Conversations: Journey of the Working Actor

[Applause] good afternoon oh my gosh it's so nice to see so many friendly faces in the afternoon thank you so much for coming out my name is Janel Riley I'm an editor at variety so so thrilled to be here today with four actors who I'm sure you recognize their faces and also probably their voices I want to start by introducing an actress that you can see now in Steven Soderbergh's the laundromat previous credits includes Star Trek Deep Space nine my personal favorite of the Star Trek's The Joy Luck Club and recently this is us you can catch her in the live-action mulan flick next year please welcome Rosalyn Chou we have an actor who has appeared in such seminal classics as all in the family more recently you've seen him in the cool kids designated survivor and you could hear his voice in such shows as Curious George and scooby-doo please welcome Clyde Kusatsu we have a four-time Emmy nominee for her work on NYPD Blue and Grey's Anatomy odds are she's appeared in at least a few of your favorite shows with roles on the ranch Desperate Housewives you can now see her on I love this series show times on becoming a god in Central Florida please welcome Sharon Lawrence finally we have acclaimed filmmaker and very busy actor there are two fantastic movies coming out this year the report and just mercy you've seen him and everything from oh brother where art there too and breakable kimmy schmitt and you can watch him now on my latest obsession HBO's Watchmen please welcome Tim Blake Nelson thank you all so much for being here thank you for spending this time with us this is an audience of sag actors so I actually always like to start by asking how did you get your sag card I know you all have one so I started as a kid I so I barely remember I think I just remember signing the paperwork and so I've been a member of sag longer than a member of anything else really do you think it was a commercial maybe I think so yeah I think a toothpaste and I had rotted teeth so it was really the backs were all rotted but the Front's look your teeth yeah now there oh sorry use your mic oh there's stage performers yeah I know I keep forgetting that in 69 while I was at Northwestern as a theater major a friend of mine in Hawaii said there you know opening up after us so I got to join after in 69 and then when I came to LA and 71 in 73 my first episode of TV work was kung fu and I got my sag card there so an official card for sag AFTRA I've been a member since 1969 so I've got 50 years of membership in this sure I should also let you know that Clyde not just has six years of membership but many decades of service as a board member to the Union and we are also board members of the sag after a foundation so he's been serving the scene in a long time I started out as an actors equity member and then got my union card in 83 I think or 85 on Dan and yogurt commercial oh good fine product by the way I'm lactose intolerant though are you really it's acting Nora Ephron's first movie this is my life that was my sag card back in 92 I believe 1992 and I went and the part was not written I went and met her in a hotel room while I was out here for other reasons it sounds shady this is not Shady and we talked that's all we did and she said I want you to be in my movie and we'll figure out how the part is going to be written and and we kind of wrote it together and a wonderful movie with Julie Kavner and and Dan Aykroyd and Samantha Fox and Gaby Hoffmann when she was a little girl actually a movie really ahead of its time too because it was about a female stand-up comedian doing such things were you know very strange and new yes well I actually want to go all the way back to the beginning and I'm curious when will you first sort of it bitten by the acting bug and there's a difference between like when you wanted to act and then when you realize that this could actually be a career I don't know if you started out in school plays you said you started from a very young age but you might have made the decision later that this would be a career yeah I kept resisting it I mean because I was I first started because my parents started putting me they were peaking opera aficionado and they kept putting me in their plays so I had an aversion to doing you know to acting for a living so I kept trying other things and then once I graduated well while I was in high school I kind of realized I don't like anything else so I you know kept it up and so I'm acting by default basically cuz I don't know how to do anything else I'm not even convinced I know how to do this that well that's all weather story so was there a moment or a job when you said oh this this is gonna be my life yeah you know I was actually interning at a radio station and they wanted to put me on the air interviewing somebody but they said I had to let go of my sag card to do that this is back in the old days you couldn't be a performer and be a journalist and it was in that moment that I thought I am not letting go of that sag card to sit behind a typewriter back in the day sit behind a typewriter for the rest of my life so that was the the an end game that's amazing and I have made the wrong choices by the way cuz know you're probably much better at it than I was for you well growing up in Hawaii in the 50s there used to be only one station was KGMB it was like the CBS and then they started getting different stations opened and they fill the time by having penthouse playoffs and all the film libraries from MGM Warner Brothers Columbia and so I sort of grew up watching hey Judy let's do his play let's put up the bar here put out the chairs and everything and I thought why couldn't I do that and but I never had the guts to do it but I was involved in choir and the band in a school called Iolani was an all-boys prep school back then and then when I was 14 the choir teacher said you know there's a dropout you want to be in the chorus of Guys and Dolls I didn't have to audition so I said cool you know geez and I once I was in that whole Nicks I thought I love this this is so different the girls were from Punahou and let's st. Andrews Priory but there was his ethos of the theater together we're gonna make a play we're gonna do a show and from 14 on I majored at Northwestern and I just took a flyer and got accepted in the program and my freshman year though it was a real big downer because I had a professor came up to me and say why do you want to be an actor there's only teahouse of the August moon and King and I how can you possibly make a living and it was crushing it was really soul-crushing so I went back to Honolulu for the summer to work in a brewery in the night shift from 4:00 to 12:00 and I said the hell with this one if I'm gonna have to work ten times more than a white actor to get notice I'm gonna have to do that so long story short in the three years by the time I graduated I became a working member of the theater department playing non-asian roles and so half the department would cast me the other half of the department go and this is an example of a working actor and and then I came to LA and I had to start all over again because all of a sudden you were at that time you were an oriental American so it's been a journey but you know what that's where you learn perseverance and