>> THE LORD OF HOSTS WILL DO BATTLE FOR US! >> HE IS REALLY A BIG MAN, A VERY BIG MAN, AND HE IS ABLE TO PAINT A BROAD CANVAS. >> I THINK THAT HE BEGAN WITH AN IMAGE OF HIMSELF AS A MAN FROM AN EARLIER TIME. THE POLITICAL INDEPENDENCE, THE RUGGED INDIVIDUALISM--HE'S ALWAYS HAD THAT. >> I THINK IT TAKES A GREAT DEAL OF STRENGTH FOR A MAN LIKE CHARLTON HESTON TO NOT BE AFRAID OF MAKING HIS CHOICES AND STICKING WITH THEM. >> HE IS ONE OF THE FEW WHO CAN DRESS IN A TOGA. HE'S ONE OF THE FEW PEOPLE WHO CAN PLAY CLASSICAL ROLES. HE'S, AS THEY SAY, A MAN FOR ALL SEASONS. >> I REMEMBER WHEN MY SON WAS 5 YEARS OLD, HE STOOD UP IN FRONT OF HIS KINDERGARTEN CLASS, AS EACH PUPIL WAS ASKED TO DO, AND TOLD WHAT HIS FATHER DID FOR A LIVING. AND HE SAID, "MY DADDY PRETENDS TO BE PEOPLE," AND I GUESS THAT'S WHAT I DO. IT'S BEEN SUGGESTED THAT I'M NOT A 20TH-CENTURY MAN, AND I SUPPOSE THAT'S TRUE. CERTAINLY MY CAREER HAS BEEN SPENT MOSTLY IN ANY CENTURY BUT THE 20TH. AND I'VE PLAYED THE GREAT PARTS OF THE GREAT FIGURES FROM HISTORY, WHICH I FIND MORE INTERESTING THAN PEOPLE TODAY. >> HE'S NOT A DINOSAUR. HE'S NOT A MAN OF THE PAST. IN SOME WAYS, HE'S AN EXTREMELY MODERN MAN. BUT HE'S HIS OWN MAN, AND THAT MAKES HIM REMARKABLE. >> NOBODY KNOWS WHY A MAN BECOMES AN ACTOR. I THINK AN IMPORTANT PART OF THAT WAS THAT I WAS RAISED AS A BOY IN A FAIRLY REMOTE PART OF MICHIGAN, AND I ESSENTIALLY WAS BY MYSELF. I WENT TO A ONE-ROOM SCHOOL WITH 13 PUPILS AND 8 GRADES. AND ASIDE FROM HUNTING AND FISHING AND TRAPPING AND CANOEING AND THE THINGS BOYS DO IN MICHIGAN, I DID A GREAT DEAL OF READING. AND LIKE ALL KIDS, I PLAYED PRETEND GAMES. ALL CHILDREN DO THAT. THEY'RE INSTINCTIVELY ACTORS, IF YOU LIKE, PERFORMERS IN THE STORIES THEY PLAY OUT. WHEN MY PARENTS DIVORCED AND MY MOTHER REMARRIED, WE MOVED TO A SUBURB OF CHICAGO. >> HE ALSO STOPPED SEEING HIS FATHER, BECAUSE HE FELT SO SELF-CONSCIOUS OF THE FACT THAT HE WAS FROM THAT KIND OF A, YOU KNOW, "DIVORCED FAMILY" BACKGROUND. >> I HAD ACCESS TO THE BEST, WHAT WAS THEN REGARDED AS THE BEST PUBLIC HIGH SCHOOL IN THE UNITED STATES, NEW TRIER HIGH SCHOOL IN WINNETKA, ILLINOIS. I CAN'T EMPHASIZE TOO MUCH HOW IMPORTANT NEW TRIER WAS TO ME, GIVEN MY SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCES AS A KIND OF A LONELY, HICK KID FROM THE WOODS WHO DIDN'T KNOW HOW TO DANCE, DIDN'T KNOW HOW TO DRIVE, DIDN'T HAVE ANY MONEY, DIDN'T KNOW HOW TO DATE GIRLS--HAD NOT A CLUE ABOUT DATING GIRLS--HAD NEVER PLAYED TEAM SPORTS, 'CAUSE IN MICHIGAN THERE WEREN'T ENOUGH KIDS TO MAKE UP A TEAM. AND THE ONLY EXTRACURRICULAR ACTIVITIES I COULD TAKE PART IN THAT I WAS EQUIPPED FOR WERE THE RIFLE TEAM AND THE CHESS CLUB. NONETHELESS, THEY DID HAVE--FOR A HIGH SCHOOL--AN EXTRAORDINARILY WELL-DEVELOPED THEATRE PROGRAM. THEY EVEN HAD A RADIO PROGRAM, OBVIOUSLY, JUST IN THE SCHOOL. >> HE WAS THE TALLEST, SKINNIEST MAN I EVER SAW IN MY LIFE. AND HE WAS WELL-KNOWN IN THE SCHOOL BECAUSE HE WAS IN EVERY PLAY. MY FIRST CONTACT WITH CHARLTON HESTON TOOK PLACE IN A CLASS AT NORTHWESTERN UNIVERSITY CALLED "FUNDAMENTALS OF THEATRE PRACTICE B-40." AND I HAD AT THAT TIME LONG, BLACK HAIR, AND A LOT OF IT. AND ALL OF A SUDDEN, I FELT MY HEAD SWING BACK, AND I REALIZED THAT THE STUDENT BEHIND ME WAS LITERALLY PULLING MY HAIR. HE CLAIMS AT THIS POINT THAT HE WAS MERELY CARESSING IT. >> I COULDN'T HAVE GONE TO NORTHWESTERN WITHOUT A SCHOLARSHIP, AND IT GAVE ME MY LIFE. IT ALSO GAVE ME MY WIFE. WHEN I CAME BACK FROM THE WAR AND MY WIFE AND I WENT TO NEW YORK, AND WHEN YOU CONSIDER THE ODDS, BOTH OF US BEGAN TO WORK FAIRLY EARLY. LYDIA GOT A BROADWAY JOB ABOUT THE SAME TIME I DID, SHE IN THE FEMALE LEAD IN "DETECTIVE STORY" IN A LONG RUN, AND I IN KATHARINE CORNELL'S PRODUCTION OF "ANTONY AND CLEOPATRA," WHICH WAS AN IDEAL FIRST EXPERIENCE FOR AN ACTOR. AND, OF COURSE, TO START IN SHAKESPEARE IS TO START AT THE TOP. >> I'D NEVER SEEN HIM ACT. I KNEW HIS WIFE WAS A SUPERB ACTOR, BECAUSE SHE WAS ONE OF THE LEADING LIGHTS ON BROADWAY AT THE TIME. I WAS A YOUNG PHYSICIAN THEN. I WAS ON THE STAFF AT THE NEW YORK HOSPITAL. BUT WHAT MADE US