think the only four elected politicians in Britain to oppose the bailouts at the time on that first day and I remember a very senior member of my party saying to me you are on your own on this no one agrees with you left or right there is an absolute consensus we've got to save the system he said all right you and Ron Paul referring to the Maverick American Republican well a week later the first opinion poll came out and I was able to email this very senior member of my party and say look it turned out to be me Ron Paul and 87% of the British population because people understood even if their leaders didn't that it was wrong to clobber the little guy in order to reward the corporate so why am I and and I am on this side unhesitatingly because the occupi crowd are occupying the wrong place I me in this country they were literally occupying the wrong place they set out to occupy the stock exchange they ended up in St Paul's Cathedral on grounds it's kind of well vaguely near the stock ex um but you know what even if they' had a better sense of direction and found the place they were after they'd have still been occupying the wrong place there is a world of difference between being pro business and being pro market sometimes those two positions happen happen to coincide often they do not corporatism is not the same thing as capitalism I want to challenge three propositions in the short time I've got I've been a I was a journalist before I was elected so I I recognize when a story has passed the point of correction and these have probably all passed that point but I'm going to have it go anyway first of all the idea that we are living through a failure of capitalism crisis of the market system secondly that the banking collapse was caused by a lack of regulation and thirdly to the IDE thirdly the idea that we have uh been brought here by greed by human weakness we start with the first one the failure of capitalism I mean I can't believe I'm having to come to the Oxford Union and explain that subsidies and nationalizations are the opposite of capitalism and yet that seems to be the contention of the Occupy crowd in a capitalist system bad Banks would have failed their profitable operations would have been sold to more efficient competitors Bond holders would have lost money shareholders would have lost money some depositors would have lost money taxpayers would not have contributed a penny the failure of a business and its replacement by a Ral is not a sign that the capitalist system isn't working it's a sign that the capitalist system is working just as you weed your garden to make space for New Growth it's precisely that replacement of inefficient old producers by better new ones that has raised Humanity to the highest standard of living we have ever enjoyed now you might say well all right but what about the regulation we heard it from two or three of the speakers on the other side you know there wasn't proper regulation just ask yourselves with the exception of nuclear power possibly of some television broadcasting what industry is more regulated than financial services the FSA handbook the guide on how to comply with their regulations is 10 and a half th000 pages is long the idea that this was a a failure of Regulation is the opposite of the truth and that is an extremely dangerous mistake to make because by responding to the crisis with further regulation we repeat the mistakes that led to it in the first place and we make the next one likely why it was the cost of compliance that drove the small providers out of the market it was the regulation that forced the consolidation which is what created this wretched too big to fail phenomenon in the first place in a properly the ideal system the one we should aim at is not a system where a bank can't fail but a system where a bank can fail without it being a problem without the taxpayer having to come and Rescue It In other words where there is aurality of small providers each striving to offer a better service we have the precise twice opposite of that we have a series of zombie Banks crawling mously with their bandages hanging off because we don't allow the market to take its natural course failure of capitalism no failure of Regulation no but let's take on the third of those propositions the idea that what we're really doing on this side whatever we say what we're really doing is somehow standing up for greed that our system is based on more selfishness or less generosity less decency than the other you know one very good point that the last speaker made we are all Fallen if by greed we mean desire for material possessions that isn't produced by Socialism or capitalism or any other ISM that is depending on your point of view hardwired into the genetic codes we evolved in PTO in Africa or else given by our creator but one way or another that is a side of human beings so the question then comes how do you harness that instinct in a socially productive way and for all its imperfections the market has up until now been the best way to do that why because in a capitalist system you to use the pejorative phrase you fulfill your greed in other words you uh attain your desire for material possessions by providing a service to someone else when I buy a program from Microsoft I am enriching Bill Gates I am adding fractionally to his net wealth but he is enriching me because he's providing me with the program each of us has benefited from the transaction under every other system yet devised by human intelligence a third party a commissar or a king gets to hand out the goodies and the way you then enrich yourself is not not by being productive to your neighbors but by crawling to those who are in a position of power the transformation of our planet the rise of wealth to a level which a previous generation could not have conceived came because of the development of markets and mass consumerism in an aristocratic system the way you got ahead was to perform for the patrons for a small number of oligarchs it was consumerism that made it pay for the people who had the inventions who had the good ideas to aim them at the rest of us as the great Economist Joseph shum to put it the princess was always able to afford silk stockings but it took capitalism to bring them within reach of the shopgirl let me close by asking you to think of who have been the real enemies of Wall Street the real enemies of stock exchanges Through the Ages they've got some pretty dishonorable foes during the second world war the city of London was repeatedly targeted by the Nazis because they understood that the free market system was part of what they saw as our degenerate system in other words one based on free contract and personal Liberty the stock exchange was repeatedly singled out by Luft vafa bombers when the Soviet Union expanded the first thing they would do taking over a new country would be to close down the bus and on September the 11th the murderers struck at the heart of New York capitalism well understanding that the thing they most liked and resent most disliked and resented about the West the personal freedom was represented in that building surely we are better than to line up with those kinds of enemies so no don't Occupy Wall Street don't occupy the London Stock Exchange don't even occupy St Paul's on the grounds that it's on the way occupy the central bank banks that have printed the money in order to get around the failures of a handful of banksters occupy the the houses of the politicians who voted to give your money to people who were not prepared to live with the consequences of their own errors and on your way to occupy those places occupy the loow the no Lobby tonight and vote for freedom [Music]

Channel: OxfordUnion

Views: 121,071

Keywords: Daniel Hannan, Occupy Wall Street, Oxford Union, Daniel, Hannan, MEP, MP, Occupy, Wall, Street, Wall Street, Opposition, Motion, Economy, Financial, System, World Economy, Financial industry, Protest, Banks, Banking System, Bankers, Crime, Tax, Capitalism, Socialism, Borrowing, 99%, 1%, Bail Out, Tax Payers, Business, Consumer, Oxford Union Society, Oxford University, University, Debates, Debating, Interview, sfn:Daniel, sln:Hannan, top:Occupy, evn:Occupy Wall St Debate

Id: 7ZpJeHN0_gw

Length: 10min 42sec (642 seconds)

Published: Fri Jan 11 2013