resilience by pursuing that which is what you love and I'm very grateful and fortunate to be this is my 46th year in front of the camera so and I'm still I think I still got it this is a good call to audition and stuff so it's cool and well as Sharon mentioned being of service is the ultimate in really fully giving purpose to the artistic element because you know you're helping for the other people coming up and you're opening up the gates and ensuring that the institutions and organizations are there more so now than they were before so absolutely and thank you guys so much for your service by the way I'm obviously very fond of this place Sharon for you I was born this way my family the scotch-irish storytellers they could all sing and so that was how I was made and the public school system in North Carolina at the time was very invested in performance programs whether they were choirs or the drama department the church I grew up in same thing so my aptitudes had support I uh I always say if I was good at math maybe I would have done something else but this was what I what happened to be comfortable out and had a knack for and I didn't think of it as a career option my father who also went to Northwestern before you did got his degree in journalism but acted in place and so I could see that it was a good hobby and a sideline I got my degree at UNC Chapel Hill in journalism and did a lot of the theatre department and during one of my seasons at summer stock which i think is a great way to continue to explore whether or not you feel useful and attracted to the that this option as a as a part of your life the reason I say that is the University they're great training programs are great but sometimes you need to be in an environment where people are not beholding to you where you are not paying to be to explore and because I was working with people that had no particular investment in me but said you could do this and I could recognize that I was able to keep up with the pros that they brought in from New York and other people that were hired around the country around the country I thought I'll give it a try in New York and Theater was my my source of income and my passion for nearly 10 years there and then technology shifted my perspective when I left high school for college shows like dynasty were on and they didn't really interest me there's kind of people that I don't say the storytelling but I didn't identify with those kind of characters and then I didn't watch television because I was working at night or in school and then on tour and living in hotel rooms and didn't see television until the VCR became ubiquitous and I could afford one and I started recording shows while I was working at night and at that point shows like China Beach and thirtysomething and LA law were on and they were more about real people people that I could identify with particularly women and I'd spent so long telling the same story over and over again eight times a week some shows for two years at a time that the idea to play a character that could evolve became interesting to me and that's when I decided to come to to Los Angeles with no no connections no really I didn't know I had a few friends here but I certainly didn't have any advocates in the business but it was technology that changed the way I saw the opportunities I acted in high school because an English teacher dragged me into a Shakespeare production and I really enjoyed it playing Peter quince in Midsummer Night's Dream wait that was your first role in a play yeah they just okay I mean that that's just kind of amazing you've never acted before and they put you in Shakespeare in your Peter yeah and then I ended up playing that in Central Park about ten years ago which one were you better in honestly yeah that's I think that I think Dan Sullivan's production was better and so I'll go with that one and then I went off to college to become an academic I was going to be a classicist and my mother was visiting me before my in the spring of my freshman year and she said what are you gonna do this summer and I said well I'm gonna come home and live in the house and maybe get a summer job and then come back to school in the fall and and she said what do you want to do with your life and I said I want to be a classicist a Latinist maybe teach high school or be a professor and she said well that's great nothing would make me happier but you did like acting in high school and you don't even have a girlfriend right now you have no affiliations and you have no financial responsibilities anywhere why don't you take advantage of that and just go act in a summer theater somewhere or be an intern do something risky this summer instead of just coming which is very generous of her because my father had just recently walked out on us and she would have liked the company and and so I went and worked for a summer theatre and when I got back to college that that fall I had changed my decision about the trajectory of my entire life I stuck with my Latin major but then after college I went to drama school sort of the opposite of you I was in school till I was 26 so I went to a four-year actor training program and and then went Julliard I've heard of it it's actually the only one that's for years most of them are three and then that was it and and I started working in theatre that's amazing because I feel like there's maybe this cliche has sort of faded but like for a long time the thinking was parents didn't want their kids to be actors like no child of mine will be an actor and she actually saw that in you and encouraged it was that anyone else's experience oh it was really well yeah okay you both came from performing families no I don't know you and you right my father was a journalist my mother could sing that she was shy but they valued it yeah yeah Peking Opera was more of a hobby for my parents so I think they thought of acting as a hobby and and a way to earn money for college so that's yeah they were that's great parenting it is yes spectacular yeah and Clyde for you you you had no connections to the industry right no no connections at all in fact I think it was just one of those motivators to say that I'm gonna do what I want to do and just I saw that the world was a greater opportunity out there than it is growing up in islands in Honolulu because in Hawaii he's sort of like you spent half the day going around this way and the other half going around in that way and some goes up Sun Goes Down beautiful but then on a daily basis is sort of like there's got to be more and there's a you know from that fantastic beyond that road lies a shining world beyond that road lies despair but it's it's got all of it and it's still an adventure and I think it's great that's funny because I'm just spending my life trying to make enough money so I can retire to Hawaii just and just stay there and watch the Sun go up and down just just a few years off uh-huh did any of you have sort of like role models or actors whose careers you thought you wanted to emulate or just people who inspired you you know you mentioned you thought it was going to be theater until you started really watching TV but what sort of path did you envision for yourselves originally we could start with Tim since he's down there well I came out here and did