FRIENDS RIGHT AWAY, BESIDES OUR WIVES, WHO IMMEDIATELY BECAME FRIENDS-- THERE WAS SOMETHING ABOUT HIM THAT MADE HIM ESPECIALLY LIKABLE TO ME. >> YOU WOULDN'T THINK OF IT NOW, BUT IN MANY WAYS, HE IS VERY MUCH A VERY--VERY INSULAR PERSON WHEN IT COMES TO TALKING ABOUT PERSONAL ISSUES. HE DOESN'T LIKE TO OPEN UP. HE DOESN'T LIKE TO SHOW HIS EMOTION. >> HE WASN'T A HAIL-FELLOW-WELL-MET. HE DIDN'T HAVE A LOT OF PALS. BUT HE WAS A SERIOUS PERSON. HE WAS A THOUGHTFUL MAN. HE WAS SOMEBODY THAT YOU COULD TALK TO ABOUT IMPORTANT MATTERS, OR ABOUT LITERATURE, OR ABOUT THE ARTS, OR WITH WHOM YOU COULD PLAY CHESS. >> I THINK IT WAS HIS FIRST ROLE ON BROADWAY, AND IT WAS CALLED "DESIGN FOR A STAINED GLASS WINDOW." AND I HAD THE LEAD IN IT, AND THIS YOUNG MAN, VERY TALL, HANDSOME YOUNG MAN CAME TO DO A LOVER. WE ONLY RAN, OH, I'D SAY, 5 OR 6 DAYS, PERFORMANCES. >> WHEN I FIRST MET CHUCK HESTON, I HAD NO IDEA THAT HE WAS A GREAT ACTOR. WE DIDN'T EVEN OWN A TELEVISION SET IN THOSE DAYS. >> THE BEST THING THAT HAPPENED TO ME WAS LIVE TELEVISION. I CANNOT IMAGINE ANOTHER DEVELOPMENT THAT WAS SO SIGNIFICANT TO ACTORS AS LIVE T.V. WHEN LIVE T.V. BEGAN IN THE LATE '40'S, EVERYONE IN THE MOVIE INDUSTRY WAS UNDER EXCLUSIVE CONTRACT TO ONE STUDIO OR ANOTHER--EVERYONE-- ACTORS, DESIGNERS, DIRECTORS, PRODUCERS, WRITERS, CAMERAMEN--AND THAT MEANT THAT THEY COULDN'T TAKE PART IN TELEVISION, BECAUSE THE STUDIOS WOULDN'T LET THEM. ON THE OTHER HAND, PEOPLE OF ANY REPUTATION IN THE LIVE THEATER IN NEW YORK WERE DISINCLINED TO DO TELEVISION BECAUSE IT WAS CONSIDERED SORT OF TACKY AND IT DIDN'T PAY VERY MUCH. SO THAT LEFT THIS WHOLE NEW MEDIUM TO BE INVENTED BY A GROUP OF UNEMPLOYED 25-YEAR-OLDS, OF WHICH I WAS ONE. WE GOT TO INVENT THE MEDIUM. NOBODY KNEW ANYTHING ABOUT IT. AND IN THE SPACE OF 15 MONTHS, AS A FREELANCE ACTOR, I GOT TO PLAY "MACBETH," "TAMING OF THE SHREW," "WUTHERING HEIGHTS," "OF HUMAN BONDAGE." IT MEANT THAT WHEN WE WENT ON TO FILMS, AS JACK LEMMON AND WALTER AND GEORGE C. SCOTT AND SO ON AND SO ON DID, WE ALREADY HAD SOMETHING OF A FOLLOWING, WHICH WAS UNHEARD OF IN FILMS. >> IN 1950, I WAS PUBLICITY DIRECTOR FOR AN INDEPENDENT PRODUCTION COMPANY CALLED HAL WALLIS PRODUCTIONS. WE SIGNED A YOUNG ACTOR OUT OF NEW YORK NAMED CHARLTON HESTON, AND I WAS ASSIGNED THE JOB OF GOING TO THE AIRPORT TO MEET HIM AND WELCOME HIM IN. HE WAS WEARING A BLUE SUIT, A VERY TIRED BLUE SUIT, WHICH I GUESS WAS HIS ONLY SINCERE SUIT AT THE TIME, AND THE PANTS WERE A LITTLE THIN, AND I WAS A LITTLE HESITANT ABOUT INVITING HIM TO COME TO LUNCH WITH ME AT ROMANOFF'S. NONETHELESS, WE DID. WE SAT DOWN. WE SAW SPENCER TRACY ACROSS THE ROOM EATING STRAWBERRIES, AND CHUCK MARVELED. "THIS MUST BE HEAVEN," HE SAID. >> MY FIRST FILM WAS WHAT WOULD NOW BE A MOVIE OF THE WEEK ON TELEVISION. IT WAS ACTUALLY NOT BAD. >> I WAS IMPRESSED WITH THE ACTING, BUT NOT WITH THE FILM. "DARK CITY," IT WAS CALLED. WE SAW IT IN ITS OPENING IN NEW YORK, WHICH WAS AT THE BROOKLYN NAVY YARD. I GUESS THEY DECIDED THEY DIDN'T WANT TO SHOW IT IN A BETTER THEATER THAN THAT. >> I WOULD GUESS THAT THE TURNING POINT IN CHUCK'S CAREER HAPPENED VERY, VERY QUICKLY. HE WAS SEEN BY C. B.. DeMILLE, WHO WAS ALSO ON THE PARAMOUNT LOT, AND DeMILLE WAS IN THE PROCESS OF PUTTING TOGETHER HIS CIRCUS PICTURE, "THE GREATEST SHOW ON EARTH." >> MY SECOND FILM WAS, OF COURSE, FOR DeMILLE, THE CIRCUS PICTURE, WHICH WON THE ACADEMY AWARD, AND, I THINK, DESERVED IT. >> C. B. DeMILLE SAW IN CHUCK THE POTENTIAL OF A VERY EXCITING AND A VERY ACTIVE, DYNAMIC LEADING MAN. >> IF YOU PLAY ONLY THE BIG CITIES, YOU'LL CUT THE HEART RIGHT OUT OF THIS SHOW. [AUDIENCE GASPS] >> BOY, LOOK AT THAT GUY. >> BUT UNDER THE BIG TOP, ONE PERFORMER'S JUST LIKE ANOTHER TO ME. >> YOU'VE GOT NOTHING BUT SAWDUST IN YOUR VEINS. >> I'VE SCRAPED TOO MANY OF YOU KINKERS UP FROM THE SAWDUST. >> IT PROBABLY IS HIS BEST PICTURE. HE CAUGHT THE COLOR, THE FEEL OF THE CIRCUS IN A WAY THAT I THINK NO OTHER DIRECTOR COULD HAVE DONE. AND OF COURSE, FOR ME TO STAR IN THE FILM, ESPECIALLY IN SUCH DISTINGUISHED COMPANY AS JIMMY STEWART, WHO PLAYED THE