stand-up comedy for a summer as a as a sort of experiment and I got on on some stages at the Laugh Factory when it was easier to get on there I don't think it's so easy anymore and The Improv and Comedy Store on open mic nights and then at the bottom rung of the ladder so I'd be that have to get there at 9:00 and just be ready to go on but then get bumped all night by better comics and usually get on after midnight and I suppose I learned from that experience that I needed to go to drama school that I didn't want to pursue a career through the ranks of stand-up comedy both because I didn't think I was very good and I really wasn't what I was doing was quite derivative and also because I didn't feel like it would give me a foundation for a career doing this and that as a character actor I would really need to explore all avenues toward as many different parts as possible in other words pursue an approach that would allow for the most elasticity in terms of the types of characters that I could play is a short guy with you know what not a cover guy face and so I guess the actors who interested me were of course the character actors and that was really everybody from I don't know Jonathan winters to Peter Sellers to Lee Van Cleef just the the the oddballs and the eccentrics who seemed to be able to humanize daring choices into a dimensionality that occasionally I've accomplished as an actor I did not in the project you and I did together we did a movie together and which I'm dreadful but she's very good but I don't think you've seen the movie yeah deidre and Lainey robbed a train yeah wonderful filmmaker and nothing against the filmmaker or anybody else involved but yeah I just I was a three and out on that one but let's move on and Sharon for you I mean you mentioned you originally thought it would you know sort of be theater I don't know if there were theater actors you looked up to and admired yes my the impulse that hit me when you said it I was thinking does it still apply and it does Shirley MacLaine uh you know she and it was because she was so uh all of her work was so honest she had great skill and freedom and that that freedom I think is what drew me that essence that quality I think is what I was so attracted to by her and I still AM and her freedom not just as an actor but as a as an advocate as an a pioneer as an explorer of things that are off the chart and path and she she will always I think be someone who I I know influenced me very early there are there are plenty of others and and it is character work that attracts me the most it always has but I'm grateful now that we as women have so many more women that are telling the story that are creating the content that we portray because it really does make a difference in the dimensions that we are able to bring to to to a story into a portrayal absolutely have you ever met sure McLean I did yeah I did I believe it was it was a big event around a political season it must have been maybe maybe when Clinton was running and that's when I met her and she was you know crusty and saucy and haha all of those things that that wouldn't surprise you yeah and I remember when she was honored with the Golden Globe Award I guess the deMille Award and that was that was a night that meant a lot to me because she was really able to look back and we could all look back with her and see to see the compilation of the retrospective really shows what she's accomplished and how long she danced and sang and that at this stage of life I I really do admire my last big musical performance was in Chicago on Broadway and I was 40 years old and I know because I started when I was 22 as a professional dancer eight times a week and that's such a difference than when you're doing it you know just in class yeah and the fact that she continued to do it standing up on a stage in Vegas everywhere touring you know you got to respect somebody that has that kind of discipline absolutely and I saw you in Chicago and you were amazing yeah I'm glad I don't have to make a living doing that anymore because it's it's rough it's like being an athlete and you know you uh that's why she transitioned and she did it with grace she's she hung in there for a long time I was exhausted what she knew in that show it is such a workout and Clyde for you you you were mentioning that you know when you started they told you you probably wouldn't have many options so I don't know if there were people you even look to you know well you know let's be honest I mean back in the 50s and 60s there weren't many people that look like me up there on the screen or in the box so I did more gravitate towards the British actors it seemed like Sir John Mills Alec Guinness and all actors of that ilk and I did a lot of watching I did a lot of observations and stuff like that and the Asian roles that were being played at the time were very subservient were very stereotypic not role models at all to look towards so it was sort of like I think I had an openness like why not you know and I become a member of east-west players back in 1972 here at a time when the way to break through was to show demonstrate to the writers directors and casting directors that Asian actors could do more than T ASSA the August moon and so east west players the whole bent was to do checkoff to do absent and all those other plays with Asian faces and we're quite successful in breaking down those stereotypes and having people and those are the days wind there were critics for the LA Times and on the trades and people would see a good review and they'd come to see your show and so with a lot of members of the professional industry and so I believe like I did get a lot of viewership from them to be brought in but even within the Asian community of east-west players I was considered an odd duck because I would practice these different accents and write might you know didn't know when it's going to happen and whatever is it why is he wasting his time with all these accents he's never going to get cast and why is he screwing around with well I got a do John Wayne the hell yesterday and I found myself why not and a lot of times I've this is back in the 80s I was doing it a two-hour Magnum in Hawaii and in between shots ago well boys were losing the light the big black tower ain't gonna like it we'd better burn some films do some giddy up here and they heard about it and the next season the exec producer wrote a role of japanese-american HPD detective that drove Tom Magnum nuts doing John Wayne and I found you know you can you can get on a bench you can scream and make wave a white t-shirt with blood on it saying but this is not right or whatever but sometimes maybe the best way of breaking down those barriers is to showing the possibility to never have people in midwesco hey I like the dude that does John Wayne he's pretty cool it said more than just trying to do this polemic about it you know and so you never know and it's it's like I married a Jewish woman I got two boys over in Hebrew school at the time and they called me back to do another episode of Magnum and that's when Stephen Jay can I love to moonlight being an actor and so I was a detective and he was the house detective and we're talking I said yeah my kids are in Hebrew school and everything like that bar Mitzvahed and everything