CLOWN-- >> HEY BRAD, THIS MIGHT HELP. >> TOO SMALL. [FANFARE PLAYS] >> I CAME INTO FILM AT AN HISTORIC TURNING POINT. I WASN'T THE FIRST--MARLON WAS THE FIRST--BUT I WAS THEN THE SECOND ACTOR TO HAVE A NON-EXCLUSIVE CONTRACT. HAL WALLIS GAVE THAT TO ME, AND I COULD DO PLAYS. I COULD GO BACK AND DO TELEVISION, WHICH I DID--UNHEARD OF FOR MOVIE ACTORS AT THE TIME--AND I COULD DO FILMS FOR OTHER STUDIOS, WHICH I DID. >> MY AGENCY CALLED AND SAID, "THERE'S SOMETHING GOING ON IN HOLLYWOOD WITH A YOUNG MAN NAMED CHARLTON HESTON THAT YOU'D BE AWFULLY RIGHT FOR. WOULD YOU LIKE US TO PRESENT YOU FOR IT?" AND I SAID, "WELL, OF COURSE." AND, "WHAT IS IT?" AND THEY SAID, "WELL, IT'S ABOUT THE 10 COMMANDMENTS. HE'S PLAYING MOSES, AND YOU WOULD BE HIS MOTHER." AND I THOUGHT, "WAIT A MINUTE. I START OUT AS HIS WIFE AND WIND UP AS HIS MOTHER?" >> THE LORD MOSES, PRINCE OF EGYPT, SON OF THE PHARAOH'S SISTER, BELOVED OF THE NILE GOD-- >> IF YOU CAN'T MAKE A CAREER OUT OF 2 DeMILLE PICTURES, YOU'D BETTER TURN IN YOUR SUIT. [FANFARE PLAYS] >> HE HAD A GRAND VOICE AND A GRAND FIGURE. >> MOSES IS NOT EGYPTIAN. HE'S HEBREW, THE SON OF SLAVES. [FANFARE PLAYS] >> HEAR, O ISRAEL, REMEMBER THIS DAY WHEN THE STRONG HAND OF THE LORD LEADS YOU OUT OF BONDAGE. >> THE LORD IS OUR GOD! THE LORD IS ONE! [CHEERING] [TRIUMPHANT MUSIC PLAYS] >> BEHOLD HIS MIGHTY HAND! [DRAMATIC MUSIC PLAYS] >> HE HAD A VERY HARD ROLE TO PLAY IN "THE 10 COMMANDMENTS," BECAUSE DeMILLE--HE HAD PUT SUCH RESTRICTIONS ON CHUCK THAT--I MEAN, CHUCK COULDN'T SMOKE IN PUBLIC. BECAUSE, AFTER ALL, HE WAS PLAYING MOSES. >> I FOUND DeMILLE AN EXTRAORDINARY MAN TO WORK FOR. HE WAS, OF COURSE, ONE OF THE GUYS THAT INVENTED THE MOVIES, ALONG WITH GRIFFITH AND VON STROHEIM. "THE 10 COMMANDMENTS" WAS, OF COURSE, AN ENORMOUS OPPORTUNITY FOR ME. THE EXPERIENCE I'VE HAD IN EPIC FILMS IS, OF COURSE, VERY SPECIAL, NOT LEAST BECAUSE THEY CAN'T MAKE EPICS ANYMORE. THEY'RE TOO EXPENSIVE. >> YOU THINK OF CHUCK IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, MOSES PARTING THE RED SEA OR BEN-HUR. I FOUND HIM TO BE SO--WHAT'S THE WORD-- DOWN TO EARTH IN HIS ALMOST BOYISH ENTHUSIASM AT WORKING WITH THE GREAT MASTER, ORSON WELLES. AND WE DIDN'T KNOW WHO WAS GOING TO BE ON THE SET THE NEXT DAY AS A CAMEO PERFORMER. I MEAN, IT WAS JOSEPH COTTEN-- >> THAT'S WHAT YOU THINK. >> AND OF COURSE, MARLENA. MARLENA WASN'T EVEN IN THE ORIGINAL SCRIPT. >> WE'RE CLOSED. >> ORSON WELLES WAS THE MOST TALENTED MAN I EVER MET IN FILM. HE WAS THE QUINTESSENCE OF CREATIVE CAPACITY. "TOUCH OF EVIL" IS NOT A GREAT MOVIE. I THINK CAHIERS DU CINEMA PUT IT BEST WHEN THEY SAID, "'TOUCH OF EVIL' IS THE GREATEST B-MOVIE EVER MADE." >> YOU FOUND THE DYNAMITE IN THIS BOX? >> DYNAMITE? >> IN ANY FREE COUNTRY, A POLICEMAN IS SUPPOSED TO ENFORCE THE LAW, AND THE LAW PROTECTS THE GUILTY AS WELL AS THE INNOCENT. >> OUR JOB IS TOUGH ENOUGH. >> IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE. IT HAS TO BE TOUGH. A POLICEMAN'S JOB IS ONLY EASY IN A POLICE STATE. THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT, CAPTAIN. WHO IS THE BOSS, THE COP OR THE LAW? >> I LIKE TO FEEL THAT IT'S MY JOB AS AN ACTOR TO PLEASE THE DIRECTOR, BUT ORSON MADE THAT A COLLABORATIVE UNDERTAKING. MUCH OF FILM ACTING CONSISTS OF GOING UP AND DOWN STAIRS AND GETTING IN AND OUT OF CARS OR ON OR OFF HORSES, DEPENDING ON THE FILM. AND IF YOU HAVE A GREAT PART--A GREAT PART--THERE ARE PROBABLY ONLY 3 GREAT SCENES IN THE PART. BUT ORSON SOMEHOW WAS ABLE TO PERSUADE YOU THAT WHATEVER SETUP YOU WERE DOING JUST HAPPENED TO BE THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF YOUR ROLE, INDEED, PERHAPS, OF THE WHOLE FILM. EVERY DAY I WORKED IN THE PICTURE WAS INTERESTING. FILMMAKING IS NOT FUN. IT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FUN. PEOPLE IMAGINE--THEY SAY, "OH, GOSH, IT MUST HAVE BEEN MARVELOUS TO HAVE A YEAR IN ROME SHOOTING 'BEN-HUR' OR A YEAR AND 7 MONTHS IN SPAIN SHOOTING 'EL CID'." YOU'RE WORKING 12, 13, 14-HOUR DAYS IN OFTEN MISERABLE CONDITIONS, NEVER QUITE GETTING IT AS GOOD AS YOU WANT. ALWAYS TRYING, ALWAYS FALLING A LITTLE SHORT, NEVER PERFECT. AND YOU MUST--YOU DO THAT. THAT'S WHAT YOU DO FOR A LIVING, BUT IT'S NOT FUN. ORSON MADE IT FUN. >> WELL, CAPTAIN, I'M AFRAID THIS IS FINALLY SOMETHING YOU CAN'T TALK YOUR WAY OUT OF. >> YOU WANT TO BET? >> I BELIEVE THAT CHUCK CHOOSES ROLES THAT EXEMPLIFY WHAT HE BELIEVES INSIDE. HIS INTEGRITY DOMINATED HIS CHOICES. HE WOULD TAKE THAT ROLE WITHOUT A THOUGHT OF HOW HE LOOKED OR WHETHER IT WAS GOING TO BE A BOX-OFFICE HIT. >> MY PART WAS ABOUT THE 5TH PART, REALLY. AND I SAID TO MY AGENT, "YOU KNOW, I KNOW THIS IS A GOOD PIECE AND IT'S A MAJOR DIRECTOR, BUT I'M A LITTLE TIRED, AND I THINK I'LL PASS ON THIS." HE SAID, "YOU'RE OUT OF YOUR MIND." HE SAID, "THIS IS--ACTORS TAKE PARTS FOR WYLER WITHOUT EVEN READING THE SCRIPT. DO THE PICTURE." ["WESTERN" FILM MUSIC PLAYS] >> I'M STEVE LEECH, FOREMAN AT LADDER RANCH. >> THANK YOU, THAT'S VERY KIND. YOU KNOW, I WAS BEGINNING TO THINK I WAS IN THE WRONG TOWN. >> I DON'T KNOW AS I'D WEAR THAT HAT TOO LONG AROUND HERE, MR. McKAY. >> OH? WHY NOT? >> WELL, ONE OF THESE WILD COWBOYS MIGHT TAKE IT INTO HIS HEAD TO SHOOT IT OFF YOU. >> CHUCK'S PART WAS TO DISLIKE ME AT FIRST SIGHT, AND TO DO EVERYTHING HE COULD TO MAKE LIFE MISERABLE FOR ME. FIRST OF ALL, IN HIS MIND, WE WERE RIVALS FOR THE SAME GIRL, CARROLL BAKER, AND BADGERED ME AND GOADED ME ON, TRIED TO GET ME TO LIVE UP TO HIS IDEA OF THE MACHO CODE OF THE OLD WEST. IN THOSE DAYS, A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO WORKED FOR WILLIE WYLER ENDED UP WITH OSCARS. HE WAS PROBABLY THE LEADING DIRECTOR OF OSCAR WINNERS IN HOLLYWOOD AT THAT TIME. >> WE HAD THIS SCENE WHERE WE WERE TO HAVE A FIERCE FIGHT, AND IT WAS TO END UP IN A KISS. WE HAVE THIS FIGHT, AND HE MAKES ADVANCES TOWARD ME AND I HIT HIM WITH MY WHIP, MY RIDING CROP. AND THEN HE IS SUPPOSED TO TAKE THE RIDING CROP OUT OF MY HAND AND PUT MY ARMS BEHIND MY BACK AND KISS ME. IT WAS A VERY EXCITING MOMENT. BUT WYLER KEPT SAYING, "HIT HIM HARDER, HIT HIM HARDER!" [WHIP CRACKS] NOW, THIS IS WHAT I JUST LEARNED. HE WENT TO CHUCK AND HE SAID TO HIM, "DON'T LET HER MOVE. DON'T LET HER HIT YOU." AND HE HAD SAID TO ME, "I WANT YOU TO HIT HIM WITH ALL YOUR MIGHT." >> SIC YOUR BRIDEGROOM ON ME? >> SO THAT HE GOT THIS ENORMOUS STRUGGLE, NOT ONLY BETWEEN THE CHARACTERS, BUT BETWEEN THE ACTORS, WHO'D BEEN GIVEN DIABOLICALLY OPPOSITE DIRECTIONS. >> FINALLY CAME THE MOMENT WHEN WE WENT OUT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT ON THE DESERT AND FOUGHT IT OUT WITH OUR FISTS FOR A COUPLE OF HOURS. AND WE POUNDED THE DAYLIGHTS OUT OF EACH OTHER UNTIL WE COULD HARDLY STAND AND WE WERE COMPLETELY DONE IN. AND NEITHER ONE WOULD GIVE IN. SO FINALLY, SOMEBODY SAID--I FORGET WHETHER IT WAS CHUCK OR ME--"WELL, HAVE YOU HAD ENOUGH?" AND THE OTHER FELLOW SAID, "YEAH, I GUESS SO." AND AS WE STAGGERED TO OUR FEET, I THINK I HAD THE LINE, "WELL, NOW, WHAT DID WE PROVE?" SO THIS WAS REALLY THE THEME OF THE PICTURE IN A WAY. IT WAS A KIND OF A PACIFIST WESTERN. >> AND IT WAS A GOOD PICTURE, AND I THINK THAT'S WHY WILLIE, WHEN HE DECIDED TO DO "BEN-HUR," CAST ME IN "BEN-HUR." [DRAMATIC MUSIC PLAYS] [CHEERING] >> THE STORY OF JUDAH BEN-HUR, THE PRINCE WHO BECAME A SLAVE, AND DARED THE EVIL MIGHT OF A CONQUEROR. >> I TELL YOU, THE DAY ROME FALLS, THERE WILL BE A SHOUT OF FREEDOM SUCH AS THE WORLD HAS NEVER HEARD BEFORE. >> WELL, ACTUALLY, "BEN-HUR" WAS A RELATIVELY EASY PERFORMANCE FOR HIM. HE MORE OR LESS PLAYED HIMSELF, IF HE WERE A FIRST-CENTURY JEWISH PRINCE, YOU KNOW. I THINK LEARNING TO DRIVE THE CHARIOT WAS REALLY A CHALLENGE FOR HIM. WHEN HE WAS PRACTICING, LEARNING HOW TO HANDLE 4 HORSES BEHIND A CHARIOT--WHICH IS SOMETHING OF A TRICK, I WANT TO TELL YOU-- AND HE DID MOST OF THAT HIMSELF. AND HE SAID TO YAK CANUT, WHO WAS HELPING HIM LEARN IT, "BUT WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THERE ARE 10 OTHER TEAMS, AND WE'RE RACING AROUND THIS CORNER?" AND YAK SAID, "OH, DON'T WORRY, CHUCK," HE SAID. "YOU JUST STAY IN THE CHARIOT. YOU'RE GOING TO WIN THE RACE, I GUARANTEE YOU." [CROWD CHEERS] [FANFARE MUSIC PLAYS] >> AT