like that then a year later there was a breaking groundbreaking show called wiseguy they arcs of nine arcs of ten and so I wound up getting cast this is FBI district officer that spoke with Jewish aphorisms and stuff like that yeah my my IDs are guns Amaka what can I tell you no prophet miss sugar what I can tell you and it worked but then again there was another way of breaking down people's conceptions of it all so many times I think during the early part of my career that you always used to be the Chinatown episode or this is the episode I never got cast for some reason I could never blend in but if you got the quirky guy that happened to be Asian I'd get cast in the thing but I think in the long run it didn't mean better justice because it gave me a different kind of challenge to do absolutely no that's amazing actually reminds me the first person who I looked up to was Barbra Streisand because I remember seeing the right I remember seeing the back of one of her albums and I was kind of homely I mean to be honest it was cute and I saw the back of one of her albums and she was dorky as well and I remember thinking oh okay so there's someone else who so it started with that and then later on as as Clyde was talking I just realized you know I remember really early on doing a guest spot with you and you didn't have that accent and your cuz we didn't have I didn't have role models my role model was like Connie Chung yeah yeah she's right no but she wasn't an actress and so I do remember one of my very early jobs I was working with Clyde and he was just you know he was a guy he wasn't you know he wasn't wearing the skullcap there was no smell of incense briefs or if you when we did all-american girl which is the first job Asian American sitcom for ABC in doing the pilot I mean people had their accents except for Margaret's show but so as the father had a slight kind of an accident Margaret that's all kind of thing and then after the pilot the second or third episode someone says what happened to the accident did you have an accent I said yeah but I was not gonna make a big thing of it yeah I just let it disappear so I became the day and so that the rest of the other shows I didn't have an accent so the gal who played my wife had an accident and my grandma or the mother of my mother had an accident but I thought it's a little subversive kind of a thing but if they don't notice they don't notice you know hey and he was working all the time I mean he was one of the Asian actors that asian-americans that we all looked up to oh yeah you know prove that you can make a living doing this she was gorgeous when she started out she was like it's like who is that oh my god and she presented so differently she didn't come off like a lotus blossom or that kind of attitude or anything she just like gorgeous but when I first started that the big thing is as an you know young Asian American I used to say I just want to do a job where I don't have to I don't get asked to put on a bikini and I don't have to kiss someone so basically I wanted to be a character actor right so I didn't realize that you know you have to hang in there if you don't want to be that girl yeah you just have to wait until the nice little wrinkles come no jelly and then you get the federal so you have to hang in there don't give up I think a lot of actors are really interested in representation and not just how you can get it because I'm sure things have changed over the years but I think for a lot of times people think that that's it you get an agent and your sets and you really do have to still work for and advocate for yourself so I'm sort of curious how did you find the representation that you know you feel fits you and how do you continue to work with them even now that you know you have an agent well I started there's a lady named Betsy Liu who ate at my parents restaurant that's how I first got sucked in yeah but now I've been with my agents Buckwald for 20 years and I used to say I'm just gonna stay with someone I've been with everybody at some point really but I did say I'm just gonna stay with someone once I'm not lied to basically people are honest with me I'm just gonna stick with them and they've been that person for me and I think it's you still do end up advocating for yourself and work baguettes were people that you work with will want to work with you again hopefully if you know you have to be grateful and you know contribute and serve the project and people will want to work with you again so I don't know how much agents have to do with it later on you know but they still obviously work for you but you still have to get yourself out there and meet people and you're here I mean you said that you've left agencies was was it because you felt lied to or I don't move around a lot I mean I think in the course of my career I've maybe been with three agencies Wow and though I was with Betsy I was Betty Lou for a long time and and we were at a dinner and guy Lee who was the person that was running Betty Lou at the time my wife said things are good for you and he said yeah it's really good Wow and then we came home that she says either it's you and your agent or me and you gotta get another agent because he's doing good but I think we should do better and it just so happened it just forced me to get into the thing where fortunately one of my good friends was exec producer of the first series I had and I called him up and he said let me do it see what I can do and I knew another guy so I called him up and then I said he's if it was any other time I'd be glad to represent you and then my friend Frank Hardy I said Oh Stan we'll we'll see you and so I had a meeting and and they had I mean I said so she said what do you do and I said well this is what I do I look at the breakdowns and everything go in the office and say once you send me out for this and and then they said here's a phone why don't we put you in this office then because that's what you're doing you're doing our job so I wound up at part but became paradigm for Buddy juniors and like anything as they absorbed other agencies those agencies have to cut and call their their client list and I got that call saying yeah your your cut and but instead of going what I said okay all right I made sure I said let me get my pictures and things I made calls and then within two days my point guy at paradigm his assistant was now an agent at stone manor Saunders and I had a meeting and within three days I was I've been with it's don't matter since then but what I did also was that was on a Monday by Friday I knew had a new agent and I just wrote from everybody from the top so damn Gore's all the way down saying I want to tell you the eighteen years has been terrific and let's move on and the email started coming back like yeah good luck because usually they expect somebody said I hate you I hope you back that type of thing and I feel this is a business and a lot of times the old stereotype is you're good Asian will get you in that door and book you and see that your career is going to go that way no a lot of times is I learned it was good to be with an agency I'd get out it would be up to me to get that job it'll be up to me to do that networking and create those relationships and not be a pain in the ass you know that type of thing and let your reputation precedes you or let your reputation be we talked about why the other people saying you want to work with a good guy do that you know and I find that that's more productive doing it that way you know instead of being an artist and odds are like if you did say you know I hope you go die to those people you'll end up working with them in the future anyway awkward later on yeah err on the side of politeness I figure sure I did not have an agent when I came to LA and I benefited from the early years of the casting director workshop process so much so that I really was sort of a poster child for for that process back in the early 90s I knew what I was castable as I understood that when I came to LA I was already 30 years old and and I think there was a real advantage to that knowing that I would play business women and I was strategic about which workshops I would go to because the idea of you know we can say at the paid paid a play wasn't the way that it was thought of then it was an opportunity to learn what the casting process was like and for me that was important because I had really done musical theater and I knew how to get cast that way but I really didn't know what the process was for episodic television and that's the way I envisioned my way in I said I wasn't thinking movies and I was thinking guest spots so I chose a casting director that was working on a creator whose series I had admired and that was Steven Boch ghost shows like I said 30-something I mean I'm la la was a show that I admired at the time they were casting a show called civil wars I read a scene like you do and got a call in because you we had pictures and resumes at the time and direct numbers and pagers and all those things pagers majors and Junie Lowry Johnson's office was who was casting that and the assistant was Scott Jenkins your who's still doing that work they both are I got the job and then a few months later and I got called in for a new series by ba Chico called NYPD Blue for a day player that was written for a man the character was an assistant district attorney they like the chemistry with Dennis Franz and I because we had an adversarial scene and thought it might be a interesting idea to extend that scene and change it from more in the first deck to the teaser they saw us in New York together because they flew me out to reshoot that as an exterior and that's when they really recognized that we would be an interesting couple it was not something that was conceived of with the the pilots Bible even the show's Bible and that's when the casting agents recommended that I needed to negotiate this contract better and that's how they said let's introduce you to to an agent so it happened kind of backdoor for me and I still think that casting directors are the way in for those of us that are working to get our foot in the door and it was explained to me in a way that I think is important for us always to keep in mind especially now that the food-chain of the dollar that's spent through our business does not end at the actor it ends with the agent because or managers because we are paying them so if you think that you're beholden to your agent that's not logically correct in the way that the the system of the business is set up but who's at the top of the food chain any thoughts who that would be producers directors the audience ah and that's why more than ever your access to the audience is really important that's why YouTube stars are who producers are looking to be in business with so that's important to remember and it changes your perspective about what your power should feel like to to yourself and to the people that you're working with and what power you have if you do create your own content I actually when you mentioned earlier that you didn't watch TV and it was because of the advent of the VCR I was thinking kind of the current example now is we can film anything we want on our iPhones and it's another reason why I were represented or Iran women in films foundation for a long time and at that point we were one of our main goals was to give film finishing funds to women because many women would start a film and not be able to quite get the sound mix done or the composer or what they would need to actually launch it out into the world and there were more women that were doing documentaries and getting stunt but but more women all applying for these funds because cameras were getting smaller and smaller and the lighting equipment was more and more compact because it wasn't as necessary because cameras were better so that's another reason we can all do our work is because technology changed it digital changed at all and Tim for you I mean you you started as an actor you you also um segwayed into directing pretty flawlessly um but did you start out just primarily wanting to act no acting and writing and mainly acting and writing I initially wrote for theatre and I wrote a play that was then made into a film that I directed that I've got I have God yeah yeah I think it's on Amazon Brian oh is it I think but yeah that was my first film and and then I started directing movies and and that's been a wonderful pursuit to go alongside the acting what what these guys have shared in their answers which will thankfully keep mine very sure is to foreground an absence of rancor and resentment and each of them I think beautifully in in their own anecdotal ways has each of them has has told stories that just don't have any room for rage and recrimination and to take every setback and every challenge and turn it into opportunity that's fueled by belief in yourself and I think that's what each of these answers has shared and rather than give my own long-winded answer that would just say the same thing I really love with what they said I think that that's really really important and it really is fueled by a belief in yourself mm-hmm so when you started out did you were you selling yourself as a writer actor director was it harder for you to sort of find someone who would represent all facets or are you mostly concentrating on finding someone to represent you it's been a kind of interesting journey and I really it began in drama school because I went to Julliard at a time when they really valued the leading actors more than they did the character actors to the extent where one wondered well why are you having a rap with these character roles in it and and why did you bring us all in if so much of the attention and focus is going to be is gonna go to the to the tall good-looking leads and I was I was particularly ostracized in the casting process it was difficult but I was always writing and for our fourth year rap I didn't really have much to do my biggest role was Fabian in Twelfth Night and so so I I went to the administration and it's a tiny school that were only between 15 and 20 of us per year so in the whole school about 50 people 50 students in the four years and I said look you really haven't given me much to do this year but if I write a full-length play will you produce it in the rep and they said that's not really likely but you can go ahead and write it and so I did and I went up to Michel Langham's office he was running Julliard at the time a wonderful director and teacher of Shakespeare in particular and we did a reading of it