THE PANTAGES THEATRE, IT'S HOLLYWOOD'S BIG NIGHT, THE 32ND ANNUAL OSCAR AWARDS, WITH A DAZZLING CROWD OF FILMDOM'S GREAT NAMES PACKING THE HOUSE, AND THE ATTENTION OF THE NATION FOCUSED ON THE CEREMONIES. SUSAN HAYWARD ANNOUNCES THE AWARD FOR BEST ACTOR. >> PAUL MUNI, "THE LAST ANGRY MAN," AND JAMES STEWART, "ANATOMY OF A MURDER." CHARLTON HESTON, "BEN-HUR"! [CHEERS AND APPLAUSE] >> LYDIA WAS THE STRONG RIGHT ARM AND HAS BEEN THROUGH HIS ENTIRE CAREER. LYDIA WAS REALLY THE STAR IN THE FAMILY. AND THEN WHEN CHUCK BEGAN TO MAKE A NAME FOR HIMSELF AS A BIG STAR, LYDIA DECIDED THAT SHE WOULD LIKE ANOTHER CAREER. >> HE ALWAYS TOOK US WITH HIM WHENEVER IT WAS POSSIBLE. AND ALL OF SUDDEN, I REALIZED THAT I WASN'T ACTING ANYMORE. AND IT WAS NOT A DISTRESS TO ME. I FOUND THAT I HAD FALLEN IN LOVE WITH PHOTOGRAPHY. IT WAS A TURNING POINT IN MY LIFE, AND I HAVE ENJOYED PHOTOGRAPHING CHUCK IN VARIOUS FILMS AND ON LOCATION, AND I THINK I HAVE A REALLY GOOD RECORD OF A MAN BEING A FATHER. >> THE FACT THAT HIS PARENTS WERE DIVORCED AT A VERY IMPRESSIONABLE AGE SCARRED HIM TERRIBLY. AND I THINK HE MUST HAVE MADE SOME KIND OF A PACT INTERNALLY AT SOME POINT TO CHANGE IT WHEN HIS TIME CAME AROUND. HE WAS SUCH A WONDERFULLY INVOLVED FATHER. >> I WAS IMPRESSED WITH HOW THIS MAN WAS ABLE TO FEEL AND EXPRESS GREAT AFFECTION AND EVEN TENDERNESS TOWARD THE FATHER WHOM HIS MOTHER ALWAYS HAD REJECTED. >> THE COUNTRY JUST NEXT TO ST. HELEN, WHERE MY GRANDFATHER BASICALLY GREW UP, WAS ALWAYS VERY SPECIAL TO MY FATHER BECAUSE HE SPENT HIS EARLIEST, VERY FAMILIAR YEARS IN THOSE WOODS PLAYING. AND HE KNEW ALL THE ROCKS AND THE RIVERS AND HE KNEW ALL THE TREES. AND SO IT WAS SO APPROPRIATE, WHEN MY GRANDPA RUSS, DIED THAT FRASER AND MY FATHER TOOK HIM TO THOSE WOODS AND FOUND THE PERFECT SPOT TO BURY HIM. IT WAS A COUNTRY THAT HE KNEW AND LOVED. >> SOMEONE ASKED ME--THEY SAID, "ARE YOU DRAWN TO PLAYING MEN WHO FAIL AT WHAT THEY TRY TO DO?" AND I CAN'T DENY IT, WHEN YOU LOOK AT SOME OF THE 60-ODD FILMS I'VE MADE, I'VE FAILED IN A LOT OF THEM. THE FALL OF THE GREAT MAN, MARC ANTONY, IN "ANTONY AND CLEOPATRA," AND GENERAL GORDON, IN "KHARTOUM." >> CHUCK HAS ABSOLUTELY NO INTEREST IN THE CONVENTIONAL MOVIE HERO OR THE CONVENTIONAL MOVIE REQUIREMENTS. AS A MATTER OF FACT, I THINK CHUCK PROBABLY ENJOYS PLAYING CHARACTER MORE THAN HE DOES PLAYING STRAIGHT. AND LOOK AT THE ROLES THAT HE'S DONE--MICHELANGELO, JACKSON, MOSES. HE SHIES AWAY FROM A STRAIGHT, EVERYDAY HERO. >> WELL, I THINK IF SOMEONE SAID CHUCK WAS A 19TH-CENTURY FIGURE, OR EVEN EARLIER, IT PROBABLY HAS SOMETHING TO DO WITH A WORK ETHIC, A CODE OF HONOR, A CODE OF DECENT BEHAVIOR THAT A MAN LIKE CHUCK HAS ADHERED TO ALL OF HIS LIFE. SOMETIMES I FEEL THAT WAY MYSELF. I FEEL LIKE I MISSED MY CENTURY. I MIGHT HAVE BEEN SOME KIND OF A CIVIL WAR FIGURE. I WISH I COULD HAVE KNOWN ABE LINCOLN. AND I THINK MAYBE CHUCK AND I HAVE THAT IN COMMON. >> I DON'T REALLY THINK THAT THERE IS ONE PARTICULAR CHARACTER THAT HE HAS PLAYED THAT IS NOT HIM. HE MADE JUDAH BEN-HUR JUDAH BEN-HUR. HE MADE EL CID THE CID. WHATEVER HE-- EMOTION, PASSION, MORAL STANDING--WHATEVER IT WAS THAT HE BREATHED INTO THOSE CHARACTERS WAS HIMSELF. >> DO YOU SWEAR THAT YOU HAD NO PART BY WAY OF DESIGN IN KING SANCHO'S DEATH? SWEAR IT! IF YOU ARE FORSWORN, MAY YOU DIE SUCH A DEATH AS YOUR BROTHER DID, STRUCK FROM BEHIND BY THE HAND OF A TRAITOR! >> THE MAN YOU CHOSE TO LOVE COULD DO ONLY WHAT I DID. >> WHY DID YOU COME, RODRIGO? DID YOU THINK THE WOMAN YOU CHOSE TO LOVE COULD DO LESS THAN YOU? >> BUT MY LOVE WON'T DIE. >> KILL IT. >> YOU KILL IT! >> OPEN THE GATE! >> NOW, IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY FOLLOW THAT HE WOULD ENJOY BEING A TRAGIC FIGURE OR SOME SUCH THING AS THAT, BUT HE HAS IT IN HIM TO UNDERSTAND THAT, THE IDEA OF A TRAGIC LOSS OR OF MAKING AN ULTIMATE SACRIFICE, OF ENDURING GREAT PAIN OR SUFFERING. CHUCK IS FINE AT A PARTY. HE'S ENJOYING HIMSELF, BUT NOT TO SHOW OFF THE GLITTER AND THE GLAMOUR. TO HIM, THAT'S SOMETHING YOU HAVE TO DO, BUT IT HASN'T MADE HIM A RECLUSE. HE'S ALWAYS BEEN A