and his in his office and they put it in the rep Wow and so it was produced along with Shakespeare and Caryl Churchill and I think Glenn Jenkin and and checkoff and in the rep and that set me on my way when I graduated from Juilliard in both writing and acting because I got a writing agent as a result of that and then this is again I'd what I loved about your answers all of you is just not taking stuff personally I was very bitter about my casting but with a lot of thinking and sitting with myself I decided that I wasn't gonna let that infect my life and that I would find a way around it and similarly I I was more successful early on as a writer director and so I signed with a bigger agency in Los Angeles and I've always lived in New York and still live in New York and I felt like I needed I've wanted them to represent me as an actor too so that my career could advance a bit and I asked the agency if they would represent me not only as a filmmaker but as an actor and they said no you're just it's it's it's it's not a good business proposition for us and I was just an off Broadway actor I felt I had a lot of promise but there just wasn't the evidence for them that they were gonna make money off of me and then I was sad and licked my wounds and stayed with a smaller agency in New York that didn't have a an LA office but then just because of my relationships in New York I ended up being offered the role in o brother where art thou and and then I asked again because I wasn't gonna let the fact that they'd rejected me the first time get in the way of what I knew was in my best interests which was to have it all under one roof with a good LA agency I didn't want to have two different agencies and so I had no pride about it I just knew what I wanted from a business point of view what was going to be best and and I've been with that same agency as a writer-director since 97 and and as an actor since 2000 so they said yes this time they did okay because it was a it was a business decision but make your you're right your question is a smart one in the way you you framed it because the agency doesn't solve your issues it it really is about behaving yourself when you get work so that people want to hire you again and it's also about doing everything you can to wrest control over your future as an actor from others and that can mean being aware of every project that's going on or it can mean writing your own material collaborating with friends putting up showcases any way that you can wrest control from others to exploit yourself creatively in a way that can advance your your own creative interests I know you're much nicer than I am and you're not holding a grudge against that agency but when you're like the title character in the Coen brothers new movie isn't there a part of you that's sort of like you know remind your agents like hey hey remember me so I mean you know what's interesting is that ya know I don't because first of all a lot of them a lot of the people aren't around anymore because it's so corporate and they move away and I've just kind of stuck there and even so I did I I did oh brother where art thou and I signed with them and then I went over to Bulgaria to shoot this movie I made there called the grey zone and I was in Bulgaria and my I was about to rap I think I had two weeks of principal photography left and I knew I'd be coming back to edit which would be about a ten week process but it felt like about the right time to reintroduce myself to the acting agents at its UTA is the agency and and so I I called and asked for my agent and they said oh he doesn't work here anymore and and nobody had bothered to call me and they hadn't even thrown me over to another agent it was just and so that's just it's just important to hear those types of stories because because all these people are cynical even even the well-meaning ones you know they've got a long they've got a 10 12 hour day inundated with all these phone calls they see the shiniest objects in front of them and everybody deals with that everybody deals with it and I Joel and Ethan Coen deal with it Terrence Malick deals with it Damon Lindelof you know it the the notion that you reach a point where the hassles just desist or go away they just they're it's it's it's it's the same there are just different species of them and and they're of different sizes sometimes but it always really does come back to your own belief in yourself and your own innate optimism about what it is you have to offer and just being certain that you're a person who shouldn't go away you must persist and then do so optimistic and speaking of situations where you sort of feel like you you don't have any control I think actors are very curious about the audition process I don't know if any like if anybody really feels like they're good at it actually that's not true I do know some people who think they audition well but I don't know when the last time was any of you actually had to audition and you know if it's if there's any hints you could give us to make it any easier what your experiences have been if you've had any of those like legendary awful experiences that we hear but I have a really good tip for you guys you know I don't love auditioning and I'm not great at it but I do feel well firstly you have to fill your life your life has to be you know you can't just sit by the phone and wait for an audition fill your life so that the audition doesn't seem like the thing that's going to change everything secondly when you do have to audition and you're free to use this I always look at where the audition is I can't believe I'm admitting to it and I look for something to eat or some treat that's right nearby so back in the day of the cupcakes remember oh sure so sprinkles was uh never leave ala vard and any time I had an audition I would make sure that I would drive by sprinkles and treat myself - I mean it got to be such a habit I would walk in they gemin and now I've got you know other places that I go to Larchmont if I have an audition over there I know I go to go get them tiger I just have my treats if I have to for after the audition after Oh after it's like my reward right I mean I try not touch if I can but if I have to that's I it works a treat literally yeah absolutely you know the audition process I mean not that I people say you hit that thing where you get the all you get the roll or you go Andrew you have to mean you don't have to audition you just talk but you always have to be willing to audition because it's sort of like you maybe Jerry Rice who was one of the best wide receivers but the reason he stayed in the game as long as he did because his training regimen was very disciplined his if you're gonna be cut by a team you got to be able to go to that another team for a tryout you got to be able to look at that playbook plays do the run patterns and everything like that so I've learned to treat auditions as the opportunity to meet some people that you have never met before and this business has grown so vastly there's there was a time when you knew Junie Lowry Johnson everybody else knew you walk in and go hi how you doing but now cut the attitude out you're there to present yourself and your talent I've learned to look at the money group when I walk in with my audition pages it's chock-a-block