PERSON WHO LIKED COMPANIONSHIP, WHO ENJOYS HIS TENNIS BUDDIES, WHO TELLS JOKES AND LAUGHS AT THOSE OF OTHERS. AND HE HAS A STRONG SOCIAL CONSCIENCE. HE'S NOT THE KIND OF RUGGED INDIVIDUALIST OF THE REACTIONARY VARIETY, EVEN THOUGH HE HAS SOMETIMES, TO MY REGRET, SUPPORTED SOME PRETTY REACTIONARY CHARACTERS BECAUSE HE LIKES THEM. >> CHUCK DID A VERY, VERY FINE JOB FOR THE SCREEN ACTORS GUILD. I THINK IN TERMS OF LONGEVITY, HE SERVED LONGER THAN ANYONE, WITH THE POSSIBLE EXCEPTION OF RONNIE REAGAN. >> I HAD MADE A FILM CALLED "THE HARLOW," AND I WAS IN A DISPUTE WITH THE PRODUCER OF THAT FILM, AND HE HAD DECIDED THAT HE WAS GOING TO MAKE ME KNUCKLE UNDER AND DO ANOTHER FILM FOR HIM. AND ONE OF THE WAYS HE WAS GOING TO MAKE ME KNUCKLE UNDER WAS BY NOT PAYING ME. SO I CALLED CHUCK, AND HE STOPPED BY MY HOUSE THAT VERY MORNING THAT I CALLED HIM. AND I TOLD HIM THE STORY, AND HE SAID, "HEY, THAT DOESN'T EXIST. ACCORDING TO THE SCREEN ACTORS GUILD CONTRACT, NO PRODUCER CAN DO THAT TO YOU. YOU FINISHED THE WORK. YOU DESERVE YOUR SALARY, AND I'M GOING TO SEE TO IT THAT YOU GET IT." AND BY GOD, I HAD IT 2 DAYS LATER, IN FULL. >> IT'S VERY HARD TO RECONCILE SOME OF CHUCK'S POSITIONS TODAY WITH SOME OF THE THINGS THAT HE DID IN THE PAST. I DON'T THINK--ACTUALLY, I DON'T THINK THAT HE'S CHANGED. I THINK CIRCUMSTANCES MAY HAVE CHANGED AROUND HIM, BUT I THINK BASICALLY, HE STILL BELIEVES IN RIGHT, IN GOOD, IN THE GREATEST GOOD FOR THE GREATEST NUMBER OF PEOPLE. >> CHUCK AND I ARE GOOD FRIENDS. WE HAVE BEEN FOR A LONG TIME. WE HAVE A LOT IN COMMON. WE BOTH HAD WORKED FOR THE GREAT KATHARINE CORNELL ON THE STAGE AT ONE TIME. CHUCK HAS DONE SO MUCH FOR THE CULTURAL LIFE OF THE COUNTRY AND FOR OUR TOWN OF LOS ANGELES--NOT ONLY PRESIDENT OF THE SCREEN ACTORS GUILD, BUT PRESIDENT OF THE LOS ANGELES MUSIC CENTER, OF THE AMERICAN FILM INSTITUTE, A MEMBER OF THE NATIONAL ENDOWMENT FOR THE ARTS, AND I'VE BEEN INTERESTED IN THOSE THINGS. THERE ARE THINGS WE HAVEN'T HAD IN COMMON. AS FAR AS I KNOW, WE NEVER SUPPORTED THE SAME PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE. CHUCK DOES THESE SPOTS ON TELEVISION FOR THE NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION. I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY HE DOES THAT. ON THE OTHER HAND, I'M A CARD-CARRYING MEMBER OF THE A.C.L.U., AND I'M SURE CHUCK DOESN'T UNDERSTAND THAT VERY WELL. >> SELMA SPRANG OVERNIGHT FROM AN OBSCURE SOUTHERN TOWN TO THE FRONT PAGES OF WORLD NEWSPAPERS-- [SINGING "WE SHALL OVERCOME"] >> ALTHOUGH I SUPPOSE SOME PEOPLE THINK OF HIM AS AN EXTREME CONSERVATIVE REPUBLICAN, LET US NOT FORGET THAT CHUCK WENT SOUTH AND MARCHED DURING THE CIVIL RIGHTS MOVEMENT, AND MARCHED ON SELMA. >> MANY PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE THAT IN THE SUMMER OF 1963, DURING THE FAMOUS WASHINGTON MARCH, WHEN MARTIN LUTHER KING GAVE HIS ULTIMATE SPEECH, "I HAD A DREAM," CHUCK HESTON WAS STANDING 20 FEET FROM HIM. HE HAD LED THE ENTIRE HOLLYWOOD DELEGATION TO THAT HAPPENING. >> I THINK OF THE MANY WONDERFUL THINGS THAT MY GRANDMOTHER GAVE TO MY FATHER WAS A STRONG SENSE OF RESPECT, OF BELIEF IN WHAT YOU'RE DOING. >> CHUCK'S ADMIRATION FOR A MAVERICK DIRECTOR NAMED SAM PECKINPAH IS VERY INDICATIVE OF HOW HE OPERATES. SAM WAS IDIOSYNCRATIC BEYOND BELIEF, AND YET CHUCK SENSED IN HIM A GREAT TALENT AS A DIRECTOR. >> "MAJOR DUNDEE" WAS SAM PECKINPAH'S FIRST MAJOR STUDIO FILM, AND I'D MAKE IT FOR HIM AGAIN. IT'S A FLAWED FILM. >> BUT IT HAD SOME MARVELOUS STUFF IN IT. >> IF I CALL YOU ONE MORE TIME, YOU'RE COURT-MARTIALED! >> WHY DON'T YOU FIND A HORSE AND MOUNT UP, LIEUTENANT GRAHAM? YOU DON'T SEEM TO BE DOING VERY WELL ON FOOT. CAPTAIN TYREEN, DOES THE PROSPECT OF SERVING UNDER YOUR COUNTRY'S FLAG ONCE AGAIN SEEM MORE ATTRACTIVE THAN DRAGGING ITS CHAINS IN THIS PRISON? >> I WOULD RATHER HANG THAN SERVE. [WHISTLING "DIXIE"] >> I SAID WE WOULD SERVE IN THIS COMMAND AND WE WILL, SIR! BUT ONLY UNTIL WE HAVE CAUGHT THE APACHE. >> AND THEN, MAJOR, I AM GOING TO KILL YOU. >> ARE YOU, BEN? >> "MAJOR DUNDEE" STARTED TO CREEP UP OVER BUDGET. I HAD TO GO DOWN TO VISIT HIM ON ANOTHER PROJECT THAT WE WERE DOING TOGETHER. THE STUDIO WAS ABOUT TO SHUT THE PRODUCTION DOWN. CHUCK WAS ON THE PHONE, AND HE SAID, "TELL YOU WHAT. LET SAM DO HIS EXTRA 10 DAYS, FINISH THE PICTURE, DO THE EXTRA 10 DAYS, AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY ME THE LAST INSTALLMENT OF MY SALARY." AND I SAID TO CHUCK, "ARE YOU CRAZY? YOU'RE GOING TO GIVE UP YOUR SALARY SO THAT THEY CAN FINISH THE PICTURE? THEY'RE GOING TO FINISH IT ANYHOW." HE SAID, "OH, THEY'LL NEVER TAKE ME UP ON IT." ABOUT 2 HOURS LATER, HE GOT A CALL FROM HIS AGENT, HERMAN CITRON. HE SAID, "YOU SILLY BASTARD, WHAT HAVE YOU DONE? I JUST GOT A CALL FROM THE STUDIO. THEY'RE NOT GOING TO PAY YOU YOUR LAST INSTALLMENT." >> I LIKE TO FEEL THAT I WAS IN THE FIRST SPACE OPERA, "PLANET OF THE APES." I REMEMBER ARTHUR JACOBS. HE HAD NO SCRIPT. HE HAD THE RIGHTS TO AN OBSCURE FRENCH NOVEL ABOUT AN ASTRONAUT STRANDED ON A PLANET INHABITED BY INTELLIGENT MONKEYS OF VARIOUS SPECIES. ARTHUR WOULD CALL AND SAY, "WELL, WE'VE GOT IT AT FOX NOW AGAIN." AND I'D SAY, "WELL, DIDN'T THEY TURN IT DOWN?" HE SAID, "YEAH, BUT THAT'S NEW PEOPLE THERE NOW, NEW PEOPLE. WE'RE GOING TO RUN IT BY THEM AGAIN." AND HE--I KNOW IT WAS AT EVERY STUDIO, AND THEY ALL SAID, "HEY, TALKING MONKEYS? ROCKET SHIPS? BUCK ROGERS? MING THE MERCILESS? COME ON, GET OUT OF HERE. YOU'RE CRAZY." BUT THE TIME WAS RIGHT FOR IT, AND WE MADE IT. [HORN BLOWS] >> I NEVER MET AN APE I DIDN'T LIKE. >> LOOK, IT'S A MAN! [BOY APE SCREAMS] >> IN HEAVEN'S NAME, GET RID OF THAT CREATURE! >> "BEWARE THE BEAST MAN, FOR HE IS THE DEVIL'S PAWN. ALONE AMONG GOD'S PRIMATES, HE KILLS FOR SPORT, OR LUST, OR GREED." >> YOUR BREED MADE A DESERT OF IT AGES AGO. >> IT STILL DOESN'T GIVE ME THE WHY. A PLANET WHERE APES EVOLVED FROM MEN? THERE'S GOT TO BE AN ANSWER. >> DON'T LOOK FOR IT, TAYLOR. YOU MAY NOT LIKE WHAT YOU FIND. >> CHUCK WAS ALWAYS AWARE THAT SOME OF THE DECISIONS THAT HE MADE ABOUT WHICH PICTURES TO APPEAR IN WERE NOT NECESSARILY GOING TO BE BOX-OFFICE BONANZAS. WE DID, I THINK, 7 OR 8 PICTURES TOGETHER, WHICH IS PRETTY MUCH OF A RECORD IN HOLLYWOOD. WHY HE AND I ENJOYED WORKING TOGETHER WAS THAT WE WERE NOT REALLY PRESSED TO MAKE A PICTURE THAT WAS GOING TO GROSS A MILLION DOLLARS. A TYPICAL EXAMPLE IS "WAR LORD." "WAR LORD" WAS A NEW YORK PLAY CALLED "THE LOVERS," WHICH RAN, I THINK, FOR A FAST NIGHT AND A HALF. IT WAS A DEPICTION OF MEDIEVAL HISTORY, WHICH IS NOT YOUR EVERYDAY, POPULAR, GO-TO-THE-MOVIES IDEA. CHUCK AND I DID A PICTURE TOGETHER CALLED "NUMBER ONE," WHICH WAS INSPIRED BY A PHOTOGRAPH THAT CHUCK SAW IN SPORTS ILLUSTRATED OF A QUARTERBACK--I THINK IT WAS Y. A. TITTLE--WHO AT THE END OF HIS CAREER, WAS BEATEN BADLY IN A GAME AND WAS DOWN ON HIS KNEES AT THE END OF THE FOOTBALL FIELD, BLOOD RUSHING OUT OF HIS MOUTH AND HIS EARS AND HIS NOSE. AND THAT LEFT AN IMPRESSION ON CHUCK. HERE WAS A GUY WHO HAD ACHIEVED EVERYTHING THAT HE MIGHT HAVE WANTED IN HIS GIVEN WORLD, IN THE WORLD OF FOOTBALL, AND HE PLAYED A LITTLE TOO LONG, STRETCHED THE CAREER A LITTLE TOO FAR, AND WOUND UP THERE ON THE GRASS REALLY PHYSICALLY BEATEN. BUT I THINK WITH THE LOOK IN HIS FACE, YOU KNOW THAT HE HAD WON. HE BEAT THE ODDS. HE MADE IT. ONE OF CHUCK'S OUTSTANDING ATTRIBUTES OF CHARACTER IS COURAGE, AND I THINK HE HAS THE COURAGE TO DO THINGS THAT PERHAPS OTHER PEOPLE WOULDN'T ATTEMPT. THE IDEA OF DOING A WESTERN WAS NOT POPULAR. AND A FRIEND OF MINE, WHOSE NAME WAS TOMMY GRISE, WAS A DIRECTOR-WRITER. AND TOMMY HAD WRITTEN ABOUT 30 PAGES OF A WESTERN SCREENPLAY--NOT COWBOYS AND INDIANS, NOT SHOOT-'EM-UP, BUT A STORY OF OVERAGE COWBOYS, ONE PARTICULAR OVERAGE COWBOY. AND I WAS KNOCKED OUT BY IT, BECAUSE I FELT IT WAS A VERY HONEST AND A VERY FORTHRIGHT AND A VERY UNUSUAL PICTURE OF THE WEST. AND IT KIND OF CAUGHT MY FANCY, AND I GAVE THE 30 PAGES TO CHUCK AND SAID, "WELL, READ THEM AND TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK." HE CAME BACK THE NEXT MORNING AND HE SAID, "LET'S DO IT. WE'LL GET GEORGE STEVENS TO DIRECT." I SAID, "WHOA, HOLD IT, FORGET IT. WE WON'T GET GEORGE