with red dots and maybe things line to say take that pause here and then maybe add a little something here and there so I'm prepared if there's like two scenes and I go in spend an extra moment to take in the room make contact buys you another 20 seconds sit down and look at that first scene in in a methodical way as if the cameras on you and you're having your close-up and I find that if there's interest on the producer director they're going hey I like that can you just typed it up and do it again then you go bingo yes because it's given me a second shot at this and so I do it and sometimes I go oh I had where's this you mind picking up the data soon we weren't gonna do it but would you do the scene so it's fine and I remember there was two three years ago they were they were casting this series called REM was called awakening for NBC and I had done my research who the director was the producer was I could say hi I like that thing and jason isaacs was a star we're auditioning and we kept hey Jason but can we do the scene and it was very innovating and I knew you go in not to book it you go in to hit it you know and but without the expectation you're gonna book it just because you want to do that you function as the actor and the professionals that you are and as I was walking to the parking lot this other actor came up maybe he was laughing he says man you freaked out all the actors in the room I said what do you mean people are going in and out 1 2 minutes of whether you were in there for twenty two minutes man and later on with audio controllers at the same time BD Wong was being negotiated by NBC to do that role because because you know he's coming off of SVU or whatever and so I understand that but to me the satisfying thing it was a demonstration of my functioning as an artisan an actor was I did the prep work I made choices presented myself in the most professional manner possible and I went in there and I hit I I did a good audition and that's the most important thing you can do it is and it could pay off down the road and you're gone you never know where yeah actually that's true I mean when when you audition you never know you might not get this role but somebody will remember you for another one or a better role than the one you're auditioning it for it's happened here's something that I think we all have to accept and that is that the self tape is not going to go away and we've got to learn to master it and by that I don't necessarily mean to imply that you must tape yourself although there's some people that probably feel excited by the prospect but finding the service that does that for you I think our union is getting more invested in that in New York the sag AFTRA location has that set up and we're we're we're investing more here in this location you'll so that we have the ability to serve all of our members needs but if you find a good place to do it it means you have to invest but you may be investing in a coach even if you're going in the room anyway I think that that's valuable too and recognize that it it gives you a couple of things to - that are to your advantage first of all you get a chance to play it back and see it and learn it's camera technique as you are working on the audition most of us if you're walking in the room you're never gonna see what you did so embrace it for that reason and casting directors have told me that they find now especially the younger ones are really working with the younger directors who would prefer to only cast from tape because they don't feel comfortable in the room with the actor for the audition yeah there's a trend toward that and and it's unfortunate because they are losing the opportunity to see whether or not there's a good chemical and alchemy that would produce something very special that maybe isn't on the pager isn't expected and the opportunity for the actor to see do I really feel like I am the best person to serve will we have a good communication but because that's not happening now casting directors are there they're pushing more for it but our unions have not figured this out I know directors that are really frustrated because oftentimes roles will be cast without the director even having input especially if it's a guest star the tape will go directly to the writer producers from the casting directors office and they're the ones that are going to make the final decision anyway so the director does not get a chance for input and it's unfortunate but it is it's it's a fact of our business now and I think we all need to learn what it means to self tape whether you're gonna buy your rim your kit of your ring light and your stand on Amazon and invest a bit or find a place that you like there are plenty of them here and of them are run by actors so you'll have someone that will be a really good reader with you and it's something that's just a necessary part of the process for you to embrace now well I'm learning something that I didn't know that people went got ring lights and did all that I just worked with a guy who went to Carnegie Mellon and he actually told me and he was in I don't think he'd mind me telling you he was in when they see us he's really good John Leguizamo's son and that and he told me that at Carnegie Mellon they actually have a class as part of your their curriculum they have a class where they teach you how to do this and he does say he has a ring light and I thought he was a freak I didn't know really technology is driving the way we do our work the way we deliver our work and even the way we get a chance to refine our work because you will be the one to choose the take that you send in where the several takes and that's that's an advantage if you if you're willing to embrace it that way I'll tell you something the younger people today with their selfies and the whole ability to be free with social media sometimes are the more relaxed in doing self tapes yes because they're able to lose those inhibitions where I mean I have to I'm learning it as well that you know sort of like oh I can do this I should but I've also learned you ever really have to do a lot of preparation as well so when I print out the sizes sent to me I make two copies one to be read by the person that's gonna do it and the other one and I rewrite them so that they're big bolts that I can see it and also I found a guy who is able to you just send him your sides he can put it on the iPad right next to the camera right there and you know you make your decisions that if you can do a self tape it says if you're gonna have a constant close-up or a medium shot and so you can look that forth I and also realize okay there it is you don't have to try to what did I say that you're spending your time too much trying to memorize it and to be perfect they want to find that essence they want to see what's there what you gonna bring out and that's where your job is sometimes I think it's a about both worlds you know I think you miss out on that person-to-person contact a lot of you you do miss out on but it is if you got the willingness to keep on growing and don't go I've been in this business for 50 years I don't have to do this no it's not it's not at all you know it's about being able to always adapt to learn and grow as you stay in this game longer and possible you adapt Tim I felt