STEVENS TO DIRECT, BECAUSE IF WE WANT TO GET THIS, TOMMY GRISE, WHO'S WRITING IT, WANTS TO DIRECT." HE SAID, "WELL, THAT'S WHAT I SAID. WE'LL GET TOMMY GRISE TO DIRECT." [CATTLE MOOING] >> WHAT'S YOUR WHOLE NAME, WILL? >> PENNY, WILL PENNY. >> YOU GOT ANY FAMILY? >> NO. >> JOAN HACKETT IS SUPERB IN IT. IT'S NOT A LARGE PICTURE, BUT IT'S A VERY GOOD ONE." [BOTH SING "DECK THE HALLS"] >> OH. STAY, WILL. >> I'VE SEEN WHAT IT WAS MEANT TO BE LIKE. BUT IT--IT'S TOO LATE, CATH. TOO LATE FOR ME. I AIN'T A GOOD GAMBLE FOR YOU. >> THE KIND OF WORK HE ENJOYS DOING MOST IS SOMETHING FOR WHICH HE HAS TO STRETCH A LITTLE. THE REALLY FINEST PERFORMANCE HE'S GIVEN IS "KHARTOUM." >> I HAD THE CHANCE TO WORK WITH LAURENCE OLIVIER, AND IT WAS THE KIND OF PART I UNDERSTOOD--AGAIN, AN HEROIC LOSER, A MAN WHO DIED TRYING TO DEFEND KHARTOUM, AS I THINK HE KNEW HE WOULD. AND THE CHANCE TO--IT'S A GOOD FILM. AGAIN, NOT AN EXTRAORDINARILY SUCCESSFUL ONE. >> STREETS PROHIBITED TO NON-PERMITS IN ONE HOUR. >> SOL? >> HMM. BEEF? >> OUT OF CHUCK'S CONCERN ABOUT WHAT HE THINKS IS THE WORLD'S NUMBER ONE PROBLEM--AND THAT IS OVERPOPULATION--CAME "SOYLENT GREEN." THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN CHUCK AND EDDIE ROBINSON DURING "SOYLENT GREEN" WAS A VERY POIGNANT ONE TO WATCH. EDDIE WAS, UNFORTUNATELY, DYING AT THE TIME. HE KNEW IT, WE KNEW IT. AND A VERY WARM RELATIONSHIP SPRUNG UP BETWEEN THEM. >> I NEVER ATE LIKE THIS. >> WELL, NOW YOU KNOW WHAT YOU'VE BEEN MISSING. >> CHUCK'S WARMTH WAS REFLECTED BY ROBINSON'S RETURNED AFFECTION AND WARMTH, AND I THINK IT WAS THAT MAGIC THAT HAPPENED BETWEEN THEM THAT MADE THE PICTURE AS SUCCESSFUL AS IT WAS. [BEETHOVEN'S "PASTORAL" SYMPHONY NO. 6 PLAYING] >> THORN? >> YES? >> THANK YOU FOR COMING. >> OH, DEAR GOD. >> I'VE LIVED TOO LONG. >> NO. >> I LOVE YOU, THORN. >> I LOVE YOU, SOL. >> HE WOULDN'T BE DOING IT IF HE DIDN'T THINK THAT IT WAS WORTHWHILE. HE PLAYS IN A DISASTER FILM WHERE HE'S RESCUING A DOOMED AIRCRAFT, OR THERE'S AN EARTHQUAKE WITH TERRIBLE CONSEQUENCES FOR ALL CONCERNED. HE TAKES HIS CHANCES, LIKE ANY ACTOR DOES. BUT THE IMPORTANT THING TO HIM IS THE ART, AND HE APPROACHES A FILM AS AN ARTIST. EVEN IF HE HAS A MINOR PART OR A CAMEO, HE GIVES IT THE SAME KIND OF SERIOUS ATTENTION AND PREPARATION THAT HE WOULD IF HE WERE DOING "THE 10 COMMANDMENTS" AGAIN. >> HE REALLY HAS ENJOYED HIS WORK IN FILMS. A PASSION FOR THE CLASSICS, HE WAS BORN WITH THAT. HE WAS ALWAYS FASCINATED AND DELIGHTED WITH SHAKESPEARE. VERY FEW ACTORS THESE DAYS HAVE THE KIND OF BACKGROUND AND CLASSICAL STAGE TRAINING. HE ALWAYS SAYS THE STAGE IS REALLY ACTORS' COUNTRY. AND HE LOVES TO GO BACK TO IT. HE TRIES TO DO A PLAY EVERY OTHER YEAR. >> FREUD ONCE SAID THAT THE OLDEST OR ONLY SON OF A CERTAIN KIND OF DOTING MOTHER WHO WAS CONVINCED OF THE BOY'S GREATNESS MUST ACHIEVE IT, BECAUSE THERE'S SOMETHING IN HIM THEN THAT REQUIRES IT. I WAS THE SON IN SUCH A FAMILY, AND SO WAS HE. I NEVER HAD ANY DOUBTS ABOUT MY OWN SUCCESS, AND NEITHER DID HE. >> THAT BOY, WHO SPENT SO MUCH TIME READING AND RUNNING IN THE WOODS AND CREATING SO MANY DIFFERENT FANTASIES, WAS ABLE TO MAKE A JOB OUT OF IT. WITH ALL THE NEGATIVES THAT HE GREW UP WITH, HE TURNED THEM INTO POSITIVES. AND I THINK WHAT HAPPENED WAS THAT HE REALLY DID GROW INTO A GREAT MAN, NOT ONLY AS A FATHER, BUT AS A MAN. >> HE COULD HAVE DEVELOPED ONE ROLE, BEEN TYPECAST, AND DONE THE SAME THING OVER AND OVER AGAIN, BUT HE NEVER WANTED THAT. HE ALWAYS WANTED A CHALLENGE. YOU COULD SEE HIM ANYWHERE. YOU COULD IMAGINE HIM IN ANY TIME, WHICH YOU COULD NOT IMAGINE OTHER PEOPLE. >> THE GREATEST ADMIRATION FOR CHUCK. I MEAN, WHO ELSE CAN PLAY THOSE GREAT CLASSICAL ROLES? WHO ELSE HAS THE STATURE, THE POISE, THE VOICE, AND THE MANNER TO PLAY ALL OF THE GREAT, GREAT HISTORICAL CHARACTERS THAT HE'S PLAYED? I DON'T KNOW ANYONE ELSE. >> I SUPPOSE I'M NOT A 20TH-CENTURY MAN. I BELIEVE THAT ACTIONS HAVE CONSEQUENCES, THAT MEN AND WOMEN HAVE RESPONSIBILITIES, AND MOST OF THE MEN I'VE PLAYED BELIEVE THAT, TOO. IN A SENSE, MY WORK HAS BEEN MY EDUCATION. AND I AM THE BETTER FOR IT.