like you laughed knowingly when I talked about bad auditions so I didn't know if you had something to contribute to that oh so many of them but I I think those are just stories and they're fun funny and you know maybe some other time I can tell some of those but as somebody who auditions people exactly I will say and I don't do that I'll look at self tapes but I have to meet an actor before I would put them in one of my films so that might be a way of meeting an actor or seeing an actor because they can't come in and meet and then usually I'll call that person if they've made the effort to self tape if they're creditable then I'll say come in and let's let's meet and work together but I think it's important to understand that many directors aren't doing that and so just because I do it doesn't mean that this is an extremely useful information because it actually is when you do come in and meet those codgers of us who still want to meet face to face with actors understand this when I audition any actor at any time in the process I want them to be the person that's desperately what I want and if I've already seen an actor who really works well in a role nothing makes me happier than seeing another actor who could work well in the role that's exciting for me it's a positive so to use a word that I won't use any more because it's I'll start to sound redundant but there's an optimism on the part of the quote-unquote auditor the person auditioning you when you walk in the room that you're going to solve an issue for him or her and if you can internalize that and understand that the person behind the camera or the desk or at the other end of the sofa wants to meet you that they are happy you're there they want you to succeed it takes an enormous amount of pressure off you and you must must must remind yourself of that if you have to write it down whatever you need you must remind yourself of that before going into a room so that you're not promoting this or projecting this notion that you don't like being judged or all that perfectly human detritus that we bring into the room that inhibits us from doing our best work just know the person auditioning you wants you to succeed probably even more than you do absolutely no they're rooting for you that's something I hear all the time from casting directors before we go I just kind of want to ask sort of as a as a fan slash geek you've all had such accomplished careers and done so many different things do people sort of stop you on the street and what's the one thing they really want to talk about when they're talking to you I'm gonna guess yours is a toilet club well no you have Star Trek fate depends so if they if they say Joy Luck Club I know they've got a great relationship with their mom oh I can tell so much about a person by what they recognize it is they say Star Trek then I know that they're really quite yeah you know pretty brilliant I've met some really I just had a Trekkie over for dinner the other day that we became friends they're so bright and you know I did this other movie that was very woowoo and if they mentioned that then I know what dreams may come yeah exactly so I know that they are completely and they're very extremely spiritual in a good way yeah so yeah I can tell a lot about a person by one thing I quoted the Joy Luck Club to you I actually did you the first time I met you which I'm embarrassed about very important movie to my family and when I did a play it's it's sort of like it depends upon the age of the person I'm going oh okay you're from the 70s right or whatever a lot of times I don't care that they may get it wrong they just say oh I like what I see when I see you and I still carried this is that for a long time the Asian Americans I had this one older couple come up to me and just say oh we always feel good when we see you want to screen because we know that we're not going to be embarrassed so and it really was a nice kind of a feedback because it was like you don't want to do that stereotype if you're gonna do have to do a stereotypic role it must be organic so that it is working because there are people that may come over on the plane or off the boat but it is always the truthfulness of your performances if that's transmitted then that's fine that's good it's generational for me too but it's also something that that I try to take the the pressure off the person when they're looking at me and they can't quite figure it out because I can look so many different ways and I do and I I wear wigs to auditions I wear glasses to I mean I love changing it up and I play good women and bad women and I can pretty much know how they're reacting to me I said I I've been in your living room and I might have killed somebody or allowed to save somebody and we'll we'll figure it out we'll do the do you know the tree will will trace it that way and that's some that's a nice reward for all the years and all the legwork and all the risks that you take as an actor that I don't feel pigeon-holed and I can I can rub people the wrong way for the wrong for the right reason and the right way sometimes for the wrong wrong reason but it's it's it's a nice a nice reward and that's what I want to keep doing is is stretching and finding new new things new new notes that I haven't played yet yeah I just varies I never know what just a lot of different roles and I never it just always comes out of that blue and I never know what to think a fun little story is that recently not recently about a year ago when it was announced I was doing Watchmen I would be stopped a lot by people who would say or you're gonna be Rorschach aren't you yeah and Rorschach is this proto-fascist ik character in the original Watchmen graphic novel and it certainly could have been taken as an insult great character great care wonderful character and probably because I've played a lot of people from the south and southwest and and a lot of woodsy types and he's very conservative they just imputed that but I thought to myself well you know Jackie Earle Haley played that part so brilliantly in the in the movie in this action hider movie that's a compliment because anytime I can be with Jackie who's a great guy in the same sentence that's he's an actor's actor and if I could play the same part as Jackie that's a great thing and so I started being very happy about the questions regarding whether I would play war shock which is funny because Looking Glass is really kind of the anti Rorschach if you think about it yes in a sense he is but then in a sense he's also his own sort of Rorschach mmm-hmm two sides of the same right yeah because people see themselves and he's reading their responses to their own image in the way that therapist reads a response to a Rorschach blot hmm I really hope you don't die this season I just want to say that now because the body count on that show is high and I love that character alright well I want to thank you guys so much for coming out and spending your afternoon with us we so appreciate it [Applause]

Channel: SAG-AFTRA Foundation

Views: 1,332

Rating: 5 out of 5

Keywords: SAG Foundation, SAG-AFTRA Foundation, Acting, Actors, Q&A, Interview, Tim Blake Nelson, Rosalind Chao, Sharon Lawrence, Clyde Kusatsu, Panel

Id: rtNwGOCZwrY

Length: 73min 31sec (4411 seconds)

Published: Wed Oct 30 2019